To me it must
> Be concealable, because being visibly armed is an idiotic death sentence unless you are active duty military
> Be extremely lightweight, because roads and gas stations will be shut down or unsafe, so I'll be carrying everything I own on my back. Every single ounce must be justified and absolutely necessary.
> Use an ammunition type that is lightweight, compact, and very common, and preferably cheap
> Be utterly reliable under harsh conditions
> Be easy to source parts and magazines for in the unlikely event they become necessary
> Be suitable for both combat AND hunting
> For combat, it should allow me to effectively return fire to an opponent at up to 100 yards. Beyond that range I can most likely egress and evade. It must be semiautomatic and have decent magazine capacity, as well as proven terminal performance.
> For hunting, it must be at least as effective as a bow. That's what 99.9% of humans in history used and I won't ask for more range or killing power than that, there's no meaningful arms race going on with wildlife.
The logical choice is a full size Glock, preferably the G34, preferably with a red dot. Show me something better.
SCAR 17S.
Cool, so you'll be walking around as "the guy with a gun" and carrying a weapon that weighs more by itself than my entire day loadout. Good luck.
The SKS can shoot Ok from 100 yards or a little more
So your plan is to be among large groups of people while carrying all of your supplies and only a handgun on your person?
>ngmi
No, that's not my plan, that's the inevitability. You're going to panick and leave your rifle in a ditch somewhere and then you won't know what the frick to do.
Why would I leave my rifle in a ditch?
Because you'll be forced into a situation where being visibly armed will get you arrested or killed and you won't have an expedient way around it. Hurricane Katrina and countless other examples. If you're armed, you are a combatant or a criminal, and they will see you before you see them.
Once you can explain the scenario where "they" go after rifles but not pistols I'll entertain your argument. Until then... you just sound dumb.
>Criminal
Open carry is legal you absolute clown.
>There is no rule of law anymore, it's a complete breakdown of society
Then any armed person attempting to disarm me by force is a valid target.
You aren't really going to do it. You aren't really going to walk around with a rifle when tanks are rolling down the street and you fricking know it.
There aren't any tanks where I live. Shouldn't be a problem.
Im outski son, dont know where you plan to go, but from my job and home, ive got a set path on where to scoot. Sucks to be you i guess
I hope everything works out the way you imagine it will.
>It's a LARP thread
I'm taking a rifle. Enjoy your 9mm though.
>Heh, I see you've failed to plan for every scenario going exactly how I say it will.
Also
>SHTF
>Getting arrested
lmao
Why are in your scenario is there an active police force, jail, and functioning judicial system but you're being forced to hunt with a pistol? lmao
>you can't have a rifle
>also everyone else has a rifle and is a sniper
dude lmao shut the frick up
>>you can't have a rifle
>>also everyone else has a rifle and is a sniper
See:
. You're not getting sniped by someone bugging out and trying to get away from problems. You're getting sniped by a homeowner.
Why would my neighbor try to snipe me? Are you some kind of antisocial autist or something?
Or by the military.
lol ok. good luck with your glock bro. I'm sure every sociopath who is murdering people in cold blood 'just in case' will leave you completely alone because of how non-threatening you appear.
If you have a rifle and I don't, and the blue helmet has one magazine, he'll shoot you 30 times.
I thought we were in a hurricane katrina situation where there's a government that is actively arresting and prosecuting people
There could be any situation. And then any other situation. If you don't know how to competently use concealable weapons then your options are fatally limited.
>It could be any situation, as long as I get to say what it is
No, I mean literally any situation I've read about in history books, and maybe situations I couldn't even imagine. No matter what happens, the absolute last thing I'm going to do as rule of law disintegrates is openly brandish weapons or try to carry around something that weighs more than my entire daypack all day long. And if I really need a rifle, which is extremely unlikely in forested country, I'll just take yours.
>try to carry around something that weighs more than my entire daypack
7 pounds? Sounds like you're pretty fricking weak.
>I'll just take yours.
You'd get yourself killed.
You're not familiar with backpacking. 7 pounds is an utterly massive amount of weight. Backpackers literally cut the handles off of toothbrushes to save .5 ounces. My daypack weighs roughly 7 pounds but I can do things with it you wouldn't believe. I would never carry a rifle unless I lived in desert or frozen tundra where I could see hundreds of yards in every direction and there were no obstacles to be constantly clearing. In the Eastern forests and mountains a rifle is completely unthinkable and ludicrous and unnecessary for 95% of shots.
My ruck-sack was 40-pounds and that's not including my plate carrier, rifle, and pistol.
If you struggle with 7 pounds you just aren't in shape.
With my daypack, I can stalk a deer on foot to less than 50 feet, vault over a creek, run at a full sprint, climb 70 degree rocky inclines like they're not even there, hike 20 miles with virtually no discomfort or fatigue, clear tree blow down on trails over a foot diameter with a tomahawk without taking my pack off and keep moving, belly crawl without making a sound on dry leaves, climb through a window, hide under a desk, I can perform any maneuver that a man in sports attire with no gear can do while having everything I need to improvise a solution to any problem and endure any hardship.
With your rucksack, are you pulling forward on the straps with your hands like a little kid going to school?
>teleports behind you
>sticks my rifle up your anus
>mag dumps
heh nothin personnel kid
I'm just going to shoot you in the dick 87 times and then jerk off on top of you to kagney linn karter videos while you scream and bleed, and there's really nothing you can do about it. pistol, rifle, aircraft, doesn't matter. when shtf, i'm sawing your dick off with this 10mm, and there's literally not a single thing you can do to stop it
Actually what would happen is I would end up with an extra fully-loaded rifle mag and you as my indentured servant.
