Because Taiwan admits that they cant really track Chinese missile launches, which would be used to knock down their air-defense systems and airbases.
This is weapons related. What are the Chinese weapons to be used in a hypothetical alpha strike against Taiwanese airbases and the american support assets in the region?
Part of the leak: Chinese usage of supersonic reconaissance drones.
Also based on the Congressional Report on China, China now possesses more than a thousand anti-ship ballistic missiles, excluding their hundreds of DF-17 hypersonic medium range missiles.
This is not a leak, tho, but just public knowledge.
More relevant, which comes from the leaks:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2023/04/13/china-hypersonic-missile-intelligence-leak/
China's launch of the DF-27 intermediate range hypersonic missile. The successor of the DF-17, but with at least 4000km range.
pic is DF-17 and the new North Korean HGV, which is based on Chinese tech. The DF-27 would be the same glider, but on a far longer ranged and bigger booster stage.
Most concerning, though, is China's abundance and growing number of airbases and their potential strike ranges. The US in comparisson has fewer bases and those are geographically contained on smaller islands with little strategic depth.
The expanding range of Chinese strike assets (both missile and aircraft) will put heavy strain on the capability of the US to sustain combat operations around Taiwan.
This is the finding of the congressional report.
>Oh no.
>Anyways...........
Problem are the bases near China, not around the world.
In fact, China would bank on the fact that the US has global commitments and need to have forces in reserve to hold down Russia, Iran and now even Saudi Arabia and Brazil, Nicaragua etc who all are moving to rebel against the Rule Based International Order.
Even if the US used 90% of all their forces against China alone, the potential basing options within the strike range of the Chinese mainland's eastern coast are very limited.
>the potential basing options within the strike range of the Chinese mainland's eastern coast are very limited.
We're just going to pretend Korea and Japan don't exist?
as said, geographically limited and with no real strategic depth.
Unironically yes, they expect all the asians they will rape later to be moronic and stay neutral. Just like Russia expectsd ukraine to stop fighting and Europe to stay neutral. You must remember the commies are the weaker power they need fanciful shit to happen, to have a chance to win.
Fun fact: there were thousands of rapes during the liberation of Paris by the allies, and almost none during the occupation of Paris by the Nazis.
That was because the Free French army was full of nafris. Not our fault that the frogs are mutt lovers and too weak to fight so they make colonials do it
>image
oh wow, the soviets were full of rapists? I didn't even know!
Chinese nationalists generally live in this sort of delusional fantasy world where all their enemies will just stand there and do nothing while China nukes them.
>Rule Based International Order.
Don't use their terminology. Call it what it is: The Global Financial Empire
>The Global Financial Empire
Makes you mad doesn't it?
>n Russia, Iran and now even Saudi Arabia and Brazil, Nicaragua
>Oh no, whatever will we do against these nations with Zero (0) power projection?
Why do we need to do anything to them? Why can't we just let countries associate with each other without having to get involve and bully everyone? Imperialism kills the soul of a nation, and I truly believe that only way we can save the nation we love is to stop being imperialistic homosexuals.
The implication is that they're non-factors and we don't need to do anything.
>Imperialism kills the soul of a nation
No.
Because then some other country becomes the hegemon and does an imperialism on you. There's never been a good faith isolationist in the USA btw.
I'm not an isolationist; I believe in diplomacy and trade and not being a Black personbrained thug who uses violence to get what it wants.
And what happened to Rome? What happened to Assyria? What happened to Egypt? What happened to Sparta? What happened to the UK? All destroyed by the people they conquered.
>And what happened to Rome? What happened to Assyria? What happened to Egypt? What happened to Sparta? What happened to the UK? All destroyed by the people they conquered.
Nothing and no one last forever, moron. We remember the legacy of empires fallen millennia ago but no one recalls the peaceful people they crushed. Be grateful America's empire is as gentle and cooperative as it is.
There are nations/cultures that have persisted for thousands of years, brainlet.
Also, you cannot have Christian values and commit yourself to a policy of coercion and lies. Those are the policies of Satan.
>There are nations/cultures that have persisted for thousands of years, brainlet.
All of who stepped on and coerced the peoples around them. Never mind, you're an evangelist brainlet. I'm out.
Seek Christ.
>Also, you cannot have Christian values and commit yourself to a policy of coercion and lies. Those are the policies of Satan.
Really? How do you think Christianity spread across Europe and later across the world? Bribes and coercion by force.
>What happened to the UK? All destroyed by the people they conquered.
How do you figure?
You see anon, 0.05% of our population are Pakistanis that came here and set up Curry houses. Thus, we are defeated.
>Egypt
Dunno about the others, but Egypt was destroyed by the Arabs, not its Roman conquerors. Arabs changed their language, dismantled their churches, recruited their children, taxed them into conversion to Islam, etc...
>what happened to Rome?
They relaxed.
Clearly the lesson is to never relax.
We maintain our global hegemony because everyone is using the petrodollar that allows us to print out way out of all debt crises and allows us to maintain our global military empire. That military empire, in return, serves to coerce all nations to continue subscribing to the US dollar system, which in turn will keep this cycle/loop going.
Is it morally questionable? Yes. But this is the system that allows us, the US, to live beyond our means and maintain our standing.
If more nations rebel against this order and we dont punish them for it with the military forces the US dollar system is kept funding, this entire cycle will come to an end and the world will become real fricking fair real fricking fast, which is BAD for us, in case you dont know.
I understand if you are a Chinese or Russian or even European and you resent this order, but as an American, you should pray that the tree of the empire will keep getting watered with the blood of brown people.
I'm an American gun owner. You're Polish. I believe in America and the values upon which it was founded, and I want it to continue existing. The only way we can continue to exist - and exist within those values - is if we cease our Black person-tier global buffoonery.
Da. I am John Smithovich from New York Ooblast and I think for the sake of the constitution drafted by Tsar George Washington that we should stop maintaining any kind of foreign military presence and stop using our financial powers so that we can enjoy a more fair and even-level relationship with our rivals China and Mother Russia.
I bet you think Whataburger is better than Culver's, kek.
He's right but americans don't want to admit it because it makes them look bad. Romans would have bragged about it, but americans are twisted by various moralisms and see it as a bad thing.
no truer things have been said...
Clausewitz would disagree, war is merely a form of communication. Who is being the Black person if you can't respond with equal and effective force? I mean yes, let diplomacy have a first chance but war in itself is a form of diplomacy. We are talking about higher level intellectual thought here and not static, ideological musings.
>bloodthirsty aristocratic homosexual supports war
No shit. Instant global communication has given humanity the ability to cast off the chains of violent psychopaths for the first time in the history of large-scale civilization, and it's going to happen.
>top 10 lines from history before a war starts
Yeah, a war between regular people and their rulers. Good thing regular people outnumber rulers about 10000:1.
>If more nations rebel against this order and we dont punish them for it with the military forces the US dollar system is kept funding, this entire cycle will come to an end and the world will become real fricking fair real fricking fast, which is BAD for us, in case you dont know.
Uh, no. The US was perfectly fine before it became World Police, and was isolationist. We have more than enough resources to exploit. The fact is, the US is currently "relying" (I say that in quotes, because it's actually hurting the US more than it's helping) on other countries to manufacture for the US.
The petro-dollar only gives the US bargaining power on the world stage. If it collapsed, they would simply revert it to some other dependency. What people should really be scared of is if the US LETS China become the dominant currency, and starts using that to its advantage. You can start expecting everything from mainland China to spread outwards to international jurisdictions. If you think liberalism and feminism is bad, just wait until banks start depersoning you because you insulted the Chinese president.
It's not the US. It's the international financial ruling class, many of whom are not American (and the ones that are have no allegiance to America). We're just their unwitting pawns (for now).
>It's the international financial ruling class
I was talking about the petro-dollar and the system revolving around that.
I'm aware that there are international silver-spoon elitist homosexuals that have never worked a day in their lives and are hell-bent on maintaining a global hegemony. I would love nothing more than to see Blackrock, Bohemia Grove, WEF, and the Bilderberg group all enveloped in pure white fire.
I know, I just don't think it's fair to blame America or Americans when we've been subjected to relentless brainwashing and propaganda our whole lives to manufacture consent for the machinations of sociopathic homosexuals.
Honestly america has one final joke to play on the world.
Should the dollar suddenly die or hyperinflate then price of labor drops and it can manufacture cheaply again, all its debt which are denomnated in the dollar are suddenly worth nothing, and the main disadvantage of critical imports becoming expensive is a none issue as all life sustianing resources (Food water power) are local so drop as well dropping in cost as well.
Unlike say pakistan turkey or lebonon whos debts were in external currancy so debt inflated and cost for food and power exploded when currency collapased.
Boomers and fixed income people will suffer however.
>Should the dollar suddenly die or hyperinflate then price of labor drops and it can manufacture cheaply again, all its debt which are denomnated in the dollar are suddenly worth nothing, and the main disadvantage of critical imports becoming expensive is a none issue as all life sustianing resources (Food water power) are local so drop as well dropping in cost as well.
Anything in America that can be exported is already priced according to international pricing. Since american foodstuffs, american diesel, american natural gas etc etc can be exported, suddenly piss poor americans will have to price compete on essential basics with foreign middle classes. Most americans will have to return to sustenance farming to survive.
idk what your idealogical bent is but you're genuinely moronic and should spend the next year reading before you try and post again
>return to sustenance farming to survive
Is that a bad thing?
The diesel in the US jumped when it meet euro standards.
Yep, but imperialism is really fricking bad and does actually NOT benefit the average joe.
We arent getting richer because we bomb some sandnig nation that is defying us - only our plutocrats and their political dynasties do.
If we could cut military spending to the degree that allows us to maintain a defensive fleet for CONUS alone and only a couple of bases in the world to support counter-piracy and legitimate policing mandates, the average joe will not be any poorer or have a worse living standard than he has now. On the contrary.
