I think one thing almost everyone can agree upon regarding the war in Ukraine is that it's shown that most countries simply lack the material depth to sustain offensive operations while also lacking the ability to quickly ramp up production to offset attrition and munition expenditure rates, particularly European militaries.
So what countries are in the best position to sustain combat operations for the longest period of time?
Probably rok, fin, ch and the other total defense nutjobs
>I think one thing almost everyone can agree upon regarding the war in Ukraine is that it's shown that most countries simply lack the material depth to sustain offensive operations while also lacking the ability to quickly ramp up production to offset attrition and munition expenditure rates, particularly European militaries.
I think one of the lessons we've learned is that a ready reserve of vehicles, artillery and ammunition is a must. I've been saying for a long time that many western militaries have glass jaws because they have like 150 tanks and IFV's and can not come back from one serious gut punch. This is hopefully a wake up call to countries to get a bit more stuff then they need and hold on to some of that old stuff but I doubt it
To be fair pretty much all the western militaries expected to be working together. You aren't looking at like 150 French tanks. You're looking at 150 French tanks + 200 British tanks + 150 German tanks + 100 Italian tanks + 300 Greek tanks + 200 Polish tanks...
Europe as a WHOLE is not exactly light on tanks, and many of them are quite nice tanks. It's just that it's also rather deceptive. If a lot of your tank fleet is out for maintenance, it makes you a lot less willing to commit the 60/100 total you DO have. Or it makes you less likely to donate even a few to a cause like Ukraine, because god forbid you donate 40 of your 80 working tanks and then suddenly you need all 80--even if some theoretical foe would have to burn all the way through Germany and Poland just to reach you.
Unironically if they had a more organized European army (unlikely to happen in the next decade) this would probably be a significantly smaller problem, because really, what harm would be done if Europe as a whole just moved all of Portugal's tanks or Belgium's tanks or Italy's tanks over to a place like Ukraine?
You're not even including all the reserve European tanks of old hulls.
Hell half the old bong tanks were sold to civvies kek.
A yes the strategic reserve of about 100 Chieftains, most of which are static display pieces, have all their equipment stripped out and their breaches welded shut
I realised this looking at stocks of weapons. Australia only had 100 JDAMs in stock for fricks sake. Not enough AIM120 or sidewinder to actually fully equip the fleet, let alone replenishment.
It's like they expect to not actually come back from the first sortie.
Or they expect to see any conflict on the horizon, and have time to either acquire munitions from America or actually have the US Navy protect them.
>Britain and France each literally have more nuclear warheads fielded than they do tanks
Because what's the point in having those vehicles, really? It's not the last century anymore, bare the russians still living in soviet copium. Britain and France sure as frick don't intend to invade Spain or Italy or something. When you have nuclear capabilities for your defense, you don't need much of anything else. What you need are the vectors for your nuclear devices, hence prioritizing airforce, missiles, nuclear submarines and ideally aircraft carriers. Tanks are useless.
European politicians are scum who want all tax payer money to go to their friends in civilian business, so they will start dismantling all military strength that has been built up the second Russia signs a peace treaty
Idiot, if you had the slightest knowledge about Yuro politics you'd know that many politicians in the 80's loved embezzling tax payer money exactly through bloated and pointless defense contracts. The military was the perfect vehicle to launder money for the crooked buddies. That's why a lot of the public got fed up with all the excessive defense spending.
Good. Europeans are awful and giving them arms is bad for everyone.
honestly, arty is only a big issue in this war because both sides are incapable of pursuing an air war. Countries with more capable air forces wouldn't need to have artillery ground slogs that use up absurd amounts of ammunition
I can't believe it took over 200 posts for someone to say something sensible
For anyone not the USA, ground artillery is really important. And even then, ground artillery is important. Aircraft can't be on-hand 24/7, and modern air defenses are still deadly even if you nominally "own" the air.
>and modern air defenses are still deadly even if you nominally "own" the air.
The idea is to make sure those air defenses don't exist.
Even with 0 opposing air power in the Balkans the US didn't achieve a 100% kill rate against the air defenses. I don't see why we're assuming we'd do better against an opponent with more modern and more numerous systems than Serbia.
>Even with 0 opposing air power in the Balkans the US didn't achieve a 100% kill rate against the air defenses
Take a look into the misallocation of resources in the Balkan conflict. We ran that shit like we fired everybody responsible for Desert Storm. Pure arrogance and failure to properly plan and execute, just throwing units at the problem because we had no respect for Balkan capabilities.
The whole point of western airpower is to remove as much of an enemy as a threat on Day 1 as possible, to the point of entirely crippling their ability to prosecute a war at all. Well, so long as you define western as "America And Friends". The assumption that anytime a western country goes to a shooting war the entire western world goes with them is pretty valid, and most of them just expect the US to be involved as a matter of course, and assume the USAF and USN air wings will flatten the piss out of anything resembling a rocket the moment hostilities open.
As a reminder, the opening stages of Desert Storm involved something like 3,000 combat aircraft.
Most militaries don't anticipate fighting a ground war for their countries survival (and don't need to). Most European militaries are basically expeditionary forces structured around the idea that the US will be running point on whatever OP is happening.
The real lesson from Ukraine is that you need overwhelming and immediate capabilities (ie, air support, deep fires, etc) to fight any sort of ground war against a competently structured enemy, which is what the US knew back in 1991. You don't win a war by artillerying guys in trenches, you win it by absolutely blitzkrieging the shit out of them and having mass surrenders/desertions.
>So what countries are in the best position to sustain combat operations for the longest period of time?
China, since it produces more than the entire NATO, and not just in volume
look up how great China is at sustaining production during wartime. protip: not great
What fricking war have they fought recently?
They haven't fought one, but they near-totally rely on imports for manufacturing inputs, especially oil. An Australia-tier navy could blockade Chinese shipping and they'd be fricked, which is why they are frantically building a large blue-water navy including aircraft carriers (that China insisted untiil recently were big expensive and worthless)
They'll just get all their imports from Russia instead. good luck trying to blockade deep overland routes, lol
Little bit of bombing and the pipes are gone.
majority of pipelines are buried deep underground. your plan just involves bombing patches of dirt
>anon when he finds out ground-penetrating bombs have been a thing for decades
>What are you going to do? Bomb the ground?
- Man threatening the country that is dumb enough to make a 12,000 kg conventional munition that digs 60 meters into the ground for no other purpose but to kill dictators (and your oil supply)
Only because we allow it to. We only had to warn China not to support russia and they obeyed like a good dog.
>Only because we allow it to
So you allowed your warships to be build using Chinese equipments?
>the US, a lot of it is heavy equipment and machinery.
That explains why 90% of the ship building equipments in your shipyards are Chinese made?
China is the one who built all the heavy industrial equipments.
>So you allowed your warships to be build using Chinese equipments?
Idk about it. Is it bad? Also how does this connected to my post, gay?
>China is the one who built all the heavy industrial equipments.
What are you smoking dude, Chinese heavy industry depends on the US / EU like 100% because of heavy duty machines.
>What are you smoking dude
I'm smoking 2023 reality, you are living in 90s lala land.
China fully dominate both low level shits and heavy industrial equipments.
Nope it's the entire USA, stop impoting parts and equipment from China. The USA deindustralize overnight
>China fully dominate both low level shits and heavy industrial equipments
You're incorrect. Bye.
