I can't wait for market court dismiss the case, H&K filing a complaint to supreme court, supreme court refusing to take the case, H&K complaining to EU courts and so on. This is the state of EU defense cooperation. Salty c**ts that cannot offer supply security Finnish defense forces need suing the military.
And they only started this shit with Finland, even though the swedes are further into the procurement process. It's almost like they decided the swedish order would be too small potatoes for them to bother.
Whats H&K's issue anyway
Basically they argue that the finnish order should go through a bidding process with trials.
The finnish argument is that in case of a hot war in Europe, the sea route between Finland and Germany may not be accessible at times, and spare parts and replacements for the HK rifles may not be available in a timely fashion. Hence the importance of domestic tooling for maintenance and production of required parts.
HK argues that this is abuse of the EU rules and basically dismiss without explanation any potential issues with parts availability and maintenance, and argue that needing to ship rifles fricked beyond basic armorer's capabilities back to Germany is not going to be an issue in a war.
>argue that needing to ship rifles fricked beyond basic armorer's capabilities back to Germany is not going to be an issue in a war.
And they think thats gonna hold up in court?
No. That anon paints a very one sided picture because he has strong feefees. I recommend reading the actual documents since HK's argument isn't that far fetched.
>And they only started this shit with Finland, even though the swedes are further into the procurement process. It's almost like they decided the swedish order would be too small potatoes for them to bother.
Tactical lawfare at its finest. I guess they count on SAKO/Beretta production being uneconomical with just Swedish order.
>Those CTR stocks are overused by everyone though.
that would be a valid argument if they were bad but theyre not
one day you will grow out of your contrarianism stage
>Those CTR stocks are overused by everyone though.
that would be a valid argument if they were bad but theyre not
one day you will grow out of your contrarianism stage
Am I the only one who thinks they’re bad because there’s a giant fricking whole in it? Perfect for catching on everything in this world. What the frick happened to snag free, smooth designs, it’s like we regressed on this aspect.
>Am I the only one who thinks they’re bad because there’s a giant fricking whole in it? Perfect for catching on everything in this world. What the frick happened to snag free, smooth designs, it’s like we regressed on this aspect.
Giant hole I assume. It might be kinda essential extending or collapsing the stock if you are wearing heavy gloves somewhere around arctic circle. Picture entirely unrelated.
4 months ago
Anonymous
MO is to ditch the heavy mittens before engaging. FDF still does not even issue winter gloves.
4 months ago
Anonymous
>he doesn't know about the "some-can-do's"
Trigger finger free.
4 months ago
Anonymous
Absolute state of that language
4 months ago
Anonymous
Don't worry, thanks to globalization it is slowly turning to pidgin English with dash of Somalian.
4 months ago
Anonymous
>FDF still does not even issue winter gloves.
That is why most sane people bring their own winter gloves.
>-44C
That's it? That can't be. Every inland western state at Colorado's latitude hits that every winter. Colorado itself hits -50f almost every other year. It's currently -24C right now as I type this in a populated place in Arizona.
>That's it? That can't be. Every inland western state at Colorado's latitude hits that every winter. Colorado itself hits -50f almost every other year. It's currently -24C right now as I type this in a populated place in Arizona.
How high up in mountains you live? Climate itself more complicated than how high up north you are or altitude. You said it yourself, inland. Finnish and Swedish Lapland are way closer to ocean than any inland part of US, be it south west, north west or mid west. -44C isn't far off from -50F.
4 months ago
Anonymous
2150m. Also his pic says the coldest this century, so the last 24 years. Every mountain west state minus AZ and NM but plus OR get that cold every year.
4 months ago
Anonymous
Most winters in this century have been mild if not outright warm. Just like 18 of 20 warmest summers on the record are from this century.
4 months ago
Anonymous
In the US there was a warmer spike in the 1930s in recorded data. Then came a cooling period into the 70s and then another warm up. In much much older data there were dozens of decades that were much hotter than the hottest years recorded this century (hence why the modern climate "scare" is blown out of proportion). The data to support this is from ancient dendrochronology (up to 15kya tree remains), glaciology, sedimentology (long lasting lake sediment compounds), ice cores going back 400kya in the northern and southern hemispheres, and direct texts referencing some of these events (Roman warm period, bronze age warm period and subsequent collapse, Germanic and Slavic migrations c500-600s AD, Justinian plague), c4500 BC warm period etc). Europe is well moderated by the jetstreams and without it it might look more like the upper midwest but at German latitudes. I was just surprised to see that was the coldest it got in northern Europe in the last 24 years, I would've expected about 10C colder in the coldest areas. Another region in the world with similar extremes to North America is inland china (-40-50C in the 30sN latitude).
4 months ago
Anonymous
>-44C
That's it? That can't be. Every inland western state at Colorado's latitude hits that every winter. Colorado itself hits -50f almost every other year. It's currently -24C right now as I type this in a populated place in Arizona.
4 months ago
Anonymous
Its not -24C in arizona. Stop lying.
4 months ago
Anonymous
Yes it was. The annual average absolute minimum statewide is between -25-30C every year (almost always in January or December). One of the coldest cities in the lower 48 with more than 50k people by number of total evenings with a low below 0C is also in Arizona. NM is also the same or slightly colder. The south Rim of GC was also -9F this morning and I have data going back a few years where the coldest temp of the year in AZ in populated places is routinely below -10F and in the state as a whole routinely below -15F (-20F most years).
4 months ago
Anonymous
I have no idea where you got your stats from. This pllace says 5 degrees celsius.
And I wont argue about arizona. I guess it can get pretty cold in some places, but im guessing that the cold doesnt last long.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/1038625/annual-average-minimum-temperature-in-the-us-celsius/
4 months ago
Anonymous
You have zero knowledge of American geography do you.
4 months ago
Anonymous
Also pic related data is just one populated location in northern AZ and no where near the coldest place in the state. Minimum monthly lows recorded in fahrenheit (-40C is equal to -40F). Shit up north is way colder, just a little farther north in Utah and Colorado their minimum lows are about 20-30 degrees colder.
4 months ago
Anonymous
We have golf stream. -5 to -25 C is the normal range for winter in most parts of Finland. People up play the coldness because that's one of the few things we are known for.
However most of the US is much warmer climates than northern Europe.
4 months ago
Anonymous
Its Gulf you silly billy
4 months ago
Anonymous
I don't know if gloves really figure into the design choice, but my brother who did Swedish military service said they were forced to practice operating their weapons quite a bit while wearing gloves so I guess it might not be too far fetched.
4 months ago
Anonymous
Sweden literally had lower temperatures even as late as 2023. Where did you get this from?
Well at least they were smart enough to get them in green instead of desert tan. Those CTR stocks are overused by everyone though.
>You WILL use the AR >You WILL have MLOK >You WILL have MAGPULL stocks and pmags on everything >and YOU WILL LIKE IT!
this is what firearms will plateau into for the next century, either that or some extruded aluminum AR18 variant that will still use the magpul stuff
Germans are very submissive people, as such they're chosen a camo that blends in with the German climate as they expect that if they do go to war, it will be to defend themselves.
Spain however has chosen a camouflage that blends in with the French countryside, as they expect to be fighting in France after France surrenders (again).
England expects to be in the Middle East and so hasn't really bothered with a pattern that would work in England.
France is an oddity, they're submissive, but also know they won't fight any other European power, so they've chosen a color scheme to suite Africa, as colonial commitments are likely to draw them there than anywhere else.
Oh wow, I always think of The Shire when I picture the UK, I know that set was in NZ but I never think about Britain. Multicam wouldn't be half bad here
literal shizo
Complete and utter schizo rambling
[...]
