>stack C-RAM across Seoul
>pre-emptively airstrike North Korean facilities
>roll over the DMZ
Why wouldn't this work and why won't this gay do it? Does he want his country to get cucked while Kim gets ever more nukes?
>stack C-RAM across Seoul. >pre-emptively airstrike North Korean facilities. >roll over the DMZ
Even iron dome is only ~90% effective.
South Korea doesn't want a ton of dead civilians.
>South Korea doesn't want a ton of dead civilians
I thought that was their official policy, especially schoolchildren
Nah only when they can shift the blame away from the military
What if a week or two before this, they evacuated the population south to a safer area for the duration of the attack?
What if the North Koreans decide to launch a pre-emptive strike in anticipation for a major offensive against them?
What if the South preemptively attacked that preemptive attack all while disguising the evacuation of the border regions of the country?
Any north korean pre-emptive strike would be pointed towards beijing, this ironically would receive massive support from all of the non-northern han population of china, keep in mind a person from shanghai can't even communicate with a person from beijing verbally let alone the southern chinese trying to talk to a northern chinese
This is patently false. One of the CCP's greatest achievements is standardization of Beijing mandarin throughout China. A lot of regional dialects like Cantonese are dying out precisely because the CCP's insistence on Beijing mandarin only. There's some hick offshoots, but the various mandarin are all mutually communicable with each other. They even got rid of traditional Chinese in favor of simplified precisely to make learning to read-write easier for all the peasants.
>but the various mandarin are all mutually communicable with each other
I'd say that's a bit of a stretch. I knew a guy from Chiongqing and the Beijingers I was with said they could only understand half of his local dialect.
This. While beijing is trying its damndest to get all chinese to speak beijing mandarin, in reality its even less prevalent than say english being used as the unofficial language of the EU
My experience is similar. There's literally officers in the PLA from the former Chengdu Military Region now Western Military Region who can't even speak mandarin and can only manage their local dialects.
There's pushback in places like in the Yangtze River and Pearl River Deltas against this and measures to encourage kids to speak Wu/Cantonese.
Sichuanese is technically part of the "Mandarin" branch of the Chinese languages.
what the South really wants at heart is some Deng Xiaoping esque reformers to take over the north and focus on the economy so that reunification won't be such a slog. proponents of immediate reunification are few and far between when confronted with the reality of trying to uplift the north
the keyword there is local dialect
yes most local dialects are unintelligible and their classification as "dialects" is purely for political reasons (although the unified understanding of Chinese characters and their meaning muddies the waters a bit), but the vast majority of China can speak mandarin nowadays - I think they're up to 80% at this point. remember there have been generations who've been educated solely in mandarin, any pop culture beyond some small local stuff is in either mandarin or cantonese, etc.
Of course the problem is *only* 20% of the population equals hundreds of millions of people who cannot speak the language.
south korea is a democracy where people have very short memories and politicians only care about re-election (yes i know presidents can only serve one term, but still be in their congress/senate). they freak the fuck out when north korea kills a few, as in under 10 people in artillery strikes. people want to be able to work, order fried chicken and watch their teevee shows. they dont give a single fuck about north korea, and EVERYONE acknowledges it would be easier to fucking join with japan as one country than rejoin with north korea economically, politically, population-ally. theyre probably permanently separated or at least until north korea becomes a stable wealthy country for at least a century.
>EVERYONE acknowledges it would be easier to fucking join with Japan as one country than rejoin with North Korea economically, politically, population-ally. they're probably permanently separated or at least until North Korea becomes a stable wealthy country for at least a century.
This. West and East Germany were separated for a far shorter period of time than North and South Korea, and East Germany wasn't nearly as bad as North Korea. Yet it still took a lot of time for things to normalize after unification, and there is still a huge disparity in wealth in Germany between the regions that were East and West Germany.
North Korea would drag South Korea's economy into the gutter, and that's not even getting into all of the social problems.
East German was also within radio "range" so there was a constant stream of not just western propaganda but simply commercial radio.
People would listen to west German radio dramas because it was entertaining and beat whatever the local radio was broadcasting.
This helped a lot with later unification because the east was never really cut of from the west culturally.
There some areas that didn't get western radio and other easterners considered them to be ignorant and stupid because they believed the party line more.
>There some areas that didn't get western radio and other easterners considered them to be ignorant
They called that area "the valley of the clueless."
