Stop wasting your time with small packs and get a British army Bergen with the side pouches. It holds over 100L of gear and is about as compact as the numerous larper packs I see. They're under $150 as well which is cheap by larger pack standards. If you can't carry 50lbs of gear for a few hours innawoods you're not fit enough to backpack
Already have one.
My only real complaint is that it's difficult to get one in good condition
I got my own in M84 from the danish forces, and it just werks. I hope to wear it out, and get a "new" one before the MTS updated back is issued.
I got an Alice medium.
Found out how small that pack really is. You have three sustainment pouches and can add two more but that fills up fast too.
I started out with a medium, then went to a large + frame when I learned how small it was for longer trips.
The small is still a handy ruck, but having a frame and the large is a big upgrade.
literally got rid of mine, it was that useless
I run a medium Alice with a frame; it's big enough for my kit year-round, especially if I strap my shelter under the frame. The lid straps are a pain though, so I'm going to replace them.
>British army Bergen
>
>even more moronic ALCE Black person
Military packs are fricking awful and not for real outdoors activities and designed to carry as much dumb bullshit as it takes to turn a soldier into a cripplegay
>the military doesn't do stuff outdoors
okay
>>the military doesn't do stuff outdoors that doesnt induce serious chronic injuries
yes
>it's the gear's fault that troops are ordered to run around with it too much
okay
literally yes
a combat load is only viable to a sasquatch that weighs 300lbs, not a human
shaq couldnt carry that much shit without destroying his knees
>it's a design flaw of the bag that someone dictated the combat load be heavier than some anon can carry
okay
yes actually
70lbs with no frame designed to sit above a PLCE that occupies your hips and ditched at an FOB isnt real backbacking gear
>it isn't real backpacking gear because someone made a logistical decision to issue more weight than anon likes
okay
>logistical decision to issue more weight than a human knee can physically carry
Doesn't sound like it's a problem with the bag
It partially is. Probably had a long list of requirements, many of them unrelated to building a good backpack and made by a committee with no backpacking or gear making background. It was made for someone to carry combat gear while wearing other gear, not to comfortably carry and sensibly organize a expedition's worth of things.
>a bag was designed for people to carry stuff while carrying other stuff, here's why that's a bad thing
okay
This is very true for a lot of US issuedequipment, and somewhat true for a lot of other militaries.
Long range recce units like the Norwegian ones tend to pic up civilian backpack, see f.ex. https://youtu.be/ofI5RV7fpT4 using Norrøna packs, which is designed to carry a lot and be easy to move with for days, which is a contrast to issued packs which has to compromise to cut cost.
>It was made for someone to carry combat gear while wearing other gear, not to comfortably carry and sensibly organize a expedition's worth of things
Some military packs can be very organized. And for more than just lugging shit load of combat gear. Take an alice for example. All those pouches. Certain places for certain gear. And don't forget that sometimes soldiers have very little time and a lot of shit to do in that time. If you can sit down behind it and open one or two pouches and feed yourself in 10 minutes, without moving from that spot, while never touching the main pouch where your sleeping gear and clothing are until it's time to use them. That's great for anyone imo. They're also huge yeah, you don't have to fill it up. But to replace where you might have inside main pouch a big old radio and a bunch of machine gun belts with extra food and water. You can go a long way with one. People love to say the things are old and outdated but I just call it proven. I can tell you I've been in a light inf unit where we got new age packs given to us and quite promptly everyone decided it was a piece of shit and demanded the alice back, because the new thing was basically 2 big compartments, and other crap like straps breaking etc.
>they have one problem: waist straps, not hip straps
You'd find most soldiers that patrol with one on cut off those things anyway, because you really don't want to be stuck to a 100lb pack when someone starts shooting at you. You want to drop the thing asap
There is actually some modern takes on these packs made but they cost about an arm and a leg, but if sounds interesting look up MALICE pack. Or really you could make something quite similar with a few old surplus packs and a sewing awl
Oh no doubt, I have gungear that's excellent and intelligent for gun stuff and I don't don't that it was made to do exactly what it needed to do. But you look at something like the litefighter tent and it s thick silnylon because this silnylon meets NVG berry compliant standards and is overbuilt to survive 6 deployments with 3 different people dragging it across whatever rock pile they were told to sleep on. And then compare that to anyone that ever selected a good campsite over a shitty one and people taking fragile dyneema tents on triple crowns. I don't think all mil gear is bad or bad at what it does but we owe it to ourselves to choose our gear for our activities, and most don't need 2 frag grenade pouches and theyd probably be better served by a pocket layout they didn't have to fight to make work. Many trips stuck carrying a MSS bivy and bag, outperformed by a 50 dollar FB marketplace find. Don't get stuck thinking mil gear is better for you because it's milsurp y'all.
a grenade pouch can fit a garmin one touch, a canister stove , all kinds of shit
PLCE bergen has an internal frame tho. They're comfy to wear and sit fine on your back. It's a backapack it's not that deep.
