USMC has a god dam varmint gun that weighs the same and these mofos have the audacity to diss a god damn battle rifle that's going to punch through mud walls like paper?
Why so many people talking shit about this Rifle?
USMC has a god dam varmint gun that weighs the same and these mofos have the audacity to diss a god damn battle rifle that's going to punch through mud walls like paper?
They made a folding-stock BR in moronic .243 winchester
Funniest shit i've ever seen
7mm-08 Remington*
I would like to more. What kind of BR was it? A scar clone? AR 10?
Why is it that whenever someone tries to diss the caliber it's always a multitude of different calibers?
The main reason they're trying to push for this cartridge and rifle is war against a peer enemy and hence body armor
Without AP rounds this system still doesn't do anything special against body armor
In a peer or near peer conflict, fragmentation, i.e. everything from grenades, mortar/artillery rounds and bombs etc. is still the killer of enemy infantry
You're going back to battle rifles while there's even more stuff that rains or helps raining he and frag on you pretending it'll make a positive difference
ukraine has shown body armor is almost entirely worthless
Hence why the cartridge (No I'm not calling it by what they want you to call it, it's dumb) is a bullshit proprietary boxticking moneygrab by SIG.
Also,
>BIMETALLIC CASES
>BIMETALLIC CASES
>BIMETALLIC CASES
>BIMETALLIC CASES
If anything, it's the opposite. I've seen pictures of guys with chewed up armor plates that saved their lives. People are much harder to kill with explosives because they're wearing vests, too.
No, it's only shown that min-max'ed just rifle plates in a plate carrier with no soft armor coverage is moronic.
It has shown, as every conflict since the invention of flak vests has shown, the literal exact opposite of what you said.
No it didn't you buffoons. The war has shown the importance of bodyarmor and also armor penetration. There are stories of soldiers surviving because of the plates they have.
Someone have the pictures of the plates painted with saints or whatever after saving someone?
>muh body armor falseflag
I'm getting the pasta
You can try and word it however you want, the idea that going back to a battle rifle is going to be a decisive factor in an infantry engagement involving combined arms is amusing, wether playing the body armor or first hit/flatter trajectory card
There is only one scenario where it plays out like that is in the desert or mountains against your average dunecoons
>flatter trajectory
like stopping power, whenever someone uses this phrase I immediately understand they never went past middle school level physics
Shut the frick up dimwit.
You don't believe that one round can have less drop / drift than another?
Mass multiplies damage, while velocity squares it. The future is high speed, old man.
For the past 50+ years, from SPIW to the ACR (G11, Steyr ACR, AAI rifle, etc.), to the XM8, all of these rifles have been designed to be lighter or have components that are lighter.
The NGSW as a concept is not a bad idea. The execution with SIGs phoned in entry is what sucks ass. A cartridge partly made of steel with an aluminum washer to contain the pressures needed to accelerate a larger bullet, which we know doesn't have a tungsten core, out of a 13 inch barrel to pierce body armor that only well funded chechen mercenaries used.
On top of that, the training ammo is regular brass and not overpressured. The round is heavier, the rifle has extra superfluous components like the rear charging handle, which impedes having a cheek riser on the stock. The barrel extension and extractor are far thicker to handle the ridiculous pressure, all of which make the rifle heavier.
M4s with ACOGs worked fine in Iraq and even Afghanistan. This rifle is the result of Milley being in bed with SIG, the latter of which have focused more on navigating the procurement process than bringing something innovative to the table.
it'd not even be so bad if it was going to supplant the EMR or something, but going back to what's basically an FAL carbine with AR components for everyone is mega dumb.
Buddy, the cartridge technology is the greatest step forward in ammo tech since smokeless powder 120 years ago. Except that it is most likely eclipsed by the shell shock technologies ammo cases.
The problem is, that they used the tech so badly to create a magnum battle rifle instead of: >5.7fn hybrids that perform as well or better than traditional 5.56.
>5.56 cases shortened to allow longer bullets at maglength, think downsized 6.5 creedmoor
They killed the LSAT for this. Battle rifles for everyone is dead. Lighter ammo and more ammo per man is the meta.
>Lighter ammo and more ammo per man is the meta.
Ammunition isn't what won us the firefights or insurgent raids on FOBs. It was the damn 4x magnified optic that completely gave us the superiority over our insurgent foes.
>us
This is a muri-mutt board, all other nations BTFO
>us
not
>US
work on your reading comprehension
ACR mentioned lets gooooo
Sig is owned by a israeli conman
Folding stocks are a meme
Barrel is bendy
Mcx is skibidi
Still needs tungsten core to punch through level iv plates.
Exact same shit as what's needed for 5.56 NATO to do the same. Also the exact same shit needed for 7.62x51 to punch through level iv plates.
It's almost like making the boolet go faster than it should given the case capacity isn't the only thing that determines armor penatration, and at the end of the day all the extra complexity in the cartridge could be removed by making them 1/4" longer.
As long as they sell the same rifle as the one military's getting on the civilian market then I don't care.