France really needs to start manufacturing small arms again.
NTA but can you tell me why he's wrong? Not argument, genuine question
Anon the last Famas G2 was produced around 1994, the MAS has been closed since 1997, the buildings destroyed or repurposed since 2001. No other assault rifle manufacturer remained. Today Verney Carron is trying to start a low rate upper and lower receivers for a line of AR15 and AR10 relying heavily on aftermarket parts. They previously had the grandiose idea of attempting to build a Galil ACE under licence but it went nowhere.
The small arms industry of France is almost dead. Only Chapuis, bought by Beretta, still makes the MR73, and PGM precision a small line up of bolt action rifles with aftermarket barrels once again.
Apart from a few boutique gunsmiths nobody is making rifle barrels anymore in France.
France had the leading company building ammunition-making machines with Manurhin, but wasn't able to protect the company which is now owned by the UAE.
C'est terminé.
Which explains why the frogs are extremely butt flustered about losing any more of their capabilities. They lost enough already.
France really needs to start manufacturing small arms again.
It's not possible currently. A small arms company can't survive on domestic military contracts alone and the civilian market isn't large enough due to decades of shitty gun laws
i dont know how its in other balt militaries but here you're supposed to augment stuff for whatever camo you have (mostly just the terrain you are dealing with)
That picture is obviously not related. That is wrong kind of forest for Jigsaw, background is way darker than camo. It works really great in leafy forests you find in Belgium and northern France, it blends into inconsistent shadows of leafy forests really well. If doesn't work that well in boreal forests with mostly pines and spruce.
Blending into foliage under a shadow is the easy part, particularly when there is no movement involved.
The hard part is not being noticed when you're operating operationally in direct sunlight.
4 months ago
Anonymous
There is a reason said inconsistent shadows, European leafy forests aren't exactly a damn triple canopy jungle. Shadows move when branches of trees move in the wind and it lets light thru it. Freaky thing about Jigsaw is that blends into leafy forest while moving better than you'd expect, especially on sunny weather when contrast between shadow and non shadow parts is more extreme. The contrast between yellow-ish light green, blue-ish dark green and red or purple-ish brown on jigsaw sort of plays into that.
>Jigsaw had a moronic color scheme thought, I don't know what moron designed it, but it was third world tier
Jigsaw worked fine in the Ardennes AND the DRC. It also worked somewhat decently in Flemish forests.
It didn't work super well elsewhere tho; but it was kinda ok. Multicam doesn't work well at all in Belgium. So imo it was only selected due to foreign missions and wanting to fit in (and due to economies of scale).
Also keep in mind that if you've only seen Jigsaw in pictures, that it often presents differently in pics. Often has more purple/pink hues which are due to flash photography (I think?).
https://i.imgur.com/5VFh9wz.png
>not having amphibious ships
Belgium still uses the F2000, mostly for grenadiers.
Pic clearly not related? The only one that disappears in that image is flecktarn
>Pic clearly not related? The only one that disappears in that image is flecktarn
Belgium considered switching to a variation of flecktarn, but that idea was killed off due to perception issues. It's what was used by "the enemy" after all.
Pic clearly not related? The only one that disappears in that image is flecktarn
https://i.imgur.com/xgjYYz1.jpg
Jigsaw had a moronic color scheme thought, I don't know what moron designed it, but it was third world tier
>Belgium considered switching to a variation of flecktarn, but that idea was killed off due to perception issues. It's what was used by "the enemy" after all.
The Belgian air force actually did for a brief time, I have one of those webbings. >left is bundeswehr parka, right is luchtmacht webbing
Pay notice to the brighter greens of the Belgian fleck, from experience, I can say it blends well in the lusher forests of flanders
AK-74M and RK-62 are my favorite rifles on there. British camo has looked good for awhile too.
The surprise for me is Turkey looking surprisingly nice with that grid backing on their camo and that rifle.
Because the pattern being shown is the "woodland pattern". Guess where its meant to be used?
Every nation has multiple patterns nowadays so I don't know why they didn't either use multiple per nation or have cammos of the same environment per nation.
>spain >mostly arid mediterranean bushland >camo is dark green as if they lived in the russian taiga
Spain's choice of camo is surprising. Their camo seems too lush for their arid environment, or any environment I would expect to see their military in. Switzerland's seems completely moronic. Italy seems the most grounded in reality.
Ok I enjoyed all the "buh muh spain green" bollocks but its time to set the record straight. Look at Picrel.
EVERYTHING NOT IN WHITE THERE IS A FOREST.
https://link.springer.com/chapter/10.1007/978-3-030-99206-4_13
Spain ain't the god damned Dustbowl. Its dry compared with Germany sure. Extremadura and La Mancha are drier than a nun's c**t. But most of the peninsula is still very much covered in dark forests, with the Iberian peninsula being one of the most ecologically diverse places on earth due to the very distinct climates caused by the effects of the mediterranean, atlantic, and utter mess of wind currents around it, and even up to the civil war most of the non-urban combat happened on the multiple forest-covered mountainranges that make up the entire god damned periphery of the peninsula and are the reason the interior is so dry.
last time I was in europe they had HK MR223 priced 4-500 euros below something like a DD MK18. I guess for an army they can get them even cheaper making them economical.
Here a MR223 is at least CHF4'000. On the other hand DD MK18, Geissele URGI 16", B&T APC223 PRO are all like CHF2'600. Even the Sig SG55x are cheaper (3-3.5k).
Not only are they israelites for trying to scam you but when you refuse to be scammed they fricking sue you.
Frick H&K and their overrated and overpriced pieces of shit. Frick the morons who give them money.
Fricking cucks. All of you, I swear. You NEED to be sucking the dick of powerful man/empire. Be it a random king, the HRE, the Reich or the EU. Sheep mentality.
Anon the last Famas G2 was produced around 1994, the MAS has been closed since 1997, the buildings destroyed or repurposed since 2001. No other assault rifle manufacturer remained. Today Verney Carron is trying to start a low rate upper and lower receivers for a line of AR15 and AR10 relying heavily on aftermarket parts. They previously had the grandiose idea of attempting to build a Galil ACE under licence but it went nowhere.
The small arms industry of France is almost dead. Only Chapuis, bought by Beretta, still makes the MR73, and PGM precision a small line up of bolt action rifles with aftermarket barrels once again.
Apart from a few boutique gunsmiths nobody is making rifle barrels anymore in France.
France had the leading company building ammunition-making machines with Manurhin, but wasn't able to protect the company which is now owned by the UAE.
C'est terminé.
Which explains why the frogs are extremely butt flustered about losing any more of their capabilities. They lost enough already.
hey when belgium splits you can take wallonia and get FN
You have to take the walloons and their debts tough.
https://i.imgur.com/dImlu3f.png
i know YOU in despitent OF
Complete and utter schizo rambling
[...]
France really needs to start manufacturing small arms again.
What.the.frick.
French steel from alsace-lorraine was literally considered THE go to for barrels.
>wasn't able to protect the company which is now owned by the UAE.
fricking insane that any country allows companies linked to fricking defense go ahead and get bought by a foreign nation
France sells what little it knows how to do.
Macron, before becoming president, he was already at the Ministry of the Economy in 2015-2017. (and before in the Rotschield bank)
-The end of Famas to buy foreign.
-For the assault tanks, we had the AMX Leclerc, that's it.
Today there is a Franco-German company, Nexter.
French know-how is given to the Germans, the Germans give nothing to the French.
-For fighter planes.
They want to do European cooperation like for the Eurofighter, with Dassault Aviation (Rafale) in it.
Once again, let Dassaulte give its know-how without compensation.
