Are they a good investment? Waste of money? Pain in the ass? I've noticed they're getting popular in areas with elevated melanin content.
Redpill me on residential solar panels
Are they a good investment? Waste of money? Pain in the ass? I've noticed they're getting popular in areas with elevated melanin content.
I just bought a home and am looking into this. In my research so far it seems that it is worth if it you actually PrepHole, depending on your local energy costs and how much sun your home gets.
Don't do one of those stupid $20k-40k contractor installed shits
Don't put panels on your roof that shit is beyond moronic. The guy who thought up that scam is right up there with the guy who invented cigarette filters.
Why not on the roof?
Seems like the best place for most properties, not everyone has a giant field in their yard
Not that anon but did you know solar panel voltage goes down when they get hot and goes up when they're cold? Sorta obvious if you think about it but your roof is probably pretty warm most of the time. did you also know the moon receives more irradiance than the earth? Imo solar really isnt going to hit it's stride until we cover Luna with panels and beam the power back to earth with gigawatt lasers. Putting an array on your house is dumb because the monkeys they hire to lay the panels will likely do a shit job i.e roof leaks and fricked up wiring and your utility company will likely frick you with a TOU rate or at a bare minimum charge you a base fee for being connected to their grid whether you buy any power from them or not. If you can manage to design a system that will cover your usage 100% and includes some batteries for back up and time of use arbitrage than go for but If I had the cash I might just take that money and give it to the electric company to cover my bill for the next 20 years.
> t. Solar trash
>Imo solar really isnt going to hit it's stride until we cover Luna with panels and beam the power back to earth with gigawatt lasers
You're fricking moronic. The cost to send panels (even with next generation launch systems like starship) to the moon rather than just to a sun synchronous orbit is monstrous. Also in space you don't have to deal with moon dust fricking your shit up and STILL losing half your power generation because the moon rotates. Oh and your lasers or microwaves are much, much cheaper since they don't have to achieve accurate collimation over a nigtrillion miles.
>t. /sfg/
Lol the dude made an off hand remark that generally meant "in the future we'll have a better solution than this" and you took his suggestion seriously.
What a fricking moron, go back to PrepHole you frickin pseud
>Not that anon but did you know solar panel voltage goes down when they get hot and goes up when they're cold? Sorta obvious if you think about it but your roof is probably pretty warm most of the time.
Your roof is warm because the sun is shining on it you drugged out moron.
Imagine making a dumber post than a beaner meth head solar panel installer
Because if you ever have to have work done on your roof you just doubled the cost for no reason. Solar is gay. Mini nuke reactors or bust.
Trump lost
Depends on a variety of factors. But yes, if you own the panels outright they can be a good investment.
If you're looking for some emergency backup-power, then yeah. No you won't save any money and no, you won't be making money by "selling" is back to the power company.
> Everyone lives where I do
Feed In Tariff is 11c/kwh here, a modest setup and average usage means no more power bills
Setup, batteries, converters, plus battery and panel replacements, over a decade. will have some big-time costs.
>battery and panel replacements, over a decade
There are no modern panels and batteries that need replacement in a decade. Cheapest ultimate chinkshit panels have 12-year general warranty and 25-year power decline warranties.
Bullshit. More can go wrong than that. good luck finding a tech to repair it. There are always plenty of salesmen though.
Like what? You can buy batteries with 10 year warranty, although the standard is 5 years, and the same is true for inverters. Do the cables fall apart in 10 years?
The only thing you can't repair yourself with regular PrepHole skills is the inverter, but the inverter is a fairly cheap component in most installs. You'd come out ahead even if it failed every 5 years, which it probably won't.
How much are you spending on electricity without them?
Where do you live?
> Solar in New England
> dumb
> solar south of the mason Dixon line
> better
I want to use solar to supplement a stand by generator during the day. Being green doesn't matter to me.
Honestly depends on your location's power company.
I'm in a location where I'm grandfathered in to having the city pay me .50 per kwh and I get sun 90% of the year so its been pretty good for me.
I also have a roof type that allows for panel attachment without any kind of penetration.
Study Will Prowse and a couple of related Youtube channels. You can't go wrong if you only do prowse.
Read diysolarforum (his forum)
Look at mobile-solarpower dot com (his quick start how to).