I'll shoot him 3000 times first.
I don't know what scenario will play out and how it will change over time. That's precisely why non-concealable weapons that are too heavy for perpetual foot travel are out of the question. Those drastically limit my options. The more options you have, the less accurately you need to predict the future. If you can go anywhere any time without a car and fit in with any crowd and simultaneously meet your physical needs without reliance on steady supply chains, that's as close to invincible as you are going to get.
>a non concealable weapon is too heavy for perpetual foot travel
Man, wait til you learn what scrawny ass 18 year olds carried on 8 hour rucks in afghanistan
I've hiked more than all of them combined in terrain 10X more challenging.
hahahahahahaha
Thanks man, I really needed that today
I've literally done almost nothing with my free time but hike and practice survival skills for the past 20 years.
You do nothing with your freetime other than post on /k/ about a fantasy SHTF scenario that somehow miraculously shifts to your exact needs so that you always get to look like the smartest person in the room
You are fat, and you are going to die the moment tendies aren't available for you to purchase from a drive-through window
>Ill just pretend everyone whos not a zogbot cant pass physical fitness requirements
Thats not why you're failing to meet recruitment targets staff sarge
There is no scenario. That's the point. If your gear is light and you can avoid conflict, you can probably endure any scenario.
>I can endure any scenario
>But the point is that there is no scenario
>and carrying a weapon that weighs more by itself than my entire day loadout
your day loadout is less than 8 lbs?
He thinks he's going to run away into the wilderness with roughly 12 hours worth of supplies and survive forever because "no really you guys I hike more than the entire military x10 and I'm definitely not making that up!"
This is why the mentally feeble should not be allowed internet access. They inevitably stumble across a greyman youtube video and believe that if they can JUST make themselves nonthreatening enough, then they'll get to be the protagonist in the apocalypse, just like Joel in The Last of Us you guys!
SKS
true mark of a moron is having a red dot on their pistol.
Why? They improve my shooting, especially in low light, and simplify sight adjustment.
Some .357 like my SW19. Long enough barrel for hunting and concealable enough.
That's not a bad choice, but the weapon is dramatically heavier than a Glock, it's ammo is heavier and rarer and more expensive, it's capacity and reload are poor, you'll never be able to repair it yourself if something goes wrong, and all you get in exchange is slightly better wounding per individual shot. Not really a good deal in my opinion.
Considering I'm not comp shooting and I can reload straight wall bp and still be fine it's really a moot point.
>You'll never be able to repair it yourself if something goes wrong
Th-the revolver? It's got less to go wrong than literally any semiauto, glock or not, it's six chambers that rotate and a firing mechanism that's effectively a more robust nail slamming into the primer, I would like to hear your logic on this point
You don't actually use the thing if you really believe that. Revolvers develop serious issues that require skilled gunsmithing. Timing is a major one. I know a guy who literally destroyed two Colt Pythons in the 80s doing silhouette shooting.
>he thinks semi-autos are more reliable than revolvers and less prone to malfunctions
>this one time, 40 years ago...
Anyway.
Modern pistols ARE more reliable than revolvers. They are less likely to develop mechanical issues within a given round count, and those issue are much easier to fix without specialized gunsmithing skills or equipment. Only people who don't actually shoot at a high level think revolvers are reliable, the guys who just go shoot a tin can every once in a while or whatever.
I've seen a few cases of springs, firing pins, and firing pin retainers break on autoloaders, but never anything on revolvers. Really the way mechanisms on revolvers are designed vs autoloaders allows the parts to be far more substantial and less likely to break.
You've never even met anyone who ever fired more than 1000 rounds through a revolver. There is not one single revolver on the market that will last as many rounds as a Glock without needing expensive professional repair work.
On what do you base this claim?
Every single revolver guy I've ever met was a casual shooter with no concept of form or trigger or recoil control, literally just 50 rounds of 7 yard slow fire in SA every couple weeks. They're ALL assclown losers like that unless they are 70 years old.
>You've never even met anyone who ever fired more than 1000 rounds through a revolver.
I average ~1k rounds a year through mine, and many times that in dry firing. I've had absolutely zero issues.
So if you shoot it like that for ten years, that's about the round count where I might consider replacing the $10 recoil spring in a Glock.
Your Glock would have already exploded by then.
After ten thousand rounds? Glocks routinely go over 70K rounds without needing more work than they're worth, and basically every single repair they ever need is just a cheap drop-in part that anyone can learn to replace from a 3 minute YouTube video. All Glock internals within generations are completely interchangeable except the recoil spring, so if you carry a subcompact G26 as a backup gun, it is also a spare parts kit for your G17/34. You can use dirt cheap steel case bimetal ammo that will wear the barrel out in 20K rounds, and just buy a new one for $120 and slap it right in in ten seconds. You can't even order a new barrel for your revolver. And you'll never need to because you only shoot 500 rounds per year.
Anon, he's either trolling or a moron, there are fenceposts you can argue with. You'll get further.
I'm sorry I can't hear you over the sound of the bear that killed you in the woods because you thought your porcelain 9mm pistol was a good idea in a SHTF scenario.
Every recorded use of 9mm on bears for self-defense was successful. 9mm will easily penetrate the skull and vertebrae of the largest bears, especially with flat metplat bullets loaded to maximum pressure limits.
Your risk to take, lmao.