While there's a lot of finger wagging and faux shows of enforcement, the black market for low level consumer goods and especially foreign media has exploded in size over the last couple decades.
humorously, television romantic comedies from the south have spread all over NK, though people still watch them in secret as they are "contraband". There's been some theorizing that this lax enforcement has been engineered as a way to re-acclimate the Northerners slightly to the language and culture of the south.
If you can believe it there was a very popular South Korean romantic comedy about a rich southern girl who ends up in the north in a skydiving accident and is taken in by a handsome officer and hidden until he can smuggle her back south. People in the south ate that shit up and it's made it across the border as well.
poland, east germany and hungary also had access to western media and goods via grey markets. yugoslavia was flooded by western goods - not in black markets but legit shops and people could simply travel to any western country whenever they felt like it. the socialist mindset still set deep roots and was a major roadblock to integration with the west - in some places it still isn't close to finished. the top 5-10% of norks having access to washing machines and worst koreas soap operas doesn't mean they'll just slot in.
as everyone said: uplifiting north korea would financially and socially ruin south korea for 50 years and stunt them for another 50. the only way it would work if north korea remained a separate state with strict immigration control and was used as a cheap workshop that gradually got resocialized and retrofitted for the 21st century by the south. however, anyone who supports reunification in the first place probably wouldn't support that scenario. so what's the point?
Oh I'm not saying soap operas are the key to reunification, I'm just sharing a funny anecdote related to the topic. Whether meaningless or effective, it's theorized that an *attempt* is being made to bring the cultural lexicon closer together, and it's a humorous method.
>the only way it would work if north korea remained a separate state with strict immigration control and was used as a cheap workshop that gradually got resocialized and retrofitted for the 21st century by the south. however, anyone who supports reunification in the first place probably wouldn't support that scenario. so what's the point?
I think this kind of long term plan is actually what most of the people with influence who want reunification imagine. A slowly growing relationship, maybe some trade or manufacturing, tiny bits of immigration or visitation, as prelude to some far off reunification fifty years down the line.
Even now people from both sides of the border describe Reunification as a "when" not an "if" pretty commonly, and while in the past for the north this meant "conquest" these days those in power basically talk about war with the south as a joke. There's zero will to have a renewed conflict, and a vague desire to reunify "at some point" in the future.
>If you can believe it there was a very popular South Korean romantic comedy about a rich southern girl who ends up in the north in a skydiving accident and is taken in by a handsome officer and hidden until he can smuggle her back south. People in the south ate that shit up and it's made it across the border as well.
…sauce?
The show is almost certainly Crash Landing on You. It was the most popular kdrama when it aired and is still 4th most watched over all.
I never heard about Norks actually watching it. I wouldn't be surprised if some did smuggle black market copies of it, but you'd think they'd prioritize food, clothing, and medicine over some shitty kdrama. Maybe they fap to it. I don't know.
For context, the show was airing during height of Moon's presidency when he tried his best to do outreach diplomacy to North Korea. This led to famous shit like Trump meeting Kim Jong Un, who promptly shut down the convos and went rheeeeeee! for some reason so SK is pretty much back to square 1 despite burning through billions trying to help the Norks out. This led to the current SK President, Yoon, who barely won his election and is much more anti-NK/China and pro-Japan/West than his predecessor.
>For context, the show was airing during height of Moon's presidency when he tried his best to do outreach diplomacy to North Korea. This led to famous shit like Trump meeting Kim Jong Un, who promptly shut down the convos and went rheeeeeee! for some reason so SK is pretty much back to square 1 despite burning through billions trying to help the Norks out.
Trump accomplished more for NK-SK relations in his term than was accomplished in all the decades since the war. From all indications Kim still thought positively of him when he was deposed, and this had a chilling effect on NK's foreign communication. They circled the wagons after the election and have been very cautious since.
Accomplishments don't mean shit if they're undone the moment you leave office. The legitimacy and PR coup the Norks got out of getting a few face-to-face meetings with a US President is insane, for no tangible US strategic gain. Literally a handout to a nuclear pariah state.
>make an effort to thaw relations between to nuclear armed states that have technically been at war since the 50s
>THIS IS LE BAD
have a nice day. You probably think gwot was unironically a good idea.