-Alstom (subway, tram, train) was sold to the Americans.
-Nuclear power, sacrificed for German coal
-sell everything to repay the banks.
the next president will have a country without know-how or industry, but still in debt.
HS Produkt was not offering such a solution, instead they offered to buy everything they could from the established french companies to accessorize the weapons. The VHS2 ended up second behind the HK416 during the competition.
>What.the.frick. >French steel from alsace-lorraine was literally considered THE go to for barrels.
Yes anon, most notably many H&K barrels are still hammer forged from steel alloy bars that are made by Aubert & Duval which is a french steel milling company. >https://www.hkpro.com/threads/what-kind-of-steel-is-used-in-hk416-417.192466/?post_id=1547395&nested_view=1#post-1547395 >https://www.aubertduval.com/markets/forgings-bars-plates-navy-missiles-firearms-armored-vehicles-artillery/firearm-materials-barrel-gun-steel-wear-defense/
But regarding military or police oriented weapons, except with the few MR73 made by Chapuis now owned by Beretta ; which is apparently treating Chapuis very well kudos to them ; not a single manufacturer uses french steel to make their small arms, not even Verney Carron, recently renamed Lebel, which is using Lothar Walther buttoned barrels for the AR15 and AR10 receivers they're machining at their facilities in Saint-Étienne. >https://www.lebel.eu/en/
Only bigger weapons and calibers still use french steel, whether it is for rifled or smoothbore guns. For 20 25 30 40 105 120 and 155mm barrels, Nexter, now fully integrated within the KNDS group alongside KMW, does 100% of the process in France. Doesn't mean everything's perfect, they have their own issues. The CTAS40 is still causing problems with certain kind of ammo for example.
Anyway, it sure looks immensely stupid for a country to be able to make rockets missiles of all sorts fighter jets nuclear submarines carriers etc, but not combat boots and rifles anymore. Yet that's where France is at right now, while it's losing more and more capabilities year after year, and not gaining much. As I said prior that's why frogs are extremely butthurt about all this stuff.
>wasn't able to protect the company which is now owned by the UAE.
fricking insane that any country allows companies linked to fricking defense go ahead and get bought by a foreign nation
For about 25 years even long before the closure of the Cartoucherie du Mans which was making ammo for the french forces, a closure that forced France to buy all of its small arms ammo abroad (that's what started the myth about the Famas not digesting brass case ammo btw) the ammunition making machines subsidiary of Manurhin was not selling anything to France. 100% of their market was foreign.
One would think if you got a company making ammunition-making machines, you could buy them some machines then start your own ammo production, right?
But not France.
During 10 years there was a debate about restarting that national capacity to make small arms ammo, for penny on the dollar comparatively with the budget of a so called first world country. In the same time Manurhin was briefly owned by the Slovak group Delta Defense.
Well, nobody agreed on anything, and the government didn't give a shit, so Manurhin got finally sold to Edic (Emirates Defense Industries Company) in 2018. The company is still located in France but could be delocalized. >https://france3-regions.francetvinfo.fr/grand-est/haut-rhin/mulhouse/mulhouse-avenir-manurhin-se-decide-au-tribunal-ce-mercredi-1520546.html >https://www.francesoir.fr/tendances-eco-france/munitions-manurhin-obtient-un-nouveau-sursis >https://www.lesechos.fr/pme-regions/grand-est/armement-des-doutes-subsistent-sur-la-relance-de-la-manufacture-du-haut-rhin-1317077
Imagine this in any other country. Not even bong officials are as dumb as french politicians.
Nexter is french, it's the ex GIAT basically. Krauss-Maffei Wegmann which is german. The two form KNDS. Technically both companies still act separately but they try to work more closely since the creation of the common brand.
>implying that the French could design a actual functional rifle
The FAMAS was a clown show, if they copied the fluted chamber they MIGHT have been able to use brass cased ammo but they didn't so using brass results in case head separation, so they adopted 5.56 NATO while not being able to use 5.56 NATO. In essence it's perfectly French. >Ian reeeee
Shut up Ian, you are wrong about everything.
Why do Baltic countries all have so different camo color while their terrain is all most identical?
Also Latvia has the worst camo pattern i have ever seen.
I think it looks great. Definetly much better than the previous desert uniforms (yes they gave the whole army desert uniforms because some soldiers were deployed in afghanistan etc)
Why do Baltic countries all have so different camo color while their terrain is all most identical?
Also Latvia has the worst camo pattern i have ever seen.
, that's the new WoodLatpat that's replacing the original LATPAT, which was designed at the height of the War in Afghanistan when the only serious combat the Latvian Army expected to see was going to be in the Middle East
yeah maybe, I just saw some Latvian troops the other day and the camo worked pretty good. this image doesn't do it justice, it's like miniature Swedish camo, or triangular digital.
from more than 20m away it just looks like green multicam.
im unironically thinking of getting a civvie one because i cant be bothered with the militia shit but i've heard that the PPA is trying to frick with new gun licence owners.
FRICK I WANT MY AK4
italian vegetato performs surprisingly well even outside of italy. meanwhile their vegetato version for clay rocky mountains is almost cheat like with how good it is if there is some sparse snow
I’m sick of living in the U.S.
Recommend me a European country that >isn’t going to be Muslim in 20 years >has good gun laws >decent wages >preferably trad/catholic
This pretty much. You'll make more as a full-time burger flipper in Cali than in most jobs in most Euro countries. That said, the cost of living is also significantly lower, so your disposable income might end up better.
The only fricked thing is property costs, the supply outgrew demand a fair while ago, so prices of homes are pretty stupid rn
Czech republic is closest to what you're looking for.
If you are in the top of your field and mentally healthy, and are willing to adopt the culture, you can try your luck with Switzerland, though they hardly let anyone in.
>I’m sick of living in the U.S.
You're probably sick of the state you live in. Try moving to another part of the US first. A state like Maine or New Hampshire checks all of your boxes.
Best rifle on the market at the time. First rifle with integratesd Optics that are rugged and where pretty good at the time for a low price. Its a light gun and very reliable.
it has two a 1x Reddot something and a 3x scope
While compared to todays optics they are extremly shit compared to the generation it was brought onto the market there was no equvialent. You either had extremly expensive stuff or you had none at all.
It's still being tested. It's going to be a while before we'll get issued these. Also, I really don't like this Lampart camo, it's not much different than wz. 93. They should have went with MAPA.
Allegedly. They initially wanted to buy Italian replacements, but eventually decided that we'll build our own local AK with NATO-standard bullets. Of course, unless we change our mind again.
idiots don't realize the point of specific camouflages is to provide identification of uniformed services and prevent blue on blue engagements, actual camouflage is a secondary concern because all of them get dirty and blend well after like a week in the field
are camouflage patterns that important for the individual soldier anymore? I feel like there should be more focus on being resistant to night vision and thermal imaging rather than trying to blend into a local bush as well as possible.
Unironically, AMCU is best for the majority of Australia, excluding the far north and Queensland, where a transition to multicam tropic would be better. Plus, multicam tropic would be better for operating in Indonesia and Papua New Guniea
Icelandic idiot here, my understanding is that NATO designated the camo pattern to be used in Iceland in case of an invasion defence scenario. I also think I recall something about the U.S giving the coast guard a bunch of camo around the closure of the airbase so that might also have something to do with it.
Spain's choice of camo is surprising. Their camo seems too lush for their arid environment, or any environment I would expect to see their military in. Switzerland's seems completely moronic. Italy seems the most grounded in reality.