Change, you party is over. Vietnam and Thailand are cheaper labor. America does not want Asian supply chain anymore. Mexican can do the work cheap too. This is the only advantage you had. "China is butthole".
>cheaper labor
moron who still think cheap labor = cheap manufacturing.
China manufacturing is cheaper because of better manufacturing tech and automation
Wait till they realize that the logistics hubs, talented labor pool, and supply chains don't exist in those other countries, too.
From Apple CEO Tim Cook himself:
>There's a confusion about China. The popular conception is that companies come to China because of low labor cost.
>I'm not sure what part of China they go to but the truth is China stopped being the low labor cost country many years ago. And that is not the reason to come to China from a supply point of view.
>The reason is because of the skill, and the quantity of skill in one location and the type of skill it is.
>The products we do require really advanced tooling, and the precision that you have to have, the tooling and working with the materials that we do are state of the art.
>And the tooling skill is very deep here. In the US you could have a meeting of tooling engineers and I'm not sure we could fill the room. In China you could fill multiple football fields.
Rich ideologically-driven homosexuals are not trustworthy sources of information.
Tim Cook will say anything if it means he gets to keep selling iphones in Cchina.
lol, lmao even
>Caterpillar/John Deere: $50 billion in 2023 ranking
>XCMG/Sany: $25 billion in same ranking
>(Bonus round) Komatsu: $25 billion
stfu chang
>inb4 tHeY doNT prodUCe iN uS
Caterpillar:
Large track-type tractors (East Peoria, Illinois)
Large mining trucks (Decatur, Illinois)
Large motor graders (North Little Rock, Arkansas)
Gas turbines (San Diego, California)
Smallest track-type tractors (Athens, Georgia)
JD:
Augusta, Georgia, United States: Compact utility and utility tractors
Waterloo, Iowa, United States: Ag tractors
Greeneville, Tennessee, United States: Lawn and garden tractors
Horicon, Wisconsin, United States: Lawn and garden tractors
>Caterpillar:
>Large track-type tractors (East Peoria, Illinois)
>Large mining trucks (Decatur, Illinois)
>Large motor graders (North Little Rock, Arkansas)
I have carterpillar branded socks that I bought at Lidl. The heavy equipment you mention does not sell outside USA because it cant compete with Hitachi, Volvo, etc on the global market. Its similar with American cars. The only ones that sell abroad are these giant F150 trucks because nobody else makes them, so American brands are the only game in town. In every other sector American products are outcompeted by euros and north east asians.
This is a surface level meme understanding that isn’t accurate at all. Over a third of Caterpillar’s sales are overseas. While consumer automobiles aren’t America’s strength, the United States is still a major supplier of large amounts of construction equipment and products. But because the average consumer doesn’t buy any of that it is easy to not notice.
Also powdered metal is almost entirely American, for example all the transmissions of Jap crotch rockets are made in Pennsylvania.
The US has about twice the actual industrial production of China, if China used the same criteria as the rest of the world.
>The heavy equipment you mention does not sell outside USA
Anon you're moronic. It definitely does sell, it's declined a bit but it still sells
Caterpillar has overseas operations and a komastu or volvo is really a second tier choice when the dollar is too strong. I see mostly Caterpillars working on jobs where it matters because they are better quality and have better parts and support for that equipment, particularly in remote areas where forestry and mining occur as well as large scale projects. You buy Caterpillar because 5% more work done adds up in construction, mining, paving. Caterpillar is everywhere.
https://www.komatsu.jp/en/company/network/america/
>Revenu = production number
You are moronic
>outright industrial espionage poaching human talent from other countries with sweetened deals
Keep believing that, the reality is that most of world's innovation are happening in China rather than west.
Muh China copy is a myth that's gonna get you all killed
have a nice day, wumao.
>wumao.
not one single white person knows what a "wumao" is
its going to be hilarious watching the integration of chinese "shilling" as not one single white American, not one single person on this mother fricking planet that isnt some terminally online, fricking absolute reddit freak has even remotely heard a chinese slang term, let alone use it in daily life
'china' and 'chinese speak' is more alien to the average westerners life than something from alpha centauri
its so inorganic, and so positively a government funded shill, its almost ludicrous you peopple even try
xigger, wumao has been a mocking term for you trash since the 2000s at minimum. You are about as well fitting as your pals ziggers are here who frequently oust themselves whenever they dont know no ancient old school trends that have floated on the site for ages. Like gachimuchi
Wumao wumao wumao. Booga booga booga!
>t. Charles Ian Allen, the federal agent inside your walls
how fricking new do you have to be to not have heard the term "wumao" before
I have personally witnessed its usage on this site for seven years and I know for a fact it was used regularly before I got here
>You are moronic
Go find the ranking by number of units then and prove me wrong chang
>most of world's innovation are happening in China rather than west
Such as?
Flagrant copying.
Varying levels of espionage and outright plagiarism of western designs, plans, patents, and scientific is used in place in china.
But, they do have a great amounts of intelligentsia due to their population size and a number of highly intelligent and skilled foreign Chinese recruited through their 1000 talents program.
Example, most IP for 5G and rare earth processing tech are Chinese. US has to pay IP fee to China to build their aircraft lol
I live in China and everything that isn't a toy is imported from the west or its allies. Chips, machines, designs, oil, food, everything is imported.
The current reshoring attempts have also hit hard, with an economic slowdown being felt everywhere. Youth unemployment is through the roof while the west thrives. The party grows more paranoid every day and recently indefinitely banned all foreign artists from performing in my city. Give it 5 more years and they ban foreign experts because they steal Chinese brain waves.
And don't get me started on the demographics mess, with tons of old people, no kids and the nationalistic frenzy. Half the nation is soon ready to suffocate if you tell them air may come from across the border.
I don't understand why westerners have this economic cuck fantasies.
First it was mighty Russia starving the west of gas and subjugating Europe. Now it's China teleporting oil through the Malacca strait and living off of sunshine instead of food. It's not gonna happen.
Fun fact:
The CCP is so panicky about food they recently decided to plant fricking rice paddies in public spaces. Fricking moronic. They even destroyed some actual agriculture to plant rice that dies after a week.
Another fun fact:
I can't drink the tap water here.
I am inclined to agree. We DO fear monger a lot, especially the MIC. China does the same about us to drum up domestic support. And nothing is going to happen, because people would stop making money and that defeats the primary purpose of war, which is money.
>/r/ing that "thumbs up USA smiley" meme of "when you are X to defeat Y, but then they turn on you so you arm Z to defeat X, but they turn on your... etc"
Even if China got their shit together tomorrow (unrealistic) and all our problems did nothing but metastasize (real problems, like political fragmentation or alliances breaking, not "le west is dying, a little mermaid is black" made-up problems)... we would not see a dent in our foreign or domestic potential for decades. Rot takes a very long time to institutionalize, generations. And while we have rot, everyone else's is as bad or worse.
And trends have a tendency to not continue to their terrifying worst-case scenarios. Remember in the 1980's, when EVERY SINGLE sci-fi setting had total Japanese cultural and economic hedgemony? Blade Runner, Neuromancer, Even Michael Crichton and Tom Clancy got into it with Rising Sun. And all of them could not have been more wrong if they tried.