He analyzes installer quotes in a video he posted in the last couple of years. They pad the numbers and as another anon said, they can frick up your roof.
Santan Solar is a good place to get panels. There's also a guy out of knoxville, advertising on FBM, that runs a solar warehouse and has things like 250 watt new unused or slightly used lease panels (like what santan offers). Santan only ships from arizona and georgia though, so your LTL charges could be hefty.
Higher wattage panels are marginally larger, but usually have a decent bump in efficiency. If you have limited square footage (as shown in photo) and you want to maximize production, and you have cash to blow, then higher wattage higher efficiency panels (starting in the 440watt range and up) are going to be what you get.
Units like the EG4 18k or 6000 or 6500 (one does single phase, one does split), are the base control units everything wires into. Batteries can be had from EG4, SOK, RIUKU, TROPHY, etc, or DIY'd (davidpoz has a good diy battery vid he posted recently).
Some analysis needs to be done on your part to determine what you want to move to a subpanel, and how much draw that's going to be. With house pictured, at a latitude up north in example, you can run a chest freezer, LED lights, a small fan or two, charging phones and a laptop, but not a 1.5 ton air unit. It can run a high-SEER 9k BTU mini-split, at least partly.
Production varies wildly, depending on cloud cover: from 100% output to 10% on overcast days. That greatly influences what kinds of loads you can maintain 24/7. Rule of thumb is whatever your average load is, you'll need 10x that in wattage on the roof, particularly up north.
>Study Will Prowse and a couple of related Youtube channels. You can't go wrong if you only do prowse.
There used to be this older Australian dude who built his whole solar system and battery banks for (comparitively) cheap with salvaged 18650 cells and stuff. Any chance you know what his channel is? I can't remember.
*average hourly load. If your power bill shows 10kw/day, then 416 watts = 4.1kw on the roof, minimum!
Very much depends on where you live, how much it costs to get a system installed, if you can legally PrepHole, if you have the skills to PrepHole, and how much you pay for electricity. Very broadly speaking, it's usually worth it, but the ROI is mostly around 10 years. Commercial high voltage battery systems are barely worth it or not worth it at all, ROI around 20+ years in most places.
Solar panels are unbelievably cheap, you can get 1kWp for $250, 10 years ago they were 5 times that price.
Inverters are pretty cheap so long as you aren't using Victron or some other non-chink brand.
Lithium iron batteries are cheap to PrepHole, low voltage commercial ones are not terribly expensive, high voltage ones are expensive.
So for maximum ROI and practicality, you can usually either do
>commercial on-grid with "grid storage" service
or
>PrepHole hybrid with battery that maybe isn't really legal
Many places have various programs with incentives for solar, where you can get additional discount on the commercial install.
Also recommend Will Prowse, he has just about everything explained on his channel.
Subsides in my STATE made paying some one to install cheaper than buying equipment... but it was close. Ebay panels and reclaimed 18650s can make a good system for what I spent.
>dont let anyone who doesnt owb your roof on it with a drill. Just dont.
>dont let anyone lease you anything
>dont point panels in dumb directions. South.
>dont pay any attention to anyone just shitting on things on the internet.
If you arent a do it entirely yourself person im not really sure what to tell ya for the best route
Im within 50 miles of the canadian border, and comepletely off grid.
Very possible to make enough power for a few kw a day, plenty of used panels and equipmet out there. Im not claiming to run heat pumps or charge cars off grid, but lights, radio and phone/computer are pretty easy
It's very location dependent but for me, I wouldn't bother unless I had a large enough yard where I could put them somewhere not my house's roof.
That is boomer heaven right there.
Lucked out with a south facing pole barn. Cheap mounts, no wasted space, and less critical leak prevention.
>I've noticed they're getting popular in areas with elevated melanin content.
I've seen this too. What's going on? Are they falling for the Home Depot scams?
They weren't really being targeted before. Most of the suburban/rural market that would've bee interested either already has them, or has been put off by how scammy most companies are. So they've moved on to less wary prey. Prey that's primed for gibs scamming.
besides the dumb Black folk fricking up your roof and the israelites loaning you panels, the power company also makes it a b***h depending on where you live...almost to the point where its better to do a separate 48V system that isn't tied in
8-Bit Guy stumbled into a good situation when he built a studio onto his house but made it powered only by solar. When the grid power went out during the winter, the was able to open the door between the studio and the rest of the house to keep some heat going and run extension cords for the important things. No lockouts or other complications required.
