I was starting to think they'd shelved it and were going to scrap the idea but I guess I've been proven wrong.
https://x.com/palmettoarmory/status/1746940957403037752?s=20
Palmetto State Armory hasn't abandoned the project just yet, thank goodness
STG-44 begins production - so I guess PSA didn't forget after all.
for what purpose
Post your 8 identical ARs
Good, that might mean their other, simpler WWII/Battlefield line guns aren't too far behind
Kek
Very nice
Witnessed
Perfect.
Gotteem
Gotem
nice
Hurrr durrrr.
First, it is ALWAYS good to have a back up. Second, they aren't identical. I use similar weapons because then your muscle memory and knowledge of the manual of arms transfers over. Getting multiple wildly different weapons is completely inefficient. If you're buying expensive toys, sure, go ahead, but those of us who plan to seriously use ours aren't going to do that because it is moronic.
Different use cases call for different set ups. It is good to use similar parts but also important, although not necessary to have some variety. Hence I have an SBR for CWC, home defense, and the truck, a mid-length for more general use (always trade offs to consider) and a longer set up as a DMR. These call for variations, but again, most parts staying the same enhances efficiency, and this is exactly what the military does. Arguably, you could go for an AR-10 for a DMR, but honestly it probably isn't worth it. 5.56mm has all the range you are likely to ever need and is generally more efficient in terms of weight, cost, etc.
But sure, if you want toys, go get them. Just don't expect them to do anything if SHTF, and you'll be wishing you had spent that money on NODs, ammo, armor, etc.
words words words
It ain't all about you, buddy. Nobody asked.
Damn, it's really this easy to get (You)s?
i had funny meme and wanted an excuse to share it
>Getting multiple wildly different weapons is completely inefficient
Of course. It's fun tough. Not that you would understand that.
>min-maxing IRL
your NVGs are no match for the power of weaponized balls of light
get blinded, nerd
anon you only need two AR's, a short one and a long one, the long one preferably being an ar10.
more than that is just dumb. there's too many other cool guns to buy than to just keep buying ARs
>Tell me how you have guns but no funs with as extremely long sentences as possible.
>Wailing Wall of Cope, the text
Excellent bait anon, very nice
i love her
Upselling to Eurochattel reenactors. And Star Wars fanatics wanting to retrofit the Hoth Rebels' blaster (Boomers in their Indian Summer primarily). And historical/engineer nerds being this is the first modern looking intermediate caliber piece.
>Peyronie's-44
>NOT a 50+yo beat up mil-surp (like say, G3 or FAL)
New production G3s (and Century CETME kits) with the wood furniture ought to have better historical and functionality cachet than this range toy presumably in 8mm Kurz unobtainium, which is the real cash cow in this if PSA starts producing it.
to style on them hoes
cool
Gem
>"first production runs are getting off the line"
>hard ETA not confirmed, testing still continuing, "sometime in 2024" estimated
That's not how psa testing goes. It goes like this
>First production alpha test released
>Customers report back
>Gen 2 beta test released
>Customers report back
>Repeat beta testing.
How long till someone tries to modernize it and complains about the ergonomics? Like with a red dot, IR laser, light, and suppressor.
>How long till someone tries to modernize it
The morons at HMG already did that before they went broke.
lmao all they had to do was to make it in a single caliber instead of all this moronic shit. If I do decide to get one it will be in 7.62x39 or 5.56
Isn't this precisely the same project though? Everything seems to be in the exact same place.
It is.
Depending on the kind of feed ramp, it may have issues with 5.56 or x39
Real ones have the recoil spring in the buttstock, not contained in the receiver. They don't have a cutout in the receiver so you can do le ebin HK slap with them either. This shit stick has about as much in common with an STG-44 as a 10/22 slapped in a stock kit has with an M1 Carbine.
The stock on the PSA-STG looks fixed, so it probably has one.
Yeah. Everyone just want a cheap STG that isn't in 22lr that could have been made in WWII Germany if they weren't in such a rush to make them. What do we think PSA's initial price will be?
2 grand is my guess.
They said at the 2023 shotshow that the price was probably going to be around 1600-1900
>1600
1600 would break the internet if they actually got it that low using their PSA magic. It would be approaching the price of a JAKL after a few years…
Thats if anyone buys them. Theres definitely a market for STG "clones" but the fact people are being autistic about "the lines dont match up" and most PSA fans being poor it might not sell as good as they hope. You see it all the fricking time with reproductions of old designs, those dudes who made reproductions of the Luger but had to price it at something like $3k because that's the price it had to be for it to be worth it for them to make. They only sold like a few dozen of them every year after the first release because people are poor as frick and don't understand that things have to cost a certain amount to make a comfy profit with inclusion of material, tooling, labor, etc.
Basically, people say they want it and are all hyped for it to release but i shit you not only 1% or less who are saying they're going to buy it, actually will. Apparently when people end up having to cough up the cash they go on about pointing out all the "issues" with the product as if they had the money to purchase it in the first place.
>hey only sold like a few dozen of them every year after the first release because people are poor as frick
Nah pretty sure it was because their not-lugers cost as much as a nice real one. If someone wanted a shooter they'd pay less. The STG wont have that problem since they are unobtanium for most people.
Yea the STG is vastly different because there's only a couple other options.
>Kit build (good luck)
>The PTR-44 (good fricking luck)
>Genuine transferable/ sample STG-44 (lol)
My point in that wasnt specifically about the Luger and all the varying factors that go with it but that people are poor and there's a load group of these poorgays that say "me want this me want this" and companies listen then when it comes doen to it, "oh I aint paying that lol". Happens all the time and it'll 100% keep happening forever and ever.
I've done this with KommandoStore pre-orders
I won't stop
good, may their stocks of premium chinkoid reproductions rot in hell
What kommandostore are you going to? shit's tight.
>a load group of these poorgays that say "me want this me want this" and companies listen then when it comes doen to it, "oh I aint paying that lol". Happens all the time and it'll 100% keep happening forever and ever.
True but any company that's been around for more than five minutes learns that lesson. IDK how many PSA expects to sell. For all I know its a passion project and the owner just wants to see it done. But I'm confident they know that the same people buying their cheapest ARs aren't going to buy this. I do have the cash for one, but I'm not going to just throw my money at it. I'll wait and check reviews before making a move. Usually gen 1 PSA products have problems.