The west is dying has more arguments beyond Black fish people
Like the very same demographic collapse that the chinkoids are going through just with a few differing variables because we're not dumb bug c**ts, just stupid
Or how the biggest environmental fear in the 1970's was....global winter. LOL.
Sometimes I think we aren't happy as a species unless we think the apocalypse is just around the corner.
yeah I have also noticed doomerism is a prime driving force. When it is not global winter it is warming. if it is not warming it is climate change. If it is not climate change it is demographic COLLAPSE.
Just like jealousy is disturbingly influental in shaping large scale behavior
>Even Michael Crichton and Tom Clancy got into it with Rising Sun. And all of them could not have been more wrong if they tried.
They were right, it just happened with China instead of Japan, but for generally the same reasons. USA cannot sabotage China with any form of Plaza Accords.
The myth of American exceptionalism is comical. Go anywhere else in the first world and it becomes immediately and painfully obvious. Everything is decaying. Decades of overconsumption and corrupt officials in every office of every western country has made us just as bad as the vatBlack folk or the slants. The sheer scale of the embezzlement, mismanagement, and incompetence of our leadership and bureaucratic class is staggering. The fact they can steal or piss away so much without most people being aware makes me sad for what could have been if we hadn’t become some neo-Confucianist shitshow where the government is just a circle-jerk of dysgenic nepotists.
post guns
post air conditioner
post refrigerator
post car
because those are all things the more developed first worlders are too civilized for or something
Lol. You homosexuals always assume that anyone critical of the US is some thirdie.
are you a twink?
Wait, you're American and you circle jerk about how much better other countries are than America? Holy shit dude
Dude, you can be American and proud of our past accomplishments, but also realize that our society is circling the toilet and needs major reform. Euros and even some South American nations beat us in quality of life and economic mobility, whereas in the US a car accident or bad illness is enough to put the average middle class citizen into poverty.
So you're pretty much just not happy with the healthcare system
That's a big one, but there's more than just that. For example, car-centric suburban development costs us trillions a year paying for vehicles, insurance, roads, healthcare for people injured in accidents, pollution from ICE, tires, and asphalt, and also leads to chronic underfunding of more efficient modes of transportation such as bikes, busses, and rail, which then makes traffic congestion even worse.
Insurance is not a panacea, nor is it instant. My gf still has long term issues from a car crash two years ago whose costs aren't covered by insurance or her accident settlement. She broke her leg last year and her health insurance refused to pay for anything, related to her leg or not, until the lawsuit against the company for code violations finished, which took 8 months. Our society is actively hostile to you unless you were born rich.
lol I was actually shitposting and yet you went in on tfw to intelegent to own a car
>future doctor steals bike
>sell it for crack
>happiness +
That's some shitty insurance then. My sister use hers a bunch when we were kids and it always had kicked in by the time the bill was due.
>Our society is actively hostile to you unless you were born rich.
This is not a commie friendly board frick off
Kinda the point. That's the best plan she could afford. That shitty insurance is what a shitload of people in the US have to live with. I don't care that rich people exist. I just want them to pay their share back into the society that enabled their wealth into the first place.
Fricking dumb as a sack of bricks. The US was just as big in 1900, we didn't need cars then. They're a luxury item, the fact that you need them to survive in the US today was an explicit political policy choice that actively hurts our society.
>Fricking dumb as a sack of bricks. The US was just as big in 1900, we didn't need cars then. They're a luxury item, the fact that you need them to survive in the US today was an explicit political policy choice that actively hurts our society.
Everyone would have loved cars and roads back then
Thats kind of why we built them
Not if you told them they also have to spend 10-20% of their income to pay for it and now they have to use it to go to everywhere.
Bad analogy anon. Forcing car ownership is more like forcing everyone to operate their own little coal plant for their electricity. Just think, you don't have to pay the power company any base fee for service! All you do is burn your coal whenever you need power. Nevermind the whole economies of scale thing of the electric grid, that's communism.
>Thats kind of why we built them
... We built them because we realized the Autobahn let Germany move frickloads of material around super fricking fast during the war.
That's why. That's explicitly the reason.
The US was just as big in 1900, we didn't need electricity and indoor plumbing then. They're a luxury item, the fact that you need them to survive in the US today was an explicit political policy choice that actively hurts our society.
>Kinda the point. That's the best plan she could afford
My job provides better insurance for $40 out of my paycheck a month dude
Damn that's a good deal. I work for a small company so we don't have a company insurance plan. I pay $870 a month on a "catastrophic plan" that basically only kicks in if you get hit by a bus or have assaidscancer. That $870 covers me, my wife, and my child though.
>I pay $870 a month
Holy fuk how much do you make
I did misspeak though, it's actually $40 a week for me, my bad. But it's a solid personal plan
80k a year. The healthcare is more than my mortgage lol
Because of the size of america everyone still needs a car
Corrected it for you.
>Because of the size of americans everyone still needs a car
I feel the same way. It's fun to dump on china and all but their infrastructure these days (at least in their larger cities) looks leaps and bounds anything than what america has.
Frickers have laid down an unholy amount of track in 2 decades including HSR, meanwhile in the same timeframe california still doesn't have HSR built after almost $100+ billion wasted and 2 decades of planning. A lot of our own rail lines are still the same ones more or less unchanged from a century ago, lacking electrification, maintenance, available labor pool, it's just peak decay. The US gets more train accidents annually than china does.
This is all just one example. Our own car infrastructure isn't even doing any better of course, see the recent I-95 bridge collapse or just the worsening traffic situation in general. Allegedly the interstate system was built to facilitate better transportation for military purposes in mind in a cold war context, imagine trying to do that today with how terrible congestion is.
America's black population causes high crime which makes normal high urban density impossible. American car centrism started as an architectural fad, and continued due to our vast distances compared to Europe, but black crime is what locked it in.
You should go leave, shitskin.
How is he wrong? Go to PrepHole or /n/ and they'll tell you the same and hold the same opinion themselves
The only people telling you that on /n/ are the same carbrained morons you see arguing for it here. /n/ has always been a cycling, bus, and train board.
t. posts on /n/
>cities full of high density mic/wop/pollack/ect neighborhoods get broken up in the 50s by the importation of nogs
>suddenly nobody wants to live in the city
>when suburbs get nogs today that suburb dies and people move to a new one
It's darkies genius, go suck off your mathematically illiterate hero on the "notjustbikes" subreddit. Urbanity should be destroyed even if it wasn't for diversity making it even shittier.
Are we pretending that blacks don't commit 50% of crime, hispanics 30%, and whites 20%? Because that's what the FBI said before they conveniently created a new crime data collection system that was expensive to implement and thus data hasn't really been collected for over two years now.
>50% of violent crime is all crime
Yeah, just stay focused on black people. Everytime someone points out some way you could improve just say "but black people!" Never fix your healthcare system, remember, black people.
Focus on that.
Pay no attention to the fact that wage theft, employers underpaying cucks like you, absolutely dwarfs all larceny and robberies combined each and every year. And remember to focus on the Mexicans, not the people hiring them. If you wanted to fix that shit you'd have to work with black people, and then where would you be?
Always remember, you're the top slave.
>ablablablah
Nobody's denying blacks are a big problem we're just tired of /misc/ deflecting to them every time we talk about other problems.
