Sure buddy, an issue heavy-duty testers like Torque Test or Project Farm never see that they'd be up on as soon as they heard it was a problem, but we should believe a rando anon on 4chinz?
It has been mentioned about the M18 12.0s. Can’t remember hearing about the flexvolts, but it could happen. Seems to be an issue with 15 cell packs I guess.
If that shit ever happens to a pack, best bet it probably running it down to 1 bar a couple times and recharging it. I’ve seen it happen on jumper bricks because the balancing system doesn’t charge the low cells faster or extra, it just tells the charger to stop when the highest cell hits 4.2V. And it’s more pronounced on the jumper packs because you let them sit in the car for a few months, then top it off from 90% to full, and one cell will self discharge slightly faster and doesn’t have time to catch up on the short top off charging cycle.
There might be issues from Milwaukee because they clearly play power games with their 18V tools that compete with multi-battery/high output batteries from other companies.
The balancing on a 10 cell 2.5Ah 40V pack, I believe they’re going to have balancing wires to half of the cells. The same 10 cells in a 5.0Ah 18V will only have half as many balancing wires, it’s going to balance each parallel set of 2 cells.
But it could also be the types of balancing systems, like I was saying with the jumper packs, I think some BMS boards don’t actually send extra energy through the balancing wires, the wires are only there to turn off the charger when the first cell or parallel set of cells hits 4.20V, so a pack without a ton of use will get unbalanced over time and it’s worse when you have sets of parallel cells
I still would like to see somebody test my theory, like if somebody is using a 12.0Ah on an impact wrench and always charges it when it hits 3 bars, the pack might just need a couple full discharge cycles, then all of the cells will run down close to 2.50V and it will charge up more evenly. Or at least test the balancing wires on those M18 packs and see if they’re sending current to the lower sets of cells or if they’re just monitoring the voltage of the cells. I’m not a computer engineer so I don’t know how those boards are designed by looking at components
I have a feeling people who use the 60V packs or the M18 12Ah packs on the regular and actually run them down to 1 bar from time to time won’t have the issue. Like those power tool testing channels have this issue, and if they’re putting them on the charger to 100% and then running a couple 15sec torque tests on a 12.0Ah pack and then puts it away for 6 weeks until the next video where they slap it on the charger at 4 bars.
I’d probably buy this if it existed earlier, and
1. They made a corded model. I have a jobmax, and they made a corded power base for it. It comes in real handy when you have a lot of work to do.
A 12v jobmax with the oscillating plunge saw can cut exactly one exterior outlet through siding and osb before it’s done from brand new after a fresh recharge.
2. That dewalt has an anemic impact motor. The problem with it is that it doesn’t develop much natural torque by itself and relies on an impact mechanism or a lot of gears which is slow.
Of course there were some crazy attachments for the jobmax, i have the jigsaw attachment too.
Black and decker made something similar, and the jobmax sold in europe as AEG with slightly different style.
Can’t buy any of the attachments for them now.
"Best?" No, probably not. But they're usually in the top performers and pretty reliable with all models. You can't go wrong with their XR and Atomic stuff, and the 60V tools are great, especially since the batteries work in 20V tools and can give them some extra oomph.
yea i've used a fair deal of different tools from different makers and makita is a good value for how many different tools they have and how well they generally perform. Some specific tools are perhaps only available from, or better from another maker.. but in general battery tools today are so powerful and smooth and capable for so many things, it's hard to go wrong with the major brands. I like metabo too and would maybe reconsider by going all-in on metabo instead of makita if i had the choice again.
There may be a factor involved in the target audience. They're pro-grade tools that can be used very hard, and if you get 3+ years out of them they're doing really well.
While Rigid are definitely in the DIYer segment, and less likely to see that kind of constant use, so they bait a purchase with the LSA. I'll note that the LSA only covers repairs, they won't replace a burned-out tool, just stick a new motor in it.
>definitely in the DIYer segment
Not really. That’s a made up argument based on nothing. Ryobi and Craftsman ads have boomer dads and their wives in the garage, Ridgid ads have dudes on the jobsite mostly. They would’ve released a fricking leaf blower long before their jobsite blower if what you said was true. And they used a tradie plumbing name to sell their power tools, it was an affordable tradesman brand if you’re not on a color team.
And Ryobi, the real homeowner tools, come with the same warranty as DeWalt and Makita so…
Eh, my hands-on experience with Rigid is the table saw my Dad has, it's functional but a pain in the ass to set up right, with a fence that locks at whatever off-angle it's at when you push the lever. Not exactly a selling point compared to how solid his DeWalt miter saw is.
>DIYer segment >Jobsite Radio
You should tell the Ridgid marketing department that your opinion which is most definitely fact is that they’re not tools built for the jobsite and they’re going to lose their ass on the LSA if they keep selling tools to tradies.
I dunno what you chucklefricks are doing to your power tools to make them endlessly blow up because I've put my Ridgid shit through hell and back and none of it has failed me. Feel free to keep paying 2x for red as an apparently necessary mask of competence.
Every Dewalt older than like 2 years I've ever seen has busted ass housings and their chucks don't grip worth a frick. Meanwhile my Ridgid is still going fine and will actually push a 1/2" round shank drill through aluminum unlike the Dewalt..
>Though once I save up a bit I'm dumping my DeWalt for a Snap-On impact.
Fricking dumb. Right now DW is leading the pack on 1/2" impacts. Snap-on is a scam.
If your already on DeWalt tools, just stick with DeWalt. They have like all new impact wrenches with a pretty good jump in power from the old ones. Snap On cordless tools aren’t really worth the money, they’re Chinese like every other brand.
The DeWalt belongs to a friend who let me borrow it. I'm only going Snap-On because my dad has been using their stuff for decades without any issues.
It’s a big waste of money, unless you work in a shop and have a really good rep.
If you want the best selecton of mechanic’s power tools, Milwaukee’s M18 Fuel is the way to go. They’re the company that every other company compares to and wants to beat, and they just dropped a new 1/2” high torque that is relatively compact for the power it has.
Compared to the other brands too, Milwaukee tends to keep their impacts pretty compact, like if you watch those test channels, there’s a giant DeWalt 1/2” that is sort of stupid for automotive because it should be a 3/4” square and it rips up sockets, and DeWalt’s newest mid-torque has tons of power for a mid-torque but it’s nearly as large as a lot of high torque 1/2” guns. Meanwhile the M18 Fuel mid-torque has plenty of power for the application and fits in tighter spots.
>I'm only going Snap-On because my dad has been using their stuff for decades without any issues.
And you're going to pay twice as much for no more performance.
There was something to be said for their quality for awhile. Like their tools and batteries are quite stout and tough while covered in grease and power steering fluid, but like 5 years ago I fell off that train completely.
Milwaukee was on the 2nd gen of their brushless high torque and Snap On was still selling a brushed gun with a little less power for like $800 with a battery (kind of like HF’s Earthquake but overpriced). Everybody who was running the Snap On guns were needing rebuilds once a year and they were out of a gun for a couple weeks, I literally sold my Porter Cable corded impact to a dude who works for FedEx airlines and his Snap On gun was out for a rebuild (again). Meanwhile the worst thing Milwaukee users had happen was the battery not fitting as tight after years of use, and they tried to fix that with the new one.
7 months ago
Kevin Van Dam
Oh and I’m pretty sure dudes running those Snap On guns had to pay like $100-$150 for each one of those rebuilds because the warranty on their Chinese power tools is nothing compared to their hand tools.
Snap-on hand tools are fine but they outsource the rest like welders and power tools so I'd not bother. Those are geared to bubba who buys everything off the tool truck. Not even the Air Force bought everything from Snap-on because while very good not everything is worth the money.
Watch Torque Test Channel to keep up with what kicks ass.
t. builder of USAF and civilian toolrooms and mech/tech since the late 1970s.
It’s a big waste of money, unless you work in a shop and have a really good rep.
If you want the best selecton of mechanic’s power tools, Milwaukee’s M18 Fuel is the way to go. They’re the company that every other company compares to and wants to beat, and they just dropped a new 1/2” high torque that is relatively compact for the power it has.
Compared to the other brands too, Milwaukee tends to keep their impacts pretty compact, like if you watch those test channels, there’s a giant DeWalt 1/2” that is sort of stupid for automotive because it should be a 3/4” square and it rips up sockets, and DeWalt’s newest mid-torque has tons of power for a mid-torque but it’s nearly as large as a lot of high torque 1/2” guns. Meanwhile the M18 Fuel mid-torque has plenty of power for the application and fits in tighter spots.
I have the DCF900 and it doesn't trash good six-point sockets. The smaller anvil is more useful as there are more 1/2" drive sockets about. If I manage to break a socket that's just a cost of doing business and why I have backups. Tools are consumables in industry, not a fetish.
The thing is outstanding for salvage work as it their recip saw. They make decapitating trucks to harvest tasty LS a breeze. More power is always good but you can select less if desired. Would buy again.
>Though once I save up a bit I'm dumping my DeWalt for a Snap-On impact.
Fricking dumb. Right now DW is leading the pack on 1/2" impacts. Snap-on is a scam.
If your already on DeWalt tools, just stick with DeWalt. They have like all new impact wrenches with a pretty good jump in power from the old ones. Snap On cordless tools aren’t really worth the money, they’re Chinese like every other brand.