9mm is the best possible bear pistol because it gives you the highest possible chance of landing a critical hit to the central nervous system due to capacity, light trigger compared to DA revolver, controllable recoil, and cheap training costs. A 44 Magnum to the lungs will kill the bear a few hours after he rips you to shreds.
Whatever you need to tell yourself man. It's your life to gamble.
Samegayging is pretty lame bro.
Highly depends on scenario, a service pistol is the baseline but I have rifles and shotguns I can grab at a moments notice if concealment doesn't matter or I need the capability.
picrel
>drop-in part
Guess what anon, basically all revolvers since Samuel Colt brought his first revolvers to market have used drop in parts. Samuel Colt's big innovation wasn't inventing the revolver, it was bringing one to market that used interchangeable parts and didn't require a skilled gunsmith to hand fit everything.
Good luck with that!
This is silly on it's face. Revolvers are mechanically simpler and have less parts that are more robust.
And they go out of time and become $1100 paper weights until you find someone who can fix it. Glock shooters shoot thousands of rounds a year. Revolver shooters shoot a box of ammo every other weekend and think they have any clue what they're talking about. Revolvers died for good reasons. The fricking military abandoned them over 100 years ago.
lol
lmao even.
Jerry Mikulek was 40 years old before police even carried semiautomatic pistols. You are completely out of touch.
The best in the world uses wheelguns. You're some trash Glock-fanboy with a complex.
The best at what? Shooting revolvers? That's like saying aikido is the best martial art because the best aikido competitor uses aikido.
>The best at what?
At anything. Jerry can mag-dump a Barrett before you even got your Glock out of the holster, lmao.
And when he's dead, the last relevant revolver shooter will be gone, and you won't be able to say that anyone who matters carries a revolver, because there is literally NOBODY else.
>100 years ago
On what mechanism do you believe bt fed weapons operate, anon? Wherein the cycling of the weapon physically rotates and pulls in the next round, typically from the side, in a rotating, some may say, revolving, action?
We're talking about handguns.
>thread title is shtf bugout guns
>belt fed handguns do exist, they simply have smaller, typically 6 link, self contained belts, some might call them revolver cylinders
Anyways I'd go for that revolver that chambers all pistol calibur, the m47 Medusa, and use it specifically to kill and eat you
The Air Force used revolvers until the 80s because they are moronproof and it takes like 30 minutes to teach a draftee who doesn't give a shit about anything how to shoot expert on it
>"mechanically simpler"
TIL clockwork is simper than a slide with a spring.
They made one far earlier than the other
Because blackpowder doesn't generate enough of an impulse to do a proper semi-auto action.
Modern smokeless was a big fricking deal.
> Be concealable, because being visibly armed is an idiotic death sentence unless you are active duty military
Fundamental issue with the premise right here. First off a hunting rifle or .22 isn't going to get you instantly shot unless there's an outright war on.
Second, this is the kind of deeply autistic personal obsession with relating to the world at large through firearms that only a LARPer would have. The scenario you have described is specific to the point of absurdity because you're obsessing over one of your least useful pieces of equipment. Where are you bugging out to? From where? Is this the kind of SHTF the US actually sees, ie natural disasters? If so if you're actually capable of bugging out it shouldn't take more than a couple of slightly shitty, slightly sketchy days to GTFO. If we're talking real SHTF, your bugout gear barely matters as long as it exists, what matters is where you're going and the logistics and supply that location entails. Learning literally any amount of survivalist/backcountry/"urban greyman operator" skills matters far more than this shit. Realistically if you were preparing for SHTF you'd grab whatever pistol was prevalent in your area (or by the box of parts at your bugout location) add your preferred sights, come up with a practice regimen, then never think about the brand of gun again as you focused on more important skills.
> isn't going to get you instantly shot unless there's an outright war on.
There will be.
>The scenario you have described is specific
Actually it's the least specific. By having ultralight gear that is concealable, I am prepared for anything that could conceivably happen. Mobility is the 100% critical build. If you have more gear than you can carry fulltime, and weapons that aren't concealable, then you're limiting your options and making dangerous assumptions about how the future will pan out.
where are you going and to where are you going from. if you are talking actual SHTF both matter far more than getting autistic over what you have on your body in the first 48 hours.
How should I know? That's the point. I'm not going to assume I'll have a car or other means of transporting gear, or that public highways will be operational and safe, and I'm certainly not going to assume that I'll be able to openly brandish weapons around panicked, desperate survivors, blue helmets, and whoever else I encounter.
And what are the battle lines in this war? Assuming you are fleeing from the front, why would you be shot?
This is so fricking moronic.
I don't know. What I do know is that lightness and a non-threatening appearance are advantageous in every conceivable situation. Those are two predictable constants.
>Appearing non-threatening will save me
Have you EVER been to America? I look forward to watching your eventual rape and murder on worldstar.
The same full size revolver I carry normally.
>Use an ammunition type that is lightweight, compact, and very common, and preferably cheap
If you're moving on foot, the only ammo that matters is the ammo you can carry. Stores aren't going to be selling more, and no one is going to be selling/trading their supply in the short term unless absolutely necessary.
>Be easy to source parts and magazines for in the unlikely event they become necessary
Like ammo, the only parts that matter are the parts you stock up on beforehand.
>Be suitable for both combat AND hunting
Honestly, this would be a waste of ammo. The space/weight taken up by a days supply of emergency calorie dense food is minimal vs a days supply of water, and you still have to worry about carrying the supplies to cook that meat. In the event that you're traveling by any kind of vehicle where you can carry more, you can already take animals that will have more meat on them than you could reasonably eat in this case with .22lr.