I fricking love this nerdy gen xer like you wouldn't believe. His set up is clever too with that minisplit he has in there.
Like mine produce more power than I use. Sell enough kWh back to cut the bill pretty good. Recently got a huge battery upgrade, should all but eliminate grid dependence.
First install was 26K got half back from state and federal subsidies. Had a small battery installed then and the switching gear.
Next upgrade is two 10 kWh batteries installed for 21k likely to get half back.
With an all E house ROI is 7 years for the panels. Batteries will take longer. Not counting opportunity cost...
Day like pic related are nice, and knowing my freezers and Starlink wont go down are neat.
how do you get half back, exactly? You pay it all and somebody mails you a check or? because if it's that bullshit where they give you back some tax money then that's a non starter.
erm
So i dont get where the "shit degrades" argument comes from. I bought a used off grid setup for 1500 usd.
The inverter was manufactured in 2012. So I assume of the 5 Renogy 205 watt panels I got with it, at least some are the same age. Most probably the ones where the white backing on the panels is cracked as frick and yellowed.
So one panel was fricked and put out half power, but the other 4 kill it. Going thru 100 ft of 6 awg wire, a breaker, a switch, and a j box then to the charge controller, ive still seen 810 watts on the charge controller consistently and 820 pop up as it cools off in oct here. I re adjusted the angle too.
So how is 10 year old shit producing more than its rated power still? Cuz I definitely have some line loss.
The four left most ones in the pic are what im referring to. I think its maintaining good connections and cleaning panels people dont do.
It comes from 30-40 years ago, when panels actually degraded a good bit in 10 years. As for your particular panels, they were probably down-rated by the manufacturer.
rated power is at light intensity or w/e it's called of 1000W/m2 and some standard temperature of the panels
depending on local conditions they can already be degraded and producing below manufacturer's specs
you need more info to know for sure
but it doesn't really matter that much, they are not degraded too much, that's for sure if you didn't misstate any of the info (if you meant 4 panels produce 820W, your post wasn't that clear)
Yeah, correct on the numbers. Meaning that whether or not it was one or all, between the 4 of them there was at least the factory rated 205w being made a decade into their lives.
once again, depending on local conditions, they could be already below manufacturer's specs
Family member works for a solar company. Initially I held the idea in disregard, but after looking at operating costs, I thought better. I had him come do an assessment for us. Even though we live in a rainy area, it would be one of the best investments we could make for our property. The only issue we have is that there are a few trees in the way of our south facing roof, so we don't get very much sun. Energy costs are going to increase a great deal. We are de-commissioning dams, coal plants and we aren't building nuclear facilities anymore. Only more people coming in. Bad situation.
TLDR; I would get solar panels if you can. 10 years and they're basically a passive income stream that paid for itself and also grants immunity to local power outages. One of the best investments you can begin.
I think there's a decent argument that while power utilities are as close to socialism as you can get in some places (fixed profit((where i am)) spreading expense between all ppl), the same way as govt, theres nothing really keeping the treatment of those participating civil by its nature. Its only goodnif it produces better results.
Given that you have power companies doubling rates in the northeast, and making monthly connection charges high enough net metering will never pay off in the midwest, starting a system now is a good foundation for cutting yourself away from being forced to pay for everyone elses dumb electrification because the power utility will only let development thats good for it happen.
Cuz if you cook and drive and heat with it... they can kina put whatever price they want on it. I dont care if it costs me a little more now and i have to be modest with my power use. I aint playin that frickin game. It's good to be in touch with howmuch energy you use and what it takes to make
it is 100% worth it if you diy it end to end with no outside help.
op pic is not worth it really.
solar has a cost of scale, it is worth it to build a small system, and a large system, but it is not worth it to build a medium system.
what this looks like in numbers, is it's worth it to build a system with up to about 6 large panels or ~2kw
this way you can max out the open circuit pv input voltage of your charger with all of them in series and it cuts down on wire sizes and controller costs.
beyond that it is 100% a ripoff all the way until you have about 12kw of panels or which you then can comfortably get rid of grid power and run off of solar alone.
this is 38 of the big panels or 570ish square feet.
most people cant accommodate this
The only roof based solar option I would consider are solar thermal for heating but it comes with overheads and potential maintenance and insulation requirements.