2500 base model 3k upper spec stuff, low production numbers won't have the economy of scale with something like the JAKL, which uses a lot of parts that they already make.
>2500 for base model
Okay this thing is going to sell like dog shit.
when did they say this?
I think that's just his guess. They should know better than to price this thing at $2k<, it will not fricking sell for shit.
>2500 base model
Lmfao that's way too expensive for the casual history buff and the actual history buffs will notice the glaring compromises they made in the design. This rifle appeals to no one.
They sell their POS retro series ARs for twice as much as they're worth and they can't keep the things in stock, I have no reason to believe these won't be the same
What year do you think we're in that 2500 is a lot for that? I still think it's a pile, but let's not pretend blind boomers won't reverse mortgage their condo for one
2500 is a lot for an imitation. I predict they'll make their money back so their equipment that makes specialty parts will pay themselves off but it's hardly going to be a money printer. Their Krinkovs are gonna make 50x more money than the STG clone and that barely has any unique parts that they can't get off the existing AK assembly line so that's almost pure profit out of nothing.
I doubt the HMG buyout cost JJE anything in the grand scheme of things.
It's basically a MKb 42 internally with a short bolt carrier and wienering handle attached to the gas piston. That fat homosexual from HMG claims the tail on a StG 44 bolt carrier that engages the recoil spring makes it a machine gun but the reality is that it was probably just easier to make the earlier style bolt and bolt carrier.
Wolfenstein looking pretty mid these days
that 7.62x39 stg clone looks moronic and I LOVE IT AAAAAAAA
Absolute coal.
I can accept modern AR 15 mags; if you used waffle mags they might look nice, but those stocks are cowadooty tier.
This is likely to happen immediately. /arg/ gays will not be able to handle having a gun that cant annihilate 400 Black folk a second from 200 yards away. Then also regardless of how expensive it is they'll say you're poor for getting it
Sounds like a whole lotta cope for being a no-fun mongoloid. Get a few different guns and you can still practice with the one you plan on using seriously more often.
Already planning on finding a way to mount a surefire, peq-15, and eotech unironically. just not sure if I want the .300blk, or 5.56.... either way it's getting a suppressor
just bear in mind that it'll be a heavy gun even without all the stuff you plan on slapping onto it.
It'll just be a terrible g3
Remember when they claimed they were doing an MP5 clone for like 2 or 3 years of SHOT?
Those at least tanked because they couldn't compete with turk clones and their collapsing economy
It’s shit and doesn’t look like a real STG. Perfect slop for the modern American gunkopop consoomer.
.... because it's not finished lol
>in development for a decade
>i-it’s not f-finished
*slow clap*
You might as well just admit you're from another website if you're gonna RP in the thread
How do you need to develop a gun that already exists?
Because you’re a moronic vaporware manufacturer that scammed PSA into buying your disaster project
Do you have some 80 year old tooling laying around?
Just paint it dark gray moron
>yet another vaporware stg44 repro with a G3 FCG
Damn that thing is hideous and looks nothing like an STG-44.
I'm not a WW2 firearms expert or anything but I can't see any major differences between them besides the color.
The lower is the worst of it. They cut corners like crazy there and didn't even try to duplicate the original's appearance. There's other more subtle things that would probably stick out like a sore thumb to someone who knows STGs better but the halfassed lower and the goofy multi-caliber shit were enough to turn me off completely.
>This cheap clone is a cheap clone
And?
>cheap
We don’t even know the price point yet. Most people are guessing around $1.5k
Oh no they
>made the safety more functional
>used less rivets
>changed the curve of the trigger guard
>slightly fatter trigger
Are these honestly your biggest complaints? Yes it's not "authentic" because they want to make something that is generally reliable by 2024 standards and is capable of lasting more than a thousands of rounds. Most actual STGs produced had a bunch of issues.
As I understand it, the O.G STGs were jam-o-matics.
Yep that was my point. Honestly isn't surprising either. They were fighting and losing a two front war, were incredibly resource constrained, and this was a first of it's kind rifle. There were bound to be issues. Add in German autism and you'll end up with some incredible rifles if everything is perfect, but few were.
They weren't you moronic Black folk.
And none of the functional improvements stopped them from getting the basic stamping pattern right.
People buying a luxury STG44 clone don't want a more functional gun, they want an accurate replica.
>they want an accurate replica.
Does that include the consistent jams and mag issues? We want it authentic after all.
Black person it's PSA. Getting 95% of the way there is their game. These will be like $2k and that doesn't price out a ton of people. If you're paying $5k+ for the HMG ones or the $10k FG42 replicas then yeah, I expect it to be authentic. These aren't that.
This is the HMG one moron. They went under and PSA bought them out.
No shit. But you aren't paying over $5k for a "custom" rifle. It's a mass production replica with some minor tweaks for convenience. Rather than talk in circles why don't you answer these
>Does that include the consistent jams and mag issues? We want it authentic after all.
>Are these honestly your biggest complaints?
I'm going to assume no and yes because we both know you won't answer honestly
People looking for anything nice don't ever have PSA in their URL. It's GB, GA, and RIA.
>Yes it's not "authentic" because they want to make something that is generally reliable by 2024 standards and is capable of lasting more than a thousands of rounds.
Do you think the deficiencies in the STG were because of the shape of its firing selector, curvature of the trigger guard, trigger shape etc. etc? No, it was because of their construction by unskilled workers in literal slave conditions using whatever materials they had since the Allies were bombing their industry back into the stone age. Take a guess what conditions PSA isn't going to be operating under.
The rivets legitimately could be a deficiency. You didn't answer the question. Are those the biggest complaints?
>psa
>lasting more than couple thousands of rounds
geeeeg
homie please
This is an AK guy testing PSA ARs and AKs and he thinks there are no issues
they mad because they know rob shoots more rounds through a psa then they will shoot in their life
"I can't believe it, the people wanting a reproduction aren't happy about the reproduction not being near an actual reproduction"
The people who are mad about it aren't buying it. There are tons of people legitimately excited about a close enough replica in a real caliber
>There are tons of people legitimately excited about a close enough replica in a real caliber
[citation needed]
There being a lot of people who are interested enough in an STG repro to drop ~$2k on it but casual enough to not be put off by glaring inaccuracies seems like a very niche group.