>make an effort to thaw relations between to nuclear armed states that have technically been at war since the 50s
That's a funny way of saying
>Bend over backwards for a totalitarian regime and embarrass yourself in front of the entire World for no gain
I can believe that this may be true for people in cities and that getting white collar urban dwellers up to speed with SK wouldn't be that hard, but what about the farmers living in bumfuck nowhere? To use China as an example again, the tier 1 cities may have some semblance of modernity to them (though this can vary greatly), but just a 30 minute drive from the city and you have people living in tin shacks. Some of the less developed western provinces are still shitholes with people living in mud brick houses.
Like others have said I dont think even the most optimistic reunionists think that reunification would be anything less than a generational prospect of slowly building more connections between the two states. I don't think there's a scenario where anyone with power wants to empty the countryside of farmers and thrust them into the south like unwashed refugees, it would probably start with a bit of trade and very small scale migration (that would mostly just be for show, but morale is important).
In short the solution to the "what about the people in mud huts" question is to just leave them in their mud huts while they slowly benefit from increased cooperation on the Peninsula, and maybe their grand kids wont live in huts, or at least a markedly better hut.
>I dont think even the most optimistic reunionists think that reunification would be anything less than a generational prospect
the thing is that generational projects like that are very rare in democracies. you need not only continuity over dozens of different administrations but resilience against the ravages of public opinion - which by its very nature is undemocratic.
when the berlin wall fell; west germans were ecstatic and greeted easterners with open arms, showering them with gifts - a week later they were complaining about them and making jokes at their expense. bashing eastern germans became a national past-time and this created tons of bad faith.
>generational projects like that are very rare in democracies
Generational projects are rare in any form of government and virtually unheard of in governance. It's always some form of "breaking shit" and then fixing it again. Like in the East-West Germany example.
mud brick (when used properly) is a cheap, reliable and sustainable building material and I'm tired of people shitting on it just because of it's historical association with underdeveloped shitholes
Mud Brick also requires certain climates to be a useful building material.
>they dont give a single fuck about north kore
lmao they loathe north korea
Not even considering the economic and social problems, unification will be completely impossible as long as the Kim family controls North Korea. I can't see them giving up power willingly.
I think control by the Kim Dynasty is a bit overrated. Sure Un and his family have large amounts of control and influence but he still needs a ruling class of high ranking party officials, generals, factory/farm leaders, and other important talking heads. What is a president pr prime minister with a cabinet? What is Putin without his various oligarchs, puppets, and other cohorts? If push comes to shove, what’s stopping China from influencing a faction to take over at the helm of the border country? Kim Jon Un didn’t help form his position, he was an afterthought after his father rejected his brother’s place in line. He’s probably more of a face on the screen while men who have been been behinds the scenes their entire lives have been keeping the Juche machine oiled and functioning.
While it is true that there is a large network of high ranking military and party officials that surround Kim Jong Un, he and his family have a strong grip on the country; control is even more centralized than in China, and that's saying something.
North Korea's entire cultural identity is based around the Kim family.
So use twice the Iron Dome. 180% effective.
They could take the L for the team
Seoul is within artillery range
you forget:
>absorb 25 million uneducated, underfed and sickly 5'4 brainwashed peasants into your country (somehow) without destroying your own economy
>??
>Profit!
Congratulations, you now have 25,000,000 low-wage industrial workers.
>millions of people suffering from borderline retardation induced by malnutrition since birth
>asking them to operate modern machinery
it's going to make chinese industrial accident videos look like a fucking joke
>it's going to make chinese industrial accident videos look like a fucking joke
How do you think those videos came about in the first place?
Is that a fucking wood gas engine?
>shut up and go steal some firewood, Lee
>we're in deep shit if comrade sergeant finds out we sold the wood ration for an ounce of black market rice porridge
I'm kind of astonished how clean their clothes are, minus the lack of socks. I guess a laundromat is easier to maintain than mass food production though.
They do a lot of trade with china so at least clothing is relatively cheap for them.
Reminds me of my city, Cincinnati. WLW was the first radio station to send out 500-kilowatt signal that could be heard all over North America and even other parts of the world. During the it’s short reign, it would dot be out other radio stations across the US and Canada and caused legal issues with the FCC. The signal was so powerful people would be able to hear broadcasts from things such as pots and pans hanging in their kitchens. This also resulted in people in other parts of the country and even the world becoming avid Cincinnati Reds fans too.
During legal hearings, some guy testified against it stating that powerful radio signals like these can be used by the likes of Mussolini to transmit propaganda throughout the world.
>I'm kind of astonished how clean their clothes are, minus the lack of socks. I guess a laundromat is easier to maintain than mass food production though.