Dewalt is owned by black and decker so no. The fact that the drill in your image has a plastic drive housing instead of a cast metal one should be a tip off.
No, but companies consolidate everything and buy their parts from the same manufacturers, like motors.
I remember an air compressor recall years back when we found out 90% of all compressors were made by DeVilbiss.
Even then, they aren't using the same parts in different brands. At best, a B&D tool might be a rebrand of an outdated, bottom tier DeWalt that isn't sold as DW anymore that they can get the parts cheaper for now than they did when it first came out.
You know you can figure this out pretty easily. Look at replacement parts for the tools and see what the compatibility is. There’s not going to be much shared between Milwaukee Fuel and the cheap Ryobi brushed tools.
If your job is to assemble furniture even those 12V are too powerful and heavy, you dumb frick.
Besides the same accessories obviously exist for 18V machines.
Let’s be more honest, gullible people who bought into cordless for work are gullible. That’s why we get these stupid chargers, impacts are everywhere, and people to shill them. Stupid people stick together.
Torque test channel tested those makita skilsaws with two batteries and it runs for 13 minutes brand new, and rapidly degrades to 10 minutes after a week. That’s far short of a day’s work.
Today’s zoomers and millennials actually like juggling and caring for heir battery packs, feeding them, putting them to bed every night in their cradle since they grew up with with tamagotchies and played with dolls. That’s why cordless tools are preferred by trans people. It’s their one “skill” although it’s useless until corded tools used by productive people to fix their incompetence.
>Let’s be more honest, gullible people who bought into cordless for work are gullible. That’s why we get these stupid chargers, impacts are everywhere, and people to shill them. Stupid people stick together. >Torque test channel tested those makita skilsaws with two batteries and it runs for 13 minutes brand new, and rapidly degrades to 10 minutes after a week. That’s far short of a day’s work.
Big packs are around 200Wh. If you pull ~1000W from those, yeah that's ~12 minutes of cutting time. Math is pretty fricking simple.
If you frame houses and cut 2 by 4's all day long with your skillsaw, you gonna need 3 packs and 2 chargers. So what. Either you spend a couple 100 bucks on that and don't have to deal with a cable, or you deal with the cable.
I don't have a need for a circular saw very often, I mostly do projects near or in my workshop and i have a huge ass tablesaw, so i don't have any high powered cordless tools. Just a jigsaw for odd jobs and a cordless drill obviously. Batteries on these last forever, and they're just compact 4AH ones. I would never consider having these tools corded.
>Today’s zoomers and millennials actually like juggling and caring for heir battery packs, feeding them, putting them to bed every night in their cradle since they grew up with with tamagotchies and played with dolls. That’s why cordless tools are preferred by trans people. It’s their one “skill” although it’s useless until corded tools used by productive people to fix their incompetence.
For shit like when the fricking guy put the drywall up on the walls first instead of the ceiling and didn’t sink the screws, so they’re 1/4 from the fricking ceiling.
I'm pretty happy with my brushelss Cryobi shit, just werks and doesn't break the bank for my needs, bonus points fo batteries that are compatible with random ass tools
Why the 6-pack charger? Makes a good battery holder I guess. I could see that being worth it with old tech batteries that you had to charge overnight, but even the compact chargers will get a dead 4.0 lithium pack up to 90% in an hour or so.
6 pack charger was on clearance for like 60CAD, and it turns out the Ryobi one only chargers 1 battery at a time. Considering what I paid for it I can't complain
Most of them are like that, “sequential”, especially the 4-6 battery chargers. I think they sort of try to trick people too because it would be obvious you buy them to charge a bunch of batteries at once. Otherwise you could have one charger and swap batteries as they’re done.
https://i.imgur.com/jOCWkVo.jpg
Get one of these and you'll get most of the functionality in those fancy dedicated installer drivers.
Those are awkward when you need any real torque but true, that installation drivet is for dudes who hang lots of cabinets and such, not really a DIYer tool.
Let’s be more honest, gullible people who bought into cordless for work are gullible. That’s why we get these stupid chargers, impacts are everywhere, and people to shill them. Stupid people stick together.
Torque test channel tested those makita skilsaws with two batteries and it runs for 13 minutes brand new, and rapidly degrades to 10 minutes after a week. That’s far short of a day’s work.
Today’s zoomers and millennials actually like juggling and caring for heir battery packs, feeding them, putting them to bed every night in their cradle since they grew up with with tamagotchies and played with dolls. That’s why cordless tools are preferred by trans people. It’s their one “skill” although it’s useless until corded tools used by productive people to fix their incompetence.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Okay.
7 months ago
Anonymous
OK, Grandpa, let's get you back to your room now.
7 months ago
Anonymous
> Gramps waddles in the room with a corded oscillator plus an extention cord (since it won't reach the work area) and casts both dirtyfrick wires out into the room, whipping them around to untangle them, blinding the dog and tripping himself in the process. He lands on the cat, killing it, and breaks his ancient hip while shitting himself in the process. The oscillator bit cuts off his dick.
> All while I had the drywall hole finished 17 minutes ago with an 18v makita.
7 months ago
Bepis
See
OK, Grandpa, let's get you back to your room now.
and
> Gramps waddles in the room with a corded oscillator plus an extention cord (since it won't reach the work area) and casts both dirtyfrick wires out into the room, whipping them around to untangle them, blinding the dog and tripping himself in the process. He lands on the cat, killing it, and breaks his ancient hip while shitting himself in the process. The oscillator bit cuts off his dick.
> All while I had the drywall hole finished 17 minutes ago with an 18v makita.
and
>Hobbyists.
If your job is to assemble furniture even those 12V are too powerful and heavy, you dumb frick.
Besides the same accessories obviously exist for 18V machines.
[...] >Let’s be more honest, gullible people who bought into cordless for work are gullible. That’s why we get these stupid chargers, impacts are everywhere, and people to shill them. Stupid people stick together. >Torque test channel tested those makita skilsaws with two batteries and it runs for 13 minutes brand new, and rapidly degrades to 10 minutes after a week. That’s far short of a day’s work.
Big packs are around 200Wh. If you pull ~1000W from those, yeah that's ~12 minutes of cutting time. Math is pretty fricking simple.
If you frame houses and cut 2 by 4's all day long with your skillsaw, you gonna need 3 packs and 2 chargers. So what. Either you spend a couple 100 bucks on that and don't have to deal with a cable, or you deal with the cable.
I don't have a need for a circular saw very often, I mostly do projects near or in my workshop and i have a huge ass tablesaw, so i don't have any high powered cordless tools. Just a jigsaw for odd jobs and a cordless drill obviously. Batteries on these last forever, and they're just compact 4AH ones. I would never consider having these tools corded.
>Today’s zoomers and millennials actually like juggling and caring for heir battery packs, feeding them, putting them to bed every night in their cradle since they grew up with with tamagotchies and played with dolls. That’s why cordless tools are preferred by trans people. It’s their one “skill” although it’s useless until corded tools used by productive people to fix their incompetence.
You seem kinda moronic.
7 months ago
Anonymous
> tamagotchi
They even have little buttons on them that you can press to see if you need to feed them again, or are unhappy. I’m going to get the batteries that connect to your phone because it has more features and is more like a real baby.
7 months ago
Bepis
>he doesn’t know where his battery is at all times
7 months ago
Anonymous
Please tell me that’s not real…
7 months ago
Bepis
It’s a good idea, I think it was a trial run for TTI to join with Milwaukee’s OneKey, but there’s more money to be made when all these batteries getting stolen/lost
You can see temp and charge cycles and “battery health” as well
For electric hand tools:
Festool is overpriced
Ryobi and WorkX are trash
Dewalt is mid bordering on meh
Milwakee isn't a bad choice
Makita is that sweet spot of slightly expensive but quality that will last years and be very worth it.
For Tablesaws
Sawstop is overrated
Oliver has great build quality
The only other thing is yes, kill your wallet and get the fricking Domino if you're doing tons of furniture serious. Frick dowel jigs unless you're a hobbyist.
>Sawstop evangelist Stumpy Nubs is running a Harvey in his new shop/studio setup
At under $1000 the DeWalt Jobsite or Delta Contractor saws are both excellent choices with similar rip capacity and good, accurate fences. Skil makes a sold low-price table saw that copies DeWalt's rack and pinion fence at ~$350.
As a Bunnings employee who works in the toolshop, I can tell you right now that Bosch and Makita are the tools that rarely get sent in for repairs from customers.
We're about as competitive as you get, for the stock that we sell. We've got people always looking at other stores to make sure we have lower prices than them even by $0.01 because if another store has a cheaper price for the exact same product we have to match their price and beat it by 10%
fricking hate crummings and their shitty drive throughs. horrible winding maze full of obstacles and they always leave rental trailers, shopping carts and other crap blocking up the parking bays, which forces me to park at the side of the path. then invariably some busybody boomer/karen piece of shit yells that I can't park there.
last time that happened i just went straight to mitre 10 because their drive through is a straight line with un obstructed parking along the entire path.
Does anyone want to share their rankings? I am from the US, my dad built housing developments when I was younger and then just retired to handyman things like building decks and bathrooms.
For power tools:
-Milwaukee and DeWalt are pretty much on the same level, both have some stinkers and have been guilty of having their name slapped on everything and becoming lifestyle brands. I see more mechanics with Milwaukee than DeWalt.
