>TL:DW
back in the 30's there was an FBI agent who was really good at shooting from the hip so everyone thought they would just try to do what he did, which turned out to not be the best idea.
I watched that, and it somehow makes no sense and a ton of sense simultaneously. On one hand, it's not surprising that people would go for strict emulation, especially when you see it now with how people discuss "the one best gun/technique" meta. On the other hand, you're telling me that for years, nobody in the position to make decisions figured out that bringing the gun up to eye level adds no additional time but increases accuracy? I can understand certain things holding institutional momentum, like shooting a handgun with only one hand, but what kind of moron makes the call that we should all just stop actually aiming the gun just because of one guy? I was a teenager playing around with a Blackhawk when I figured out that hip shooting was just for theatrical bullshit.
>follow up shots
Unnecessary if you practice your point shooting enough
I see "point shooting" get posted all the time here, but what do you mean by it? Is it strict hip shooting, "Doom shooting" from just below eye level, or something else? Is it still point shooting if I have both hands on the gun, a proper grip and stance, but I'm focused on the target and relying on muscle memory, or "pointing", for aiming?
>I see "point shooting" get posted all the time here, but what do you mean by it?
These are both very short and highly informative videos on the subject, presente by two bonified experts.
1. even back then hip shooting was only recommended for close range, like 7 yards and in. Bringing the gun up to eye level and using the sights was still taught for longer range engagements. And he does mention that in the video
2. much more speculative on my part, I don't think there was as much emphasis on "good hits" back then. As in they seemed to not emphasize hitting vitals and seemed to treat all torso hits as equal. Which is understandable, because in the vast majority shooting vids, when someone is hit once or twice, it usually stops the fight. The videos of people needing a whole mag to go down are the exception, not the rule.
3. Fairbairn probably had an effect on it as well, as not only did he specifically advocate for shooting from the hip (at close ranges, he also recommended using the sights, or just a brass bead was his recommended sight for revolvers, at longer ranges). He was also heavily emphasized getting the first shot off, even if it missed and so people probably just assumed that shooting from the hip was slightly faster and worth the tradeoff to get a first shot off in a very close range engagement.
Because you always train for follow up shots, why wouldn’t you? Why not just have a single shot? Because that’s fricking stupid and you should never rely on dropping someone with one shot. Shotguns with stocks are designed to be shoulder fired because it absorbs more recoil that way, you can pump it faster, and you can aim better. Why would I give those things up just to look like a moron? You’re fricking stupid.
>be me at rural king last month looking at guns >they have a Mossberg shockwave there >boomer standing next to me says something like "they'll be after those next after they take our ARs" >I used to own one and chime in "eh they're not that great anyway, I tried to aim with one and busted myself in the chin" >he says you're supposed to hipfire a shotgun and poses like in OP
>requires people to practice and also remain calm if they do have to draw and shoot
All shooting requires practice; and there's nothing you can do about an intense rush of adrenaline in a real self defense situation; other than try& practice for it.
>do a thing that requires work and also gives me a non-sequitur thing to derail the conversation
Point shooting is lazy and you need to be accountable for your shots, also shot placement is very important for handguns so simply hitting the target isnt good enough
>Point shooting is lazy
Not at all, it's tougher to master than other pistol shooting methods
>it's tougher to master
Then why do it? The only reason I’d point shoot is if I was trying to shoot somebody point blank and didn’t have time to raise my gun all the way.
>do a thing that requires work and also gives me a non-sequitur thing to derail the conversation
Point shooting is lazy and you need to be accountable for your shots, also shot placement is very important for handguns so simply hitting the target isnt good enough
I shoot from the hip when wearing nods. It makes me feel like terminator and get yelled at to "Take this shit seriously." I don't care. I shoot from the hip.
Contrarian Neo-Fudds are the most bizarre shit. It's like Indian mumbo-jumbo about "following the Wisdom of Our Ancestors," but instead it's the "Comic Dipshittery of Our Ancestors."
61313823
Because you're giving bad advice on shooting. It's irresponsible. >b-but my troll is so funny and le epic!
People like you are why this website is shit btw.
>Because you're giving bad advice on shooting. It's irresponsible
Spotted the liberal.