Like
says they can get cheap clothes. But also understand that in a potemkin dictatorship like that visual cues are big. Anything that can be covered up and hidden, starving people at home or shit electricity or whatever is fine. People in ratty clothing though LOOK poor and primitive. Relatively speaking dictatorship wants (for as cheap as possible) to have good optics.
Another thing to remember is that you can't trust basically any video coming out of NK entirely. Yes a little bit is smuggled out, but even having a private camera in secret can be a capital crime. Most of what comes out is approved one way or another. There aren't independent journalists wandering about. They aren't going to show you the worst stuff.
Which itself is food for thought: a lot of what you might think is ridiculous, they think is showing off their BEST lol.
Here’s a funny thing about North Korea, due to the way society is structured, and what
said, there is a considerable black market in the country. Ever since Un took over after his father died, he’s been far more tolerant of the black market to a point where it’s essentially a grey market. Goods smuggled in from China are bought/sold/bartered at illegal markets but everyone takes part in it. Police can raid and dismantle markets but of course, everyone is corrupt to some degree. Things from food, candy, makeup, material goods, electronics l, etc are at these markets. Items from South Korea and the Korean portions of chain are the most popular items. Flash drives and disks containing South Korean media are also popular to a degree but it’s hard to gauge how much. Although many people in North Korea live in poor, destitute conditions, often in gulags and labor camps, not every does so. Meaning that people who live in cities and urban areas can benefit from high standards of living and luxuries not commonplace in North Korean society.
It’s now to a point where higher class North Koreans are getting more luxuries than ever before. Things that used to be only available to the top 1% are now starting to trickle down if you will, fancy cell phones, clothing, personal washing machines, computers, and even cars are becoming more commonplace. Traffic lights are even becoming commonplace in cities, repulsion the infamous traffic officers.
Due to black/grey market trade and higher costs of labor, some Chinese companies are already starting to outsource production to North Korea, this brining in some more economic flow into the country.
I don’t know what the future holds for North Korea, but for some of its upper class people, they can live fairly normal lives.
Yes, they have converted a bunch of 1950’s era diesel trucks of Soviet and Chinese design, plus local copies, to run on wood gas. It’s a wonder they have any trees at all in the country, between fuel shortages and converted vehicles you would think the place should look like Haiti.
In the Stalin era, Russia had some pretty good forest conservation and management practices in place. NK is Stalinist but more so.
>25,000,0000 disease-riddled, mal-nourished peasants
>25,000,000 Norks raised on propaganda to hate SK
>25,000,000 Norks raised on a diet of lying, cheating, stealing to survive
>25,000,000 facing discrimination from SK, growing their hatred
>25,000,000 people that need to be educated in common decency and trusted enough to operate machinery without stealing everything nailed down
I just don't see the South Koreans letting the North Koreans in without at least decades worth of integration efforts. They might turn North Korea into some kind of SK economic zone and build factories and import shit, but it'll be effectively apartheid until the Norks get their shit together and stop weeping when the dear leader's hearst drives by.
To be fair, the norks that have defected at least seem like good people.
>25,000,0000 diseased naked peasants at nork ranch
h-hot.
Just like Africans in Europe ! A real success and based opportunity!
yeah this, and also there is a racist idea that north koreans are even ethnically different ie. "half chinese" or just conotations of such. they really hate them especially people under 30.
Why would this destroy the economy? If anything you have more workers who speak the correct language and assimilate perfectly and just need some on the job training. Or they can continue to live in their own communities which will grow in wealth.
The only downside is the short term deaths.
>speak the correct language
North Korean dialect is different from the SK dialect and it's gotten worse. It leads to...
>assimilate perfectly
discrimination. Even among the defectors, they note Norks have difficulty adjusting to SK westernized life styles and their children bullied/discriminated against. They even have Nork-only schools in SK for defector children that are far below typical SK standards.
>Or they can continue to live in their own communities which will grow in wealth.
Historically these immigrant communities will prey on each other and exploit each other. The Italian mob did it. The Mexican Cartels do it. It will happen eventually, but you're asking the SK to soak up a crime and poverty stricken mass of people that will be 1/3rd of their total population with pay-offs in 30+ years time, if ever.
>Why would this destroy the economy?
You can't be this fucking stupid
>assimilate perfectly
I think you underestimate how fucked up and isolated North Korea is. The two populations have been separated long enough for noticeable lexical drift to occur, to the point that one of the most valuable assets defectors bring to the table is an understanding of how North Koreans actually speak.