>For combat, it should allow me to effectively return fire to an opponent at up to 100 yards
I suppose, but I'm not aware of any cases past 50 yards where returning fire was a preferable option to running that didn't involve police drawing attention to themselves via yelling/lights/sirens when dealing with someone who was already shooting before encountering the police.
>If you're moving on foot, the only ammo that matters is the ammo you can carry.
There's enough 9mm ammo in circulation in America and sitting in storage to fight three world wars.
>Like ammo, the only parts that matter are the parts you stock up on beforehand.
Everyone and their uncle has a Glock, and every Glock contains Glock parts. I'll probably find them on dead bodies regularly.
>Honestly, this would be a waste of ammo.
I could live for a month off of one deer. Theoretically I could survive for decades with only the ammo I EDC
>I suppose, but I'm not aware of any cases past 50 yards where returning fire was a preferable option to running that didn't involve police drawing attention to themselves via yelling/lights/sirens when dealing with someone who was already shooting before encountering the police.
Then why carry a gun at all?
>I could live for month off of one deer
This one sentence really shows you don’t know what you are talking about. You’re going to consume a whole deer before the carcass rots? Or do you somehow have the means to process, preserve, and carry a whole deer on your person for later consumption that will last you a month?
I have practiced food preservation extensively.
You can practice preservation all you want but it won’t change the fact carrying a whole deer, even if it’s fully dehydrated, is heavy, preserving a whole deer takes a decent bit of time, and you probably don’t want to spend to much time in one spot, and that small game is far more abundant, easier to preserve, and quicker to preserve. If you think you are going to live off of deer in a shtf situation while constantly on the move, you are living in a fantasy.
If I absolutely have to move then I'll leave the rest for the coyotes. I'm not going to pass up shots at anything when I'm starving.
Yeah and then the people following you see a half processed deer carcass and smoking/drying setup and know you are in the area
Why would someone be following me? I'm nobody's enemy and don't have anything anyone wants.
It’s not necessary that somebody is following you, just that you don’t want people knowing your in the area. You put a lot of emphasis on not being suspicious or dangerous looking but at the same time won’t take the precautions to make sure nobody even knows you are in the area. If somebody stumbles upon your deer carcass, they will know you are in the area and will know you are armed.
>I'm nobody's enemy and don't have anything anyone wants.
That's not something somebody even casually following you would know. Even just hearing an occasional shot ring out, seeing a bit of smoke, or coming across a deer carcass would be enough in a shtf scenario to arouse suspicion;
I don't know that you DON'T have something I want, but if I'm desperate for resources, it wouldn't be out of the question to figure that you've probably got something I'd want
>because roads and gas stations will be shut down or unsafe
I'm sorry, but covering long distances on foot is moronic. Even a 50cc scooter, that will be able to filter through car congested roads, can cover 100-150 miles in a few hours with the fuel in the tank, and even a small 20 ounce fuel bottle of gasoline will get you another 17 or so miles (about the average hiker's limit for what they'll do in a day). A human will go through about as much water by volume to what a scooter's tank holds in gas in a day of hiking, and water weighs about 37.5% more than gas.
What can you carry on a scooter? What makes you think interstate travel will be allowed at all?
I live in the East where there is water issuing forth from every crag. I carry an 8oz Poland Spring bottle and a lifestraw and that's all I've ever needed. I do long wilderness trips every single week.
This. Pic related has 62.2 liters of cargo space just between the saddle bags that are on the smaller side (19.6 liters each) and the under seat bag (23 liters). Once you start getting into motorcycles rather than scooters, people will throw hard cases on the sides of larger off road able bikes like the KLR650 that will hold 45L each. Motorcycles and scooters can pack a lot more than what you can carry on your person. There's basically no reason for a bug out plan based around walking.
Anything I can't carry on foot is a bonus item that I will leave behind without a second thought. I keep rifles in my car, I don't give a shit about them, they're disposable. Material possessions are not going to limit my options or slow me down.
>SHTF bug out
>must be concealable
??? you’re not supposed to be around people in such scenario
What makes you think you'll have a choice?
because my bug out location offers fresh water, plenty game to hunt and solar energy.
now, if we’re talking about a massive natural disaster such as the yellowstone blowing up, then it’s probably best to leave the country anyway lol
How will you get there?
to my bug out location or the other country?
bug out: with my bike
other country: doesn’t matter because you won’t be allowed to bring your guns anyway. you’ll become a helpless little noguns refugee
>bugging out means hunter gatherer LARPing in the woods, rather than safely leaving for a place to continue living your life
>What can you carry on a scooter
More than you can carry on your back unaided.
>What makes you think interstate travel will be allowed at all?
Exactly what scenario are you thinking of?
>More than you can carry on your back unaided.
There's no way you can carry more on a scooter than you could on foot. You would be off balance and probably die.
>Exactly what scenario are you thinking of?
Roads are extremely dangerous in times of conflict. If you don't know this then you must not study warfare at all. The government was threatening to shut down interstate travel in the USA as early as two years ago due to COVID. If you can't carry your gear through the mountains and swamps then your system is flawed. You're going to get holodomored, or just shot.
>There's no way you can carry more on a scooter than you could on foot. You would be off balance and probably die.
You do know panniers exist, don't you? You don't just stack all the weight on top of the seat.
>Roads are extremely dangerous in times of conflict.
They're safer than the reality of traveling by foot, and even a scooter get you moving faster than an advancing army.