>made by a committee with no backpacking or gear making background
literally Berghaus but ok
based
the secret to the medium is running the LBE with it
>medium alice + frame with sleep system on the bottom and sleeping pad on top
>LBE with buttpack and pouches of your choosing
can easily get 3-5 days out of it, only up/downside is you look like you're about to patrol the fulda gap
your right, I would rather look like I am patrolling the DMZ
>If you can't carry 50lbs of gear for a few hours innawoods you're not fit enough to backpack
Camo doesn't work in a civilian setting. Camo in a civilian setting attracts attention which is the literal opposite to what camo is supposed to be used for.
Ruck is camo because a ruck never blinds in.
In the ruck you keep civilian bags that are internal compartments.
Simple as.
Pro Tip:
Get a waterproof ruck cover in the most obnoxious neon colour you can find.
This also covers things strapped to the outside of your pack like tent/tarp, cooking equipment, hatched/shovel/saw etc.
Really lets you blend in with the instagram thots on their backpacking trips.
I do almost exactly the opposite. My pack is just a regular blue color but my pack rain cover is camo.
>have a non shit bag like an osprey and just put an alice pack camo cover over top instead of throwing out your back/destroyng your knees
One puncture later
have you never seen a homeless person? they all have bigass backpacks.
>Camo in a civilian setting attracts attention which is the literal opposite to what camo is supposed to be used for.
Lol homosexual i bet you call the police when you see someone inawoods
why does that matter are you a spy or something
You always have a backpack cover on anyways. Its not a big deal. Lots of civilians also started to wear camo packs.
If possible I would just get one in brown or olive.
>Camo doesn't work in a civilian setting
nobody gives a frick
maybe where you live but in Arizona it usually just means you're cheap or ex-military..
Yeah I wish they made these without the military aesthetic, because then I could use it more discretely without prieng eyes. greyman style
Finally a backpack that will fit my 30 year old Coleman sleeping bag!
Already have a berghaus crusader
These packs are based but get a Berghaus Cyclops 2 Vulcan or Crusader instead if you can it’s basically the same thing only the hip straps are better positioned to transfer weight to your legs.
what you wear in 2023
Are you the guy that photoshops random gear models chins lmao? If so, post some more of your handywork, your subtler one's are your best imo
kekked hard. more of this please. make the larpers and UL gays seethe.
I'm planning on buying the 30 litre british backpack. these british rucks seem to have good cost/quality ratio
>stock photo
>poor
>only walks for a few hours
Guaranteed you’re a fat child who gre up without a father.
I prefer 50L.
>for a few hours
yep we know, you camp right next to the parking lot. bet you can still hear the highway.
anon you haven't even used it yet
you've owned it for 1 day
Those are different bags stupid
looks like a burghan
British are homosexual hicks So no thanks
I actually fell for this meme. I bought a 90l ruck for I think $800 and once it arrived it realized it was made for people that were at minimum 6 foot 5.
For me it's the large alice
In case of external frame get a small one even if you are a big c**t, so it will sit nice and high up your back, not really used the bergen but it looks like a skyscraper that will either be in the back of your neck or hanging around your arse.
please give me the info i am tall and need big bag.
It's tasmanian tiger brand and its some kind of weapon carrier. The thing is legitimately made for enormous men. I can't remember anything else about what specific bag it was but it has two detachable saddle bags which come off and connect to form a smaller day bag.
is it this one?
https://tasmaniantigerusa.com/product.php?id=185
That's extremely similar to it. I can take a picture of it for you if you want but I'm pretty sure the exact model isn't made any more because I've tried to find it again but couldn't.
>buys an overpriced bag, completely missing half the point of milsurp
>buys one designed to weapons systems
>is a manlet
>complains
Shut the frick up, your opinion sucks
>under 6'5 is a manlet
I once had a 120L Lowe Alpine Saracen. It fit everything I could probably want to take with me, so I did. Then I took it on a multi-day hike and was miserable. Now I have a 50L Osprey pack and I take only what I need instead of trying to act tough to please a bunch of internet nobodies.
this. OP is a frickin moron.
>i own bags bigger than anything anyone has ever posted here that they actually own and after years of being a dummy i use a kelty redwing 50L
>135L bag. you dont know what stupid heavy is.
You look like a gay on the trail and all the girls you pass think you're weak like sorry you got mogged
Why do you care so much about what others think of you?
imagine being too weak to backpack and being proud of it. 50L cuckruck lmao just lmao
Ha! You god damn sissy ultralighters with your basedjack faces and plastic shopping bag backpacks! This is what REAL MEN use. You would crumble even trying to lift it up.