-makita is independent but never seem to really be top of their class, a lot of knockoff tools use Makita batteries. They also have a bunch of different levels of batteries that confuse my small mind.
-Ridgid gets used by a couple of tradie friends of mine, bought by their companies, they work in the stone and masonry trades, but they gimped their lineup and I really don't know how well supported they'll be
-ryobi has a huge lineup and you can use the same new batteries in pawn shop tools you pick up, so you can build up a big arsenal, but they just don't have the same build quality as they're built to a price point.
-skil, new craftsman, kobalt, Bosch in the US, flex, worx are all unknown to me, they seem like they have limited lineups, how much is Lowes going to be investing in kobalt now that they have craftsman?
-porter cable is just old DeWalt designs in a gray shell, it's a zombie brand at this point, and again, now that black and Decker has craftsman, how much will they develop porter cable?
-black and Decker has completely given up, it's like low homeowner tier shovelware
-bauer and Hercules from harbor freight, some tools approach the price of a DeWalt or Milwaukee when they go on sale with a free battery. The plug in tools are good enough for weekend usage in my experience.
-harbor freight warrior is the cheapest of cheap, for your daughters apartment
Personally I use DeWalt 18v tools with a 20v adapter and Milwaukee 12v, and then whatever plug in tools fit my needs
Also Hilti is for big companies to buy for their idiot employees to abuse, festool is for redditors to show off except they lead in certain saw things I don't care about, I saw a video of Walmart returns and they had a whole bunch of impact driver kits with DOA batteries, buying random e-waste Chinese tools off Amazon is for mongoloids.
I hate paying for new batteries because one cell died or having to worry about them being in the cold or the heat, or putting them in the charger too soon after using, or doing maintenance cycles. I also hate running extension cords everywhere.
My dad had a 40v dewalt leaf blower he left in his garage over winter. Battery was completely toast in the spring, wouldn’t charge, charger was flashing errors. I think that project farm nut also killed a battery by putting in the freezer.
t. canada
Yeah, he was used to gas, lead acid, and ni cd batteries which all survived multiple -40 winters without issue. The dead battery was on his second blower, after the first blower’s battery also bit the dust over winter.
He doesn’t care though, he’ll buy another one, he absolutely loves the thing.
I don't think Kobalt competes with Craftsman. Kobalt is a step above in performance and price. Kobalt is more like Flex on a budget. Similar to how Rigid is to Milwaukee. Chevron seems to be slow with putting out new tools but their Marketing tells me they are investing in Flex quite a bit. Kobalts XTR line is probably discontinued since Flex filled that role when it was released.
I have no real experience with any of those brands I lumped together, they're pretty much all brands I wouldn't invest any money into, how long are they going to be around? Craftsman has been through how many different lines of power tools by now? I'll accept they'll at least be around longer than any random harbor freight Chicago electric cordless battery format, or how long their earthquake cordless line stayed around.
My dad had a 40v dewalt leaf blower he left in his garage over winter. Battery was completely toast in the spring, wouldn’t charge, charger was flashing errors. I think that project farm nut also killed a battery by putting in the freezer.
t. canada
All my batteries except the 7.2V nicad dewalts for a cordless screwdriver live in the garage in upstate New York. 18v DeWalt nicad from 2012 are now starting to fail, and I have had one 12v Milwaukee die, but I only have 1.5ah packs and I abuse them in a sawzall cutting steel.
Also realized I forgot metabo and metabo HPT since I consider them pointless extra fluff, even if they aren't awful tools, why bother?
Because I’m the genius that all of PrepHole respects, here’s a QRD of the brands you will find at the major US stores-
Milwaukee M18- Contractor grade, most innovative tools for the trades like electricians, plumbers, HVAC. M12 is the best 12V lineup for certain compact tools like the ratchets. A few bucks more than many other contractor grade brands
DeWalt 20V- Contractor grade, sold across multiple big retailers so good selection in stores and best sales of the contractor grade brands.
Makita 18V- Milwaukee prices with less selection. Boomers like their woodworking tools but their selection isn’t as expansive as Red and Yellow in the US, largest battery is 6.0Ah.
Bosch 18V- Contractor grade but weak selection of cordless tools in the US, especially in brick & mortar stores
Metabo HPT18V- Same as Bosch
Flex 24V- Contractor grade, Powerful tools, but new to the US market so up to you if you want to invest in a cordless system that is sold at one retailer and just showed up a couple years ago.
^^^ These are all the major contractor grade name brand tool.
Ridgid 18V-Kobalt 24V-Masterforce 20V-
All store brand power tools made by one of the big manufacturers of the other contractor brands. Good quality and performance for the money right about with the contractor grade brands, but their lineup is more limited than the big brands and they mostly cover just the basics.
Ryobi 18V- Weekender grade, wide slection of homeowner stuff, better HP tools and cheaper brushed tools depending on your needs. Made by the same parent company as Milwaukee and Ridgid. Ryobi is one of the few brands that never changed battery design whem every brand went from NiCd tech to Lithium, so they care about consumers with old tools who want compatibility, although the older battery style with the post leads to odd form factor in a couple tools.
Craftsman 20V- Weekender grade. Some brushless stuff is rebranded last-gen DeWalt for a few bucks less. Decent lineup of the basics.
Skil 20V- Weekender grade, this is a newer lineup since the name was bought by another company. They’re produced by the same parent company as Flex and Kobalt, good performance for the money with brushless tools but not a huge selection
Porter Cable 20V- Not sure if they’re still around, the parent company of DeWalt sort of killed them off and replaced them with Craftsman as their weekender brand.
Black & Decker 20V- Light use, the drill your lesbian aunt has in her junk drawer from that time she wanted to hang a planter on the balcony of her apartment.
Porter cable is still sold at tractor supply stores, I guess they turned it into their house brand, it's just old DeWalt designs, maybe with cheaper motors and switches.
With so many brands, battery lineups, and with most company's having a 20v yard tool line as well as their more powerful ~40v stuff, I'm thinking of making a spreadsheet to keep track of which tools you can get with each battery form factor. My sister got a production job and needs power tools, but trying to figure out the best battery to get into is a nightmare between comparing those starter packs, waiting for the right BOGO sales, and making sure she'll have access to the best selection of tools in the future. If I make the spreadsheet I'll probably post the Google sheets link here somewhere.
> porter cable is old dewalt
Porter cable is (or, perhaps, was) actually one of the originals and ancient and based like makita.
Picrel is porter cable in use in 1996.
Same exact drill (middle) from the mid-90s in Russell Morash’s workshop surrounded by two newer porter cable models in 2023.
It’s not that they copied dewalt, they just pretty much kept the design.
Yeah, their routers used to be the go-to for anyone serious, but like I said before, they're now a zombie brand to trick brand recognition for people who used to see them in their dad's shop and assume their good tools.
Also Makita is moronic. Go ahead and buy that 40V drill, the same damn thing as the 18V model but for more money. And the 40V 2.5Ah battery is the same shit as the 18V 5.0Ah. No cross compatibility between any of the tools either like DeWalt’s Flexvolt, so if you buy into the 40V and want to run smaller low demand tools, you better hope they offer them on the 40V platform or your stuck buying into the 18V platform as well.
They handicapped themselves with a bunch of dumb decisions
Also your pic, look how huge that pack is on a drill that would run fine with a 5 cell pack, so stupid.
[...]
Oh wait just realized that’s the big impact wrench, the frickhueg 40V 8.0 battery makes it look like a drill, and that’s an even dumber pic, but it’s a good metaphor for how stupid Makit’s battery system is because you would rather adapt a 3/4” or 1/2” square down to PH2 instead of paying $300 for a drill that works on the 40V system or spending as much to get on the 18V platform.
Makita is about to introduce “powerstack”-like batteries — the flat polymer cells. Everything will move to 40v. No reason not to.
The whole industry is dumb…. They should have all gone to a 48v standard with 13 cells, and the big-ass packs can use the 18650s and the smaller packs can use the flat polymer cells since they can make them a lot smaller.
I’ll be waiting. Makita is finally doing tabless 40V packs, but they’re not pouch cells. I don’t think they had the lithium packs ready to make compact 48V tools, and it would fricking suck to use an impact driver with a 13 cell 18650 pack.
Also more cells means more of a margin for error, so there’s still an upside to 5 cell 18V packs that can deliver a lot of current.
7 months ago
Anonymous
https://i.imgur.com/whkpJTe.jpg
It’s friggin huge!
Anyone here buy into the DeWalt 36v before they shit canned it? I think they had a rotary hammer, sawzall, hammer drill, circ saw, impact wrench and like a vacuum or something.
Ahh good ol’ DeWalt that actually has compatibility between batteries and tools and chargers, unlike stupid Makita.
>Cont’d
Hercules 20V/12V- Contractor grade if you trust Harbor Freight, but don’t believe their pricing, a DeWalt kit will often be cheaper than the Hercules and it’s a trusted brand. 90 day warranty on lots of items.
Bauer 20V- Weekender grade, similar to Ryobi-Craftsman but only 90 day warranty. Like Hercules, the name brand kits are often cheaper than the Bauer in the end
>Other voltages, not a replacement for 18V/20V/24V, but rather specialty tools in addition to the core 18V stuff
Milwaukee M12- Contractor grade, compct, by far the largest select of 12V tools, compact battery packs that fit inside the handle of many tools. Handful of tools that aren’t offered on the 18V platform
DeWalt 12V- Contractor grade compact. Limited lineup, slide packs will work on some 20V chargers.