Someone don't tell him that they don't chrome line nor use the hi-speed parts for the commercial market variants
>hi-speed parts
WTF are those
Mainly a military quality barrel.
parts that go fast. duh
a civilian wouldn't want a chromed barrel, moron. nitride is more accurate. chromed just lasts longer if you're cooking the shit out of it.
Shut the frick up you stupid homosexual.
Nitride is a budget option and your fudd lore about muh accuracy and muh barrel life is just that, fudd lore.
Chrome lasts longer, full stop.
This rifle will demonstrate the moral of the fox and the grapes within 5 posts if mentioned on this website.
Its not fox and grapes, the Spear is available to civilians. Nobodys buying it though, not even to flex on poors or get instagram clout.
Wow, I didn't know that. You're telling me now for the first time.
>7.62mm version
You pussied out.
You're a nobody, that's why you bought it kek
You spent over 4K on a ar10 made by indians insteaf of a combat proven FN SCAR made by White men, are you happy?
he could have spent 1000 on an AR-10 made by Black folk in South Carolina and been happier
Yes I'm very happy. I can't wait to try 6.8x51 once they release CAL-X kits.
I bet you're brown
A bet you would lose
I bet you don't really have any business posting about guns worth over $500, or maybe guns at all.
I'd rather not buy firearms made with indian parts and labor and a israelite ceo
Raged poor person again LOLOLOL
Being a sigger proves your poverty of mind, not just wealth.
Ahem. Frick siggers.
Do you actually shoot this thing at ranges where it outperforms 5.56 though? within 600yds what's the point?
If you go by that logic what is the point of owning anything but a 5.56?
If 5.56 gets the job done what IS the point? It's the cheapest and most accurate centerfire rifle cartridge available in the US right now. Why WOULDN'T you choose it?
Because maybe you need to hit further or kill something larger than a small deer or a person. This may blow your mind but some animals are pretty big and need a little more oomph than what 5.56 can give. Plus not all of us are mindless trend followers, its refreshing to try a new round in a different gun
Okay, so DO you hunt with this thing or do you just take pictures of it on your back patio? Also, going with what logistically makes the most sense is hardly trend following. I can fill 5 mags of 5.56 for the cost of 1 mag of 6.whatever
What would you shoot with 7.62x51 at what distance, that you would not with 5.56x45?
Also maybe note the bullets you would use.
>5.56
>mindless trend followers
>trend
Lmao. Since when is the decades-long ubiquitous standard a "trend"
Accuracy and lethality at ranges exceeding 300 meters, obviously.
Companies responsible for CHF barrel manufacturing will happily admit that nitride coating of barrels will result in slightly higher accuracy at the cost of slightly lower barrel life especially at higher temperatures typically resulting from extended automatic fire.
The only reason militaries and police opt for chrome lined barrels is because they know the gun is going to sit uncleaned in an armory for decades and be fired automatic by low IQ grunts and cops.
The only fudd moron here is you man.
>slightly
>they admit
>hurr durr
Shut the frick up moron, this gay ass rule of thumb isnt, and no, the difference in barrel life isnt "slightly" its significant, especially when your homosexual ass 6.8 fuddmagnum is pushing the pressure it is.
Ofc assuming the bimetal meme ammo becomes available.
Stop letting nitirde peddlers market you bullshit.
Where have you read what you're typing? Who told you this? You don't even know what you're saying lmao.
Shut the frick up moron
Hows the accuracy on the spear?
Good
>No one is buying it
The gun is not the problem, anon.
It's like buying LMT or H&K, you shell out 4x as much for something a PSA rifle could do.
More like the boy who cried wolf. The more you insist the less it's true
XM7
>Carries less ammo at the same weight
>Less ammo means less suppression
>Larger caliber means take more time for follow on shots
>No bayonet mount
Have fun doing cqb with that shit. Not to mention the machine gun they're shilling doesn't have a qd barrel.
One thing m27 has over is the availability of mags that can be shared over the team, weight distribution is simplified.
damn look at how fricking stupid this motherfricker is
Hes right on all points tho.
>a fricking bayonet
There is zero reason not to have one, bayonet charges happened in Afghanistan and that was a conflict with full air supremacy.
I don't think a single bayonet charge has happened in multiple years of fighting in Ukraine, and in 20 years of Afghanistan there was, what, one? Two maybe?
Enlighten me.
My apologies. It was an attempt at humor.
>current year
>shit sour
Cool non cl barrel and panjeet MIM parts (unless you get a .mil one) and rail that needs a strengthener to not bend under a gentle breeze
Whole gun is silly (two charging handles! Modular forward assist!); would like to see AR10s chambered in that round though, wonder how hot it gets going out of an 18” barrel
>coworker peacetime mil-vet LARP gay buys an LT
>goes to LARP this past winter
>rifle has bad extraction issues
>copes with "I was just using the wrong lube"
I look forward to the shitshow these things will have when the US and NATO have to run a peacekeeping mission in a civil war collapsed Russia. Imagine it's 2030 and you get domed by a salty Russian vet of the Russian-Ukraine war with an old rusty AK-74.
Because if this rifle didn't at least look cool you yourself wouldn't be supporting the adoption of it.