Well I'm sure you know better than the company that's taking all the risk, so I guess it's their loss.
Are you actually implying companies don't make laughable frickups all the time? If this were 2010 and I said that USFA stopping production on their renowned SAA repros so the owner could divert everything to his blatantly moronic ZipGun idea, would you say I couldn't comment on how stupid a move that would be because I wasn't the company taking the risk?
PSA would have a perfectly reasonable gauge of demand when they learned of whatever HMG's preorder numbers were. It would be illogical to believe, were the market as negligible as you seem to claim, that they would bother with the project. Furthermore, to compare a wildly successful company buying out an extant project with an extremely niche company leveraging their entire future on a foray into an completely different market is simply absurd.
I do not believe for a second that PSA is entering into some ridiculous boondoggle.
Look at their H&R sales. They are selling repro M16A2s for $1200. Those are successfully selling in large numbers. So much so a lot are out of stock. PSA's customer bases isn't just "the poors" like everyone claims. For example the Rock might be the best 5.7 handgun out there even if it is also the cheapest. $2k isn't that much for a lot of people.
nta but comparing an AR15 clone to a pseudo-clone of a 80 year old WWII rifle seems a bit of a stretch...$1200 isn't really that much either.
>pseudo-clone
Again, what's so wrong with it? I said on Monday
>Oh no they
>>made the safety more functional
>>used less rivets
the curve of the trigger guard
fatter trigger
Is that honestly so bad?
>$1200 isn't really that much either.
No it isn't but how many people already have basically a A2? Or 6 different ARs already? Why would someone be willing to buy another AR for $2000 but completely scoff at the idea of $2000 on a unique reproduction (with a few minor changes)? Yeah it's not for everyone, but a lot of people would like it.
You're typically arguing with autists who are mentally incapable of understanding any thoughts outside their own. Let them whip themselves into an aneurysm trying to force their newest tortanic, they can't understand anything more.
not to mention legally they're forced to make the trigger / grip housing substantially different due to NFA reasons. While they were forced to make changes they went ahead and put a cousin trigger system in there with the G3 triggers, which makes perfect sense. People are such homos
>The people who are mad about it aren't buying it.
Well, fricking obviously anon.
>There are tons of people legitimately excited about a close enough replica in a real caliber
I don't disagree, there are plenty of Funko Pop collectors... I mean, "gun enthusiasts" who will throw their money at anything. Good on PSA for making money at least.
>a funko pop analogy
>The lower is the worst of it.
It really is, but here's the thing. IF they sell enough of these (and I have my doubts, but IF), that will create the market for a cosmetically correct trigger group as an aftermarket part. Most PSA buyers won't care, but if you send Ian one to make a video on, some significant fraction will. And once they're already >$1500 deep on the gun, spending an extra $300 or so on the latest accessory is a lot easier sell.
To use HK-compatible FCG parts that are already in production, instead of either accurately cloning the original FCG, or designing a new one to fit the original layout, and either way making a bunch of model-specific FCG parts.
>that will create the market for a cosmetically correct trigger group as an aftermarket part
that is actually a hope of mine. We saw the lack of yugo ak furniture for years and now we're seeing a significant increase.
Even if its some small dinky shop making a hundred of them a month like those guys who make M16A1 wood stocks, thats pretty good for us
Damn, I was kinda excited, but this is just gnarly.
>cheaped out and used the G3/MP5 selector and trigger
>0 effort spent making it look like the actual part
Looks like a Wish knockoff.
I couldn’t care less. Still going to buy. PSA is still awesome. You’re not smart
It looks completely fine.
I thought the lower looked fat and a bit too much a kubelwagen. That's quite disappointing.
If I order one STG-44, do I get four of them?
https://twitter.com/palmettoarmory/status/1657117080846585877
Holy shit lol. I wish I could have this happen with Leupold scopes...
>did they really have to label the firing modes in English??
This bugs the frick out of me in any repro.
>but we HAVE TO make it in English
Why? It's a fricking repro of a foreign gun!
>>but we HAVE TO make it in English
I want mine to say "Peace in our time" and "BLITZKRIEG"
If they do custom engraving I am copying you
I look forward to seeing all the farb reenactors show up to events with these.
I’m more worried about 3/4s of reenactors being comically obese than weapons at this point.
It's missing that something something that made the original StG-44 so hot. Also, did they really have to label the firing modes in English?? That's such a turn off. God.
I'm genuinely excited for a non-AR/AK.
And I don't think it's ugly at all.
I want to get one, maybe in 5.56 for easy ammo, and see what it's about.
It could be comfy.
It's a long-stroke tilting bolt gun. Must feel really fun to shoot
That something something it's lacking are all the little details gunsoomers insist are meaningless because it kinda sorta looks like an StG from 10 feet away.
Convince the gunsoomers that your details are meaningful by explaining the functional merit they provide for the rifle.
An STG without full-auto is just a very unreliable rifle.
Will they come with rails and knockoff ZF4s?
Any gun can have rails if the buyer really wants it to
i totally understand why they made the choices they did, but still wish it was just a true clone--warts and all--in the original caliber
They have to make it a fraction of the price somehow. As long as they don't completely change how the gun functions when they simplify it, then I am happy. Less rivets is a small price to pay for a legit STG
Having all the features and proper lines and shit (at least a majority of that) is understandable to anyone but like do you fricking seriously think, from a business stand-point, it would be worth it to produce the shit in motherfricking 8mm Kurtz? People are fricking b***hing and moaning about not wanting to buy their Krink clone on 5.45 because it's "too expensive" imagine how'd they feel about 8mm Kurtz kek
>People are fricking b***hing and moaning about not wanting to buy their Krink clone on 5.45 because it's "too expensive
Literally no one did that in that thread gaslighting moron. It was just the opposite, people saying they'd wait for 5.45 then boogtard morons cried about how that was stupid and 5.56 was better.
Tldr lying ass. The buttholes butthole.