The imperial machine does not serve us. It serves "them" and that bogeyman about how we will "eat shit and live in a jungle" when the empire stops being an butthole to everyone is just that: Fear tactics to keep us supporting the ZOG state.
Ah yes, the mythical "them" and blatant ignorance over shit that goes on the world
With the kind of thinking you're undergoing, China would rapidly turn the USA into the next Hungary using a grip on advanced electronics. It's moronic and I'm glad you're probably too autistic to get near any kind of office.
Remind me who has tried to ban tech exports to China and thus made them realize that they need their own semiconductor fabrications?
We had them on the hook when Huawei and ZTE were totally dependent on TSMC and intel to produce and design their chips, until we banned them and basically forced them to develop their own, thinking that they are too moronic to ever be able to accomplish it.
Guess what, they are now just one or two generations behind from the previously 5 generations.
Cooperation and not starting a cold war blockade against them would have literally guaranteed American control over Chinese internal policies and economy, as the Chinese are greedy pragmatic people who rather chose money over confrontation.
We pushed them to confrontation and gave ultranationalists around Xi all the political ammo they needed to weed out all pro-westeners.
This was incredibly ill-adviced, to say it in terms your feddies use.
Perhaps so, but this isn't the past anymore. There were plenty of missteps in recent times, shit like TPP that got killed in its crib and there's no problem in admitting that. Just giving up on everything to go full moron would be the cherry ontop of the moron cake you just posted about, which makes it strange why you'd promote it. Would you like us to invade the GDR next?
None of this changes anything about a Taiwan invasion. If China invades, chances are TSMC destroys its factories and the world economy is ruined because of China. The US defends Taiwan? Less so of a chance. Big win if it doesn't turn into WW3 and devolves into stand-off. Fact of the matter.
China also has no hope of becoming fully independent of the west, food, oil and tech are not in their hands and they don't have the tech to make the tools to make the tech either. The EU does.
>China also has no hope of becoming fully independent of the west, food, oil and tech are not in their hands and they don't have the tech to make the tools to make the tech either. The EU does.
Still living in early 2000s I see. Please don't wake up
Living in the 2000s sounds sweet, but not as sweet as living in the fantasy land you're presenting me.
>real fricking fair
If we were somehow knocked out, the world would be ripped apart by a handful of authoritarian socialist psychotic leaders, each competing for racial domination of the others and attempting to secure an opaque future where their word is law forevermore.
There is no evidence to indicate that the US-led world order being ripped apart would somehow be worse for the world in terms of authoritarianism. If anything it would be more stable as more countries are kept in check instead of a sole hegemon allowed to do whatever it pleases
I don't give a shit about the history of oppression of the #globalsouth, I'm not letting hordes of billions of rape-orcs "sieze" their "deserved reparations" from Americans.
If we fell, the European leftist women who cry about capitalism on twitter would be immediately sold into secual slavery to impotent ccp party members with micropenises (and that's by chinese standards).
>history of oppression
Another ~~*psyop*~~
It was a war, mostly started by them, we won, get over it seething brownoids YWNBW
Here is the dirtiest secret about US hegemony. Everyone else wants it. Europe, Asia, Africa, Latin America all like US hegemony, in many cases more than Americans do
No, the ruling class bloodsuckers in all of those countries like outsourcing their dirty work to our government. I'm sick of it.
Not even a secret. The sour grapes sneeding and dickriding to remain relevant to the number one power in human history is clear to everyone.
>Why can't we just let countries associate with each other without having to get involve and bully everyone?
It's always funny that people who complain about the US being "imperialistic" are just BRICS homosexuals who want carte blanche to roll into other countries and set up their own imperialistic system of conquest, which is much, much worse.
By the way you chinkposters are so fricking obvious, especially with your samehomosexualry in the first few posts of the thread. If China was actually capable of taking on the US they wouldn't be posturing about all of the preparations they've made to take a small island off of their coast. The US is literally thousands of miles away from Taiwan and you're still visibly quaking with fear at the possibility of having to confront us despite every theoretical strategic advantage. It must be this amazing courage and forward thinking that have ensured that china has won precisely zero wars in its modern history.
We ditched this whiny isolationist attitude long ago. We're Americans, the world is our empire.
>Kills the soul of a nation
That's the poetic faux intellectual bullshit you here the Chinese say all the time. I remember reading some ancient Chinese historian making up what some emporer said when he was a peasant and this dude claimed he said "the eagle does not care what the sparrow thinks" like the man's a fricking fortune cookie
>we
homie if we let shitskins like you, vatniks, chinks and third worlders rule the world you will destroy any White country that still exists
The us could beat all those countries with one aircraft strike group in less than a week
>Saudi arabia and brazil
The frick do you think life is, game of thrones or something? Total war? Why the frick would Saudi Arabia and Brazil want to go to war with the US let alone be able to threaten them? Russia's had to invest a lion's share of their army in Ukraine but they don't have to worry about a 'force in reserve' to stop the US in Vladivostok or China in Siberia because of fricking nukes.
Frick, you don't really think BRICSS is going to be some actual NATO do you?
Brazil is unlikely but Saudi Arabia could very well turn against the US. They aren't exactly happy with the last ten years of their relationship with the US and have been pivoting more and more towards courting the Chinese and settling their differences with the Iranians.
The Saudi royal family know that they would be getting beheaded on live leak by Wahhabis if not for the US military.
>well they COULD turn against the US someday maybe
yeah okay
and what does that have to do with the Pacific theater?
the saudis do not look to the USA for protection anymore.
and the USA does not look to the saudis for energy anymore.
therefore the relationship is dead.
therefore, the saudis are looking for a new protector.
that protector is china, if you havent been reading the news for the last few weeks.
except china isnt dumber than a pile of dogshit steaming on the sidewalk (unllike the USA), and they have enabled/helped peace between the iranian and saudi powerblocks.
so china will get all the energy it needs from iran and saudi arabia but without the never fricking ending moron sand people wars that the USA created for some reason.
it is actually hilarious how easily they did it too. I would just like to point out that the entire situation could have been avoided if the anglo persian oil company would have treated its workers decently, and shared its profits with its host nation. but that was too much to ask aparently, so we paid trillions of dollars in wars instead.
The UK and the US being moronic about Iran and the Saudis during the last century doesn't mean that those countries are going to be friends.
The Saudis ASKED the US to get involved during both Gulf Wars to protect them (the first one was the reason Bin Laden was mad against the US), and their current King is a stupid spoiled thug butthurt because the West was forced to call him so after tyhe Kashoggi affair, even if we've been helping them with arms in their war against Yemen (that they still haven't been able to win because they're fricking useless and corrupt)
The Iranians will never stop hating for religious reasons the corrupt Saudis, even if their moronic boomer leaders need a life line to keep their young population in line.
The chinese "peace deal" is not going to last. They're been used by these countries, not the other way around.
That map is wrong about Europe. There still resources and mines, but they're not exploited by enviromental/strategic reasons or because it's cheaper to buy them from other countries.
the map in
is specifically about copper deposits and the question of IF those former deposits can be mined (since its mainly former copper mines which noone really knows how accessible and fruitful they are) if you go to the USGS website you can filter out by mineral and it shows roughly the same deposit locations and lack thereof.
But even your map demonstrates the lack of REEs pretty well aside from 3 exploration efforts in finland theres nothing there, same goes for platinum, vanadium and others. It gets worse when you look at the actual definitions of suspected deposits, for example the light green areas in the copper map is copper that /might/ be within 3km depth.
I' dont want to split hairs and all, but it's pretty clear massive amounts of resources are flowing from africa, australia and china into the west compared to what europe could produce on its own. and access to those resources might be contested.
Not even trying
'For example,
an Upper Ordovician horizon may rank as one of the largest
concentrations of HREEs in the world. This nearly horizontal
horizon occurs at, or just below the surface, over an area of
2,000 square kilometers (km2) in northern Arkansas (fig. 8).
Samples from more than 100 km2 of this 1.5-m-thick horizon
have remarkably homogenous REE abundances, estimated to
comprise 235 Mt of phosphate rock with 1.3 Mt of extractable
total REE, of which 0.37 Mt are HREE, which is nearly twice
the HREE content of the south China clays deposits"
https://pubs.usgs.gov/circ/1454/circ1454.pdf
The REEs in sedimentary phosphorites are nearly 100 percent extractable, using technologies currently (2019) used in the phosphate fertilizer industry in the United States (Emsbo and others, 2015). The scale of the domestic fertilizer industry, which produces 30 million metric tons per year, suggests that byproduct REE production from phosphate mines could meet much of the Nation’s HREE demand
>so china will get all the energy it needs from iran and saudi arabia but without the never fricking ending moron sand people wars that the USA created for some reason
naive take, you'll remember me in 5 years
>and Taiwan will gain dam-busting supremacy within an hour
Red Chinamen talk big about colonizing North America and using bioweapons to do it, and they've been caught red handed, shown that whatever they did manage to bioengineer could be simple gene-edited in a matter of months worse case scenario, and their 'post-Soviet' ally is just as much a cargo cult basket case as they are. It's bull baiting at this point and a practical joke on a geopolitical scale.
>We bribed African primitives, so our resource extraction factories abroad will be safe
Recent events demonstrated how that will go, and entirely with plausibly deniable impunity.
>"No, we do not [think about the cost of borrowing for the USA itself]. In other words, that's... fiscal dominance. IF we were constrained in our monetary policy by the budgetary situation of the USA (and we're not, we're clearly not) the path we're on is not sustainable but the level of debt that we have is not unsustainable.
>"Is not" is sustainable, put it that way. So we don't think about interest costs when we make monetary policy, we think about maximum employment and price stability." — Jerome Powell, March
'Petrodollar' is a meme and not required to exert the kind of influence you're alluding to. "There's room in the world for more than one reserve currency." -- Also Powell. And the switch from LIBOR to SOFR finalized in the last dribs and drabs this summer was instrumental in that.
