which is the better low observable cruise missile, SCALP or JASSM

> low altitude flight and terrain masking is the best stealth you'll get
Isn’t helpful when in flat areas or in the ocean. You’ll Definitely want RAM to have the most effective chance of slipping past missile defenses

https://i.imgur.com/O7mU9OU.jpg

They have to be climate controlled in storage, so almost certainly. Not that it really matters because low altitude flight and terrain masking is the best stealth you'll get.

also low terrain isn't really helpful for achieving its maximum range.

>I'm french
My condolences

Warriortard seethes about the Warrior IFV and other british equipment, spams threads and samegays a lot, is possibly just another fake alter ego of Armatard.

He pitted himself like 4 of these threads ago moron

The british shills pretend like anyone making fun of them is the same person and named the persona warriortard. They are too dumb and gave up on persuading anyone, and would rather pretend to be fighting an imaginary boogieman.

It's getting M-code GPS upgrade soon.

Both have RAM coatings, and both are stealthy missiles. Apache isn't marketed as stealthy and it's the same shape as scalp, the addition of a coating is easily visible.

>range
your typical scalp or the scalp naval?
>RAM coating vs No RAM coating
irrelevant for the newer ones the detection range at such low alt is the same regardless since radar bleed through elliminates "ram coating"purely because of peak power
>the ability to change course after firing
on a cruise missile? i can hardly see any sort of type of situation where this would happen
>better launch platforms
define better the f35 can carry 2 jassm and only one jassm-er and -xr not sure how this is a better platform..
scalp besides mirage 2000 which can only carry one on the rest it can be carried by 3+4 (AA 2 fox 2 2 fox 3) and 2 external fuel tanks
plus the naval version with the booster can be fired from both sylver and mk 41

scalp naval has a 1400km range
so no
> Just saying RAM coating is irrelevant doesn’t make it so. Better platforms as in B2 stealth bombers and palletized out of a c-130.

you clearly dont understand stealth if you think that peak power output isnt the only factor at play here

>Yea JASSM XR

The JASSM ER outranges both. Just saying RAM coating is irrelevant doesn’t make it so. Better platforms as in B2 stealth bombers and palletized out of a c-130.

>The JASSM ER outranges both.

homie please stick to a story
>Feels good that this guy keeps commenting and losing
please tell me how stealth works anon ill wait

please
PLEASE DO

Scalp naval also has to strap a massive booster on and is exceedingly rare. And it’s still outranged by air launched JASSM. The air launched SCALP is just so short ranged

and? its still a scalp its not like jassm-er and -xr doesnt come with a booster

>its not like jassm-er and -xr doesnt come with a booster
ER doesn't, XR probably does, the ER is physically the same size though.
>Using a more efficient engine and larger fuel volume in an airframe with the same external dimensions as the JASSM, the JASSM-ER is intended to have a range of over 575 mi (925 km) as compared to the JASSM's range of about 230 mi (370 km)

JASSM-XR is like 2x the weight with 2x larger warhead though, so it most likely has a big booster on it.

Range and stealth mostly

>Not having a missile that can switch to secondary targets when told to is a massive capability that’s lost.

It can swap when it realises the first target is destroyed, it's never been a problem in its extensive combat use, and the new version probably can be programmed in flight. You're really clutching at straws here.

Iraq, Afganistan, Syria, Libya, Yemen, possibly in west Africa too, i don't know if the french used it there. Likely coming to Ukraine at some point.

you can google it for yourself yes

i'll do that when you prove that Javelin has a refrigerated box, RQ 170 is large and unstealthy (and can be tracked on flight radar) and that harpoon isn't a cruise misisle. Juts a few of your hilariously wrong opinions.

Meanwhile everything I've posted is self evident. Cry about it. This is probably why you're unemployed.

The fact you think you're talking to the same person is funny.

Also see [...]
Just because you want to ignore responses that make you look moronic doesn't mean they don't exist.

These posts are too close together. It’s clear there are 2 pro JASSM posters and 1 anti JASSM poster making the bulk of the posts.

>i'll do that when you prove that Javelin has a refrigerated box, RQ 170 is large and unstealthy (and can be tracked on flight radar) and that harpoon isn't a cruise misisle. Juts a few of your hilariously wrong opinions.
I didn't make any of these claims, so, why would I need to back them up, brainlet? Now, where is that proof?

But you've never once proven SCALP even matches JASSM, let alone "out performs".

Lmao ahh great now we've reached the point where you just admit it's straight up worse, but it doesn't matter because no one needs it anyway.

K

But how does it back up your claim of
> It can swap when it realises the first target is destroyed

>not having RAM
If you repeat it enough maybe you will start believing it

Why do you think it can’t fly low? It doesn’t because unlike the storm shadow it’s VLO so it can fly higher and more efficiently.

Absolutely mogged by JASSM variants.