Bosch 12V- More contractor grade compact stuff with an ok lineup. Batteries are similar to M12
Makita 12V- Same as above, slide packs like DeWalt but no cross compatibility with chargers
DeWalt Flexvolt- 60V for high power tools, packs can still be used on 20V tools.
Makita 40V- Some higher power tools, no compatibility with 18V tools or chargers like DeWalt. Many of the smaller 40V tools like the drill and impact driver are basically the same as the 18V but cost more.
Milwaukee MX Fuel- Jobsite tools, let the company pay for them.So
7 months ago
Anonymous
>DeWalt Flexvolt- 60V for high power tools, packs can still be used on 20V tools.
There's also a couple special tools like a cordless miter saw that uses two for 120V operation. Project Farm's first test of battery chainsaws had DW's 60V chainsaw outperform his ten year old Stihl gas saw.
Yeah, the 60V batteries can be ludicrous, but the 20V 4AH XR batteries I got with mine are pretty much perfect size. That said, you could work all week on that pack.
7 months ago
Bepis
DeWalt’s 3.0 and 4.0 20V packs are pretty dope for most handheld tools like drills and impact drivers. Ridgid had it for a minute with the 3.0Ah Octanes but they were bigger than the DeWalt packs because of the board. Then they slimmed down their next gen packs. Less rubber bumpers and such. Guess it depends what you want from the packs, compact or will hold up to falls with rubber bumpers.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Since dewalt lies and says their 18v batteries are 20v, it means their 40v are really 36v and the 60s are actually only 54v.
Anybody that buys dewalt shit is just supporting a chinese marketing company.
7 months ago
Anonymous
KYS, memelord.
7 months ago
Anonymous
when they are fully charged they are technically 20vs, but it's still an 18v pack, and basically all other brands do this as well
7 months ago
Anonymous
> technically 20v for a few hours after a full charge
According to
Ahh good ol’ DeWalt that actually has compatibility between batteries and tools and chargers, unlike stupid Makita.
>Cont’d
Hercules 20V/12V- Contractor grade if you trust Harbor Freight, but don’t believe their pricing, a DeWalt kit will often be cheaper than the Hercules and it’s a trusted brand. 90 day warranty on lots of items.
Bauer 20V- Weekender grade, similar to Ryobi-Craftsman but only 90 day warranty. Like Hercules, the name brand kits are often cheaper than the Bauer in the end
>Other voltages, not a replacement for 18V/20V/24V, but rather specialty tools in addition to the core 18V stuff
Milwaukee M12- Contractor grade, compct, by far the largest select of 12V tools, compact battery packs that fit inside the handle of many tools. Handful of tools that aren’t offered on the 18V platform
DeWalt 12V- Contractor grade compact. Limited lineup, slide packs will work on some 20V chargers.
Bosch 12V- More contractor grade compact stuff with an ok lineup. Batteries are similar to M12
Makita 12V- Same as above, slide packs like DeWalt but no cross compatibility with chargers
DeWalt Flexvolt- 60V for high power tools, packs can still be used on 20V tools.
Makita 40V- Some higher power tools, no compatibility with 18V tools or chargers like DeWalt. Many of the smaller 40V tools like the drill and impact driver are basically the same as the 18V but cost more.
Milwaukee MX Fuel- Jobsite tools, let the company pay for them.So
only the shit tier harbor fright knock-offs claim 20v. Everybody else can read the spec written on the batteris and add them up correctly.
Either they (1) can’t add, or (2) are intentionally lying since they know batteries aren’t rated like that, or (3) both. I think it’s probably both since they’re primarily a marketing firm it seems.
In the EU, they deemed it fraudulent, so they’re rated their actual voltage there.
Either way, I’m not buying any more dewalt crap. When they start pulling shit like this you know they’re on the way out.
KYS, memelord.
Sorry, dewalt shill. You’re just lucky nobody bothered to class-action it. We can’t do anything about whatever goes on in china, but we can block all imports.
7 months ago
Anonymous
It’s like rating a corded tool at “Now with 170v… all our competitors are still at 120v”
Technically, the 120v is the RMS voltage that everyone advertises and the 170 volts is technically accurate if you’re talking about the peak voltage of the AC waveform.
Ladies buying a drill for their man to help them hang a picture frame might get the more manly 170v version thinking it was better (because more is better, right?)
Just like dewalt probably squeezed out some extra purchases on father’s day, but it’s some short-term fraudulent gains.
Or nobody but you cares, since they make genuinely good tools and you're just a butthurt fanboy.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Maybe they do still make genuinely good tools. I’ll never know.
I have some dewalt cordless and lots of corded… all the cordless stuff died long ago. Seemed like good stuff, no complaints. Batteries finally gave out.
It’s just sad that the MBAs that infiltrated the company don’t know anything about engineering, electricity, or power tools, and spend more money, time and effort trying to scam people that making good tools nowadays.
But, it happens with a lot of companies.
I have some commercial Black and Decker stuff from the 70s. Still works great, but their reputation is about nil now, I think a teardown showed plastic gears in their cordless drill. I actually have one (found it in the trash) it seems incredibly cheaply made.
7 months ago
Anonymous
They never claimed that 18v is the nominal voltage. That they should refer to their nominal voltage as opposed to their no-load voltage is a standard that you invented. You're literally making up reasons to not like them.
7 months ago
Anonymous
It’s like rating a corded tool at “Now with 170v… all our competitors are still at 120v”
Technically, the 120v is the RMS voltage that everyone advertises and the 170 volts is technically accurate if you’re talking about the peak voltage of the AC waveform.
Ladies buying a drill for their man to help them hang a picture frame might get the more manly 170v version thinking it was better (because more is better, right?)
Just like dewalt probably squeezed out some extra purchases on father’s day, but it’s some short-term fraudulent gains.
7 months ago
Bepis
I’m sort of with you. It’s a bit of a scam, but I also give them the benefit of the doubt because if they had called it 18V, there would be so many moronic boomers and drunk tradies with 18V XRP packs getting pissed off that the 18V packs they just bought don’t fit their 18V tools.
7 months ago
Anonymous
> dewalt battery line that doesn’t fit
That seems even worse. I didn’t realize they tweaked the battery slot mechanism again.
Although slightly inconvenient, I always recommend everyone get ryobi one plus if they’re worried about battery frickery. I probably have 10 ni-cd era blue tools and they all still work great, it’s been 20 years now. Especially for tools I rarely use, like the cordless circ saw when I have to cut some plywood down to fit in my car in the home depot parking lot.
7 months ago
Bepis
There’s upsides to the slide packs. For tradies who use the stuff daily and need to carry a couple batteries in their bag, it’s probably worth upgrading to the new style of tools over the course of a couple years. And they sell the adapters.
But for Ryobi, the homeowner stuff, it was worth it to keep the old design. Those guys aren’t wearing out their tools within 3-5 years so it was nice that they didn’t screw them over.
Based Ridgid has been using slide packs since the NiCd days so it’s the one brand where the Gen 1 tools work with Gen 6-7 batteries and Gen 1 batteries will still run Gen 7 tools (albeit not as well as the lithium pack)
I'll note that the battery doesn't look that bad in one of the tools it was really intended for.
7 months ago
Anonymous
I've cut a shitload of trees with that and a Makita after shoulder replacement meant no more pull starting for me. Now I'm healed and still use electric. Unless you're cutting firewood in bulk electrics work very well. I've felled many trees up to two feet diameter. Not quickly but I'm in no hurry.
Also Makita is moronic. Go ahead and buy that 40V drill, the same damn thing as the 18V model but for more money. And the 40V 2.5Ah battery is the same shit as the 18V 5.0Ah. No cross compatibility between any of the tools either like DeWalt’s Flexvolt, so if you buy into the 40V and want to run smaller low demand tools, you better hope they offer them on the 40V platform or your stuck buying into the 18V platform as well.
They handicapped themselves with a bunch of dumb decisions
Also your pic, look how huge that pack is on a drill that would run fine with a 5 cell pack, so stupid.
Oh wait just realized that’s the big impact wrench, the frickhueg 40V 8.0 battery makes it look like a drill, and that’s an even dumber pic, but it’s a good metaphor for how stupid Makit’s battery system is because you would rather adapt a 3/4” or 1/2” square down to PH2 instead of paying $300 for a drill that works on the 40V system or spending as much to get on the 18V platform.
I like Milwaukee's hackzall (mini sawzall) for cutting through drywall. With the appropriate blade or even a carbide blade, minimal mess.
All of the DeWalt drills and impact guns I've used felt flimsy. For drills, Ryobi will suffice if you don't need much power or doing basic handyman shit in your house. Just don't drop them.
>I like Milwaukee's hackzall (mini sawzall) for cutting through drywall. With the appropriate blade or even a carbide blade, minimal mess.
makita already solved drywall cutting
that crappy plunge jigsaw will cut drywall faster and in a straighter line
and good luck cutting out drywall in a ceiling without nicking a wire with that baby roto tool
because im not poor
how slow are you at putting a battery in?