Given that the US industrial base has all moved to small towns(all white) with cheap frieght rail access or are ten minutes from a nearly deserted interstate there is no reason to concentrate in urban centers anymore. Computers eliminate the need for a centralized white collar workforce in a single office.
Are you homosexuals from TRS, you spout their same talking points. Rural(white only) America is doing fine with its 2.3 birthrates. I cheat on taxes like a mother fricker and have for decades. When the feds can't replace a bridge the township does 8 of them in a year for a quarter the price via local politicking. When they try to import darkies we murder them and burn down the Section 8 housing. Even the lowest of the poorgays around here isn't in any real trouble and they are practically white Black folk, I know because I prefer to hang out with them rather than "respectable" pussies.
>some South American nations beat us in quality of life and economic mobility
You don't understand bro favelas are actually comfy bro it's what uncle Ted wanted fr fr
>in the US a car accident or bad illness is enough to put the average middle class citizen into poverty
No it's actually not, it can in extreme situations but insurance, which most people get though work these days, and the fact that you can literally negotiate with hospitals are a thing
You can negotiate but most hospitals don't staff any people for that. You negotiate with the debt collectors they sell it to, often before your insurances has even paid.
When my son was about 9 months he has a weird episode of a parasomnia. Often mistaken for a seizure. We drove him to the ER but by then he had come out of it. No wait, which is uncommon, so we went right in. They were taking is temperature and had all of one CNA, likely getting paid $9 an hour, in there for about 4 minutes. We said we'd just go to our pediatrician and left.
$600 since we didn't stay long enough for insurance. Submitted it to insurance who paid $134. Get another bill, $611 now, because the rate charged if you have insurance is higher.
Insurance only covers shit in the ACA for copays, which isn't much. Anything over gets balanced billed to you until you reach your deductible, normally a few thousand. When we had my son, uncomplicated birth, just regular check ups, that was about $6,000. We have a higher income but that's about 10% of your median households pre-tax income.
When I broke my ankle years ago I was making a lot less money. Got my hours slashed at work because I couldn't do as much and got hit with huge bills because, while the hospital I had gone to was in network, they can decide to have out of network doctors there whenever they want, who can bill you whatever they want and then hope you'll negotiate to something or they'll just turn a profit selling the debt. If I had a family then I'd definitely have financial problems.
People who think the US system is sane are either children on mommy and daddy's plan or have never tried using US insurance and don't look at their pay stubs. Average family plan in the US is $22,400. That's a significant amount of most household incomes going to a plan that will pay frick all if you got into a car wreck until the deductible is met.
>But my employer pays for it.
You don't think the fact that an employer has to pony up $23,000 for each employees healthcare (still $8,000 for a single) means you don't make less money? Even if the employer covers a high % or all, that's still money that can't go into pay.
It hits people making under $100,000 the hardest because the question becomes "why am I going to hire someone for $20 an hour when, if they have a family, their insurance doubles our cost and I'm not 'legally' allowed to term them for being expensive." Employers don't hire due to insurance expenses all the time; I see it from working with MA companies where healthcare was free for low wage workers.
If you're making just $80,000, which is still go for the US median, you're insurance ends up easily still being equivalent of 25% of your pay going. People don't understand this and that's why they don't fully get how moronic it is to have life expectancy worse than Cuba or Qatar but healthcare spending 2-3 times higher than other developed nations. Third world outcomes for over twice the price, and richgays still get worse health outcomes due to systemic issues.
Breakdown the life expectancy by race and then discount industrial or automotive accidents and the whites in the US have the same life expectancy as Luxembourg or Cannuckia. People also say the US education system is shit yet white Americans score higher on Math and Science PISA tests than the Finns or Japs. Indeed higher than any other population that isn't already undergoing strong sorting pressures and therefore isn't representative of the population as a whole(exp Shanghai assuming that's not just cheating).
>if we just simply ignore all these other relevant factors we come out on top!!
>btw it's cheating when other countries like china do this
No libtard if you want to identify the source of the discrepancy between statistics(assuming the same and accurate data collection methodology) you attempt to emulate the experimental method. You want to control for all factors. If there is no difference once your normalize the data for the excluded factors then clearly those factors are the most likely cause of the discrepancy. Darkies die much earlier, homosexuals die much earlier, so if you start crying about the mean age of death I'm going to start asking for a demographic breakdown. Understand that I hate blacks and do not care if they die, thus I don't want to solve the "problem". Unless it hurts whites I like then I don't care and may indeed prefer the "problem" to exist as it kills my enemies.
cool, glad to hear you make excuses for how it's okay when your country does it but it's cheating when other countries do the same
>discount industrial or automotive accidents
Literally making my case for me lmao
>supposition: health care is the problem the results in differing outcomes
>eliminate all factors except for healthcare
>no statistically significant difference in outcomes
We weren't' talking about cars dumbass. Heavy equipment which you use often will result in a increase in fatal accidents. Though oddly enough the only things that lead to significant increases in fatal accidents according to the CDC are inground swimming pools and a flight of more than twelves steps, because they are essentially pit traps. Everything else just changes the mode of fatal accident rather than the rate.
White America is way more rural, industrial, and operates way more machinery of all types than Europe so we have about 10% more fatal accidents and since they proportionally kill the young who use them more often and have less experience it has an outsized effect on life expectancy, knocking a year or two off. Which is why we also break down life expectancy into age brackets, in order to determine what factors are killing people and when.
LRN2 statistical analysis.
>person of any color
>not coloured or more creative slurs
I actually don't hunt waterfowl, never got the migratory bird stamp.
Also look up the missing person's reports for Jefferson and Clearfield Counties in Pennsylvania. 99.9% white counties and all the missing persons are imported darkies. A few might be skipping out on child support or snitches getting stitches but not all.
My second post in those whole discussion
was about how much car dependency hurts quality of life in the US. You are literally making my case for me that we match Euros "if we exclude that from the equation". You utter fricking moron.
>I actually don't hunt waterfowl, never got the migratory bird stamp
Fair, stamps are gay, that's why ditch chickens are my go to
As far as Jefferson county missing persons go on the page I checked there are two, both white women, on the Clearfield list there are three Black folk, a red, and the rest are white
Frick off with the head cannon homosexual
>If you're making just $80,000, which is still go for the US median, you're insurance ends up easily still being equivalent of 25% of your pay going
How can this be true? I make 90k/y and I "pay" like 2-3k a year in health insurance. Is this because my employer pays for the rest?
Yes.
america is the best
Have you ever been abroad?
Not american
So you're from reddit, are you guys still protesting?
are you in a prison cell in norway?
Are you in a closet?
>buzzwordsbuzzwordsbuzzwords
You think you're really smart , don't you?
5th columnist incel mad because Western women don’t look at him
Are you Chinese or foreign? IDK why the CCP doesn't shorten the work day/week, to create more jobs. They rule their country with an iron fist and have the power to do anything and they keep using their power for the most moronic shit.
You need to shift your perspective to understand it, don't think like a person or a leader or a Chinese nationalist - think like a party boss
the people work long hours because working is what the people are for. if they weren't working then what would be the point in having them around?
This mindset is not exclusive to the Chinese communist party, it's the same reason the Russian oligarchs don't care how many mobiks die and it's also the way your arsehole boss feels about you
Yeah I was tracking the great green wall project thats was pants on head moronic.
Been watching the forest to farm projected they started that you are talking about.
