MGCS

Bros... the Ascalon turret looks too goofy.

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  1. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    If it works, it's not stupid.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      The french design is absolutely disgusting.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Place your bets on how much the frogs will screech until their design is adopted.

        It's an artist's impression you morons.
        The actual Ascalon turret as seen on the EMBT looks like this, and again that's just a demonstrator, which is set to get fitted with the 140mm semi-telescoped gun.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous
          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            It looks strange, it's so full of nooks and crannies. The gun mantlet seems to completely break with convention, is it missing a huge amount of armour? Why is there a 'twisted' structure on the barrel?
            The Leclerc-style turret layout, with the sights beside the gun instead of on top, is confusing me. If a KEP was fired from the front, at slightly higher elevation, or while the tank was driving down a decline, could it not punch straight through one of the sights, over the crewman's head, and into the autoloader?

            Pic is Leclerc.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          For comparison here's a render of this tank.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          https://i.imgur.com/pk0ZLDt.jpeg

          https://i.imgur.com/8B02IAM.png

          For comparison here's a render of this tank.

          The EMBT demonstrator wasn't fitted with Ascalon. That's a regular 120mm gun.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Yes, which is why I wrote
            >which is set to get fitted with the 140mm semi-telescoped gun.
            Implying it wasn't yet.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            https://i.imgur.com/8B02IAM.png

            For comparison here's a render of this tank.

            https://i.imgur.com/pk0ZLDt.jpeg

            https://i.imgur.com/eGrU0y7.jpeg

            [...]
            It's an artist's impression you morons.
            The actual Ascalon turret as seen on the EMBT looks like this, and again that's just a demonstrator, which is set to get fitted with the 140mm semi-telescoped gun.

            Frick off frog

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              Mange ma baguette.

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              >just let us how our coping thread OKAY

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      That is untrue, it can in fact be both

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Are you sure this is going to help us sell tanks?

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >sell tanks?

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Modern prop planes look like shit because of the oversized canopies they have for superior visibility and the anorexic looking turboprops for efficiency

  2. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >me on the left

  3. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Place your bets on how much the frogs will screech until their design is adopted.

  4. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    useless without shells

  5. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    speaking of MGCS, Germany is already thinking of a stopgap solution between the Leopard 2A8 and MGCS, currently some are referring to it as Leopard 2AX

    >Starting in the 2030s, a more modern system would then have to be introduced that is adapted to the current threat level in terms of its performance and has additional capabilities compared to the A8. This main battle tank would then serve as a bridge solution until the MGCS is introduced. A service life of around 25 years is apparently planned.

    >The exact specification of this type of battle tank will probably not be decided until 2026, when the results of various R&D studies that are currently in preparation are available. It is not publicly known exactly which ones. However, observers assume that several studies will be awarded that will increase the mobility, protection and effectiveness of the main battle tank. These are likely to include a 130mm cannon, a new high-performance power pack, new sensors and protection systems.

    >If all R&D studies are successfully completed and the Bundeswehr decides to implement these capabilities in a new main battle tank, observers assume that this system would be fundamentally different from a current Leopard 2.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Will it have Force Shields?

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      So the Panther?

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >Re-using cat names
        Why not call it something like Serval or Smilodon?

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        No, Panther is Rheinmetall producing a tank without KMW.
        Which isn't a terrible idea tbh.

        • 4 weeks ago
          T-I-G-E-R-S

          Panther is just a turret. RHM won't provide the chassis.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        No, Panther is Rheinmetall producing a tank without KMW.
        Which isn't a terrible idea tbh.

        apparently Hungary ordered Rheinmetall to fully develop the KF51 into a finished product, although with a 120mm gun instead of the 130mm
        if the KF51 is finished in a couple of years I could see Germany ordering it too, since nowadays the focus seems to be on "off the shelf" solutions.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          don't forget, they also ordered the research on a Skyranger variant.
          Tracked SPAAG bros we are so back

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            that's not really research. Skyranger 30 is already finished, as is the Lynx. They just have to be put together.

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              >Armament: 30mm + 2x Stingers
              Wow, literally an avenger tier gadget after only 30 years being late. I'm wondering how much they're going to fleece out of this piping heap of shit.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                30mm is a huge jump in terms of engineering problems and capabilities above M3 50cal.