If you bought the bergen in OP you wouldn't have larphiker problems like not even eyeballing the pack you're going to use
is that why its being carried by a 5'2 asian twink wearing fake off white fashion brand sweatpants?
anon all the chuds with girlfriends on the trail are wearing osprey and arcteryx.
wearing camo is like buying a toyota supra to pick up girls, the only people who think its cool are other gay men.
begone bugman. the real chad bag is here.
wuts dat bulge? kfc container?
extra pocket.
>its Hueg
BUY BUY BUY BUY
KEEP SPENDING MONEEEEEEY
DON'T EVEN GO OUT, DOESN'T MATTER
KEEP SPENDING AND BUYING AND SPENDING AND BUYING
YOU COULD LITERALLY JUST GO OUT FOR A WALK BUT INSTEAD STAY AT HOME AND BUY BUY BUY BUY
milsurp is cheap
I already have a backpack, i don't need to waste money with another.
true outs have +5 backpacks
Idk, my 85 litre Savotta LJK rucksack has been great for me for my hikes. Never needed anything larger.
Only ever I have had issues with rucksack capacity was when I was in army doing my conscript service (the size of the issued bag was about same as with my own) and in my reconnaissance nco training. That was because we as a squad had to fit several days worth of radio batteries(which were size of bricks), food, water, claymores, a squad tent and a fricking wood burning stove in addition to our own personal equipment.
they have one problem: waist straps, not hip straps, so the load isn't distributed to your hips and they still destroy your shoulders. make sure to ignore the idiots who don't know the difference between the long back and short back variants.
i got mine for £25 but it was heavily used.
Ppl will scoff becuase its .5 ounces too heavy
>100L
Anon I'm a manlet and I would fit in that. I don't need that much.
big dog's gotta eat.
The inner water proofing layer is ass and degrades when it dries up, causing it to split, ship and fall apart.
I'll never get another bergen.
>Split, chip and fall apart
Is what i meant to say.
Or get a Berghaus Vulcan, the pack the UK based the bergen on.
Had mine for 10 years, can't beat it
Also you don't have to look like a mil gay
But I want to look like a milgay
Pic rel is the only pack I’ve ever had. Jansport Tundra 88L. It’s 20 years old. I don’t even know if it’s a shitty pack or not, nothing to compare it to. It’s got some wear and tear so I’m starting to look for a modern pack. Suggestions? Not interested in Milsurp. Could probably get away with a smaller pack. I rarely fill this to capacity.
If it's 20 years old and hasn't fallen apart, either it's a great pack or you don't do anything to warrant a sturdier one. Just buy the same kind again.
>I don’t even know if it’s a shitty pack or not, nothing to compare it to.
My Trans by Jansport is the same way. About the same age too. I've taken it camping, hiking, biking, on planes, to college, and it's my daily pack that I keep my art supplies in. The only thing on it that's damaged is the corner of one of the pockets where I laid my motorcycle down and slid on top of it, on my back, for a few yards on asphalt. It's lasted longer than any other backpack I've ever had. I'm afraid to replace it because I fear the quality won't be as good these days
> I fear the quality won’t be as good these days
They don’t make this pack anymore and I’m worried about the same thing with their newer models. I’ll probably try one though since it’s what I know. This pack is getting stressed where some of the straps are stitched to the body and it’s only a matter of time before one of them breaks. Theres a small hole in the top and that’s it besides stains and dumb shit like that.
>Trans by Jansport
>the only pack I’ve ever had. Jansport
they made one called trans ... the name jansport is instantly synonymous with 40 year old soccer moms and turbo normie karens.
nothing could make me more avrse to buying something than the brand name jansport.
jannie sport
janet sport
a model called trans
very nty
I don’t care and you can’t make me
Yes I can, and I'll do it right now! HNNNNGGGGGG
God damnit, you win anon, you always do.
>Not interested in Milsurp
ngmi
I've also had my Everest 65L for 21 years now, some nicks here and there but the built in rain cover is still as good as ever and the zippers (which are nice and thick) are still in perfect working condition.
I mean yeah, I am a little nerdy about cleaning, treating and lubing stuff, but still I'm surprised a cheap bag like this has held up for this long. (3-4 x week long trips and 1 x longer, about 3 weeks long, per year, so not a "power user" by any means) but it has seen its fair share of hiking.
Whats this called?
Love these packs, can fit loads in but pack isn't comfortable
A sustainment pouch?
Utility pouch generally, i keep my stove in it generally or first aid.
it's too small and should have been another rocket pouch. Canteen Copepouch
Chop the bugger off and sew a rocket pouch there
It's for putting your entrenching tool in and then forgetting about forever.
They're also absolutely useless for load carrying unless worn with PLCE.
Big central top loader with two spacious side pockets is kino. I get hard when the front of the pack can be used to lash and secure things.
