what's a good sleeping mat that's comfortable and has good thermal isolation?
no inflatables
I like the savotta one bc of the flaps and the plastic outer layer that makes it waterproof and more solid, but I feel moronic spending 80 euros on a mat
sleeping mat
otherwise there's these 2, the ridgecrest seems the most insulating one from the reviews I've seen
only thing that mattres is the R value for the season you gonna use it with. Also inflatables are going to be superior in R value to weight and volume ration so if you gonna be uppity about it might aswell haul 2 of those foam ones for colder seasons
>only thing that mattres is the R value for the season you gonna use it with.
Actually there are other things that matter, such as size and comfort. If it's too small or feels uncomfortable to lay on you will have a bad night regardless of the R value. Some sleeping pads are made for midgets, women and manlets. You gotta be careful out there.
the only things that matter:
- r value
- weight / r value to weight ratio
- bulk when folded/rolled (varies more than you think)
- comfort
and lastly, depending on who you are i might add:
size might matter to some people but i guess it depends what you're using it for and how you sleep. if you're a sicko who can train yourself to sleep on your back, its pretty popular to shorten ccf pads from anywhere ranging from knee length to just a square for the back. all you actually need when its not winter if you're not a side/belly sleeper & its nice to hike without a bulky ass pad. ive seen people mod their pads with snap rings to re-attach the parts they cut off when its cold out too. smart idea.
but if you can't sleep like that, its def worth it to have a pad you can actually sleep on.
the savotta, ridgerest, and z lite all have r values around like 2-2.5. i think they're all r value 2 actually, off the top of my head.
savotta is 960 grams, ridgerest is about 400 grams and z lite sol is about 400 grams.
the z lite folds up a lot smaller than the ridgerest and savotta.
the ridgerest is a bit more comfortable than the z lite sol, to me.
if you live in an obscure third world country or something you can buy a fake z lite off alibaba anywhere in the world. its a good deal and almost as good as the actual one.
if you don't mean these specific pads, you can find a blue foam mat anywhere. they're ubiquitous and like $10-20.
just get a z-lite or a nemo switchback and put a piece of tyvek underneath lmao
this. The Nemo is also the most comfortable foam mat for the weight category (400-500g). The Savotta is nice but heavy and bulky. The Savotta mat is a ~1.2mm EVA mat that has the same weight and bulk as a 2mm EVA but much less insulation. More below.
I use the Nemo and Z-Lite from March to late November, down to just below freezing (maybe -4C as a max). The trick is to wear extra wool as insulation like a thick wool sweater and thick wool long johns, and to have a solid ground sheet of course. Then you won't be too cold even when its freezing.
Additionally in the winter, or when you feel too cold on it in general, you can add an Aluminum mat (150g), or an EVA mat (0.5mm 250g), (1mm 450g), (1.5mm 750g), (2mm 950g). I can strap a 2mm EVA and a Z-Lite on the back of my pack without much trouble. The 2mm is a standard mat for people on expeditions to carry either as the main mat or as a backup for the inflatable. Its quiet bulky but when you are in the mountains or in the arctic it can be necessary especiallly in the winter.
is the z lite better than the ridge rest?
apples and oranges. basically the same pad. which one is more ideal depends how you plan on packing it.
i sleep better on them. simple as. i sleep on the floor in a asiatic style bed at home. just can't get a good night sleep on anything memory foam or inflatable.
other reasons:
had an inflatable fail in an un-field-repairable way on a cold night. another reason i went back to ccf is so that i could use it as a quasi-frame with my frameless un-padded backpacks. unless i'm bringing extra shit my pack weight is low enough to get away with it. the weight savings from the pack winds up making the ccf comparable to high end inflatables in terms of ultralight-gayging. i also like that i can slap up my shelter way faster since i don't have to frick about with inflation bags or blowing a pad up.
in the winter i definitely use inflatables or stack one on top of the foam. nothing competes with insulated inflatables for r value to weight ratio.
by eva mat you mean the foam ones you use at the gym?
bc I have one rn and that's what I'm using, for now I'm new to going out, in fact I don't even have a sleeping mat yet, but I've slept outside a couple times, once was in spring iirc and I slept in a small wooded area near where I live, with a decathlon sleeping bag rated for high low temps, didn't bring a mat, wome up shaking in the morning, didn't manage to light a fire too with the ferro rod.
other 3 times were in a camping spot in a tent, I slept on the fitness foam mat using a mylar blanket as a blanket bc I'm moronic and forgot the sleeping bag, it was summer in the hills, wasn't too cold so I managed to sleep but it was a bit cold and the mat is shit as far comfort goes, I hade fricking roots stabbing my back all night, but that was also poor choice of the site to sleep.
anyway, if I only use foam, then I should have a thicc and insulating mat, and for very cold weather use 2 or use an inflatable, but I prefer foam bc it's faster to place and remove and more sturdy, so I prefer it for larping reasons.
since I don't have a good bag either, and where I live even not in mountains gets cold and humid in winter (3C to -1C), and in the mountains gets cold as shit and snowy, I was thinking of the carinthia defence 4, are there better options?
humid as in there's so much fog you can't see more than 5m I front of you when in non urban areas, and little more than that, like 15 to 25 in urban
I don't understand your post. Do you mean cm instead of mm?
ya agree
the two best foam pads imo are the switchback and the fake z-lites (just because they're so damn cheap)
You can buy sleeping pads off aliexpress that are identical to the nemo switchback at an actual reasonable price. my nemo is full of holes from a few months of constant use and i regret not just getting an offbrand one from canadian tire because theyre both of equal (shitty) quality.