Because you sell that 7 Year Strategic Grain Reserve like it's Russian Tank ERA, and are the biggest energy importer in the world.
>the rogue province
An even worse canard than Han hegemony.
>One quick strike would remove the US from the Pacific
MAD = "You can first strike us 100% successfully, and our subs alone will glass you into the Stone Age by themselves, because we will not negotiate or submit to nuclear blackmail under any conditions, even 'defeat'"
>Nicaragua
oh noo
Wait doesn't USA still have basing rights in Bermuda?
>Cyprus split into two
Will never stop leling that they spend decades trying to kick the Brits out. Kick the Brits out (while the Brits kept the important parts) and then immediately get invaded by Turkey. Almost like they shouldn't have kicked the Brits out.
>Turkey
*Türkiye
>Niger
Why?
Despite
Why not?
America loves nigers
so does china though
America has a base in Åland islands in the Baltic?
Yes, but you're forgetting the fact that Chinese planes are about 30 years behind the US. They still don't have an actual 5th generation fighter. The Chengdu J-20 has less impressive stealth technology than the B-2, apparently not even being able to be called a "stealth" aircraft, despite the entire design behind it relegating it to that category. Basic Indian radar was able to detect the J-20, so I have literally zero fears about China "dominating the air". It's like that border-line moronic kid in class that says he'll kick everyone's ass and constantly brags about how he knows karate, then gets his ass handed to him when he inevitably picks a fight.
I usually ignore threat assessments from the pentagon anyway; they are designed from the ground-up to instill fear in the US public and convince congress to bend over and increase the national defense budget.
Congrats on being so confidently moronic
https://basicsaboutaerodynamicsandavionics.wordpress.com/2023/01/15/f-35-vs-j-20-vs-su-57-radar-scattering-simulation-summary/
Leaked paper in question: The flight data suggest that it had an average speed of Mach 9 throughout the flight.
Those are not for taiwan lol
Naturally, majority are for the US. It doesn't take much to shut down somewhere like Guam with things like these.
OH MY GOD, YOU MEAN CHINA IS GOING TO USE THEIR CHEAPLY MADE DOG SHIT DRONES FOR RECON THAT CAN SIMPLY BE SWIPED OUT OF THE AIR WITH A STANDARD STINGER MISSILE?
>Stinger max reach 3800 meters
>Wz-8 max altitude 50000 meters
Stingers aint it moron kun, i bet you think tanks are irrelevant as well due to modern manpats
>THAT CAN SIMPLY BE SWIPED OUT OF THE AIR WITH A STANDARD STINGER MISSILE?
tell me you're a dumb frick without telling me you're a dumb frick: the post.
Imagine being a civilian coping and seething this hard over some other nation’s military having a fast aircraft lol. What a loser lmaooo
>supersonic reconaissance drones
Didn't the Americans have this technology in the 60s
Yes and we ditched it. Supposedly these things actually travel (not what China touts) at Mach 3 or about the cruising speed of an SR-71.
Where do I get the files?
just give up.
i have been telling this board for years that china is a huge problem. they refuse to acknowledge it. the US is fricked. the only thing that can clean away the decades of intransigent, calcified, corruption and arrogance is a major strategic defeat. The only thing we can hope for at this point is that it happens soon, so that the USA has the time to reform and recover before it is irreversible.
dilate chang
see?
neolibs and neocons have too much money already invested in china. they are now employing bots to shit on all warnings about china. when the USA is defeated, our economic and political elites will simply take their wealth and fly to dubai or israel or new zealand or switzerland. They literally dont care.
they do care though. They cant rule over the US if the chinks rule over the US. Like everybody knows a chinese hegemony is worse than an american one. You think the euro's are gonna harbor filthy capitalist americans if they were to flee? get real.
And they're not only using bots to say "everything is fine". they are also using shills to say "omg, only this product from Lockheed Martin can save us from the chinese! Vote for higher tax right now!" Which is basically what all this CNAS/CSIS thinktanks are.
They don't care about ruling over the US if they can just go to some other neutral country with a higher standard of living. If you're rich like Ray Dalio, you get to easily choose instead of being tethered to the country of birth like the rest of the population.
Thanks for sharing anon. What would you suggest to as a solution?
I dont think there is one.
its too late.
We having been trying to pivot to Asia for what.... 10 fricking years?
And somehow the political and economic elites keep pulling us into bullshit distraction wars while china grows larger.
At this point, i literally believe that the wars of the last 20 years were specifically engineered to distract the population from our country being hollowed out and our workers being turned into baristas and subprime mortgage salesmen while china puts literal secret police stations on American soil.
The only way to stop it, is to immediately enact massive economic sanctions on china with our allies helping.
If the US can keep its allies on side, its still in the stronger position. Cold war 2 except this time with the nicer, more functional half of the soviet union on the western side is pretty lopsided.
As nice as the half of the soviet union on the western side is, there's no way they'll be capable of providing more than token contributions if were talking a Taiwan war scenario. Which is the one thing that's holding America's superpower status together. They're great for telling Russia to frick off, not China, who is several oceans away. Maybe in an overall sense even if on the small chance that Taiwan is lost, but I can't see remaining US influence having much leverage in that event.
>several oceans away
You should study geography and history . Burgers have always projected more power in the Pacific then in Eastern Europe , now more then ever . Also Iraq is actually several oceans away and they kicked them around just fine .
Americans aren't in doubt but that post was talking about the nicer, more functional half of the soviet union states as allies. Who don't possess any reasonable power projection capabilities to operate in the pacific on their own.
> the only thing that can clean away the decades of intransigent, calcified, corruption and arrogance is a major strategic defeat
Too bad our enemies are fricking Russians and chinks lmao.
And holy projection.
>intransigent
China is still controlled by one party communists m8. Russia is run by kgb pedos trying to recreate the Soviet Union. How is the US refusing to change compared to a country with a dictator that’s ruled for like 24 years and a country with a dictator that just re-elected themself and purged all dissenters?
>calcified corruption
Russia and China are some of the most corrupt places in the world lol
Like if these are all things that are killing the US, why aren’t they also killing the countries that are even worse?
yes china is corrupt.
but it is nationalist corruption.
the USA has neoliberal and corporate corruption which has zero loyalty to the USA or its people.
there are examples of american CEOs literally defending slavery in china with lobbyists on behaf of the CCP. they have been captured by the CCP.
i guess it is debatable which form of corruption is worse.
>China is still controlled by one party communists m8. Russia is run by kgb pedos trying to recreate the Soviet Union. How is the US refusing to change compared to a country with a dictator that’s ruled for like 24 years and a country with a dictator that just re-elected themself and purged all dissenters?
Well the USA is ruled by wiener suckers like bill kristol and larry sommers. who have been in and out of power for 30 years themselves. and they havent changed their ideas at all over that time. if you havent noticed anything over the last 7 years, the government/corporate establishment in the USA is capable of purging virtually anyone it wants from public power or even the right to speak privately on issues.
>Too bad our enemies are fricking Russians
i guess i just dont see russia as a credible threat. and i dont understand why people lose their shit over them.
The USA also has a nationalist corruption. You don't see it, and don't want to because you equate the old abrahamic moral virtues with the nation. But they're not seeing it that way. The equate the state of the cash flow with the state of the nation.
When neoliberals push for homosexuality and anti-racism they are making a cooperative fighting and working force of men with no loyalties that can't be bought. They disarm you so they can choose who is armed. When corporatists strip away your rights and destroy the environment they are utilizing that growing rootless mercenary base.
>No blacks, no whites, no christians
>Just Americans
>nationalist corruption is good
Lol that’s a big cope.
> i guess it is debatable which form of corruption is worse
No it isn’t. You’re just a chinaman so you have to pretend like it’s equivalent.
corruption =/= corruption
We see a lot of corruption in the US, especially with the regards to how and where military contracts are fulfilled. ("Noooo, my district needs jobs too") The result of that is coming on 200% over budget with maybe a delay here and there because everybody who wants a piece of the pie needs to be happy. At absolute worst it's a lobbyist parking a brand new mercedes in some senators driveway. But think about it, all the biggest blunders in US procurement weren't the companies selling or making a shit product. It was always the military procurement dreaming to big, or dreaming about the wrong thing.
Now contrast that with russian corruption, where a guy sells off half of the base on ebay to get that nice vacation he always wanted. The end result being clear.
China is also very corrupt, but they have a superior surveillance state. Chang selling off his tank treads isn't gonna fly here. Their corruption is on another level: Xi Jinping is head of the chinese CMC. Imagine if joe biden was solely charge of the pentagon and every senior officer has to go through him if he wants to make general or admiral. Well, he's gonna be surrounded by yes-men sooner or later, because everybody gets shitcanned. Thats how china works. You either get with the program or you get gone. And while this seems like the liberal dream come true, it also means that you end up with a lot of confirmation bias with noone even questioning if something might be stupid. And this goes down to the junior level, like a chinese NCO isn't going to be judged for his cool thinking under fire. he's going to be judged according to whatever manual they have and any deviation is unacceptable.
>i have been telling this board for years that china is a huge problem. they refuse to acknowledge it. the US is fricked.
The problem with doomers like you is not getting that this game has been rigged since the start, just like it was with Japan in the 70-80s. The West didn't simply gave China their factories so our rich buttholes could simply become middlemen counting money for doing nothing (although that's a thing, sure).
China was given a mutually beneficial deal but with built in assurances. We're their biggest customer, they buy our debt to the point it would be a problem for them if we didn't pay, they play under the banking and economic system controlled by us, key hi-tech bottlenecks aren't shared with them, and they depend on sea trade and oil supply that can be cut off at any time by the US Navy, besides all their butthurt neighbours. We locked them in an economic MAD situation.