Also how do you teach basic science to people who've been raised their whole life to believe that the Kim's basically are responsible for every natural phenomenon they know of?
Consider that China has been open to development for over 40 years and they still have a large population of poor uneducated street shitters. While the total number of Norks is small, relative to SoKo's population it's still quite big.
>assimilate perfectly
You're underestimating just how much authoritarian socialist regimes undermine their populations ability to have a functioning society. As someone who spent some time living in a socialist system and witnessed the pitfalls of transition to free market democracy:
Socialism teaches you that all property belongs to everyone. But for practical reasons and due to basic human nature there is still property that is "yours" more or less: Perhaps you don't technically "own" your apartment - but instead you merely are "using" it or have it "assigned" to you - but the effect is the same. So all you get from this is a sense that even stuff that isn't yours is still up for grabs: when something belongs to everyone, it belongs to no one. So stealing, cheating and just simple neglect and apathy become the order of the day. Plus, due to the whole authoritarian part that always come with socialism: you're used to shutting up and not questioning the guys in power. Plus, even the availability of fish at the local market tends to be volatile - so you learn to take what you can now, and not worry too much about the future. These attitudes becomes a part of the general mentality and psychology of people and is extremely hard to purge them. It's like a virus.
I saw guys stealing wiring from machines at the factory they worked at - they'd sell it for 100$, full well knowing that this will cause machines worth 100k$ or more to get wrecked and cause stoppages costing millions. They knew that that would cause them (and hundreds of others) to lose their jobs - but they just didn't give a shit. And nobody can say anything - because everyone has done something similar; people in glass houses and all that. So socialism does indeed foster solidarity and cooperation - but in extremely destructive ways. The rule of law gets torn apart - and a trillion dollars of natural resources can be pissed away with nothing to show for it by a corrupt society.
No, anon. NK would need a significant overhaul. It's pretty much a full rebuild on SKs dime. There will be significant hardship in the rebuild process.
The reunification of Germany was a disaster for the country and the damage it has caused is felt to this very day. And I would argue that the East and West Germans had a lot more in common than the South Koreans and the Norks and that the situation in East Germany was much, much, much better than it is in North Korea.
It is simply not feasible.
what effects are felt today other than the wealth disparity?
east germany has more drunks, junkies, crime, shizo conspiracy theorists, more pensioners and invalids, less kids, less engineers, less doctors, and as you mentioned - they're much poorer. nowadays the difference isn't quite THAT stark - but east germany is noticeably more assi (short for "anti-social" ie. white trash) than west germany. and that's after over 30 years of concentrated effort and with much less of a difference between east and west germany during reunification than between north and south korea nowadays.
appreciate the info
He also forgot to mention that it's not like 99% of public servants and politicians were fired, so you have large number of former KGB/Statsi assets who remained in power and now have climbed their way up the food chain, which is part of the reason Germany has such a problem with a 5th column.
I think it's worth mentioning that German reunification was pretty much "you are FRG now, have fun" in the span of a few months at best. All the Korean reunification proposals I've seen are a one country, two systems deal, some don't even advocate for toppling the Kim family.
Only way I can see it working is, say SK actually won and totally beat NK. They'd have to implement a reunification plan that kept the DMZ area, kept north separate from south, and slowly introduced southern concepts into the north over the course of two decades.
Who said anything about absorbing? Just topple, disarm, leave.
congrats, you now have somalia on your border.
Reminder that KEK Obama stopped SK from curbstomping NK
SK doesn't want to curbstomp Best Korea. It doesn't want to absorb all the impoverished, uneducated and malnurished northerners. Their reunification bureau (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ministry_of_Unification) basically determined that it would destroy their economy using the historical lessons from German Unification where West German was paying over a trillion each decade to East Germany after the collapse of the Berlin Wall.
North Korea is far worse off than the DDR. I think the South would literally let the Northern brether all die than reunifiy. Most of the generation from pre-DMZ with memories of a united Korea are all elderly. The post-War generation want nothing to do with a country that continually threatens them and kills their soldiers.
