it's honestly the only way to actually kill anything. most nato warships will have good air defense and you don't have enough anti-ship missiles to kill them (unless the russians have been smart which we know they haven't in this area they blew their load a year into ukraine), your electronic warfare probably isn't good enough to get close enough to the ships to kill them, and you can't win a stand up air to air fight against anything nato has. all nato ground based air defenses are monsters too. the only way to do any damage is to expend fighters in moronic nuclear strikes or use nuclear armed ballistic/cruise missiles.
in case of hostilities just blockade it until they are no threat to anyone -its tiny, Kaliningrad has no industry - its basically military base in middle of NATO space to lob missiles further
>in case of hostilities just blockade it until they are no threat to anyone -its tiny, Kaliningrad has no industry - its basically military base in middle of NATO space to lob missiles further
Why not send all the streetshitters, africans, ragheads and pakis that the Russians have been shoving in from north africa and over the finish, polish and Swedish borders since 2014 to kaliningrad, Its already surrounded my minefields.
It wouldn't work. Europe's too cucked to allow a proper open-air prison and US would also mewl about muh human rights since it's not the israelites doing the funny.
Invade? Motherfricker at this point Kaliningrad is going to be a financial liability. It was supposed to be a wedge between Baltic states and rest of Nato. Now that advantage is gone and burried.
Why invade it, when Russia will be wasting millions on maintaining base that dosen't justify this kind of expenditure? Frick. I bet nobody would even want to take that shithole even if Russia will be offering it for free or even paying anyone willing to take it.
>Bunch of tanks pass near Kalinigrad due to random training exercise >Super stable and wise local Russian commander panics >Hits the nuke button to fight imaginary HATO invasion troops >Lithuanian tank commander stares in awe as distant Kalinigrad disappears in a massive mushroom cloud >Twitter personalities rant and screech that Russia didn't need the city, and that this was part of a grand strategy far beyond Western comprehension >Moscow memoryholes the whole thing and pretends the city never even existed
They should do a test run or three once they get all the HIMARS/Chumno. That sounds like the sort of plan that needs the kind of refinement you only get with experience.
>I'd love to see the Poles and Finns do something about that >Finns
St Petersburg has a higher population than all of Finland. Plus, what claims could Finland possibly manufacture? At least with Kaliningrad, a claim could be made that it's a Russian settler colony that's only existed since 1945, and that it's rightful Polish/Lithuanian/German clay.
>what claims could Finland manufacture
Rightful Finnish clay that was stolen from them in 1700 by Tsar Peter the Great. They inherit the claim because they are the true Caroleans
Piter is a complete meme and in a realistic russian breakup scenario they would more likely before a free city state like singapore than anything else. Vyborg and all the other lost lands + a little extra is a far more believable scenario.
>Vyborg and all the other lost lands + a little extra is a far more believable scenario
My name is Igor Pekkala from Äänislinna municipality and I support this proposition
probably send a bunch of troops into Finland and the Baltic states in a near suicidal rush very early on to give them more to deal with, then keep as many of my aircraft airborne as possible to do around the clock suicidal bombing runs of nato forces. the moment they begin hitting any of my air bases, c2 nodes, or anything else fricking nuke them. try a few nuclear dumb bomb air strikes against nato shipping.
there is basically no winning here, just losing in a way that fricks everyone else up.
considering the geography and the assumption that other russian ships have an operational readiness level equal to the moskva it's best to just avoid pissing anyone off
>texas, California and some other states suffer catastrophic civilian deaths near their borders >most medical facilities are overwhelmed and the army has to move in just to triage and maintain control >literally everything north of oklahoma/los angeles or east of texas is fine >you get nuked
you'd be better off nuking germany and the united kingdom, anon.
Nah, the USAF wouldn't even need nukes to kill the cartels within 150 km of the border. It'll get a lot easier when the only stand up fighting groups are using civilians as shields to get into the US (likely not to matter in a post-nuclear environment lets be honest) or running around in the open (LGB bait).
The Germans still haven't unfricked east Germany yet, you want to give them another ex-soviet shithole they will never fix?
Make it an EU joint zone they all pay to fix and it can be used as a refugee dumping ground.
Anyone who could want it had no say in 45. Koningsberg isn't a shithole naturally, it's a shithole because of being occupied by Russia for almost a century.
It should be isolated, technologically wiped and have sky bridges installed over it with viewing platforms so everyone can travel to view russians fighting for scraps and killing each other
While on the sky bridge, you could toss down torn up loaves of bread and sharpened sticks and then watch them fight each other for bread. Bring a pizza for you and your date and y’all would have dinner and show!
>give it to Poland
What did Poland do to warrant such a cruel punishment
Germany doesn't want it back, Poland doesn't want it, Latvia definitely doesn't want it. No one would want it because it's a dilapidated shithole filled with Russians but at the same time the EU probably wouldn't want it to be an independent citystate precisely because it's full of Russians, it'd be an annoying pro-Russian fifth column that would be constantly shitting things up for the next century or two.
The best option would be deport them all and turn it into a giant nature reserve.
>The best option would be deport them all and turn it into a giant nature reserve.
100% unironic agreement and frankly would get so much support from lefties.
>That cannot be done because of international laws about genocide
Every time someone brings it up just start yawning loudly and change the subject.
If they persist then do something they can't ignore like open your fly and expose your penis until they're forced to address the fact that your penis is exposed. I call it phallusbustering.
Lawyers could also vault onto tables, take a shit on them, and return to their seats, yawning loudly and wearing clothing made out of those crinkly heat blankets you see paramedics handing out after car crashes. I bet that would also make them sweat profusely, providing further distraction.
All we need are like 20,000 lawyers to keep up the effort until Kaliningrad is depopulated. Better to ask forgiveness than permission.
sharing is caring anon, split it between poland & lithuania with poland taking the more populous city and the Curonian spit being split by it's narrowest part
>The settlement of modern-day Kaliningrad was founded in 1255 on the site of the ancient Old Prussian settlement Twangste by the Teutonic Knights during the Northern Crusades, and was named Königsberg in honor of King Ottokar II of Bohemia.
rightful Czech clay
only if every single zigger is permanently removed from the area, maybe.
it will have to be a walled off and placed under a level 50+ superfund site for at least two decades until they can cleanup the filth the vatniks have left behind.
A better idea would be to have Kaliningrad be the capital of the EU or be the new NATO headquarters and build a proper military facility where the Americans can just frick around... send the Russians back to Russia.
First of all, frick off we don't want it
Second, the RSFSR already tried to pawn it off to the Lithuanian SSR in the 60's and they didn't want it, so why would we
its either bite the bullet and give up the moronic imperialist larp from 300 years ago so you can stably integrate into the European economic/political environment (don't necessarily have to try to adopt the political institutional changes required to join the EU and NATO) OR be drawn inevitably into the Chinese economic orbit as a clear junior partner. we saw it before 2012, Russia was able to mostly play nice, make shit tons of money, and have access to Western expertise in technology and industrial development by just having mostly normal (if a bit distant) relations with the Europeans like the Middle East does (and China did before wolf warrior autism and then the Ukraine War fricked it). Europeans are happy to trade with all sorts of autocrats provided they are stable and practice healthy moderation with the human rights abuses. China operates illegal secret police offices in other countries to crack down on their expats, showing they don't give a frick about sovereignty, and East Russia is full of Chinese people already. for frick sake they quietly updated their state maps to use Chinese names for places in Eastern Russia and are actively selling drones and equipment to the Ukrainians at the same time as their 'no limits partner' Russia (while steadfastly adhering to Western sanctions of their own freewill).
The east has always been enemy to civilization which Russia only apes when it comes to technology while remaining a collection of conquests ruled by Muscovites, their minions and those they choose to empower as tyrants.
That's the underlying socio-strategic basis for the Russian ways of war and military management. A competent force threatens the Tsar but an incompetent politically nepotistic force does not. Fine for internal security (the main reason for the armed forces) but less fine against motivated military opponents.
oh please those Black folk have been absolutely moronic forever. >"oh boo hoo I can't own everything and make it shit woe is me this is russophobia ;~~*~~*(("
god you're so worthless
Both sides are nuclear powers so there’s zero (0) security concern. The war in Ukraine is all about the European energy market and the only role the Baltic Sea could play are EEZs related to possible pipeline routes.