Yeah, they were domestically manufactured so the military has plenty in stock. They were looking for a replacement but that program apparently fizzled into nothingness. Specialist units and spec-ops get M16s and M4s, and in the navy we had everything from fully kitted M4s to old Uzis, Turkish shotguns captured from smugglers and a fricking BAR.
Austria is by far the smartest because they don't actually use standard camo, they wear solid colours and adopt region specific smocks or fatigues based on deployment as needed
France is right behind them for somehow making a decent version of multicam
Ireland is good for using AUGs and woodland (very fashionable, I don't actually know anything about the Irish defence forces and assume they are completely underfunded)
Malta is mega based for just buying old AKMs lol
Latvia took too much LSD
I own a set of Italian camo and it actually works pretty well in chaparral, and I have to give them points for using a domestic rifle
Ukraine's shitty digicam is garbage, one of the few camos worse than multicam, Russia's is less bad but not great, all the other slavs are okay
Turkey actually has a pretty interesting pattern, I'd like to see how well it works especially in low light conditions
If the german army was real I would say they are above average
Everyone with basic b***h multi cam is moronic
I have no other strong opinions regarding the others, except to say Slovakia is cool for still using the VZ.58
also lol bosnia thinks it's the USMC
>Who is moronic and who is smart according to this?
Bullpup users = smart
Others = moronic
Also who tf knew Slovenia uses the F2K that's sexo
Iceland having no army is either extremely smart or extremely moronic and I can't quite decide which. On one hand, it's very hard for someone to justify an attack you if you don't have any military assets in the first place. Which means every other country on the planet should theoretically side with you if that were to happen. On the other hand, well....
>Iceland having no army is either extremely smart or extremely moronic and I can't quite decide which. On one hand, it's very hard for someone to justify an attack you if you don't have any military assets in the first place. Which means every other country on the planet should theoretically side with you if that were to happen. On the other hand, well....
I think that the reasoning is mostly "who the frick is going to invade us?" and frankly I don't really think they're wrong.
Russians, but unrelated to the AK and the pattern
Finland and Sweden are both transitioning to SAKO assault rifles and battle rifles.
>Finland and Sweden are both transitioning
true
>Brings up trannies
Why
rent free trannies of course
he should start charging them
Sosialism, you know.
In Finland its currently being delayed because H&K sued government.
https://www.reuters.com/business/aerospace-defense/german-arms-maker-takes-finland-market-court-over-rifle-choice-2023-08-08/
I can't wait for market court dismiss the case, H&K filing a complaint to supreme court, supreme court refusing to take the case, H&K complaining to EU courts and so on. This is the state of EU defense cooperation. Salty c**ts that cannot offer supply security Finnish defense forces need suing the military.
Ah yes, and this means that the adoption of the new rifle gets postponed by several years. Fricking EU and most of all, fricking germoids.
Whats H&K's issue anyway
And they only started this shit with Finland, even though the swedes are further into the procurement process. It's almost like they decided the swedish order would be too small potatoes for them to bother.
Basically they argue that the finnish order should go through a bidding process with trials.
The finnish argument is that in case of a hot war in Europe, the sea route between Finland and Germany may not be accessible at times, and spare parts and replacements for the HK rifles may not be available in a timely fashion. Hence the importance of domestic tooling for maintenance and production of required parts.
HK argues that this is abuse of the EU rules and basically dismiss without explanation any potential issues with parts availability and maintenance, and argue that needing to ship rifles fricked beyond basic armorer's capabilities back to Germany is not going to be an issue in a war.
>argue that needing to ship rifles fricked beyond basic armorer's capabilities back to Germany is not going to be an issue in a war.
And they think thats gonna hold up in court?
Yes.
And that's before anyone pulls out the "demand surge" argument that a large land war in Europe would cause.
No. That anon paints a very one sided picture because he has strong feefees. I recommend reading the actual documents since HK's argument isn't that far fetched.
Link?
>And they only started this shit with Finland, even though the swedes are further into the procurement process. It's almost like they decided the swedish order would be too small potatoes for them to bother.
Tactical lawfare at its finest. I guess they count on SAKO/Beretta production being uneconomical with just Swedish order.
I bet HK is gonna throw another hissy fit at Beretta like with their SA contract
those things look sexo as frick
painting something green automatically makes it sexier
>painting something green automatically makes it sexier
That's most likely not what she said.
Well at least they were smart enough to get them in green instead of desert tan. Those CTR stocks are overused by everyone though.
>Those CTR stocks are overused by everyone though.
that would be a valid argument if they were bad but theyre not
one day you will grow out of your contrarianism stage
They're not bad but they're is nothing about them that means everyone and their mother has to use one. Have some style for once.
Going for "style points" in the military has gotten out of fashion ever since WW 1
Am I the only one who thinks they’re bad because there’s a giant fricking whole in it? Perfect for catching on everything in this world. What the frick happened to snag free, smooth designs, it’s like we regressed on this aspect.
>Am I the only one who thinks they’re bad because there’s a giant fricking whole in it? Perfect for catching on everything in this world. What the frick happened to snag free, smooth designs, it’s like we regressed on this aspect.
Giant hole I assume. It might be kinda essential extending or collapsing the stock if you are wearing heavy gloves somewhere around arctic circle. Picture entirely unrelated.
MO is to ditch the heavy mittens before engaging. FDF still does not even issue winter gloves.
>he doesn't know about the "some-can-do's"
Trigger finger free.
Absolute state of that language
Don't worry, thanks to globalization it is slowly turning to pidgin English with dash of Somalian.
>FDF still does not even issue winter gloves.
That is why most sane people bring their own winter gloves.
>That's it? That can't be. Every inland western state at Colorado's latitude hits that every winter. Colorado itself hits -50f almost every other year. It's currently -24C right now as I type this in a populated place in Arizona.
How high up in mountains you live? Climate itself more complicated than how high up north you are or altitude. You said it yourself, inland. Finnish and Swedish Lapland are way closer to ocean than any inland part of US, be it south west, north west or mid west. -44C isn't far off from -50F.
2150m. Also his pic says the coldest this century, so the last 24 years. Every mountain west state minus AZ and NM but plus OR get that cold every year.
Most winters in this century have been mild if not outright warm. Just like 18 of 20 warmest summers on the record are from this century.
In the US there was a warmer spike in the 1930s in recorded data. Then came a cooling period into the 70s and then another warm up. In much much older data there were dozens of decades that were much hotter than the hottest years recorded this century (hence why the modern climate "scare" is blown out of proportion). The data to support this is from ancient dendrochronology (up to 15kya tree remains), glaciology, sedimentology (long lasting lake sediment compounds), ice cores going back 400kya in the northern and southern hemispheres, and direct texts referencing some of these events (Roman warm period, bronze age warm period and subsequent collapse, Germanic and Slavic migrations c500-600s AD, Justinian plague), c4500 BC warm period etc). Europe is well moderated by the jetstreams and without it it might look more like the upper midwest but at German latitudes. I was just surprised to see that was the coldest it got in northern Europe in the last 24 years, I would've expected about 10C colder in the coldest areas. Another region in the world with similar extremes to North America is inland china (-40-50C in the 30sN latitude).
>-44C
That's it? That can't be. Every inland western state at Colorado's latitude hits that every winter. Colorado itself hits -50f almost every other year. It's currently -24C right now as I type this in a populated place in Arizona.
Its not -24C in arizona. Stop lying.
Yes it was. The annual average absolute minimum statewide is between -25-30C every year (almost always in January or December). One of the coldest cities in the lower 48 with more than 50k people by number of total evenings with a low below 0C is also in Arizona. NM is also the same or slightly colder. The south Rim of GC was also -9F this morning and I have data going back a few years where the coldest temp of the year in AZ in populated places is routinely below -10F and in the state as a whole routinely below -15F (-20F most years).