There's nothing wrong with point shooting. It was standard practice for decades and is still extremely relevant. In fact, I'd say that if you carry, you should practice one-handed point shooting. Say you're walking your dog and you're attacked by another feral dog or by a person. Can't just let go of your dog's leash, THAT would be highly irresponsible. Gotta practice point shooting to stay prepared and responsible. Now, as far as who's shitting up the board, i'd say it's the homosexual "WHAAA I'm not giving you a (you) because you upset me!" types. Also the Slavic shills.
spotted the moron who can't read. My post was not saying point shooting was bad. You're reading comprehension is abyssal. My post was a response to an idiot saying >you don't need to learn how to perform follow up shots or proper stance because you can just point shoot and one hit kill your target.
I didn't even read your wall of text since it was responding to a strawman that only existed in your head.
If you don't practice with your gun enough to guarantee hitting your target in the vitals on the first shot every time, then you are a completely irresponsible gun carrier. Follow up shots are contingencies for a lack of skill. Read: a cope.
Personally I point-shoot my double-barrel (with only one barrel loaded, there has NEVER been a recorded self-defense incident where a shotgun needed to be fired twice) from my coat pocket (I wear extremely large coats year-round and destroy over three dozen coats per year practicing), in fact just pumping the action is enough to "send 'em runnin'" (the double-barrel doesn't have a pump action so I just make a "CHUK-CHIK" sound with my mouth).
>newbie doesn't understand how to post >newbie doesn't actually make any arguments >newbie deflects constantly >newbie baits by claiming others are baiting >newbie calls others newbie
Tale as old as /k/
sadly, cops decided they didn't want to dress like homosexuals anymore (also they learned that you're more likely to hit what you're aiming at if you actually aim)
Me
>TL:DW
back in the 30's there was an FBI agent who was really good at shooting from the hip so everyone thought they would just try to do what he did, which turned out to not be the best idea.
I watched that, and it somehow makes no sense and a ton of sense simultaneously. On one hand, it's not surprising that people would go for strict emulation, especially when you see it now with how people discuss "the one best gun/technique" meta. On the other hand, you're telling me that for years, nobody in the position to make decisions figured out that bringing the gun up to eye level adds no additional time but increases accuracy? I can understand certain things holding institutional momentum, like shooting a handgun with only one hand, but what kind of moron makes the call that we should all just stop actually aiming the gun just because of one guy? I was a teenager playing around with a Blackhawk when I figured out that hip shooting was just for theatrical bullshit.
I see "point shooting" get posted all the time here, but what do you mean by it? Is it strict hip shooting, "Doom shooting" from just below eye level, or something else? Is it still point shooting if I have both hands on the gun, a proper grip and stance, but I'm focused on the target and relying on muscle memory, or "pointing", for aiming?
>I see "point shooting" get posted all the time here, but what do you mean by it?
These are both very short and highly informative videos on the subject, presente by two bonified experts.
And
1. even back then hip shooting was only recommended for close range, like 7 yards and in. Bringing the gun up to eye level and using the sights was still taught for longer range engagements. And he does mention that in the video
2. much more speculative on my part, I don't think there was as much emphasis on "good hits" back then. As in they seemed to not emphasize hitting vitals and seemed to treat all torso hits as equal. Which is understandable, because in the vast majority shooting vids, when someone is hit once or twice, it usually stops the fight. The videos of people needing a whole mag to go down are the exception, not the rule.
3. Fairbairn probably had an effect on it as well, as not only did he specifically advocate for shooting from the hip (at close ranges, he also recommended using the sights, or just a brass bead was his recommended sight for revolvers, at longer ranges). He was also heavily emphasized getting the first shot off, even if it missed and so people probably just assumed that shooting from the hip was slightly faster and worth the tradeoff to get a first shot off in a very close range engagement.
IMO I really like the Rex Applegate's method. It's sort of the compromise between point shooting and sighted aimed fire
aiming
The fact that it's neither a good pose for accurate shooting and sucks ass if you want to quickly rack n' aim follow up shots.
>follow up shots
Unnecessary if you practice your point shooting enough
moronic post.
How so?
Because you always train for follow up shots, why wouldn’t you? Why not just have a single shot? Because that’s fricking stupid and you should never rely on dropping someone with one shot. Shotguns with stocks are designed to be shoulder fired because it absorbs more recoil that way, you can pump it faster, and you can aim better. Why would I give those things up just to look like a moron? You’re fricking stupid.