Both seem to make the same mistake that the four pest project made.
In which nature should bend to the party and proced to frick up natrual cycles.
>I live in China and everything that isn't a toy is imported from the west or its allies
No you don't. You are just a glowie
repeating the same talking ignorant point.
>Give it 5 more years and they ban foreign experts because they steal Chinese brain waves.
Pircel, USA being brain drained by China
You're a special kind of moronic, the kind of moron who thinks he's smart.
You fall for fake shit even though it's obviously bs like the pic you've posted.
Picrel shows the source, which you conveniently left out because you don't know shit and that's why you believe a dumb graph and just incorporate whatever bs you see online into your sooner worldview.
Tell me, how can you source the numbers for 2021 on a report from 2017? Oh and the report is publicly available and there's nothing in it that has anything to do the shitty little graph you've posted.
I've heard similar from other Chinese nationals here and elsewhere. Would the assessment of "The Mao era part 2, this time with smartphones" be about right? With all the senseless death, blind fanaticism, and general stupidity of government that that entails?
Personally I just wanna see schizo Xi go full moron and try to conquer Asia for food and Alaska for oil, fulfilling the Fallout timeline.
If we don't fearmonger our gear gets rusty and outdated.
>plant fricking rice paddies in public spaces.
kek. what was the actual implementation?
>90% of the ship building equipments in your shipyards are Chinese made?
>1 (one) industry
Okay
Total amount and breadth of goods produced is an important factor, but not the only one.
As an example of qualitative over quantitative goods, the U.S. pioneered microchips and the complex infrastructure necessary to built the highest performance ones at scale. Taiwan's monopoly on the best fab plants is a fairly recent development, and Intel still has the engineers and patents to make a domestic plant if the billions of dollars needed were supplied. China is currently barred from purchase of the etching for the process below some number of nanometers, a problem at which Xi Jinping has shown great willingness to throw money. It's a complicated thing to derive from first principles, and progress has been slow going.
There are other extremely high tech and high margin businesses that have not been outsourced to China, and the espionage activity uncovered in different sectors has been interesting, to say the least.
While all of that is true, it's not guaranteed that China won't eventually reach parity.
They don't yet have the entire equipment chain setup, but these are scientific and engineering problems which have reproducible solutions, given enough time.
And China has proven to leapfrog at a quick pace multiple times over by now; outright industrial espionage poaching human talent from other countries with sweetened deals (TSMC engineers for example; British / German air pilots teaching at PLAAF flight schools).
It's not like China is incapable of making their own EUV processes, they just saw no need to when they could just buy them at a relatively much cheaper cost-- until very recently where it now became a matter of national security due to last year's chips ban. It will take a while and the west has the lead now, but China is here to stay for the foreseeable future. What then when they inevitably catch up?
outright industrial espionage or* poaching human talent
Anon,HSMC started in 2018.They even poached TSMC bigwig Chiang Shang-Yi and got with him an ASML lytography machine.If you think China didn't try that time or that it can pull that again you're very mistaken.
>HSMC
Speaking of
https://www.npr.org/2021/03/25/980305760/a-cautionary-tale-for-chinas-ambitious-chipmakers
>Intel still has the engineers and patents to make a domestic plant if the billions of dollars needed were supplied
There is a $21 billion dollar semiconductor complex in Ohio going up right now. That is huge investment. You can build a really big car plant for $1.5bil, to give you an idea just how big that chip plant is.
>and Intel still has the engineers and patents to make a domestic plant if the billions of dollars needed were supplied
Two each in Ohio and Arizona are already in construction
Anon
Indians made Usain Bolt's Shoes for pennies an hour.
Who gives a shit.
Slaves make cheap things. That's their job.
is that why china is still buying all that russian energy?
Your pic shows it producing the same amount as NATO but that alone doesn't cover it. The US alone has 17% of the worlds manufacturing capability, China produces a lot of the stuff you find at the dollar store, the US, a lot of it is heavy equipment and machinery.
What's worse for China is that in terms of production, in a conventional war with the United States China's theoretical production capacity will drop fast as their factories run into unexpected stealth bomber related production delays. China is formidable but they don't have the world by the balls, they can't even feed themselves.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clean_Plate_campaign
They seem to be feeding themselves just fine these days.
>links to Wikipedia page which clearly states they have not yet achieved their goals of food security
This is either a new level of moronation or a new level of shitposting or maybe a new level of both.
>The US alone has 17% of the worlds manufacturing capability,
Only trough accounting magic since its measured in unadjusted PPP dollars, not actual output. China produces a bit over 50% of all the world's steel. USA does like 15%. That translates into a massive chink advantage in shipbuilding.
What kind of ships? Chinks have plenty of commercial shipbuilding experience and infrastructure but doesn't the USA still retain the ability to design and manufacture warships completely internally?
1. China produces 10x the steel the US does. I'm not saying it's good. 2. The US does not have the large machine tool capability anymore either. I am talking about large precision lathes ect for ship/sub driveshafts, turbines. 3. We do not educate enough people in trades to operate this equipment. 4. Semiconductor is returning from the Pacific Rim. 5. The entire electric car activity is to cut down on imported oil, and cut down the influence of the countries that produce it.
"value add %" represents profits from cheap labor, not output. Not important here.
>cheap labor
>China
Pick one. China is the world capital of automation and smart factories
>"China is the world capital of automation and smart factories"
>posts a graph where China is fifth
>1-4 are US allies
>6 is also a US ally
>7th is Chinese, finally
>8th is literally Taiwan
???
to be fair he posted a per captia chart when he was talking about total.
So in actual numbers he is most likely correct.
China lacks basically all critical manufacturing resources at an indigenous level, as well as basics like water, fuel and food production.
More so, their logistics train to supply their industry and population relies completely on A) ports and shipping lanes in and around areas where their enemies either have a major naval presence and/or B) countries that are strategically allied with China's most likely military rivals.
Even with the strictest of rationing, china's current stockpiles of primary resources, fuel and food would be exhausted within weeks to month depending on the specific item in question and an attack on any number of reservoirs, especially the 3 gorges dam, would plunge most of the country's agriculture and population into catastrophic drought.
There is a reason why China belting out as many blue water ships as possible and trying (and failing) to create overland logistics infrastructure right now and its not because Xi is compensating for his little chinese dong; China MUST completely dominate several major shipping lanes if they want to fight a war against western allied nation like the US, Japan or Taiwan.
>China lacks basically all critical manufacturing resources at an indigenous level,
Uh no. F.ex China produces the bulk of the world's pharmaceuticals, either directly or trough the production of chemical precursors. A war with China would mean that the supplies of blood pressure and anticoagulant medications would dry up for everyone but the richest Americans, and 30 million Americans would die over the course of 1-2 years as their bloated bodies collapse without the basic medical hacks required to keep them alive. The risk of dying from cardiovascular complications increase exponentially the fatter you are. Ideal body composition is like 10% fat if you are a man and 20% fat if you are a woman. Americans are way way way beyond that. "He's a big guy". No he is just fat.
all of this assumes that china is ok with totally cutting itself from trade with america which is not going to happen because our economies are tied together. it's economic MAD. may as well argue that china can also nukes
I think you underestimate Xi's moronation.
There's a weird sense of permanism that underlies both pro and anti-Chinese discourse, when in fact China has only existed as a modern and functional state since 1979 at best, and this period of rationality may in fact be an aberration.