What about installing puppet government and using them as cheap labor? Without reunification and with very limited immigration from north?
a) The existing North Koreans who have fled to the South already have a difficult time integrating into the South due to their lack of knowledge of how the modern world works (there's basically South Korea 101 classes for these people explaining how stuff works) and their short stature/different vocabulary/grammar marks them as Northerners making them ripe for discrimination.
b) South Korea already has cheap jobs programs in the North. It's basically welfare or extortion depending on your pov. I'm not super knowledgeable, but I don't think it's profitable and using any developing country with a functional education system like Vietnam would be more effective.
forgot to mention
c) China already uses North Korea for cheap labor.
cheap labor for what? they don't even know how to operate modern farm equipment. they plow with cows and fertilize with fermented shit like it's the dark ages.
If they farmed like the dark ages, they could at least practice crop rotation. Thanks to the retarded commie regime they keep planting the same crop because they have to meet a quota.
Korea would be one country, you can't immigrate within the same country. If you impose domestic movement controls then that's what the DPRK already does so you are just swapping one oppressive system for another.
> It doesn't want to absorb all the impoverished, uneducated and malnurished northerners.
Just let them starve to death
Lol once NK bombed an island and Obama had to tell morons to chill out because they wanted to take revenge
Wouldn't matter. Overall cost benefit for all of society doesn't matter at all. What matters is that the right people would make money off of it.
>Just launch an offensive against a state with nuclear weapons bro!
Yeah I'm sure that will work out just fine. There is no reason to just maintain the status quo
What is the point?
The goal of the Norks is being ignored and there is nothing in North Korea that is worth anything beyond the name. The entire peninsula is a desolate wasteland that cannot sustain a modern society. There is no farmland, no resources, no nothing.
The only things you get from conquering the North is worthless clay, millions of worthless people you need to feed and support and reeducate and a border with China.
The current situation is best for everyone and the Kims very much know this too. They made nukes they could maintain this situation indefinitely.
>no nothing
Double negative
to be fair, norkies do a whole lot of fuckery related to cyberheists, drug smuggling, kidnapping, etc. They wouldn't gain much, and it wouldn't be worth it at all, but there are definite reasons to want the Kims out of town.
Kim Un is a million times better than what would replace him. A lot of it comes down to his time spent overseas and how that altered his perspective.
I think it's also hilarious that former Sec of State Pompeo revealed that Kim Jong Un wants the US in Korea, as a counterbalance to China who'd overrun the peninsula like Tibet. I think it shows KIm's a realist who has no disillusions about the Chinese who would put two bullets to the back of Kim's head and call it a suicide if they could replace him for a compliant successor.
he also got rid of one of his own family that was to buddy buddy with the chinese
Because China tried to overthrow him via internal court coup using his uncle and half-brother.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kim_Jong-nam
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jang_Song-thaek
They are both dead btw.
I was surprised to learn that the north was historically more valuable because it had the heavy industries and raw materials.
Well, it no longer does.
>No resources
North Korea actually has almost all of the peninsula's resources, though? It literally only lacks farmland and was the industrial center of the country before the split.
The fact that the positions have reversed is due to the power of American capitalism and hilarious Norkie mismanagement.
This makes me wonder; why not just officially end the war and say "yeah, you guys can keep it"? SK gains nothing of they don't come out worse by winning and NK knows they're never going to win.
>C-RAM
>good against rocket and mortars
>not good against artillery snd ballistic missiles
It will not stop koksans or no dongs.
>counter rocket, artillery, and mortar
>it doesn't stop artillery
What a scam
because then the international community will hate him, they will sanction his ass and destroy the korean economy, the US wont support them, and this will give china cause to invade them.
This is an extremely naive take on the scenario.
The doves always talk about the theoretical sanctions of SK invading the north, but the reality is that SK would ONLY do it with US support, whether explicit or implicit - this goes with nukes as well. If SK ends up assembling nukes, its with certainty that the nuke programs were coordinated with the US.
>If SK ends up assembling nukes, its with certainty that the nuke programs were coordinated with the US.
No, SK or especially Japan could be headed for an economic distancing from the US, in which case they could eventually build nukes on their own. Japan told Biden to fuck off on the Russian energy boycott, and SK could as well.
Absolutely retarded post. Not only is Japan cutting energy imports from Russia SUBSTANTIALLY, but South Korean-US defense cooperation has never been stronger, and it continues to be integral to SK defense policy
Japan started importing oil from Sakhalin again in 2023, completely forgoing any oil price cap, retarudo-kun.
The North honestly isn't worth conquering. The payback time for the war plus reconstruction would be a generation or two. Even for the North just surrendering to the South today it would be decades to restructure the North away from their "military first" economy. That's just how worthless collectivized economies are.
