Technically they did seize the airport just fine. Its the bits that came after that were a problem. Kind of like dying in a high speed car crash - its not the going fast that kills you
They did have the airport for a bit, it was the whole holding it and connecting with reinforcements part that seemed to not work out too well.
>The Dieppe Raid was a success. They took the beach!
This hostomel-was-actually-a-win althistory bullshit is so tiresome. I bet we'll hear it for decades to come.
Hm?
It's okay to say that out of a scenario of three parts that the first part went well.
In a sports game, for example, your team can be up in the first half then lose 10,000 vehicles over 2 years of your 3 day military exercise in the second half.
The team still did okay that first half. That's okay to say. Don't be so autistic.
>first half
more like scoring 1 point in the first minute but multiple of your helicopters get shot down and then you proceed to get raped by farmers with their tractors for the next 4 weeks
Bro, if Russia is holding so much as one square meter of Ukrainian land at the end of the war we'll spend the next century listening to 90-IQ brown people gloating about Russia's victory over "the west".
Why are thirdies so sychophantically pro Russian?Is this some decades long propaganda effort by russians? An understandable animus towards their nasty history with western powers?
They do understand that Russians see them as subhuman, right?
Thirdies hate that they are demonstrably incapable of functional society, and that the closest they came to it was being lorded over by the master race(s) from Europe. Anything that seems bad for a white nation is applauded
>thirdies so sychophantically pro Russian?
they smell money >Is this some decades long propaganda effort by russians?
yes >An understandable animus towards their nasty history with western powers?
yes but only among the hoi polloi. Go to India and you quickly find that the upper caste Aryan Indians are VERY clear about their preference for the UK/US/Israel, but the further down the rungs and the browner you get the more they like to slob soviet knob.
Also they they're the cheapest native-english speaking troll farmers around, even cheaper than the teenage slave labor in belarus and moscow, so King Monke gets a lot for a little rupee >softly softly catchee monke
>so King Monke gets a lot for a little rupee
Makes sense. Russia has billions in rupees from selling gas and oil to India, but can't spend it anywhere else.
Did you know you can examine events that occured within a scenario individually?
The initial drop and seizure of Hostomel was successful. The events after were a failure and the actual outcome of the entire scenario was a failure for the RuAF.
Just because copelord is conflating initial success with overall outcome doesn't mean you have to be a contradictory twat.
>The initial drop and seizure of Hostomel was successful
The initial drop you speak of were wiped out with the VDV having to land outside the airport. The "seizure" you say included the whole airport destroyed and the runways blown to bits which meant it couldn't be used for anything and from the first day to the day they left there couldn't bring in planes and were under artillery fire.
Stop with this fricking autism. Take your fricking meds, taking things too literally and not understanding nuance is a sign of autism. You're not israeli so it obviously can't be fricking phariseeism.
The VDV "landed" and "seized" the airport the same way I park my car by running it into the fricking wall and breaking my neck. Frick off, take your meds.
>Airport was held for a period of time
another undisputable russian win
3 months ago
Anonymous
Wasn't a win. Operation was an overall failure. Just seems like you toddlers can't comprehend they landed and occupied a patch of a dirt and concrete. I'm sure in your version events they simply all died en route due to heart disease or something
3 months ago
Anonymous
Based moron
3 months ago
Anonymous
Maybe you can get some clapped out pussy at your local gas station anon. Seems like you need some
>The Dieppe Raid was a success. They took the beach!
Honestly, this is the best comparison
Although a higher percentage of the Dieppeleafs actually managed to retreat, because they weren't an airmobile force
Dieppe is a good comparison though I feel like Dieppe is easier to argue as a "win" since it atleast gave valuable lessons learned of how not to do an invasion that could be applied to D-Day later.
No, they technically didn't seize it just fine. They totally failed their objective because they were too slow and the Ukrainians were able to disable the runway. Airfield seizure needs to take the airfield intact - an airfield with an inoperable runway isn't an airfield, it's just a random field.
>No, they technically didn't seize it just fine. They totally failed their objective because they were too slow and the Ukrainians were able to disable the runway.
/thread
>Airfield seizure needs to take the airfield intact - an airfield with an inoperable runway isn't an airfield, it's just a random field. >implying that they can't repair the runways
FFS Russian fighter jets all have rough field capability (mostly because their regular runways are complete shit as is).
>Russian fighter jets all have rough field capability
Ok, so what then? Land jets in mortar range to be surrounded by long-range AA and not be able to even fuel or arm them?
The real objective was to land thousands more troops on heavy transport planes, which absolutely cannot land on rough ground or even light tarmac.
Seizing =/= securing. VDV's job was to secure it and they failed.
I mean it basically went >seize the airport from a bunch of reservists who only retreated when they ran out of ammo >they still downed several helicopters and forced the VDV to scuttle another >VDV sit at the airport while they wait for the glorious column of troops to march out of Belarus >meanwhile AFU surround the airport and begin counter attacking >VDV realise the Belarus attack is delayed so long they’re going to run out of ammo >VDV can’t even get an airlift due to intensity of fire >VDV surrounded and fought into submission >meanwhile the Belarus column is facing near constant ambushes on their push for Kyiv
It’s like the vatniks saw Market Garden and decided to try and mimic it
>Well ACKshually the Hostomel landing was a complete success
They did have the airport for a bit, it was the whole holding it and connecting with reinforcements part that seemed to not work out too well.
No it's not. The purpose of the operation is to seize the airport as an airbridge -IN ORDER TO BRING IN MORE TROOPS BY IL76-. Did they do that second part? No? THEN IT'S A FRICKING FAILURE
I'm tired of having this discussion with deluded vatniks. Absolutely anyone, anyone in the world can send a bunch of poor batsards to sit on an airfield for 6 hours before getting shelled to bloody shreds. Even fricking Arab nations can manage that, no problem.
No one knows what the objective was. If it was to use the airport then it was a failure BECAUSE YOU CAN’T FLY CARGO PLANES THROUGH AD you fricking mouth breathing reject. IF they intended to use the airport it would only be possible if AD had been knocked out regardless of the VDV’s success.
>No one knows what the objective was >Proceeds to then explain what the objective, which was exactly what I said it was.
Is this some kind of new brownoid tactic, to be so moronic you just confuse the person you're arguing with?
It doesn't matter exactly why they failed, all that matters is they failed. In fact a mission can fail because of more than one reason.
Their objective was to capture Kiev as fast as possible by using the airport for troop and armor transport. They thought they could capture Kiev before Ukraine had time to organize a defence.
They wanted to encircle Kiev, but not capture it — until that became necessary, ie, plan B in a regime-change plan. However, as long as AD remains up they simply CAN’T use the airport so even if they did originally intend to use it they would have to give up on that no matter how well the VDV performed. The fact that they pulled out the next day after having linked up with a ground unit tells me they never actually wanted to use it otherwise I’d imagine they’d hold on for a while longer hoping they could knock out AD shortly. This was BEFORE the UA had mustered their defenses so it’s not as if those VDV were urgently needed somewhere else more important than an airport they wanted to make use of.
Air defense was not the main issue, it was artillery and the fact that the UA remained active and did not rout. This was obviously planned as a repeat of Czechoslovakia and Operation-222, but those only worked because the enemy dissolved on contact and they had intact infrastructure to fly in reinforcements and supplies.
>The fact that they pulled out the next day after having linked up with a ground unit tells me they never actually wanted to use it otherwise I’d imagine they’d hold on for a while longer hoping they could knock out AD shortly.
No, they pulled out because Ukraine shelled the tarmac and made the runway useless.
>They wanted to encircle Kiev, but not capture it
Your first sentence is Turdworlder cope, I’m not reading past it. >We never wanted to capture the “””illegal””” government of the nation we invaded to vassalise.
Did you even listen to Putin’s Feb 22 speech? Tell me 10 lies, I’m not going to listen to any of them.
They pulled out the next day because they came under ground attack by infantry you fricking idiot. After that day that's when the rest of the collumn arrived and they re-occupied the airport but the runway was useless. They only fully pulled out when they pulled out from Northern Ukraine in general.
>They wanted to encircle Kiev, but not capture it
No. They intended to capture it from the outset.
That's not conjecture; we know because (picrel) when the 1st Guards Tank Army abandoned vehicles outside of Kyiv, they left behind copies of their orders from the Kremlin. A decapitation strike on Kyiv was THE lynchpin of the Russian plan to install a puppet government quickly enough that the West would have to accept it as a fait accompli.
Further details from the source here: https://static.rusi.org/359-SR-Ukraine-Preliminary-Lessons-Feb-July-2022-web-final.pdf > The northern axis was the main effort, focused on the encirclement and capture of Kyiv. For this purpose, the Russians formed two groups of forces commanded from the Eastern Military District Command Post. One group was formed in the Gomel region of Belarus and used the tactical sign ‘V’ with orders to attack Kyiv along the right (western) bank of the Dnipro River. The second group was formed in the Bryansk region of Russia and used the tactical sign ‘O’ with orders to surround Kyiv from the left (eastern) bank.
3 months ago
Anonymous
The 1GTA routing like cowards is still the best part of this horrible war.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Agreed, but only because we were blue-balled on the spectacle of a massive Russian Dollar-Store D-Day getting absolutely wrecked in Odesa. Still, watching the much-vaunted 1GTA ditch undamaged tanks to flee in panic? Glorious.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>Still, watching the much-vaunted 1GTA ditch undamaged tanks to flee in panic? Glorious.
The massive amount of top end (for Russia) gear left behind in the opening days of the war is a big part of why Ukraine managed to hold on and make big gains in the counter offensives in Kherson and Kharkov. Russia really was the #1 supplier of military equipment to Ukraine in that time.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>but only because we were blue-balled on the spectacle of a massive Russian Dollar-Store D-Day getting absolutely wrecked in Odesa
Don't even make my remember Gopnipoli
It could have been hilarious
Let me guess, the objective was to find unicorns so DVD made successfull landing, captured airport, found unicorns down there and the retreated to Belarus because "Frick Kiev, Russia now have unicorns!"
>No one knows what the objective was
Bullshit. Their objective was same as it was in Danube, Pristina and Simferopol. Seize a forward airbase to act as a logistics hub to bring in more supplies and reinforcements. >If it was to use the airport then it was a failure BECAUSE YOU CAN’T FLY CARGO PLANES THROUGH AD you fricking mouth breathing reject.
Once they could not establish control over the airbase, the reinforcements being brought in by IL-76s had to be re-routed to Belarus. The air defense angle just goes to show how completely Russian intel failed prior to the war.
Face it, the VDV were sent on a suicide mission and their only success was to die in the manner in which they were sent.
>BECAUSE YOU CAN’T FLY CARGO PLANES THROUGH AD you fricking mouth breathing reject. IF they intended to use the airport it would only be possible if AD had been knocked out regardless of the VDV’s success.
It's pretty well established that the Russians thought they were going to knock out all the AD in the initial strikes. Unfortunately for them they completely underestimated Ukraine's mobile AD assets, and relied on extremely outdated intel about where the fixed stuff was, quite a few Russian missiles hit locations that where AD installations had been years previously (some literally during the Soviet era) but were long gone. This is why there were so many Russian aircraft shot down in the initial invasion too, they flew in expecting zero resistance and were caught totally by surprise.
It's not at all hard to believe that the Russians planned on flying cargo planes right into the airport.
>Even fricking Arab nations can manage that, no problem.
I can't stop laughing at the most successful air assault operation being done by fricking Africans of all people
They took the airport initially yes, but they didn't secure it or keep it secured to exploit it, nor did their allies arrive to assist them as planned.
did VDV prosecute themselves as professional soldiers? maybe, even probably, but they still fricked it up.
It's like ordering Fettuccine Alfredo at a restaurant and being served a plate of boiled plain macaroni.
>did VDV prosecute themselves as professional soldiers?
reminder that the VDV also was part of the war crimes around Bucha out of butthurt when their column was attacked near there.
That was a month later iirc. Their taints weren't as bruised yet during the airport fiasco. Honestly if anything the unit's later behavior is likely informed by how fricking awful everything went for them during the previous month. All those unsupported helicopter raids across MANPAD land, getting blasted off the airport, daylight paradrops, etc. Kind of shocking they aren't implicated in more war crimes yet, but i guess most of them were dead by late march, so it's probably lack of manpower.
Point of aerial assault on airport is to secure the landing strip for quick deployment of heavy troops to seize whatever they wanted to seize in Kyiv. So no, they didnt capture it "just fine".
Technically they did seize the airport just fine. Its the bits that came after that were a problem. Kind of like dying in a high speed car crash - its not the going fast that kills you
>get bombed by Su-24 on day 1 >get shelled by Grad on day 2 >I-It's fine guys, the Il-76 can totally still make the landings and reinforce us
No, they were fricked from day 1. Forget about ground forces linkup - the *airlanding reinforcement* wasn't on the table - and that was critical for even having a shot at actually holding the area and having a chance to survive until the armor drove up (which it never could have because of the 40-mile traffic jam). This wasn't Market Garden, this was like the Soviet VDV suicide jumps during the 1941 counter-offensives. Did Stalin never tell you about those? I wonder why.
It was supposed to be Prague Spring 2.0. It's painfully obvious how similar these operations were when you look closely. Only one problem - Russian intelligence has degenerated even more so than the Russian military, as compared to Prague spring. The S2 and corresponding strategy was TERRIBLY off the mark. If Putin saw the real picture, there would have never been an invasion of any kind.
>It was supposed to be Prague Spring 2.0. It's painfully obvious how similar these operations were when you look closely.
I was laughing so hard seeing all those dead Russian riot police. I hope they begged before their lives ended.
>if the enemy would certainly damage the runway
Russians expected Ukrainians to be unwilling to fight, and incapable of doing it properly if they tried
Uh, actually the French successfully entered the Saar region in September 1939, so obviously the Battle of France was definitely NOT an Allied failure.
A lot. Have you read his horny book about a pair of 20 year old steampunk lesbians slowly falling for each other, full of descriptions about how they breastfed boobily as they dressed?
t. 24 year old virgin here (fricked my life up professionally, not a dysgenic creep), and reading the excerpts from this guy's book makes me want to crush his skull.
Why they left the next day is up to speculation. Maybe they originally wanted to use the airport but couldn’t because AD hadn’t been knocked out so that was impossible. Maybe it was a diversion, maybe it was to deny the use of the airport for day 1 ops.
What the frick? Dude, this board swam in pictures and videos of their burned carcasses and wrecked BMDs for days after the battle. I'll never forget the melted aluminium puddles, it was sick. You're living in a fricking alternate reality.
So it was a total success, and then they left? What happened at Irpin then, with that famous crossroads video filmed by Ukrainian SSO, featuring a lot of BMD-4's and Spetsnaz with Adidas strips?
Never seen TDF with that kind of kit, or operating that hard. Could've been anyone of course, given how much of a clusterfrick the first week was. Could've been GUR or even a foreign fighter unit. But I've never heard them called anything other than SSO.
Never seen TDF with that kind of kit, or operating that hard. Could've been anyone of course, given how much of a clusterfrick the first week was. Could've been GUR or even a foreign fighter unit. But I've never heard them called anything other than SSO.
It was both, the Ukrainian Special Purpose units were leading the TDF, like paramilitary units are supposed to be used.
>Ukraine invented a wild story about launching a crushing counterattack >The VDV looted the werehouse of ammo then linked up with ground forces the next day and left, the end.
so they left because...?
For those unaware, this was an article that was accidentally posted by Russian media when they thought the invasion was going to be successful. It was immediately retracted, but people screen capped it. Interestingly, it effectively broadcasts all of Russia's insecurities by stating the real reasons got the invasion. I'm surprised this hasn't been weaponized as a psyop on a more widespread scale. Things that make Russians cry:
>The knowledge they are irrelevant and their geopolitical power has been declining for 30 years. >The fear that other states doing better than them and soon they will be a "have-not" state. >A East-West Germany scenario where Russians have the option to flee to a prosperous, democratic, western aligned Ukraine >The knowledge that their military/demographics/oligarchy is collapsing and this was their last chance to invade >Domestic unrest from war fatigue and western sanctions impacting livelihoods. >EU + US cohesion containing them
TZD. Their whole worldview seems to be about stealing someone else's toilet rather than fixing their own.
>A East-West Germany scenario where Russians have the option to flee to a prosperous, democratic, western aligned Ukraine
Well I don't see that happening in my lifetime. Guess the SMO is actually achieving some of its objectives.
Well done Russia.
1. 100 Billion + are going to go to them to rebuild from the west post-war
2. They will likely get the 300 Billion of seized Russian assets as part of any peace negotiations
3. EU integration will lead to hundreds of billions in aid to help upgrade infrastructure over the coming decades
4. Millions of young Russians who don't want to live in a failed autocracy will flee to Ukraine post war.
5. Ukraine has huge untapped energy reserves to bring in revenues
6. Ukraine is making huge strides dealing with corruption since Maidan
Look at how all the other post-cold war eastern Euro states are doing compared to Russia. I'd bet that by 2040 there will be serious talks about Schengen and full admittance. Hell, they're already figuring out the roadmap NOW.
I probably wasn't explicit enough.
I don't see a sovereign Ukraine accepting much Russian immigration (paperclip-lite situations aside) for a while after the war ends.
