I'm really sick of the weird prejudice some guys on here have about reusing nylon nuts. No, a used nylon nut is not "looser" than a new one. This is a myth. No matter how many times a nylon nut is used, no matter how big the bolt is, it does not affect the tightness. And honey, you little bolt isn't going to leave it "loose" either.
Do you see that blue stuff? It is basically blue Loctite. So reusing them you should put more Loctite on them.
>Do you see that blue stuff? It is basically blue Loctite.
uhm.. its a nylon ring. made of nylon. not loctite you fricking moron
>not loctite you fricking moron
it works like loctite, to keep the nut from loosening.
i have a lose nut for you, homosexual
sorry anon I'm taken.
yes, yes they do.
I did.
>Meaning BY FINGER. "Hand" implies any wrench.
no it means without a tool.
nylon is not loctite. Does the nylon just jam and therefore creates additional tension or does it crush and create a 2~1part epoxy that acts as an adhesive to the bolt & nut?
you know the answer to this.
yeah no shit. I said it is LIKE loctite. I did not say it WAS loctite. learn to read.
Also Loctite is not epoxy, it's more like corn starch in that it turns hard on vibration but flows when left alone.
It's anaerobic meaning it cures when deprived of air. Vibration does not "harden" it.
https://www.henkel-adhesives.com/us/en/products/industrial-adhesives/threadlockers.html
"The anaerobic threadlocker material cures in the absence of air to form a strong, thermoset plastic that locks threads and joints in place."
In more detail:
https://www.permabond.com/resource-center/anaerobic-adhesive-curing-considerations/
"To facilitate full cure, the anaerobic adhesive needs to have exclusion of oxygen in combination with contact with a metal. With both these boxes ticked, the reactive molecules inside the liquid adhesive become activated, which triggers the curing mechanism, causing the monomers to polymerize and create a solid."
Type of metal affect cure speed.
Analogies are not useful because they confuse rather than enlighten and perpetuate old wives tales. Reasons do not exist to avoid specificity about what things really do.
Except is is not "like" Loctite but different. Loctite does not rely on compression but cures in place when deprived of oxygen while in contact with metal which is quite different. Plastic insert locking fasteners rely on compression and the insert remains under load while the nut or insert (they can be found on some studs etc but that's less common) is installed.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thread-locking_fluid
>Thread-locking fluid is often a thixotropic fluid: under shear stress, it exhibits a time-dependent decrease in viscosity to allow it to be squeezed into place but not flow too quickly on its own.
Still does not act as a round spring in the manner of an insert.
that is for the uncured product.
> anaerobic threadlocker material cures in the absence of air
It’s just the metal contact. It acts like a catalyst to polymerize the threadlocker. The anaerobic/oxygen-free is deception.
Yes, it’s basically paint with abrasive in it, sold at an astounding mark-up
In reality, this is a very well known process, look up “japan driers” and how they make modern “boiled” linseed oil. Hint: They don’t boil it.
Who hurt you? It wasn't any of us.
People think you can't reuse nyloc nuts?
Even in the aviation industry we do, sure best practice is new nuts but most manufacturers stance is if you can't tighten past the nylon by hand it's good 2 go
you're not supposed to tightened past the nylon?
be able to, by hand.
Meaning BY FINGER. "Hand" implies any wrench.
t.ancient engine puke and crew dog.
Of course since hands and finger are not standard prevailing torque is used.
AC 43.13-1B, Section 4, Page 7-11 and 7-12. Table 7-2 etc.
Wrong but they're not especially common. I've seen a few on fighters for little/tiny shit.
For DIY I just buy all-metal locknuts by the bag for my home bench stock there being no reason to prefer plastic/fiber insert lock nuts. If I reuse one on non-aircraft equipment it gets a dab of red locking adhesive for good measure even if it's not loose.
Zero failures in near 40 years of widely varied wrenching.
2011 reno air race crash:
The investigation report, released in August 2012, found that the probable cause of the crash was reused single-use locknuts in the left elevator trim tab system that loosened. This led to a fatigue crack in an attachment screw and allowed the trim tab to flutter. This flutter caused the trim tab link assembly to fail, which led to the loss of control of the aircraft. Untested and undocumented modifications to the airplane contributed to the accident. Particularly, the right trim tab had been fixed in place. Had both trim tabs been operational, the loss of the left trim tab alone may not have caused the loss of control. When the trim tab failed, Leeward experienced 17 g, which quickly incapacitated him and likely rendered him unconscious.
more from the actual report:
The investigation focused on how the left elevator trim tab link assembly could buckle and fracture in bending overload flight. Examination of the elevator trim tabs found that, of the three screws that attach each tab to its respective hinges, two screws in each tab were found intact. All of the intact screws could be rotated easily, even when fully engaged in their locknuts and the locknuts’ insert material was badly deteriorated to the extent that screw-retaining torque could not be maintained.
the pilot was doing his own maintenance and had OP's mind set, because of that he died and took 11 other people with him.
pics of one of the reused lock nuts.
They needed a $5 bottle of red Loctite to prevent the crash.
Eh, sounds like the whole plane was untested trash, loctite can’t fix that.
The NTSB tells me to only throw them out when in doubt
>only throw them out when in doubt
That's not what the quote in your image says.
I worked as an aircraft mechanic for 7 years we ALWAYS threw out used nuts.
those are not even nuts.
those are permanent and pressed into the sheet metal. Even my Honda has these stupid things pressed into the engine protection plate that protects the cheap hoses they use now instead of pipes.
Good job nobody inspects anything anymore.