7 months ago
Anonymous
The same applies to saws. 90% of the time I'm using hand saw because by the time I get the miter saw out, plug it in, etc I can have all my cuts done already
7 months ago
Anonymous
> use hand tools
For smaller jobs and one-offs, the older I get, the *more* I use hand tools, like hand saws and chisels. I even picked up a brace-and bit and one of those egg beater drills. They are small, light, the battery is always charged, no extension cord, nobody will steal it, cold and heat tolerant, and it won’t die due to software or battery systems changes.
I’m a plumber and I use Ryobi. A lot of plumbers use Milwaukee or Dewalt, but it’s all Chinese shit at the end of the day. I’ve never had a problem getting the job done with Ryobi tools, and I’m not paying an arm and a leg trying to impress anyone.
Just had my first experience trying to warranty a Ryobi battery that is a year or two old. The old cat lady had an old blue Ryobi drill and sawzall and old dead NiCd battery so I convinced her to pick up the $30 fan with battery and charger. Pretty sure she ran the battery on the inflator down to 0% and then left it in a hot car for months and possibly that helped to fry something in it, I couldn’t even charge it on a power supply.
TTI customer service emails are slow as shit, but she didn’t know where the receipt went and the stuff was never registered, however I gave them the serial #s off the battery, charger, and fan and they’re sending me a fresh battery.
Only downside is they take a week to reply to each email. There’s a phone # that would be faster but from calling the Ridgid support one, I know it’s 45min on hold sometimes.
Also update, looks like India tech support mis-typed the address on the new battery, so I will be surveiling my neighbor’s house today and trying to intercept the package from the UPS guy.
No.
that's a bad example fren. I'm all in on DeWilt, but even I would go with the m12 installation driver.
Why not post the 60v batteries with the matching grinder and circular saw instead?
>60v batteries
These get unbalanced and bricked if you look at them wrong. Flexvolts have been my least reliable tools.
Sure buddy, an issue heavy-duty testers like Torque Test or Project Farm never see that they'd be up on as soon as they heard it was a problem, but we should believe a rando anon on 4chinz?
It has been mentioned about the M18 12.0s. Can’t remember hearing about the flexvolts, but it could happen. Seems to be an issue with 15 cell packs I guess.
If that shit ever happens to a pack, best bet it probably running it down to 1 bar a couple times and recharging it. I’ve seen it happen on jumper bricks because the balancing system doesn’t charge the low cells faster or extra, it just tells the charger to stop when the highest cell hits 4.2V. And it’s more pronounced on the jumper packs because you let them sit in the car for a few months, then top it off from 90% to full, and one cell will self discharge slightly faster and doesn’t have time to catch up on the short top off charging cycle.
There might be issues from Milwaukee because they clearly play power games with their 18V tools that compete with multi-battery/high output batteries from other companies.
The balancing on a 10 cell 2.5Ah 40V pack, I believe they’re going to have balancing wires to half of the cells. The same 10 cells in a 5.0Ah 18V will only have half as many balancing wires, it’s going to balance each parallel set of 2 cells.
But it could also be the types of balancing systems, like I was saying with the jumper packs, I think some BMS boards don’t actually send extra energy through the balancing wires, the wires are only there to turn off the charger when the first cell or parallel set of cells hits 4.20V, so a pack without a ton of use will get unbalanced over time and it’s worse when you have sets of parallel cells
I still would like to see somebody test my theory, like if somebody is using a 12.0Ah on an impact wrench and always charges it when it hits 3 bars, the pack might just need a couple full discharge cycles, then all of the cells will run down close to 2.50V and it will charge up more evenly. Or at least test the balancing wires on those M18 packs and see if they’re sending current to the lower sets of cells or if they’re just monitoring the voltage of the cells. I’m not a computer engineer so I don’t know how those boards are designed by looking at components
I beat the shit out of mine without issues but YMMV. Never a bad battery and I bought all mine in 2018.
My 60vs have seen hell and back, get used nearly every day, and I haven't had a single issue.
I have a feeling people who use the 60V packs or the M18 12Ah packs on the regular and actually run them down to 1 bar from time to time won’t have the issue. Like those power tool testing channels have this issue, and if they’re putting them on the charger to 100% and then running a couple 15sec torque tests on a 12.0Ah pack and then puts it away for 6 weeks until the next video where they slap it on the charger at 4 bars.
I do that and agree. All my DeWalt batteries from 2018 are fine and I still have an M28 Milwaukee battery from 2011 that is about 80% good.
I’d probably buy this if it existed earlier, and
1. They made a corded model. I have a jobmax, and they made a corded power base for it. It comes in real handy when you have a lot of work to do.
A 12v jobmax with the oscillating plunge saw can cut exactly one exterior outlet through siding and osb before it’s done from brand new after a fresh recharge.
2. That dewalt has an anemic impact motor. The problem with it is that it doesn’t develop much natural torque by itself and relies on an impact mechanism or a lot of gears which is slow.
Of course there were some crazy attachments for the jobmax, i have the jigsaw attachment too.
Black and decker made something similar, and the jobmax sold in europe as AEG with slightly different style.
Can’t buy any of the attachments for them now.
"Best?" No, probably not. But they're usually in the top performers and pretty reliable with all models. You can't go wrong with their XR and Atomic stuff, and the 60V tools are great, especially since the batteries work in 20V tools and can give them some extra oomph.
From everything I've used so far: Makita.
Except their routers and vacuums. Those are shit coming out of a dick.
yea i've used a fair deal of different tools from different makers and makita is a good value for how many different tools they have and how well they generally perform. Some specific tools are perhaps only available from, or better from another maker.. but in general battery tools today are so powerful and smooth and capable for so many things, it's hard to go wrong with the major brands. I like metabo too and would maybe reconsider by going all-in on metabo instead of makita if i had the choice again.
They're fine. Just don't buy into the hype.
If Makita had better product support where I live, I'd probably use them. About all I see around here are drill/drivers and cordless saws.
Ah, that fine olde tradition.
Godspeed Sir.
>no Lifetime Service Agreement
On the other hand, DW tools probably won't blow out like a Rigid and need that.
Why don’t they stand behind their tools with a better warranty then?
Fwiw, Hilti’s warranty seems pretty badass, it’s 20 or 30 years and I think they promise a 48 hour turnaround on repairs.
Also I think Flex is still doing the lifetime warranty on tools bought and registered until the end of the year. Unless that was 2022 and I’m moronic
There may be a factor involved in the target audience. They're pro-grade tools that can be used very hard, and if you get 3+ years out of them they're doing really well.
While Rigid are definitely in the DIYer segment, and less likely to see that kind of constant use, so they bait a purchase with the LSA. I'll note that the LSA only covers repairs, they won't replace a burned-out tool, just stick a new motor in it.
>definitely in the DIYer segment
Not really. That’s a made up argument based on nothing. Ryobi and Craftsman ads have boomer dads and their wives in the garage, Ridgid ads have dudes on the jobsite mostly. They would’ve released a fricking leaf blower long before their jobsite blower if what you said was true. And they used a tradie plumbing name to sell their power tools, it was an affordable tradesman brand if you’re not on a color team.
And Ryobi, the real homeowner tools, come with the same warranty as DeWalt and Makita so…
Eh, my hands-on experience with Rigid is the table saw my Dad has, it's functional but a pain in the ass to set up right, with a fence that locks at whatever off-angle it's at when you push the lever. Not exactly a selling point compared to how solid his DeWalt miter saw is.
>DIYer segment
>Worksite Wednesday
>DIYer segment
>Jobsite Radio
You should tell the Ridgid marketing department that your opinion which is most definitely fact is that they’re not tools built for the jobsite and they’re going to lose their ass on the LSA if they keep selling tools to tradies.
>jobsite
>Everything looks like high school new clothes for the first day back
Yea bruh, Ridgid power tools really do make you look that fresh, not some neckbeard with Festiool and Makita.
why is that Black person pretending to be Deadmau5?
Bepis’ tools always look like that. I think he’s curating a museum.
My mom has a job site Makita radio.
I dunno what you chucklefricks are doing to your power tools to make them endlessly blow up because I've put my Ridgid shit through hell and back and none of it has failed me. Feel free to keep paying 2x for red as an apparently necessary mask of competence.
Every Dewalt older than like 2 years I've ever seen has busted ass housings and their chucks don't grip worth a frick. Meanwhile my Ridgid is still going fine and will actually push a 1/2" round shank drill through aluminum unlike the Dewalt..
And my uncle works at Nintendo.
Okay buddy.
That's my line, because your statement was obvious bullshit.
>put drill in Dewalt at work
>slips like a motherfricker
>put drill in my Ridgid
>drills fine
Didn't know McDonalds had anything you'd need to drill for.
Well, you'd be the expert on that, wouldn't you?
I am Nintendo
My co-workers Ridgid 1/2 impact is strong as frick and I always like using it. Though once I save up a bit I'm dumping my DeWalt for a Snap-On impact.
Check out Torque Test Channel before buying any impact. They dyno test them.
The DeWalt belongs to a friend who let me borrow it. I'm only going Snap-On because my dad has been using their stuff for decades without any issues.
It’s a big waste of money, unless you work in a shop and have a really good rep.
If you want the best selecton of mechanic’s power tools, Milwaukee’s M18 Fuel is the way to go. They’re the company that every other company compares to and wants to beat, and they just dropped a new 1/2” high torque that is relatively compact for the power it has.