I don't see why they shouldn't. Almost every young educated person in Russia is against the war. Young Adult immigrants with higher education who can easily learn to speak Ukrainian are the holy grail of immigration. They aren't really a security threat since theymost likely oppose the current Russian regime and are nominally pro-west. A Million+ have already fled to Georgia/Armenia/the -Stans. I'd bet good money they'd prefer to live in Ukraine where there is more opportunity compared to those places + potential future EU membership. If you consider Russian speakers themselves as a national security concern, I'd argue that since Zelensky and Azov are Russian speakers you'd be dead fricking wrong about excluding them based on language and cultural background. Security checks, sure, but immigration of young adults from Russia bleeds Russia and makes Ukraine stronger, IMO.
3 months ago
Anonymous
>Almost every young educated person in Russia is against the war.
nope, its quite literally the opposite. You western morons still have a long, looonnng way to understanding the snow monkeys mindset. And why helping them to stop Barbarossa was the biggest disaster you ever caused in east euros history
and they are mouth foaming ziggers. The vatnik portion that is. What the russia todays of the world dont tell you is baltic russian speakers are divided between ukranians, belarussians and vatnigs proper. Not all of them are longing for monkes big liberation campaign
1. 100 Billion + are going to go to them to rebuild from the west post-war
2. They will likely get the 300 Billion of seized Russian assets as part of any peace negotiations
3. EU integration will lead to hundreds of billions in aid to help upgrade infrastructure over the coming decades
4. Millions of young Russians who don't want to live in a failed autocracy will flee to Ukraine post war.
5. Ukraine has huge untapped energy reserves to bring in revenues
6. Ukraine is making huge strides dealing with corruption since Maidan
Look at how all the other post-cold war eastern Euro states are doing compared to Russia. I'd bet that by 2040 there will be serious talks about Schengen and full admittance. Hell, they're already figuring out the roadmap NOW.
>1. 100 Billion + are going to go to them to rebuild from the west post-war >2. They will likely get the 300 Billion of seized Russian assets as part of any peace negotiations
Bruh, the invasion caused trillions in damage and fricked whole parts of the country for multiple decades to come even if someone would try to resolve the issues.
Well they're not making dubai even the moderately big city would probably only cost a couple of bill
3 months ago
Anonymous
Bruh, not even counting thousands of square kilometers of mined land (and also polluted land), there are things like dams destroyed, bridges, power plants, elements of the grid, factories (azovstal itself is more than 10+ billion USD), entire cities (like Mariupol, which basically got reduced to rubble), don't forget people (up to 100k civilians just in Mariupol).
3 months ago
Anonymous
Obviously they won't rebuild everything 1:1 and they won't giving free homes to everyone either. Expect a commieblock 2.0 or something a bit nicer if zhang involved
i kind of envy ukraine because they have a government that is willing to actually improve the country
3 months ago
Anonymous
Oh my sweet summer child
3 months ago
Anonymous
either elaborate of frick off vatBlack person
That’s what this war ultimately stems from: not want to wither and die and get looted by gulaghomo
3 months ago
Anonymous
not him, but before war Ukraine was generally known in the EU as a turbo corrupt country run by mafia. Basically russia, but smaller.
There's a good reason why a lot of eastern euros don't like ukies - because a lot of ukies who "work" there are either mafia, or thugs.
You have to understand eastern european countries- that after soviet union fell, there was a decade of total chaose lawlessness, and anarchy. A lot of shit got stolen by shitty people, who quickly became oligarchs and started doing business. And these people exist to this day - often in goverment positions.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Black, the "oligarchs" were the people doing all the stealing in the USSR already. They didn't become shit they just changed titles.
3 months ago
Anonymous
It would be hard to condense the answer for a point like this into a single post, here's 6 just for surface stuff.
The core of the issue is that since 1991 nobody really cleaned house after the commie regime and scars of the soviet past still haunt the country and society, despite some reforms and token decommunization.
One of the reasons for this is people who were in power mostly staying in power, perpetuating the soviet tradition of turbo corruption and nepotism. This is compounded by the fact that people lived so long with that shit during soviet times that they low key see that thing as normal and/or even beneficial.
Many people would unironically tell you that corruption is good, while not actually being the benefactors of it and instead the victims of it: "hurr-durr, corruption is good, thanks to it I just gave a bribe of X dollars and got the issue solved in few days and without it I'd need to spend like months to solve it", i.e. people unironically don't understand that the whole reason they are put into a position where some BS red tape shit takes months of time is specifically an artificially constructed situation by the corrupt homosexuals, basically placing them into a position where they can't live normally without paying bribes. Why? Because they didn't know better, because this is a natural continuation of soviet corruption, which might have been cheaper (because people were poor AF), but still required constant bribing to make thing work even a tiny bit.
Basically people in public sector and similar fields won't do shit until they get their wheels greased. Because the system doesn't have normal mechanism for responsibility and feedback. Because a ton of fricked up soviet red tape still exists, specifically to frick up your life. And a lot of that shit then would get entrenched and even more monetized by what you might call the "corrupt deep state", because people in such a system would obviously want to have more ways to monetize shit.
1/6
3 months ago
Anonymous
This creates a situation similar to cancer, where the system that should solve the issue is part of the issue. You can't expect cancer to cure itself. It's just too valuable of a mechanism to try and destroy for anyone in power, not only because of the amount of money it brings in (and yes, the flow of money goes to the top, as in with any organization, the old soviet criminal code "you steal for yourself, you share with the bros" applies, i.e. some low level homosexual gets money and shares it with his boss, the boss then shares with his own boss and it goes all the way to the government), but also because the power it provides. When all of the homosexuals don't have any responsibility and are tied by corruption, they'll do anything you tell them, hence you can use not only to protect someone, but also to create issues for someone. A person is being a pain? Let's have the tax office wake up and say that the apartment he sold 5 years ago in the middle of the economic crisis caused by Crimea and Donbas war was undervalued like 5x market price and thus he skimmed on taxed. Proof? What proof? Frick you, we're the government, we invent shit out of thin air. Let's the jail this person. And so on.
2/6
Any time processes would get successfully improved (and such situation did happen) it's at least partially caused by just removing a specific process from being done by people it was previously handled, or just outsourced entirely. Some of issues like this solved themselves via the market, such as basically the local package shipping industry overtaking the notoriously shitty state-run postal company. But there's also the issue of people's mentality being stuck doing things which they did before. Here's a fricked up example from around 2014: a friend of a colleague had his kid reach the age where they'd need (want) to send him to the kindergarten, they go to a local municipal one and get told that "hurr-durr, not enough vacant positions in the kindergarten to go around, you had to get in queue 5 years (when they didn't have a kid yet lol) ago to get a position new", while obviously signaling that they expect him to pay the bribe. Because that what they do. They are put in a position where they control access to something you need, nobody would frick them over for their shit, so they demand bribes or else. So the guy goes and pays $5K and the position for his kid magically appears. When I was first told of this situation it honestly blew my mind, not only because the degenerate in question actually went and paid $5K just for access to the shitty soviet municipal kindergarten (not the services of going there by the way, that would cost on top, albeit being cheap), instead of going to a private one where no such BS would take place, and where his $5K would pay for years of a very good one, but also why did he even need kindergarten in the first place? His wife doesn't work, the kid can stay home. "Hurr-durr well, back when I was a kid my parents sent me to a kindergarten, so that's normal, so that's what I'll do as well" - like no frickin' shit, as if your parents had a frickin' choice.
3/6
When this sort of shit exists for decades after decades it fricks up things to such a degree that you have teens dreaming of going to specific public position to steal stuff. Imagine a 16 y.o. kid saying shit like he want to go work in the customs office, because people there "get" a shit load of money. Or the tax office, or the police, or the court system, or the any government work in general. Basically, no normal person would touch those position with a ten foot pole. And even if they somehow got there, they'd either get corrupted in some time themselves (imagine basically a normal person starts working it local government and then he starts lying by default, even to friend and family, even when discussing things which don't matter and have no benefit for him, because that's his default mode now), or they'll run away screaming from that hell hole, or they'll get squeezed out. Hey, somebody needs to get jailed for corruption, right? Let's frame the new guy who thinks he's better than us kek.
This could be changed, but requires a ton of political will and integrity from the top, which is obviously isn't there. Because if you have it, you would need to start jailing your own guys that you brought in with yourself for loyalty reasons and they started doing corrupt shit. But you can't do that, because they are "your guys", at most you'll fire them. But what sort of incentives that creates? Sure, you can do corrupt things, but you'll never answer for this, at most you'll lose your position personally.
In such a system good results happen only by chance and there are a ton of people who'd frick over any good project or initiative just because it happens without their greasy fingers being involved.
4/6
And yes, this is in many ways caused / stimulated by russians. Because such a system provides them additional control and influence. Hence why the relations between russia and Georgia started falling apart only when Saakashvili started firing entrenched corrupt homosexuals. Because if you remove corruption, it erodes the pidor influence matrix. But, once cultivated and stimulated, it creates a ton of local entrenched interest. Because it creates layers of society which can live like kings, compared to regular folks, without doing anything productive in their lives.
Here's a fricked up example from around 2012: your regular frick can barely afford a new $10K Daewoo Lanos, while you drive around on a pretty much new Toyota Land Cruiser which cost you $5K, because it was stolen in EU and illegally imported here (because you can't register it within the EU) and registered under bogus documents in the registry, you have access to his car because you father is a cop in the right position, and those people have this cottage industry of these cheap fancy cars, which they can enjoy without paying a real price for them.
You want to import a car from EU or US? Get ready to be raped financially. Some Black person with connection imports is? Zero payment, yanukovich personally will sign a decree saying that you're importing this Cadillac Escalade as a way to help the local agricultural industry and thus you shouldn't need to pay taxes or import duties on it. (Not a joke).
So yes, even though it's nowhere near the level of shit being done in russia, it's still bad and fricked up.
And even a ton of progress happening since 2014 didn't magically fix almost a century of soviet frickery.
5/6
So yes, while in some locations shit got fixed after attacks pretty fast, any local would point you to examples of when things are different and shit gets dragged out for months and months without too much progress, because the corrupt fricks don't care about the result, they care that the affiliated company would work on this and thus skim over the money. Like it's pretty bad in Zaporizhia for example. People know about it, it's in the media, for some reason nobody is getting jailed for this.
This is partially the similar reason why a lot of local MIC projects are fricked: corruption, traitors and all that shit.
6/6
[...]
This isn't because of the government, but because people. People here, despite being fricked over by soviet shit, are still generally way more proactive and have way more initiative, compared to russia. Russia is hyper-paternalism going apeshit. Ukraine is grassroots country.
thank you
3 months ago
Anonymous
This creates a situation similar to cancer, where the system that should solve the issue is part of the issue. You can't expect cancer to cure itself. It's just too valuable of a mechanism to try and destroy for anyone in power, not only because of the amount of money it brings in (and yes, the flow of money goes to the top, as in with any organization, the old soviet criminal code "you steal for yourself, you share with the bros" applies, i.e. some low level homosexual gets money and shares it with his boss, the boss then shares with his own boss and it goes all the way to the government), but also because the power it provides. When all of the homosexuals don't have any responsibility and are tied by corruption, they'll do anything you tell them, hence you can use not only to protect someone, but also to create issues for someone. A person is being a pain? Let's have the tax office wake up and say that the apartment he sold 5 years ago in the middle of the economic crisis caused by Crimea and Donbas war was undervalued like 5x market price and thus he skimmed on taxed. Proof? What proof? Frick you, we're the government, we invent shit out of thin air. Let's the jail this person. And so on.
2/6
Any time processes would get successfully improved (and such situation did happen) it's at least partially caused by just removing a specific process from being done by people it was previously handled, or just outsourced entirely. Some of issues like this solved themselves via the market, such as basically the local package shipping industry overtaking the notoriously shitty state-run postal company. But there's also the issue of people's mentality being stuck doing things which they did before. Here's a fricked up example from around 2014: a friend of a colleague had his kid reach the age where they'd need (want) to send him to the kindergarten, they go to a local municipal one and get told that "hurr-durr, not enough vacant positions in the kindergarten to go around, you had to get in queue 5 years (when they didn't have a kid yet lol) ago to get a position new", while obviously signaling that they expect him to pay the bribe. Because that what they do. They are put in a position where they control access to something you need, nobody would frick them over for their shit, so they demand bribes or else. So the guy goes and pays $5K and the position for his kid magically appears. When I was first told of this situation it honestly blew my mind, not only because the degenerate in question actually went and paid $5K just for access to the shitty soviet municipal kindergarten (not the services of going there by the way, that would cost on top, albeit being cheap), instead of going to a private one where no such BS would take place, and where his $5K would pay for years of a very good one, but also why did he even need kindergarten in the first place? His wife doesn't work, the kid can stay home. "Hurr-durr well, back when I was a kid my parents sent me to a kindergarten, so that's normal, so that's what I'll do as well" - like no frickin' shit, as if your parents had a frickin' choice.
3/6
When this sort of shit exists for decades after decades it fricks up things to such a degree that you have teens dreaming of going to specific public position to steal stuff. Imagine a 16 y.o. kid saying shit like he want to go work in the customs office, because people there "get" a shit load of money. Or the tax office, or the police, or the court system, or the any government work in general. Basically, no normal person would touch those position with a ten foot pole. And even if they somehow got there, they'd either get corrupted in some time themselves (imagine basically a normal person starts working it local government and then he starts lying by default, even to friend and family, even when discussing things which don't matter and have no benefit for him, because that's his default mode now), or they'll run away screaming from that hell hole, or they'll get squeezed out. Hey, somebody needs to get jailed for corruption, right? Let's frame the new guy who thinks he's better than us kek.
This could be changed, but requires a ton of political will and integrity from the top, which is obviously isn't there. Because if you have it, you would need to start jailing your own guys that you brought in with yourself for loyalty reasons and they started doing corrupt shit. But you can't do that, because they are "your guys", at most you'll fire them. But what sort of incentives that creates? Sure, you can do corrupt things, but you'll never answer for this, at most you'll lose your position personally.
In such a system good results happen only by chance and there are a ton of people who'd frick over any good project or initiative just because it happens without their greasy fingers being involved.
4/6
And yes, this is in many ways caused / stimulated by russians. Because such a system provides them additional control and influence. Hence why the relations between russia and Georgia started falling apart only when Saakashvili started firing entrenched corrupt homosexuals. Because if you remove corruption, it erodes the pidor influence matrix. But, once cultivated and stimulated, it creates a ton of local entrenched interest. Because it creates layers of society which can live like kings, compared to regular folks, without doing anything productive in their lives.
Here's a fricked up example from around 2012: your regular frick can barely afford a new $10K Daewoo Lanos, while you drive around on a pretty much new Toyota Land Cruiser which cost you $5K, because it was stolen in EU and illegally imported here (because you can't register it within the EU) and registered under bogus documents in the registry, you have access to his car because you father is a cop in the right position, and those people have this cottage industry of these cheap fancy cars, which they can enjoy without paying a real price for them.
You want to import a car from EU or US? Get ready to be raped financially. Some Black person with connection imports is? Zero payment, yanukovich personally will sign a decree saying that you're importing this Cadillac Escalade as a way to help the local agricultural industry and thus you shouldn't need to pay taxes or import duties on it. (Not a joke).
So yes, even though it's nowhere near the level of shit being done in russia, it's still bad and fricked up.
And even a ton of progress happening since 2014 didn't magically fix almost a century of soviet frickery.
5/6
So yes, while in some locations shit got fixed after attacks pretty fast, any local would point you to examples of when things are different and shit gets dragged out for months and months without too much progress, because the corrupt fricks don't care about the result, they care that the affiliated company would work on this and thus skim over the money. Like it's pretty bad in Zaporizhia for example. People know about it, it's in the media, for some reason nobody is getting jailed for this.
This is partially the similar reason why a lot of local MIC projects are fricked: corruption, traitors and all that shit.
6/6
[...]
This isn't because of the government, but because people. People here, despite being fricked over by soviet shit, are still generally way more proactive and have way more initiative, compared to russia. Russia is hyper-paternalism going apeshit. Ukraine is grassroots country.
Wonderful posts. I never even put a foot in Europe but I recognize this whole process due to living in a shithole with a long history of corporatists and socialists in positions of power.
And yes it all goes back to paternalist state policies and the culture it creates, though in here it wasn't communism, but rather an attempt to build a populist, corporate state.
Right now, in a state here, a bridge was damaged by a flood. The government estimatives for repairing the bridge were ate 26 million. The local population with a local construction company repaired the bridge for 6 million, all paid out of their own pockets. Unfortunately that's rare as in a country like this people with this much money and with private businesses available to work with them are not common.
3 months ago
Anonymous
This creates a situation similar to cancer, where the system that should solve the issue is part of the issue. You can't expect cancer to cure itself. It's just too valuable of a mechanism to try and destroy for anyone in power, not only because of the amount of money it brings in (and yes, the flow of money goes to the top, as in with any organization, the old soviet criminal code "you steal for yourself, you share with the bros" applies, i.e. some low level homosexual gets money and shares it with his boss, the boss then shares with his own boss and it goes all the way to the government), but also because the power it provides. When all of the homosexuals don't have any responsibility and are tied by corruption, they'll do anything you tell them, hence you can use not only to protect someone, but also to create issues for someone. A person is being a pain? Let's have the tax office wake up and say that the apartment he sold 5 years ago in the middle of the economic crisis caused by Crimea and Donbas war was undervalued like 5x market price and thus he skimmed on taxed. Proof? What proof? Frick you, we're the government, we invent shit out of thin air. Let's the jail this person. And so on.
