Turkish Foreign Minister Mevlut Cavusoglu has reaffirmed his country’s refusal to transfer its advanced long-range Russian-built S-400 air defense missile systems to Ukraine — which could really do with them right now.
"The U.S. asked us to send the S-400s to Ukraine, and we said no," said Cavusoglu on May 7.
In December, Russia warned Greece against potentially supplying Ukraine with its S-300PMU-1 systems, which are much older and less advanced than the Turkish S-400. Moscow invoked prior bilateral intergovernmental agreements and prohibitions on unauthorized transfers to third parties in that warning. Athens subsequently ruled out transferring those missiles after briefly having contemplated it.
There may be another way Turkey could help Ukraine significantly bolster its air defenses. In March, the chairman of Turkey's Aselsan missile manufacturer boasted Turkey was eliminating the need for S-400s by developing the indigenous Siper system, which Ankara plans to offer for export. Tested in December, the Siper can hit targets over 60 miles away.
Turkey supplied Ukraine with approximately 50 Bayraktar TB2 drones after Russia's February 2022 invasion. When Moscow objected, Ankara stressed that the transfers were between the private company which produces the TB2 and Kyiv and therefore did not technically constitute state-to-state arms sales. It could invoke similar technicalities over any future Siper sale to Ukraine.
By supplying Ukraine with the Siper, Turkey would also have a unique opportunity to assess the system's effectiveness on a modern battlefield.
While the Siper certainly won't be ready for export in time for Ukraine's looming counteroffensive, they could help bolster the country's air defenses down the road, which could still make a difference if this costly war drags on for the foreseeable future.
I can never understand turkish cope
You realize your government bought and is not letting go of their s400 because they want to ride the line between west and russia, right? so why would you ever think your government would sell s400 copies to be used against russia?
and the bayraktar is a different story because russia has nothing to do with the bayraktar. and since it effectively has the same usefulness as a javelin, it was hardly any kind of gamechanger.
I get that erdogan's bullshit fills you with hope, you the reality is the turkey is the NATO leper.
They are really retarded thinking the US would still go ahead with selling F-35s after the S-400 purchase because russian engineers are regularly on Turkish bases when they need to inspect/repair the S-400.
Also, the S-400 is overrated russian braggadocio shit, you might as well call it S-300PMU3, they literally admitted that the name was just a marketing shtick. Sure it's better than the S-300 but only in the form of a "DLC" not as a "new game".
hold on for 3 more days ukiebros. having a little existential crisis rn
What is Turkey’s problem in general?
they want to recrate the ottoman empire
That looks too "humble" for turks autists, I've seen some of them claiming picrel as "historic tuckish lands".
>all the lands that have ever been inhabited by brown stinky people are tvrkish
>not france tho
I wouldnt touch france with a 10ft pole
Tell your friends to leave then. Thanks.
According to Ataturk the Ottoman Empire was not a Turkish country and instead was an imperial state from which Turks had to fight for independence, same as any other nation.
The founding father of the Turkish nation explicitly postulated that there is no continuity of state between Ottomans and Turkyie.
If you missed the cue, Erdogan dedicated his entire career attempting to dismantle Kemalism, so it doesn't matter they larp as an extinct empire again
it's full of turks
bazaar type dictator that haggles with every direction all at once. kind of like belarus before luka sold his ass to monke to save himself in 2020
this, if turkey demuslified itself and droped all of those Aegean sea claims it would become a functioning democracy and it could unironicaly rival china in all areas but bugmenisim
>When Turkey drops all their interests and act according to my interest, then they would redeem themselves.
One of the most sane decisions they've made to not transfer s400. They literally have no lther air defense.
Except that if they did the USA would probably let them have f35s
They're playing a balancing game between NATO and Russia but they actually don't want Russia near their borders or around Black Sea.
I think Turkey logic is:
1) Prevent Kurdish autonomy by the Kurds they don't like near their borders.
2) Prevent Russia from getting too close to Turkish borders.
3) Claim eastern Med rights and don't allow Greek run government in Cyprus.
4) Threaten Greece for bonus internal politics points.
It's pretty basic actually and I have to say I don't think it's inconsistent or anything. Think of it this way:
- Russia engages in Georgia, Turks support the Georgian government.
- US asks Turkey to deliver goodies for the Syrian rebels, they comply happily (Operation Timber Sycamore) and shoot down a Russian plane.