Of course this wasn't perfect and they're trying to get away from this with delusions of grandeur, but you understimate the West if you think nobody saw this coming and we don't have ways to answer to their attempt to subvert our hegemony. The hi tech semiconductor embargo has been just the first shot of this.
Remember than the West is still basically 2/3+ of the world's economic power. China has never been the master in this retationship, and they know it. That's exactly why they're butthurt about it.
tbh thats not entirely accurate. the US-china relation basically had two stages:
>1 Nixon wants to build china up as a counterweight to the USSR
>2 Clinton normalizes trade relations and gets china into the WTO because "trading free makes china free"
While the first one was a "success", in combination with 2 it built the biggest communist nation on the planet. Far more powerful than the USSR ever was economically.
The second one was an obvious failure that basically only got rectified in 2018 on paper, but we're still waiting on actual work being done to reverse the policy.
It's also worth mentioning that the strategy behind chinese IP theft (and legal acquisition of foreign companies) heavily plays into this. For example a lot of western GPD is based on creating value from raw resources: making a high tech robot and selling it. China takes the role of the supplier for the raw resources. So china has acquired not the super high-tech stuff that we keep under lock and key, but it has acquired the equipment that makes that stuff. Whether its boeing or lockheed martin - go through their production facilities and I bet you good money at least half of their robots or assembly equipment is made in or owned by china. This also goes for the actual expertise by sending hundreds of thousands of politically trusted students to the US and europe. So at best the "MAD" is heavily skewed toward china, because they hold the resources that we use to make stuff, or they are even capable of building stuff themselves. And you are also assuming the "west" would be united in the china question, which it clearly is not, not only because many western nations have a more one-sided relationship with china.
China doesn't have the actual raw resources or the customer base to sustain their economy, both things are in westernized foreign countries or heavily influenced by them. The nature of modern capitalism also makes them vulnerable like us to sudden market disruptions, like what happened with the supply chain issues during Covid (This is part of the MAD situation). They also have a lot of internal economic and structural issues that are becoming worse and not better.
Sure, they have been making moves to get away from this. But unless they go full moron with war like Russia, they can't do it fast enough so the West is left behind, as the semiconductor issue has proven. They also have already fricked up a few of their soft-power attempts in Africa or South America due to cultural differences, and those coutries just like them as a counterweight to the West, not as substitutes (they've been more sucessfull in SEA, though)
Just like with Japan decades ago, we're going to see a gradual displacement of manufacturing to other cheaper countries the more China tries to use their economic power. And unlike Japan in the 90s, China still hasn't reached a comfy development plateau: they need to keep grinding or they will fall behind again.
Their only winning move is to actually keep playing along and Russia as their b***h as a consolation price.
the universal shift that happened in the west was that as countries become richer, they get a middle class and thus become consumers instead of producers. We like to think of china in the same way, but china is basically 2 countries: "rich" cities and impoverished countryside. so they can basically shift production internally, both population-wise and location wise.
The actual supply of raw resources varies greatly, as does the ability to actually mine them. For example europe basically has close to zero access to rare earth elements on their home turf (pic related) the closest bigger deposit is in russia.
1/2
the map was taken from https://mrdata.usgs.gov/nicrpge/map-us.html
which actually shows most non fuel mineral deposits and suspected deposits. Of particular note is the lack of platinum, chromium and nickel in the west, with an additional lack of copper in europe.
The long and short of it is that china pretty much has all resources at home or in russia, whereas the status is questionable for a few things in the west:
>mineability in central europe (millions of people live on top of those mines now, environmental concerns and so forth)
>"closed mines" closed due to profitability or due to exhaustion? (red is former copper ore producers for example)
US manufacturing 11%
US DOD 2.9%
https://apps.bea.gov/iTable/?reqid=150&step=2&isuri=1&categories=gdpxind#eyJhcHBpZCI6MTUwLCJzdGVwcyI6WzEsMiwzXSwiZGF0YSI6W1siY2F0ZWdvcmllcyIsIkdkcHhJbmQiXSxbIlRhYmxlX0xpc3QiLCI1Il1dfQ==
So 11.1% of 25T is 2.2775T vs
25% of 16.86T is 4.215T
So by this crude metric china has double the manufacturing of the USA.
CIA world fact book has China GDP at $24.861 trillion in 2021 est.....
And Current value added manufacturing at 27%
https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/NV.IND.MANF.ZS?locations=CN
The US is fricked.
You forget two things:
1.The US is not alone, their interests vs. China overlap with pretty much the rest of the westernized world
2.Most of China's production is consumer goods for westernized countries and they don't have the internal demand to cover for them, and non-westernized countries do not have the money
We're no longer in the 1940s. The modern global economy doesn't give China the room to cut ties without the West being aware and ready for it in advance. We made them need us much like we need them, and anything else means losing money for both. That's the rational position unless they go full moron out of butthurt pride like Russia.
>china so scary we need mo' money fo' dem carrier groups
t. usn
Meanwhile, Pentagon claimed that Russia would overtake Ukraine in a week. Yet here we are.
It really works for everyone. Pentagon scare mongers everyone into being hyper prepared while also giving their propagandists shit to become over-confident about. They show up underprepared and wienery and we show up insanely prepared and anxious about every possible variable.
>we
Which combat division are you serving in currently?
Nunya
more like none, jej
K. Do you count being a chink shill as military service? Why is some foreign asiatic LARP accusing anyone else of lying?
>I try and be pedantic about a citizen showing pride in his nations military capabilities
This doesn't make you look clever it just makes you look like a gay.
implessive
Implessive
velly implessive
>It's another take things out of context episode
Why OP
oops I guess we will have to give them access to our early warning systems tee hee
Implessive posters on life support. Every lie we make denying Chinese power is a debt to the truth which must be repaid.
China holds air superiority over Taiwan, but that's not speaking of what happens when the US/partners get involved.
Nor does it compensate for the fact that if China wants the island, they need to land on it and take it, and that is far more easy said than done. Taiwan survives purely because of its natural defense, just as Britain survived WW2 because of theirs. Operation Xilöwe is not gong to happen.
>if China wants the island, they need to land on it and take it, and that is far more easy said than done
No they don't, they can easily just blockade the island and siege it into starvation. Taiwan completely lacks both food and energy security.
Then the US runs the blockade and tells China to try and stop them.
That's most likely what the PLA is factoring into anyway. Which is why they haven't (yet) pulled the trigger. But if/when they're willing to, they aren't tied to the option of ONLY doing an amphibious invasion like so many think.
Which is stupid because it doesn't actually take the island and it very quickly removes any positive sentiment towards China. All while the PLAN is bust trying to hold a blockade, while now defending their own land from attacks.
China lost its chance to gain Taiwan's support organically and they've also lost any element of initiative, the Asia and the West saw China's open threats and is now countering them. So the day where China feels "ready" for war will not actually come. Not unless they want to do the same as Russia and go do-or-die on a national scale.
>All while the PLAN is bust trying to hold a blockade
What makes you think you need a continuous presence of naval assets to hold a blockade? This is the 21st century, not WWI - WWII era. Blow up the ports, blow up their machinery, mine the waters, and nothing feasibly gets in or out of Taiwan. Vast majority of merchant ships won't be willing to go to Taiwan anyway since shipping companies will not be willing to insure.
>Make your own coast, sea lanes and import routes for food and energy a war zone
Might as well nuke Shanghai and hope the radiation blows east.
It's a lot worse for Taiwan than it is China. China has land routes to make up for some of the loss, and a huge newfound ally to the north to get cheap commodities and essentials. Painful for sure, but the people are nationalistic enough and the state irredentist enough to feasibly pull this off when push comes to shove.
It would kill both China and Taiwan, and that assumes SK, Japan and the US won't just break any blockade. Which they would. After Taiwan is ruined it loses all value to China, which then merely sits on top of the rubble.
A war is a lose lose situation for China, which benefits greatly from trade with a functioning and free Taiwan. Chinese are crazy, but their elites are smart enough to play along and not act on these feelings.
You are moronic. Governments can just order civilian shipping to move goods, by the way. Believe it or not, no war has ever been affected by insurance companies.
Okay. And how are they going to unload anything if all the ports are busted up and the port machinery blasted to pieces, genius?
Blockading the largest fleet of modern warships of the world with a fleet of outdated 30yr old ships... good luck
So then why isn't the blockade already in place?
Then why haven't the Chinese attacked yet? Are they cowards?
They have the capability but peaceful reunification is always preferable. Of course that's easier said than done so the buildup continues to get the most efficiency out of a war scenario or at least act as an effective deterrence to force peaceful reunification
>screeches and throws a tantrum for an old land landing in Taiwan
>peaceful
You can drop the "we actually want le pweaceful reunification, we're not scared of the US" shtick.
Thanks, it'll be fun to see what two of the three largest airforces in the world can really do. Is the F-35 actually shit? Is stealth actually a big deal? Is datalink as cool as it sounds like? We'll see!
>he thinks china has more major surface combatants than the USN
pretty hilarious post anon. you have 7 055s and 25 052Ds. Only the 055s are possible up to par with US ships. The US has 70 burkes and 17 Ticos. Throw in even a tiny contribution from the UK, Japan and Australia and you've got over 100 major surface combatants. Quantitative and qualitative superiority.
Do you wanna talk about submarines next? It's very embarrassing for the chinks.
Not all of those are going to be brought against China because america needs a decent chunk of them elsewhere due to global commitments.
Also ignoring the fact that all ticos are slated for decommission by 2027 with no full replacement until DDG(X) realistically in the mid-2030s.
Or that a good chunk of those burkes are older, less capable flight I and flight IIs. 052Ds are absolutely comparable to these.
You're also not factoring in China's Coast Guard and Maritime Militia whatsoever, which any serious assessment of PLAN capabilities would never leave out.