Beyond that, I just think the culture would be so radically different. We laugh at when South Korean pop idol groups perform to the disgust of North Koreans during those diplomatic exchanges, but I think that's the least of their problems.
You got starving North Koreans who have never known luxury who will pillage shit and steal because that's how it is in the North. Crime would skyrocket because the Norks literally wouldn't know any better. It'd overburden the Korean penal system, which is already pretty overburdened as it is. Norks have a culture of lying through their teeth because the Soviet-style Juche ideologies prioritizes lying about results more than actual results.
You'd have to conduct so many fucking immunization and outreach campaigns. Virtually every defector from North Korea has parasites. God knows if they have polio, measles, and other shit they need to purge before being introduced to the general population.
If North Korea does want to rejoin the South and the Kim family/military steps down, they'd need at least 20-50 years to deprogram and gradual transition to integrating with the South. Background checks, work visas, and Nork basically under SK military occupation during the transition.
The SK would also be extremely xenophobic to the Norks after constant exposure to the crime and poverty they'd bring. They're over 70 years removed from them so hardly any of them give a shit about familial connections. At least a work program would give the SK a cheaper labor force instead of importing Indians or Filipinos.
I remember how that mid-range soldier who escaped in 2017 was malnourished and full of huge worms, considering that the army has guaranteed food and medical care, I don't want to imagine how the average population is
>I don't want to imagine how the average population is
bellies full of worms.
imagine millions of people contaminating the groundwater with outhouses and human shit for fertilizer, and then drinking straight out of wells without any filtering.
>cut open the average nork to remove some parasites
>imagine the smell
MEAT'S BACK ON THE MENU, BOYS.
>I'm gonna NOOOOOOOOOOOOK
Ignoring the casualties and damage to the infrastructure from NK counter strikes, there was a study, IIRC from the late '90s, based off the reunification of Germany and if the two Koreas reunified it would literally bankrupt the country in the short-term trying to even remotely try to bridge the gaps in quality of life, farming, power-grid and basic roads.
So don't. Just do a two systems country with the goal of eventual reunification, on the requirement that South Korea be North's suzerain and impose a constitution on the North. There's nowhere for North Korea to go but up, just let it take time.
moron the war is OVER.
Even the Nork brass jokes about it now, they're unironically way more touchy about their "Greatest Ally" fucking with them.
's not entirely wrong tho. The first time I went to Guangzhou in 2012 I hardly heard any Mandarin and most people spoke in Cantonese. The second time I went was in 2015 and I heard a lot more mandarin being spoken in public.
The point I was trying to make in my previous post wasn't so much about the Government's attempts to get rid of other languages/dialects, but the fact that even the "Mandarin" family of languages has pretty noticeable regional differences.
This was meant for
Don't know why the post number got cut off.
same reason finland doesn't want karelia back
The only way they reunite is if Kim decides they should.
It's believed that Kim actually does want reunification, but for all kinds of reasons that's a very far off goal.
SK's economy is in a really fragile place right now with a rampant inequality. The last thing they need right now is millions of malnourished norks to take care of.
Did you know that South Korea's military is subordinate to the US military? In the event of war, the US takes over their command.
Guys GUYS
Do you really not see the 5D chess?
The two Koreas have a plan
South Korea gets all the Western support, technology, etc.
North Korea gets Chinese support, hell even some Western aid
But most importantly, North Korea has its nuclear weapon program. This means that upon unification, Korea will have both its own nuclear weapons program and a Western level economy. The two Koreas are playing off East and West against each other while playing the long game.
I’m sorry I think you mean to say they are praying the rong game.
We truly do live in a pre Finno-Korean hyper war era.
Weaponising time travel was always a terrible mistake
I will warn them about this, but they refused to listen
I have always wondered, would the North Korean nuclear arsenal even be useful in the first place to a united Korea, even if they were allowed to keep it?
Yes, for intimidating China which is rumored to be a common sentiment in North Korea already.
I know they would border China and Russia, I was wondering if the nork arsenal is even in good enough conditions to be useful to a real country.
It might be in a "China thinks it might be good enough and so will hesitate until it actually is good enough" kind of way.
which is perfect for their ultra- ultra long game of nuking Japan and invading them as payback.
South Korea's fertility rate is 0.78. They cannot replace any losses whatsoever.
South Korea has 50+ million peopl on land barely larger than Ireland or Hungary, SK will and should stabilize around 30 million in SK proper which is still hyper high population density, the shortfall in labor will be compensated with robotics and ai both of which SK is leading in globally
It would work but you're losing tens of thousands of your own citizens even of everything goes perfectly. Status quo is better than taking those losses.