>amazon
ngmi
where else can I buy these?
there are no irl stores that sell those where I live, the only other online store I know that has mats, and only the savotta ones, is varusteleka
Multiple sites, (including Savotta, not surprisingly) sell them. But you said you didn't want to spend the money on it. Just get a closed cell mat and a narrow tarp.
https://varuste.net/en/p16359/savotta-fdf-sleeping-pad
whats this site?
it seems the name tries to copy varusteleka, is it associated with them or a knockoff or something like that?
anyway here it costs way less thanks
Varuste just means gear/supplies/equipment in Finnish so they ain't related. It's a large outdoor sports store. I've bought most of backpacks and some other gear from there.
they seem ti have good prices Nadal also cheap shipping since it's just 10 euros from Finland to Italy
so what are the best foam pads for cold weather that I can also use in summer
2x of whatever foam ones you like because there is no such thing as best foam pad for winter, you need inflatables
Sad reality yeah. I also dislike inflatables, but they are essential when it's cold.
even with a carinthia defence 4?
The loft insulation underneath you is flattened by your body-weight. You'll need a pad.
The folding of the z-lite is the difference but largely the same mat.
evazote encompasses a lot of foams. There are lighter foams than the typical blue yoga mat.
>muh inflatables.
Inflatables are only good for waifus.
for pads, stick to foam. foam wont let you down. a blow up tho will.
During the conscription in the FDF we just cut down some spruce branches as an extra insulating layer in between of us and earth in our military exercises during winter. That's the most comfy way of sleeping, I'd even dare to bet that it would be more comfy than with an inflatable sleeping pad.
>getting sap all over your gear
If you're in the military and get gear issued it's fine I guess.
Whatever you're using, just make sure the total R-value is over 6 or you wil end up with a cold back. I'd recommend just getting a thermarest neoair xtherm or sea to summit etherlight extreme. Yes, they're expensive, but only as expensive as 2-3 nights in a hotel.
Similar experience as a conscript in the Norwegian army. We'd use a 2R foam mat, carinthia defence 4 and a canvas tent, which worked even down to -40°C. Tho it should be noted we were often 8-10 guys cramped together and had a small primus hiker+ running all night. But it worked even with just 1 guy and no primus.
I still use a similar setup nowadays, tho Ill some times bring an extra light inflatable mat for extra comfort. Hammock/jerven camping can also help you get away with an only sleeping mat solution.
Spruce branches is also a great way of insulating, like you said I'd wager it'd be better than many inflatable mats. But it does of course rely on you having access to spruce.
>no inflatables
I was you but I'm going inflatable for winter. Bringing one insulated inflatable and one closed cell so I won't die if the inflatable gets punctured.
Savotta one is good but it's only real value is its indestructibleness
Thermarest Z-lite is the same quality but half the weight
I have both and I usually just use the Z-lite
Savotta is great for bivvy camping and that's it because of the integrated groundsheet flaps
Z-lite is better for every other situation, including bivvy camping if you don't slip n slide in your sleep
what's the advantage of pads like the z-lite and switchback over an inflatable? apart from them being more durable.
I like them because I don't have to blow up a pad and deflate and stow it in the morning, otherwise nothing really if you aren't counting durability. I guess you could use it as a sit pad or emergency splint and/or sled
im a fan of robens zigzag slumber, 20usd for a whats practically a lighter Z-Lite but slightly thinner, mine weights 290g and is very comfy, R=2.2. also gonna drop this:
https://algonquinbeyond.com/sleeping-pad-comparison-table/
oops meant less width not thinner*
I got the wide version
My friend had this pseudo raised bedding system that he flexed on everyone with first 2 weeks of summer plant in northern ontario.
It had 2 rows of spine style hangers that lift the canopy off the ground.
What's a good sleep pad for a fatty? I'm trying to lose weight and want to hike, but I fear my fatness will fatteningly pop an inflatable sleeping pad.
Congratulations for becoming active and not falling for snake oil
95% of weight loss is eating habits, not activity.
If you don't have a feeling for how much you may eat or you are not seeing progress, use a calculator for your TDEE and a tracking app for your cals.
https://tdeecalculator.net/
Suggestion is to lose some weight first to reduce risk of injury
You can probably even use inflatables if you put the pressure on them evenly and don't kneel on it etc.
Most common problem is internal damage due to high stress on the bonding walls, depending on specific construction this risk varies.
You could also use a foldable like nemo switchback or thermarest z-lite if the R value is high enough