>Russia was able to mostly play nice
Because it was them preparing to reclaim their Soviet states via their age old tactic of >Have clay want >Move Russians into clay >Have Russians become dominant clay population >Say the state that administers that clay is persecuting Russians >Say you will protect Russians >Use military to protect Russians >Lose a huge amount of men and the state you're fighting gives up because it isn't worth it >Claim glorious victory, clay is now yours >Now do the same to another neighbour >Rinse and repeat until you've absorbed the entire state >Torture and execute dissidents and replace them with more Russians >Bonus; use the new non-Russians as cannon fodder to expand into MORE clay
Had Ukraine fallen as their propaganda claimed it had on Feb 24th, 2022 they would have moved onto Moldova and Georgia - likely at the same time. This would have then left them with Armenia (who likely would have 'democratically' joined Russia out of fear of a war, how Russia is stronk and for 'protection' from Azerbaijan). Then Azerbaijan and Kazakhstan would be next on the list. Then the rest of the -stans. By that point China is no longer the dominant power in the East and has to - reluctantly - respect Russia. This then leads to them fighting over Mongolia (which China is trying to turn into a puppet state ala Burma). After that? Well the Baltics, most likely.
>By that point China is no longer the dominant power in the East and has to - reluctantly - respect Russia
how come? all the -stans are largely worthless, and them reluctantly joining ziggeria wouldn't really matter much unless ziggers wanted to blockade chinks - but that would require US to do it at sea at the same time
That's basically it. Russia is desperate for relevance and if they make the mighty dragon bow to them, then they are superior. Plus, typical 'We must be as big as we used to be' deal.
>Invade Ukraine >Suffer sanctions >Hopefully win >Hopefully Nato loses credibility >Hopefully you can now invade other non NATO states like Georgia or Kazakhstan. >With this countries your Petro-economy is hopefully diversified, and your dropping demographics are improved. >By this point hope that Pandas invaded Thailand and conflict is prolonging itself due to lack of support from Europe since Americans failed to support Ukraine. >Sell guns to China to further improve relations. >Hopefully Pandas won >Now in 2050 or so US-Europe relations are hopefully weak, >Russia's economy hopefully is no longer a petro state or less so. >Russia's demographic crisis is hopefully alleviated
Now as Russia I can maybe invade Poland. It is still finnicky. But Finland is pain due to terrain, plus there is not much to gain. Poland economy is fairly ok and it would boost my state further assuming i take control. It's a stupid plan full of gambles, but this what I came up with when one friend of a friend who is in a SOF said to me that some analysts analyzed the shit and they assume eventual Russian invasion against Poland. It might be just bullshit hearsay though. Plus we in eastern Europe always assume that Russians are planning something.
But personally I hope that country with biggest nuclear arsenal balkanizes, would be funny.
I love this whenever I see it, and I need to ask, as I always do: what regiments would Russia use to invade Poland, provided they continue their SMO in Ukraine and don't just fully lose everything, Crimea included in 2 days so that they can muster the troops?
>sink entire HATO with naval drones >send meatwaves against the baltics >spend rest of the budget on a huge shilling campaign >wait until westerners get bored
It's that easy
by conquering the baltic states. Not only is it a large chunk of baltic sea shorline the land mass is ideal for stationing sam and anti-naval missile assets all along the coast. nothing gets to move in the sea without its eyes on them
>inb4 nook
about as credible as vatniks screeching about nooks for every random asset blown up
At the beginning of the war, "military experts" were talking about all the capabilities Russia had and Ukraine should surrender immediately. One of the weapons Russia supposedly had was EMP missiles that could shut off all the electricity in Ukraine.
Technically, most nukes could be emps if you detonate them at the right altitude. It's just that everyone else will have made their nukes detonate at the altitude to be nukes and respond to the launch instead of the landing.
>How would YOU contest a nato dominated baltic sea as russia?
I wouldnt contest it, neither will russia.
Basically if you opponent hard dominates some area or some thing its strategically often smarter to approach things asymetrically and focus elsewhere, where you opponent is weaker. In a basic RTS terms, if your opponent rushes mass Phoenixes in PvP, it is way too late to queue up some stargates and start producing your own, you just flatout lose, so you look alternatives like giving up air control and focusing on stalkers for harrasment and cannons to keep you alive.
In this baltic case the only real strategy would be to focus your fleet assets to north sea or pacific and search for an advantage there - like disrupting shipping and communication cables in North Sea - while ignoring the baltic sea completely.
Russians know this anyway, they are not 100% moronic, there is a reason why baltic fleet is already just bunch of third rate junk.
^This and that's historically normal. The Baltic is a NATO lake and shooting gallery. Russia has no strategic need to waste resources contesting it or anything but building icebreakers to assist civilian trade and other utilitarian missions.
>Detonate a phat nuke in the middle of the lake >zerg rush the newly flooded coastlines with landing craft >zerg rush AA sites with whatever the fricks left from ukraine >collapse as a state 3 months later
By simply investing the entirety of my gold reserves into the Trump Campaign and RNC in order to have America leave NATO, taking the piggy bank and main arms supplier out of the equation. I then tell Putin and whatever is left of the loyal oligarchs to race to the floor and start to kissass Donny on what a strong leader he is, and how strong and independent from Europe this makes the US look. I then divert whatever cash I have left under the sofa to pay the Dalits in Hinduistan to run a shillfarm dedicated solely to running EU exit campaigns. >inb4 /misc/troon
hybrid propaganda and political espionage are legitimate wartime strategies and weapons.
Because by the time the Germans and Poles realize they're gonna have to start going full14/88, I'll hope that my Dalit cash cows have successfully convinced all the morons who actually vote across the Eurozone that not being part of the EU is actually based, and that X country wasn't pulling their weight and was tanking their home country's economy and defense spending. Once the EU defense treaty is null and void, and Trump pulls all US aid (and subsequently doubles Israel's aid package to $8 billion a year at the behest of Kushner), I then flatten Ukraine with every last Katyusha, Kinzal, FAB, and Sahad I can find.
Again, purely hypothetical. I just figured that the Terminal Boomerism that Americans are facing will keep anything Trump does for at least 20 years. See how the majoraty of young people and those under 60 want to rejoin the EU, but the boomers who actually vote keep electing Tories to run the UK into the ground. They're finally gonna know the joy of private healthcare like their US brethren, and they're gonna find out how fun it is when you loosen renters protection and sell all the public apartments to Indians, and watch them raise the rates a measly 45%.
Doesn't actually work because there are powers that be that aren't too keen on derailing their geopolitical strategies over the whims of a few hicks at the polling stations. You can bet that if Trump actually wins again he will drop all his current narratives about NATO and Ukraine extremely fast.
Well, if I were Russia, I would establish good will through respect of my neighbors, their citizens, and their territorial integrity/ sovereignty; then, cooperate with them for a century so they begin to forget about how much an incurable imperialist bastard I am. The well on operations has been run pretty dry for the foreseeable future, just put contemporary ambitions on ice and keep the long term plan a closely guarded executive branch secret.
Spend some decades stamping out corruption in Russia and also pay out reparations to the former eastern bloc countries + apologize for our role in WW2, respect basic human rights and assert that we make no claims whatsoever to any territory outside Russia. Also grant Kaliningrad independence. Work on joint militaey exercises with the USA for Chinese containment.
Once we've proven we're not c**ts anymore, apply to join NATO.
>How would YOU contest a nato dominated baltic sea as russia?
I'd start by handing over Putin the Ukrainian pows and kidnapped Ukranian children along with a letter of apology and a plea for mercy in the name of Christ. There may not even be time left for that.
>Presumably because of free speech and because they're not actually at war with Russia
Treason the man is working for Russia which targets Americans with nuclear weapons
Reminder that video is from a parody/comedy show in Russia. It isn't meant to be serious. Like, I know humour is subjective and all but the outdated maps bit kinda gives it away.
He's a convicted pedo. You can't get lower than that. russia doesn't need any extra compromising material.
He has to prostitute himself to monke because nobody else will hire him.
>You can't get lower than that.
A video of him raping a child has the potential to send him behind bars for a long time. Threaten to inform all of his new friends in prison just what he's doing time for and the prospects get even darker for him.