2/6
Any time processes would get successfully improved (and such situation did happen) it's at least partially caused by just removing a specific process from being done by people it was previously handled, or just outsourced entirely. Some of issues like this solved themselves via the market, such as basically the local package shipping industry overtaking the notoriously shitty state-run postal company. But there's also the issue of people's mentality being stuck doing things which they did before. Here's a fricked up example from around 2014: a friend of a colleague had his kid reach the age where they'd need (want) to send him to the kindergarten, they go to a local municipal one and get told that "hurr-durr, not enough vacant positions in the kindergarten to go around, you had to get in queue 5 years (when they didn't have a kid yet lol) ago to get a position new", while obviously signaling that they expect him to pay the bribe. Because that what they do. They are put in a position where they control access to something you need, nobody would frick them over for their shit, so they demand bribes or else. So the guy goes and pays $5K and the position for his kid magically appears. When I was first told of this situation it honestly blew my mind, not only because the degenerate in question actually went and paid $5K just for access to the shitty soviet municipal kindergarten (not the services of going there by the way, that would cost on top, albeit being cheap), instead of going to a private one where no such BS would take place, and where his $5K would pay for years of a very good one, but also why did he even need kindergarten in the first place? His wife doesn't work, the kid can stay home. "Hurr-durr well, back when I was a kid my parents sent me to a kindergarten, so that's normal, so that's what I'll do as well" - like no frickin' shit, as if your parents had a frickin' choice.
3/6
When this sort of shit exists for decades after decades it fricks up things to such a degree that you have teens dreaming of going to specific public position to steal stuff. Imagine a 16 y.o. kid saying shit like he want to go work in the customs office, because people there "get" a shit load of money. Or the tax office, or the police, or the court system, or the any government work in general. Basically, no normal person would touch those position with a ten foot pole. And even if they somehow got there, they'd either get corrupted in some time themselves (imagine basically a normal person starts working it local government and then he starts lying by default, even to friend and family, even when discussing things which don't matter and have no benefit for him, because that's his default mode now), or they'll run away screaming from that hell hole, or they'll get squeezed out. Hey, somebody needs to get jailed for corruption, right? Let's frame the new guy who thinks he's better than us kek.
This could be changed, but requires a ton of political will and integrity from the top, which is obviously isn't there. Because if you have it, you would need to start jailing your own guys that you brought in with yourself for loyalty reasons and they started doing corrupt shit. But you can't do that, because they are "your guys", at most you'll fire them. But what sort of incentives that creates? Sure, you can do corrupt things, but you'll never answer for this, at most you'll lose your position personally.
In such a system good results happen only by chance and there are a ton of people who'd frick over any good project or initiative just because it happens without their greasy fingers being involved.
4/6
And yes, this is in many ways caused / stimulated by russians. Because such a system provides them additional control and influence. Hence why the relations between russia and Georgia started falling apart only when Saakashvili started firing entrenched corrupt homosexuals. Because if you remove corruption, it erodes the pidor influence matrix. But, once cultivated and stimulated, it creates a ton of local entrenched interest. Because it creates layers of society which can live like kings, compared to regular folks, without doing anything productive in their lives.
Here's a fricked up example from around 2012: your regular frick can barely afford a new $10K Daewoo Lanos, while you drive around on a pretty much new Toyota Land Cruiser which cost you $5K, because it was stolen in EU and illegally imported here (because you can't register it within the EU) and registered under bogus documents in the registry, you have access to his car because you father is a cop in the right position, and those people have this cottage industry of these cheap fancy cars, which they can enjoy without paying a real price for them.
You want to import a car from EU or US? Get ready to be raped financially. Some Black person with connection imports is? Zero payment, yanukovich personally will sign a decree saying that you're importing this Cadillac Escalade as a way to help the local agricultural industry and thus you shouldn't need to pay taxes or import duties on it. (Not a joke).
So yes, even though it's nowhere near the level of shit being done in russia, it's still bad and fricked up.
And even a ton of progress happening since 2014 didn't magically fix almost a century of soviet frickery.
5/6
So yes, while in some locations shit got fixed after attacks pretty fast, any local would point you to examples of when things are different and shit gets dragged out for months and months without too much progress, because the corrupt fricks don't care about the result, they care that the affiliated company would work on this and thus skim over the money. Like it's pretty bad in Zaporizhia for example. People know about it, it's in the media, for some reason nobody is getting jailed for this.
This is partially the similar reason why a lot of local MIC projects are fricked: corruption, traitors and all that shit.
6/6
[...]
This isn't because of the government, but because people. People here, despite being fricked over by soviet shit, are still generally way more proactive and have way more initiative, compared to russia. Russia is hyper-paternalism going apeshit. Ukraine is grassroots country.
Based UA-anon dropping truth bombs
3 months ago
Anonymous
I'm just a jaded and butthurt old fricker who was literally born in USSR and had his work eroded to shit multiple times due to overall soviet-tier Black persontry happening in Ukraine. Don't get me wrong, if it were my decision, I'd drop nukes on russia without taking a single moment of doubt, but one should still objectively look at issues we have within the country.
3 months ago
Anonymous
This creates a situation similar to cancer, where the system that should solve the issue is part of the issue. You can't expect cancer to cure itself. It's just too valuable of a mechanism to try and destroy for anyone in power, not only because of the amount of money it brings in (and yes, the flow of money goes to the top, as in with any organization, the old soviet criminal code "you steal for yourself, you share with the bros" applies, i.e. some low level homosexual gets money and shares it with his boss, the boss then shares with his own boss and it goes all the way to the government), but also because the power it provides. When all of the homosexuals don't have any responsibility and are tied by corruption, they'll do anything you tell them, hence you can use not only to protect someone, but also to create issues for someone. A person is being a pain? Let's have the tax office wake up and say that the apartment he sold 5 years ago in the middle of the economic crisis caused by Crimea and Donbas war was undervalued like 5x market price and thus he skimmed on taxed. Proof? What proof? Frick you, we're the government, we invent shit out of thin air. Let's the jail this person. And so on.
2/6
Any time processes would get successfully improved (and such situation did happen) it's at least partially caused by just removing a specific process from being done by people it was previously handled, or just outsourced entirely. Some of issues like this solved themselves via the market, such as basically the local package shipping industry overtaking the notoriously shitty state-run postal company. But there's also the issue of people's mentality being stuck doing things which they did before. Here's a fricked up example from around 2014: a friend of a colleague had his kid reach the age where they'd need (want) to send him to the kindergarten, they go to a local municipal one and get told that "hurr-durr, not enough vacant positions in the kindergarten to go around, you had to get in queue 5 years (when they didn't have a kid yet lol) ago to get a position new", while obviously signaling that they expect him to pay the bribe. Because that what they do. They are put in a position where they control access to something you need, nobody would frick them over for their shit, so they demand bribes or else. So the guy goes and pays $5K and the position for his kid magically appears. When I was first told of this situation it honestly blew my mind, not only because the degenerate in question actually went and paid $5K just for access to the shitty soviet municipal kindergarten (not the services of going there by the way, that would cost on top, albeit being cheap), instead of going to a private one where no such BS would take place, and where his $5K would pay for years of a very good one, but also why did he even need kindergarten in the first place? His wife doesn't work, the kid can stay home. "Hurr-durr well, back when I was a kid my parents sent me to a kindergarten, so that's normal, so that's what I'll do as well" - like no frickin' shit, as if your parents had a frickin' choice.
3/6
When this sort of shit exists for decades after decades it fricks up things to such a degree that you have teens dreaming of going to specific public position to steal stuff. Imagine a 16 y.o. kid saying shit like he want to go work in the customs office, because people there "get" a shit load of money. Or the tax office, or the police, or the court system, or the any government work in general. Basically, no normal person would touch those position with a ten foot pole. And even if they somehow got there, they'd either get corrupted in some time themselves (imagine basically a normal person starts working it local government and then he starts lying by default, even to friend and family, even when discussing things which don't matter and have no benefit for him, because that's his default mode now), or they'll run away screaming from that hell hole, or they'll get squeezed out. Hey, somebody needs to get jailed for corruption, right? Let's frame the new guy who thinks he's better than us kek.
This could be changed, but requires a ton of political will and integrity from the top, which is obviously isn't there. Because if you have it, you would need to start jailing your own guys that you brought in with yourself for loyalty reasons and they started doing corrupt shit. But you can't do that, because they are "your guys", at most you'll fire them. But what sort of incentives that creates? Sure, you can do corrupt things, but you'll never answer for this, at most you'll lose your position personally.
In such a system good results happen only by chance and there are a ton of people who'd frick over any good project or initiative just because it happens without their greasy fingers being involved.
4/6
And yes, this is in many ways caused / stimulated by russians. Because such a system provides them additional control and influence. Hence why the relations between russia and Georgia started falling apart only when Saakashvili started firing entrenched corrupt homosexuals. Because if you remove corruption, it erodes the pidor influence matrix. But, once cultivated and stimulated, it creates a ton of local entrenched interest. Because it creates layers of society which can live like kings, compared to regular folks, without doing anything productive in their lives.
Here's a fricked up example from around 2012: your regular frick can barely afford a new $10K Daewoo Lanos, while you drive around on a pretty much new Toyota Land Cruiser which cost you $5K, because it was stolen in EU and illegally imported here (because you can't register it within the EU) and registered under bogus documents in the registry, you have access to his car because you father is a cop in the right position, and those people have this cottage industry of these cheap fancy cars, which they can enjoy without paying a real price for them.
You want to import a car from EU or US? Get ready to be raped financially. Some Black person with connection imports is? Zero payment, yanukovich personally will sign a decree saying that you're importing this Cadillac Escalade as a way to help the local agricultural industry and thus you shouldn't need to pay taxes or import duties on it. (Not a joke).
So yes, even though it's nowhere near the level of shit being done in russia, it's still bad and fricked up.
And even a ton of progress happening since 2014 didn't magically fix almost a century of soviet frickery.
5/6
So yes, while in some locations shit got fixed after attacks pretty fast, any local would point you to examples of when things are different and shit gets dragged out for months and months without too much progress, because the corrupt fricks don't care about the result, they care that the affiliated company would work on this and thus skim over the money. Like it's pretty bad in Zaporizhia for example. People know about it, it's in the media, for some reason nobody is getting jailed for this.
This is partially the similar reason why a lot of local MIC projects are fricked: corruption, traitors and all that shit.
6/6
[...]
This isn't because of the government, but because people. People here, despite being fricked over by soviet shit, are still generally way more proactive and have way more initiative, compared to russia. Russia is hyper-paternalism going apeshit. Ukraine is grassroots country.
thanks for the effort post
the baltics moved a lot of their government services to online platforms to remove official/citizen contact, can't ask for/offer a bribe if you don't know who case this is or who is handling your case
3 months ago
Anonymous
Huh, that’s actually quite clever. But wouldn’t that remove a lot of civil service jobs? I know muh jerbs program but having stable government work is quite helpful for an economy and providing stability to the lower classes. Or does the online stuff preserve workers still
3 months ago
Anonymous
you still keep most of the staff because they still have to push paper. But you make sure that the guy that pushes the paper and the guy that need the paper push don't meet/know each other.
you can't get rid off all corruption with it but it helps clean up culture bottom up because the new guys don't get to learn corruption in their starting position.
That and EU public tender rules, makes dodgy shit stand out like crazy. Doesn't fix everything automatically but sure helps because it forces them to make a uniform paper trail that any corruption hunter can use. Or a competitor that got snubbed and wants to file a civil suit (which I have done and won).
3 months ago
Anonymous
This creates a situation similar to cancer, where the system that should solve the issue is part of the issue. You can't expect cancer to cure itself. It's just too valuable of a mechanism to try and destroy for anyone in power, not only because of the amount of money it brings in (and yes, the flow of money goes to the top, as in with any organization, the old soviet criminal code "you steal for yourself, you share with the bros" applies, i.e. some low level homosexual gets money and shares it with his boss, the boss then shares with his own boss and it goes all the way to the government), but also because the power it provides. When all of the homosexuals don't have any responsibility and are tied by corruption, they'll do anything you tell them, hence you can use not only to protect someone, but also to create issues for someone. A person is being a pain? Let's have the tax office wake up and say that the apartment he sold 5 years ago in the middle of the economic crisis caused by Crimea and Donbas war was undervalued like 5x market price and thus he skimmed on taxed. Proof? What proof? Frick you, we're the government, we invent shit out of thin air. Let's the jail this person. And so on.
2/6
Any time processes would get successfully improved (and such situation did happen) it's at least partially caused by just removing a specific process from being done by people it was previously handled, or just outsourced entirely. Some of issues like this solved themselves via the market, such as basically the local package shipping industry overtaking the notoriously shitty state-run postal company. But there's also the issue of people's mentality being stuck doing things which they did before. Here's a fricked up example from around 2014: a friend of a colleague had his kid reach the age where they'd need (want) to send him to the kindergarten, they go to a local municipal one and get told that "hurr-durr, not enough vacant positions in the kindergarten to go around, you had to get in queue 5 years (when they didn't have a kid yet lol) ago to get a position new", while obviously signaling that they expect him to pay the bribe. Because that what they do. They are put in a position where they control access to something you need, nobody would frick them over for their shit, so they demand bribes or else. So the guy goes and pays $5K and the position for his kid magically appears. When I was first told of this situation it honestly blew my mind, not only because the degenerate in question actually went and paid $5K just for access to the shitty soviet municipal kindergarten (not the services of going there by the way, that would cost on top, albeit being cheap), instead of going to a private one where no such BS would take place, and where his $5K would pay for years of a very good one, but also why did he even need kindergarten in the first place? His wife doesn't work, the kid can stay home. "Hurr-durr well, back when I was a kid my parents sent me to a kindergarten, so that's normal, so that's what I'll do as well" - like no frickin' shit, as if your parents had a frickin' choice.
3/6
When this sort of shit exists for decades after decades it fricks up things to such a degree that you have teens dreaming of going to specific public position to steal stuff. Imagine a 16 y.o. kid saying shit like he want to go work in the customs office, because people there "get" a shit load of money. Or the tax office, or the police, or the court system, or the any government work in general. Basically, no normal person would touch those position with a ten foot pole. And even if they somehow got there, they'd either get corrupted in some time themselves (imagine basically a normal person starts working it local government and then he starts lying by default, even to friend and family, even when discussing things which don't matter and have no benefit for him, because that's his default mode now), or they'll run away screaming from that hell hole, or they'll get squeezed out. Hey, somebody needs to get jailed for corruption, right? Let's frame the new guy who thinks he's better than us kek.
This could be changed, but requires a ton of political will and integrity from the top, which is obviously isn't there. Because if you have it, you would need to start jailing your own guys that you brought in with yourself for loyalty reasons and they started doing corrupt shit. But you can't do that, because they are "your guys", at most you'll fire them. But what sort of incentives that creates? Sure, you can do corrupt things, but you'll never answer for this, at most you'll lose your position personally.
In such a system good results happen only by chance and there are a ton of people who'd frick over any good project or initiative just because it happens without their greasy fingers being involved.
4/6
And yes, this is in many ways caused / stimulated by russians. Because such a system provides them additional control and influence. Hence why the relations between russia and Georgia started falling apart only when Saakashvili started firing entrenched corrupt homosexuals. Because if you remove corruption, it erodes the pidor influence matrix. But, once cultivated and stimulated, it creates a ton of local entrenched interest. Because it creates layers of society which can live like kings, compared to regular folks, without doing anything productive in their lives.
Here's a fricked up example from around 2012: your regular frick can barely afford a new $10K Daewoo Lanos, while you drive around on a pretty much new Toyota Land Cruiser which cost you $5K, because it was stolen in EU and illegally imported here (because you can't register it within the EU) and registered under bogus documents in the registry, you have access to his car because you father is a cop in the right position, and those people have this cottage industry of these cheap fancy cars, which they can enjoy without paying a real price for them.
You want to import a car from EU or US? Get ready to be raped financially. Some Black person with connection imports is? Zero payment, yanukovich personally will sign a decree saying that you're importing this Cadillac Escalade as a way to help the local agricultural industry and thus you shouldn't need to pay taxes or import duties on it. (Not a joke).
So yes, even though it's nowhere near the level of shit being done in russia, it's still bad and fricked up.
And even a ton of progress happening since 2014 didn't magically fix almost a century of soviet frickery.
5/6
So yes, while in some locations shit got fixed after attacks pretty fast, any local would point you to examples of when things are different and shit gets dragged out for months and months without too much progress, because the corrupt fricks don't care about the result, they care that the affiliated company would work on this and thus skim over the money. Like it's pretty bad in Zaporizhia for example. People know about it, it's in the media, for some reason nobody is getting jailed for this.
This is partially the similar reason why a lot of local MIC projects are fricked: corruption, traitors and all that shit.
6/6
[...]
This isn't because of the government, but because people. People here, despite being fricked over by soviet shit, are still generally way more proactive and have way more initiative, compared to russia. Russia is hyper-paternalism going apeshit. Ukraine is grassroots country.