Compared to the other brands too, Milwaukee tends to keep their impacts pretty compact, like if you watch those test channels, there’s a giant DeWalt 1/2” that is sort of stupid for automotive because it should be a 3/4” square and it rips up sockets, and DeWalt’s newest mid-torque has tons of power for a mid-torque but it’s nearly as large as a lot of high torque 1/2” guns. Meanwhile the M18 Fuel mid-torque has plenty of power for the application and fits in tighter spots.
>I'm only going Snap-On because my dad has been using their stuff for decades without any issues.
And you're going to pay twice as much for no more performance.
There was something to be said for their quality for awhile. Like their tools and batteries are quite stout and tough while covered in grease and power steering fluid, but like 5 years ago I fell off that train completely.
Milwaukee was on the 2nd gen of their brushless high torque and Snap On was still selling a brushed gun with a little less power for like $800 with a battery (kind of like HF’s Earthquake but overpriced). Everybody who was running the Snap On guns were needing rebuilds once a year and they were out of a gun for a couple weeks, I literally sold my Porter Cable corded impact to a dude who works for FedEx airlines and his Snap On gun was out for a rebuild (again). Meanwhile the worst thing Milwaukee users had happen was the battery not fitting as tight after years of use, and they tried to fix that with the new one.
Oh and I’m pretty sure dudes running those Snap On guns had to pay like $100-$150 for each one of those rebuilds because the warranty on their Chinese power tools is nothing compared to their hand tools.
Snap-on hand tools are fine but they outsource the rest like welders and power tools so I'd not bother. Those are geared to bubba who buys everything off the tool truck. Not even the Air Force bought everything from Snap-on because while very good not everything is worth the money.
Watch Torque Test Channel to keep up with what kicks ass.
t. builder of USAF and civilian toolrooms and mech/tech since the late 1970s.
I have the DCF900 and it doesn't trash good six-point sockets. The smaller anvil is more useful as there are more 1/2" drive sockets about. If I manage to break a socket that's just a cost of doing business and why I have backups. Tools are consumables in industry, not a fetish.
The thing is outstanding for salvage work as it their recip saw. They make decapitating trucks to harvest tasty LS a breeze. More power is always good but you can select less if desired. Would buy again.
>Though once I save up a bit I'm dumping my DeWalt for a Snap-On impact.
Fricking dumb. Right now DW is leading the pack on 1/2" impacts. Snap-on is a scam.
If your already on DeWalt tools, just stick with DeWalt. They have like all new impact wrenches with a pretty good jump in power from the old ones. Snap On cordless tools aren’t really worth the money, they’re Chinese like every other brand.
Dewalt is owned by black and decker so no. The fact that the drill in your image has a plastic drive housing instead of a cast metal one should be a tip off.
Now this is some serious dipshittery. Do you think Milwaukee is the same as Ryobi because they have the same parent company?
No, but companies consolidate everything and buy their parts from the same manufacturers, like motors.
I remember an air compressor recall years back when we found out 90% of all compressors were made by DeVilbiss.
Even then, they aren't using the same parts in different brands. At best, a B&D tool might be a rebrand of an outdated, bottom tier DeWalt that isn't sold as DW anymore that they can get the parts cheaper for now than they did when it first came out.
You know you can figure this out pretty easily. Look at replacement parts for the tools and see what the compatibility is. There’s not going to be much shared between Milwaukee Fuel and the cheap Ryobi brushed tools.
For chop saws and table saws yes. Every other tool they make is outclassed in some fashion.
Makita because I can steal batteries from my shop :3
Nope.
I've had two drills from them and both crapped out after less than 40 hours
I have a couple beat up ones, all years old, all work fine.
Heavy duty use as well.
>12 volt
Hobbyists.
>Hobbyists.
If your job is to assemble furniture even those 12V are too powerful and heavy, you dumb frick.
Besides the same accessories obviously exist for 18V machines.
>Let’s be more honest, gullible people who bought into cordless for work are gullible. That’s why we get these stupid chargers, impacts are everywhere, and people to shill them. Stupid people stick together.
>Torque test channel tested those makita skilsaws with two batteries and it runs for 13 minutes brand new, and rapidly degrades to 10 minutes after a week. That’s far short of a day’s work.
Big packs are around 200Wh. If you pull ~1000W from those, yeah that's ~12 minutes of cutting time. Math is pretty fricking simple.
If you frame houses and cut 2 by 4's all day long with your skillsaw, you gonna need 3 packs and 2 chargers. So what. Either you spend a couple 100 bucks on that and don't have to deal with a cable, or you deal with the cable.
I don't have a need for a circular saw very often, I mostly do projects near or in my workshop and i have a huge ass tablesaw, so i don't have any high powered cordless tools. Just a jigsaw for odd jobs and a cordless drill obviously. Batteries on these last forever, and they're just compact 4AH ones. I would never consider having these tools corded.
>Today’s zoomers and millennials actually like juggling and caring for heir battery packs, feeding them, putting them to bed every night in their cradle since they grew up with with tamagotchies and played with dolls. That’s why cordless tools are preferred by trans people. It’s their one “skill” although it’s useless until corded tools used by productive people to fix their incompetence.
You seem kinda moronic.
What's the one with the 1/4 hex chuck that is offset by an inch for?
For shit like when the fricking guy put the drywall up on the walls first instead of the ceiling and didn’t sink the screws, so they’re 1/4 from the fricking ceiling.
Oh, literally just an offset driver. Alright, neat, thanks.
Get one of these and you'll get most of the functionality in those fancy dedicated installer drivers.
They're handy for some things but lose power when impacting. I use mine but use cordless ratchets more.
I'm pretty happy with my brushelss Cryobi shit, just werks and doesn't break the bank for my needs, bonus points fo batteries that are compatible with random ass tools
>unused pegboard
Topkek, it’s perfect. Frick pegboard.
Why the 6-pack charger? Makes a good battery holder I guess. I could see that being worth it with old tech batteries that you had to charge overnight, but even the compact chargers will get a dead 4.0 lithium pack up to 90% in an hour or so.
6 pack charger was on clearance for like 60CAD, and it turns out the Ryobi one only chargers 1 battery at a time. Considering what I paid for it I can't complain
Most of them are like that, “sequential”, especially the 4-6 battery chargers. I think they sort of try to trick people too because it would be obvious you buy them to charge a bunch of batteries at once. Otherwise you could have one charger and swap batteries as they’re done.
Those are awkward when you need any real torque but true, that installation drivet is for dudes who hang lots of cabinets and such, not really a DIYer tool.
>Otherwise you could have one charger and swap batteries as they’re done
Let's be honest here, people are lazy
Let’s be more honest, gullible people who bought into cordless for work are gullible. That’s why we get these stupid chargers, impacts are everywhere, and people to shill them. Stupid people stick together.
Torque test channel tested those makita skilsaws with two batteries and it runs for 13 minutes brand new, and rapidly degrades to 10 minutes after a week. That’s far short of a day’s work.
Today’s zoomers and millennials actually like juggling and caring for heir battery packs, feeding them, putting them to bed every night in their cradle since they grew up with with tamagotchies and played with dolls. That’s why cordless tools are preferred by trans people. It’s their one “skill” although it’s useless until corded tools used by productive people to fix their incompetence.
Okay.
OK, Grandpa, let's get you back to your room now.
> Gramps waddles in the room with a corded oscillator plus an extention cord (since it won't reach the work area) and casts both dirtyfrick wires out into the room, whipping them around to untangle them, blinding the dog and tripping himself in the process. He lands on the cat, killing it, and breaks his ancient hip while shitting himself in the process. The oscillator bit cuts off his dick.
> All while I had the drywall hole finished 17 minutes ago with an 18v makita.
See
and
and
> tamagotchi
They even have little buttons on them that you can press to see if you need to feed them again, or are unhappy. I’m going to get the batteries that connect to your phone because it has more features and is more like a real baby.
>he doesn’t know where his battery is at all times
Please tell me that’s not real…
It’s a good idea, I think it was a trial run for TTI to join with Milwaukee’s OneKey, but there’s more money to be made when all these batteries getting stolen/lost
You can see temp and charge cycles and “battery health” as well
Just my experience but
For electric hand tools:
Festool is overpriced
Ryobi and WorkX are trash
Dewalt is mid bordering on meh
Milwakee isn't a bad choice
Makita is that sweet spot of slightly expensive but quality that will last years and be very worth it.
For Tablesaws
Sawstop is overrated
Oliver has great build quality
The only other thing is yes, kill your wallet and get the fricking Domino if you're doing tons of furniture serious. Frick dowel jigs unless you're a hobbyist.
>Sawstop evangelist Stumpy Nubs is running a Harvey in his new shop/studio setup
At under $1000 the DeWalt Jobsite or Delta Contractor saws are both excellent choices with similar rip capacity and good, accurate fences. Skil makes a sold low-price table saw that copies DeWalt's rack and pinion fence at ~$350.