I have no idea where you got your stats from. This pllace says 5 degrees celsius.
And I wont argue about arizona. I guess it can get pretty cold in some places, but im guessing that the cold doesnt last long.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/1038625/annual-average-minimum-temperature-in-the-us-celsius/
You have zero knowledge of American geography do you.
Also pic related data is just one populated location in northern AZ and no where near the coldest place in the state. Minimum monthly lows recorded in fahrenheit (-40C is equal to -40F). Shit up north is way colder, just a little farther north in Utah and Colorado their minimum lows are about 20-30 degrees colder.
We have golf stream. -5 to -25 C is the normal range for winter in most parts of Finland. People up play the coldness because that's one of the few things we are known for.
However most of the US is much warmer climates than northern Europe.
Its Gulf you silly billy
I don't know if gloves really figure into the design choice, but my brother who did Swedish military service said they were forced to practice operating their weapons quite a bit while wearing gloves so I guess it might not be too far fetched.
Sweden literally had lower temperatures even as late as 2023. Where did you get this from?
moronkun, check the top right 🙂
Well what could catch in that hole? That triangle is there so that it would not snag.
What would you propose instead?
>Transition
I would have not put a more proper wording!
troonysition to rifles that jam on winter. THANKS NATO
Are these trannies in the room with us now? In your search history perhaps?
>Jams
>Forward assist do nothing
The Swedish national guard will never get to touch the AK 5 does it? another 40 years of the trusted ak 4 (FN FAL)
Ak4 is a G3, not a FAL.
>another countries are falling to AR menace
>You WILL use the AR
>You WILL have MLOK
>You WILL have MAGPULL stocks and pmags on everything
>and YOU WILL LIKE IT!
this is what firearms will plateau into for the next century, either that or some extruded aluminum AR18 variant that will still use the magpul stuff
Cope and Seethe AK gay
MLOK is disgusting
It's better than Keymod or HKey but the worse offender is all of the handguards that are too slim/narrow or cut with way too many damn holes.
>red dot + magnifier
Oh no no no, /arg/ on sucide watch.
For some reason we decided to go with the 7.62 mm as the standard rifle and the 5.56 as a PDW
That's because God apparently exists and prefers the proliferation of battle rifles to the alleviation of human suffering
It's pretty interesting you can use this map to see which country fights offensively (dominant) and defensively (submissive).
elaborate
Germans are very submissive people, as such they're chosen a camo that blends in with the German climate as they expect that if they do go to war, it will be to defend themselves.
Spain however has chosen a camouflage that blends in with the French countryside, as they expect to be fighting in France after France surrenders (again).
England expects to be in the Middle East and so hasn't really bothered with a pattern that would work in England.
France is an oddity, they're submissive, but also know they won't fight any other European power, so they've chosen a color scheme to suite Africa, as colonial commitments are likely to draw them there than anywhere else.
I don't know if this is an elaborate troll, you are a based moron, or need your meds. Or all of the above.
His A.I. girlfriend didn't allow him out of his chastity cage today and now he's resorting to writing erotic fanfiction to relieve himself.
hot
>England expects to be in the Middle East and so hasn't really bothered with a pattern that would work in England.
snorted
literal shizo
>England expects to be in the Middle East and so hasn't really bothered with a pattern that would work in England.
Please be trolling
There are thirteen scotsmen passed out drunk in that photo. All are wearing blue/red/yellow coloured kilts.
Oh wow, I always think of The Shire when I picture the UK, I know that set was in NZ but I never think about Britain. Multicam wouldn't be half bad here
NTA but can you tell me why he's wrong? Not argument, genuine question
Complete and utter schizo rambling
France really needs to start manufacturing small arms again.
It's not possible currently. A small arms company can't survive on domestic military contracts alone and the civilian market isn't large enough due to decades of shitty gun laws
Have a (You)
everything you said is moronic except for the bit about Germans they really do suck
Belgium is moronic for switching to multicam
Jigsaw had way more soul
Jigsaw had a moronic color scheme thought, I don't know what moron designed it, but it was third world tier
Jigsaw had a perfectly fine color scheme.
You'd be surprised how effective it can be
Pic clearly not related? The only one that disappears in that image is flecktarn
i dont know how its in other balt militaries but here you're supposed to augment stuff for whatever camo you have (mostly just the terrain you are dealing with)
why is that Carl Gustav see through
because i didnt have the wooden dummy round loaded and that rifling is gorgeous
Estonian stealth ammo
That picture is obviously not related. That is wrong kind of forest for Jigsaw, background is way darker than camo. It works really great in leafy forests you find in Belgium and northern France, it blends into inconsistent shadows of leafy forests really well. If doesn't work that well in boreal forests with mostly pines and spruce.
Blending into foliage under a shadow is the easy part, particularly when there is no movement involved.
The hard part is not being noticed when you're operating operationally in direct sunlight.
There is a reason said inconsistent shadows, European leafy forests aren't exactly a damn triple canopy jungle. Shadows move when branches of trees move in the wind and it lets light thru it. Freaky thing about Jigsaw is that blends into leafy forest while moving better than you'd expect, especially on sunny weather when contrast between shadow and non shadow parts is more extreme. The contrast between yellow-ish light green, blue-ish dark green and red or purple-ish brown on jigsaw sort of plays into that.
Never said it did good, merely implying that it performs better than the silly color scheme may lead you to believe
I've done exercises with Belgian troops and their camo blends in surprisingly well. I had the same attitude as you when I first saw it.
It seems like a leftover from the colonial days in the Congo.
>Jigsaw had a moronic color scheme thought, I don't know what moron designed it, but it was third world tier
Jigsaw worked fine in the Ardennes AND the DRC. It also worked somewhat decently in Flemish forests.
It didn't work super well elsewhere tho; but it was kinda ok. Multicam doesn't work well at all in Belgium. So imo it was only selected due to foreign missions and wanting to fit in (and due to economies of scale).
Also keep in mind that if you've only seen Jigsaw in pictures, that it often presents differently in pics. Often has more purple/pink hues which are due to flash photography (I think?).
Belgium still uses the F2000, mostly for grenadiers.
>Pic clearly not related? The only one that disappears in that image is flecktarn
Belgium considered switching to a variation of flecktarn, but that idea was killed off due to perception issues. It's what was used by "the enemy" after all.
>Belgium considered switching to a variation of flecktarn, but that idea was killed off due to perception issues. It's what was used by "the enemy" after all.
The Belgian air force actually did for a brief time, I have one of those webbings.
>left is bundeswehr parka, right is luchtmacht webbing
Pay notice to the brighter greens of the Belgian fleck, from experience, I can say it blends well in the lusher forests of flanders
Dude from experience French Jigsaw works, especially after 50 meters it's as good as any other Camo
AK-74M and RK-62 are my favorite rifles on there. British camo has looked good for awhile too.
The surprise for me is Turkey looking surprisingly nice with that grid backing on their camo and that rifle.
Why is Spain so green?
Because the pattern being shown is the "woodland pattern". Guess where its meant to be used?
Every nation has multiple patterns nowadays so I don't know why they didn't either use multiple per nation or have cammos of the same environment per nation.
Ok I enjoyed all the "buh muh spain green" bollocks but its time to set the record straight. Look at Picrel.
EVERYTHING NOT IN WHITE THERE IS A FOREST.
https://link.springer.com/chapter/10.1007/978-3-030-99206-4_13
Spain ain't the god damned Dustbowl. Its dry compared with Germany sure. Extremadura and La Mancha are drier than a nun's c**t. But most of the peninsula is still very much covered in dark forests, with the Iberian peninsula being one of the most ecologically diverse places on earth due to the very distinct climates caused by the effects of the mediterranean, atlantic, and utter mess of wind currents around it, and even up to the civil war most of the non-urban combat happened on the multiple forest-covered mountainranges that make up the entire god damned periphery of the peninsula and are the reason the interior is so dry.