- US decides to support the Kurds instead, Turkey gets S-400 to stick it to the man.
- Internal politics get hot, they threaten Greece during elections season because it's popular.
Why did they think that the S-400 was a better deal than the F-35? Is the S-400 that good? I doubt it. The Turks missed out, big time.
Difference maker was, russia allowed them to do whatever they want whereas f35s would essentially be under US control, meaning they couldn't just decide to bomb syria one day without US approval.
S400 absolutely doesn't make up for lack of F35s but Sovereignty is important
>you're probably some thirdie argie-shitier
>t. room temperature iq
Again, why are Greeks and Turks in NATO?
strategically important land
WTF did the Greeks do to you? Exist? 2 of the biggest naval bases in the Med are not enough?
>whay are a bunch of strategically important non-communist countries that were threatened by the warsaw pact members of nato?
Gee, i just cant work it out, i guess its just a mystery
Turkey is probably one of NATO's most important members
Because if they WEREN'T in NATO, their politicians would be Putin's butt buddies to an even greater extent than they are as part of NATO
Damn, it’s like both nations have border issues with their neighbors and communist bullshitery on top of their geographic relevance.
Turks really wanted to be in NATO because historically Russia does have some ambitions to go south so they even joined the Korean war. However, it would have been very inconvenient if Greece got close to Russia or if Turkey got into some stupid fight with Greece. So they both joined at the same time. US even used Turkey to trigger Russia with the Jupiter missiles which basically led to the Cuban missile crisis. So it was a strategic location and having them both prevents NATO commitment to either side in case of some small skirmishes (for example invasion of Cyprus).
Modern days I think it's much more useful to have Turkey and Greece in NATO than allow them to get close to Russia. It doesn't really cost anything to keep them but it allows NATO some interesting tactical advantages considering their location. Also big boy armies, even Greece fields larger army than Germany.
This is stupid at one moment in time NATO is bitching about turkish purchase of S-400
Now they are bitching them to give it to ukies
Giving the S-400s would be borderline pointless in a full-scale war because the ammo is limited. Turkey didn't buy them just to fucking give them away. They're for protecting domestic skies.
S-400 is just for the personal protection of erDOGan against F-16s. There are like 300-400 missiles in inventory at best. And during in an actual war, either the Russian backdoors won't let the system work properly or it will run out of missiles fast.
>he Russian backdoors won't let the system work properly
imagine believing this, retard
>the Russian backdoors won't let the system work properly
Pretty sure Ukraine has been using S-300
If erdogan loses the election the other candidate will probably send them
>If erdogan loses the election the other candidate will probably send them
No he won't, and he won't even raise a finger to Russia either.
>Which explains why Erdogan is getting a lot of 'discrete' help from Moscow with the upcoming election. Of course they will support their best friend in NATO.
You're retarded. Turkey's been at war with Russia longer than anybody, both across the last 400 years and since the early 2010s. Literally only NATO state to shootdown a Russian jet in 2015, proposed joint NATO patrols in the Black Sea in early 2016, and have been countering Russia in Syria, Libya, South Caucasus and Ukraine alike—and one of a handful of states to supply weapons to Ukraine before 2022 while others scoffed or outright sold weapons to Russia or worked with it.
Which explains why Erdogan is getting a lot of 'discrete' help from Moscow with the upcoming election. Of course they will support their best friend in NATO.
Does the US not have enough Patriots or something? Sending Ukraine air defense equipment seems like one of the most easy to justify moves. Send more Pats and some Avengers. I am sort of surprised the US has nothing else aside from Aegis and THAAD. Seems very heavy on missile defense but only one, expensive, old SAM system.
But if Ukraine is reliant on Euros or Russian gear for air defense, then it could be a long run problem. Any big push they get going can get fucked by Russia hurling air assets at it as they leave their umbrella like during the Kharkiv offensive.
Patriot is more a "brand" than a fixed system. Like the F-16 or F-35, they get updated continously without a name change.
>Russia warned Greece
Recall Turkey asked the US for Patriots during their adventure in Syria. Also recall that Turkey bought the S-400 and fucked themselves out of the F-35 program as a result.
>Recall Turkey asked the US for Patriots during their adventure in Syria.
Turks have been asking for Patriots even before that. If you look at their military equipment they have a severe lack of medium-high altitude air defense besides interceptors. It's just that US doesn't want to give them Patriots but they also ask for a lot, like they want to basically produce them locally under license while having option to develop it into their own version.