5.56 is better but man I would kill for a 5.45 gun. The calibers are pretty much the same as far as I'm concerned.
> I would kill for a 5.45 gun.
Then get one? They're out there, and no one's buying them because 5.45 is turbofricked and costs as much as .308
the answer is a four letter word that starts with p and ends with r
penisr?
> It was just the opposite, people saying they'd wait for 5.45 then boogtard morons cried about how that was stupid and 5.56 was better.
lmfao you absolute woman, right out of the gate of that shitshow thread it was purists scoffing at the 5.56 version even existing and not getting why anyone would want it, being told why, and then sperging out. we have archives now you know, anyone can check;
https://desuarchive.org/k/thread/60639770/#60660390
were you that homosexual who said XTAC was on par with tulammo and then swore he didn't after getting gangbanged?
Holy shit that is one of the worst threads I've seen in a while, Jesus
my favorite part was that the poster(s) insisting that the point of AKs is to shoot slavshit ammo and wanting 5.45 AKs in 5.56 makes you a poor/boogtard didn't once post evidence that they owned 5.45 AKs lmfao
They may have had AKs in 5.45 at one point, but like most people I know who had them, offloaded them once the 7n6 ban went into effect. It was pretty much over for 5.45 then.
No one said that XTAC was as low quality as shitcase you sperg, the argument was purely about ammo prices. Cheap = Low cost.
heyyyy it's the illiterate caveman again! you ever contact your english teachers to let them know how hard they fricked you over?
>No one said that XTAC was as low quality as shitcase you sperg
????
Post guns
What?
Okay so you're new
My guy what is your damage?
People who talk about things they know nothing about.
I have literally dozens of guns and have been here for over a decade. Even if none of that was true, or even if I proved it was, how would that have any bearing on me pointing out that someone did directly imply that XTAC was in the same tier as Tula?
No one said that and the homosexual you think said it didnt mean to say they're the same quality, they're just both cheap crappy ammo. Everyone and their mother knows that Tulammo is some of the lowest quality ammo probably ever.
>No one said that
I...I just posted someone who did. He literally says "Tula is cheap dogshit ammo just like PMC X-TAC." How can you even say that that doesn't mean what it says?
>and the homosexual you think said it didnt mean to say they're the same quality
But he did. And how do you know what he meant?
There was 3 of us literally telling you M193 pattern ammo is way better quality than Tulammo and I'm sure that moron was one of them. You just ignored that because you wanted to win le epic internet argument. Grow up.
How do you know any of this? From the number of posters to my motives?
Because I was one of the morons telling you the XTAC is cheap ammo but because it's M193 that puts it leagues above Tula. I was one then I saw 2 replies back to back calling you moronic so I'm assuming there was 3 of us that thought you were illiterate.
I wasn't in that thread, anon.
>homosexual you think said it didnt mean to say they're the same quality, they're just both cheap crappy ammo
How would you know what that homosexual meant unless you are that homosexual? You are, we know you are, and holy shit you are dumb.
the archived thread should've been enough for you to see he's unironically moronic.
Oh hey it's the moron that called them both dogshit and then acted like that doesn't mean they are the same. Hi moron
>verification not required
Fricking liar.
D-K Production has STG-44 receiver flats and parts made by Sport-System Dittrich if you want a true clone in 8mm Kurtz. They are very nice but priced accordingly. It was almost $1300 for a bolt and bolt carrier assembly when I checked awhile back.
Who does this appeal to? Collectors or anyone into WW2 historical guns wont be interested because it barely even looks like an STG 44. PSA's usual customer base (broke Black folk and newguns) won't be interested because it will almost certainly cost more than $400. Might as well get one of those shitty .22 STG 44s. It'll scratch the itch for an STG 44 shaped object as much as this one will and be much cheaper to shoot.
I think you severely underestimate the number of 20-30-something WW2 nerds who can't afford to buy an actual repro and want something to larp with.
GSG makes a MP40s and they’ve had plenty of success despite not being an exact replica.
>it barely even looks like an STG 44
Why the frick do people keep saying this it looks exactly the same besides the straight magwell and less rivets. Do you want a 5.56 STG you can afford or not?
Why does it matter that it shoots 5.56 instead of .22 if neither are authentic? .22 is still way cheaper.
Because one is an actual rifle and the others a plinker? Do you not understand why someone would want an actual rifle and not a toy?
This thing is absolutely unequivocally a toy, so yes I struggle to see the distinction.
Then there's no point in continuing with you any further, buy and enjoy the GSG .22lr model since it's better for (You).
post your 10/22 body kits
Because one is a real intermediate rifle caliber which is the same concept as the original and one is a .22. Also with it in 5.56 you can do a barrel swap to .300 blackout and get basically 8mm kurz.
Man, I just CANNOT understand why someone would want something in an actual rifle caliber over a .22lr. It's just so crazy that someone wouldnt just buy the .22lr and be happy with it! Gee wiz, I just don't understand. I have an AR in .22lr and an AK in .22lr and theyre just as good as rral ones at fraction of the cost! Why would people spend more for bigger bullets when little bullet is still a bullet!?
Some people rather b***h and moan and not have anything at all, it's a very immature mindset.
>I can't enjoy this so neither can you!
The criticism is deserved though. Hopefully if the first fee batches PSA releases sell pretty good they'll come out with another variant that is a true clone seeing that their customers want it THAT bad.
Also Black person look at everything. The mag, the furniture, the receiver, the controls, it's all totally wrong. I know it's not meant to be a "clone" or even a faithful replica, but there needs to be something it offers in terms of additional authenticity that those GSG .22 ones don't and I don't see it.
Okay if you care so much and you genuinely were going to drop the money on The PSA cope STG if it looked clone accurate then post your GSG .22lr right now. Obviously if you have the money to buy the cope STG you'd have the money to purchase the "athenticity" of the GSG .22 model and bought it, so lets fricking see it.
Average PSA owner logic.
Yeah I thought so.
Not the same poster, but .22 is a b***h's round good for varmint and cheap plinking and not much else.
This anon understands.
And it's cheap. Plentiful. Allows you to fire more rounds. You get more practice in with it and finally, it is still deadly.