>that weighs the same
Yeah but nah
Because /k/ is a bunch of dimwits. Years ago the F35 was constantly shit talked about being a garbage plane that was overbudget and behind schedule while people unironically heralded the A-10 as the best plane in service. If /k/ existed in the 60s I can promise you they'd be calling the M16 a plastic hunk of shit and the M14 the right rifle that the "weak college boys" in the army just can't handle. Likely also making up or fully believing every tale of 5.56 failing to kill a target just like how they speak of 5.7 today
Okay, but it's still a dumb gun based on US army staff autism and swiss israelite greed.
I kinda like the cartridge actually, with a 16 or 18 inch barrel and a normalish AR-10 layout with some care given towards weight I bet it could be really good
It'd be okay were it an actual longgun, but as a carbine being pushed into the service rifle role it's insane. See
>modern SIG Sauer
>swiss in any way
based moron
Honestly it's not surprising given the absolutely insane amount of propaganda against any US/NATO defense project these days. Just off the top of my head you've got:
>Domestic media using them as clickbait or as a proxy to attack politicians they don't like
>Defense contractors who lost the contract trying to force a re-award they might win, or trying to improve foreign sales prospects of them, or just out of spite
>Domestic politicians also using them as proxies against other politicians, or to push a general narrative, or because the contractor in their district didn't win, or because they want the money spent on their own pet projects
>Foreign governments and their English-language shill media trying to undermine confidence in the US/NATO and improve their relative image, or just trying to improve sales prospects of their own competing products
>Seething thirdies coping
And so on. It's especially effective here on PrepHole too because we have such a potent wienertail of the aforementioned seething thirdies mixed with a huge contingent of people who've fallen into an extreme blackpill political worldview where everything the US/NATO does is a fricked up complete disaster and so they lap up anything bad about these weapons programs because it reinforces their pre-existing headcanon.
My problem with the thing is that it's a fricking m-14 wearing an AR-10's clothes, complete with weird shit that's only on there because the US army can't make up it's fricking mind on anything.
If it was 16"-20" barrel length, a DMR, fitted with an actual short stroke gas piston instead of whatever the frick kind of botched shit it's got, and came with a half-decent stock that locked into something, then I'd be fine with it. Oh, and they got rid of one of the charging handles.
That should be a clear indication that they're catering it to the dumbfricks in charge of procurement, not designing a good rifle.
Most of the problems with it seem much more manageable when it's a niche weapon to replace restocked M-14's with a much flatter tragectory cartridge, that isn't expected to be used like an SMG, like the M4 is. That's why the M4 is select fire, to fudge together the M3 and the M14 conceptually, and give 90% the effectiveness of both in the same package.
The fact that it's being used like it is however, is utterly moronic, and the problems with the cartridge arise immediately because now it has to compete with .223 in terms of cost, which with a two-piece design like they want is just not going to happen, not even close.
There is so much about it that is clearly just bumping on-paper specs as much as they can without really giving a practical implementation. I have no idea how this thing passed into service, when it lacks such basic shit like a locking folding stock.
I don't doubt that it shoots further, but in practice I can only imagine the thing missing, harder, because the fundamental problem isn't range or armor penatration or anything that could be solved with the new cartridge, it's the fact that the Mk1 eyeball and hands aren't always aiming where they need to be. ACOG's fixed this issue largely, and the machine gun or DMR in the squad already has enough range to satisfy the niche few times you need more.
>actual short stroke piston
nah I'll take DI please
Well I think a lot of the accuracy issues will be resolved by the new computerized optic. Maybe adopting a whole new rifle to implement such tech is unnecessary but ultimately I think it'll work out, at least in terms of improving downrange lethality of the individual soldier. Now as to how it will affect the solider outside of combat and if such a tradeoff is worth it, I can't say for certain but it seems like an objective downgrade
>computerized optic
And how will it make the soldiers snap shoot better?
I think the gun just sucks bro
Should have gone with a less gay version of this.
Canadians SOF really chose well
Yeah, too bad the charging handle design is shit. I would have just gone with a FAL/M7 side charger.
Sig saure is shit. Evrry time us military changed to 7.62, they rechange back to 5.56.
Bitches would b***h about a 13lb ar10 but own a 13lb SPR lmao
my AR-15 weighs 6 pounds right now if I take the bipod off and mag out
I need to get one of those tuned gas tubes so I can use a lighter buffer
>so I can use a lighter buffer
Dont, as long as its ejecting properly and isnt overgassed with an H2 unsuppressed then leave it be.
overgassed with an H3
>13lb varmint rifle
ftfy anon
Mark my words these will not get wide adoption. Went through testing rounds with airborne units last year and Sig has be quiet about it since. It was supposed to see mass adoption at the end of last year.
Marked
People that like SIG are moronic. Frick gay Euro short strokes and folding stocks. Frick SIG pistol's skyscraper bore axis and drop safety issues. Frick the over pressured, over weight meme gun that is no better than a .338 Laupa.
it's not even better than 308, anon
Stfu moron
still don't get why they put a short ass barrel on it and then had to use absurdly high pressure ammo just to get acceptable velocity out of it
they couldn't have just made the thing 3 to 4 inches longer?
you need to be at least 18 to post here.