                Avenger wouldn't approach that level unless this upgrade package went widespread. Which for some reason it hasn't.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >30mm is a huge jump
                assembly
                For you.
                >Avenger wouldn't approach that level unless this upgrade package went widespread. Which for some reason it hasn't.
                Yeah, because they're already moving onto a new platform.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Avenger had a .50 cal, not a 30mm autocannon with airburst ammo. Also MBDA has a 9x anti-drone missile launcher under development for the turret.

                also Hungary will be getting the turret with 4x Mistral, only Germany will get it with 2x Stinger (+ redundant extra radar) as interim solution, later going for the 9x MBDA missiles in all likelihood

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Avenger had a .50 cal, not a 30mm autocannon with airburst ammo.
                Cope. Swapping out M3 to M230LF is easier than mounting stingers on those pseudo VADS larpers.
                >muh future plans
                Who is paying for all of those upgrades on top of the current plans?
                Also
                >using IRST against drones
                If you wish to go bankrupt, sure. But for everyone else, guided 70mm rockets are more than enough.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                alright Mr. L3harris shill
                I don't really care to engange in this corporate war
                the Skyranger is being introduced into several Euro militaries currently, they'll have probably thought about it deeper than some moron on /kay/
                small drones aren't the only airborne threat btw

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >just wait and see
                Lol I'm sure it worked out so well for Ukraine that it completely relies on US arms supplies.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Btw, Hungary has only agreed on the production of the vehicle but hasn't ordered any yet. I'm guessing krauts are probably feeding the current ruling party pretty well for cucking out to them.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            I know
            but if it's a fully developed system it makes orders much more likely

          • 4 weeks ago
            T-I-G-E-R-S

            >production
            assembly

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >120mm gun
          why

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      There was an idea floating around that current Leopards and Leclercs could be refitted with the MGCS gun (either a 130mm or 140mm), to reduce costs and help solidify the new standard.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        neither the 130 nor the 140 will be adopted, the project will be severely delayed and merged in a larger European project and by that day you'll need 150+ mm

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      So they would do to the leopard what they're planning with the Abrams.

      Which makes sense. In terms of what can be produced in mass you are likely to need interim systems that can be produced asap than rely on the development cycle of an entirely new system.

      I sorta think they should have had a plan for this to work to by now. They know they're making leopard 2's. They should have more than enough data on required improvements. Beginning 2025 would be the absolute max deadline. You're going to have to frick with the tooling and shit in prototyping anyway, but general principals like "We're using the same hull" means you can add the interim requirements to current orders

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Am I mistaken for thinking we just need more tanks. just a lot more, all this bullshit is just more grifting and moronic inter-european competition.
      Sure the intermediate upgrades are cool and stuff, muh R&D and whatnot, but simply more tanks is more better. Nothing the soviets designed can match it and russia is creating expensive technology demonstrators which they are afraid to actually use at the front.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >nothing the soviets designed can match it
        Why does everyone pretend that this didn't exist

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Because it didn't.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >11 functional prototypes made
            >2 still exist in ukraine (tho 1 cannibalized for parts
            >literally paid someone to break into the malyshev factory to take pictures inside of it
            I still have the pictures on an old HDD somewhere, I'll look for it and post them if I find it. There's still quite a few photos of 477 online, it was a very real tank.

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              It isn't a service vehicle.

  6. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >literal RTS unit designs

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Do we know anything more about the various turret types ?
      The one with the rocket launcher pod looks goofy as frick.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        It will be a "system", with plans for a tank, a tank/command vehicle, a heavy IFV/drone carrier, and a ATGM vehicle.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >a heavy IFV
          I doubt the Germans need a IFV

  7. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    So K2 style turret with gun being slightly higher? I guess this layout really saves weight on turret armor.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >K2 Style
      Could asiaticshills just stop for one single second to have bad takes?
      The K2 is a direct copy of the Leclerc especially its autoloader which dictated the whole turret architecture in the first place.
      Meaning the same French company that built the Leclerc, Nexter, Formerly GIAT, now part of a joint venture with Krauss Maffei Wegman called KNDS, are committing the horrible crime, of copying themselves.
      These bloody frogs truly have no shame I swear.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >that asiatic shill literally live rent free 24/7 in your head
        Damn, I guess the latest export success has broken some europoors... Even Macron mentioned it, putting its mic on par with America's.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          die

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            ...zeit Europas ist vorbei.