>The government was threatening to shut down interstate travel in the USA as early as two years ago due to COVID. If you can't carry your gear through the mountains and swamps then your system is flawed. You're going to get holodomored, or just shot.
Just plan a routes using back roads then you moron.
>You do know panniers exist, don't you? You don't just stack all the weight on top of the seat.
Cool, then I'll steal one with panniers from someone who won't suspect a thing because I look unarmed and normal and use that to cut through traffic if there aren't any blue helmet NWO checkpoints
>They're safer than the reality of traveling by foot, and even a scooter get you moving faster than an advancing army.
I've been hiking for 25 years, I'm definitely comfortable with it.
>Just plan a routes using back roads then you moron.
I have. I'm prepared for the possibility that that doesn't work out. My base bugout loadout allows me to move through the wilderness on foot very easily and simultaneously blend in with masses of disgruntled or panicked survivors who are being constantly surveyed for armed troublemakers by snipers. I have the maximum number of options possible and can pass through almost any conceivable filter.
They'll just shoot anyone who isn't staying in their homes. You really think walking around with your backpack is going to make inconspicuous? You really haven't thought through this fantasy.
I don't have a home. I live in my car.
If they're literally just shooting anything that moves then we are all fricked no matter what.
>I live in my car.
Unironically hows that going for you? Feel like itd be a pretty freeing thing
sounds awful on your back.
The first year is hard. Then it's pure freedom. I'm on my fourth year and I'm never going back inside.
So you're a homeless nobody who fantasizes about the EXACT, specific end of the world scenario that will finally allow you to show all those people with homes and families and careers that you were right all the time? Is that it?
So you have no home, no job, and I'm supposed to believe that you're some hardcore survivalist? Begging for money from strangers isn't going to do shit for you even in the best of times, moron.
Why am I even wasting my time explaining this to you. If you were smart enough to understand any of this you wouldn't sleeping in a 1994 honda civic, collecting an unemployment check and pretending that you're somehow winning at life while phoneposting from a gas station
>EXACT, specific end of the world scenario
I am prepared for any scenario. That is why I adopt the most versatile tools and strategies.
>So you have no home, no job, and I'm supposed to believe that you're some hardcore survivalist? Begging for money from strangers isn't going to do shit for you even in the best of times, moron.
Why am I even wasting my time explaining this to you. If you were smart enough to understand any of this you wouldn't sleeping in a 1994 honda civic
I make 75K a year and sleep in a 2020 Forester.
Why not get an RV or one of those big vans? If you’re going to be homeless making $75,000/year, why not be somewhat comfortable?
Because discomfort and hardship gives me superpowers. It's addicting.
Oh cool. I make 75,001 a year and I sleep in a house, along with my family.
>i'll steal one
Okay, and then I, a bystander who witnessed you stealing, will shoot you in the back because you're a homosexual thief who deserves it. Next?
>he can’t continue his life on a small bugout farm
>self reliant living is LARP now
>moron thinks self reliance is just something you can pick up on the fly after some major happening, rather than a lifestyle that takes years of experience and preparation to achieve, and takes up a large portion of your time to maintain
>moron thinks he's just going to find somewhere to start a farm
>implying I’m not doing all that for decades already
Hell you really shouldn't be out traveling anywhere in that scenario, but sure enough here's OP trying to figure out the best ultralight setup so he can get out and about and so no dick goes un-sucked even in the apocalypse.
ar10 because I must be able to reliably hunt large game
For me it's the GE Minigun.
>Be concealable
Being concealable is not relevant. If someone sees me coming, they aren't going to want to mess. In the rare chance they have a death wish, if they try to take me out from behind, the ammo packpack will deflect their bullets. If they are coming from the front, I would have already seen them and mowed them down.
>Be extremely lightweight
Weight is irrelevant. Lift more.
>Use an ammunition type that is lightweight...
Ammo is weightless and 5mm rounds are the most common ammo type.
>Be utterly reliable under harsh conditions
Just take care of your equipment. Simple.
>Be easy to source parts and magazines for in the unlikely event they become necessary
Miniguns don't need magazines and nobody else will be fielding one so the parts will all be mine for taking.
>Be suitable for both combat AND hunting
False. I'll just make you do my hunting for me.
>For combat, it should allow me to effectively return fire to an opponent at up to 100 yards
You aren't doing that with a pistol you absolute clown.
>For hunting, it must be at least as effective as a bow. That's what 99.9% of humans in history used and I won't ask for more range or killing power than that, there's no meaningful arms race going on with wildlife.
Until you get mauled by a bear because your 9mm BBs weren't enough to stop him.
This is an objectively correct choice. The only other option is two colt .45 revolvers that you use to gun everything down gunslinger style before walking away in slow motion, like John Wayne would have done.
homosexual but realistic answer: glock 19
Based answer: g36
Steel frame cz with gold brass grips.
>bug out
Frick no. I'm staying put. You can pry my home from my exploding hands you out of town refugeeBlack folk.
>so I'll be carrying everything I own on my back.
that sounds really stupid.
Then enjoy eating your niece.
yeah dude, any day now the fan will shit and with all the skills you learned from youtube FINALLY you will come out ahead of all your peers who dared to have real careers and be more successful than you, they will all get eaten by Black folk while you stoikly sit by a fire in the woods cooking up a rabbit or some shit
Yes, exactly, just like what happened all over the world multiple times within living memory, even in Europe.
>just like what happened all over the world multiple times within living memory
how many years since the last one?