Why are you so upset? Are you mad? What's wrong buddy?
t. Someone who goes to the range once a month and point shoots at targets 7 feet away
always bully and antagonize point shooting enthusiasts
twice per month, 21ft away
>be me at rural king last month looking at guns
>they have a Mossberg shockwave there
>boomer standing next to me says something like "they'll be after those next after they take our ARs"
>I used to own one and chime in "eh they're not that great anyway, I tried to aim with one and busted myself in the chin"
>he says you're supposed to hipfire a shotgun and poses like in OP
fricking boomers
Boomer was a moron but so are you for either having too loose of a grip or keeping the gun too close to your face.
He mogged you
61313633
>if you practice point shooting enough you'll never miss and always one hit kill!!!
moronic post and likely bait so no (you).
Not an argument, very low effort, no guns and nonwhite
61313660
Work on your bait skills newbie
Post your gun and then explain why point shooting isn't viable
>point shot this pheasant btw
it is, but still still want to bring it up to eye level. That's what skeet/bird shooters do and what Rex Applegate advocated for with handguns.
requires people to practice and also remain calm if they do have to draw and shoot, which 90% of cops cant do either of those things
>requires people to practice and also remain calm if they do have to draw and shoot
All shooting requires practice; and there's nothing you can do about an intense rush of adrenaline in a real self defense situation; other than try& practice for it.
>Point shooting is lazy
Not at all, it's tougher to master than other pistol shooting methods
>it's tougher to master
Then why do it? The only reason I’d point shoot is if I was trying to shoot somebody point blank and didn’t have time to raise my gun all the way.
>do a thing that requires work and also gives me a non-sequitur thing to derail the conversation
Point shooting is lazy and you need to be accountable for your shots, also shot placement is very important for handguns so simply hitting the target isnt good enough
>What ended this?
Modern police officers are too heavy for their knees
They realized it was more effective to shoot hippies in the face and upper body than it was to shoot them in the groin.
I shoot from the hip when wearing nods. It makes me feel like terminator and get yelled at to "Take this shit seriously." I don't care. I shoot from the hip.
Contrarian Neo-Fudds are the most bizarre shit. It's like Indian mumbo-jumbo about "following the Wisdom of Our Ancestors," but instead it's the "Comic Dipshittery of Our Ancestors."
61313823
Because you're giving bad advice on shooting. It's irresponsible.
>b-but my troll is so funny and le epic!
People like you are why this website is shit btw.
>being a fricking newbie
Just kys.
>Because you're giving bad advice on shooting. It's irresponsible
Spotted the liberal.
There's nothing wrong with point shooting. It was standard practice for decades and is still extremely relevant. In fact, I'd say that if you carry, you should practice one-handed point shooting. Say you're walking your dog and you're attacked by another feral dog or by a person. Can't just let go of your dog's leash, THAT would be highly irresponsible. Gotta practice point shooting to stay prepared and responsible. Now, as far as who's shitting up the board, i'd say it's the homosexual "WHAAA I'm not giving you a (you) because you upset me!" types. Also the Slavic shills.
spotted the moron who can't read. My post was not saying point shooting was bad. You're reading comprehension is abyssal. My post was a response to an idiot saying
>you don't need to learn how to perform follow up shots or proper stance because you can just point shoot and one hit kill your target.
I didn't even read your wall of text since it was responding to a strawman that only existed in your head.
If you don't practice with your gun enough to guarantee hitting your target in the vitals on the first shot every time, then you are a completely irresponsible gun carrier. Follow up shots are contingencies for a lack of skill. Read: a cope.
If this is true, what’s the point of owning any gun that isn’t a single-shot?
Excellent excellent question.
Personally I point-shoot my double-barrel (with only one barrel loaded, there has NEVER been a recorded self-defense incident where a shotgun needed to be fired twice) from my coat pocket (I wear extremely large coats year-round and destroy over three dozen coats per year practicing), in fact just pumping the action is enough to "send 'em runnin'" (the double-barrel doesn't have a pump action so I just make a "CHUK-CHIK" sound with my mouth).
Learning that you generally don't hit things if you don't aim
61314006
Work on your bait skills newbie
>newbie doesn't understand how to post
>newbie doesn't actually make any arguments
>newbie deflects constantly
>newbie baits by claiming others are baiting
>newbie calls others newbie
Tale as old as /k/
61314117
hi newbie!
Regulations on lead paint.
sadly, cops decided they didn't want to dress like homosexuals anymore (also they learned that you're more likely to hit what you're aiming at if you actually aim)
by evolving