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              Yeah, no.
              lol

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >importing Black folk is good
                KEK. Ask me how do I know you're brown.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Go home VANK, you're drunk.

          Except Leclerc has a completely different turret. K2 is Abrams mixed with Leclerc and japanese design that was sold to Korea. This turret style is actually from that japanese design.

          Anybody with eyes can see you're lying.

          ?t=22

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            He's right though. The basis of K2 is K1 which is based on one of the prototypes of XM1.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Except Leclerc has a completely different turret. K2 is Abrams mixed with Leclerc and japanese design that was sold to Korea. This turret style is actually from that japanese design.

  8. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >massive turret with just 6 missiles

    Literally why.

  9. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    I wonder how they will counter the drone spam.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Drones

  10. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >There are stabilized fire-on-the-move 155mm SPGs now
    Why isn't there one on a tank?

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >stabilized
      It's a gimmick. It's far safer and accurate to fire in a stationary position.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        That's probably true, but the point I was making is, what can a 155 not do at this point that a tank needs to be able to do? They can direct fire, they can be stabilized, and they can be mounted on much lighter vehicles. The power of a 155 is absolutely insane, it would simplify logistics to just have one large bore caliber, and you could have your tanks do actual artillery things in a pinch.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Sheridan had a 152mm gun. See what happened afterwards.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >what can a 155 not do at this point that a tank needs to be able to do?
          Ensure 'first shot, first hit, first kill', many times, while having high mobility and range, within cost and weight limits.
          You still need to lug the thing around, and its ammo, and point and aim it faster than the other guy. NATO/Rheinmetall studied a 140mm gun in the 90s and concluded it wasn't worthwhile.

          Consider the following, what can a Barrett .50 cal not do at this point that a service rifle needs to be able to do? Hugely superior external and terminal ballistics, incredible penetration, and total range overmatch vs 5.56mm/5.45mm/5.8mm rifles.
          Yet it'd be exhausting to lug around, slow to bring onto target, and have massive recoil, flash, and blast - and you could only carry a small amount of ammo.
          >Fighting between the big-round and small-round groups reached a peak in the early 1960s, when test after test showed the .223 Remington (M193 5.56×45mm) cartridge fired from the AR-15 allowed an eight-soldier unit to outgun an 11-soldier unit armed with M14s at ranges closer than 300 meters. U.S. troops were able to carry more than twice as much 5.56×45mm ammunition as 7.62×51mm NATO for the same weight, which allowed them an advantage against a typical NVA unit armed with Type 56-1s.

          For tanks, bigger rounds translates to reduced range and endurance, lower power to weight ratio, poorer mobility, slower traverse and elevation, slower loading, slower rate of aimed fire, and a lower number of stowed kills. If you beef up the powerpack and all the actuators, and enlarge the fuel tanks, and magazine, now everything is bigger and heavier, so now you need more armour for the same protection, and even more power to have adequate mobility, and so on, and the cost goes through the roof.
          So there are strong reasons to always use the 'smallest' possible ammo that will be lethal against the expected opposition.

  11. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >Bros... the Ascalon turret looks too goofy.
    just wait until you see the new M2A4E1 Bradley

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      80% of that shit should be integrated into the turret armor, what were they thinking?

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        There's just not enough room without a turret redesign. Same problem with the Abrams, the army got content with bolting shit on and now is at the limit. Makes me worried for the XM30 if this is even a thing they're doing but APS is worth looking butt ugly tbh

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        To be fair, just bolting shit to the armor is orders of magnitude cheaper than redesigning it from the ground up.
        It also makes the turret MODULAR(tm).

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          The tank of the future is a Toyota Corolla with MODULES attached MODULARLY all over it until it looks like

          https://i.imgur.com/pk0ZLDt.jpeg

          .
          Fully customisable, highly versatile, supremely lethal, and superbly superior at rattling itself apart rolling down a highway at 10 mph.
          No known or projected vehicle can match this GLOBAL MODERN MODULAR PLATFORM SYSTEM at superlative bullshittery. No compromise.

  12. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    what is the tank in the back supposed to be? LOSAT clone? Anti-air? AT carrier?

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      I believe the initial images in this thread are purely a naive artist's conception. They make no sense.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      ATGM carrier.

  13. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Are these those networked drone tanks?

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