Deng implemented some economic reforms, in the hopes they would deliver an economic miracle like they did in Taiwan, South Korea, Singapore, Hong Kong, etc., and they generated $20 trillion in GDP, but at the reflexive, emotive level Xi HATES those "reforms."
Everything about him suggests his desire to kill China's golden goose out of sheer ideological spite; see him suddenly repealing the 10-year term limits implemented by Deng.
I'd also make the comparison to Russia, in that Putin's actions were almost inconceivably irrational and contrary to Russian interests, that Russia had the opportunity to become an integrated and modernized superpower and it just blatantly went "Nope, we're not gonna do that lol"
>China has only existed as a modern and functional state since 1979 at best
I think that is an unfair statement and would instead argue that the mainland Chinese state has existed largely unchanged for more than three thousand years now
The PRC is not a new state, its just the same old China with a new flag and a different word for "emperor"
>the mainland Chinese state has existed largely unchanged for more than three thousand years now
Post emperor
He calls himself "General Secretary of the Chinese Communist Party" these days
>I think that is an unfair statement and would instead argue that the mainland Chinese state has existed largely unchanged for more than three thousand years now
lmao, spotted the actual real life chinese
Xi is basically a reactionary idiot boomer, just like Putin is. They'll both drive their nations into the wall.
>war happen
>China send tsunamis of poor starved conscript told the other countries have been pillaging their food
>50% of them die
>war is won for China and they solved both their overpopulation and food problem
Only real problem for them is that India have a population just as big and will likely side against them if any serious shit happen, or at best, let China go weak from the war, then play their own card.
>China send tsunamis of poor starved conscript
China doesn't even have conscripts
Mutts are so brainwashed
Half of that is child labor
As I have informed your moronic slant ass in numerous other threads China counts construction as an "industrial process" and construction accounts for a full third of their economy. They also define automotive maintenance and electricians fixing your wiring as "industrial" but that is a smaller contributor. Even if you discount construction and its supporting industries that still leaves nearly a third of the real industrial production tied in in cement and brickwork which is a real industrial product but one of little use in modern war since bunkers are no longer effective as fortifications.
If China used the same criteria as Murica, Germany, or Japan to define what "industrial" is their total industrial production would be about 1/4 of what they claim and thus roughly equivalent to Germany or Japan and half that of America. And that doesn't even account for the fact that your "value added" homosexualry is mostly assembling components shipped in from elsewhere: for example America ships cihp components to Taiwan which ships the chips to China which puts them into plastic boxes press formed in America fitted with Screens finished in japan with components made in America.
Understand that I don't like this situation, I want America to be a genocidal tariff empire like it was in the 19th century. I want you all beggared and starved, but I'm not in charge, yet.
This, but with the caveat that they don't get internationally sanctioned or blockaded during this hypothetical war. If eithervof those things happen, they fold fast.
Have we ever seen chinkshit in action?
Some of it in Syria, mostly missiles. They do as missiles do. Not much to write about.
This and also this
>slant shills still try to claim their grifter society is somehow the future
There is a saying in China that once you've struck rich, you do everything you can to leave because 1) you have most likely scammed your way to money 2) the business environment is China is forever shifting and never stable and you're likely to lose the money tomorrow on CCP whim.
America, both Koreas, Pakistan, India, Iran, Turkey, Greece, Poland, Romania, Belarus (?), Germany, France, Spain (?), Eritrea, Syria (?), Egypt, Sudan.
What am I missing? Feel like I'm missing some obvious ones
>inb4 what about this western country!!!
If you dont have thousands of stockpiled afvs your going to lose
What planet are you living on?
If the UK somehow got into a peer war and it lasted over 6 months they would literally run out of afvs. What does sustained combat mean to you
Sweden
An average US state is larger then most nations in Europe. So this is no surprise. This is also why NATO and EU was created.
Stuff your vatBlack person-chang shit up your ass and frick off. VatBlack person-chang for roubles spam thread goes in all fields.
Look at your inarticulate english as a second language bullshit posting. Look at you go.
I don't understand why ziggers false flag like this
>An average US state is larger then most nations in Europe.
Not really, it's just that the continental US is the size of the entirely of Europe, but with only half the population. So we aren't crammed together anywhere near as much and thus have a lot of room to put shit. I think I remember reading somewhere that America would have to have a population of 1 billion to reach the same population density as Germany.
dafuk is the storage cope cage?
you are again confusing "it looks big on the map" with hard metrics. Is Russia a global superpower because it look so big on the map?
Real war demands the mobilization of the economy and the conversion of civil industry to war industry.
The countries with the most industry can do this the better. So, USA, Japan, Germany and Korea are kings.
A country with a powerful industry like Germany could start pumping tanks, planes and ammunition like if they were candy if it decides to go all in again.
The issue is that you still need a significant stockpile of equipment and munitions to alleviate equipment loss and usage while your industry ramps up so you don't lose momentum and freedom of action. In Ukraine right now we're seeing both sides have more or less exhausted their initial stockpiles and are now having to wait for equipment production to reach a point that they can attempt large scale offensive actions, both sides losing initiative in the meantime.
Western production is lagging behind simply because military corporations work for profits so they don't want to ramp up production if they don't have guaranteed sales, in a total war scenario they would get seized or forced to cooperate by the govts and shit out ammos
Moron detected. In total war they'd gleefully ramp up supplies just like previous wars. You tourists have feelings instead of historic knowledge.
I can no longer discern parody from actual moronation from /misc/
US, China, RoK maybe. Nobody else actually has (usable) deep storage programs.
>A country with a powerful industry like Germany could start pumping tanks, planes and ammunition like if they were candy if it decides to go all in again.
I don't think that any country exists anywhere that can crash produce modern weapons, period. This is the fault of the weapons, not the nations. They've simply gotten too complicated, and simplifying them just renders them ineffective in battle and creates a race to the bottom where the loser is the one to take the first step. We will never see any nation produce modern tanks and aircraft at anything resembling a crash pace. Not the least because factory lines capable of such throughput have simply never been built, because it's unfathomably expensive to do that and nobody, anywhere, wanted to foot the bill.
Modern sustainment is going to be entirely based on stockpiling.
There's a reason why America is considered the world's superpower. European countries for example don't want to go to war and generally only do so at America's bidding. For this they only need an air force (which is much more effective than a massive army frankly) and a battalion if they feel frisky, or maybe just a squad if they don't. The only exceptions are France because they have dreams of ruling Francophone Africa, and UK, who keep one eye on Argentina at all times. Neither of which require a large army or any significant investment in sustainable war fighting prowess. If Europe were to collectively attack or fight against Russia, they could quite comfortably do so with what they have, because their (small on paper )air and land power would chew through Russia's forces like a hot chainsaw through butter in a week. Ukraine is nothing like the major militaries of Europe, which are actual first world countries with first world militaries.
this is an interesting topic because defense is always easier than offense.
so if a defensively oriented military of a european country was invaded, even if they manage to halt the invasion pretty quickly from advancing further, it would be very difficult for them to then retake the now enemy controlled territory.
>so if a defensively oriented military of a european country was invaded, even if they manage to halt the invasion pretty quickly from advancing further, it would be very difficult for them to then retake the now enemy controlled territory.