So yes, there are many ways they can blackmail him with that. Also since CP is legal to possess in russia it was likely that bait which caught him in the first place.
>Make your nation the global one-stop-shop for CP >Pack all the websites out the ass with tracking program >Screen everyone who accesses your shit from Europe or America for potential usefulness >You now have instant double agents
Hory sheeit maybe the FSB isn't as useless as I thought.
Pedophiles don't suddenly stop just because they get caught. It is very possible that the Russians are blackmailing Ritter with something that could send him back to the joint for a long time. It's also the case that Ritter is angry and Bitter about Uncle Sam busting him in the first place, so he wants to get back at the US however he can.
What I don't get is that multipolar russia doesn't lack useless idiots from the west, why do they pick a convicted pedophile when all he does is do more damage than good? Like literally there are thousands they could groom
>why do they pick a convicted pedophile
Well they need someone from west who hates their country and this scott ritter, he talked dirty to some glowBlack person who pretended to be 12 - i would be pissed off aswell to be punished for that, as this is imaginary crime.
But as time moves on and west falls further a LOT more people look for something better somewhere else - and some morons believe what putin is selling that russia is trad and based etc and some are just so pissed off at their country and leaders betraying the people that they will do whatever to bring it all down.
Russians like Scott because he was one of the few people who was outspoken in his belief that Iraq and Afghanistan had no WMD's during the GWOT. It seems to be a broken clock situation though, because around the same time Scott also was adamant that the US Military would be shattered by the regular forces of Iraq.
No it's the real one
His is "@therealscottritter"
Armchair copelord is "@ArmchairW"
The best parody is https://twitter.com/ArmchairCopelrd
Scott Ritter constantly posts in the replies of the Copelord parody, it really badly gets to him that his friend is getting mocked and he seethe in the replies pic related kek.
He even speaks like the average /chug/ user, I'm convinced they're briefed on some sort of propaganda script, either that or they're just copying each others speech patterns due to doing nothing but speaking to each other every day all day.
What's even funnier is Scott Ritter Child Diddler sat in front of thousands of soldiers on Chechnya and made a moronic speech, how anyone can say he's an American Patriot after that is beyond belief.
https://vxtwitter.com/igorsushko/status/1743849724745302412 for the link to the translated speech
>opens google maps >looks at the coast around helsinki
holy shit I thought it was only the interior that was a shitshow for invading militaries
it's like looking at a sharks mouth
this coastline has fricking teeth dude what the frick
[...]
holy fricking shit I was joking
it actually does
During the iceage there was a massive fricking glacier that crushed the shit out of the baltic sea, Sweden is basically on a mountain slope of an ancient mountain range, hence the hilly environment + depression = island hell
>bro, just move your troops forward bro, that's all you got to do bro >fortifications? logistics? difficult terrain? what are you talking about bro, none of that matters, just look at the lines
This is the type of shit i would come-up with when i was ten and day-dreaming about conquering the world. He probably got it from his latest victim after getting them in his van.
Does he just airbrush random arrows in MSpaint while jerking off? Is his big strategy the blindingly obvious plan of crossing the Suwalki Gap? >Wow, that is some elite General Staff level planning. Patton would be jealous.
I stopped last night after the new life imprisonment laws were introduced. Badly photoshopped fanfiction is now considered hate speech. >Do you think NATO is aware of the Russian Suwalki Gap strategy? Maybe I should send them a letter or something with a giant map inside of it covered in giant red arrows..
You ever think that Russia just facepalms and goes 'Why did we spend money on this guy?' when they make posts like this. Just boggles and baffles. Does this guy not realise that NATO's navy then goes and sails into the sea and starts raining missiles on their ground forces while setting up a screen of AA missiles all the while aircraft carriers launch F-35's? Like I know Russia could set up AA and shit around the coast but pretty sure they'd be targeted by various things at that point. Be it long range aircraft launched missiles or naval missiles.
>Anon, at best, the Russian ICBM's might be able to hit Hungary before years of neglect cause them to malfunction and break apart in flight.
"John Cody Fidler-Simpson CBE is an English foreign correspondent who is currently the world affairs editor of BBC News. He has spent all his working life with the BBC, and has reported from more than 120 countries, including thirty war zones, and interviewed many world leaders."
Same thing that stops the citizens of st. Peterburg from doing it. Aka nothing, they themselves dump more toxic shit in there than indians do in their holy river.
>Nuke the US border and watch the USA collapse without the illegals that its leaders love so much.
The majority of mass immigration into the EU and a reasonable proportion of that via the USAs southern border is orchestrate by Russia and in the case of the USA, China.
Sweden backs Finland closing borders to fend off ‘Russia-orchestrated’ migrant crisis
https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/italy-blames-surge-migration-russias-wagner-group-2023-03-13/
ROME, March 13 (Reuters) - The Italian government on Monday said Russian mercenary group Wagner was behind a surge in migrant boats trying to cross the central Mediterranean as part of Moscow's strategy to retaliate against countries supporting Ukraine.
You'd have to start with the Baltic states and southern Finland and hope that Belarus doesn't cuck out again. Without that coastline they don't have a hope in hell of leaving St. Petersburg, and its guaranteed that there will be damn near silent diesel-electric subs creeping about just itching to sink anything that does leave dock. You'd need air control to deal with the sub threat first and that's no easy task when fighting against NATO.
Their best hope is to split up NATO first, but they fricked that option up by invading Ukraine.
In fact they would just be far better off going and re-conquering the USSR's more easterly provinces first, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Tajikistan, Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan and just forgetting about anything NATO controlled. Plenty of land they can grab relatively easily there and make their population think that they're a great nation again able to conquer others. Trying to expand into Europe is just suicide.
They tried it, but then the eternal slavehood instinct won and they decided they need a banan dictator to squander their wealth in a war of conquest of a land that was likely to just join up willingly if monke did not steal all the wealth.
Strategically Russia shouldn't sweat it. If they weren't moronic they'd be investing in massive upgrades to Murmansk's ports and infrastructure to take advantage of the metric frick ton of new shipping bypassing the Suez and Panama canals. Russia could be setting itself up to be the shipping mecca of Europe.
But instead they decided to roll in the mud over a highway to crimea, a semi decent natural gas basin, and juuust enough new land to bury their dead on.
Yup. And if their belligerence continues, they will be preparing to get Murmarsk bombed.
On an unrelated tangent did you know that NATO already has B61-capable WS3 lockers in northern Finland? Pretty close to Murmarsk. And Finland is getting F35s soon. What a funny string of coincidences.
Every navy in the world except the US navy is a prestige project.
The US navy keeps trade lanes open and safe (mostly), and the other navies pose for photos.
The follies of trying to actually use a navy as a country other than the USA can be seen in the Russian Black Sea campaign.
Lure EU into building Nordstream 3 by agreeing to sell cheap gas. Hold them hostage after dependency. Provoke the US into blowing it up for lulz. It's like poetry.
Hitler poisoned the well for commie haters and gave the communists a scapegoat and a rhetorical tool, unfortunately. Should've just killed every single Russian. Would've been easier, and more ethical.
Russia already stood no chance of competing in the Baltic anyway and it wouldn't have made sense to try even before they joined. RU would have to commit forces to St Petersburg to deal with Finland rather than concentrate fully on the Baltics. Sweden is basically a non-factor except as a staging point for harassment, but would likely be untouchable and should just be ignored except as a target for missiles and bombs.
Strategy would be to blitz the highway between Vyborg and Turku before Finland can get up to wartime strength. Would be a good trade if this meant the loss of Kaliningrad but splitting offensive capability between Estonia / Finland would lessen the chances of success in either and NATO is both more ready to defend Estonia than Finland and will also have an easier time reinforcing and supplying large troop movements there.
Then dig in or go for the Baltics depending on how the cookie crumbles.
It took 4 years for brave American warriors to take the Sadr city from goat farmers with unlimited 100% air support. Now imagine them taking Kaliningrad fortress with trained garrison and underground networks + constant sams ambushes on nato planes
Absolutely possible they don't take it, but deciding to focus on Finland first instead of Baltics is at the expense of time to relieve Kaliningrad. There is uncertainty there regardless and the decision should be made with the worst outcome in mind
>Strategy would be to blitz the highway between Vyborg and Turku before Finland can get up to wartime strength.