3 months ago
Anonymous
This creates a situation similar to cancer, where the system that should solve the issue is part of the issue. You can't expect cancer to cure itself. It's just too valuable of a mechanism to try and destroy for anyone in power, not only because of the amount of money it brings in (and yes, the flow of money goes to the top, as in with any organization, the old soviet criminal code "you steal for yourself, you share with the bros" applies, i.e. some low level homosexual gets money and shares it with his boss, the boss then shares with his own boss and it goes all the way to the government), but also because the power it provides. When all of the homosexuals don't have any responsibility and are tied by corruption, they'll do anything you tell them, hence you can use not only to protect someone, but also to create issues for someone. A person is being a pain? Let's have the tax office wake up and say that the apartment he sold 5 years ago in the middle of the economic crisis caused by Crimea and Donbas war was undervalued like 5x market price and thus he skimmed on taxed. Proof? What proof? Frick you, we're the government, we invent shit out of thin air. Let's the jail this person. And so on.
2/6
Any time processes would get successfully improved (and such situation did happen) it's at least partially caused by just removing a specific process from being done by people it was previously handled, or just outsourced entirely. Some of issues like this solved themselves via the market, such as basically the local package shipping industry overtaking the notoriously shitty state-run postal company. But there's also the issue of people's mentality being stuck doing things which they did before. Here's a fricked up example from around 2014: a friend of a colleague had his kid reach the age where they'd need (want) to send him to the kindergarten, they go to a local municipal one and get told that "hurr-durr, not enough vacant positions in the kindergarten to go around, you had to get in queue 5 years (when they didn't have a kid yet lol) ago to get a position new", while obviously signaling that they expect him to pay the bribe. Because that what they do. They are put in a position where they control access to something you need, nobody would frick them over for their shit, so they demand bribes or else. So the guy goes and pays $5K and the position for his kid magically appears. When I was first told of this situation it honestly blew my mind, not only because the degenerate in question actually went and paid $5K just for access to the shitty soviet municipal kindergarten (not the services of going there by the way, that would cost on top, albeit being cheap), instead of going to a private one where no such BS would take place, and where his $5K would pay for years of a very good one, but also why did he even need kindergarten in the first place? His wife doesn't work, the kid can stay home. "Hurr-durr well, back when I was a kid my parents sent me to a kindergarten, so that's normal, so that's what I'll do as well" - like no frickin' shit, as if your parents had a frickin' choice.
3/6
When this sort of shit exists for decades after decades it fricks up things to such a degree that you have teens dreaming of going to specific public position to steal stuff. Imagine a 16 y.o. kid saying shit like he want to go work in the customs office, because people there "get" a shit load of money. Or the tax office, or the police, or the court system, or the any government work in general. Basically, no normal person would touch those position with a ten foot pole. And even if they somehow got there, they'd either get corrupted in some time themselves (imagine basically a normal person starts working it local government and then he starts lying by default, even to friend and family, even when discussing things which don't matter and have no benefit for him, because that's his default mode now), or they'll run away screaming from that hell hole, or they'll get squeezed out. Hey, somebody needs to get jailed for corruption, right? Let's frame the new guy who thinks he's better than us kek.
This could be changed, but requires a ton of political will and integrity from the top, which is obviously isn't there. Because if you have it, you would need to start jailing your own guys that you brought in with yourself for loyalty reasons and they started doing corrupt shit. But you can't do that, because they are "your guys", at most you'll fire them. But what sort of incentives that creates? Sure, you can do corrupt things, but you'll never answer for this, at most you'll lose your position personally.
In such a system good results happen only by chance and there are a ton of people who'd frick over any good project or initiative just because it happens without their greasy fingers being involved.
4/6
And yes, this is in many ways caused / stimulated by russians. Because such a system provides them additional control and influence. Hence why the relations between russia and Georgia started falling apart only when Saakashvili started firing entrenched corrupt homosexuals. Because if you remove corruption, it erodes the pidor influence matrix. But, once cultivated and stimulated, it creates a ton of local entrenched interest. Because it creates layers of society which can live like kings, compared to regular folks, without doing anything productive in their lives.
Here's a fricked up example from around 2012: your regular frick can barely afford a new $10K Daewoo Lanos, while you drive around on a pretty much new Toyota Land Cruiser which cost you $5K, because it was stolen in EU and illegally imported here (because you can't register it within the EU) and registered under bogus documents in the registry, you have access to his car because you father is a cop in the right position, and those people have this cottage industry of these cheap fancy cars, which they can enjoy without paying a real price for them.
You want to import a car from EU or US? Get ready to be raped financially. Some Black person with connection imports is? Zero payment, yanukovich personally will sign a decree saying that you're importing this Cadillac Escalade as a way to help the local agricultural industry and thus you shouldn't need to pay taxes or import duties on it. (Not a joke).
So yes, even though it's nowhere near the level of shit being done in russia, it's still bad and fricked up.
And even a ton of progress happening since 2014 didn't magically fix almost a century of soviet frickery.
5/6
So yes, while in some locations shit got fixed after attacks pretty fast, any local would point you to examples of when things are different and shit gets dragged out for months and months without too much progress, because the corrupt fricks don't care about the result, they care that the affiliated company would work on this and thus skim over the money. Like it's pretty bad in Zaporizhia for example. People know about it, it's in the media, for some reason nobody is getting jailed for this.
This is partially the similar reason why a lot of local MIC projects are fricked: corruption, traitors and all that shit.
6/6
[...]
This isn't because of the government, but because people. People here, despite being fricked over by soviet shit, are still generally way more proactive and have way more initiative, compared to russia. Russia is hyper-paternalism going apeshit. Ukraine is grassroots country.
Good effortposting, thanks anon. I was incidentally interested in post-Soviet Europe long before this recent dust-up so it's been equal parts amusing and frustrating to see so many people sucking Ukraine's wiener and pretending that it was always comparable to western Europe when it absolutely has not been and that everything is going to change overnight when the war is over. In the post-Soviet era Ukraine been massively corrupt, generally a shithole on par with the richer parts of Russia and its global relevance outside of its neighbors was largely limited to growing grain for the third world and exporting prostitutes and child pornography - though in fairness I'll say that they've been improving, although that's a big part of their current problems. I've been meaning to write up an essay on what I see as the cultural relevance of the war and I might get around to it but if I don't then the tl;dr is that this entire mess is literally just an ego-driven punitive expedition and any strategic and military concerns for Russia are tertiary.
3 months ago
Anonymous
This creates a situation similar to cancer, where the system that should solve the issue is part of the issue. You can't expect cancer to cure itself. It's just too valuable of a mechanism to try and destroy for anyone in power, not only because of the amount of money it brings in (and yes, the flow of money goes to the top, as in with any organization, the old soviet criminal code "you steal for yourself, you share with the bros" applies, i.e. some low level homosexual gets money and shares it with his boss, the boss then shares with his own boss and it goes all the way to the government), but also because the power it provides. When all of the homosexuals don't have any responsibility and are tied by corruption, they'll do anything you tell them, hence you can use not only to protect someone, but also to create issues for someone. A person is being a pain? Let's have the tax office wake up and say that the apartment he sold 5 years ago in the middle of the economic crisis caused by Crimea and Donbas war was undervalued like 5x market price and thus he skimmed on taxed. Proof? What proof? Frick you, we're the government, we invent shit out of thin air. Let's the jail this person. And so on.
2/6
3 months ago
Anonymous
Any time processes would get successfully improved (and such situation did happen) it's at least partially caused by just removing a specific process from being done by people it was previously handled, or just outsourced entirely. Some of issues like this solved themselves via the market, such as basically the local package shipping industry overtaking the notoriously shitty state-run postal company. But there's also the issue of people's mentality being stuck doing things which they did before. Here's a fricked up example from around 2014: a friend of a colleague had his kid reach the age where they'd need (want) to send him to the kindergarten, they go to a local municipal one and get told that "hurr-durr, not enough vacant positions in the kindergarten to go around, you had to get in queue 5 years (when they didn't have a kid yet lol) ago to get a position new", while obviously signaling that they expect him to pay the bribe. Because that what they do. They are put in a position where they control access to something you need, nobody would frick them over for their shit, so they demand bribes or else. So the guy goes and pays $5K and the position for his kid magically appears. When I was first told of this situation it honestly blew my mind, not only because the degenerate in question actually went and paid $5K just for access to the shitty soviet municipal kindergarten (not the services of going there by the way, that would cost on top, albeit being cheap), instead of going to a private one where no such BS would take place, and where his $5K would pay for years of a very good one, but also why did he even need kindergarten in the first place? His wife doesn't work, the kid can stay home. "Hurr-durr well, back when I was a kid my parents sent me to a kindergarten, so that's normal, so that's what I'll do as well" - like no frickin' shit, as if your parents had a frickin' choice.
3/6
3 months ago
Anonymous
When this sort of shit exists for decades after decades it fricks up things to such a degree that you have teens dreaming of going to specific public position to steal stuff. Imagine a 16 y.o. kid saying shit like he want to go work in the customs office, because people there "get" a shit load of money. Or the tax office, or the police, or the court system, or the any government work in general. Basically, no normal person would touch those position with a ten foot pole. And even if they somehow got there, they'd either get corrupted in some time themselves (imagine basically a normal person starts working it local government and then he starts lying by default, even to friend and family, even when discussing things which don't matter and have no benefit for him, because that's his default mode now), or they'll run away screaming from that hell hole, or they'll get squeezed out. Hey, somebody needs to get jailed for corruption, right? Let's frame the new guy who thinks he's better than us kek.
This could be changed, but requires a ton of political will and integrity from the top, which is obviously isn't there. Because if you have it, you would need to start jailing your own guys that you brought in with yourself for loyalty reasons and they started doing corrupt shit. But you can't do that, because they are "your guys", at most you'll fire them. But what sort of incentives that creates? Sure, you can do corrupt things, but you'll never answer for this, at most you'll lose your position personally.
In such a system good results happen only by chance and there are a ton of people who'd frick over any good project or initiative just because it happens without their greasy fingers being involved.
4/6
3 months ago
Anonymous
And yes, this is in many ways caused / stimulated by russians. Because such a system provides them additional control and influence. Hence why the relations between russia and Georgia started falling apart only when Saakashvili started firing entrenched corrupt homosexuals. Because if you remove corruption, it erodes the pidor influence matrix. But, once cultivated and stimulated, it creates a ton of local entrenched interest. Because it creates layers of society which can live like kings, compared to regular folks, without doing anything productive in their lives.
Here's a fricked up example from around 2012: your regular frick can barely afford a new $10K Daewoo Lanos, while you drive around on a pretty much new Toyota Land Cruiser which cost you $5K, because it was stolen in EU and illegally imported here (because you can't register it within the EU) and registered under bogus documents in the registry, you have access to his car because you father is a cop in the right position, and those people have this cottage industry of these cheap fancy cars, which they can enjoy without paying a real price for them.
You want to import a car from EU or US? Get ready to be raped financially. Some Black person with connection imports is? Zero payment, yanukovich personally will sign a decree saying that you're importing this Cadillac Escalade as a way to help the local agricultural industry and thus you shouldn't need to pay taxes or import duties on it. (Not a joke).
So yes, even though it's nowhere near the level of shit being done in russia, it's still bad and fricked up.
And even a ton of progress happening since 2014 didn't magically fix almost a century of soviet frickery.
5/6
3 months ago
Anonymous
So yes, while in some locations shit got fixed after attacks pretty fast, any local would point you to examples of when things are different and shit gets dragged out for months and months without too much progress, because the corrupt fricks don't care about the result, they care that the affiliated company would work on this and thus skim over the money. Like it's pretty bad in Zaporizhia for example. People know about it, it's in the media, for some reason nobody is getting jailed for this.
This is partially the similar reason why a lot of local MIC projects are fricked: corruption, traitors and all that shit.
6/6
Is half of Ukraine without water or electricity like Russia is?
This isn't because of the government, but because people. People here, despite being fricked over by soviet shit, are still generally way more proactive and have way more initiative, compared to russia. Russia is hyper-paternalism going apeshit. Ukraine is grassroots country.
3 months ago
Anonymous
Is half of Ukraine without water or electricity like Russia is?
>4. Millions of young Russians who don't want to live in a failed autocracy will flee to Ukraine post war.
They neither exist nor would be welcome in Ukraine.
And my personal favorite >Forgetting that the unification of Europe occured only thanks to the unification of Germany, which occured according to the Russian good will
Literally "it was a gesture of good will. We didn't want berlin anyway"
And my personal favorite >Forgetting that the unification of Europe occured only thanks to the unification of Germany, which occured according to the Russian good will
Literally "it was a gesture of good will. We didn't want berlin anyway"
"Unfication of Europe"
The EU should have zero lawmaking power over the European nations and their states. Them being leftist, anti-national (to each and every seperate people), Black person-loving fifth columnists is surely a coincidence.
you stupid homosexual I watched the CNN footage when it happened - it just proved the VDV were there a didnt evaporate immediately.
[...]
what documented proof? no really, what? because I remember every day clearly and I remember the vatnik copes and I remember what a shitshow it was and how confused it was. every time hostomel is mentioned some Russian frickwit comes out of the woodwork to explain it was obviously a success, but you homosexuals NEVER produce and proof
PROVE YOUR CLAIMS homosexual
haha fricking stupid hohols and their /k/ope squad, those vdv were actually dropping in with Ukrainian POW's to be exchanged and the dumb ukrop forces opened fire on them
>>"The military airbase included an 11,483 foot (3,500 meter) runway, capable of supporting the largest of transport aircraft, and several dozen single-story and multi-story structures — some up to six stories — and two large hangers. The built-up area, or cantonment area, was the home base of the Ukrainian National Guard’s 4th Rapid Reaction Brigade and located to the southeast of the runway. "
>they weren't killed there >they were ACTUALLY killed other there, next to those looted washing machines
Every time that you are having a bad moment, remember that thousands of ziggers die everyday for nothing but banana
Guys do you remember how the premier unit in the Russian army got ass raped by nobodies from teritorial defense
Those were the days,when one could jerk off to burned BMDs and crispy VDVtards
Home Guard holding an AS Val, posing it in front of the blood of its previous owner pooling on the asphalt... An image so beautiful it is seared into my memory. What a day that was.
Home Guard holding an AS Val, posing it in front of the blood of its previous owner pooling on the asphalt... An image so beautiful it is seared into my memory. What a day that was.
For me its the Chechen convoy that got btfo so hard they hightailed their asses back to grozny for a year
It was mostly national guard at the airport too. So it was a bunch of Military Police gendarmerie cops who blew them away. This is them at one of the airport exits in the battle.
I'm not kidding, they've zoomed in so far on their cope maps that even if you measure their cope arrows from beginning to end (see early rybar maps why thats moronic) it's a km or two.
Zoom out even more and you'll see it's 3 or 4 KM from downtown donetsk.
https://www.russiadefence.net/t9051p825-russian-special-military-operation-in-ukraine-52
Point and laugh at these morons
>front line barely moving despite ~80k casualties and rising from vatBlack person meat waves not to mention massive equipment losses >strategic military/oil industry and warehouses and more blowing up all over Russian territory >an obviously important IL76 intercepts the ground and prompts intense low IQ lying/seething from vatBlack folk >lose irreplaceable AWACS & command center planes >vatBlack person soviet infrastructure is breaking and muh "EUROPE WILL FREEZE" are now actually literally freezing and are walking on 2" of ice in their stair wells of their crumbling commieblocks >Ukies continuously killing vatBlack person military commanders and "war" heros lmao >Ukies claim to have progressed back to a 8-10:1 kill ratio on vatBlack folk since the meat assaults began
The vatBlack person mind is weaker than a T72 turret's will to stay attached to its hull.
Tank turrets are held in place by the pisky force.
When the pisky drive is compromized the turrets levitate rapidly sometimes hurling the orb hundreds of miles.
….are you for real? How do you suppose a turret is able to rotate…?
3 months ago
Anonymous
Does the words "bearing" and "slipring" mean anything to you, or has that technology not yet reached your part of Calcutta?
3 months ago
Anonymous
Please explain the use of bearings and slip rings with bolts…?
3 months ago
Anonymous
Nta but the turret doesn't have to be rigidly secured to rotate on bearings or with a turret drive. Warship turrets had nothing them really holding them in place either. I don't know if tanks are this way, but they certainly could be
3 months ago
Anonymous
I looked it up just because I was curious, and at least on the Abrams, the turret is placed and then a retaining ring is bolted from the top into the bottom race ring to sandwich the bearing and hold it in place
3 months ago
Anonymous
>sandwich
americans not talking about food for a second = impossible
3 months ago
Anonymous
It's highly technical jargon. Thirdies wouldn't know it
this is just strait up revisionism. it was known at the time that it was pointless and unnecessary and remarked at the time that nothing of value was learned. just like Gallipoli, a British commander wasted the lives of colonial subjects on a pointless vanity landing
No, it isn't. Dieppe learned that you couldn't get tanks onto shingle beaches because they just got stuck. They learned that heavy bunkers were resistant to the current weapons on tanks right now. They learned that flamethrowers were needed to clear bunkers, but troop carriers were exposed. They learned that you needed to have a distraction force to hold off reinforcements before the beachhead was made. They learned you needed people to set up defences to resist counter-attacks once the beachhead was made. They learned you needed bombing runs around the areas you were going to hit, not the area you were hitting.
Like, there is so much they learned from Dieppe that your post actually angers me.