Though the offended countries job would be to blunt the assault the rest of the EU and US would be spear. Even without the US, realistically who has the army to invade the EU by land? Then take a chunk of land, hold it, then withstand a military response from a bloc with thousands of tanks, IFV's and fighter jets and millions of troops. Even with all they've given to Ukraine it is a miniscule fraction of what they have and with over 400 million pop to draw troops from and a large(r then people think) manufacturing base to build equipment from a long war doesn't suit an invader.
People thought it would be Russia but half their military is currently holding territory in the Oryx webpage front and the other half are continuing to take heavy casualties in Ukraine. Who is left now?
>who is left now
right this second? no one, of course.
but the future could see russia going ultra nationalistic revanchism mode, a la germany in the 30's.
sanctions are hurting them now sure, and their demographics for the future don't look too good.
but you simply can't predict what the future will look like.
as china starts to decline and realizes that it has no chance of dominating the west and that from here on out it will only grow weaker as the west grows stronger. they might decide that the world order where they have to play by the wests rules is not acceptable, and a core alliance of russia/iran/china/nk could form, and attempt to impose it's own rules on the world, like russia was planning with ukraine/eastern europe, and china wishes to do with taiwan and southeast asia, and etc.
Sweden does not have 86 artillery unless you count mortars as well. We have 24x155 mm and nothing more. And we only have 40 tanks, the rest of the 122's arent modernized.
>Sweden does not have 86 artillery unless you count mortars as well. We have 24x155 mm and nothing more. And we only have 40 tanks, the rest of the 122's arent modernized.
Until very recently they had 48 Archer 155mm artillery systems, 14 were sold to the brits, 8 more went to Ukraine, 2 are in storage leaving 24 active. The rest are 40 self propelled 120mm mortars adding up to 96. So I guess they counted the self propelled mortars and not the 84 regular 120mm infantry mortars which is a strange choice.
It's a bit weird, Sweden has a fair amount of equipment like tanks, IFVs, APC's but chose to gut their 155mm artillery. Their 48 Archer systems seems like an okay number for a force their size, probably could use another 24 on top of them and maybe a dozen GMLRS launchers but they went the other way instead.
China because it produces everything. And no "value added," and "profit" accruing to Western companies for shit made in China doesn't count towards Western production. What matters during a war is who can actually make shit, patents become moot. Countries that couldn't step up fricking face coverings in 12 months during a period when trillions of dollars were flowing out the door from the government aren't going to open up tank plants easily.
Industrialization takes decades, deindustrialization took decades, and assuming a flip back takes a few months is moronic.
all this
>"we will just build the factories!"
>"it will be ww2, we will just snap our fingers and start producing like its 1942 all over again! easy!"
delusion is surreal
the US/uk/nato doesnt have the raw materials
>metal
>steel
>rare-earth elements
>other elements
>(insert tech item)
to even warrant factory production in the first place
the anglosphere is completely and totally de-indsustrialized in every sense of the word, down to the raw materials
Bizarre cope.
>Industrialization takes decades, deindustrialization took decades, and assuming a flip back takes a few months is moronic.
Industrialization takes several decades, deindustrialisation takes one decade at most. Its not just the machines, people are needed as well, and America has little engineering talent left due to generations of dysgenics.
Anyone got the pictures of Russia letting all their vehicles go to shit?
>most countries simply lack the material depth to sustain offensive operations while also lacking the ability to quickly ramp up production to offset attrition and munition expenditure rates, particularly European militaries, without the government instituting a full war economy
fixed that for you
I don't think Europe would be hard pressed to get raw materials from Africa/Americas and ramp up local industrial production, if the war is a means of survival
The thing is, any war with a west nation will result in war with their full arsenal. As it stands right now, Ukraine and Russia are extremely limited in their air force usage. If Russia was fighting NATO, NATO would have spent most of last year trying to identify and destroy air defences. They would likely have suffered losses i n the process. With that done, the air force (combined with naval assets) would remove heavy guns other important systems. Only then would the ground forces go in, covered by roving aircraft, helicopters and loitering systems.
So while yes it has shown you need to have a lot of stock, had this war been with NATO, NATO wouldn't be just sending artillery, a few missile systems and some scraped together armoured vehicles. There would be 13 aircraft carriers, numerous support carriers, dozens of destroyers and frigates in the Med and Pacific, with hundreds of fighter jets and helicopters all working together with ground forces while long range missile strikes remove valuable targets spotted with military intel gathering systems.
So yeah, in theory, if NATO was forced to fight with its arms tied behind its back, sure. Or forced to supply a nation that doesn't have the systems in place to support hundreds of aircraft, sure.
>Only then would the ground forces go in, covered by roving aircraft, helicopters and loitering systems.
Which ground forces? The war would have gone nuclear long before that. Cold war Warzaw pact planning was using nukes from the first minutes.
It's not the Cold War anymore. NATO also planned on using tacnukes on the Soviet spearhead. But that was before they had complete aerospace dominance.
What's the point? It's only useful if you intend to invade your neighbor, something that's been out of fashion, other than for soviet boomers it seems. Otherwise, for defense, that's what nukes are there for. At least as far as I'm concerned.
The problem my dear Frenchman is that if you cannot defend militarily friends and neighbor, without resorting to your weapon of last desperation, you'll end up alone against giant who can starve you economically.
All the lessons of the cold war were forgotten by the west once it ended, and we kidded ourselves that supply chains weren't of strategic consequence. We've snapped out of that delusion, but actions to remedy those mistakes are minimal, and we've already created an industrial behemoth of a rival in China.
Absolute giga brainlets in here. Ukraine teaches us:
1. You need nukes. They are the only viable and necessary insurance you have for lasting peace.
2. Tanks are obsolete.
3. Helicopters are obsolete.
4. Fighter jets are obsolete.
5. Artillery is king
6. Infantry is Joker
7. Drones, UAV, loitering munitions are queens
8. Mines win another war
9. Logistics are as important as ever.
TL;DR: Get nukes. It’s the disgusting nuclear powers that are preventing you from getting them, but when Pakistan can get them, you can too.
Ukraine didn't teach us that you need nukes. The US did many years before by invading both Iraq and Libya. Notably after both gave up developing their programs in exchange for western promises (that were ultimately broken).
North Korea realized this which is why they went ahead with their nuclear program. Iran, too, especially after JCPOA was torn apart. I wouldn't be surprised if KSA eventually gets one by the end of the decade as a hedge against the Americans, either.
North Koreas nuclear deterrent pales in comparison to the humanitarian crisis it's collapse would cause. Not having 26 million starving, unskilled peasants flooding China and South Korea, and it's place as a buffer between China and the US, is why kim-so-fat is still alive.
moronic take.
I think what it has taught us is that we need a strategic production reserve to rapidly spin up production of munitions should the need arise.
Warehouses of machinery perhaps, maybe a program where you can get certified to operate them and get a small stipend in exchange for being called up to work in a new factory, sort of like nasty girls but with factories.
Yeah we've had too much of a focus on platforms and less of a focus on production. No one was ready for this sort of war, not even the US. And this war has shown that if you don't have 1000 modern tanks lying around ready to roll you're not at the races.