Some issues with this:
1. Russia couldn't even fricking blitz Kyiv after months of build up.
2. Russia would in no way shape or form have air superiority here. NATO would 100% be fricking the Russians from the air the whole time.
3. Pretty much all of Finland is a densely forrested swamp intersperesed with thousands of lakes. And the Finnish road network in the eastern parts of the country is intentionally constructed to frick up any advance from the Russian side. This isn't a good place to blitz anything.
Ukraine had 300k troops in position at the start of the invasion, roughly outnumbering Russia 3:2, versus Finland's standing army of ~25k. Airpower or not Finland doesn't have the bodies to stand up to what Russia has IF they get caught off guard.
It's a whole other story if they get up strength but the idea here is not to engage NATO in Finland because its a great place to fight but to engage Finland before NATO has its ducks in a row to keep it from being the monumental pain in the ass it has the potential to be for all the reasons you've described.
Occupying Finland is also a huge political bargaining chip in the sense that Russia has no reasons or interest in annexation or long-term occupation and could probably get away with extracting some nice concessions in exchange for leaving if its a fait accompli and both sides get nervous and don't want things to spiral any further than they already will have by that point
I think you underestimate how much shit terrain + air dominance would level the playing field
Nevermind that pre-war Russia doesn't exist anymore, only their rundown, depleted self does. If they spent months arming up next to Finland and Finland got informed by US intelligence like Ukraine did the matchup is a complete stomp
You simply can't mass enough forces that matter and supply them near the very few possible routes of invasion without tipping things of weeks if not months in advance. And the orders to actually attact would be known by western spooks before the commanders themselves, like it happened already. The only reason it worked in Ukraine was that the ukes were afraid of angering russia if they reacted and were desperately hoping that russia was a rational actor. No way that happens with Finland where they've been preparing for this for almost a century now. And that was before the great banan retrieval attempt.
you forgot that the ukrainians actually did respond, it was just the government (mostly zelensky apparently) that refused to give the formal "disperse and prepare for war" orders from kyiv. the army and air force both moved to wartime conditions without being formally ordered to do so.
>versus Finland's standing army of ~25k
now what are the reserves. I know this is a alien concept for western mind used to only microscopic mercenary armies but it is possible to bulk the shit out of your standing armies with mobilized reservists that are trained systematically in the years leading up to it. Both finland and estonia practice that in the region as conscription can actually work and not just end up in a forced gay orgy like the vatnik variant
Finlands population is only 5.5 million. If we assume a standard demographic pyramid, (which we shouldn't because Finland is european) then that means Finland can only draw on a maximum of 2.1 million troops IF they conscript every man and woman between the ages of 18 and 50. Ukraine has that many men under arms after two years of war and they're starting to buckle; Finland would have no chance in a prolonged fight (without reinforcement)
Just like how there was no way were able to push into soviet Karelia during WW2? Graphs about (on paper) manpower mean nothing, when we know Russian logistics can barely arm and supply the 200k troops they have in Ukraine. Neither side is never going to field a military force larger than 300k at any point, and the fact of the matter is Russia's logistics is entirely reliant on trucks and trains. There is literally three highways in the entirety of eastern Finland big enough for Russia to transport their troops and all the assorted supplies they're gThey would have to use the roads, which means hundreds of kilometers long columns like in the beginning of the Ukraine war, except we actually have the artillery, rocket and air power to turn that column into pink mist. Russia can't advance on Ukraine's flat plains, so i highly fricking doubt they can do in Finland.
Finland is not a giant frontline fight like Ukraine due to the shitty environment, there's no reason to assume Russia can leverage its advantages as easily as on a flat field.
Remind me why the Finns sued for peace in the Winter War and the Continuation War
3 months ago
Anonymous
they did, and lived to fight another day
remind me how many tanks did Finland have vs soviets
3 months ago
Anonymous
Yeah but why did they do it
3 months ago
Anonymous
to live and fight another day
btw, notice how putin is not doing this and is slowly breaking russia apart until it will cease to exist
3 months ago
Anonymous
Yeah but why were they at risk of dying?
3 months ago
Anonymous
>why were they at risk of dying?
they were not, and especially not when you compare it to the 20M russians who got killed
3 months ago
Anonymous
Then why did they sue for peace in the Winter War under the same terms Stalin asked for, and in the Continuation War under terms so harsh it forced them to attack their German allies?
3 months ago
Anonymous
Because the allies were supplying the Soviets with infinite supplies?
3 months ago
Anonymous
what a historical fricking mistake, the nukes should have been tested on moscow instead
3 months ago
Anonymous
>why the Finns sued for peace in the Winter War
The western allies did not supply Finland exept for minor handouts and a handful of volunteers. Instead the US started to dump fricking assloads of free shit to the sovshit union >and the Continuation War
Germany faltered and it was better to live as independents vs. be swallowed by sovshit
3 months ago
Anonymous
Winter War was over before the Lend Lease to the Soviets even started.
3 months ago
Anonymous
They didnt even have recoiless rifles back then for blowing up tanks in the woods
lots of ethnic Finns in America, and many of them did a leap year conscripted in Finland because baba told them from mother's milk that Finland needs defending
Just like how there was no way were able to push into soviet Karelia during WW2? Graphs about (on paper) manpower mean nothing, when we know Russian logistics can barely arm and supply the 200k troops they have in Ukraine. Neither side is never going to field a military force larger than 300k at any point, and the fact of the matter is Russia's logistics is entirely reliant on trucks and trains. There is literally three highways in the entirety of eastern Finland big enough for Russia to transport their troops and all the assorted supplies they're gThey would have to use the roads, which means hundreds of kilometers long columns like in the beginning of the Ukraine war, except we actually have the artillery, rocket and air power to turn that column into pink mist. Russia can't advance on Ukraine's flat plains, so i highly fricking doubt they can do in Finland.
Finland is not a giant frontline fight like Ukraine due to the shitty environment, there's no reason to assume Russia can leverage its advantages as easily as on a flat field.
>IF they get caught off guard
Yeah, IF russkies just happen to pull teleportation and invisibility technology out of their asses. Goddamn this board is full of morons nowadays.
What do you mean Russia can't just poof 300k troops and all their equipment into existence on the border without anyone noticing? The invasion of Ukraine wasn't preceded by literal months of troop build up on both sides, they just appeared out of nowhere the exact moment whatever news channel i first heard about it first spoke about it, bro.
You simply can't mass enough forces that matter and supply them near the very few possible routes of invasion without tipping things of weeks if not months in advance. And the orders to actually attact would be known by western spooks before the commanders themselves, like it happened already. The only reason it worked in Ukraine was that the ukes were afraid of angering russia if they reacted and were desperately hoping that russia was a rational actor. No way that happens with Finland where they've been preparing for this for almost a century now. And that was before the great banan retrieval attempt.
I think you underestimate how much shit terrain + air dominance would level the playing field
Nevermind that pre-war Russia doesn't exist anymore, only their rundown, depleted self does. If they spent months arming up next to Finland and Finland got informed by US intelligence like Ukraine did the matchup is a complete stomp
>versus Finland's standing army of ~25k
now what are the reserves. I know this is a alien concept for western mind used to only microscopic mercenary armies but it is possible to bulk the shit out of your standing armies with mobilized reservists that are trained systematically in the years leading up to it. Both finland and estonia practice that in the region as conscription can actually work and not just end up in a forced gay orgy like the vatnik variant
https://i.imgur.com/u0AqPVA.gif
What do you mean Russia can't just poof 300k troops and all their equipment into existence on the border without anyone noticing? The invasion of Ukraine wasn't preceded by literal months of troop build up on both sides, they just appeared out of nowhere the exact moment whatever news channel i first heard about it first spoke about it, bro.
Strategic ambiguity and a boy-cried-wolf approach with enough time could create an opening. Start massing tanks outside st Pete to encourage 175k western reservists to interrupt their cushy lives and sit in a trench in -40c weather and then sit there menacingly for a bit. Stand down, try again next year , probe for political weakness, give up if more sustained deterrence is put into place but if not talk big game about moving into Estonia and pull a bait and switch. Russia enjoys the advantage of a malleable populace content to stay on war footing and Finland would feel the price of having to commit to repeated, unnecessary build-up chicken games way more than Russia would.