There's a reason you don't see them often
> initial cost
> put holes into the roof to install them
> they wear out eventually and are damaged by hail
I've heard, after it's all said and done, you barely come out ahead financially. So, not really worth it.
>> they wear out eventually and are damaged by hail
>
>I've heard, after it's all said and done, you barely come out ahead financially. So, not really worth it.
The ones I have have a 25 year warranty on them, to include any damage from install to the roof.
Owned the house a a few years, after tax credits the panels cost me 50k, but the house has increased almost 175k since I bought it.
If I were to do it again, especially now with the higher interest rates and no tax credits, buy used and install yourself. Good luck with the nerve gas.
>I've noticed they're getting popular in areas with elevated melanin content.
The systems as installed probably make zero sense and this is some sort of kickback of public dollars. I bet they will cost a fortune to be installed and be broken within 5 years.
https://www.epa.gov/newsreleases/biden-harris-administration-launches-7-billion-solar-all-grant-competition-fund
40% of households in the Netherlands have them. They always save some cost, but what makes solar attractive is legisltion more than nything else.
https://go.todaysgreenlivingtips.com/energizer-1?utm_source=google&utm_medium=display&utm_id=20569750215&utm_content=154218746296&utm_term=&creativeId=674840248208&gclid=CjwKCAjwkNOpBhBEEiwAb3MvvR8bAR9rc8prywpv5TjX21VEflS0BNI1wnHDfdREsuh6R80kN_d0wBoCX0cQAvD_BwE
Hey kinda related is this true has anyone tried it?
Beautiful technology. If you size the project right and diy it you will make your money back in 3 - 4 years max. In terms of investment is a great way to put some of your money to work for you.
And for us apartment dwellers, balcony solar. Two 150 watt polycrystaline pv's in series, feeding a WVC-600 600 watt grid-tie inverter.
Had these two panels from a previous residence and decided to put them to work rather than have them sit in storage doing nothing. Now 57 months in operation.
i've been seeing some dudes on youtube say they can buy decomissioned 100-200w panels for like 20 bucks a pop but they never really say how or where they find these deals.
i wouldn't mind fricking with solar if panels were really that cheap.
Brand new 450W panels cost like $120 and they come with warranty, I don't see why you'd buy used panels.
Panels aren't expensive. It's only expensive when you need to install 20 afci breakers to comply with.modern us horse shit.
Facebook marketplace.
I got 2 440w longi panels for free because the underside glass was broke.
Craigslist
People sell off grid setups they dont understand or know anything about from places they just bought for dirt cheap.
>his country's grid isn't 80%+ nuclear power
>he doesn't have access to near-unlimited, cheap energy
>his grid doesn't have enough fuel to last for all time, always
solar panels make sense if you're a cringe g*rman with an IQ of 45 and your government has zero planning abilities, resulting in a grid dependent on russian gas / your neighbour's excess electricity exports, resulting in higher prices for everyone including those with nuclear because you make up ridiculous laws to outlaw anti-competitive behaviour (aka any energy prices lower than russian gas) and then you gaslight your country into thinking they're green for wasting all their money on solar and wind and it's not enough because you allowed millions of shitskins into your country so you have to dig up coal again so you decide to boycott the EU (which is the only way for your "authority" to be recognized in this continent) again until coal and gas are considered "green" but will block any attempt at aknowledging that nuclear is a green energy and despite all this fiasco still refuse to use nuclear energy because you're terminally moronic and ape out at any time any country disagrees with you, which is a byproduct of being a g*rman subhuman, so you cry yourself to sleep while your wife gets fricked by a turkish migrant, and you keep lying to yourself and calling nuclear dangerous and toxic and ramble on about "muh deustche qualitat", but secretly you wish your country never existed and that it was still split between the allied powers and the USSR.
I picked up 5 broken solar panels on offer up for $50. There supposed to be 320 watts each but seem significantly less. Even if its only 20% of the original rating that would be about 300 watts for $50.
honestly just wait another 5-10 years when they release commercial quantum dot solar paints.