You forgot the biggest learning point - taking an existing port fast enough to support an invasion wasn't practical if defended, so they needed to bring their own ports with them or use other means of offloading cargo such as DUKWs.
>We've reached the "actually it was a victory" phase of vatnik cope already
Lmao
VDV are totally still alive you guys, just you wait, Russia has yet to remove the gloves! Soon they will actually start trying in this wa- err special military operation! The almost 500,000 dead mobiks were merely a distraction! We didn't need those oil refineries in Russia anyway!
>What level of delusion are you on? >Dunno, maybe Hamas and Houthis are winning? >Ha! You are like little baby, watch this!
George Orwell would have to come up with an entire new term to describe Zigger bizzaro world think.
Where is McCarthy when we need him? He was in the right. He was 100% right. Where is the McCarthy of our era? We need to cleanse that 5th column. In every allied country. I'm sick of these homosexuals subverting our democracies.
>Latest turdie cope is that Texas will secede and ally with russia.
And then the brown thirdie fricks will fricking seethe and rage that we refuse to ever take them seriously lmao
nta but i've already seen posters with a russian flag posting this shit on PrepHole claiming that shots have already been fired and other states are seceding along with Texas
I am legit certified loon and even I recognize this as pure insanity. This is way beyond cope.
This is like when in 2022 or 2023 all of a sudden obviously bots started spamming copy and pasted messages on Xitter that the Ukrainian war has no footage or videos despite it being some big war. Some FSB mobster frick got blown away in Ukraine and his replacement just creates bullshit moronic spam about equally moronic conspiracy theories.
I wonder if they all know the national guards units are mostly for show and there are still larger swathes of the border that are unguarded and open. It’s all distracting BS for the election. >CAPTCHA: ASSS
I hope they actually pay you to be this moronic and delusional. If you do it for free it's just fricking pathetic.
I am donating $20 to Ukraine for this post.
I was being objective. Hostomel was OBJECTIVELY a failure because they failed to achieve the objective. Not the larger strategic ones or the tactical objective of the air assault to begin with. You're just mad because you hate having this pointed out.
I'm not sure why the idea that air defense being the crucial factor is important to you, but it's also irrelevant to the central point. It literally doesn't matter.
I can only assume your post is largely projection, and you're absolutely furious about the VDV ubermensch getting their teeth kicked in by weekend citizen soldiers, but that's what happened. >But you have sympathies for Ukraine waaaaa waaaaaaa!
Of course, people like winners and Russia is a loser.
I mean sure, Im positive their corpses might have been there for more than a month, but the mix Ukrainian national guard and air force drove them off in under 12 hours. That's why the Il-76s had to be diverted to Belarus instead of offloading in Hostomel.
holy shit, meds >VDV tries to land ay Hostomel >bunch of non-regular troops stationed at Hostomel (can't remember any more if TDF or cadets) notice, fire on them, pin them, bring down one Alligator >Rapid Reaction Force had been kept near Hostomel, had the runway pre-sighted and made it impossible for air reinforcements to land. >DVD is all alone, burrows into basements, all land reinforcement columns were TZD >Eventually there's no more DVD
yes they took Kyiv but left next day coz gest of good will da da also they shot Zelenskiy first day but resurrect him next day, coz again, all objections was achieved and they don't car if he alive or not
Um, ackshually, NAFOtroons, those weren't VDV.. glorious Rasha sent khokhol POW from 2014 to capture the airport.... real 30% muslim Muscovite morons would have captured it for sure!
They liberated the Hostomel Duty-free Store, which was the primary objective. That makes the operation an overwhelming success. It's not the fault of the VDV that regular forces couldn't take Technohouse to consolidate the victory
I... frick. Ok, Picrel is one of the lines producing infantry mortar shells for the anarchists during the Spanish Civil War.
Note how fricking high they're stacking that shit. Because they had to. Because they were producing them THAT fast.
And this was ANARCHIST SPAIN during the fricking SPANISH CIVIL WAR. Forget pallets! These fricking idiots can't even come close to the rate of production of the fricking anarchists a century ago!
For fricks sake can they not just fricking hurry?! Fricking that ammo could save your guys' lives in the front you're not building toys here GET A FRICKING MOVE ON FFS STOP POLISHING AND GET TO RAMMING GUNPOWDER IN ALREADY!
I know, I know I must look like a vatnik getting mad at this shit but no. Frick no. I advocate for TZD as every good moderate should but for fricks sake I JUST CAN'T STAND INCOMPETENCE OF THIS CALIBER. It just pisses me the frick off to see this degree of sheer, astonishing worthlessness on display. Do they not give a shit they're getting slaughtered?! What level of subhuman scum are we on by now?!
> Why must you contort yourself over documented facts of reality?
Why must you butcher the English language so? You don’t here messing up those wiener gobbling sounds you call Russian
>the usual respone
I'm just in it for the entertainment tbh. I follow these things like a sporting even. First was Iraq, then Afghanistan, then syria, then yemen (against the saudis), now it's Ukraine. Dont care enough for the israelites and sandBlack folk to care for Israel vs Palestinian tho. Just because my tax dollars keeps one side afloat doesn't mean i have to root for anyone. I just like the memes and the footage, particularly the cqb.
You homosexuals are like bots with these responses. Neutrality is a valid position. I hate all of you equally. Go die in a muddy trench now Pidor/Pydior (whichever is correct for your homosexual dialect)
>neutrality is a valid position >neutrooler acts surprised when bad actor pushes his successes and forces confrontation >neutrooler becomes cucked isolationist when forced to deal with the consequences of not nipping it in the bud.
Only children and politicians lack the understanding that not killing a problem will come back to bite you later down the road.
If you’re ‘neutral’ when you see Russia terrorbombing Ukrainian civilians, putting them through concentration camps and torturing them in cellars, you are a sociopathic little shit no better than the Russians.
ITT ukie shills and vatnik shills trying to out delude eachother
https://i.imgur.com/8qbkGnd.jpg
>Le both sides
Frick off.
This is why being a anti Russian Norktard is so much better, if you are serious it confuses shills from all sides so much sometimes you can actually talk about the weapons you like.
The air assault worked, the ground forces couldn’t link up with at the airfield. The VDV was then targeted by artillery and obliterated/hunted into the woods by the Ukrainians.
The air assault got men on the ground, but saying it “worked” requires you par back the goals of that phase of the operation to the point that not further phase of the operation can succeed. It’s like saying someone successfully landed an airplane when they hit an office building at 100 mph 30 feet after the wheels touched the ground.
A successful version of the Hostomel air assault would include getting enough combat power down to neutralize the artillery and drive off the attack helicopter, allowing the air bridge maneuver to be completed.
The VDV managed to deny Ukraine use of Hostomel airport, but that wasn’t their goal, a competent bombing run or missile strike could have done that without massacring Russia’s best fighters. The goal of any air assault on an airport, like the one on Hostomel, is to secure the airport for the attacking force’s use, not merely deny it to the enemy. In the end, the VDV successfully spent ~300 men and 8 helicopters to “””accomplish””” what would take the US Navy approximately 20 Tomahawks or the US airforce approximately 20 GBU-53B Stormbreakers.
The "air assault" didn't even get them on the ground because the first few landings were wiped out and the VDV immediately switched to landing outside the airport in the woods on the side opposite the side of the airport the Ukrainians were in. They only managed to land in the airport after the troops from outside the airport reached it and by then the damage was already done.
buddy, i can have both, can revel in objective truth and also kick back and enjoy taunting russians for their ridiculous losses.
win win and cake all day - that's the reality of dealing with ziggers and their dogshit tier propaganda.
To be fair, there is a lot of resistance to accepting Ukraine into the EU due to agriculture. Farmers form the core of a lot of the right wing parties who are on the rise atm are dead set against accepting Ukraine because the combination of location and soil conditions means that a Ukrainian farmer can outperform any competition in the EU by a huge margin unless they're a big agricorp. During the first months of the war the EU allowed Ukrainian produce to be shipped by rail into the EU which cause a crash in prices as the agricultural markets were flooded with cheap Ukrainian fruit/grains, leading to several ape outs across the continent. If Ukraine is ever going to enter the Union it won't happen until they find a way to keep Ukrainian produce flowing out of Europe to protect domestic growers, that being said there is a lot of energy behind the movement so I think the 2030/40 timeline is pretty realistic.
the european farmers market only functions via a sophisticated psyop to cinvibce euros that only They can do agriculture Right (including such ridiculousness as legislating away the existence of danish feta) amd everyone else eats poison, paired with gigantic subsidies that would make the US dairy industry blush. oh, and using the former nonsense to artificially close markets kek
Holding a static position makes you an easy target even for inferior forces.
Not holding territory means your side does not control the location.
This is part of what makes war miserable. Even the most elite forces die if they act like guards.
Offense has been stronger than defense since gunpowder was invented.
If you stay relatively static you get precision bombed or hit with arty. If you constantly are mobile you hit mines and ambushes. Mines and ambushes tend to wipe out less of you than being obliterated by ordinance, so mobile is better but still results in regular casualties that cannot be countered by the skill of the soldier. War is hell.
Just imagine how many quality fighters have died because even one guy uses a cell phone to call home or use the internet and the opposition then kills all soldiers in that location having located it as a result.
All those volunteer glory seekers posting updates probably got most of the people they worked with killed.
I posted half of this in another thread but its also relevant here.
It's pretty fricked up how many different "factions" with the Russians have been more or less wiped out in succession. The VDV, separatists, Volunteer paramilitary units, Kadyrov Mafia goons, National Guard, Sea Infantry, Gazprom mercs now Wagner. They were either wiped out, or hit hard enough they ran off. It's now just mobiks, mobik units and more mobik units. That and Storm-Z.
There are still remnants of those units they are just held or sent after the mobiks. Ironically RU is wanting to hold anyone at all with experience right now. Cant teach the next wave without someone who knows something.
I remember back when the "George Bush is a chimpanzee" memes were in full swing. Good to see it finally getting turned around on the propagandists themselves.
If a problem is circular, and repeats itself, despite obvious solutions, and is resistant to error correcting; consider then, this: The problem is actually a process disgusted as a problem.
The powers that be are force shaping two populations in preparation for whatever machination comes next.
>gucci DMR with camo netting >adidas colorado beetle stripes on the helmet
Arent those two concepts mutually exclusive if your rifle and the helmet are facing the same direction ?
Yeah, it would be grim if it wasn't so funny.
At the start of the war the russians had full ratnik kits looking like the little green men that took crimea.
Now like 95% of russians I see killed look like random hobos.
How do vatniks explain and internalize this to themselves? >"xaxaxa we're using native ukrainian donbabweans to fight NATO"
doesnt really fit into their "We had to start the war to protect the donbabweans" narrative.
I know some russians think the war needs to continue at any cost because russia will be destroyed by ukraine and NATO without it (lol), but I don't understand what they think they could possibly gain from it at this point.
Are they just fighting and dying because they're told to?
Actual fricking serf mentality
>be airborne >secure your objective >follow up forces fail to relieve you >low on everything but an angry enemy operating within their own AO >get BTFO because no support could reach you
A tale as old as the parachute infantry itself.
they didn't secure anything because the airport and runway was destroyed on the first day and they had to retreat to the woods on the second day. They returned on the 3rd day once the support collumn showed up. They couldn't land helicopters at the airport during these 3 days either due to the fire, the waves after the first landings all landed outside the airport in the woods.
Not even tanks. Compare the capacity of an IL-76 with helicopters: a Mi-8 helicopter can carry about 20-24 troops while an IL-76 can easily do 5x more troops. Getting personnel in via dozens of helicopters, even with attack helicopters acting as escorts, is very dangerous, hence quite a number of them got fricked over with MANPADs. You'd need to do use like hundreds of helicopters going back and forth to move personnel to try and replace a runway getting IL-76s landing with stuff.
I think what's particularly repugnant about this guy is that he's a coward. When Russia started crumbling in Kharkiv in the fall of 2022 he went offline and said "akshually I'm not interested in dispensing my commentary anymore I have other things to do". Then when Russia went back on the offensive in Bakhmut he reactivated his account.
jesus christ, it's been two years and you /k/opers still believe ukrainian version of events? vdv took the airport with almost no resistance, they were there, sporadically mortared by ukrainians, until they connected with main russian forces. there are hours of vide footage confirming all this, including a cnn broadcast, while all the talk about repelling them and shit comes from interviews with a couple of literally who ukrainian soldiers. you're laughable.
Still kind of strange to see that happening on a somewhat modern looking European street.
Usually we only see corpses and wrecked Soviet hardware littering the streets in some African shithole or the sandbox.
>"They'll add gays, women and Black folk and make everything about some homosexual emotional struggles"
Do...do you even know who Nolan and Mendes are?
Specifically Nolan, the guy who's constantly criticized for "not having enough women or romance" in his films?
Technically they did seize the airport just fine. Its the bits that came after that were a problem. Kind of like dying in a high speed car crash - its not the going fast that kills you
>The Dieppe Raid was a success. They took the beach!
This hostomel-was-actually-a-win althistory bullshit is so tiresome. I bet we'll hear it for decades to come.
Hm?
It's okay to say that out of a scenario of three parts that the first part went well.
In a sports game, for example, your team can be up in the first half then lose 10,000 vehicles over 2 years of your 3 day military exercise in the second half.
The team still did okay that first half. That's okay to say. Don't be so autistic.
>first half
more like scoring 1 point in the first minute but multiple of your helicopters get shot down and then you proceed to get raped by farmers with their tractors for the next 4 weeks
Bro, if Russia is holding so much as one square meter of Ukrainian land at the end of the war we'll spend the next century listening to 90-IQ brown people gloating about Russia's victory over "the west".
Why are thirdies so sychophantically pro Russian?Is this some decades long propaganda effort by russians? An understandable animus towards their nasty history with western powers?
They do understand that Russians see them as subhuman, right?
Thirdies hate that they are demonstrably incapable of functional society, and that the closest they came to it was being lorded over by the master race(s) from Europe. Anything that seems bad for a white nation is applauded
>thirdies so sychophantically pro Russian?
they smell money
>Is this some decades long propaganda effort by russians?
yes
>An understandable animus towards their nasty history with western powers?
yes but only among the hoi polloi. Go to India and you quickly find that the upper caste Aryan Indians are VERY clear about their preference for the UK/US/Israel, but the further down the rungs and the browner you get the more they like to slob soviet knob.
Also they they're the cheapest native-english speaking troll farmers around, even cheaper than the teenage slave labor in belarus and moscow, so King Monke gets a lot for a little rupee
>softly softly catchee monke
>so King Monke gets a lot for a little rupee
Makes sense. Russia has billions in rupees from selling gas and oil to India, but can't spend it anywhere else.
>Why are thirdies so sychophantically pro Russian?
Because they are unironically butthurt subhumans
Did you know you can examine events that occured within a scenario individually?
The initial drop and seizure of Hostomel was successful. The events after were a failure and the actual outcome of the entire scenario was a failure for the RuAF.
Just because copelord is conflating initial success with overall outcome doesn't mean you have to be a contradictory twat.
>The initial drop and seizure of Hostomel was successful
The initial drop you speak of were wiped out with the VDV having to land outside the airport. The "seizure" you say included the whole airport destroyed and the runways blown to bits which meant it couldn't be used for anything and from the first day to the day they left there couldn't bring in planes and were under artillery fire.
Stop with this fricking autism. Take your fricking meds, taking things too literally and not understanding nuance is a sign of autism. You're not israeli so it obviously can't be fricking phariseeism.
The VDV "landed" and "seized" the airport the same way I park my car by running it into the fricking wall and breaking my neck. Frick off, take your meds.
>They landed
>Airport was held for a period of time
I'm sorry these simple facts have buck broken you.
>Airport was held for a period of time
another undisputable russian win
Wasn't a win. Operation was an overall failure. Just seems like you toddlers can't comprehend they landed and occupied a patch of a dirt and concrete. I'm sure in your version events they simply all died en route due to heart disease or something
Based moron
Maybe you can get some clapped out pussy at your local gas station anon. Seems like you need some
>invincible ignorance fallacy
As expected.
>His mid-air summersault was perfect, it's just the part where he landed on his neck that he messed up
>The Dieppe Raid was a success. They took the beach!
Honestly, this is the best comparison
Although a higher percentage of the Dieppeleafs actually managed to retreat, because they weren't an airmobile force
Dieppe is a good comparison though I feel like Dieppe is easier to argue as a "win" since it atleast gave valuable lessons learned of how not to do an invasion that could be applied to D-Day later.
No, they technically didn't seize it just fine. They totally failed their objective because they were too slow and the Ukrainians were able to disable the runway. Airfield seizure needs to take the airfield intact - an airfield with an inoperable runway isn't an airfield, it's just a random field.
>No, they technically didn't seize it just fine. They totally failed their objective because they were too slow and the Ukrainians were able to disable the runway.
/thread
>Airfield seizure needs to take the airfield intact - an airfield with an inoperable runway isn't an airfield, it's just a random field.
>implying that they can't repair the runways
FFS Russian fighter jets all have rough field capability (mostly because their regular runways are complete shit as is).
>Russian fighter jets all have rough field capability
Ok, so what then? Land jets in mortar range to be surrounded by long-range AA and not be able to even fuel or arm them?
The real objective was to land thousands more troops on heavy transport planes, which absolutely cannot land on rough ground or even light tarmac.
Seizing =/= securing. VDV's job was to secure it and they failed.