Again, if you're still on the 'Russia is depleted' train you haven't been paying attention, and that line of thinking is the exact kind of miscalculation that would see a country get caught off guard
And you think the Finnihs populace would think twice about turning out en masse after being given a sorely needed reminder pf the sort of looting, murdering, raping, and torturing vatniks like to inflict on civilians?
Personally think they would very hapy to go sit in a tent time and time again while private conscriptovich starves to death on a cold floor to ensure that doens't happen to Finland.
Be honest; are you just projecting your own lazyness and cowardice on an entire nation, now?
As other people have stated you're a fricking moron
But on top of you being a moron, everything you've said doesn't matter anymore because they're in NATO, so they now have millions of troops available and just a few hours away.
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Strategic ambiguity and a boy-cried-wolf approach with enough time could create an opening. Start massing tanks outside st Pete to encourage 175k western reservists to interrupt their cushy lives and sit in a trench in -40c weather and then sit there menacingly for a bit. Stand down, try again next year , probe for political weakness, give up if more sustained deterrence is put into place but if not talk big game about moving into Estonia and pull a bait and switch. Russia enjoys the advantage of a malleable populace content to stay on war footing and Finland would feel the price of having to commit to repeated, unnecessary build-up chicken games way more than Russia would.
Again, if you're still on the 'Russia is depleted' train you haven't been paying attention, and that line of thinking is the exact kind of miscalculation that would see a country get caught off guard
The absolute fricking delusion to think that Finns won't live in ice huts and drink human blood just to stop the pozziyan mongrel horde claiming another square foot of their land.
The absolute delusion to think the vatBlack person barbarians have more grit when this very board hosts 100+ video compilations of them killing themselves in the trenches.
Also, here's a funny thought; NATO armies actually pay and properly equip their troops. Send them off to a Finnish winter and it's a neat training exercise - frick, I got a buddy in the officer corps and he's bored out of his fricking mind most of the year, he would LOVE that shit.
>The absolute fricking delusion to think that Finns won't live in ice huts and drink human blood just to stop the pozziyan mongrel horde claiming another square foot of their land.
Finland is full of delusional fatties who think any notion of war is bad because they can't keep gorging on pizza and beer, fifth columnists who think pozziya good because of cheap vodka and hookers, and women who refuse all notion of self-defence
That said our military still isn't as bad as most Euro nations
>Strategy would be to blitz the highway between Vyborg and Turku before Finland can get up to wartime strength.
Some issues with this:
1. Russia couldn't even fricking blitz Kyiv after months of build up.
2. Russia would in no way shape or form have air superiority here. NATO would 100% be fricking the Russians from the air the whole time.
3. Pretty much all of Finland is a densely forrested swamp intersperesed with thousands of lakes. And the Finnish road network in the eastern parts of the country is intentionally constructed to frick up any advance from the Russian side. This isn't a good place to blitz anything.
Add to this the fact that the distace between Vyborg and Turku is like 500 kilometers with several large cities in the way, including fricking Helsinki
Lmfao defeating Finland was off the table before, now it's literally impossible.
The strategic depth that the alliance with Sweden gives means that for all intents and purposes they can move their troops to the moon for reconstitution. On top of that Sweden literally have their own MIC with their own fighter program, which by all accounts is very formidable and it will be supplemented by NATO intelligence and air control assets.
So the air war is instantly lost, logsitics are now too vast and deep to ever be cut, and never forget that it's fricking Finland and we know how pozziyans invading there works out.
Step 1: unfrick Russia's Banana Republic-tier legal/political system
Step 2: use new-found anti-corruption measures to unfrick Russia's Gulf State-tier economy
Step 3: use new-found political and economic liberty to generate a wave of hope which will unfrick Russia's demography
Step 4: use new-found wealth, industry, and manpower to create a new anti-NATO powerbloc that can generate sufficient economies of scale to maintain more than 8 Su-57s
Step 5: use my Gen 6 or 7 fighter-bomber fleet to clear the air and water of non-Russian forces
Simple as
Someone needs to take this picture, frame it, put it on a table in an empty room with those candles with saints on them, with an AK on each side or some shells. One of those slav tribute displays.
Give it long enough timeline there will be a Trinity of Nemtsov, Prigozhin and Navalny with some snow Black folk doing their church worship around in a few generations
They might be praying in Chinese, but they will still be quite drunk
>political and economic liberty to generate a wave of hope which will unfrick Russia's demography
Not sure that would work
Most first world countries have those liberties and they are demographically fricked too
There a very few ways to fix the demographics of any country imo >Mass immigration (Line goes up, but the country is screwed long term) >Banning birth control (''worked'' in Communist Romania; but kids ended up in terrible state orphanages since the parents were too poor to take care of them) >Spread religious fanaticism (Orthodox israelites are already becoming the majority in Israel because the other sects don't have enough kids)
All true, BUT there is reason to believe that Russia's fertility rate could be recovered by those liberties for three reasons:
1. Less gangsterism means more security means more people are comfortable having kids and raising families
2. More economic well-being means its easier for people to justify having and affording children
3. Better political and economic conditions means fewer young people migrating to richer countries and maybe having their children there
Then there's also the immigration pull 'line goes up arguments but you already covered that.
The tough thing about industrial fertility rates is that no one has an idea on how to fix them. The only correlation that exists with high fertility is female social agency, commonly referred to as 'median female education attainment', and short of turning the clock back on feminism by 200 years, with female consent, that isn't a solution. Even Hungarys solution of basically bribing women to have three children didn't do anything more than bring Hungary's fertility rate back up to about replacement level.
> Russia's fertility rate could be recovered
It might increase it somewhat but it would probably be still on par with EU nations (So still fricked)
Developed nations like South Korea and Italy have even lower birth rates than Russia; and on the other hand a poor shithole like India breeds more than ''happiest in the world'' Scandinavian countries >Then there's also the immigration pull 'line goes up arguments but you already covered that.
This is also a temporary solution at best; if immigrants ''assimilate'' (Which you'd theoretically want them too) they will be affected by whatever is stopping the locals from breeding >short of turning the clock back on feminism by 200 years,
Yeah i think that might be the only solution
In a scenario where you are in charge of Russia you could potentially pull it of; since you already have a structure in place to control people
Granted not even Iran's birthrate is that good >Even Hungarys solution of basically bribing women to have three children
This might work but pherhaps more extreme; no retirement or gibs for people who don't reproduce
Anyway if i was in charge of Russia the main priority would be increasing the birth rate somehow; in the long run the first power to do that wins (At the end only rivals left are even shittier backwaters that breed more and dying boomer nations)
https://vxtwitter.com/paulmcleary/status/1762848086152421393
Czech defense policy chief, Jan Jires, brings the heat:
"Some crucial segments of the European defense industry are now performing better than US defense industry....Rheinmetall in Germany is producing way more 155 artillery shells than the entire US defense industry combined."
Yeah, this reminds me of that quote "I fear all we have done is to awaken a sleeping giant and fill him with a terrible resolve."
The Europeans DO KNOW how to wage war. Just because they have been sleeping like a beauty for the past half a century doesn't mean that they have forgotten. And if you wake them up and give them a reason to genuinely start arming themselves, shit might get real ugly surprisingly fast.
that still leaves Expal and the Aussie factory to pick up the slack, not to mention NAMMO
I won't be satisfied until the EU is outproducing South Korea
>shit might get real ugly surprisingly fast.
It better. Someone needs to pick up the slack.
This time the starting positions of the pieces are great compared to WWI and WWII. Only good things can come out of this. Feel free to quote me on that once the world is a frick.
It fills me with a warm fuzzy feeling knowing Europeans are finally starting to gain some sense back into themselves. EU has been the most successful peace project in history, no one in Europe aside from Russia wants war, but it also made everyone except few nations like Finland too soft. Glad that we're finally fixing that part.
and as america's influence fades when Trump is elected, Europe will get to flex its fully military muscle bordered by Easter European countries itching for payback.
Absolutely no one on this world wants a militarized imperialistic europe besides some hawks from the old continent dreaming of the good old days.
That's a great way to get ganged up by the other Great Powers. China, India, Russia, and the USA will have a very big say in this process if it ever begins.
>That's a great way to get ganged up by the other Great Powers. >China
Lmao >India
GOOD MORNING SARS PLEASE DO OF NEEDFUL WE ARE GREAT POWER YES >Russia
Lmfao wake me up when they're able to defeat one of their neighbors >and the USA
Uh... why?