As a Bunnings employee who works in the toolshop, I can tell you right now that Bosch and Makita are the tools that rarely get sent in for repairs from customers.
are there places cheaper than bunnings to get brand new makita stuff or is bunnings competeitive in price
We're about as competitive as you get, for the stock that we sell. We've got people always looking at other stores to make sure we have lower prices than them even by $0.01 because if another store has a cheaper price for the exact same product we have to match their price and beat it by 10%
fricking hate crummings and their shitty drive throughs. horrible winding maze full of obstacles and they always leave rental trailers, shopping carts and other crap blocking up the parking bays, which forces me to park at the side of the path. then invariably some busybody boomer/karen piece of shit yells that I can't park there.
last time that happened i just went straight to mitre 10 because their drive through is a straight line with un obstructed parking along the entire path.
tool brand wars are just the boomer version of console wars
t. runs milwaukee and wish i got dewalt instead
Does anyone want to share their rankings? I am from the US, my dad built housing developments when I was younger and then just retired to handyman things like building decks and bathrooms.
For power tools:
-Milwaukee and DeWalt are pretty much on the same level, both have some stinkers and have been guilty of having their name slapped on everything and becoming lifestyle brands. I see more mechanics with Milwaukee than DeWalt.
-makita is independent but never seem to really be top of their class, a lot of knockoff tools use Makita batteries. They also have a bunch of different levels of batteries that confuse my small mind.
-Ridgid gets used by a couple of tradie friends of mine, bought by their companies, they work in the stone and masonry trades, but they gimped their lineup and I really don't know how well supported they'll be
-ryobi has a huge lineup and you can use the same new batteries in pawn shop tools you pick up, so you can build up a big arsenal, but they just don't have the same build quality as they're built to a price point.
-skil, new craftsman, kobalt, Bosch in the US, flex, worx are all unknown to me, they seem like they have limited lineups, how much is Lowes going to be investing in kobalt now that they have craftsman?
-porter cable is just old DeWalt designs in a gray shell, it's a zombie brand at this point, and again, now that black and Decker has craftsman, how much will they develop porter cable?
-black and Decker has completely given up, it's like low homeowner tier shovelware
-bauer and Hercules from harbor freight, some tools approach the price of a DeWalt or Milwaukee when they go on sale with a free battery. The plug in tools are good enough for weekend usage in my experience.
-harbor freight warrior is the cheapest of cheap, for your daughters apartment
Personally I use DeWalt 18v tools with a 20v adapter and Milwaukee 12v, and then whatever plug in tools fit my needs
Also Hilti is for big companies to buy for their idiot employees to abuse, festool is for redditors to show off except they lead in certain saw things I don't care about, I saw a video of Walmart returns and they had a whole bunch of impact driver kits with DOA batteries, buying random e-waste Chinese tools off Amazon is for mongoloids.
I hate paying for new batteries because one cell died or having to worry about them being in the cold or the heat, or putting them in the charger too soon after using, or doing maintenance cycles. I also hate running extension cords everywhere.
My dad had a 40v dewalt leaf blower he left in his garage over winter. Battery was completely toast in the spring, wouldn’t charge, charger was flashing errors. I think that project farm nut also killed a battery by putting in the freezer.
t. canada
Well your dad is an idiot for leaving a battery out in a garage through a canadian winter
Yeah, he was used to gas, lead acid, and ni cd batteries which all survived multiple -40 winters without issue. The dead battery was on his second blower, after the first blower’s battery also bit the dust over winter.
He doesn’t care though, he’ll buy another one, he absolutely loves the thing.
I don't think Kobalt competes with Craftsman. Kobalt is a step above in performance and price. Kobalt is more like Flex on a budget. Similar to how Rigid is to Milwaukee. Chevron seems to be slow with putting out new tools but their Marketing tells me they are investing in Flex quite a bit. Kobalts XTR line is probably discontinued since Flex filled that role when it was released.
I have no real experience with any of those brands I lumped together, they're pretty much all brands I wouldn't invest any money into, how long are they going to be around? Craftsman has been through how many different lines of power tools by now? I'll accept they'll at least be around longer than any random harbor freight Chicago electric cordless battery format, or how long their earthquake cordless line stayed around.
All my batteries except the 7.2V nicad dewalts for a cordless screwdriver live in the garage in upstate New York. 18v DeWalt nicad from 2012 are now starting to fail, and I have had one 12v Milwaukee die, but I only have 1.5ah packs and I abuse them in a sawzall cutting steel.
Also realized I forgot metabo and metabo HPT since I consider them pointless extra fluff, even if they aren't awful tools, why bother?
Here’s my new copypasta:
Because I’m the genius that all of PrepHole respects, here’s a QRD of the brands you will find at the major US stores-
Milwaukee M18- Contractor grade, most innovative tools for the trades like electricians, plumbers, HVAC. M12 is the best 12V lineup for certain compact tools like the ratchets. A few bucks more than many other contractor grade brands
DeWalt 20V- Contractor grade, sold across multiple big retailers so good selection in stores and best sales of the contractor grade brands.
Makita 18V- Milwaukee prices with less selection. Boomers like their woodworking tools but their selection isn’t as expansive as Red and Yellow in the US, largest battery is 6.0Ah.
Bosch 18V- Contractor grade but weak selection of cordless tools in the US, especially in brick & mortar stores
Metabo HPT18V- Same as Bosch
Flex 24V- Contractor grade, Powerful tools, but new to the US market so up to you if you want to invest in a cordless system that is sold at one retailer and just showed up a couple years ago.
^^^ These are all the major contractor grade name brand tool.
Now we have the other tools:
Ridgid 18V-Kobalt 24V-Masterforce 20V-
All store brand power tools made by one of the big manufacturers of the other contractor brands. Good quality and performance for the money right about with the contractor grade brands, but their lineup is more limited than the big brands and they mostly cover just the basics.
Ryobi 18V- Weekender grade, wide slection of homeowner stuff, better HP tools and cheaper brushed tools depending on your needs. Made by the same parent company as Milwaukee and Ridgid. Ryobi is one of the few brands that never changed battery design whem every brand went from NiCd tech to Lithium, so they care about consumers with old tools who want compatibility, although the older battery style with the post leads to odd form factor in a couple tools.
Craftsman 20V- Weekender grade. Some brushless stuff is rebranded last-gen DeWalt for a few bucks less. Decent lineup of the basics.
Skil 20V- Weekender grade, this is a newer lineup since the name was bought by another company. They’re produced by the same parent company as Flex and Kobalt, good performance for the money with brushless tools but not a huge selection
Porter Cable 20V- Not sure if they’re still around, the parent company of DeWalt sort of killed them off and replaced them with Craftsman as their weekender brand.
Black & Decker 20V- Light use, the drill your lesbian aunt has in her junk drawer from that time she wanted to hang a planter on the balcony of her apartment.
Porter cable is still sold at tractor supply stores, I guess they turned it into their house brand, it's just old DeWalt designs, maybe with cheaper motors and switches.
With so many brands, battery lineups, and with most company's having a 20v yard tool line as well as their more powerful ~40v stuff, I'm thinking of making a spreadsheet to keep track of which tools you can get with each battery form factor. My sister got a production job and needs power tools, but trying to figure out the best battery to get into is a nightmare between comparing those starter packs, waiting for the right BOGO sales, and making sure she'll have access to the best selection of tools in the future. If I make the spreadsheet I'll probably post the Google sheets link here somewhere.
> porter cable is old dewalt
Porter cable is (or, perhaps, was) actually one of the originals and ancient and based like makita.
Picrel is porter cable in use in 1996.
Same exact drill (middle) from the mid-90s in Russell Morash’s workshop surrounded by two newer porter cable models in 2023.
It’s not that they copied dewalt, they just pretty much kept the design.
Yeah, their routers used to be the go-to for anyone serious, but like I said before, they're now a zombie brand to trick brand recognition for people who used to see them in their dad's shop and assume their good tools.
> makita biggest battery is 6Ah
Well…
>Makita 18V
Lern2reed
Also Makita is moronic. Go ahead and buy that 40V drill, the same damn thing as the 18V model but for more money. And the 40V 2.5Ah battery is the same shit as the 18V 5.0Ah. No cross compatibility between any of the tools either like DeWalt’s Flexvolt, so if you buy into the 40V and want to run smaller low demand tools, you better hope they offer them on the 40V platform or your stuck buying into the 18V platform as well.
They handicapped themselves with a bunch of dumb decisions
Also your pic, look how huge that pack is on a drill that would run fine with a 5 cell pack, so stupid.
Makita is about to introduce “powerstack”-like batteries — the flat polymer cells. Everything will move to 40v. No reason not to.
The whole industry is dumb…. They should have all gone to a 48v standard with 13 cells, and the big-ass packs can use the 18650s and the smaller packs can use the flat polymer cells since they can make them a lot smaller.
I’ll be waiting. Makita is finally doing tabless 40V packs, but they’re not pouch cells. I don’t think they had the lithium packs ready to make compact 48V tools, and it would fricking suck to use an impact driver with a 13 cell 18650 pack.
Also more cells means more of a margin for error, so there’s still an upside to 5 cell 18V packs that can deliver a lot of current.
Anyone here buy into the DeWalt 36v before they shit canned it? I think they had a rotary hammer, sawzall, hammer drill, circ saw, impact wrench and like a vacuum or something.
It’s friggin huge!
Ahh good ol’ DeWalt that actually has compatibility between batteries and tools and chargers, unlike stupid Makita.
>Cont’d
Hercules 20V/12V- Contractor grade if you trust Harbor Freight, but don’t believe their pricing, a DeWalt kit will often be cheaper than the Hercules and it’s a trusted brand. 90 day warranty on lots of items.