>France replacing the FAMAS to a foreign manufactured rifle
arent the french extremely autistic about independant military capabilities? Why not replace it with a domestic rifle?
>independant military capabilities
Not anymore, apparently HK416 are actually somewhat economical in the big picture
last time I was in europe they had HK MR223 priced 4-500 euros below something like a DD MK18. I guess for an army they can get them even cheaper making them economical.
H&K are fricking israelites.
Here a MR223 is at least CHF4'000. On the other hand DD MK18, Geissele URGI 16", B&T APC223 PRO are all like CHF2'600. Even the Sig SG55x are cheaper (3-3.5k).
Not only are they israelites for trying to scam you but when you refuse to be scammed they fricking sue you.
Frick H&K and their overrated and overpriced pieces of shit. Frick the morons who give them money.
should have stayed in the HRE mountain israelite
Fricking cucks. All of you, I swear. You NEED to be sucking the dick of powerful man/empire. Be it a random king, the HRE, the Reich or the EU. Sheep mentality.
>Here a MR223 is at least CHF4'000
that's just the absurd cost of everything in switzerland. my mr223a3 costed me 1999 euros
https://www.frankonia.de/p/heckler-koch/selbstladeb%C3%BCchse-mr223-a3/182930
>malt and seethe
Its still pretty expenisve at nearly 3k Euros
but they have a nice price for a Zigger hunting rifle right now. It comes with a integraded supressor
https://www.frankonia.de/p/haenel/repetierb%C3%BCchse-rs-8-subsonic/2002000?lastSelected=f_s_kategorie&f_s_kategorie=GK-Matchb%C3%BCchsen&navCategoryId=62273
https://www.frankonia.de/p/heckler-koch/selbstladeb%C3%BCchse-hk-243-s-tar/181495?sortOption=price_desc&navCategoryId=66790
Last link I dont want to advertise to much but 2,5k for a G36 look alike seems a bit steep but I think its more precise as its for sport and not war
>https://www.frankonia.de/p/heckler-koch/selbstladeb%C3%BCchse-mr223-a3/182930
>3k for key-mod
Anon the last Famas G2 was produced around 1994, the MAS has been closed since 1997, the buildings destroyed or repurposed since 2001. No other assault rifle manufacturer remained. Today Verney Carron is trying to start a low rate upper and lower receivers for a line of AR15 and AR10 relying heavily on aftermarket parts. They previously had the grandiose idea of attempting to build a Galil ACE under licence but it went nowhere.
The small arms industry of France is almost dead. Only Chapuis, bought by Beretta, still makes the MR73, and PGM precision a small line up of bolt action rifles with aftermarket barrels once again.
Apart from a few boutique gunsmiths nobody is making rifle barrels anymore in France.
France had the leading company building ammunition-making machines with Manurhin, but wasn't able to protect the company which is now owned by the UAE.
C'est terminé.
Which explains why the frogs are extremely butt flustered about losing any more of their capabilities. They lost enough already.
fricked up
France sells what little it knows how to do.
Macron, before becoming president, he was already at the Ministry of the Economy in 2015-2017. (and before in the Rotschield bank)
-The end of Famas to buy foreign.
-For the assault tanks, we had the AMX Leclerc, that's it.
Today there is a Franco-German company, Nexter.
French know-how is given to the Germans, the Germans give nothing to the French.
-For fighter planes.
They want to do European cooperation like for the Eurofighter, with Dassault Aviation (Rafale) in it.
Once again, let Dassaulte give its know-how without compensation.
-Alstom (subway, tram, train) was sold to the Americans.
-Nuclear power, sacrificed for German coal
-sell everything to repay the banks.
the next president will have a country without know-how or industry, but still in debt.
least schizo frenchoid
hey when belgium splits you can take wallonia and get FN
You have to take the walloons and their debts tough.
We will have to filter the wallons from the Moroccans too.
And 3.5 million hobos unwilling to work, fricking frogs.
You could've bought VHS license and restart your small arms manufacture.
HS Produkt was not offering such a solution, instead they offered to buy everything they could from the established french companies to accessorize the weapons. The VHS2 ended up second behind the HK416 during the competition.
i know YOU in despitent OF
What.the.frick.
French steel from alsace-lorraine was literally considered THE go to for barrels.
>What.the.frick.
>French steel from alsace-lorraine was literally considered THE go to for barrels.
Yes anon, most notably many H&K barrels are still hammer forged from steel alloy bars that are made by Aubert & Duval which is a french steel milling company.
>https://www.hkpro.com/threads/what-kind-of-steel-is-used-in-hk416-417.192466/?post_id=1547395&nested_view=1#post-1547395
>https://www.aubertduval.com/markets/forgings-bars-plates-navy-missiles-firearms-armored-vehicles-artillery/firearm-materials-barrel-gun-steel-wear-defense/
But regarding military or police oriented weapons, except with the few MR73 made by Chapuis now owned by Beretta ; which is apparently treating Chapuis very well kudos to them ; not a single manufacturer uses french steel to make their small arms, not even Verney Carron, recently renamed Lebel, which is using Lothar Walther buttoned barrels for the AR15 and AR10 receivers they're machining at their facilities in Saint-Étienne.
>https://www.lebel.eu/en/
Only bigger weapons and calibers still use french steel, whether it is for rifled or smoothbore guns. For 20 25 30 40 105 120 and 155mm barrels, Nexter, now fully integrated within the KNDS group alongside KMW, does 100% of the process in France. Doesn't mean everything's perfect, they have their own issues. The CTAS40 is still causing problems with certain kind of ammo for example.
Anyway, it sure looks immensely stupid for a country to be able to make rockets missiles of all sorts fighter jets nuclear submarines carriers etc, but not combat boots and rifles anymore. Yet that's where France is at right now, while it's losing more and more capabilities year after year, and not gaining much. As I said prior that's why frogs are extremely butthurt about all this stuff.
>wasn't able to protect the company which is now owned by the UAE.
fricking insane that any country allows companies linked to fricking defense go ahead and get bought by a foreign nation
For about 25 years even long before the closure of the Cartoucherie du Mans which was making ammo for the french forces, a closure that forced France to buy all of its small arms ammo abroad (that's what started the myth about the Famas not digesting brass case ammo btw) the ammunition making machines subsidiary of Manurhin was not selling anything to France. 100% of their market was foreign.
One would think if you got a company making ammunition-making machines, you could buy them some machines then start your own ammo production, right?
But not France.
During 10 years there was a debate about restarting that national capacity to make small arms ammo, for penny on the dollar comparatively with the budget of a so called first world country. In the same time Manurhin was briefly owned by the Slovak group Delta Defense.
Well, nobody agreed on anything, and the government didn't give a shit, so Manurhin got finally sold to Edic (Emirates Defense Industries Company) in 2018. The company is still located in France but could be delocalized.
>https://france3-regions.francetvinfo.fr/grand-est/haut-rhin/mulhouse/mulhouse-avenir-manurhin-se-decide-au-tribunal-ce-mercredi-1520546.html
>https://www.francesoir.fr/tendances-eco-france/munitions-manurhin-obtient-un-nouveau-sursis
>https://www.lesechos.fr/pme-regions/grand-est/armement-des-doutes-subsistent-sur-la-relance-de-la-manufacture-du-haut-rhin-1317077
Imagine this in any other country. Not even bong officials are as dumb as french politicians.