2. My last employer tried to force me to take the vaccine and I was only able to quit my job because I had survival skills to fall back on that you don't.
I already do
Do you honestly think you'll be able to forage or hunt more food on a daily basis than three months of food I already have in storage? Do you REALLY thunk you'll be bagging deer with your anemic 9mm glock?
No, I don't think that. What I think is that I'm not going to assume that I will be able to maintain access to my storable food as society collapses around me and hostile actors rapidly enter my environment. I'm prepared to leave everything behind if necessary. I'm not banking on some specific plan working out. I'm prepared to rely on the most minimalistic gear in existence if I have to.
And let's say your plan works out. You will survive to what end exactly? What is the goal or end state?
Find some place that isn't a warzone or a holocaust in progress. And keep fricking b***hes until I'm dead.
Sounds pointless. I'll stand my ground while you wander around in the woods and get yourself killed.
That has almost never worked in history. The army always wins.
and the lone wolf in the woods always dies
>Do you REALLY thunk you'll be bagging deer with your anemic 9mm glock?
>he thinks 9mm won't put down a deer just fine with proper shot placement
Airgun hunters take deer with .380 level muzzle energies.
So why aren't you taking an airgun?
>excited because OP points out the reality that handgun >>>>>>> long gun for a realistic SHTF scenario, and that a larger offensive handgun build is realistically the largest you'll be able to get away with carrying in most cases
>read thread
>OP ends up being a homeless schizo who lives out of his car and is prepping for the day his car breaks down
whatever my usual EDC is, this winter was a glock 17. Now that its getting warmer I might downgrade to something small, but im debating how much I give a shit anymore. Ive debated about having a PCC or something in my car, but I dont like leaving any gun, let alone a more expensive one, alone like that.
Im also not bugging out. Im bugging in. Whatever is in my bag or on my person is just going to get me back to my house which is more suitably defended and has better gear. I dont see the appeal in fricking off into the woods to live in a tent. If Im dying, its going to be under my own roof
>If Im dying, its going to be under my own roof
Imagine the feeling of despair knowing someone just got you and theyre going to take your house that you earned through toiling for decades
imagine abandoning your property and everything you've stashed, just to live like a homeless person. If im dead, its not my problem anymore. If thats the last bit of comfort I have, then its worth defending and dying for
Homelessness is freedom. The smarter you are, the easier it is.
>The fricking military abandoned them over 100 years ago.
>abandoned them over 100 years ago
>over 100 years ago
>100 years ago
What's the SHTF situation? Civil War? Breakdown of law? Tornado? Gotta be more specific.
LARP dream in which being an armed hobo without other support will resulte in flawless victory of some sort.
The alternative is being dead like all the people in Ukraine who are dead right now because they didn't escape.
bullpup SBR is extremely concealable while still being capable, especially if the cartridge is short barrel optimized
Someone needs to get on the 10" bullpup market. A 20" long 5.56 rifle with good ballistics would be a game changer for the PDW concept.
DesertTech already is
The Micron only shaves off 3" with the 13" barrel. I want a rifle the size of a P90. It'll probably need to be built from the ground up to bring the grip back far enough to get a support hand on the forend.
idgaf about being concealable. if SHTF I want as much firepower and capability as possible, hence my setup is a 16-18" GPR or SPR suppressed with thermal clip on and LPVO, offset RDS for night vision.
>gets sniped from a distance by someone he never saw without firing a shot
Actually anon, he'd be taking that shot, as he opted to not take the pistol. Worst case scenario is endless tf2 sniper wars, as nobody but gay op went with a pistol
The guy carrying the pistol keeping to himself isn't going to be the person getting involved in that shit. People trying to keep their lives running somewhat normally will when they see someone walking down the street in front of their home kitted up and looking like a threat.
>Weird how these snipers are only murdering people that are carrying longarms.
Because people walking around out in public carrying a rifle would be seen as a threat by anyone who isn't circle jerking online about how cool getting to LARP you favorite piece of post apocalyptic media would be. People aren't going to be running around sniping people. They're going to be sniping the idiot they don't know who's walking down the street kitted up and looking like a threat from their house.
It's fine because I have Level IV armor head to toe. It's their grave.
So are there tanks rolling down the street, or is life going on as normal? It's almost impressive how you keep this many schizophrenic fantasies going on in your head at once.
I'm not OP.
>So are there tanks rolling down the street, or is life going on as normal?
If tanks are rolling down the street then you already fricked up, as you should have checked out before they even got there. There are plenty of examples from Ukraine about how you don't want to stick around for that. Otherwise, SHTF situations that I feel are actually worth concerning yourself with fall into 2 categories:
>disasters that cause the area you live in has become unfit for human habitation (be it natural disaster, or man made disasters like war)
>large scale disasters that significantly reduce quality of life, but aren't fantasy bullshit where society just dissolves for some reason (think Great Depression, hyperinflation, if COVID was worse, etc.)
The first covers situations where you'd evacuate or bug out as soon as possible and continue your life elsewhere or return once things returned to normal. The second covers situations where you just try to live as much of the normal life you wanted to live as you can if you can't leave. In neither case is walking around town looking like a significant threat to the average person something you want to do, and if people are already on edge and can't call or rely on the cops for some reason, then you risk them taking matters into their own hands. Consider we've already had cases of people walking around exercising their right to open carry a rifle getting held at gunpoint by other concerned citizens, like that case that happened at a Walmart in late 2019. Also consider that here are plenty of cases of crazy rumors of violence that would put people more on edge than they would already be after disasters (in some cases completely absent any real violence), just look at what people still think happened after Katrina vs what actually happened.