>I just know that SCALP range is longer than I can find a source for because it came to me in a dream
I broke this guy

>it probably has the same as the system that has almost double the listed range
lmao

That's the radar horizon, it's not exactly a challenging distance for a modern radar even on a VLO target (cruise missiles aren't VLO)

The harpoon is an anti ship missile used for anti ship purposes. The scalp is not an anti ship missile and is used for striking stationary targets. The fact that scalp only has a 300 mile range means it’s a very short ranged cruise missile to be launched from a boat. That would be a long range anti ship missile but since it lacks anti ship capability it’s just a short ranged cruise missile. When you tried to compare the two as equals it was actually pretty funny because you didn’t have a shorter range boat launched cruise missile to compare it to

It’s an old as frick anti ship missile. Why are you so desperate to compare it to a missile that’s meant to strike targets on land? 300 miles is really short for a ship launched cruise missile. And that 300 mile figure is almost certainly when launched from altitude

What's a cruise missile?

Impressive

>it has to be climate controlled
>it is described as stealthy when APACHE which is the same shape isn't
>you can literally see the coating

Then why can’t you just source it already? If I’m so wrong about the RAM coating just prove it

>Why is Storm Shadow stealthy
It’s not very stealthy. It’s LO due to its shaped features

>Javelin ATGMs get stored in refrigerated boxes too

No they don't lmao. You think there's a refrigeration system in here that can deal with being stored at up to 71C?

moron

> The M98A1 is equipped with a Dewar Stirling refrigerator. The missile is equipped with a small battery-compatible refrigerator in the launch tube. If the power is not locked and launched for 4 minutes, the power will not be enough, and a small refrigerator and battery need to be replaced.

https://i.imgur.com/Y0hZ3XO.jpg

>how to spot a neverserved
at the ASP javelins are in climate controlled boxes. In the field they are not. Now watch as I BTFO you with a picture of SCALP outside of its box. Next you’re going to have to show me stormshadow in its climate controlled box. You wont be able to and we will continue to laugh at you grasping for straws

2/2

You claimed the box was refrigerated, you then posted information about the seeker. You are yet to prove that Javelin has a refrigerated box.

I have posted Storm Shadows climate controlled box.

The SCALP doesn’t have RAM. That’s why it can’t cruise like JASSM

Again how do you know what its cooling. Could be pre-chilling fuel, or some other electric component. You have no idea what it's doing.

You keep ignoring the fact that it doesn’t have RAM. Why is that

And they’re not for the RAM because SCALP doesn’t have it as we’ve proved earlier in the thread

You're so upset you've started false flagging lmao, i own you. I know vastly more about military matters than you and it shows every time we interact radar kiddie. Must suck living in your literally who euro country looking at the UK shitting on every military capability your country has.

You're the only one whi speaks hindi street shitter, use google translate.

Frick off warriortard

It's not warriortard, it's the euro wanabe of him. likely German or one of those shitty made up countries between Germany and France.

Stop replying to him moron he's 200 posts in of mostly samegayging.

All of this may be true, but it doesn’t change the fact that JASSM is better than storm shadow. And all of this warriortard talk won’t change that simple fact

Stop replying to him moron he's 200 posts in of mostly samegayging.

You’re the one that’s visibly upset that the US designed and produced a better cruise missile than the British

>Storm Shadow is an Anglo-French low-observable, long-range, air-launched cruise missile developed since 1994 by Matra and British Aerospace
wrecked again. Please keep commenting

We’re talking about SCALP. It’s a British design
> Storm Shadow is an Anglo-French low-observable, long-range, air-launched cruise missile developed since 1994 by Matra and British Aerospace
Regarding the Apache
> The SCALP EG missile is based on it, notably featuring similar aerodynamics and stealth. However, the latter has a different propulsion system and carries a single high-penetration warhead instead of the Apache's cluster submunitions.
>latter has different propulsion and warhead
>latter does not have RAM

>Why is Storm Shadow stealthy and APACHE not?
Jesus Christ it's virtually almost the same airframe you cretin. The Black Shaheen is closer to the APACHE to be entirely fair. But there is no special bong sauce applied to the SCALP to make it magically better. It's just a french airframe with a bong 400kg tandem charge inside. It's also 30+ years old tech at this point. Which is why it's gonna get replaced in a few years.
Holy shit wtf is this thread?

Why are you quoting the person proving the point and not the person trying to claim it has some fastest RAM coating?

Someone could explain in great detail how Iran hacked RQ-170 and you'd still here crying about sources despite there being literal pictures of the drone in Iran lol.

>RQ 170 is non stealthy

Well that's yet another moronic take from you. I'm going to pin that up next to "harpoon isn't a cruise missile".

But yeah, you go on thinking that the US who denied it's existence and edited satellite photos to obscure it in Afghanistan allowed it to be tracked on flight radar. I love this regular reminders that you're a metal midget radar kiddie.

I bet you think B21 isn't stealthy because the US aren't telling us about all of it's details.

Of course we all know B2 wasn't stealthy which is why it was kept secret for so long.

Staggering levels of moronation you're showing and you're so humiliated you're falling back on the "i win, you lose" fallacy.