>b-b-but muh stopping power
Meme. I'm not saying carry a .22 handgun or anything, just saying the .22 is a good all rounder round.
are you going to fight the government with your 10/22? lol
Are YOU going to fight the government big man
I shall do it the Aum Shinrikyo way
if things ever went the way of a civil war you can bet there'd be chemical warfare lol
Do they have a takedown model?
Do you actually not understand the appeal of a rifle being in a rifle caliber and not a .22lr in a shell?
I know that you're probably single, so let me explain why that is.
>SIZE DOES MATTER.
Nobody wants a dinky little .22.
It's gotta be at least a intermediate (one could say "average") sized cartridge before anyone is REALLY interested.
For me? It's the giant tacky logo.
That logo is fricking awful and I hate them for putting that shit on there like it's some cheap piece of shit RIA 1911 or something.
I am just going to cover it anyway
BASED
what are they supposed to put the reichstatdler there instead?
This is my own gripe with the gun, the logo should be underneath or something
>not meant to be a "clone" or even a faithful replica
What the frick is the point then?
The other anon worded it well - gunkopop consoomers. The people buying this will be mostly Tiktok users watching tiktok prostitutes posting wojaks inbetween tittyshots
The only reason people want the STG-44 is for the aesthetics.
Because it is worse than ARs or AKs in everything.
Remove the aesthetic part and you have a piece of poop.
>it looks exactly the same
Are you unironically blind?
>Do you want a 5.56 STG you can afford or not?
If it looks wrong?
No.
Samegay
Try again
Ok I was wrong. There are just two morons saying similar things at similar times.
there definitely is a market
suppose I want a somewhat vintage looking military style rifle that's NOT a 50+yo beat up mil-surp (like say, G3 or FAL)
what can I buy?
AK? AR with wooden grips?
production workaround
it's one thing to make reproductions of machined gun and whole another thing to make reproduction of a stamped gun
they could have made 100% accurate copy and then nobody who might wanted it could not afford it
>suppose I want a somewhat vintage looking military style rifle that's NOT a 50+yo beat up mil-surp (like say, G3 or FAL)
>what can I buy?
...A new production PTR that isn't "beat up surplus"?
>it barley even looks like an stg
You should have a nice day how honesty.
I will use this as my primary rifle.
I will use this for home defense.
I will use this for competition.
I will use this for hunting.
I will use this for SHTF.
What I'm understanding so far is that this is a far cry from a 1 to 1 replica, it will be cost prohibitive for their customer base, and without being full-auto it doesn't maximize it's already limited potential usage.
Even so, pic related.
Should've left HMG to die on their own merits.
/msg/ homies be like "no it's not an AUTHENTIC repro because it doesn't use a 4x4 canted gas operated dodecahedron, it's like calling a chevy a porsche!"
you don't understand, if the trigger group (which is different anyway because this is SA only) isn't needlessly complex and prone to failure it's literally the same as a hi point
Alright, then change the handguard so you have less overheating issues.
Change the locking system so the gun can be lighter.
Switch out the gas block connector so the barrel can be free floated.
Drop the wood stock for practicality.
Yes, they already sell that.
That piece of shit "entered production" in 2016 and I hope that lard man mac is no longer involved in any capacity
Something looks off.
Why is there a huge plate above the trigger?
The sizes don't match.
>don't measure same thing
>don't get the same outcome
who could have thunk
Well that's a comparison of the 7.62x39 model (takes x39 AR mags) so a different caliber one might have a different magwell but what REALLY bugs me is that the selector is all the way up there despite the grip panel being cut out for the selector as in the original.
The HMG/PSA gun is bigger than an original. They scaled it up to handle larger and higher pressure rounds than 8mm K.
I only care about this because its an inroad to silliness like x39 or 556 reproduction SVTs and other uncommon firearms where they can hide the mechanical differences under the wood
>but just buy an sks if you want that!
Rule of cool reigns supreme. We’ll never see a repro garand though because the CMP is impossible to beat for a refurbished gun with new production barrels at a $700-$1k price point when msrp of a whole new garand would probably be $2k+
rule of cool does indeed reign supreme. If there's one gun I want PSA to make after this it's an AS VAL in .300 Blackout
>.300 Blackout
you mean 9x43, right?
Didn't tromix make a 9mm version of .458 SOCOM? What's the case capacity on that and is it comparable to Soviet 9mm spooky
An SVT in 5.56 would be max sex
I will always be fascinated at how current years westerners are unable to reproduce properly what our ancestors did in the past with very little.
Nazi Germany was under an embargo from pretty much the whole world, was severely lacking everything, including steel. Its workers were uneducated, and worked on manually operated mills, lathes and stamping machines. And despite being invaded by the Soviet Union on one side, and the allies on the other side, they still managed to produce hundreds of thousands of STG44s.
Fast forward nowadays, it's 2024 and highly educated American workers with CNC milling machines can't figure out how the frick to mass produce the same rifle, or even how to make a single one that works properly.
Really activates the almonds.
The issue modern manufacturing is they could be using that CNC for something else that is more profitable. That’s ultimately what it comes down to most of the time in the “lost technology” scenarios. You don’t have the soviet union and the allies attacking you, so you don’t have the pressure to make STG44s so instead you can make doodads and widgets for more profit. Mass manufacturing on manual machines involved throwing a lot of mills set up to do one or two operations at the problem when CNC machines are more flexible. It may seem counterintuitive, but that flexibility means they can respond to market demands that aren’t the STG44.
The question isn’t “can I do it”, it’s “can I do something else instead that makes me more money”.
such is the unfortunate nature of capitalism. A necessary evil that means cool stuff won't be manufactured when something else exists that's more profitable to make.
>they still managed to produce hundreds of thousands of STG44s.
Because they wanted to and had their entire economy focused on the war. This isn't a matter of can't. It's a matter of not wanting to at a price point that isn't profitable.
Also people get pretty efficient when their lives are threatened.
trying to compare a desperate stamping power house to a few guys with a CNC mill... ok
It's not that they can't make it. They have to make it at a profit.
in terms of design how would the STG-44 compare to an AK? Was the bolt design of it a dead end?
If HK got the G3, chambered in 7.92×33mm Kurz.
Modified a few parts cosmetically.
Wouldn't it become a STG-44?