Bauer 20V- Weekender grade, similar to Ryobi-Craftsman but only 90 day warranty. Like Hercules, the name brand kits are often cheaper than the Bauer in the end
>Other voltages, not a replacement for 18V/20V/24V, but rather specialty tools in addition to the core 18V stuff
Milwaukee M12- Contractor grade, compct, by far the largest select of 12V tools, compact battery packs that fit inside the handle of many tools. Handful of tools that aren’t offered on the 18V platform
DeWalt 12V- Contractor grade compact. Limited lineup, slide packs will work on some 20V chargers.
Bosch 12V- More contractor grade compact stuff with an ok lineup. Batteries are similar to M12
Makita 12V- Same as above, slide packs like DeWalt but no cross compatibility with chargers
DeWalt Flexvolt- 60V for high power tools, packs can still be used on 20V tools.
Makita 40V- Some higher power tools, no compatibility with 18V tools or chargers like DeWalt. Many of the smaller 40V tools like the drill and impact driver are basically the same as the 18V but cost more.
Ryobi 40V- Weekender grade, mostly yard tools, newer expanding lineup.
Kobalt 40V- Weekender grade yard tools.
Milwaukee MX Fuel- Jobsite tools, let the company pay for them.So
>DeWalt Flexvolt- 60V for high power tools, packs can still be used on 20V tools.
There's also a couple special tools like a cordless miter saw that uses two for 120V operation. Project Farm's first test of battery chainsaws had DW's 60V chainsaw outperform his ten year old Stihl gas saw.
Yeah, the 60V batteries can be ludicrous, but the 20V 4AH XR batteries I got with mine are pretty much perfect size. That said, you could work all week on that pack.
DeWalt’s 3.0 and 4.0 20V packs are pretty dope for most handheld tools like drills and impact drivers. Ridgid had it for a minute with the 3.0Ah Octanes but they were bigger than the DeWalt packs because of the board. Then they slimmed down their next gen packs. Less rubber bumpers and such. Guess it depends what you want from the packs, compact or will hold up to falls with rubber bumpers.
Since dewalt lies and says their 18v batteries are 20v, it means their 40v are really 36v and the 60s are actually only 54v.
Anybody that buys dewalt shit is just supporting a chinese marketing company.
KYS, memelord.
when they are fully charged they are technically 20vs, but it's still an 18v pack, and basically all other brands do this as well
> technically 20v for a few hours after a full charge
According to
only the shit tier harbor fright knock-offs claim 20v. Everybody else can read the spec written on the batteris and add them up correctly.
Either they (1) can’t add, or (2) are intentionally lying since they know batteries aren’t rated like that, or (3) both. I think it’s probably both since they’re primarily a marketing firm it seems.
In the EU, they deemed it fraudulent, so they’re rated their actual voltage there.
Either way, I’m not buying any more dewalt crap. When they start pulling shit like this you know they’re on the way out.
Sorry, dewalt shill. You’re just lucky nobody bothered to class-action it. We can’t do anything about whatever goes on in china, but we can block all imports.
Or nobody but you cares, since they make genuinely good tools and you're just a butthurt fanboy.
Maybe they do still make genuinely good tools. I’ll never know.
I have some dewalt cordless and lots of corded… all the cordless stuff died long ago. Seemed like good stuff, no complaints. Batteries finally gave out.
It’s just sad that the MBAs that infiltrated the company don’t know anything about engineering, electricity, or power tools, and spend more money, time and effort trying to scam people that making good tools nowadays.
But, it happens with a lot of companies.
I have some commercial Black and Decker stuff from the 70s. Still works great, but their reputation is about nil now, I think a teardown showed plastic gears in their cordless drill. I actually have one (found it in the trash) it seems incredibly cheaply made.
They never claimed that 18v is the nominal voltage. That they should refer to their nominal voltage as opposed to their no-load voltage is a standard that you invented. You're literally making up reasons to not like them.
It’s like rating a corded tool at “Now with 170v… all our competitors are still at 120v”
Technically, the 120v is the RMS voltage that everyone advertises and the 170 volts is technically accurate if you’re talking about the peak voltage of the AC waveform.
Ladies buying a drill for their man to help them hang a picture frame might get the more manly 170v version thinking it was better (because more is better, right?)
Just like dewalt probably squeezed out some extra purchases on father’s day, but it’s some short-term fraudulent gains.
I’m sort of with you. It’s a bit of a scam, but I also give them the benefit of the doubt because if they had called it 18V, there would be so many moronic boomers and drunk tradies with 18V XRP packs getting pissed off that the 18V packs they just bought don’t fit their 18V tools.
> dewalt battery line that doesn’t fit
That seems even worse. I didn’t realize they tweaked the battery slot mechanism again.
Although slightly inconvenient, I always recommend everyone get ryobi one plus if they’re worried about battery frickery. I probably have 10 ni-cd era blue tools and they all still work great, it’s been 20 years now. Especially for tools I rarely use, like the cordless circ saw when I have to cut some plywood down to fit in my car in the home depot parking lot.
There’s upsides to the slide packs. For tradies who use the stuff daily and need to carry a couple batteries in their bag, it’s probably worth upgrading to the new style of tools over the course of a couple years. And they sell the adapters.
But for Ryobi, the homeowner stuff, it was worth it to keep the old design. Those guys aren’t wearing out their tools within 3-5 years so it was nice that they didn’t screw them over.
Based Ridgid has been using slide packs since the NiCd days so it’s the one brand where the Gen 1 tools work with Gen 6-7 batteries and Gen 1 batteries will still run Gen 7 tools (albeit not as well as the lithium pack)
I'll note that the battery doesn't look that bad in one of the tools it was really intended for.
I've cut a shitload of trees with that and a Makita after shoulder replacement meant no more pull starting for me. Now I'm healed and still use electric. Unless you're cutting firewood in bulk electrics work very well. I've felled many trees up to two feet diameter. Not quickly but I'm in no hurry.
turn it upside down and you got a hammer
Oh wait just realized that’s the big impact wrench, the frickhueg 40V 8.0 battery makes it look like a drill, and that’s an even dumber pic, but it’s a good metaphor for how stupid Makit’s battery system is because you would rather adapt a 3/4” or 1/2” square down to PH2 instead of paying $300 for a drill that works on the 40V system or spending as much to get on the 18V platform.
I like Milwaukee's hackzall (mini sawzall) for cutting through drywall. With the appropriate blade or even a carbide blade, minimal mess.
All of the DeWalt drills and impact guns I've used felt flimsy. For drills, Ryobi will suffice if you don't need much power or doing basic handyman shit in your house. Just don't drop them.
>I like Milwaukee's hackzall (mini sawzall) for cutting through drywall. With the appropriate blade or even a carbide blade, minimal mess.
makita already solved drywall cutting
>Crappy plunge jigsaw versus the Rotozip that everybody makes
that crappy plunge jigsaw will cut drywall faster and in a straighter line
and good luck cutting out drywall in a ceiling without nicking a wire with that baby roto tool
>Tool literally for scribing a perfect cutout around power boxes regardless of shape
Don't get mad just because you don't know how to use it right.
roto tool is only good for curves, literally everything else is faster, easier, and straighter with the makita
Wtf are you talking about. The roto tool goes as fast as you.can move it.
Rotozip also turn into a killer die grinder using a 1/8" collet. Got one at a yard sale just for that, more balls than a Dremel.
Why are you buying hundred dollar tools for something I can do with a drywall knife before you even get the battery in.
because im not poor
how slow are you at putting a battery in?
The same applies to saws. 90% of the time I'm using hand saw because by the time I get the miter saw out, plug it in, etc I can have all my cuts done already
> use hand tools
For smaller jobs and one-offs, the older I get, the *more* I use hand tools, like hand saws and chisels. I even picked up a brace-and bit and one of those egg beater drills. They are small, light, the battery is always charged, no extension cord, nobody will steal it, cold and heat tolerant, and it won’t die due to software or battery systems changes.
I have the 12v non-fuel and I love it, so much handier than a full sized saw, but it eats batteries.
you can diy those
I’m a plumber and I use Ryobi. A lot of plumbers use Milwaukee or Dewalt, but it’s all Chinese shit at the end of the day. I’ve never had a problem getting the job done with Ryobi tools, and I’m not paying an arm and a leg trying to impress anyone.
Just had my first experience trying to warranty a Ryobi battery that is a year or two old. The old cat lady had an old blue Ryobi drill and sawzall and old dead NiCd battery so I convinced her to pick up the $30 fan with battery and charger. Pretty sure she ran the battery on the inflator down to 0% and then left it in a hot car for months and possibly that helped to fry something in it, I couldn’t even charge it on a power supply.
TTI customer service emails are slow as shit, but she didn’t know where the receipt went and the stuff was never registered, however I gave them the serial #s off the battery, charger, and fan and they’re sending me a fresh battery.
Only downside is they take a week to reply to each email. There’s a phone # that would be faster but from calling the Ridgid support one, I know it’s 45min on hold sometimes.
Also update, looks like India tech support mis-typed the address on the new battery, so I will be surveiling my neighbor’s house today and trying to intercept the package from the UPS guy.
got one of their cordless drills with 2 batteries for $90 (leaf dollars) on sale
does what i need it to without issue
https://youtube.com/shorts/I2s_eB9FyQE?si=Ce7tuCg2MULR9oBJ