Rate of procurement also matters. China has reached a point where every year they lay down far more hulls than USN shipyards can keep up with, at a lower cost and with a far greater labor pool of skilled engineers to select from. China make multiple 052Ds, 054As, and 055s for every burke III laid.
We haven't even gotten towards factoring in the PLAAF into all of this.
The USN has better subs, but chinese ASW isn't exactly known. It would be foolish to think that they haven't developed some degree of countermeasures.
https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/41478/china-tested-an-ai-controlled-submarine-hunting-underwater-drone-a-decade-ago-report
>far greater labor pool of skilled engineers to select from.
>China
Kek, with regards.
They do. You don't become the world's largest shipbuilder without a strong talent pool that has both the funding and the know-how.
Point is, their shipyards aren't exactly hurting for labor. Can you say the same for bath iron works?
>You don't become the world's largest shipbuilder
>strong talent pool
>know-how
>China
You should become a comedian, if you already aren't that is.
Do you think the US is the largest shipbuilder? How up to date is your info regarding any of this? Because relying on outdated 20 year info is a sure way to get blindsided
Not the largest shipbuilder, but soon to be the only real space colonizer
Look are you not able to fricking read? I'm clearly insinuating that China builds low quality trash. If China went to war with my dog tomorrow, I would put my life savings on my dog. That's how little faith I have in the trash that China fields.
>I'm clearly insinuating that China builds low quality trash
Okay, continue confirming that your only source for any of this is outdated /k/ memes based on a perception that is continuously 20 years out of date.
I think I'd rather trust current CSIS assessments over relying on your enemy to remain incompetent based on old, outdated info.
What modern chinese kit has been used in action anon?
>America spams jasms and B2s at every single CCP mil airfield and staging point
It's so fricking over west bros
there arent even enough old shit tomahawks to even keep two or three of those Chinese bases closed down for more than a few days.
>he thinks they'll strike the mainland
would look identical to a first strike. escalation risks are too great
Taiwan is so close that mainland can literally send 100s of thousands of missiles to destroy everything
Vely implessive
>muh ballistic missiles
I sleep
>paki rape gangs
source that isn't your dad's facebook
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotherham_child_sexual_exploitation_scandal
>decade old nothingburger
next you'll tell me about justin trudeau's blackface
What are you, some kind of liberal?
Yeah all the rape gangs and not the corrupt Conservative Party getting bought by Russian shills for Pennies and pushing for the uk to commit economic and geopolitical suicide, it was those darn browns!
>brings up RusBlack folk out of nowhere
meds now, schizo
>don’t bring up how the conservatives are guilty of treason and actively conspired with a foreign adversary to destroy the future of the country noooooo
homosexual.
Unironically unhinged. Meds. Now.
lmao you're british
British mom and Uk passport. Went from being able to frick around in all of Europe ez pz to basically having an america jr passport.
Now I’m rooting for Scotland to break away and rejoin the EU because then I could have an actual useful passport again.
You struggle with English and spam the same go-to talking points regardless of what anyone says. You should have a nice day 🙂
>bongistani moron
>doesn't own guns
Why are you here?
I’m technically a gun dealer. You’re a foreign culture wars tribalism wienersucker.
And I’m here because I’m currently sitting in line at the pot store and shitposting to look busy. I don’t need to axe why you’re here tho do I? You making them schmekels bb
Russia Russia Russia
You are a Russian shill
Russia Russia Russia
You should commit suicide
see
Whataburger was ok and I feel like I may have gone to a Culver’s in nc but idk.
Do you think that russian shills are at the point of spamming about russian shills, or are you just doing that russian shill thing where you no u the buzzwords?
Wtf is picrel?
>I'm a gun dealer
Sure you are vatBlack person. have a nice day homosexual.
Meds schizo. You drank your own Kool-aid. Suck start a shotgun homosexual.
Verification not required.
>British mom and Uk passport. Went from being able to frick around in all of Europe ez pz to basically having an america jr passport.
Sweden has deported 1500 britbongs after britland left EU. It was pretty brutal, some of them had their families and jobs here, then got a notice that said that they are evicted and have to leave in 14 days. Meanwhile we have several hundred thousand illegals that the authorities are completely unable to find and deport.
nu/k/ is such trash jesus christ
>I don't like when people point out my hypocrisy!!
It's usually weird when people do like it so at least you're "normal"
>You severely underestimate how much the Global South distrusts the west.
Funny, Imperial Japan said the same. China is a global butthole and people quickly realize it once they get involved. The West isn't so "evil" by comparison when you see the alternative.
>Blow up the ports, blow up their machinery, mine the waters, and nothing feasibly gets in or out
Again, the instant China does this, the favor gets returned. Along with any Chinese-flagged vessel becoming liable to seizure or destruction.
This warfare all sounds easy in theory when you just predict the enemy won't react. That's why no one has fired a first shot. Everyone knows it's not going to end well for either side.
Imperial Japan wasn't the largest trade partner of majority of the world's countries at the time, try again. Between enabling their economic survival or siding with some literal island non-country, they're gonna pick the former. You already see this with majority of Global South countries defying western sanctions against Russia
>Mug largest trade partner
Peddling cheap shit. In return for food to feed their own population.
China's economy folds the instant their factories come under fire and the embargo/blockade starts.
I don't think you'll want Arab Spring x 1000 because you decide to bomb China and now countries can't feed themselves. Have fun with the eventual European refugee situation that would cause.
There will be no refugees because every able-bodied Chinese citizen will be working or fighting for their government. And all invalids will be liquidated. Anyone saying otherwise would be guilty of treason and demoralization.
China is the only side which is going to start a war. The West and rest of Asia is content with letting things ride as they are because they all still benefit. So long as Taiwan stands, China is contained and free trade remains possible. No further action is needed unless China begins a war.
By refugees that would also include all the countries whose economies get ravaged by the conflict extending because they rely heavily on Chinese trade. So essentially refugees from all the countries in red here
>Peddling cheap shit.
China produces the bulk of the medications used in the world, either as precursor chemicals or as final products. A break with China would cause serious personal problems for approximatively 15-20% of americans. F.ex overweightness and obesity is really dangerous if you dont use blood pressure medications. I dont see America moving to reestablish its own chemical industry, so the hot air coming from Washington is just hot air, fanned by the american military industrial complex so that there can be more monies for them programs, programs that are never meant to be more than money sinks that produce a handful of botique hand crafted weapons.
Hungry people are dangerous. Hyperglycemic people are dead.
>With any Chinese flagged vessel liable to seizure or destruction
Lmao good thing very few Chinese owned cargo ships are actually Chinese flagged. Its a common practice to pick some random shithole island nation to register a ship with. Most countries do this.
>Why would they care about some insignificant island they don't even diplomatically or legally recognize as its own sovereign country, as opposed to their most significant trade partner who is also a bulwark against a century of western aggression?
Because fricking with that island can significantly frick the entire global economy, start enough shit on that island and suddenly the rate of fresh electronics coming out every week drops to a crawl and everyone's IT infrastructure is on a clock until production can be established elsewhere which will take many years.
That would be seen as the fault of US meddling by the majority of the world, not China. Everyone would prefer peace, even if it means peaceful reunification of Taiwan with the mainland. Nobody wants a war instigated by recent aggressive US foreign policy moves (Pelosi visit, CHIPS act, Huawei ban, Philippines bases, etc)
According to who? China and its lapdogs? Everyone knows China could just not act like a conquering dictatorship like they always have. Everyone also knows China lies and tries to frick with people's sovereignty internationally. Everyone knows they don't need Taiwan to grow their economy, they just want to be powerful for the sake of power like most dictators.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_police_overseas_service_stations
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/china-accused-of-creating-overseas-police-stations-to-target-dissidents?
https://edition.cnn.com/2023/04/17/americas/fbi-arrest-china-police-station-intl-analysis/index.html
China could just try not to be aggressive and it wouldn't have any issues right now, it's denied that soley because of its own moronation, similar to Russia.
Everything you are saying about China applies to the US on a far greater scale. Bombing Yugoslavia, invading Iraq/Afghanistan, arming Syrian fundamentalists further destabilizing the region, assassinating Iranian personnel, attempting to coup Bolivia and Venezuela, plunging Libya into civil war, meddling in Ukraine- all of this in the past 30 years. And that doesn't even scratch the surface of the cold war era meddling.
Your extreme projection is showing. It's exactly this hypocrisy that the global south sees and is distrustful of, something that China offers an alternative to. Where the US brought hundreds of thousands of deaths and lopsided deals that favor foreigners over their own nation, China brought food, infrastructure, and stability. Why wouldn't they simply see the US entering on the side of the rogue province as just another step in their meddling as they've always done? Why would the global south give a damn over Taiwan by going against China, their major partner, so that the US could eventually focus on taking them down too via coups, funding rebels, destabilizing the region, plundering the land for foreign companies, enforcing sanctions...?
The conquering dictator is not China, but the US, and you are simply too blind to realize it
At least in the USA I can speak out and expect a chance at justice if regional party secretary Bang Ding Ow’s son drunkenly runs over my granny. And that, my dear Chang, is worth all the mideast misadventures in the world.
>And that, my dear Chang, is worth all the mideast misadventures in the world.
Based and true.
>meddling in Ukraine-
Sorry Ivan, you don't get to fiddle Ukrainian kiddies with impunity. You are foghting and dying in screaming agony for nothing more than the ego of your current czar and his typical attempted soviet landgrab. have a nice day.
Implessive.
>Bombing Yugoslavia
I wasn't aware preventing genocide was account to being a "conquering dictator"
>Invading Iraq
Were about to invade Kuwait, got what they deserved, less so the 2nd time though
>Afghanistan
Killing thousands of your citizens should always provoke retaliation, if you argue otherwise then it's pretty certain you're just an angry wumao.
>Arming Syrian fundamentalists
Syria was always a frickup, but the source of the conflict ain't the US. Also Assad is just another Putin shill, so in retrospect you can't really trust anything he says.