Especially things that—if they should fail at a single point—end up in a catastrophic domino effect.
that was one nut, and if you read the report it says the pilot routinely removed and reinstalled nylon lock nuts. A big no no in aviation.
At least two F-16s were destroyed because new insert style locknuts backed off generator shafts at high RPM causing complete loss of electrical power. It's been so long I'd have to look it up but IIRC it was on Pratts not GEs. The cure was an all metal lock nut.
Use prevailing torque and you remove strength variations between mechanics (for example dickheads with speed handles overtorquing panel fasteners). On aircraft there's no real reason to reuse somethng so cheap so on throttle switches etc into the trash they went.
Liking inserts is wetoddid when superior alternatives exist. If tech data specifies them I covered my ass by always using new hardware as I would if the bird were mine. Ditto on my motorcycles and other machinery as the cost is microscopic.
Yea but were they nylocks or distorted thread locknuts or elliptical offset or jet nut any of the other types of locknuts that can’t be reused
see
official report here:
https://www.ntsb.gov/investigations/accidentreports/reports/aab1201.pdf
>17 g
Wow
Sometimes I see nylok nuts used in lieu of proper jam nuts. Think for instance of linkages like some brake pedal. A screw goes through a flat bar, then through some cable link, through another flat bar and is held there with a nylok. The only thing stopping that nylok from loosening is the ring of nylon. The nut itself has zero torque. I can understand in this context that reusing an old nut could make it loosen under repeated movement, but if it's used the same way as the typical flat washer, lock washer and regular nut combo, torqued to the right amount, I can't imagine it loosening under normal conditions.
>I can't imagine it loosening under normal conditions.
I can
happened on tenerife too...the nylocks holding van zantens ego in place failed
I'm usually swingin' a pretty girthy bolt and while there are a lot of nuts for me to screw out there, the nylon ones in particular DO in fact get a bit "spoiled" once I'm through with them. You'd have to be either very inexperienced at "bolting one on" or in denial to think that your nut will still remain pristine and pure after being threaded by a man packing a larger bolt in his toolbelt.
to be fair this pic is fibre and not nylon and this nut wasn't reused once it was busted several times till all was gone
also i doubt most PrepHole guys here work on airplanes. for 90% of diy things a reused nyloc will still work
mfw op is literally a roastie
Needs link to thw report and then perfect
god damn it
Genuinely not sure whether to take this thread seriously or pass it off as a shitpost, well done.
Nobody uses nylon nuts for aircraft and other safety critical applications. We use castle nuts and lock them with wire.
This thread is fake, and gay.
Wrong and gay.
you cage your bolt, anon?
eww
That shit is actually not as strong as a standard nut and the practice is driven by unfounded paranoia.
You've been smoking plumber's crack. Their use on aircraft is driven by necessity and strength is a matter of individual spec. Examples include F-16 engine mount nuts which are highly loaded.
begone roastie, nobody wants your blown out holes
Just look at the nut. It's either busted or it isn't. Don't care if it got that way from use, or it was born that way. A loose nut is a deal breaker.
I hate aluminum so goddamn much bros
That's a meme accident and irrelevant. That Pee Fiddyeight was driving five hundred and eighty miles an hour in the Worlds Grand Prix and the engine was generating over a bajillion horse power. The engine and airplane you can't even call it extensively modified, because it would be an extreme understatement. Plus the pilot was an enfeebled octogenarian walking around with like crutches and shit.
But by far the biggest problem was the flutter. it's a difficult insidious problem that we didn't even have accessible tools to measure until literally relatively recently. Every engineer had to watch the tacoma narrows video as a babby, in aviation people have been dying in flutter induced accidents since literally a hundred years ago. it's like chainsaw accidents, it's literally extremely common.
Makes no sense to blame it on a lock nut. meme accident. irrelevant. Also makes no sense to call him lazy. he made a bad decision and killed half of the entire shitty reno air races which was shitty in the first place.
in experimental aviation they educate everybody on how to correctly safety wire stuff (including not putting cotter pins where they can poke your hand) and the technical adviser has to approve it. You can do whatever the frick you want, but the safety advisor ain't no goddamn stupid son of a b***h, so if you try to attach the propeller to the hub with lock nuts despite multiple annual powerpoint presentations explaining which direction to put the safety wire, with annotated good and bad examples, a QA session etc... then you're not gonna get signed off. Also you cant put it in the engine compartment it'll melt
My point is this: that motherfricker could have farted on a sheet metal bracket that holds the flaps on, or he could've forgotten to shake the can of glue when he attached the counterweight to the inside, and that shit would have fluttered apart in the exact same way. He shouldn't have had the single point of failure but that plane ain't taking your kids to day care, it was a suicidal crazy person who even competes in unlimited air racing in the first place. Elevator trim and flutter is like the fricking bread and butter of mechanical airplane failures, appending any significance to the lock nut is an absolute mischaracterization.
I took nylock nuts off my mulcher last week and they were totally ruined, so IDK what this thread is all about.
yeah this one time for my dad anecdotal evidence was totally valid
>look at nut
>is it in shit condition?
>if no, reuse, if yes, discard
Nylocs are a cope to begin with. There's better and real ways to hold shit together under heavy vibration.
My pet peeve is people pulling apart rusty shit, not cleaning it replacing a part damn near stripping all the bolts and putting it back together
People do that to Cnc machines all the time.
Everytime I pull something off a machine all the bolts get throwin in the recycling bin and I get all new hardware
We’re not living in India here
>Everytime I pull something off a machine all the bolts get throwin in the recycling bin and I get all new hardware
I'd love to see this clown get a job at a tire shop.
I was a mechanic when I was 17 flag rate, crashed a customer car once too