>cant land reinforcements because of heavy fighting
>have to abondon it
>great success tovarish
technically you are a stupid fricking Black person
>just fine
lol
lmao even
https://warontherocks.com/2023/08/the-battle-of-hostomel-airport-a-key-moment-in-russias-defeat-in-kyiv/
People are STILL unironically trotting out this revisionist cope?
I mean it basically went
>seize the airport from a bunch of reservists who only retreated when they ran out of ammo
>they still downed several helicopters and forced the VDV to scuttle another
>VDV sit at the airport while they wait for the glorious column of troops to march out of Belarus
>meanwhile AFU surround the airport and begin counter attacking
>VDV realise the Belarus attack is delayed so long they’re going to run out of ammo
>VDV can’t even get an airlift due to intensity of fire
>VDV surrounded and fought into submission
>meanwhile the Belarus column is facing near constant ambushes on their push for Kyiv
It’s like the vatniks saw Market Garden and decided to try and mimic it
No it's not. The purpose of the operation is to seize the airport as an airbridge -IN ORDER TO BRING IN MORE TROOPS BY IL76-. Did they do that second part? No? THEN IT'S A FRICKING FAILURE
I'm tired of having this discussion with deluded vatniks. Absolutely anyone, anyone in the world can send a bunch of poor batsards to sit on an airfield for 6 hours before getting shelled to bloody shreds. Even fricking Arab nations can manage that, no problem.
No one knows what the objective was. If it was to use the airport then it was a failure BECAUSE YOU CAN’T FLY CARGO PLANES THROUGH AD you fricking mouth breathing reject. IF they intended to use the airport it would only be possible if AD had been knocked out regardless of the VDV’s success.
>No one knows what the objective was
>Proceeds to then explain what the objective, which was exactly what I said it was.
Is this some kind of new brownoid tactic, to be so moronic you just confuse the person you're arguing with?
It doesn't matter exactly why they failed, all that matters is they failed. In fact a mission can fail because of more than one reason.
Their objective was to capture Kiev as fast as possible by using the airport for troop and armor transport. They thought they could capture Kiev before Ukraine had time to organize a defence.
They wanted to encircle Kiev, but not capture it — until that became necessary, ie, plan B in a regime-change plan. However, as long as AD remains up they simply CAN’T use the airport so even if they did originally intend to use it they would have to give up on that no matter how well the VDV performed. The fact that they pulled out the next day after having linked up with a ground unit tells me they never actually wanted to use it otherwise I’d imagine they’d hold on for a while longer hoping they could knock out AD shortly. This was BEFORE the UA had mustered their defenses so it’s not as if those VDV were urgently needed somewhere else more important than an airport they wanted to make use of.
You're forgetting that Russia successfully eliminated Ukraine's entire air defense network in the opening salvos.
Air defense was not the main issue, it was artillery and the fact that the UA remained active and did not rout. This was obviously planned as a repeat of Czechoslovakia and Operation-222, but those only worked because the enemy dissolved on contact and they had intact infrastructure to fly in reinforcements and supplies.
>The fact that they pulled out the next day after having linked up with a ground unit tells me they never actually wanted to use it otherwise I’d imagine they’d hold on for a while longer hoping they could knock out AD shortly.
No, they pulled out because Ukraine shelled the tarmac and made the runway useless.
>They wanted to encircle Kiev, but not capture it
Your first sentence is Turdworlder cope, I’m not reading past it.
>We never wanted to capture the “””illegal””” government of the nation we invaded to vassalise.
Did you even listen to Putin’s Feb 22 speech? Tell me 10 lies, I’m not going to listen to any of them.
Eat shit pidor.
They pulled out the next day because they came under ground attack by infantry you fricking idiot. After that day that's when the rest of the collumn arrived and they re-occupied the airport but the runway was useless. They only fully pulled out when they pulled out from Northern Ukraine in general.
>They wanted to encircle Kiev, but not capture it
No. They intended to capture it from the outset.
That's not conjecture; we know because (picrel) when the 1st Guards Tank Army abandoned vehicles outside of Kyiv, they left behind copies of their orders from the Kremlin. A decapitation strike on Kyiv was THE lynchpin of the Russian plan to install a puppet government quickly enough that the West would have to accept it as a fait accompli.
Further details from the source here: https://static.rusi.org/359-SR-Ukraine-Preliminary-Lessons-Feb-July-2022-web-final.pdf
> The northern axis was the main effort, focused on the encirclement and capture of Kyiv. For this purpose, the Russians formed two groups of forces commanded from the Eastern Military District Command Post. One group was formed in the Gomel region of Belarus and used the tactical sign ‘V’ with orders to attack Kyiv along the right (western) bank of the Dnipro River. The second group was formed in the Bryansk region of Russia and used the tactical sign ‘O’ with orders to surround Kyiv from the left (eastern) bank.
The 1GTA routing like cowards is still the best part of this horrible war.
Agreed, but only because we were blue-balled on the spectacle of a massive Russian Dollar-Store D-Day getting absolutely wrecked in Odesa. Still, watching the much-vaunted 1GTA ditch undamaged tanks to flee in panic? Glorious.
>Still, watching the much-vaunted 1GTA ditch undamaged tanks to flee in panic? Glorious.
The massive amount of top end (for Russia) gear left behind in the opening days of the war is a big part of why Ukraine managed to hold on and make big gains in the counter offensives in Kherson and Kharkov. Russia really was the #1 supplier of military equipment to Ukraine in that time.
>but only because we were blue-balled on the spectacle of a massive Russian Dollar-Store D-Day getting absolutely wrecked in Odesa
Don't even make my remember Gopnipoli
It could have been hilarious
>objective
>russia
Let me guess, the objective was to find unicorns so DVD made successfull landing, captured airport, found unicorns down there and the retreated to Belarus because "Frick Kiev, Russia now have unicorns!"
Not unicorns, they needed to loot the sims 3 copies from the warehouse.
>No one knows what the objective was
Bullshit. Their objective was same as it was in Danube, Pristina and Simferopol. Seize a forward airbase to act as a logistics hub to bring in more supplies and reinforcements.
>If it was to use the airport then it was a failure BECAUSE YOU CAN’T FLY CARGO PLANES THROUGH AD you fricking mouth breathing reject.
Once they could not establish control over the airbase, the reinforcements being brought in by IL-76s had to be re-routed to Belarus. The air defense angle just goes to show how completely Russian intel failed prior to the war.
Face it, the VDV were sent on a suicide mission and their only success was to die in the manner in which they were sent.
>BECAUSE YOU CAN’T FLY CARGO PLANES THROUGH AD you fricking mouth breathing reject. IF they intended to use the airport it would only be possible if AD had been knocked out regardless of the VDV’s success.
It's pretty well established that the Russians thought they were going to knock out all the AD in the initial strikes. Unfortunately for them they completely underestimated Ukraine's mobile AD assets, and relied on extremely outdated intel about where the fixed stuff was, quite a few Russian missiles hit locations that where AD installations had been years previously (some literally during the Soviet era) but were long gone. This is why there were so many Russian aircraft shot down in the initial invasion too, they flew in expecting zero resistance and were caught totally by surprise.
It's not at all hard to believe that the Russians planned on flying cargo planes right into the airport.
>Even fricking Arab nations can manage that, no problem.
I can't stop laughing at the most successful air assault operation being done by fricking Africans of all people
They took the airport initially yes, but they didn't secure it or keep it secured to exploit it, nor did their allies arrive to assist them as planned.
did VDV prosecute themselves as professional soldiers? maybe, even probably, but they still fricked it up.
It's like ordering Fettuccine Alfredo at a restaurant and being served a plate of boiled plain macaroni.
>did VDV prosecute themselves as professional soldiers?
reminder that the VDV also was part of the war crimes around Bucha out of butthurt when their column was attacked near there.
That was a month later iirc. Their taints weren't as bruised yet during the airport fiasco. Honestly if anything the unit's later behavior is likely informed by how fricking awful everything went for them during the previous month. All those unsupported helicopter raids across MANPAD land, getting blasted off the airport, daylight paradrops, etc. Kind of shocking they aren't implicated in more war crimes yet, but i guess most of them were dead by late march, so it's probably lack of manpower.
>That was a month later iirc
No, that all happened barely a week later in early March
This
The VDV got Arnhemed, but they fought to the last man with what weapons and ammo they had
Is that supposed to be impressive? You don't get points for trying. You don't even get a grave, lol.
it's impressive enough from an individual soldiering point of view
not the operational part of seizing, holding and reinforcing the airfield, no
Point of aerial assault on airport is to secure the landing strip for quick deployment of heavy troops to seize whatever they wanted to seize in Kyiv. So no, they didnt capture it "just fine".
>Technically they did seize the airport just fine
But they really didn't
At one point Russia was in control of the airport area.
At no point where they able to actually use it as an airport and fly in reinforcements.
Is it really control, if you can't use the damn thing?
in control the same way the Black folk in this here video are in control of a freshly stolen bike before they fall flat on their asses
?si=KPQD1sm746tKL-BU&t=108
They did have the airport for a bit, it was the whole holding it and connecting with reinforcements part that seemed to not work out too well.
>get bombed by Su-24 on day 1
>get shelled by Grad on day 2
>I-It's fine guys, the Il-76 can totally still make the landings and reinforce us
No, they were fricked from day 1. Forget about ground forces linkup - the *airlanding reinforcement* wasn't on the table - and that was critical for even having a shot at actually holding the area and having a chance to survive until the armor drove up (which it never could have because of the 40-mile traffic jam). This wasn't Market Garden, this was like the Soviet VDV suicide jumps during the 1941 counter-offensives. Did Stalin never tell you about those? I wonder why.
What was even the point of taking the airport if the enemy would certainly damage the runway and make it unusable within hours if not minutes?
They did not expect resistance.
It was supposed to be Prague Spring 2.0. It's painfully obvious how similar these operations were when you look closely. Only one problem - Russian intelligence has degenerated even more so than the Russian military, as compared to Prague spring. The S2 and corresponding strategy was TERRIBLY off the mark. If Putin saw the real picture, there would have never been an invasion of any kind.
>It was supposed to be Prague Spring 2.0. It's painfully obvious how similar these operations were when you look closely.
I was laughing so hard seeing all those dead Russian riot police. I hope they begged before their lives ended.
>if the enemy would certainly damage the runway
Russians expected Ukrainians to be unwilling to fight, and incapable of doing it properly if they tried
Just like how British paras seized the Arnhem bridge
expanding the perimeter... with no survivors!
Thats ukrainian hostomel
xaxaxaxa
Uh, actually the French successfully entered the Saar region in September 1939, so obviously the Battle of France was definitely NOT an Allied failure.
>the charge of the light brigade at Balaklava was a success
Interesting take
How much CP dirt does the FSB have on this guy?
about three fiddy
t. his FSB handler
Care to share some stories?
A lot. Have you read his horny book about a pair of 20 year old steampunk lesbians slowly falling for each other, full of descriptions about how they breastfed boobily as they dressed?
t. 24 year old virgin here (fricked my life up professionally, not a dysgenic creep), and reading the excerpts from this guy's book makes me want to crush his skull.
How did you frick that up? Sign up for work in the oil fields or something?
How can they succeed in taking and holding the airfield if they left after a day?
Why they left the next day is up to speculation. Maybe they originally wanted to use the airport but couldn’t because AD hadn’t been knocked out so that was impossible. Maybe it was a diversion, maybe it was to deny the use of the airport for day 1 ops.
I'm sorry anon I didn't realize that you are actually moronic. You write really well taking into account that you cannot read.
What the frick? Dude, this board swam in pictures and videos of their burned carcasses and wrecked BMDs for days after the battle. I'll never forget the melted aluminium puddles, it was sick. You're living in a fricking alternate reality.
If Hostomel was a success, then the US won in Vietnam, Afghanistan and Iraq.
>100% success minus the loss a few helis and later on the entire regiment
So it was a total success, and then they left? What happened at Irpin then, with that famous crossroads video filmed by Ukrainian SSO, featuring a lot of BMD-4's and Spetsnaz with Adidas strips?
>SSO
Wasn't it the TDF that fricked up the VDV there?
Never seen TDF with that kind of kit, or operating that hard. Could've been anyone of course, given how much of a clusterfrick the first week was. Could've been GUR or even a foreign fighter unit. But I've never heard them called anything other than SSO.
I thought that was the Rubizh brigade.
It was both, the Ukrainian Special Purpose units were leading the TDF, like paramilitary units are supposed to be used.
There was the SSO, TDF and a "quick response brigade". There were also Georgian, British and French volunteers that came a bit later
>Ukraine invented a wild story about launching a crushing counterattack
>The VDV looted the werehouse of ammo then linked up with ground forces the next day and left, the end.
so they left because...?
Gesture of good will. Decadent globohomosexual west would not understsnd
They were playing tag and Ukraine was It.
>altering the reality again
For those unaware, this was an article that was accidentally posted by Russian media when they thought the invasion was going to be successful. It was immediately retracted, but people screen capped it. Interestingly, it effectively broadcasts all of Russia's insecurities by stating the real reasons got the invasion. I'm surprised this hasn't been weaponized as a psyop on a more widespread scale. Things that make Russians cry:
>The knowledge they are irrelevant and their geopolitical power has been declining for 30 years.
>The fear that other states doing better than them and soon they will be a "have-not" state.
>A East-West Germany scenario where Russians have the option to flee to a prosperous, democratic, western aligned Ukraine
>The knowledge that their military/demographics/oligarchy is collapsing and this was their last chance to invade
>Domestic unrest from war fatigue and western sanctions impacting livelihoods.
>EU + US cohesion containing them
TZD. Their whole worldview seems to be about stealing someone else's toilet rather than fixing their own.
archive link to the original article
http://web.archive.org/web/20220226051154/https://ria.ru/20220226/rossiya-1775162336.html
L O L
>A East-West Germany scenario where Russians have the option to flee to a prosperous, democratic, western aligned Ukraine
Well I don't see that happening in my lifetime. Guess the SMO is actually achieving some of its objectives.
Well done Russia.
Latvia and Lithuania are already full of Russians who enjoy a living standard that is unimaginable in Russia.
I probably wasn't explicit enough.
I don't see a sovereign Ukraine accepting much Russian immigration (paperclip-lite situations aside) for a while after the war ends.
I don't see why they shouldn't. Almost every young educated person in Russia is against the war. Young Adult immigrants with higher education who can easily learn to speak Ukrainian are the holy grail of immigration. They aren't really a security threat since theymost likely oppose the current Russian regime and are nominally pro-west. A Million+ have already fled to Georgia/Armenia/the -Stans. I'd bet good money they'd prefer to live in Ukraine where there is more opportunity compared to those places + potential future EU membership. If you consider Russian speakers themselves as a national security concern, I'd argue that since Zelensky and Azov are Russian speakers you'd be dead fricking wrong about excluding them based on language and cultural background. Security checks, sure, but immigration of young adults from Russia bleeds Russia and makes Ukraine stronger, IMO.
>Almost every young educated person in Russia is against the war.
nope, its quite literally the opposite. You western morons still have a long, looonnng way to understanding the snow monkeys mindset. And why helping them to stop Barbarossa was the biggest disaster you ever caused in east euros history
You are naive and delusional
and they are mouth foaming ziggers. The vatnik portion that is. What the russia todays of the world dont tell you is baltic russian speakers are divided between ukranians, belarussians and vatnigs proper. Not all of them are longing for monkes big liberation campaign
1. 100 Billion + are going to go to them to rebuild from the west post-war
2. They will likely get the 300 Billion of seized Russian assets as part of any peace negotiations
3. EU integration will lead to hundreds of billions in aid to help upgrade infrastructure over the coming decades
4. Millions of young Russians who don't want to live in a failed autocracy will flee to Ukraine post war.
5. Ukraine has huge untapped energy reserves to bring in revenues
6. Ukraine is making huge strides dealing with corruption since Maidan
Look at how all the other post-cold war eastern Euro states are doing compared to Russia. I'd bet that by 2040 there will be serious talks about Schengen and full admittance. Hell, they're already figuring out the roadmap NOW.
>by 2040 there will be serious talks about Schengen and full admittance.
By 2040 Ukraine will be more than a decade in Schengen and the EU
>1. 100 Billion + are going to go to them to rebuild from the west post-war
>2. They will likely get the 300 Billion of seized Russian assets as part of any peace negotiations
Bruh, the invasion caused trillions in damage and fricked whole parts of the country for multiple decades to come even if someone would try to resolve the issues.
Trillions? No
$500-800 billion? Yes
You underestimate just how fricked things are
Well they're not making dubai even the moderately big city would probably only cost a couple of bill
Bruh, not even counting thousands of square kilometers of mined land (and also polluted land), there are things like dams destroyed, bridges, power plants, elements of the grid, factories (azovstal itself is more than 10+ billion USD), entire cities (like Mariupol, which basically got reduced to rubble), don't forget people (up to 100k civilians just in Mariupol).
Obviously they won't rebuild everything 1:1 and they won't giving free homes to everyone either. Expect a commieblock 2.0 or something a bit nicer if zhang involved
i kind of envy ukraine because they have a government that is willing to actually improve the country
Oh my sweet summer child
either elaborate of frick off vatBlack person
That’s what this war ultimately stems from: not want to wither and die and get looted by gulaghomo
not him, but before war Ukraine was generally known in the EU as a turbo corrupt country run by mafia. Basically russia, but smaller.