>Does he want his country to get cucked while Kim gets ever more nukes?
Best Korea is playing the long game by just waiting it out until Incel Korea dies off on its own.
That's a disgustingly bad demographics curve. Jesus.
The feminist cult that told its members to rape and kill every male child they could didn't help either.
>manlets with medieval technology who only plant one kind of crop at a time and are obsessed with military might/destroying the tall smug intellectual foreigners
...are North Koreans my dwarves from Dwarf Fortress?
>congratulations, now you have to unfuck a country with a completely uneducated malnourished populace with zero skills relevant to the South Korean economy and with zero relevant industry and no resources whatsoever
Uh, why?
>C-RAM
Okay cool Seoul gets leveled by the massed Nork artillery because C-RAM is for fucking mortars and rockets not howitzers
Because the norks have nukes and the possibility they manage to detonate one over seoul is non zero
Chyna would send millions of soldiers with NK passports probably.
This is literally NK's worst nightmare, China sending an army to "Help stabilize" if something goes wrong.
>China wants a buffer state between them and any western aligned country so the chances of this expanding into a greater war are higher than anybody wants
>The fallout/humanitarian crisis from actually incorporating NK citizens and territory back into Korea would be fucking huge and nobody wants to deal with it
>Nukes
Because while South Korea would win any war without Chinese intervention, Seoul will get shelled and tens of thousands of civilians will die. In a country with a birth rate of 0.8.
There is nothing in North Korea realistically worth a war. The regime plays the MUH NOOKS IM INSANE SOMEONE STOP ME game to get attention and free gibsmedats from the international community. If you stopped giving aid they'd starve. China just wants to keep them propped up to prevent a refugee crisis and prevent a US ally from having troops on its borders, otherwise they are also very inconvenient for China.
-굥-
Soeul is too close to the north Korean border. Any attack would result in massive civilian casualties.
>inb4 just evacuate first
Then north korea would catch on and strike first.
Okay, let's say you win. Enjoy managing a broken NK and trying to un-mindfuck the denizens. Kek, what's the next step in your master plan?
pioneer NKJAV with even more outlandish scenarios and even more pixels. making the takeover pay for itself and saving humanity.
Because just behind the border is an enormous mountain range with four decades worth of entrenched artillery positions aimed at SK population centers, the largest of which is uncomfortably close to the border and all of that artillery.
If war broke out, Seoul would be unironically flattened within a month, and nothing short of an unprecedented strategic nuclear bombardment of NK's mountains would stop that.
The current situation is strategically much more desirable. Every generation more norks die of starvation and disease than SK could ever hope to kill in a war, every new generation the norks get dumber and fall farther behind technologically and doctrinally. Why poke the hornets nest if they're already dying.
Every generation the morons are dying off due to a negative replacement rate concurrently.
It's kind of amazing the fertility suicide that's happening with so many industrialized countries. It's a national security issue when you don't have a large enough population to support your economy or young people to take up arms.
We'll just import brown people, what's the worst that could happen? Whatcha me get banned for speaking the truth here.
Slowly importing Norks to bolster the population would be much better than importing more genetically distant foreigners.
No, because those "genetically distant" foreigners are much closer to you than the norks are.
People from Europe or Japan or the US or even Turkey and other 2nd tier countries live lives that much more like the lives of the people of South Korea than the Norks will for another 100 years.
>implying Nork evolution hasn't diverged from SoKo's since the war.
The problem is that industrialization increases the valued of a woman's labor, relative to a man's, that having children imposes substantial opportunity costs along with the explicit costs of raising a child. Part of the reason the US had a baby boom after WWII was that the government worked to push women out of the workforce so that veterans would have an easy time launching a career and starting a family.
Such a strategy is now a non starter because in a globalised economy, your nations productivity will be reduced, making your country's uncompetitive in the short term.
they make too much money not being at war
they gain so much negative money if they conquer the north
What's the tactical advantage of that haircut?
when you're a high ranked worst korea official your two greatest worries are luscious best korea twinks sent to entrap you and snipers. the haircut protects against both. against twinks: makes you less stylish and appealing. against snipers: same principle as dazzle camo - from a distance it looks like he's standing at a different angle than he really is.
Thanks for your answer.
Underground mountain fortifications. North Korea is impossible to invade.