>wouldn't it become a STG-44?
You are taking what the STG became and reversing all the changes so you could get it close to an STG. The problem is that while you may get it to look about the same, the internals are nothing alike. It would not feel snappy and jumpy like a Stg-44
>It would not feel snappy and jumpy like a Stg-44
Implying he has one STG-44
Take your meds.
If the ship Theseus used to sail to Crete was repaired over and over throughout the years, such that every last piece of wood had been replaced at some time or another, would it still be the original ship? If not, when did it change?
Sorry, I accidentally wandered in here from PrepHole looking for ancient/medieval weapons threads. Remember to start with the Greeks!
>when did it change
When Theseus left.
>After Virtue
A good book up until chapter 10 when MacIntyre tries to proscribe a solution the social failings he accurately described previously. He fails because after all that fanfare he sort of lamely resorts to Platonic essentialism, defaulting to Rousseauian "oh well people will just know when the right has been done".
If you want a virtue ethics that's NOT going to fall on it's face when going up against Nietzsche's arguments your only real choice is Objectivism. It's that or giving up and joining a monastery.
>roller delayed blowback
No.
No, you'd get the StG-45.
So when you buy this you get put on an extra list?
>reproducing nazi guns
disgusting
Nazi science got us to the moon lol
What are you so offended about? I'm israeli and this is a W. I hope more cool Nazi guns come back
She's a little chubby above the pistol grip but I have high hopes about what I am seeing so far
>WHAT? You’re not seething? You’re not pissing and shitting on the floor? You’re not sperging because the trigger is different? You’re going to enjoy and have fun with it instead of seething over small differences
>no left side mag release button like the original
If it's not full auto, then it's already not going to be like the original
This has to be what bugs me the most about their reproduction. I don't mind the trigger pack ridges being a little off, I can understand that. And on some level I can understand why they altered the magazine release and mags themselves, but frick me I hate it.
I understand if you hate it, but I'm not gonna butt frick you
>likely $2000 price tag for a half-assed repro that doesn't even look right when viewed up close
I love the stg44 but this HMG/PSA repro is pure fricking dogshit. I'd excuse the gun not looking right if it only cost $600 or less, but this thing is probably going to be nearly $2000 which is fricking outrageous for what they're giving you
>2000 bucks for a half assed repro that can be shot to shit
or
>8000 dollar PTR 44 that will break and costs 8000 fricking dollars
What do you people want
all I want is for the $2000 gun to look *mostly* right to where it isn't immediately obvious that it's a repro when you pick it up.
>can be shot to shit
this is the HMG clowns who went bankrupt and PSA we're talking about, these were never going to be reliable even with the nigged up fcg
>all I want is for the $2000 gun to look *mostly* right to where it isn't immediately obvious that it's a repro when you pick it up
Too bad!
>.t PSA Customer Service
Why is PTR fricking up this hard?
A STG clone? A half baked G41 clone?
Why not just make HK33's and HK53's? 5.56 MP5 not a good enough selling point???
An STG-44 I can afford. I don't know if this is it. Not like it matters, I will probably never buy one.
Break into a metal shop and stamp the sheet metal yourself.
https://www.machinegunboards.com/forums/index.php?/topic/27405-converting-full-auto-trigger-group-to-semi-bar-1918a2/
Ohio makes them nowadays.
>they are still arguing about ammo itt
More PSA garbage. Not beta testing for years only for them to never get it right and charge too much.
I might actually get one. The only thing is the caliber.
>5.56
>7.62
>.300 Blackout
If they had it in grendel or Valkyrie I would pre order tonight.
While I won't be buying it, my hope is that if it's released in 8x33 Kurz, it will give the cartridge a new chance at life that it was robbed of when the war ended. Would be neat to see other manufacturers make some rifles chambering 8x33 if it takes off. Also, if this thread is still up, I can post some wartime reliability tests run by the Wehrmacht on the StG44 during the war when I get home if there's interest.
Didn’t they already announce that it was coming in 8mmK? The Hill and Mac company’s site said they did back in the day
What niche does it fill, or does better, that the current selection of calibers do not?
Being cute.
>I can post some wartime reliability tests run by the Wehrmacht on the StG44 during the war when I get home if there's interest.
I am very interested.
As to reviving 8mm kurz, I mean yes it would be neat but why? I think it would be cool because it's semi unique and the history behind it but in terms of "being robbed" what can it do that 7.62x39 or .300 blackout cant? You can exactly mimic the performance (or exceed) with those two rounds.
>I am very interested.
Here comes the info dump.
Here's your Dragunov clone.
What do you mean it's not the same thing? Quit sperging out over meaningless details!
>What do you mean it's not the same thing? Quit sperging out over meaningless details!
this but unironically
false equivalence
Serves the same purpose. Not spending 10k on an uber rare import dragunov.
>Serves the same purpose
So just the STG clone with a more functional safety and more practical caliber?
False equivalence. The PSA STG only differs in the trigger group and some minor details. The PSL is a completely different gun from the SVD.
I want it to sell well so PSA decides to invest in doing clone runs of more stamped guns. Honestly its the only chance any of us have of getting FAMASes.
this, I don't give two fricks about WW2 shit, but I'd love some 80s clones that I don't have to weld back together myself
Maybe if they come out with a version more true to the OG, way too many compromises for me to overlook. Shame.
I wanna just punch these stupid boomers and take their shit, they don't deserve to have such nice things.
Sorry you missed out, youngin'. Thanks for the social security! :^
Oh no that sucks.
watch out, some casual history buff who has only ever seen one in videogames and has no intention of ever buying PSA's abortion will accuse you of being too picky and autistic for not being satisfied
Are those pre 86 transferable MGs? I'm fricking mad that I'll never be able to afford a MG42 unless the NFA is abolished.
If originals extremely based. Owning history is the coolest part about surp imo.
Source for the following info dump is Hans Dieter Handrich's book "Sturmgewehr! From Firepower to Striking Power", it is a must read if you have any interest in the history and implementation of the StG44.
A Leutnant Dr. Werner Hahlweg led a series of trials in occupied Greece with 20 MP44s in July and August of 1944 as a part of an internal test by the Technisches Versuchskommando WaA/Versuchsgruppe Wapruf 2(Technical Test Dept of the WaA/Test group 2). The trials consisted of a mix of ERMA and Haenel manufactured MP44s.