Until I decide that you look suspicious, because everyone in this neighborhood knows each other, and now you've got a 6mm in your gut without ever having seen me or my neighbors, because you seriously thought that walking through a place you dont belong with a backpack would protect you like a magical shield
Every time this thread comes up, there's always people who say that they're going to just start shooting anyone they don't recognize. You're so disappointed in your own flawed strategies and useless over specialized heavy gear you've invested in that you have no response left but to say that discretion and non-aggression won't work because you're just going to shoot anything that moves anyway. Do you realize how pathetic this sounds?
>I'm going to run away to live in the woods!
>I'm an expert survivalist!
>N-no really you guys I mean it!
>I'm going to survive in the woods with my pistol!
>I-stop it stop laughing! I've been doing this for DECADES
>I SAID STOP LAUGHING AT ME
>Because people walking around out in public carrying a rifle would be seen as a threat
Cool take OP. Which Le Ebin Greyman Youtuber taught it to you?
Weird how these snipers are only murdering people that are carrying longarms. Also who are these snipers and why are they murdering *checks notes* their neighbors?
International peacekeepers most likely.
>bugging out
&
>being visibly armed is an idiotic death sentence unless you are active duty military
Maximum moron.
G19
I didn't just put in the foundations to this aquaponic greenhouse that purifies it's own water to go walk around like a homosexual if shit hits the fan. Anyone on my property without my permission is getting vibe checked with a G3.
>it's too heavy!
>it's too big!
>it's unconcealable!
I'm not carrying it anywhere and I'm not hiding it from anyone. Stay off my land. Maybe my neighbors and I will have some food to share with you in exchange for work if things are stable enough to trust you.
You'll be bombed. You'll know it's happening but you won't be able to escape because you are attached to your property and material possessions and don't know how to live on the move.
If places like my pocket in the middle of the Ozarks are getting levelled I am praying to God the last secure source of food and water I know of is going to be spared, and if it doesn't I am dying in place. I'm willing to bet that I will probably never be bombed in my lifetime, and that securing a supply of fresh food and water immediately solves 99% of the alternatives in my area. Have fun being homeless. I hope food and water remain easy to access as long as you're good enough at being homeless. I hope they never become massively contaminated in such a way that it doesn't matter how smart you are, you were just downstream of the wrong reservoir. Because that doesn't even require bombs to happen-- that's just what economic decay looks like.
Contamination is precisely the reason why it is important to be capable of moving rapidly.
Should've been a better gardener.
>muh bio/chemical/nuclear weapons
Barring damage from the blast itself from nukes, if any of these are a problem it's a skill issue. We can grow vegetables in space, figure it out dude.
>glock 19
>10/22 Takedown
Second this but with the magpul backpacker stock
Fits in a duffel bag
>that storage inside the cheek rest
Damn, nice.
OP will die because he is forever alone. Meanwhile I will use the super-power of Teamwork to survive.
Yeah I'm sure you're drinking buddies will be able to fend off NWO indefinitely.
Longer than a forever-alone hiding in the woods and getting mauled by bears.
scared boot?
you could get some work done if you rolled into the hood like that, ngl
Wait, I know you. You're Maximum Pistol Man. You used to talk about how rifles are absurdly heavy becuase they're the heaviest primary weapon ever used in history.
Anyway, if it is you, one time you mentioned carrying a pistol in an elastic band or something around your midsection. Something about a drawstroke in a "forward throwing motion," I believe. I was wondering whether this was over the top of an underlayer with a traditional cover garment that's easy to clear, or if it just needs a t-shirt to conceal and draw quickly from.
I strictly carry directly against the skin. It is always smoother to get my hand down to bare skin than to a specific layer of clothing unless you are wearing shirt garters or something.
Okay, that's a hyper-specific motivation but I'll take it. More questions.
>is this from a 2-4 o'clock position, or AIWB-style noon to 2?
>do you have trigger protection, or just the material of the elastic band?
>am I right in thinking of the concept as working like a strong side take on the vertical shoulder holster when it comes to draw issues/benefits?
>how tight does the band have to be to prevent movement?
4-5 o'clock. At 2 you are basically chiseling your hip girdle.
I use nylon holsters rubberized to resist movement, support weight through skin friction, and repel sweat.
I wouldn't compare it to a shoulder holster. It's just a high ride that allows proper movement of the hip joints for squat/deadlift/highstep type motions that you are doing constantly in the mountains, and simultaneously allows for a long barrel length, and the full concealment of the grip in the kidney hollows under light clothing even when bending over.
The belt doesn't have to be tight at all if all of your gear is rubberized. It can be practically falling off. As it slips down slightly, the weight ends up being supported by the shoulders due to the holster clip catching on the pants, and the mag pouches doing the same weakside. When I've eaten too much I sometimes allow this to happen.
How do you safely reholster a firearm in a soft-sided holster like that? By removing the rubberized nylon holster, inserting the firearm, and reinserting it as a unit?
I don't have any issue reholstering it. The mouth stay open just enough to get the corner of the slide in.
Not that anon, but I don't habeeb it.
The bottom of the extended slide of the Glock 34 is rounded in a way that makes it easy to push into a soft IWB holster.
The point of concern is pushing a trigger pasty an elastic material and into collapsible, rigid fabric. This is exactly how people give themselves glockleg.