Anon America has tons of platforms AND stockpiles. If the US was fighting this war it'd have been over pretty much the second it began because the USAF/USN would have turned Ukraine into the world's largest open air soviet monument consisting of a 40 km burned out convoy. WE would be fine. Even most of Europe probably would have been fine for the above reason. You'd be seeing a Highway of Death almost every day for a month straight until the Russians either quit or were forced to the border. Just a few HIMARS systems crippled them to the point they were nonfunctional for some time, let alone if the USAF was conducting daily F-35 bombings and ass-blasting any soviet flyers.
Ukraine-Russia is what you see when neither side can actually get enough gear to the front fast enough, and neither of them can maintain air superiority/suppression for very long. It's a brutal slog because both of them are outright missing a core part of combined arms or at the least have drastically scaled back capabilities in those regards relative to their ground forces.
The US is not able to sustain a years long artillery duel. That isn't how the US is set up to fight. It's assumed that the bulk of the fighting will be wrapped up in weeks.
The US is currently sustaining a years long artillery duel in Ukraine just fine
Expand the front and escalate the situation and do you think that would really be true? Honestly curious, because I'm skeptical in both directions
We're unironically building additional artillery shell production lines at the moment. They're taking the idea that our current crash production capacity is wholly inefficient very seriously. The plants won't be online in time to help the current conflict, but the idea is to never get caught with our pants down shell wise ever again. Our production otherwise is decent, certainly better than basically anyone, but still way lower than it needs to be.
Air power would take some pressure off if it was a conflict directly involving the US.
Shrinking blue collar male workforce and no factories. Russia has really missed China in this conflict, as they could easily outproduce NATO in artillery and vehicles.
>Entire western world has been freeloading off Pax Americana
Everyone already knew this
The thing is modern military-industrial-scientific complex should invest in new forms of storage for emergencies, unless we somehow manage to get CnC MCVs (basically giant super 3D printers) the challenge is not so much production as keeping machines and supplies for a long time without huge investments, there is also the matter of keeping modularity so platforms and systems can be continuously updated with newly developed hardware and software, I know is easier said than done but in the long term it may be quite a good investment tbh.
https://www.army.mil/article/247076/gvsc_awards_contract_to_build_largest_metal_3d_printer_ever
metal print size at 30 feet long, 20 feet wide and 12 feet high.
>simply lack the material depth to sustain offensive operations while also lacking the ability to quickly ramp up production to offset attrition and munition expenditure rates, particularly European militaries.
No. If the Russians were facing America, in a hypothetical no-nuke world, it would be GW1 2.0 but with a muuuuch longer air campaign.
The modern world is not ready or willing to commit to total war
Waste of money and resources
VatniksLaw.jpg
Why did you use an ancient photo? Tourist idiot detected.
China alone accounts for more than 50% of the world’s steel production
United States is barely above 4%
What is steel made of and where is it mined?
Almost all of this steel is made from Australian iron ore
You're only counting virgin steel. The US does large amounts of steel recycling, which works just fine for most applications.
>The US does large amounts of steel recycling
As does china, which curiously gets left out whenever morons go on about MUH STRAYAN IRON ORE DEPENDENCY
Look, moron, you can keep claiming victory for 200 threads in a row, it's not going to affect the shaping operations on the ground, it's not going to make Russia magically regain their equipment and it's not going to stop the Ukrainian advance. It doesn't matter if you think you're being subtle because one of your threads was left up.
You're a waste of time and money, I don't know why they keep sending you here. You're like a helicopter being sent to Chornobaivka.
>You're like a helicopter being sent to Chornobaivka.
murdered by words
The Chinese, the Americans, and apparently the Russians, but not very well.
To be fair, while European nations don't have enough weapon to match 1:1 a russian-like invasion force, together they still have more than enough to take over a russian-like federation. And the European Union WILL band together if one was attacked.
The REAL problem for the European Union is that no one can agree to build their army in common so they have near to no interoperability outside ammo.
If the EU mass produced true European airfighter, tanks and every other component of a war, they would be second only to the US, or maybe third if China keep its growth.
>Also we're excluding the fact that we murder thousands of nogs for good reason in rural America every year
No we fricking don't, I'm skeptical you've ever even shot a duck let alone a person of any color
you demonstrate nothing, your posts are an incoherent rambling mess at best
Last I checked the people shooting up schools, churches, and malls were all wh*tes
No its nogs, statistically speaking. Occasionally spics. Remember they now consider somebody discharging a firearm and nobody dying a "mass shooting" whereas before you had to kill at least 4 people. It's mostly drive bys and "mutual combat" ie Black folk having a beef with one another in the schools. They just change definitions on a wimp to buoy up their statistics and push for gun control. White shooters are a statistically insignificant contribution.
homosexual it as was pointed out that the difference attributable to motor vehicles is barely above the standard deviation for the data set. The defiance is almost entirely attributable to the percentage of darkies in the given society. They get killed, commit crime, and are poor due to their fundamental nature. Race is real. All automotive/industrial/agricultural accidental deaths only alter the mean age of death by a year or two and that is mostly because the majority of the deaths are teenagers or young adults. If you live a rural life you will operate heavy machinery and inattentive fools will die from time to time. I'd tell you to go live in your urban hive but the fact that blacks exist denies you desired lifestyle. Hence why you feel you need to b***h about infrastructure in a /k/ thread. Europe doesn't really do resource extraction anymore while the US produces and exports the most raw resources of any nation on earth and whites do all that work. People will get fricked up and if its not fiscally viable to reduce the accident rate then it won't be reduced.
Stop anon. You're making a fool of yourself.
Image related
This is proof that Roundabout make roads safer.
Frick roundabouts, i'd rather be a statistic than see those blights on american soil
They look cooler than primitive intersection, science proved it's simply better all around. Enjoy your stop, you'll be a rounding error in history.
Nice "rationel", buzzword count and rambling there moron.
Not sure what your point was but sounds legit.
Militaries are now nothing more than excuses for money laundering by the rulers.
They fund a weapon program six trillion dollars. 99% goes to operating costs, 25% goes to oversight. The weapon itself works okay but is far too expensive. So a study is commissioned to evaluate it for rejection. That study soon goes over budget. No one gives a flying frick if the military truly works. The israelites are now at the top of most Governments and control almost every currency on Earth. They cannot lose. Look at Ukraine. The israelites left before the shooting started. What does it matter who wins? Either way, you'll be paying them interest on the money you gave them to conduct a study on human rights abuses committed by white supremacists. This will increase the deficit in your country and they will have no choice but to raise taxes.
Just my opinion.
You are assuming that we (they) give more than a frick about ukraine. I work in metal industry in europe. We could easily build war machines/parts/ammunition if we were paid. We would need just some weeks to start building them. But we have not received the word. You are clearly underestimating the power of europe or usa's industry.
>Ukraine
It's not just about Ukraine though. It's about actual preparedness.
imagine Roosevelt not giving trucks to commies because muh escalation
Chinks are literally starving right now and I'm so happy
The lesson to be learned from the Ukraine war is the overmatch is the only way to fight a war.
If you don't lose any materiel, you don't need to have a lot of it. If you an air force and the enemy doesn't, you're invincible.
Simply do not fight a war if you do not have an overwhelming advantage already. Which is to say, in modern day.
>So what countries are in the best position to sustain combat operations for the longest period of time?
Russia + China
>Russia completely ready to open up its anus and be a vassal state for all eternity
kek but not at all a surprise. even less a surprise that the no limits friendship has limits at providing weapons apparently.