Trial 1
>Dusting of the weapons without inserted magazines transported by vehicle:
>a) 2 within the vehicle
>b) 2 fastened outside the vehicle
>c) 2 carried on the vehicle's trailer
Date: July 31, 1944
Duration: 11:00-16:00h
Temperature: 35.2C
Ammo: 360 rounds PistPatr44
Type of Road: poorly maintained asphalt road and unpaved dirt road, 60km
Test firing: 5 rounds individual fire, 3 short bursts, rest sustained fire
Results of Trial 1
>Haenel 1444, slight fouling, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
>ERMA 4132, slight fouling, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
>Haenel 1516, medium fouling, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
>ERMA 4218, medium fouling, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
>Haenel 1103, heavy fouling, 60 rounds, jammed case, other flawless function
>ERMA 4032, heavy fouling, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
Trial 2
>Further dusting of weapons used in trial 1(not cleaned) with inserted magazines, plus 2 additional weapons
Date: August 1, 1944
Duration: 09.30h - 14.00h
Temperature: 34.5C
Type of Road: Unpaved dirt roads, 50km
Ammo: 480 Rounds PistPatr44
Test Firing: Same as Trial 1
Pics are some nice pics of early MP43/1s, not related to dump
Results of Trial 2
>Haenel 1444, slight fouling, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
>ERMA 4132, slight fouling, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
>Haenel 1516, medium fouling, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
>ERMA 4218, medium fouling, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
>Haenel 1103, heavy fouling, 60 rounds, shots 1-5 flawless, 6-7 bolt not locked, 8-60 malfunctions
>ERMA 4032, heavy fouling, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
>Haenel 2020, heavy fouling, 60 rounds, shots 2-3 stuck cases, 4-30 no malfunctions, 31-33 case not ejected, 34-60 no malfunctions
>ERMA 4170, heavy fouling, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
Trial 3
>a)further dusting of weapons used in Trials 1 & 2, weapons were stored thereafter
>b)Dusting of 2 additional weapons on vehicles with test firing after
Date: August 2, 1944
Duration: 09.30h-15.00h
Temperature: 30.1C
Ammo: 120 rounds PistPatr44
Road: Same as Trial 2
Test Firing: Same as Trials 1 & 2
Results of Trial 3
>Haenel 2196, heavy fouling, 60 rounds, shots 1-3 case not ejected, 4-30 no malfunctions (catridges slightly oiled), Magazine 2 no malfunctions (cartridges not oiled)
>ERMA 4373, heavy fouling, 60 rounds, shots 1-4 case not ejected, 5-30 no malfunctions (cartridges slightly oiled), Magazine 2 no malfunctions (cartridges not oiled)
>all other weapons stored
Trial 4
>Muddying of clean weapons
Date: August 2, 1944
Duration: 14.00h-16.00h
Temperature: 30.5C
Ammo: 270 rounds PistPatr44
Results of Trial 4
>Haenel 2425, heavy fouling(sprinkling of bolt parts with wet mud), 60 rounds, during the first 5 shots, motion of bolt impeded, cartridges not fed. After slight oiling of the sliding surface of the bolt, the mud loosened and further shots could be fired without malfunctions
>ERMA 4344, heavy fouling, 60 rounds, same as Haenel 2425
>Haenel 9160, slight fouling(sprinkling of receiver with wet mud in area of the bolt), 60 rounds, no malfunctions
>ERMA 4533, slight fouling, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
Trial 5
>Muddying of dusty weapons
Date: August 3, 1944
Duration: 14.00h-16.00h
Temperature: 32.4C
Ammo: 300 rounds PistPatr44
Results of Trial 5
>ERMA 4533, heavy fouling(sprinkling of bolt parts with wet mud), 60 rounds, no malfunctions in individual fire; hard bolt motion in burst fire
>Haenel 9929, heavy fouling, 60 rounds, same as ERMA 4533
>Haenel 9160, slight fouling(sprinkling of receiver with wet mud in area of the bolt), 60 rounds, bolt not comletely locked; after slight oiling, function was flawless
>ERMA 4344, slight fouling, 60 rounds, same as Haenel 9160
>Haenel 2425, slight fouling, 60 rounds, same as Haenel 9160
Trial 6
>a)Test firing of some of the stored weapons from Trial 3
>b)Fouling of these weapons with sand followed by test firing
>c)Sprinkling with water of the remaining stored weapons followed by test firing
Date: August 3, 1944
Duration: 14.00h-16.00h
Temperature: 32.4C
Ammo: 360 rounds PistPatr44
Results of Trial 6
>Haenel 1103, stored for 2 days after dustings of trial 3, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
>ERMA 4032, same as Haenel 1103, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
>Haenel 1103, after third firing test, weapon was sanded heavily(means lots of sand applied), and then test fired, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
>ERMA 4032, same as above, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
>ERMA 4170, stored for a day after trial 3, sprinkled with water, and then test fired, 60 rounds, after several loading motions by hand and lightly oiling, function was flawless
>Haenel 2020, same procedure as ERMA 4170, 60 rounds, Magazine 1 - hard bolt motion. Magazine 2 - weapon and cartridges slightly oiled, no malfunctions
Trial 7
>a)Dusting of weapons on vehicle with following firing test
>b)Sprinkling of water on weapons with following firing test
Date: August 7, 1944
Duration: 09.00h-15.00h
Temperature: 26.8C
Ammo: 510 rounds PistPatr44
Dusting: medium; wet dust which did not get too far into the weapon
Sprinkling: heavy
Road: Poorly maintained asphalt road, unpaved dirt road, 60km
Test firing: 5 rounds individual fire, 3 short bursts, rest sustained fire
Results of Trial 7
a)
>Haenel 9160, medium dusting, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
>Haenel 2425, medium dusting, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
>ERMA 4532, medium dusting, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
>ERMA 4218, medium dusting, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
b)