Nexter is french, it's the ex GIAT basically. Krauss-Maffei Wegmann which is german. The two form KNDS. Technically both companies still act separately but they try to work more closely since the creation of the common brand.
>implying that the French could design a actual functional rifle
The FAMAS was a clown show, if they copied the fluted chamber they MIGHT have been able to use brass cased ammo but they didn't so using brass results in case head separation, so they adopted 5.56 NATO while not being able to use 5.56 NATO. In essence it's perfectly French.
>Ian reeeee
Shut up Ian, you are wrong about everything.
You can tell Ukraine are the good guys because they use wood in their rifles
>Scandinavia, the baltics and Poland
Name my band
Depression factory
Scandinavia is one of the happiest places on earth, ironically. Sweden these days, not so much…
>Sweden these days, not so much
Its actually up on the index
Fake news
lol I've worked in Romania and was only happy for some ladies.
"Gustavus Adolphus and the boys"
Vasa
Every weapon is okay enough except the british lol
Estonia has it pretty good
brace yourself
for what, fighting some arabs while your shithole gets raped
After the improvements, it's perfectly fine.
They will upgrade soon enough, though.
>Greece
>G3
holy shit i love Greece even more than i did now.
Czechia has the prettiest colors.
>not having amphibious ships
>britain, to the north from germany and poland uses desert camo
moronic
not to mention rifle meme
Romania is by far the most cretinous.
why tho
Bad genes i guess
0 friendly fire
>dress your guys like they are Player 1 units in an RTS
kinda based
Austria was the last smart country.
Why do Baltic countries all have so different camo color while their terrain is all most identical?
Also Latvia has the worst camo pattern i have ever seen.
>Also Latvia
they are called scatvia for a reason
I think it looks great. Definetly much better than the previous desert uniforms (yes they gave the whole army desert uniforms because some soldiers were deployed in afghanistan etc)
Forgot pic
It blends very well
That's not the same pattern as
, that's the new WoodLatpat that's replacing the original LATPAT, which was designed at the height of the War in Afghanistan when the only serious combat the Latvian Army expected to see was going to be in the Middle East
The pattern I posted is the one in the OP picture
This pic has both patterns
I like the Latvian camo
yeah maybe, I just saw some Latvian troops the other day and the camo worked pretty good. this image doesn't do it justice, it's like miniature Swedish camo, or triangular digital.
from more than 20m away it just looks like green multicam.
this, it makes the triangles look massive when in reality they're pretty much the same size as LATPAT minecraft cubes, that is, pretty fricking small
i refuse the R20 and will kill gommies with ak4, like god intended
Irklas :DDDD
im unironically thinking of getting a civvie one because i cant be bothered with the militia shit but i've heard that the PPA is trying to frick with new gun licence owners.
FRICK I WANT MY AK4
i cant see shit
Croatian made their own fantastic gun.
I fricking love vegetato
>UK
>Russia
>Belgium
>MonteBlack
>Romania
>Denmark
moronic
>Spain
>Switzerland
>France
>Germany
>Ukraine
>Italy
>Turkey
>Georgia
>Croatia
>Serbia
>Bosnia
>Czech Republic
>Slovakia
>Finland
>Sweden
>Norway
>Baltic states
>Netherlands
Smart
Whats wrong with multicam? Also, the dude is wearing chink branded pants lol.
>Irish camo so good he didnt even see it
>AK5C
>BF4 itch: ON
i'd say iceland is moronic for having no army but still making a camo pattern
It’s just American woodland camo, I think they’ve used it a handful of times for UN things.
italian vegetato performs surprisingly well even outside of italy. meanwhile their vegetato version for clay rocky mountains is almost cheat like with how good it is if there is some sparse snow
I’m sick of living in the U.S.
Recommend me a European country that
>isn’t going to be Muslim in 20 years
>has good gun laws
>decent wages
>preferably trad/catholic
>has good gun laws
I live here and none of us have this. The Czechs are probably the closest but you'll be shocked by the wages as an American
This pretty much. You'll make more as a full-time burger flipper in Cali than in most jobs in most Euro countries. That said, the cost of living is also significantly lower, so your disposable income might end up better.
The only fricked thing is property costs, the supply outgrew demand a fair while ago, so prices of homes are pretty stupid rn
everywhere with decent wages is overrun by Africans and Indians
I'd take jeets over Pakis and assorted Muslim terrorists any day
Italy
I don't want foreigners here.
then send the Africans back, coward
Pick a semi poor euro country like Portugal or eastern Europe, and find a ok paying job in it
frick off we're full
Czech republic is closest to what you're looking for.
If you are in the top of your field and mentally healthy, and are willing to adopt the culture, you can try your luck with Switzerland, though they hardly let anyone in.
Switzerland is like 40% immigrant so he would have to find a serious backwater
>I’m sick of living in the U.S.
You're probably sick of the state you live in. Try moving to another part of the US first. A state like Maine or New Hampshire checks all of your boxes.
Czech Republic or, failing that, Poland.
Iceland is moronic
>georgia running marpat and m4
outstanding, very based
>malta with akms
just why?
why do we put the magesine behind the handle like morons?
>spain
>mostly arid mediterranean bushland
>camo is dark green as if they lived in the russian taiga
it fits the climate they'll have to fight in
spainbros... are we white?
yes
>he doesnt know
Plenty of Spain is forested, and their NATO deployments are in Eastern Europe anyway. They also have a good arid/desert uniform for when they need it.
Malta and Finland, keeping those 7.62 kalashnikovs while the rest of world turns gay
I have bad news for you anon...
Finland is not giving them up for good. They'll go into storage because they can't be surplused and we still have ammo
Camo I like > Camo you like.
Why are so many countries using the G36? Did HK give a discount when they bought MP5s?
Best rifle on the market at the time. First rifle with integratesd Optics that are rugged and where pretty good at the time for a low price. Its a light gun and very reliable.
>First rifle with integratesd Optics
AUG
>optics
it has two a 1x Reddot something and a 3x scope
While compared to todays optics they are extremly shit compared to the generation it was brought onto the market there was no equvialent. You either had extremly expensive stuff or you had none at all.
How does the Belarus pattern look more like what Russians actually wear?
>all this diversity
>not on my watch
HK416s and multitarn knockoffs for everyone
EU army when?
only if that mutlitarn was made from real german skin
also, Poland needs to be updated on this. they've recently joined Finland and Luxembourg in having this type of fractal pattern design
Poland can into camo
very derivative country. poseurs
Is this going to be the final pattern? They've gone through a bunch of redesigns.
I want the Poles to join the M05 master race
Although theirs is more like M05 mixed with fleck or Rauchtarn
It's still being tested. It's going to be a while before we'll get issued these. Also, I really don't like this Lampart camo, it's not much different than wz. 93. They should have went with MAPA.
>https://defence24.pl/sily-zbrojne/nowe-mundury-i-wyposazenie-na-testach-u-podhalanczykow-foto
thank you for permitting me to unleash my camo autism. one of the few things in this life that brings me joy anymore
made this for the Uke bros. got it printed out but the manufacturer fricked up the color, and my test photos are too large to post
Looks like a mix of concamo and M90
Dutch colonial marine camo, made for use on Curacao and in Suriname
Uke multicam knockoff. this uses a fake 3d effect to emulate depth within the pattern
CCE is giga underrated
I'm rtarded, this is the new ATACs
CCE is the prettiest woodland
I do like Korean woodland and ERDL too
new French vic camo is actually S tier. the specific shade of brown they picked blends into everything
tuna salad camo, fricking ugliest shit ive seen in my life
Austrian bros have it figured out
here is that new uke pattern on the left
>Multicam goyslop
Yuck
Multicam black is the official camo of baddies
wow
it's night tigerstripe but shittier
With what’s pictured I’d take Finlands camouflage and Belgiums SCAR.