>Assassinating Iranian personnel
Iran's government sucks ass and deserves it, I don't need to say more.
>attempting to coup Bolivia and Venezuela
I sure like commies. It should be noted that this kind of foolery was very popular back when geopolitical "realists" were popular, like Kissinger. Not so much anymore, times change.
>plunging Libya
Pretty much on France. But same shit, just some genocide and a hammer.
>meddling in Ukraine
Russia deserves all the meddling it can get. It's the antithesis of an "innocent" on the field of geopolitics.
>[Headcanon]
Didn't read.
The lengths people like you will go to deflect blame and justify naked aggression, while accusing others of doing the same, never surprises me any more. It's all the same with people like you indoctrinated by ideology of decades.
不是我冤,是武举老爷冤!
Saddam deserved it
What the US did to Iraq was far worse than what Saddam had ever done.
>blah blah blah my poor brownies
And I care?
动态网自由门 天安門 天安门 法輪功 李洪志 Free Tibet 六四天安門事件 The Tiananmen Square protests of 1989 天安門大屠殺 The Tiananmen Square Massacre 反右派鬥爭 The Anti-Rightist Struggle 大躍進政策 The Great Leap Forward 文化大革命 The Great Proletarian Cultural Revolution 人權 Human Rights 民運 Democratization 自由 Freedom 獨立 Independence 多黨制 Multi-party system 台灣 臺灣 Taiwan Formosa 中華民國 Republic of China 西藏 土伯特 唐古特 Tibet 達賴喇嘛 Dalai Lama 法輪功 Falun Dafa 新疆維吾爾自治區 The Xinjiang Uyghur Autonomous Region 諾貝爾和平獎 Nobel Peace Prize 劉暁波 Liu Xiaobo 民主 言論 思想 反共 反革命 抗議 運動 騷亂 暴亂 騷擾 擾亂 抗暴 平反 維權 示威游行 李洪志 法輪大法 大法弟子 強制斷種 強制堕胎 民族淨化 人體實驗 肅清 胡耀邦 趙紫陽 魏京生 王丹 還政於民 和平演變 激流中國 北京之春 大紀元時報 九評論共産黨 獨裁 專制 壓制 統一 監視 鎮壓 迫害 侵略 掠奪 破壞 拷問 屠殺 活摘器官 誘拐 買賣人口 遊進 走私 毒品 賣淫 春畫 賭博 六合彩 天安門 天安门 法輪功 李洪志 Winnie the Pooh 劉曉波动态网自由门
>protecting our CIA puppet states so we can force racemixing and sodomy on foreign populations as our ~~*masters*~~ bid
>WHY DO THEY HATE US?????
The eternal shartmutt
KEK. dumbass wumao chinksect, you killed 100 million of your own people through your terrible mismanagement and totalitarian dictatorship. Not to mention you're responsible for the hellish totalitarian dictatorship that is North Korea. Notice how all of those countries had problems with the US were unstable shitholes anyway regardless of of what the US did. You can't point to a chinese occupation as successful as South Korea or Germany, but I can point directly to China for the communist 1984 hellhole that is NK. You chinksects as still proping up that shithole today and even the Taliban don't lock up 4 generations of your family for speaking against the government.
This is unironically true. All countries are fricking buttholes thinking about their interests above all else. The thing is most of the world still sees siding with China as worse alternative to USA.
wow look at all that shit you wrote! At the end of the day, non-idealogically aligned countries will choose the devil they know. The US has a long track record, countries know what they're getting. What most everyone really prefers is a non-hegemonic power structure where they can get gifties from both sides. You know what no politicians actually care about? The shit you just listed!! None of that amounts to more than PR campaigns in the end. Realpolitik don't care.
Man, I didn't think I'd find firefly here
Shut the frick up Reapers
>Why wouldn't they simply see the US entering on the side of the rogue province as just another step in their meddling as they've always done?
Because china is doing this strategically. Of course they are going to be there with a smile and a ship full of food to deliver aid to the poor underprivileged of the world. But I think it's pretty clear that given a change in hegemon I doubt the chinese would pull off color revolutions or have steven colbert like figures appear on state tv.
They would take a much more hands on approach. It's like with the US you can *suspect* on being put into a FEMA camp until you're a good bootlicker. With the chinese it's a certainty.
>That would be seen as the fault of US meddling by the majority of the world, not China
If you think southeast asian countries will blame the USA for starting war in the south china sea I have a 99-year lease on a dam I could build you
Last time I checked, SEA was not majority of the world.
Vietnam would be uncomfortable admittedly, but there's a good chance their response will be muted because their economic prosperity depends on China as their largest trading partner. The political class wouldn't want to give that us.
Phillipines would be upset because they're effectively an american puppet (duterte being an aberration). But even they recently defied the US and affirmed that the US must not use their bases for the purpose of defending Taiwan-even they want nothing to do with it.
Everyone else in the region doesn't care and would prefer to remain neutral. Even if they did, so what? There is no alternative to Chinese trade in the region. Is the US suddenly going to supplant China with their nonexistent manufacturing, trade deals, and cheap labor? You can't wish your way out of a material reality, SEA states are hopefully smart enough to realize this and not rock the boat with respect to China.
>Last time I checked, SEA was not majority of the world.
Sure, but they're in Southeast Asia which is the location in question being discussed.
>There is no alternative to Chinese trade in the region. Is the US suddenly going to supplant China with their nonexistent manufacturing, trade deals, and cheap labor?
Every SEA nation stands to gain these things from a weakened China
Your idea of SEA just peacefully accepting Chinese reign is reminiscent of boomer talk on weibo
Not like China has had border skirmishes, or flat out wars, with all their SEA neighbors before. Or, if we want to bring up long past grievances, the history of Chinese colonialism across SEA. The USA is no saint, certainly not an ally, but is arguably more reliable and less violent than China is.
no you don't get it, all of these nations will flat-out ignore the opportunity to reject the 9-dash line forever, they'd prefer it that way
China goes against the US. Position of prime US manufacturer is up for grabs. Asia falls over itself to send their kids to make my nikes. Easy peasy, gg.
>Peace is giving an aggressor whatever they want because if you don't, they will attack you and it will be *your* fault
Again, you shouldn't be surprised, non-western countries (majority of the world's population) essentially take this stance already with respect to Russia and Ukraine. War is bad for everyone except those who profit from it, which is almost always the west
Taiwan would rather be red than dead, logically enough. They're not Ukraine and have never seriously suffered under Communism. They're just descendants of escaped Kuomintang as as such remain bugs. Hong Kong is not even interesting any more and once absorbed no one will care about Taiwan.
China should pursue economic and military overmatch then compel reunification. The objecting bugs can flee to the US.
>china can somehow take out all the vheeled anti-air systems on the island
Shayna can't even make a decent jet engine and fighting anti-air systems from afar is ridiculous. Conclusion: fake leak.
I am Peter John from the Texas Autonomous Economic Zone and am frightened of many basses and missiles of China. I write the regional administration asking to stop interfering with China internal affairs. Go the Cowboys!
You are Polish, and nobody in America is afraid of China invading the United States. That's a glowie fantasy.
Something I don't see getting brought up much is that China right now has an excess male population. You pair a stuttering economy (not dead by any means, but nothing like the growth of the last twenty years) with a lot of disenfranchised 16-35 year old males and that's a recipie for disaster and internal dissent.
Long term, China's middle-class and upper-class elite might decide to openly wage a war that they know they can't win just to kill off and scare off any possibly revolting males. If the hegemony of the west ends up on top, they can bet that the US/West treats them like 90's Russia and lets them reconsolidate power under a new government with some shit like 'capitalism with Chinese characteristics'.
If there's going to be a big war, I would think that China is more likely to declare against India than anything else. The strategic water sources on the border are still critical, not to mention India has recently just surpassed China in population count, making them an even bigger long term threat to China with their own population starting to decline.
yet another BUY WAR BONDS headline and twitter screencap thread on /k/
LMAO you severely underestimate how much everyone hates china, from indonesia to italy to even fricking peru , everyone hates china and wouldnt mind putting them in their place
They don't like China either but to think they prefer the US is peak delusion. China wasn't the one causing hundreds of civilian deaths in Indonesia for instance, that was the US with CIA involvement.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indonesian_mass_killings_of_1965%E2%80%9366
https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2017/10/the-indonesia-documents-and-the-us-agenda/543534/
What the frick is this? Go back to the fricking '60s with this talking point
>consequences from past historical events don't propagate into the present and future because..... They just don't, okay??!!?!!
You are as dense as a brick wall
Am I supposed to be surprised the CIA worked with a post-Colonial dictator to root out communism? Was the US supposed to not fight the Cold War?
You don't know shit about Indonesia-US relations. Stop posting, you're embarrassing yourself. Saying the Indonesians hate Americans because of their support of Suharto is like saying Vietnamese hate the US because of the Vietnam War. The truth is that people in both countries have far more mistrust of the Chinese, simply because the Chinese have always made trouble for them while with the Americans it was just the one time.
T. Lived in both countries for years.
Yeah, I never understood the idea that china would somehow unite the asiansphere when they all fricking loathe each other and are several orders of magnitude more racist toward each other than white people could have ever hoped to be.
The most expensive legal case in US history is about white people raping kids at a kindergarten. If you think this is unique to just the UK, you're moronic. Also, so what? Their leader is a billionaire brown person (who is Hindu, not Muslim). The funniest thing, he is part of the 'right wing' party while the 'left wing' party has lost literally every single 'first' to them. First female PM? First non-white PM? They're gonna have to try for first gay, black or transgender one soon.
Oh sorry, he has a net worth of $870m, my bad. Thought it was $1bn.
>Everyone in Asia hates the West and would ally with a fellow Asian nation in a heartbeat
>The US has done bad things and so they cannot complain about what others do
>Our navy is the biggest and its ships are immaculately maintained
>The American does not have the stomach for war
>One quick strike would remove the US from the Pacific
Where have I seen this before?