I only wish I could find a streamlined "sportier" model in a toned down "fashion" camo pattern with a proper hip belt and fabric that isn't 1/4" thick (for milsurp prices)
>carries all of your bullshit
>modular
>durable
>easily repairable cause parts are dirt cheap at surplus stores
>cheap as frick, can be bough for $80 total, used
>mogs your $400 osprey
If you're so fricking worried about looking a certain way on the trail, you're not far enough out
If you're b***hing about bad knees, I'm going to assume you're a weak legged b***h. The best kind of weight distribution/support system you can buy is a gym membership and some protein powder to toughen up your chicken legs
Or maybe drop some weight and leave your nintendo switch back at moms house
isnt the shitty molle plastic frame only relevant when youre carrying 70lb+ combat loads?
Oh yeah, these are good. You can snap a lot of extra pockets on them.
True. But Rit dye that shit asap. Are osprey really up to 400usd now? Fricked up. I ever get civil I'll just get some North face reg bag.
medium and rit dye (apple green), when you apply the dye, the water needs to be completely boiling at first, keep in water 75 minutes, stir and move around every 15minutes
I don't know why it never occurred to me to dye ACU fabrics. That actually looks good.
fricking around with nylon and rit dye sucks, vinegar stinks up the place
t.goth gay who dyed everything black one year in hs
If did the dying in my backyard would that keep most of the smell out of the house, or does the fabric reek for a long time?
no im just moronic/didnt have a propane burner as a teenager
Id hand wash and dry in the bath tub 2 times to get residual dye/vinegar out
>not using m81 Molle
>Tranime patches
> SLAVA israelitecraine
>m81 Molle
are they $40?
jej
Is "Condor" a good brand? I'm looking at their Orion Assault 50L backpack, it seems like it covers all my needs perfectly, but it is really expensive and I can't try it in person first. Does anyone know the brand or even the backpack itself?
>Condor
its chink crap
only good for pouches
Thanks. It seems to be the consensus I can find online too. Pity, because the design is perfect for me, but I don't want to pay the extortionate price (260 dollars) for something that is really a cheap product.. Hard decision..
SwissGear ScanSmart Laptop Bag
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B097S4JJQV
Got this one because it's the closest I could get compared to one I got used in 2007, and used up till 2022.
the fact that people are seriously considering 50L packs ITT is just plain sad. Ultralarpers, do you sleep in garbage bags in double layered clothing or something? Just a good sleeping bag alone takes up plenty of space
Wait, are you saying a 50L is too small or too big? I can't tell who you're trying to troll.
too small. I absolutely hate trying to stuff these small packs with an overnight's worth of gear
Holy shit, what all are you bringing on your overnighters that you need over 50L?
I did the AT with a 44L and had room to spare most days.
Here’s an old pic of everything I bring for lows around 30F. I think there was also a warm day on that trip, so I opted for the umbrella instead of a jacket. Plenty of space left in a 45L pack, and that’s with a hammock (two quilts).
Bringing an umbrella PrepHole?
Methinks I'm going to start doing this, seems pretty useful in hindsight.
Sucks ass, the canvas isn't waterproof, the internal frame is heavy as shit, the bag is heavy as shit in general, and the hip support is non-existent. If you're doing regular thru-hiking stuff just get a frickin' 3F UL cheapshit bag for a fraction of the cost, if LARPing go buy something from Mystery Ranch or Helikon or something.
>internal frame heavy
You're weak
>bag is heavy
You're weak
>Canvas isn't waterproof
Get the liners or use a garbage bag
>muh hips
You're weak
>2.2kg empty
Sad! Many such cases!
I only carry a trash bag with lightening holes cut in it. Anything heavier hurts my back and makes it hard for me to clean up after my wife's boyfriend leaves
Tiny, malnourished wrists typed this post
>no hip pockets for easy access to my hourly protein bar snack
>into the trash it goes!
>he doesn't wear pants with cargo pockets
ngmi
>he cant move ergonomically because he walks around with shit in his pants
>he adds unnecessary weight around his legs
>"which of my ten cargo pockets did I put it in"
>he constantly takes of his 100ml back to check on an item because he couldn't reach it
>his chocolate flavored protein bar melts in his pants on account of sitting too close to the skin
>he constantly sits on his valuables
>he cant tie his shoe laces because his filled to the brim thigh picket prevents him from bending over
>ergonomically
stopped reading there
what are you carrying that requires 100 liters? i can't even imagine what that would look like.
my -40f camping setup still isn't enough shit to fill my redwing 50, how the hell do you manage to fill that monstrosity?
Milsurp gays are something else lmao. When serving you realise how shit military gear actually is, but of course milsuro gays haven't served.
I was in, which is why I'm picky about the milsurp I buy.
That's fair. There are definitely some items worth having, but the larpers who exclusively use and praise milsurp are straight up moronic.