Finnish special forces, then
The new Norwegian camo is really cool.
new and old Greek camos
Will Romania update their rifles soon? Its weird they are still using 7.62 while buying F-35, abrams and K9/PzH2000.
Allegedly. They initially wanted to buy Italian replacements, but eventually decided that we'll build our own local AK with NATO-standard bullets. Of course, unless we change our mind again.
t. Romanian
this is the weapon in case anyone is interested in seeing how moronic Romania's army is
https://adevarul.ro/stiri-locale/alba-iulia/arma-de-asalt-romaneasca-la-standarde-nato-facuta-2311311.html
?si=-GXyJCTLPEvCiyiD
For me, its the Grot(or VHS-2 or Beryl) and M90
What am I supposed to be looking at? There is nothing in your picture.
Also nice GET
I miss the DPM and the G3, this shit just doesn't feel right
Norway's new camo is pretty sick.
That is pretty aesthetic, if only they'd actually get in a real fight we might see how effective it is.
Dark green blob at 100 meters, just like all the other dark green focused camos
idiots don't realize the point of specific camouflages is to provide identification of uniformed services and prevent blue on blue engagements, actual camouflage is a secondary concern because all of them get dirty and blend well after like a week in the field
are camouflage patterns that important for the individual soldier anymore? I feel like there should be more focus on being resistant to night vision and thermal imaging rather than trying to blend into a local bush as well as possible.
Unironically, AMCU is best for the majority of Australia, excluding the far north and Queensland, where a transition to multicam tropic would be better. Plus, multicam tropic would be better for operating in Indonesia and Papua New Guniea
However, given AMCU is more green focused than multicam, it isn't so good for the more arid and dry parts of Aus
Everything should be UCP
moronic:
White russia
Russia
Moldova
Turkey
Malta
Croatia
Ukraine
Serbia
Mega moronic:
Slovakia
Northern Macedonia
Romania
Smart:
Switzerland
Sweden
The Netherlands
Greece
Somewhat clever:
Poland
Czech republic
>Iceland
>Has no military
>Still has a camo pattern
They have coast guard and emergency response personel.
Why would those need camouflage?
I'd expect they would wear the opposite (high-vis)
Icelandic idiot here, my understanding is that NATO designated the camo pattern to be used in Iceland in case of an invasion defence scenario. I also think I recall something about the U.S giving the coast guard a bunch of camo around the closure of the airbase so that might also have something to do with it.
Ukraine's camo looks pretty good.
What were the russians thinking when they came up with that camo? That shit just doesn't work.
>smart
normal rifle users
>moronic
bullpup users
M90 TIL THE DAY I DIE homie
If you can see the enemies gun, your too close.
How about those NYC tunnels op.
>Live in a dusty sun scorched desert
>Have the most green camo
Lol
Grot is a meme rifle. It's on par with that shitty mexican clone of the G36
>shitty mexican clone of the G36
thats the funny part, the internals are completely unrelated to the G36
Spain's choice of camo is surprising. Their camo seems too lush for their arid environment, or any environment I would expect to see their military in. Switzerland's seems completely moronic. Italy seems the most grounded in reality.
LatPat is the superior modern pattern.
old but gold
I've always kind of wondered why nobody uses ASAT; that shit is genuine black magic and it's been around for like thirty years at this point.
Latvia has a weird camo huh
>Greece still has the G3 as it's service rifle
The frick?
Yeah, they were domestically manufactured so the military has plenty in stock. They were looking for a replacement but that program apparently fizzled into nothingness. Specialist units and spec-ops get M16s and M4s, and in the navy we had everything from fully kitted M4s to old Uzis, Turkish shotguns captured from smugglers and a fricking BAR.
Everyone using something other than an AK or AR pattern rifle.
FAL gets a kino pass
Everything else is special snowflake shit
>SCAR-L
Wait I thought Belgium still issued the F2000? (the best bullpup).
in no particuler
germany
russia
belarussia
serbia
Austria is by far the smartest because they don't actually use standard camo, they wear solid colours and adopt region specific smocks or fatigues based on deployment as needed
France is right behind them for somehow making a decent version of multicam
Ireland is good for using AUGs and woodland (very fashionable, I don't actually know anything about the Irish defence forces and assume they are completely underfunded)
Malta is mega based for just buying old AKMs lol
Latvia took too much LSD
I own a set of Italian camo and it actually works pretty well in chaparral, and I have to give them points for using a domestic rifle
Ukraine's shitty digicam is garbage, one of the few camos worse than multicam, Russia's is less bad but not great, all the other slavs are okay
Turkey actually has a pretty interesting pattern, I'd like to see how well it works especially in low light conditions
If the german army was real I would say they are above average
Everyone with basic b***h multi cam is moronic
I have no other strong opinions regarding the others, except to say Slovakia is cool for still using the VZ.58
also lol bosnia thinks it's the USMC
this is what they look like in their standard service uniform
makes the rest of the world look like bums
jesus they look so much more professional
God I love the parameme boots
The Austrian issue trousers are the bomb but the jacket is a POS
>ywn get to go to war with your bros wearing bright blue smurf outfits and pom-poms
camouflage was a mistake
camo is for losers that don't want guaranteed contact
WTF is a fricking ex-sovietic country doing with m4a1???? what da hell georgia?? I'm armenian i've never seen any georgian soldier with an m4a1
Latvian camo is pretty sick looking
Props to the maker of that image for including malta
>Who is moronic and who is smart according to this?
Bullpup users = smart
Others = moronic
Also who tf knew Slovenia uses the F2K that's sexo
Iceland having no army is either extremely smart or extremely moronic and I can't quite decide which. On one hand, it's very hard for someone to justify an attack you if you don't have any military assets in the first place. Which means every other country on the planet should theoretically side with you if that were to happen. On the other hand, well....
>Iceland having no army is either extremely smart or extremely moronic and I can't quite decide which. On one hand, it's very hard for someone to justify an attack you if you don't have any military assets in the first place. Which means every other country on the planet should theoretically side with you if that were to happen. On the other hand, well....
I think that the reasoning is mostly "who the frick is going to invade us?" and frankly I don't really think they're wrong.
Perfect time for the Ottomans to strike again
Slovenia also uses ZASTAVA M70 AB2 for reservists...
Actually all the slovenian equipment is listed on this page https://www.slovenskavojska.si/en/weapons-and-equipment/infantry/#c4095
>pic related least gay slovenian tank
KICK ASS RIFLES:
>Portugal
>Malta
>Ireland
>Belgium
>Luxembourg
>Finland 200%
>Norway
>Sweden
>Estonia
>France
>Greece
>Netherlands
>Denmark
>Switzerland
>Austria
KICK ASS CAMOS:
>Germany
>Sweden
>Finland
>Estonia
>Poland
>Italy
>France
>Greece
>Bulgaria
>Spain
>Portugal
>Ireland
For me it's
Rifles:
>Belarus
>Bulgaria
>Finland
>Greece
>Malta
>Moldova
>North Macedonia
>Romania
>Russia
>Serbia
>Switzerland
>Ukraine
Camos:
>Belarus
>Finland
>France
>Germany
>Greece
>Ireland
>Italy
>Moldova
>North Macedonia
>Norway
>Romania
>Russia
>Spain
>Serbia
>Switzerland
Spain should be transitioning to the 416 soon, some branches and their SF have already adopted it
can any AKgays rate the AK derivatives on this map?