That is only an issue with old, thin leather holsters, or ones that are poorly designed. I like Bulldog holsters, there is no way for the material to enter the trigger guard.
I've used every brand of expensive popular kydex holsters and have generally found them unsuitable. They are too broad if they are pancake style, they don't have clips that completely encapsulate the belt so that it can't come off, they're too bulky, I never found one I liked. The cheap nylon ones work because they essentially aren't there. All they need is sweatproofing, which is easy to add.
What if the situation is, that you see a deer or whatever and you pull out your Glock and shoot it. The noise alerts the nearest blue helmet sniper who then drops you instantly?
They can't see me because the average visibility is 70 yards. The trees act as baffling and you can't hear 9mm from more than a mile away generally.
Sorry they already saw you and you're dead.
The purpose of a pistol is to fight your way back to wherever it was you left your rifle you fricking moron.
The purpose of a pistol is to avoid fighting.
So carry nothing at all then moron. If looking helpless will magically keep you safe, then surely BEING helpless will render you invincible. Or are you finally starting to realize what an absolute fricking moron you really are?
Maadi-Griffin .50BMG Pistol. Gotta be prepared for any situation.
The joys of having a pilot's license. My ass is driving ten minutes to the airstrip, I'm fricking off.
Anon, I...
nice windows xp wallpaper
I don't get this meme. Either way, I have more than five thousand hours on just a C206 alone. Lately been fricking around with a C310
Stealing or flying your own rig?
I own a C206, but I'm fine with stealing something nicer if needed.
The only things I ever had to bug out from were hurricanes and the only thing I had was an M1A so that
>bugging out
If a situation is dire enough to require bugging out where I live, how concealable a firearm is ends up being irrelevant.
Whatever you say.
what is SHTF bugout in your 17 year old highschool opinion?
Any situation whereby normal expectations of safety are violated.
so like masses of leftist revolutionaries doing looting and pillaging at will without any resistance from cucked law enforcement who have been ordered to stand down and let the purge happen? in that case, why wouldnt you have a rifle and stay put with your other neighbors and circle the wagons on your neighborhood in a show of force to keep the monkeys moving down the road?
Because I don't have a neighborhood. I live in my car and move every 6-8 months. I don't give a shit about wherever I currently am or the people here.
ok then you should have said this in your OP because 99% of people here cant relate to you. in your specific situation a handgun is probably best since you will either be in your vehicle or nearby and cant be seen in the open waving around a rifle
>The logical choice is a full size Glock, preferably the G34
No, it isn't. It's a grip chopped G23 with a 9mm conversion barrel. Possibly also a 357 SIG barrel since that'll be the very last thing off the shelves.
Using a full size 9mm locks you in to 9x19 and full size mags.
my mg42, peace through superior firepower.
>my mg42
can i see it?
My shtf guns are my AR and a Blackbeard tier assortment of pistols stowed on me and in my bag
Glock 17
No need to elaborate
>G17 when the superior G45 exists
ngmi
>because being visibly armed is an idiotic death sentence unless you are active duty military
Huh?
My gun doesn't need all of that bullshit because i'd rather kms than live in basically russia without the internet pornography
>This entire fricking thread
You see this OP? This is what SHTF actually looks like. And THIS is what men do. This is what it's going to be like. But of course you know better. You're going to grab your Glock, the only gun that you ever even bothered to own, and run away into the woods, because you're Jeremiah fricking Johnson and you're going to deadeye a bull moose at 300 yards with your 9mm and all those people who were mean to you in high school are FINALLY going to get what they deserve while you survive like a hero, except for Stacey of course, Stacey's not going to die, because you, survivor that you are, are going to rescue her and she's going to finally love you, just like she always should have.
You'll just be one of hundreds of thousands of casualties with your plan, like in Ukraine.
>there will be hundreds of thousands of casualties!
>just like in Ukraine!
>What zogbots think SHTF is
Shooting larpers that are struggling with kit from the comfort of their MRAPS
>What SHTF will really be for zogbots
Guy just pulls out a pocket pistol and kills your best friend one day at a medical station you're pulling security at
S&w m&p 5” long slide with red dot in bag. Glock 42 in front pocket. Makarov in holster right side. Taurus g2c in vest pocket left side. Nagant revolver in holster left side cross draw. Beretta 92 tucked in back no holster. Beretta 84 tucked in front aimed at balls.
When I get shot and killed no matter what side is facing up my wife can grab a gun off of my mangled corpse
In the same way Spike carries a Jericho, not because he likes it, but because it will always go bang even after you pawn all your guns and 99% of your ammo, I like my Shield. I've cleaned it probably 3 times in the 3k rounds I've put through it. Small, extremely concealable, extremely reliable, 9mm. I can and have (in vidya) snuck this thing into secure buildings, a couple times by accident.
My Benelli M4. Simple reason: birds. I can deal with hunting deer with slugs better than I can deal with hunting doves with .308. And I expect to need to get food more often than needing to fight humans. Concealment doesn't matter because I'm simply never going to go anywhere near people other than my current immediate neighbors should SHTF and any outsiders trying to flee here would be a shoot on sight situation, so there's just noone to hide anything from.
>;62 cal fusil.
When shtf bullets are going to be rarer and more valuable than gold. I have a bullet mold and sourcing lead is easy from car batteries to fishing weights. My powder I can refine from either chicken shit or bat shit, my own piss, and charcoal. Flints and churk I find where ever limestone deposits are.
I have 2 springs, and less than 5 moving parts. It has its disadvantages but Im about surviving and evading not looking for fights. One shot it all I need.