Inb4
>Well that was [then] when the US was the industrial power. [Now] China is the power!
No, China is the Dollar Tree of nations. Nobody buys anything because of quality, they buy it because of convenience. When it becomes a hindrance to do business with them then other sources will be sought or production returns home (as it should). Please, give America a reason to undo Nixon's mistake and bring domestic industry back.
What's China's answer to a blockade of the SEA straits anyway? Don't they get most of their energy from gulf sourced oil?
they don't have one which is why the party line is peaceful reunification. which countries besides china accept the 9-dash line? any surrounding nation will take advantage of the chaos and the USA is banking on the fact that it & nations neighbouring China will be positioned to benefit greatly from blocking them
Their answer is that the US would initiate a blockade there if they're stupid.
1) many US partners and allies in the region rely on the malacca strait remaining open, including japan and south korea. Blockading that means blockading their lifelines as a lot of them rely heavily on imports and aren't self sufficient.
2) a blockade wouldn't guarantee choking China's oil supply in an instant. They still have their strategic reserves to burn through. Recent studies around 2021 or so posit that they'd maintain current oil consumption for 3-5 years relying just on their strategic reserves, assuming a level of wartime rationing. That is not taking account China getting oil from countries like Russia or Iran as well. Not to even mention China having and producing their own oil. Not to mention also that Chinese society at large is far less dependent on oil than a place like the US. Things like effective public transit and push towards EVs demonstrates this.
All a malacca blockade would just show that the US is unable to defend their allies and face the Chinese missile umbrella head-on, and instead opting for a move that doesn't even help their situation whatsoever in curbing China in the short to medium term while making it actively worse for their partners in the area.
>Not to mention also that Chinese society at large is far less dependent on oil than a place like the US. Things like effective public transit and push towards EVs demonstrates this.
conveniently ignoring the fact that china uses coal where the rest use oil
That has no bearing on oil supply being supposedly constricted, which is the main argument at hand. Not whoever has the greener energy policy.
>on oil supply being supposedly constricted
Oil isn't the only thing being discussed, a blockade of China is in question. We aren't talking about the inability of oil to get to China by sea in a vacuum, in fact the consequences will be even worse as Mongolia is not capable of supplying the coal China consumes via naval import. This has nothing to do with green policy but good try
Almost always a blockade in the SEA straits circles back to talk of China running out of oil.
Okay fine, let's assume oil isn't the only thing being discussed. The point still stands, a blockade of China is effectively a blockade of Malaysia, Singapore, Indonesia, Vietnam, South Korea, Japan, etc. etc. You are effectively talking about a blockage of 60% of global trade by volume. Good luck pulling that off without effectively setting off economic nukes under the feet of your allies, who are far less sufficient than China is when it comes to core resources. Because if China isn't getting anything through the sea, you can guarantee that Japan and South Korea aren't as well.
>The point still stands, a blockade of China is effectively a blockade of Malaysia, Singapore, Indonesia, Vietnam, South Korea, Japan, etc.
Your entire premise hinges on these nations just sitting back and suffering instead of actively participating in the weakening of China. Based on your odd and consistent disregarding of the latter despite its historical precedence, I am going to say you are speaking entirely out of desire and not out of reality. All of the nations you mentioned would see China as the instigator and would see immediate benefits offered by the USA who would be acting in their interests by helping them thwart China.
>actually, we prefer the 9 dash line!
said no non-Chinese asian ever
My premise, or yours? Whoever the instigator is doesn't matter, just whoever gets the trade flowing so that a giant hole where Chinese trade used to be doesn't tear their economies into pieces. Look at the current conflict in Ukraine for an example of this. It doesn't matter how many UN votes were cast condemning Russia as the instigator- everyone buys Russian commodities, even US allies. because there is no alternative that doesn't involve prices shooting through the roof and populations erupting into open revolt. The US providing unproven security assurances doesn't suddenly make them no longer dependent on fertilizers from China. Unless if the US magically assures that it will be the new provider, which given what's been going on since the 70s with US manufacturing capability diminishing, I highly doubt that.
You are now openly fantasizing and expecting me to address your fantasies as if they are anything more than tangential to reality
Current reality isn't openly fantasizing. What IS openly fantasizing is you thinking that surrounding countries will just sit back and be okay with the US taking an economic hammer to their knees, in order to accomplish a military strategy of dubious importance, where the US has little comparable economic alternative to offer. Good luck with that.
>1) many US partners and allies in the region rely on the malacca strait remaining open, including japan and south korea. Blockading that means blockading their lifelines as a lot of them rely heavily on imports and aren't self sufficient.
You don't know how blockades work. Allied boats would be allowed through after an inspection.
Yeah, they would. And I'm sure they pinky promise sweared from the bottom of their heart that they won't be headed to china, either.
The Japs, SKs, and probably the Flips too will help us so it's not as big a deal as you want it to be. You're ignoring the political reality of the area moron
>SKs
https://asiatimes.com/2023/01/south-korea-would-play-role-in-a-taiwan-contingency/
"According to a survey conducted by the Seoul daily Joong-Ang Ilbo and the East Asia Institute in August, only 18% of respondents opposed any involvement of South Korea in a Taiwan contingency, while 22.5% said they would support its participation in the joint military operation with the US forces.
"In the same survey, 42% responded that South Korea’s military role should be limited to providing rear-area support for US forces."
In practical terms, 18+42=60% of south Koreans would prefer avoiding direct conflict with China. To use your own words against you, it's not as big as a deal as you want it to be 🙂
>Flips
https://www.scmp.com/week-asia/politics/article/3217607/us-cannot-store-arms-philippines-defend-taiwan-manila-says-friends-all-policy
I think this link says it all, really.
Wont argue against japan, LDP is probably crazy enough to do it. But it's not this grand coalition of the willing like you think it will be.
All of this changes the moment a shooting war starts, how you don't comprehend that I'll never understand
Ukraine is a good example of this change, the US and the UK in the '40s is another
Ukraine is a terrible example. Involved countries provide rear area support and token gestures of aid and that's it, because Russia won't bomb their cities so as long as they don't get directly involved due to how NATO is setup on the continent.
Likewise, China almost certainly won't lob missiles at other countries like South Korea and sending them back into the stone age so as long as they don't become directly involved. There's far more skin in the game there to not get involved, because getting involved ensures their civilisational collapse due to the force disparity, and the fact that there's no NATO-like setup to bail them out.
US and UK were empires in their own outright clashing with other empires challenging their place in the sun, of course they would get involved. Bad comparison #2, considering the countries we are talking about aren't exactly big players.
>Ukraine is a terrible example. Involved countries provide rear area support and token gestures of aid and that's it, because Russia won't bomb their cities so as long as they don't get directly involved due to how NATO is setup on the continent.
So in your mind SEAsia allows an empire to conquer as it pleases, and if they don't the US won't support them moreso than they are Ukraine?
>Likewise, China almost certainly won't lob missiles at other countries like South Korea and sending them back into the stone age so as long as they don't become directly involved.
Lets say the chinks don't, the norks will. And then things go to shit for china. But again, your assuming chinas regional rivals have no reason to stop them, they have many reasons.
>There's far more skin in the game there to not get involved, because getting involved ensures their civilisational collapse due to the force disparity, and the fact that there's no NATO-like setup to bail them out.
If SK is attacked a lot of people will get involved NATO or no NATO. Nations like Australia for example.
>US and UK were empires in their own outright clashing with other empires challenging their place in the sun, of course they would get involved. Bad comparison #2, considering the countries we are talking about aren't exactly big players.
Neither wanted war before it started, then when it did they threw everything they had at it. Being a big or small player is irrelevant.
Sure SEAsia would, why not? That's just simple realpolitik, which you seem to have a hard time understanding. It wouldn't even be an empire conquering whatever it pleases, since according to SEAsia (most of the world really except for about 5 or 6 no name countries like Somalialand), there is only one china per the one china policy and any matter between taiwan and china is an internal matter that has no bearing on actual foreign, non-chinese states. Going against that would mean going against international law and their own legal obligations, as well as stepping on a landmine for them in terms of keeping goods and services flowing.
>norks
Why the frick would North Korea get involved as long as South Korea stays out of it? You're not even making sense at this point.
Again, nations that don't feel like their very existence is threatened, isn't going to take the risk to go directly against their giant neighbor, which would pointlessly ensure their existential removal anyway. Which, being a smaller nation is absolutely relevant because they lack effective means of striking back, so again why take the risk seeing?
China taking over Taiwan is not an existential threat even for a nation like Vietnam.
>China taking over Taiwan is not an existential threat even for a nation like Vietnam.
Not that anon but you are moronic, if China get a hold of Taiwan, they will control the South China Sea, the entire of Asia will be under the mercy of the Chinese and I'm sure none of them will accept that.
Chinkshill, please. Just stop, it's embarrassing. No one anywhere in the whole of this green earth prefers China to the US, not even our mortal enemy Russia. Certainly not any of the SEA countries that can see the writing on the wall if China begins to develop anything that even remotely resembles power projection capability. This is what your argument amounts to:
>Hm, my neighbor just killed his roommate and now he's standing around the hallway with a gun
>This dude I know from upstairs has offered to help out, but you know what, he's kind of a dick and I prefer hallway dude
>Hallway dude would never attempt to enter my apartment, this is fine
>Damn, frick that guy upstairs though
Also if you're at the point where you're inspecting every ship, you're effectively doing a blockade anyway because ships are getting forever put on the waiting list. It's just not feasible given how much merchant shipping goes on in the area.
As a Japanese, I would gladly kill many chinks as possible, there’s no other more pleasurable thing in life than watching these wienerroaches being wiped off from the face of the earth
China won't defeat Taiwan.
They are less organized and experienced than Russian's military.