You’re the one that’s visibly upset that the US designed and produced a better cruise missile than the British

>Storm Shadow is an Anglo-French low-observable, long-range, air-launched cruise missile developed since 1994 by Matra and British Aerospace
wrecked again. Please keep commenting

We’re talking about SCALP. It’s a British design
> Storm Shadow is an Anglo-French low-observable, long-range, air-launched cruise missile developed since 1994 by Matra and British Aerospace
Regarding the Apache
> The SCALP EG missile is based on it, notably featuring similar aerodynamics and stealth. However, the latter has a different propulsion system and carries a single high-penetration warhead instead of the Apache's cluster submunitions.
>latter has different propulsion and warhead
>latter does not have RAM

>similar stealth to the Apache
SCALPers keep digging themselves a deeper hole.

> The missile is designed to fly low-level terrain following flight path, which enables effective bypassing of most enemy defenses. The advantages of its low observable properties ensure its survivability during the missile ingress to the target. The missile is also prepared to engage enemy jammers.

> One of the unique features of the current model of JASSM is its capability to send back a sequence of pre-strike images of the target, just before impact.

frogs BTFO.

One entered service in 2003 the other entered service in 2009. That 6 years, not 20 years.

>I don't see how in any reality you can argue SCALP is better and expect to be taken seriously.

Combat record doesn't lie. JASSM just isn't very good.

>Scalp has only been used 6 times

The desperation is hilarious

>combat record
>export success

Yeah, Scalp wins.

So they fired 30 and one didn't work? a literal nothing burger.

The nation that used the scalp reported failures in combat. That hasn’t happened with JASSM. That’s why JASSM has a much better combat record.

Just wait until you see the combat record of the tomahawk. Mogs the SCALP so hard

Shame scalp can’t fly at efficient altitudes while mainting stealth.

t.JASSM chad

> Why is 1,600ft more efficient than 100ft when air density doesn't change in a meaningful way until much higher up?
How’s not having to constantly adjust altitude to account for changes in geography
> Also, why do you think SCALP can't fly higher?
Who said it can’t? It doesn’t because it lacks proper RAM so it needs to mask its signature behind terrain. Try to keep up

JASSM can adjust for terrain now. Which is it moron

Obviously it can but it’s most efficient to fly higher. Let’s hope that stealth works out

Except you’re pulling numbers out of your ass. You don’t know if a radar can detect JASSM from 4 miles out let alone 60

JASSM can take pictures of the target moments before impact but it can't detect if there is a tree or hill coming up?

Lmao

So all the official USAF generals talking about terrain following and low altitude terminal phase was all just... Bullshit?

Come on, the US had this figured out in the '80s and' 90s, if you honestly think JASSM can't do the SAME or even lower altitude than SCALP I've got a bridge in London to sell.

What sensor does scalp use?

Not sure exactly what, but the front-facing sensors also face downwards.

>which is why it can only cruise at 1,600ft.

>That's not how it works.
That is literally how it works.
[...]

kek someone just posted a video of it cruising a few meters above sea level. That must really hurt

I'd really love to know what makes you lie so much about JASSM being worse than SCALP.

That’s a tercom sensor right there. Good job anon

homie you are arguing with a troll. He purposefully argues matchups US will win on purpose just so he can make fun of bongs, who literally are within the exact same MIC sphere and thus complement each others capabilities with different weapons, filling in the gaps between each other.
This is despite the fact that Chinese missiles mog basically anything America has and he is cope and seething all day.

>Availability of this world-beating system represents a significant leap forward in technology and capability for the RAF. The state of the art navigation system, providing phenomenal precision, together with the specialised bunker-busting BROACH warhead has no known equivalent in the world today.

The UK was using Tomahawk when it said this.

How many SCALPs have been fired?

If the US DoD paid for the R&D, paid to build and field it they own the rights to the IP, not Raytheon or LM. If they want LM to use the BROACH warhead they would give them the data, and blueprints to build it.

It is how it works, the US produces hundreds of BROACH warheads for JSOW. Do you think we place an order with MBDA? Lmao

Just like all UK nuclear reactors are actually american since the only reason you got submarine reactors is because the US gifted you theirs and then RR modifies a few parts and announces from the rafters that they designed a brand new 100% UK reactor.

> PWR3 was a new system "based on a US design but using UK reactor technology". The Royal Institution of Naval Architects reported that it was likely that the UK was given access to the US Navy S9G reactor design used in their Virginia-class submarines.

>which is why it can only cruise at 1,600ft.
[...]

Warhead seems fine. Can I see the SCALP sled tests?

Why do you ignore?

Sea skimming is less than 1600ft, and the warhead penetrates reinforced concrete just fine. What say you my lonely shill nonfren?

>It's not sea skimming because it lacks that ability
Yet, it is on video doing it. WHAT IS THIS MAGIC!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

Lower than 1600ft. Much lower.

Clearly glide bombs with a motor attached aren't very good

You’ve been proven wrong by a video posted showing JASSM sea skimming