There's a good reason why a lot of eastern euros don't like ukies - because a lot of ukies who "work" there are either mafia, or thugs.
You have to understand eastern european countries- that after soviet union fell, there was a decade of total chaose lawlessness, and anarchy. A lot of shit got stolen by shitty people, who quickly became oligarchs and started doing business. And these people exist to this day - often in goverment positions.
Black, the "oligarchs" were the people doing all the stealing in the USSR already. They didn't become shit they just changed titles.
It would be hard to condense the answer for a point like this into a single post, here's 6 just for surface stuff.
The core of the issue is that since 1991 nobody really cleaned house after the commie regime and scars of the soviet past still haunt the country and society, despite some reforms and token decommunization.
One of the reasons for this is people who were in power mostly staying in power, perpetuating the soviet tradition of turbo corruption and nepotism. This is compounded by the fact that people lived so long with that shit during soviet times that they low key see that thing as normal and/or even beneficial.
Many people would unironically tell you that corruption is good, while not actually being the benefactors of it and instead the victims of it: "hurr-durr, corruption is good, thanks to it I just gave a bribe of X dollars and got the issue solved in few days and without it I'd need to spend like months to solve it", i.e. people unironically don't understand that the whole reason they are put into a position where some BS red tape shit takes months of time is specifically an artificially constructed situation by the corrupt homosexuals, basically placing them into a position where they can't live normally without paying bribes. Why? Because they didn't know better, because this is a natural continuation of soviet corruption, which might have been cheaper (because people were poor AF), but still required constant bribing to make thing work even a tiny bit.
Basically people in public sector and similar fields won't do shit until they get their wheels greased. Because the system doesn't have normal mechanism for responsibility and feedback. Because a ton of fricked up soviet red tape still exists, specifically to frick up your life. And a lot of that shit then would get entrenched and even more monetized by what you might call the "corrupt deep state", because people in such a system would obviously want to have more ways to monetize shit.
1/6
thank you
Wonderful posts. I never even put a foot in Europe but I recognize this whole process due to living in a shithole with a long history of corporatists and socialists in positions of power.
And yes it all goes back to paternalist state policies and the culture it creates, though in here it wasn't communism, but rather an attempt to build a populist, corporate state.
Right now, in a state here, a bridge was damaged by a flood. The government estimatives for repairing the bridge were ate 26 million. The local population with a local construction company repaired the bridge for 6 million, all paid out of their own pockets. Unfortunately that's rare as in a country like this people with this much money and with private businesses available to work with them are not common.
Based UA-anon dropping truth bombs
I'm just a jaded and butthurt old fricker who was literally born in USSR and had his work eroded to shit multiple times due to overall soviet-tier Black persontry happening in Ukraine. Don't get me wrong, if it were my decision, I'd drop nukes on russia without taking a single moment of doubt, but one should still objectively look at issues we have within the country.
thanks for the effort post
the baltics moved a lot of their government services to online platforms to remove official/citizen contact, can't ask for/offer a bribe if you don't know who case this is or who is handling your case
Huh, that’s actually quite clever. But wouldn’t that remove a lot of civil service jobs? I know muh jerbs program but having stable government work is quite helpful for an economy and providing stability to the lower classes. Or does the online stuff preserve workers still
you still keep most of the staff because they still have to push paper. But you make sure that the guy that pushes the paper and the guy that need the paper push don't meet/know each other.
you can't get rid off all corruption with it but it helps clean up culture bottom up because the new guys don't get to learn corruption in their starting position.
That and EU public tender rules, makes dodgy shit stand out like crazy. Doesn't fix everything automatically but sure helps because it forces them to make a uniform paper trail that any corruption hunter can use. Or a competitor that got snubbed and wants to file a civil suit (which I have done and won).
Good effortposting, thanks anon. I was incidentally interested in post-Soviet Europe long before this recent dust-up so it's been equal parts amusing and frustrating to see so many people sucking Ukraine's wiener and pretending that it was always comparable to western Europe when it absolutely has not been and that everything is going to change overnight when the war is over. In the post-Soviet era Ukraine been massively corrupt, generally a shithole on par with the richer parts of Russia and its global relevance outside of its neighbors was largely limited to growing grain for the third world and exporting prostitutes and child pornography - though in fairness I'll say that they've been improving, although that's a big part of their current problems. I've been meaning to write up an essay on what I see as the cultural relevance of the war and I might get around to it but if I don't then the tl;dr is that this entire mess is literally just an ego-driven punitive expedition and any strategic and military concerns for Russia are tertiary.
This creates a situation similar to cancer, where the system that should solve the issue is part of the issue. You can't expect cancer to cure itself. It's just too valuable of a mechanism to try and destroy for anyone in power, not only because of the amount of money it brings in (and yes, the flow of money goes to the top, as in with any organization, the old soviet criminal code "you steal for yourself, you share with the bros" applies, i.e. some low level homosexual gets money and shares it with his boss, the boss then shares with his own boss and it goes all the way to the government), but also because the power it provides. When all of the homosexuals don't have any responsibility and are tied by corruption, they'll do anything you tell them, hence you can use not only to protect someone, but also to create issues for someone. A person is being a pain? Let's have the tax office wake up and say that the apartment he sold 5 years ago in the middle of the economic crisis caused by Crimea and Donbas war was undervalued like 5x market price and thus he skimmed on taxed. Proof? What proof? Frick you, we're the government, we invent shit out of thin air. Let's the jail this person. And so on.
2/6
Any time processes would get successfully improved (and such situation did happen) it's at least partially caused by just removing a specific process from being done by people it was previously handled, or just outsourced entirely. Some of issues like this solved themselves via the market, such as basically the local package shipping industry overtaking the notoriously shitty state-run postal company. But there's also the issue of people's mentality being stuck doing things which they did before. Here's a fricked up example from around 2014: a friend of a colleague had his kid reach the age where they'd need (want) to send him to the kindergarten, they go to a local municipal one and get told that "hurr-durr, not enough vacant positions in the kindergarten to go around, you had to get in queue 5 years (when they didn't have a kid yet lol) ago to get a position new", while obviously signaling that they expect him to pay the bribe. Because that what they do. They are put in a position where they control access to something you need, nobody would frick them over for their shit, so they demand bribes or else. So the guy goes and pays $5K and the position for his kid magically appears. When I was first told of this situation it honestly blew my mind, not only because the degenerate in question actually went and paid $5K just for access to the shitty soviet municipal kindergarten (not the services of going there by the way, that would cost on top, albeit being cheap), instead of going to a private one where no such BS would take place, and where his $5K would pay for years of a very good one, but also why did he even need kindergarten in the first place? His wife doesn't work, the kid can stay home. "Hurr-durr well, back when I was a kid my parents sent me to a kindergarten, so that's normal, so that's what I'll do as well" - like no frickin' shit, as if your parents had a frickin' choice.
3/6
When this sort of shit exists for decades after decades it fricks up things to such a degree that you have teens dreaming of going to specific public position to steal stuff. Imagine a 16 y.o. kid saying shit like he want to go work in the customs office, because people there "get" a shit load of money. Or the tax office, or the police, or the court system, or the any government work in general. Basically, no normal person would touch those position with a ten foot pole. And even if they somehow got there, they'd either get corrupted in some time themselves (imagine basically a normal person starts working it local government and then he starts lying by default, even to friend and family, even when discussing things which don't matter and have no benefit for him, because that's his default mode now), or they'll run away screaming from that hell hole, or they'll get squeezed out. Hey, somebody needs to get jailed for corruption, right? Let's frame the new guy who thinks he's better than us kek.
This could be changed, but requires a ton of political will and integrity from the top, which is obviously isn't there. Because if you have it, you would need to start jailing your own guys that you brought in with yourself for loyalty reasons and they started doing corrupt shit. But you can't do that, because they are "your guys", at most you'll fire them. But what sort of incentives that creates? Sure, you can do corrupt things, but you'll never answer for this, at most you'll lose your position personally.
In such a system good results happen only by chance and there are a ton of people who'd frick over any good project or initiative just because it happens without their greasy fingers being involved.
4/6
And yes, this is in many ways caused / stimulated by russians. Because such a system provides them additional control and influence. Hence why the relations between russia and Georgia started falling apart only when Saakashvili started firing entrenched corrupt homosexuals. Because if you remove corruption, it erodes the pidor influence matrix. But, once cultivated and stimulated, it creates a ton of local entrenched interest. Because it creates layers of society which can live like kings, compared to regular folks, without doing anything productive in their lives.
Here's a fricked up example from around 2012: your regular frick can barely afford a new $10K Daewoo Lanos, while you drive around on a pretty much new Toyota Land Cruiser which cost you $5K, because it was stolen in EU and illegally imported here (because you can't register it within the EU) and registered under bogus documents in the registry, you have access to his car because you father is a cop in the right position, and those people have this cottage industry of these cheap fancy cars, which they can enjoy without paying a real price for them.
You want to import a car from EU or US? Get ready to be raped financially. Some Black person with connection imports is? Zero payment, yanukovich personally will sign a decree saying that you're importing this Cadillac Escalade as a way to help the local agricultural industry and thus you shouldn't need to pay taxes or import duties on it. (Not a joke).
So yes, even though it's nowhere near the level of shit being done in russia, it's still bad and fricked up.
And even a ton of progress happening since 2014 didn't magically fix almost a century of soviet frickery.
5/6
So yes, while in some locations shit got fixed after attacks pretty fast, any local would point you to examples of when things are different and shit gets dragged out for months and months without too much progress, because the corrupt fricks don't care about the result, they care that the affiliated company would work on this and thus skim over the money. Like it's pretty bad in Zaporizhia for example. People know about it, it's in the media, for some reason nobody is getting jailed for this.
This is partially the similar reason why a lot of local MIC projects are fricked: corruption, traitors and all that shit.
6/6
This isn't because of the government, but because people. People here, despite being fricked over by soviet shit, are still generally way more proactive and have way more initiative, compared to russia. Russia is hyper-paternalism going apeshit. Ukraine is grassroots country.
Is half of Ukraine without water or electricity like Russia is?
>4. Millions of young Russians who don't want to live in a failed autocracy will flee to Ukraine post war.
They neither exist nor would be welcome in Ukraine.
Pidor hordes are delusional.
Patton was right
And my personal favorite
>Forgetting that the unification of Europe occured only thanks to the unification of Germany, which occured according to the Russian good will
Literally "it was a gesture of good will. We didn't want berlin anyway"
"Unfication of Europe"
The EU should have zero lawmaking power over the European nations and their states. Them being leftist, anti-national (to each and every seperate people), Black person-loving fifth columnists is surely a coincidence.
Yeah this shouldn't have been memoryholed and deserves to be brought out every anniversary at least.
vdv just left next day, the end. ignore all the wrecks, mkay?
That's hohol btr-82a
I keep being reminded by how BIG the 2a42 is. I should really stop being surprised
>vatnik trying to legitimize an alternate reality when everyone remembers everything
>moron trying to pretend this wasn’t caught on camera by CNN
you stupid homosexual I watched the CNN footage when it happened - it just proved the VDV were there a didnt evaporate immediately.
what documented proof? no really, what? because I remember every day clearly and I remember the vatnik copes and I remember what a shitshow it was and how confused it was. every time hostomel is mentioned some Russian frickwit comes out of the woodwork to explain it was obviously a success, but you homosexuals NEVER produce and proof
PROVE YOUR CLAIMS homosexual
haha fricking stupid hohols and their /k/ope squad, those vdv were actually dropping in with Ukrainian POW's to be exchanged and the dumb ukrop forces opened fire on them
It was except for never being used as an airfield after capture.
They were there for a month you aperg
>It was except for never being used as an airfield after capture.
It's a cargo airport not a military one.
>looted abandoned arms wherehouse
>in a civilian airport
Do vatniks really?
Eh, it was more of a mixed use airbase.
>>"The military airbase included an 11,483 foot (3,500 meter) runway, capable of supporting the largest of transport aircraft, and several dozen single-story and multi-story structures — some up to six stories — and two large hangers. The built-up area, or cantonment area, was the home base of the Ukrainian National Guard’s 4th Rapid Reaction Brigade and located to the southeast of the runway. "
https://warontherocks.com/2023/08/the-battle-of-hostomel-airport-a-key-moment-in-russias-defeat-in-kyiv/
>they weren't killed there
>they were ACTUALLY killed other there, next to those looted washing machines
Every time that you are having a bad moment, remember that thousands of ziggers die everyday for nothing but banana
>You are thinking of the town of Homstel
You're not even worth a reply from my pc
Spoken like a true vatnik. So there must be some evidence from those film crews right?
Guys do you remember how the premier unit in the Russian army got ass raped by nobodies from teritorial defense
Those were the days,when one could jerk off to burned BMDs and crispy VDVtards
Home Guard holding an AS Val, posing it in front of the blood of its previous owner pooling on the asphalt... An image so beautiful it is seared into my memory. What a day that was.
For me its the Chechen convoy that got btfo so hard they hightailed their asses back to grozny for a year
Do you mean the supposed kill squad that got ambushed? Yeah, that was the moment I knew this wasn't going to be easy for Russia.
Thats the one
for me it's the Tiktok Chechen selfie video where they literally record their own death
It was mostly national guard at the airport too. So it was a bunch of Military Police gendarmerie cops who blew them away. This is them at one of the airport exits in the battle.
Those were the days…
Can someone link tbharchive threads for this? I wasn’t able to see the live reactions to this sadly.
The next thing is some vatnik will try to convince us that the moskva is actually safe at port.
It made it to port under it's own power.
Like that A-50
actually Moskva never existed
>Not a ONE came from Homstel Airport
Jesus Christ. It's literally 4th post itt you gay. Here
I saw them talking to the media that morning.
>Hurr durr We're The russian armee - said the green drabbed chimp
I remember thinking - those are some dead men fronting there
Glad to know I was right
>everywhere on the frontline
For example?
Anon you know very well that there is buttfricking anywhere you have russian soldiers
I'm not kidding, they've zoomed in so far on their cope maps that even if you measure their cope arrows from beginning to end (see early rybar maps why thats moronic) it's a km or two.
Zoom out even more and you'll see it's 3 or 4 KM from downtown donetsk.
https://www.russiadefence.net/t9051p825-russian-special-military-operation-in-ukraine-52
Point and laugh at these morons
>We've successfully seized the airfield!
>Hold it? What for?
>front line barely moving despite ~80k casualties and rising from vatBlack person meat waves not to mention massive equipment losses
>strategic military/oil industry and warehouses and more blowing up all over Russian territory
>an obviously important IL76 intercepts the ground and prompts intense low IQ lying/seething from vatBlack folk
>lose irreplaceable AWACS & command center planes
>vatBlack person soviet infrastructure is breaking and muh "EUROPE WILL FREEZE" are now actually literally freezing and are walking on 2" of ice in their stair wells of their crumbling commieblocks
>Ukies continuously killing vatBlack person military commanders and "war" heros lmao
>Ukies claim to have progressed back to a 8-10:1 kill ratio on vatBlack folk since the meat assaults began
The vatBlack person mind is weaker than a T72 turret's will to stay attached to its hull.
>A T72 turret's will to stay attached to its hull.
KEK
Reminder that the only thing that keeps a T-72 turret in place is gravity
Thats like, every post ww2 tank ever
Yes. That's how tank turrets work. That's how gun turrets on warships work, too, hence why pic relevant.
>That's how tank turrets work
Well no, they are bolted on. Its just not "able to take the force of 40 HE shells"-bolts. A blow-out turret, if you will
Tank turrets are held in place by the pisky force.
When the pisky drive is compromized the turrets levitate rapidly sometimes hurling the orb hundreds of miles.
….are you for real? How do you suppose a turret is able to rotate…?
Does the words "bearing" and "slipring" mean anything to you, or has that technology not yet reached your part of Calcutta?
Please explain the use of bearings and slip rings with bolts…?
Nta but the turret doesn't have to be rigidly secured to rotate on bearings or with a turret drive. Warship turrets had nothing them really holding them in place either. I don't know if tanks are this way, but they certainly could be
I looked it up just because I was curious, and at least on the Abrams, the turret is placed and then a retaining ring is bolted from the top into the bottom race ring to sandwich the bearing and hold it in place
>sandwich
americans not talking about food for a second = impossible
It's highly technical jargon. Thirdies wouldn't know it
excellent bait
> T72 turret's will to stay attached to its hull.
I cum
>weaker than a T72 turret's will to stay attached to its hull
stealing that one for later use
It's only in the West that you can really be as stupid as him and still get away with being alive
this is just strait up revisionism. it was known at the time that it was pointless and unnecessary and remarked at the time that nothing of value was learned. just like Gallipoli, a British commander wasted the lives of colonial subjects on a pointless vanity landing
No, it isn't. Dieppe learned that you couldn't get tanks onto shingle beaches because they just got stuck. They learned that heavy bunkers were resistant to the current weapons on tanks right now. They learned that flamethrowers were needed to clear bunkers, but troop carriers were exposed. They learned that you needed to have a distraction force to hold off reinforcements before the beachhead was made. They learned you needed people to set up defences to resist counter-attacks once the beachhead was made. They learned you needed bombing runs around the areas you were going to hit, not the area you were hitting.
Like, there is so much they learned from Dieppe that your post actually angers me.