Ever heard of... balance of power? What do you think happens if another super state - especially one with a long history of genocide and colonialism - is added to the mix?
this is a reminder that there is no better alternative to being part of the american hegemony, we might have trannies and homosexuals but it is still better than being russian or chinese >democracy is non-negiotable.
that's overblown domestic politics, the republican party is seething about the border because it's the only issue they can run a president on. there's no "peaceful protests" like there were in the past to drum up a boogeyman
What value does the USA derive from running global security? How does that value compare to the expense? Can that value be substituted by other means?
I'll answer for you: >trade relations and resource access to global markets allows the US to swiftly and cheaply import virtually anything they want for almost no cost >this is achieved at the cost of $800 billion per year in defense spending on top of tens of billions of dollars of international bribes and discretionary spending, as well as domestic economic dislocation from lack of import tariffs >luxury goods such as French wine or Italian cars cannot be replaced fully, but domestic production can come close. Dirt cheap foreign manufacturing can be found in countries like Columbia and Venezuala, which are much closer and have less baggage than India or Indonesia
tl;dr the USA spends tons of money that it doesn't have to maintain access to top-tier luxury goods and international influence that supports global endeavors. From the POV of a Paradox player, it's bad to ket that go. From the POV of the guy footing the bill, its a joke
You're being a moron. The point of NATO is to prevent nuclear proliferation by bringing countries that have very clear and justified reasons to desire nukes (i.e. Eastern Europe) under the US nuclear umbrella, thereby keeping nukes under US control. Remember, you aren't dealing with thirdie countries that are only a couple of generations removed from mud-huts here, the Europeans can start building nukes tomorrow if they want to.
That sounds like a job for an international agency to enforce international non-proliferation treaties. But even this answer builds on the previous, because the US is shouldering the burden to prevent international incidents for free
Let them settle in then subtly program all their men to be gay and their women to frick blacks, while encouraging unlimited migration into their public services and let women vote.
They pretty much program themselves you'd just need to keep pointing it out
So people either see you as an alternative to this or lean hard on it saying any opposition to it is treason to their values (The enemy hates it, so it must be good!)
Also work hard on removing those problems from your country while you are it (Russia is failing this)
Promote radical communist ideology, racial agitation, class envy, and sexual fetishization of gender roles as appropriate for children. Then I'd attack the people pointing this out as in league with me.
If I were expecting imminent war, I would send the whole fleet out to sea before the enviable blockade is put in place. I would order them to cause as much havoc on NATO supply lines before getting sunk. Hopefully they can cause some trade disruption before being destroyed.
Like Ukraine did - drones, a lot of naval drones. Very cheap, very effective, everyone would be shitting themselves and civilian vessels would leave ports only in heavily guarded convoys. Any Nordic naval commerce would basically cease to be.
i would secretly stockpile all my nukes in kaliningrad and then blow them up at the same time when nato tries to invade it
Why would anyone want to invade a shithole?
Russians invade each other's shitholes every day.
>become russian
>address new reality by employing thermonuclear an-hero technique
exquisite
it's honestly the only way to actually kill anything. most nato warships will have good air defense and you don't have enough anti-ship missiles to kill them (unless the russians have been smart which we know they haven't in this area they blew their load a year into ukraine), your electronic warfare probably isn't good enough to get close enough to the ships to kill them, and you can't win a stand up air to air fight against anything nato has. all nato ground based air defenses are monsters too. the only way to do any damage is to expend fighters in moronic nuclear strikes or use nuclear armed ballistic/cruise missiles.
on that note ook ook nook nook gib banana
>kaliningrad is vaporized along with all the vodka Black folk inhabiting it
holy based
But that would be doing NATO a favor. Nobody wants to administrate a region infested with Russians.
total strategic HATO victory
that would be quiete convinient and spare the EU trillions in money due to less russians existing
And nothing of value was lost
New Russian flag dropped
in case of hostilities just blockade it until they are no threat to anyone -its tiny, Kaliningrad has no industry - its basically military base in middle of NATO space to lob missiles further
>in case of hostilities just blockade it until they are no threat to anyone -its tiny, Kaliningrad has no industry - its basically military base in middle of NATO space to lob missiles further
Why not send all the streetshitters, africans, ragheads and pakis that the Russians have been shoving in from north africa and over the finish, polish and Swedish borders since 2014 to kaliningrad, Its already surrounded my minefields.
Not a bad idea actually.
It'd be like a multicultural Palestine, so people might actually care about it, if only out of morbid curiosity.
It wouldn't work. Europe's too cucked to allow a proper open-air prison and US would also mewl about muh human rights since it's not the israelites doing the funny.
>since it's not the israelites doing the funny.
Lets make it a second israel and get the israelites to handle the brownies.
>It'd be like a multicultural Palestine, so people might actually care about it, if only out of morbid curiosity.
kek a tower hamlets nation
Invade? Motherfricker at this point Kaliningrad is going to be a financial liability. It was supposed to be a wedge between Baltic states and rest of Nato. Now that advantage is gone and burried.
Why invade it, when Russia will be wasting millions on maintaining base that dosen't justify this kind of expenditure? Frick. I bet nobody would even want to take that shithole even if Russia will be offering it for free or even paying anyone willing to take it.
Are you planning to the equivalent of grenade an heroing but with nooks?
>Bunch of tanks pass near Kalinigrad due to random training exercise
>Super stable and wise local Russian commander panics
>Hits the nuke button to fight imaginary HATO invasion troops
>Lithuanian tank commander stares in awe as distant Kalinigrad disappears in a massive mushroom cloud
>Twitter personalities rant and screech that Russia didn't need the city, and that this was part of a grand strategy far beyond Western comprehension
>Moscow memoryholes the whole thing and pretends the city never even existed
OOK OOK NOOK NOOK
A funny thing. It is said that Poland is buying hundreds of Himars and Chumno to raze the Królewiec region If a war occurs.
They should do a test run or three once they get all the HIMARS/Chumno. That sounds like the sort of plan that needs the kind of refinement you only get with experience.
cry on every platform existing
>Only Kaliningrad and Saint Petersbourg are left
I'd love to see the Poles and Finns do something about that
If that isn't the culmination of this, it'll happen again in twenty years
We are going to build a wall across Gulf of Finland and the Russia is going to pay for it!
And then the Finns and Swedes go to war with each other over it
nah, all we are both happy with what we got. anything ruski is shit and cursed.
however, we, the nordics, are EXTREMELY FRICKING KEEN on making sure to contribute to russia getting slaughtered once and for all in Ukraine
>picrel
Fenno-swedish war would be two way struggle snuggle and in the end both would be satisfied with no hard feelings.
St. Petersburg is rightful Dutch clay due to copyright infringement and because it would be funny.
>I'd love to see the Poles and Finns do something about that
>Finns
St Petersburg has a higher population than all of Finland. Plus, what claims could Finland possibly manufacture? At least with Kaliningrad, a claim could be made that it's a Russian settler colony that's only existed since 1945, and that it's rightful Polish/Lithuanian/German clay.
>Plus, what claims could Finland possibly manufacture?
It would be very, very funny.
>St Petersburg has a higher population than all of Finland.
It's not much but it's a good start to TZD
>Plus, what claims could Finland possibly manufacture?
Are you moronic? Both Karelians and the Ingrians are Finnish.
Karelia
>what claims could Finland manufacture
Rightful Finnish clay that was stolen from them in 1700 by Tsar Peter the Great. They inherit the claim because they are the true Caroleans
Piter is a complete meme and in a realistic russian breakup scenario they would more likely before a free city state like singapore than anything else. Vyborg and all the other lost lands + a little extra is a far more believable scenario.
>Vyborg and all the other lost lands + a little extra is a far more believable scenario
My name is Igor Pekkala from Äänislinna municipality and I support this proposition
probably send a bunch of troops into Finland and the Baltic states in a near suicidal rush very early on to give them more to deal with, then keep as many of my aircraft airborne as possible to do around the clock suicidal bombing runs of nato forces. the moment they begin hitting any of my air bases, c2 nodes, or anything else fricking nuke them. try a few nuclear dumb bomb air strikes against nato shipping.
there is basically no winning here, just losing in a way that fricks everyone else up.