>Haenel 9160, heavy sprinkling, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
>Haenel 2425, heavy sprinkling, 60 rounds, individual fire no malfunctions; jamming of bolt in burst fire, no malfunctions after lightly oiling the sliding surface of bolt
>ERMA 4532, heavy sprinkling, 90 rounds, Magazine 1:faulty function of the bolt due to hard bolt motion. Magazine 2: After oiling of cartridges, 4 malfunctions of bolt. Magazine 3: After oiling of bolt, flawless function
>ERMA 4218, heavy sprinkling, 60 rounds, Magazine 1: individual fire no malfunctions; sustained fire not possible due to penetrated dust impeding bolt movement. Magazine 2: After slight oiling of bolt, flawless function
Trial 8
>a)Test firing of dusted weapons after 4 days of storage
>b)Sanding of weapons with following firing test
Date: August 8, 1944
Duration: 14.00h-16.00h
Temperature: 28.9C
Ammo: 840 rounds PistPatr44
Degree of dusting: slight, heavy
Test Firing: Same as Trial 7
Results of Trial 8
a)
>ERMA 4317, slight dusting, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
>Haenel 2394, slight dusting, 60 rounds, shot no 1: jammed case, otherwise flawless function
>Haenel 1444, heavy dusting, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
>ERMA 4373, heavy dusting, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
>ERMA 4132, heavy dusting, 60 rounds, Magazine 1: 4 misfires. Magazine 2: 4 misfires, otherwise flawless function
>Haenel 2196, heavy dusting, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
b)
>ERMA 4317, heavy sanding, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
>Haenel 2394, heavy sanding, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
>Haenel 1444, heavy sanding, 90 rounds, Magazine 1: shots 1-2 jammed case, burst fire: jammed cases, sustained fire: faulty. Magazine 2: shot no 2 jammed case, otherwise flawless function. Magazine 3: no malfunctions
>ERMA 4373, heavy sanding, 60 rounds, no malfunctions
>ERMA 4132, heavy sanding, 120 rounds, Magazine 1: 4 misfires due to hampered bolt motion. Magazine 2: 3 misfires due to stuck bolt. Magazine 3: shots 1-2 had misfire due to stuck bolt. After slight oiling, 3 jammed cases otherwise flawless function. Magazine 4: no malfunctions
>Haenel 2196, heavy sanding, 60 rounds, Magazine 1: bolt had to be moved several times back and forth by hand. Individual fire: hard bolt movement. Sustained fire: flawless function. Magazine 2: no malfunctions
Trial 9
>Fouling of weapons with mud and following firing test
Date: August 8, 1944
Duration: 14.00h-16.00h
Temperature: 28.9C
Ammo: 240 rounds PistPatr44
Degree of muddying: slight, heavy
Test Firing: 5 rounds individual fire, 3 short bursts, rest sustained fire
Results of Trial 9
>ERMA 4344, slight fouling(sprinkling of receiver with wet mud in area of bolt), 60 rounds, After 5 rounds of individual fire, bolt got stuck-sustained fire not possible. After oiling the bolt and moving it back and forth, flawless function
>Haenel 1629, heavy fouling(weapon dipped in mud), 90 rounds, Magazine 1: shots 1-3 flawless, shots 4-5 jammed case, bursts not possible. Despite oiling and moving bolt back and forth, faulty function. Magazine 2: 4 jammed cases. Magazine 3: Flawless function
>ERMA 4359, heavy fouling, 90 rounds, Magazine 1: Despite mud getting into the weapon through the open dust cover, first 5 shots fired without malfunction. Sustained fire not possible. After field stripping and a coarse cleaning, function still faulty. Magazine 2: 3 jammed cases. Magazine 3: Flawless function.
Trial 10
>Fouling of weapons with mud with following firing test
Date: August 11, 1944
Duration: 08.00h-10.00h
Temperature: 22.3C
Ammo: 270 rounds PistPatr44
Degree of fouling: Heavy, tough and pebbly mud
Test Firing: Same as Trial 9
Results of Trial 10
>ERMA 4373, heavy fouling, 60 rounds, Magazine 1: shots 1-3 flawless function, thereafter stuck bolt. After coarse cleaning of the bolt, flawless function.
>ERMA 4132, heavy fouling, 90 rounds, Magazine 1: shots 1-3 jammed case. After heavy oiling of bolt, flawless function.
>ERMA 4373, weapon dropped into mud puddle during marching, 60 rounds, Hampered bolt motion. After washing off the mud and oiling the bolt, flawless function.
Last of the dump, hope someone finds it interesting.
Trial 11
>Ordinary dirtying of weapons during combat exercises: 280km by vehicle and 80km by foot followed by firing test.
Date: August 8-18, 1944
Date of Firing: August 18, 1944, 16.30h-17.30h
Temperature: 30-35C
Ammo: 90 rounds PistPatr44 for each weapon
Degree of Fouling: Very Heavy
Results of Trial 11
>Haenel 1629, 90 rounds, no malfunctions
>ERMA 4359, 90 rounds, no malfunctions
>ERMA 4218, 90 rounds, no malfunctions
>Haenel 2394, 90 rounds, no malfunctions
>Haenel 1516, 90 rounds, no malfunctions
>Haenel 2196, 90 rounds, no malfunctions
>ERMA 4032, 90 rounds, no malfunctions
>ERMA 4373, 90 rounds, no malfunctions
>ERMA 4533, 90 rounds, no malfunctions
>ERMA 4344, 90 rounds, no malfunctions
>Haenel 9929, 90 rounds, no malfunctions
>Haenel 2425, 90 rounds, no malfunctions
>ERMA 4317, 90 rounds, wienering handle stuck. After wienering a second time, bolt not properly locked. After removing magazine and moving bolt back and forth several times, flawless function.
>Haenel 1444, 90 rounds, Individual fire flawless function. Burst no 1: Case not ejected. Burst No 2: Bolt does not move back, stuck case. Further malfunctions: After one shot, jammed case. After two further shots, cases not ejected. After moderate oiling of bolt and gas piston, flawless function.
>weapon dropped into mud puddle during marching
whoops
Let me know when they start making the cool shit.
Wake me when there’s a BAR (with easy shiggy diggy) run from a company that’s not trash. I demand 30.06 fun.
>this homie doesnt know about OOW BARs
rip little dude you didnt look close enough
I believe he's implying that OOW is trash