You forgot the biggest learning point - taking an existing port fast enough to support an invasion wasn't practical if defended, so they needed to bring their own ports with them or use other means of offloading cargo such as DUKWs.
>after having looted
That much i believe 100%. Hard to bring with you a washing machine or 7-year olds while on foot though
In 5 years Russia will produce a movie in which the heroes of Hostomel stop the Ukrainian false flag nuclear attack on Kyiv in a selfless sacrifice.
Tbh I wish Nolan or Mendes would do a Hostomel film with some kino shot of the Mriya burning, but that probably won't happen
>We've reached the "actually it was a victory" phase of vatnik cope already
Lmao
VDV are totally still alive you guys, just you wait, Russia has yet to remove the gloves! Soon they will actually start trying in this wa- err special military operation! The almost 500,000 dead mobiks were merely a distraction! We didn't need those oil refineries in Russia anyway!
Ok and what did they accomplish for that month besides getting all of their helicopters blown up?
They were there for 12 hours before being forced off. Ground units took it a day or two later.
>What level of delusion are you on?
>Dunno, maybe Hamas and Houthis are winning?
>Ha! You are like little baby, watch this!
George Orwell would have to come up with an entire new term to describe Zigger bizzaro world think.
The frick is that picture?
Latest turdie cope is that Texas will secede and ally with russia.
This is on par with the fricking Zimmerman telegram
Comparing this to the Zimmerman telegram is frankly an insult to the telegram.
XD
This is all just an attempt to create a perpetual motion machine by harnessing the power of McCarthy spinning in his grave.
Where is McCarthy when we need him? He was in the right. He was 100% right. Where is the McCarthy of our era? We need to cleanse that 5th column. In every allied country. I'm sick of these homosexuals subverting our democracies.
>Where is the McCarthy of our era?
good question, who is the most anti-communist person in the US government right now?
communists?
He'll realize or he won't
Always gommies
>Latest turdie cope is that Texas will secede and ally with russia.
And then the brown thirdie fricks will fricking seethe and rage that we refuse to ever take them seriously lmao
They’re posting this shit on other boards too lmao
t. PrepHole autist
I am legit certified loon and even I recognize this as pure insanity. This is way beyond cope.
nta but i've already seen posters with a russian flag posting this shit on PrepHole claiming that shots have already been fired and other states are seceding along with Texas
This is like when in 2022 or 2023 all of a sudden obviously bots started spamming copy and pasted messages on Xitter that the Ukrainian war has no footage or videos despite it being some big war. Some FSB mobster frick got blown away in Ukraine and his replacement just creates bullshit moronic spam about equally moronic conspiracy theories.
I guess Strelkovs 4 moods now are pain, pain, pain and partytime with the churkas
I wonder if they all know the national guards units are mostly for show and there are still larger swathes of the border that are unguarded and open. It’s all distracting BS for the election.
>CAPTCHA: ASSS
>"He's gone away from us Jack..."
>"I'm afraid you're right Mr. Helpmann, he's gone. "
>Snow
>Texas
I gotta say that better be Amarillo but there are too many trees for Amarillo.
That picture looks a bit chile for Texas.
I hope they actually pay you to be this moronic and delusional. If you do it for free it's just fricking pathetic.
I am donating $20 to Ukraine for this post.
At this point the continued existance of Russia is too absurd to be real
I was being objective. Hostomel was OBJECTIVELY a failure because they failed to achieve the objective. Not the larger strategic ones or the tactical objective of the air assault to begin with. You're just mad because you hate having this pointed out.
I'm not sure why the idea that air defense being the crucial factor is important to you, but it's also irrelevant to the central point. It literally doesn't matter.
I can only assume your post is largely projection, and you're absolutely furious about the VDV ubermensch getting their teeth kicked in by weekend citizen soldiers, but that's what happened.
>But you have sympathies for Ukraine waaaaa waaaaaaa!
Of course, people like winners and Russia is a loser.
I mean sure, Im positive their corpses might have been there for more than a month, but the mix Ukrainian national guard and air force drove them off in under 12 hours. That's why the Il-76s had to be diverted to Belarus instead of offloading in Hostomel.
holy shit, meds
>VDV tries to land ay Hostomel
>bunch of non-regular troops stationed at Hostomel (can't remember any more if TDF or cadets) notice, fire on them, pin them, bring down one Alligator
>Rapid Reaction Force had been kept near Hostomel, had the runway pre-sighted and made it impossible for air reinforcements to land.
>DVD is all alone, burrows into basements, all land reinforcement columns were TZD
>Eventually there's no more DVD
>lying about Hostomel Airport.
So they won Hostomel then? They secured the landing strip to allow for transport planes carrying more troops to land?
yes they took Kyiv but left next day coz gest of good will da da also they shot Zelenskiy first day but resurrect him next day, coz again, all objections was achieved and they don't car if he alive or not
Interesting video about the whole thing: https://youtu.be/r0Ji7KqqEqg?si=0Yvc4GCRScCrXooQ
nooooo it's fake video it was Ukrainian VDV
Um, ackshually, NAFOtroons, those weren't VDV.. glorious Rasha sent khokhol POW from 2014 to capture the airport.... real 30% muslim Muscovite morons would have captured it for sure!
They liberated the Hostomel Duty-free Store, which was the primary objective. That makes the operation an overwhelming success. It's not the fault of the VDV that regular forces couldn't take Technohouse to consolidate the victory
>Actually that was a hohol RIA Novosti xaxaxa mmm roasted piggie news outlet
>the projection on display here lmfao
classic vatnik
Ahhh yes, NATO is truly devious to control Russian State Media.
So zalupa rusnyavaya kuda ti delas? ne ponravilso vidos:
?
>hasnt been posted yet
Im disappointed in you /k/
>too absurd to be real
Two years into this fricking war and *nothing* is too absurd for Russia anymore.
>state of the art Russian iron bomb produ cation line
>state of the art Russian iron bomb produ cation line
He didn't' see that webm of an american weapons factory.
This factory was built by the US during WW2 under Lend-Lease
dont forget to polish your bombs when boss is around
I... frick. Ok, Picrel is one of the lines producing infantry mortar shells for the anarchists during the Spanish Civil War.
Note how fricking high they're stacking that shit. Because they had to. Because they were producing them THAT fast.
And this was ANARCHIST SPAIN during the fricking SPANISH CIVIL WAR. Forget pallets! These fricking idiots can't even come close to the rate of production of the fricking anarchists a century ago!
For fricks sake can they not just fricking hurry?! Fricking that ammo could save your guys' lives in the front you're not building toys here GET A FRICKING MOVE ON FFS STOP POLISHING AND GET TO RAMMING GUNPOWDER IN ALREADY!
I know, I know I must look like a vatnik getting mad at this shit but no. Frick no. I advocate for TZD as every good moderate should but for fricks sake I JUST CAN'T STAND INCOMPETENCE OF THIS CALIBER. It just pisses me the frick off to see this degree of sheer, astonishing worthlessness on display. Do they not give a shit they're getting slaughtered?! What level of subhuman scum are we on by now?!
>PRETEND to be sentient
This sure sounds like something someone with English as a first language would say.
But its the Ziggers who are saying it was a successful operation
Kadoyrov crying on social media that his friend died was incredible
Frick I missed that
>Kadoyrov crying on social media that his friend died was incredible
You write this and then you provide no sauce. What is wrong with you?
Oh, he retroactively hexed the whole operation, amazing.
>THEY WERE THERE FOR A MONTH
dead rusBlack person corpses dont count you moronic homosexual
The pidor is returning into the ground, nature is healing
in zigger propaganda dreamlands, they were continuously wonnering and advancing until they made a sudden gesture of a good will
I don't think the fourth picture is from the same place
They didn't learn anything they didn't already know, revisionist. Now explain how the fall of Singapore thought us something valuable.
> Why must you contort yourself over documented facts of reality?
Why must you butcher the English language so? You don’t here messing up those wiener gobbling sounds you call Russian
ITT ukie shills and vatnik shills trying to out delude eachother
>Le both sides
Frick off.
>the usual respone
I'm just in it for the entertainment tbh. I follow these things like a sporting even. First was Iraq, then Afghanistan, then syria, then yemen (against the saudis), now it's Ukraine. Dont care enough for the israelites and sandBlack folk to care for Israel vs Palestinian tho. Just because my tax dollars keeps one side afloat doesn't mean i have to root for anyone. I just like the memes and the footage, particularly the cqb.
You homosexuals are like bots with these responses. Neutrality is a valid position. I hate all of you equally. Go die in a muddy trench now Pidor/Pydior (whichever is correct for your homosexual dialect)
oooh you're so edgy. I remember too when I hated everybody equally and would cut my wrists and listen to black metal when I was 14 like you.
The hairline cauldron is closing. Soon the hohols will know all!
Is this the guy who routed ziggers from Chernobyl exclusion zone?
>neutrality is a valid position
>neutrooler acts surprised when bad actor pushes his successes and forces confrontation
>neutrooler becomes cucked isolationist when forced to deal with the consequences of not nipping it in the bud.
Only children and politicians lack the understanding that not killing a problem will come back to bite you later down the road.
If you’re ‘neutral’ when you see Russia terrorbombing Ukrainian civilians, putting them through concentration camps and torturing them in cellars, you are a sociopathic little shit no better than the Russians.
Neutrality is valid stance to take wen you see somebody attacked on street
Don't worry, he fricks dogs, his opinion on politics and guns can be safely ignored.
Kys.
This is why being a anti Russian Norktard is so much better, if you are serious it confuses shills from all sides so much sometimes you can actually talk about the weapons you like.
Being pro-Russian on here is banable so one has to be "nooootral" occasionally.
The air assault worked, the ground forces couldn’t link up with at the airfield. The VDV was then targeted by artillery and obliterated/hunted into the woods by the Ukrainians.
The air assault got men on the ground, but saying it “worked” requires you par back the goals of that phase of the operation to the point that not further phase of the operation can succeed. It’s like saying someone successfully landed an airplane when they hit an office building at 100 mph 30 feet after the wheels touched the ground.
A successful version of the Hostomel air assault would include getting enough combat power down to neutralize the artillery and drive off the attack helicopter, allowing the air bridge maneuver to be completed.
The VDV managed to deny Ukraine use of Hostomel airport, but that wasn’t their goal, a competent bombing run or missile strike could have done that without massacring Russia’s best fighters. The goal of any air assault on an airport, like the one on Hostomel, is to secure the airport for the attacking force’s use, not merely deny it to the enemy. In the end, the VDV successfully spent ~300 men and 8 helicopters to “””accomplish””” what would take the US Navy approximately 20 Tomahawks or the US airforce approximately 20 GBU-53B Stormbreakers.
The "air assault" didn't even get them on the ground because the first few landings were wiped out and the VDV immediately switched to landing outside the airport in the woods on the side opposite the side of the airport the Ukrainians were in. They only managed to land in the airport after the troops from outside the airport reached it and by then the damage was already done.
buddy, i can have both, can revel in objective truth and also kick back and enjoy taunting russians for their ridiculous losses.
win win and cake all day - that's the reality of dealing with ziggers and their dogshit tier propaganda.
>EU
Unité Européenne?
Also, I wonder why is that.
To be fair, there is a lot of resistance to accepting Ukraine into the EU due to agriculture. Farmers form the core of a lot of the right wing parties who are on the rise atm are dead set against accepting Ukraine because the combination of location and soil conditions means that a Ukrainian farmer can outperform any competition in the EU by a huge margin unless they're a big agricorp. During the first months of the war the EU allowed Ukrainian produce to be shipped by rail into the EU which cause a crash in prices as the agricultural markets were flooded with cheap Ukrainian fruit/grains, leading to several ape outs across the continent. If Ukraine is ever going to enter the Union it won't happen until they find a way to keep Ukrainian produce flowing out of Europe to protect domestic growers, that being said there is a lot of energy behind the movement so I think the 2030/40 timeline is pretty realistic.
the european farmers market only functions via a sophisticated psyop to cinvibce euros that only They can do agriculture Right (including such ridiculousness as legislating away the existence of danish feta) amd everyone else eats poison, paired with gigantic subsidies that would make the US dairy industry blush. oh, and using the former nonsense to artificially close markets kek
>UE
then why don't you live in Nigeria or Algeria, Jean-Luc?
the VDV combusted under their own power
>not satisfied with getting dunked on daily, he resorts to relitigating old dunks
he has to be getting off to this, right?
Any other youtuber making such battle maps recaps for this war? I like this format. Wouldn't mind good ones for WWII as well.
tl;dr about Hostomel: https://teletype.in/@tysknip/HostomelEN
>.in
Did they take the airport?
Yes.
Did they die (soldiers are supposed to die)
Yes.
They succeeded. Armchad warrior is right again.
If you let your enemy kill you, you win
Holding a static position makes you an easy target even for inferior forces.
Not holding territory means your side does not control the location.
This is part of what makes war miserable. Even the most elite forces die if they act like guards.
Offense has been stronger than defense since gunpowder was invented.
If you stay relatively static you get precision bombed or hit with arty. If you constantly are mobile you hit mines and ambushes. Mines and ambushes tend to wipe out less of you than being obliterated by ordinance, so mobile is better but still results in regular casualties that cannot be countered by the skill of the soldier. War is hell.
Just imagine how many quality fighters have died because even one guy uses a cell phone to call home or use the internet and the opposition then kills all soldiers in that location having located it as a result.
All those volunteer glory seekers posting updates probably got most of the people they worked with killed.
I posted half of this in another thread but its also relevant here.
It's pretty fricked up how many different "factions" with the Russians have been more or less wiped out in succession. The VDV, separatists, Volunteer paramilitary units, Kadyrov Mafia goons, National Guard, Sea Infantry, Gazprom mercs now Wagner. They were either wiped out, or hit hard enough they ran off. It's now just mobiks, mobik units and more mobik units. That and Storm-Z.
Everybody's dead.
There are still remnants of those units they are just held or sent after the mobiks. Ironically RU is wanting to hold anyone at all with experience right now. Cant teach the next wave without someone who knows something.
I remember back when the "George Bush is a chimpanzee" memes were in full swing. Good to see it finally getting turned around on the propagandists themselves.
If a problem is circular, and repeats itself, despite obvious solutions, and is resistant to error correcting; consider then, this: The problem is actually a process disgusted as a problem.
The powers that be are force shaping two populations in preparation for whatever machination comes next.
>gucci DMR with camo netting
>adidas colorado beetle stripes on the helmet
Arent those two concepts mutually exclusive if your rifle and the helmet are facing the same direction ?
Yeah, it would be grim if it wasn't so funny.
At the start of the war the russians had full ratnik kits looking like the little green men that took crimea.
Now like 95% of russians I see killed look like random hobos.
How do vatniks explain and internalize this to themselves?
>"xaxaxa we're using native ukrainian donbabweans to fight NATO"
doesnt really fit into their "We had to start the war to protect the donbabweans" narrative.
I know some russians think the war needs to continue at any cost because russia will be destroyed by ukraine and NATO without it (lol), but I don't understand what they think they could possibly gain from it at this point.
Are they just fighting and dying because they're told to?
Actual fricking serf mentality
>be airborne
>secure your objective
>follow up forces fail to relieve you
>low on everything but an angry enemy operating within their own AO
>get BTFO because no support could reach you
A tale as old as the parachute infantry itself.
they didn't secure anything because the airport and runway was destroyed on the first day and they had to retreat to the woods on the second day. They returned on the 3rd day once the support collumn showed up. They couldn't land helicopters at the airport during these 3 days either due to the fire, the waves after the first landings all landed outside the airport in the woods.
probably dumb question but couldnt an airpost still be useful for helicopters even if runways are damaged?
How many tanks can you fit in your helicopter anon?
Not even tanks. Compare the capacity of an IL-76 with helicopters: a Mi-8 helicopter can carry about 20-24 troops while an IL-76 can easily do 5x more troops. Getting personnel in via dozens of helicopters, even with attack helicopters acting as escorts, is very dangerous, hence quite a number of them got fricked over with MANPADs. You'd need to do use like hundreds of helicopters going back and forth to move personnel to try and replace a runway getting IL-76s landing with stuff.
I think what's particularly repugnant about this guy is that he's a coward. When Russia started crumbling in Kharkiv in the fall of 2022 he went offline and said "akshually I'm not interested in dispensing my commentary anymore I have other things to do". Then when Russia went back on the offensive in Bakhmut he reactivated his account.
>that corpse hanging off the bmp
kek, if I didn't know this war, I'd say it's staged
>bmp
oh come on
Aren't BMDs extinct nowadays? People might as well forget their existence entirely.
jesus christ, it's been two years and you /k/opers still believe ukrainian version of events? vdv took the airport with almost no resistance, they were there, sporadically mortared by ukrainians, until they connected with main russian forces. there are hours of vide footage confirming all this, including a cnn broadcast, while all the talk about repelling them and shit comes from interviews with a couple of literally who ukrainian soldiers. you're laughable.
bait.
Still kind of strange to see that happening on a somewhat modern looking European street.
Usually we only see corpses and wrecked Soviet hardware littering the streets in some African shithole or the sandbox.
Yes, it definitely failed successfully.
>"They'll add gays, women and Black folk and make everything about some homosexual emotional struggles"
Do...do you even know who Nolan and Mendes are?
Specifically Nolan, the guy who's constantly criticized for "not having enough women or romance" in his films?