Pay indians to shill the same image of a destroyed weapon system on all platforms to deflect from this strategic loss.
considering the geography and the assumption that other russian ships have an operational readiness level equal to the moskva it's best to just avoid pissing anyone off
>texas, California and some other states suffer catastrophic civilian deaths near their borders
>most medical facilities are overwhelmed and the army has to move in just to triage and maintain control
>literally everything north of oklahoma/los angeles or east of texas is fine
>you get nuked
you'd be better off nuking germany and the united kingdom, anon.
you forgot
>the cartels get nuked
Nah, the USAF wouldn't even need nukes to kill the cartels within 150 km of the border. It'll get a lot easier when the only stand up fighting groups are using civilians as shields to get into the US (likely not to matter in a post-nuclear environment lets be honest) or running around in the open (LGB bait).
you misunderstand - the original scenario was RUSSIA nuking the US border.
meaning Russia would have nuked the cartels without the US doing anything. half the land next to the border isn't in the US
Kaliningrad should unironically be confiscated and given to Poland.
no frick you and spierdalaj
give this shithole to the germans, krauts need to reap what they sow
No, exclaves are dumb, and Germans can't be trusted to build nice things.
Also it has the potential to be good, it's just Russians currently live there.
the germans are not having another fricking excalve
The Germans still haven't unfricked east Germany yet, you want to give them another ex-soviet shithole they will never fix?
Make it an EU joint zone they all pay to fix and it can be used as a refugee dumping ground.
Give it to Czechs
Nah, it shouldn't be the burden of one nation alone. Split it between Poland and Lithuania along the river.
Just make it a special EU administered zone
>this
every other thing would only bring more tension but before anything the current inhabtitants need to be expulsed and the buildings destroyed
kantberg autonomous zone
Doesn't Russia control it because nobody else wanted it?
Anyone who could want it had no say in 45. Koningsberg isn't a shithole naturally, it's a shithole because of being occupied by Russia for almost a century.
It should be isolated, technologically wiped and have sky bridges installed over it with viewing platforms so everyone can travel to view russians fighting for scraps and killing each other
While on the sky bridge, you could toss down torn up loaves of bread and sharpened sticks and then watch them fight each other for bread. Bring a pizza for you and your date and y’all would have dinner and show!
no one would want to have to pour billions into unfricking the place
only real option is an independent city state
>give it to Poland
What did Poland do to warrant such a cruel punishment
Germany doesn't want it back, Poland doesn't want it, Latvia definitely doesn't want it. No one would want it because it's a dilapidated shithole filled with Russians but at the same time the EU probably wouldn't want it to be an independent citystate precisely because it's full of Russians, it'd be an annoying pro-Russian fifth column that would be constantly shitting things up for the next century or two.
The best option would be deport them all and turn it into a giant nature reserve.
>The best option would be deport them all and turn it into a giant nature reserve.
100% unironic agreement and frankly would get so much support from lefties.
>filled with Russians
Sterilise them, we are Europeans not Americans, we don't have to pretend to be gentle and fair with Russians at this stage.
>Sterilise them
Katyn style?
I mean, they could turn it into a crater. Maybe mine it out for natural resources once the surface problem has been vaporized.
>The best option would be deport them all and turn it into a giant nature reserve.
That cannot be done because of international laws about genocide
>That cannot be done because of international laws about genocide
Every time someone brings it up just start yawning loudly and change the subject.
If they persist then do something they can't ignore like open your fly and expose your penis until they're forced to address the fact that your penis is exposed. I call it phallusbustering.
Lawyers could also vault onto tables, take a shit on them, and return to their seats, yawning loudly and wearing clothing made out of those crinkly heat blankets you see paramedics handing out after car crashes. I bet that would also make them sweat profusely, providing further distraction.
All we need are like 20,000 lawyers to keep up the effort until Kaliningrad is depopulated. Better to ask forgiveness than permission.
All the replies to this shows you how shitty this board is, literal reddit board.
>NOOO DON'T MAKE FUN OF KALININGRAD, IT'S RUSSIAN CLAY!!!!
Please do cry more.
sharing is caring anon, split it between poland & lithuania with poland taking the more populous city and the Curonian spit being split by it's narrowest part
Nah, deport the Russians there, demolish Kaliningrad and rebuild everything into the ideal pan-european free city.
>The settlement of modern-day Kaliningrad was founded in 1255 on the site of the ancient Old Prussian settlement Twangste by the Teutonic Knights during the Northern Crusades, and was named Königsberg in honor of King Ottokar II of Bohemia.
rightful Czech clay
revive the Trusteeship Council. mandate a global garbage dump in the territory.
only if every single zigger is permanently removed from the area, maybe.
it will have to be a walled off and placed under a level 50+ superfund site for at least two decades until they can cleanup the filth the vatniks have left behind.
It should be made into a US state so America can join the European Union.
Yes them and lithuianua
A better idea would be to have Kaliningrad be the capital of the EU or be the new NATO headquarters and build a proper military facility where the Americans can just frick around... send the Russians back to Russia.
First of all, frick off we don't want it
Second, the RSFSR already tried to pawn it off to the Lithuanian SSR in the 60's and they didn't want it, so why would we
having good relations with NATO, simple as
its either bite the bullet and give up the moronic imperialist larp from 300 years ago so you can stably integrate into the European economic/political environment (don't necessarily have to try to adopt the political institutional changes required to join the EU and NATO) OR be drawn inevitably into the Chinese economic orbit as a clear junior partner. we saw it before 2012, Russia was able to mostly play nice, make shit tons of money, and have access to Western expertise in technology and industrial development by just having mostly normal (if a bit distant) relations with the Europeans like the Middle East does (and China did before wolf warrior autism and then the Ukraine War fricked it). Europeans are happy to trade with all sorts of autocrats provided they are stable and practice healthy moderation with the human rights abuses. China operates illegal secret police offices in other countries to crack down on their expats, showing they don't give a frick about sovereignty, and East Russia is full of Chinese people already. for frick sake they quietly updated their state maps to use Chinese names for places in Eastern Russia and are actively selling drones and equipment to the Ukrainians at the same time as their 'no limits partner' Russia (while steadfastly adhering to Western sanctions of their own freewill).
The west Need an enemy, they never wanted Russia
The east has always been enemy to civilization which Russia only apes when it comes to technology while remaining a collection of conquests ruled by Muscovites, their minions and those they choose to empower as tyrants.
That's the underlying socio-strategic basis for the Russian ways of war and military management. A competent force threatens the Tsar but an incompetent politically nepotistic force does not. Fine for internal security (the main reason for the armed forces) but less fine against motivated military opponents.
oh please those Black folk have been absolutely moronic forever.
>"oh boo hoo I can't own everything and make it shit woe is me this is russophobia ;~~*~~*(("
god you're so worthless
Petition to officially redefine the borders of Europe so that it will exclude all of r*ssia and belar*ssia
>ceding rightfully European lands to the Mongol rapebabies instead of reclaiming it
tsk tsk, Hitler would be disappointed
If only
Both sides are nuclear powers so there’s zero (0) security concern. The war in Ukraine is all about the European energy market and the only role the Baltic Sea could play are EEZs related to possible pipeline routes.
>Russia was able to mostly play nice
Because it was them preparing to reclaim their Soviet states via their age old tactic of
>Have clay want
>Move Russians into clay
>Have Russians become dominant clay population
>Say the state that administers that clay is persecuting Russians
>Say you will protect Russians
>Use military to protect Russians
>Lose a huge amount of men and the state you're fighting gives up because it isn't worth it
>Claim glorious victory, clay is now yours
>Now do the same to another neighbour
>Rinse and repeat until you've absorbed the entire state
>Torture and execute dissidents and replace them with more Russians
>Bonus; use the new non-Russians as cannon fodder to expand into MORE clay
Had Ukraine fallen as their propaganda claimed it had on Feb 24th, 2022 they would have moved onto Moldova and Georgia - likely at the same time. This would have then left them with Armenia (who likely would have 'democratically' joined Russia out of fear of a war, how Russia is stronk and for 'protection' from Azerbaijan). Then Azerbaijan and Kazakhstan would be next on the list. Then the rest of the -stans. By that point China is no longer the dominant power in the East and has to - reluctantly - respect Russia. This then leads to them fighting over Mongolia (which China is trying to turn into a puppet state ala Burma). After that? Well the Baltics, most likely.