Even India and the Poos can keep up with China.
China just lies about everything.
It's ingrained into their culture.
Ever been to China?
It's a dumpster.
Think of the worse Afro-american crap hole in the US, the average Chinese city is far far worse than that.
That's how bad it is.
You have been asleep for the past 20 years if you sincerely believe any of this.
he's right about everything though? Outside a few mega cities and tourist traps, 90% of china look like this
In the last 20 years Taiwan became the global supplier of 5 nm chips
What has China accomplished with over ten times the population?
>What has China accomplished with over ten times the population?
being the most searched keyword over Liveleak and BestGore.
Becoming the #1 manufacturer or almost everything? This is cars for example.
There is a lot of wrong with China but claiming they achieved nothing is completely moronic. They are even starting to win the soft power war with shit like Genshin.
Anyone can manufacture
What in the frick is this cope? Have fun with everything being 5x more expensive.
You're right, Chinese are poor. More reason not to begin futile wars.
https://www.semianalysis.com/p/chinas-smic-is-shipping-7nm-foundry
https://www.ft.com/content/25509dc5-861b-4a6b-b07e-fa0e7a19009e
It's funny how you think China doesn't possess one of the world's top foundries for exactly this sort of thing. China's already on the cusp of 7nm process nodes, what other countries on the planet can even boast accomplishing that? Not even Intel has reached comparable lengths, it's really only South Korea and Taiwan. So China right now is 3rd, and they are rapidly catching up.
https://archive.is/ICuUO
>there are signs that China could already be well on its way to producing sub-14 nm chips. Semiconductor Manufacturing International Corp. (SMIC), China's largest contract chip producer, last year appeared to successfully produce 7 nm chips
>Under the CHIPS and Science Act, passed last year, the U.S. is funneling $52.7 billion into building, modernizing and expanding domestic chip production. The EU is mulling a plan to invest $46 billion.
>But even combined, these amounts pale in comparison to the 1 trillion yuan ($146 billion) package that China is said to be preparing.
It's so funny reading /k/ threads about China, it just shows perceptions of the country are completely, laughably out of date like
are signs
Wow, I don't care
Okay, continue sticking your head in the sand then
https://www.legacyresearch.com/the-daily-cut/americas-chip-war-against-china-will-backfire/
Reminder that you don't need EUV for making sub 7nm chips in case you bring up ASML restrictions. Not like it matters anyway considering that China is 100% capable of making such breakthroughs and possesses EUV machines of their own. It's not some magic that one whites are capable of understanding
k
Usually it's just dumb patriotic burgers thinking China is the same it was 30y ago. Shit is changing fast. The big problems chinks have tho are trash allies especially now after Russia turned out to be a complete joke.
Middle East seems to be realigning with China. China probably won't have any allies they can guarantee on in a pure war sense but the trade links they've been establishing are nothing to sneeze at. If they manage to woo the Saudis and they ditch the US that has huge implications right from the get-go.
If third worlders could form alliances without backstabbing each other, they wouldn't be third worlders.
Middle East is horribly unreliable and has nothing to offer beyond oil that is rapidly losing importance.
Chinks are getting vassal states in Africa and this is far more important. Cheap manufacturing lines are going to move there.
>Chinks are getting vassal states in Africa
correction: chinks are giving out long-term predatory loans to african countries and building infrastructure that will not get used. these debts will not get paid and china will not have any real way to collect when insurgents deny them access to "their" mines
Those deals are not about getting the money back.
that's cope and you know it. what are the deals for? to build roads with which the insurgents of the week will deny access to resources? do you even know how chinese troops have reacted to african insurgents?
None of this happened meanwhile chinks are building massive farms and plants protected by Chinese PMCs all over Africa.
>None of this happened
>proceeds to imply something even more nonsensical is taking place
stay off baidu as much
Anon go google chinese PMC. It's literally chink army pretending it's not.
Have you talked to any African about that? Debts trap is done by the West
Yep. My impression from speaking with them is that the Chinese are preferable because they don't ask too many questions compared to the IMF which often comes with strings attached. Not saying whether it's right or wrong but that's what I've heard
>there are signs that
signs of failure
>appeared to
"bro just trust me"
>is said to be preparing
80% of it will go straight into the pocket of corrupt politicians, the rest will be laundered through real estate projects, wow congrats, more ghost cities.
So when china catches up to ASML's current lead in a few years what will your next cope be then?
>current lead
the lead will have moved in a few years time
Unlikely. Current production methods used by ASML will not be applicable past certain advances in high-NA EUV lithography. Beyond that there requires a completely different approach. The current lead in the west isn't guaranteed once that plateau is reached and some other nation like China could very well break out of that plateau with the resources and know-how they're pouring into this space.
For now, yes, they are playing catch-up. But it's at a rate that only a fool would disregard because he thinks EUV lithography is some white devil magic that no one else would be able to replicate
This chart is fricking moronic because it's using the marketing names for process nodes instead of categorising them by feature density. You should be ashamed for posting it.
Take it up with the IEEE if you're upset, that's where the source comes from. A lot more charts where that comes from.
https://irds.ieee.org/editions/2022
I said you should be ashamed for posting it, not for making it. I'm taking it up with you for being dumb enough to signal boost it. I couldn't care less what IEEE infographics say, as long as they churn out sensible standards and eventually fix 802.11. I care when dopes like you post marketing names for process nodes on my home board and pretend they're meaningful.
If your only contribution is needless autistic hairsplitting you're more than welcome to frick off from this thread if it bothers you that much. The focus is China's capabilities in this area that contradicts whatever blatantly false or outdated info is posted ITT, not whatever pointless spergouts you're having at any hour of the day.
OK, you want a meaningful contribution? SMIC was barely able to manufacture working 14nm, ten years late. It then failed to manufacture 10nm on its own and stumbled to the 10nm mark two generations late by looting TSMC engineers to ape TSMC ""7nm"" which is a DUV process.
EUV doesn't need to be "western black magic" to be exponentially harder than DUV. SMIC, who isn't yet producing 10nm at scale and didn't actually design a single piece of 10nm tech, now needs to start from scratch on EUV while also being trade embargoed from EUV machinery and know how.
Slightly ahead of SMIC 10nm cope scale manufacturing TSMC and Samsung reached 3nm commercial production (after actual 7nm and 5nm nodes), and who knows what the frick Intel is actually doing with their process nodes at this point. EUV also doesn't plateau until roughly 1-2nm once you factor interference patterning like was used for DUV shrinks so EUV won't plateau this decade; there are some good comments on this by Keller, Weiss and Hinton.
SMIC is slightly more than 3 generations behind on existing foundary operations, and seems to be about 5 behind on foundry development and IC architecture or integration. The last is the elephant that no one is touching. Having a foundary is fantastic and all, but it's a necessary condition for making useful chips, not a sufficient one. China has never produced an indigenous CPU, let alone APU, let alone drivers or an ISA. China is still freeloading off all of the actually difficult fundamental work (lithography, process engineering, architecture, integration, drivers, ISA) and has demonstrated zero ability to do their own shit in these areas.
Even if the free world plateaus in lith and fab development I think we're still extending our real gap on China right now, so the plateau will need to be very long for SMIC to scale the EUV cliff and then learn other shit well enough to produce competitive or superior chips.
SMIC is still obviously behind, that as much is clear. The degree at which they will be however within the next decade isn't so clear, now that they have every reason to develop their own supply chain and advances after a unilateral round of bans and sanctions on the US side. They aren't Russia-tier at the very least like so many think; by all indications they're taking this very seriously.
A lot still unproven on China's side (not denying that they poach TSMC engineers which massively helps) but we shall see. Building out a supply network for the entire operation takes time. Depends also how serious the west is either at maintaining the gap. Not seeing it on US side right now, CHIPS' $50 billion investment is a good joke
Developing the supply chain for EUV took more than 20 years. EUV turned out to be much harder than anyone thought it would be. Maybe China can steal some shit or demonstrate Han Superiority and develop EUV tech from scratch in a flash, but I don't think I'd bet on it. In the alternate maybe they try to skip EUV and ace everyone, who knows, but all of the storylines for Chinese silicon supremacy are implessive af.
I love how reading the body of the article you can see the progression of the clickbait headline and even more baity OP post. It’s the same progression from “there would be casualties in a war between JUST Taiwan and China,” to “CHINA NUMBA WON!!”
The bugmutts won't do shit.
I've read a lot of the thinktank analysis papers and came to the conclusion: these people dont know what they're talking about.
For example CSIS talks in depth about "what about LRASM or JASSM-ER" how does it effect strike range? But no mention is being made about TASM Block V, which has even better range than the DF-21.
Oh no! Quick! Someone buy 1000 more F-35s from Lockheed-Martin!
Not one post in this thread matters and the big ones are wasting calories because the U.S. would win if China got too big for their britches and if they did start to lose you bet your fricking ass we wouldn't go down a dying empire without pushing the button and brining them down with us.
dun dun america dis stupid russia will re-arm cuba
It's kind of funny that Russia's utter failure in Ukraine made people forget about humiliations US army suffered over last few years.
I really doubt China would do better but stop pretending US army is this amazing unbeatable war machine that can never do wrong. If war with chinks actually happens 90% of it is going to be people pushing buttons on screens and missiles flying around anyways.
>Saigon, 1975
>side at war with the US is ultimately buck broken, signs a peace deal, US decides behind closed doors to not help their ally if the conflict is reignited
>Afghanista, 2021
>side at war with the US is ultimately buck broken, signs a peace deal, US decides behind closed doors to not help their ally if the conflict is reignited
>this is somehow equivalent to the US invading Mexico and needing 9 months to take Tijuana
These losers need to believe they are a world power when they are just another shithole. You can't get through to them.
>Taiwan admits that they cant really track Chinese missile launches
Source?
Can anyone link these "leaks" in full? I only see parts here and there.