Too bad their army sucks
>By that point China is no longer the dominant power in the East and has to - reluctantly - respect Russia
how come? all the -stans are largely worthless, and them reluctantly joining ziggeria wouldn't really matter much unless ziggers wanted to blockade chinks - but that would require US to do it at sea at the same time
That's basically it. Russia is desperate for relevance and if they make the mighty dragon bow to them, then they are superior. Plus, typical 'We must be as big as we used to be' deal.
The Europeans had to be forced to stop trading with Russia during the war in which they were supplying Ukraine, so I'd drop the 'human rights' bit
>Invade Ukraine
>Suffer sanctions
>Hopefully win
>Hopefully Nato loses credibility
>Hopefully you can now invade other non NATO states like Georgia or Kazakhstan.
>With this countries your Petro-economy is hopefully diversified, and your dropping demographics are improved.
>By this point hope that Pandas invaded Thailand and conflict is prolonging itself due to lack of support from Europe since Americans failed to support Ukraine.
>Sell guns to China to further improve relations.
>Hopefully Pandas won
>Now in 2050 or so US-Europe relations are hopefully weak,
>Russia's economy hopefully is no longer a petro state or less so.
>Russia's demographic crisis is hopefully alleviated
Now as Russia I can maybe invade Poland. It is still finnicky. But Finland is pain due to terrain, plus there is not much to gain. Poland economy is fairly ok and it would boost my state further assuming i take control. It's a stupid plan full of gambles, but this what I came up with when one friend of a friend who is in a SOF said to me that some analysts analyzed the shit and they assume eventual Russian invasion against Poland. It might be just bullshit hearsay though. Plus we in eastern Europe always assume that Russians are planning something.
But personally I hope that country with biggest nuclear arsenal balkanizes, would be funny.
>But Finland is pain due to terrain, plus there is not much to gain.
You have forgotten the Bouncy Ball.
> invade Poland
I love this whenever I see it, and I need to ask, as I always do: what regiments would Russia use to invade Poland, provided they continue their SMO in Ukraine and don't just fully lose everything, Crimea included in 2 days so that they can muster the troops?
>Russia's economy hopefully is no longer a petro state or less so.
Ukraine is working on it
That's a lot of hoping that needs to come true.
self immolation
bear in mind most russian exported oil has to pass through that
>sink entire HATO with naval drones
>send meatwaves against the baltics
>spend rest of the budget on a huge shilling campaign
>wait until westerners get bored
It's that easy
Nice vid. Which ship got pwnd?
by conquering the baltic states. Not only is it a large chunk of baltic sea shorline the land mass is ideal for stationing sam and anti-naval missile assets all along the coast. nothing gets to move in the sea without its eyes on them
>inb4 nook
about as credible as vatniks screeching about nooks for every random asset blown up
Start dumping radioactive materials and chemicals into the sea
Simply threaten to nook after Trump withdraws the US from Europe
The point is if there was a war, it would be nuke war, so obviously nuke everyone first.
Yes. Post collapse of the USSR, Russia was called a 3rd world country with the largest nuclear weapons holder.
>Germany only has salvaged british tanks
>Germany has jetplanes
>allied propagandists: :)d
At the beginning of the war, "military experts" were talking about all the capabilities Russia had and Ukraine should surrender immediately. One of the weapons Russia supposedly had was EMP missiles that could shut off all the electricity in Ukraine.
>supposedly had was EMP missiles
How did that happen? Reporter read a wikipeia article about HANE EMP and got confused?
Technically, most nukes could be emps if you detonate them at the right altitude. It's just that everyone else will have made their nukes detonate at the altitude to be nukes and respond to the launch instead of the landing.
Nobody asked. Go back.
Turn your brain back on.
>How would YOU contest a nato dominated baltic sea as russia?
I wouldnt contest it, neither will russia.
Basically if you opponent hard dominates some area or some thing its strategically often smarter to approach things asymetrically and focus elsewhere, where you opponent is weaker. In a basic RTS terms, if your opponent rushes mass Phoenixes in PvP, it is way too late to queue up some stargates and start producing your own, you just flatout lose, so you look alternatives like giving up air control and focusing on stalkers for harrasment and cannons to keep you alive.
In this baltic case the only real strategy would be to focus your fleet assets to north sea or pacific and search for an advantage there - like disrupting shipping and communication cables in North Sea - while ignoring the baltic sea completely.
Russians know this anyway, they are not 100% moronic, there is a reason why baltic fleet is already just bunch of third rate junk.
^This and that's historically normal. The Baltic is a NATO lake and shooting gallery. Russia has no strategic need to waste resources contesting it or anything but building icebreakers to assist civilian trade and other utilitarian missions.
>baltic fleet is already just bunch of third rate junk
my god, the Russians are still using ships of the line?
You should have realised that they never throw anything of military value away by now.
Vote for me to be the board /k/ommander and I will guarantee to you that they will be using musketoons by May 2026.
>baltic fleet is already just bunch of third rate junk
Some things never change, huh?
>Detonate a phat nuke in the middle of the lake
>zerg rush the newly flooded coastlines with landing craft
>zerg rush AA sites with whatever the fricks left from ukraine
>collapse as a state 3 months later
I probably wouldn’t even try to contest it beyond immediate shorelines, it’s an environment where evey move would get punished hard.
By simply investing the entirety of my gold reserves into the Trump Campaign and RNC in order to have America leave NATO, taking the piggy bank and main arms supplier out of the equation. I then tell Putin and whatever is left of the loyal oligarchs to race to the floor and start to kissass Donny on what a strong leader he is, and how strong and independent from Europe this makes the US look. I then divert whatever cash I have left under the sofa to pay the Dalits in Hinduistan to run a shillfarm dedicated solely to running EU exit campaigns.
>inb4 /misc/troon
hybrid propaganda and political espionage are legitimate wartime strategies and weapons.
How much gold do you have and why would you waste your entire reserve on something so short-term?
This is just asking for a personal disaster of biblical proportions.
Because by the time the Germans and Poles realize they're gonna have to start going full14/88, I'll hope that my Dalit cash cows have successfully convinced all the morons who actually vote across the Eurozone that not being part of the EU is actually based, and that X country wasn't pulling their weight and was tanking their home country's economy and defense spending. Once the EU defense treaty is null and void, and Trump pulls all US aid (and subsequently doubles Israel's aid package to $8 billion a year at the behest of Kushner), I then flatten Ukraine with every last Katyusha, Kinzal, FAB, and Sahad I can find.
Again, purely hypothetical. I just figured that the Terminal Boomerism that Americans are facing will keep anything Trump does for at least 20 years. See how the majoraty of young people and those under 60 want to rejoin the EU, but the boomers who actually vote keep electing Tories to run the UK into the ground. They're finally gonna know the joy of private healthcare like their US brethren, and they're gonna find out how fun it is when you loosen renters protection and sell all the public apartments to Indians, and watch them raise the rates a measly 45%.
Doesn't actually work because there are powers that be that aren't too keen on derailing their geopolitical strategies over the whims of a few hicks at the polling stations. You can bet that if Trump actually wins again he will drop all his current narratives about NATO and Ukraine extremely fast.
Well, if I were Russia, I would establish good will through respect of my neighbors, their citizens, and their territorial integrity/ sovereignty; then, cooperate with them for a century so they begin to forget about how much an incurable imperialist bastard I am. The well on operations has been run pretty dry for the foreseeable future, just put contemporary ambitions on ice and keep the long term plan a closely guarded executive branch secret.
I would contest anything. I'd listen. Which is something nobody else did.
>How would YOU contest a nato dominated baltic sea as russia?
russia can not even contest a black sea dominated by a country with no navy
Spend some decades stamping out corruption in Russia and also pay out reparations to the former eastern bloc countries + apologize for our role in WW2, respect basic human rights and assert that we make no claims whatsoever to any territory outside Russia. Also grant Kaliningrad independence. Work on joint militaey exercises with the USA for Chinese containment.
Once we've proven we're not c**ts anymore, apply to join NATO.
feign neutrality until NATO looses its raison d'être
kek Russia almost managed to do that but just had to frick it up
dam it
>Almost manage it
>Frick up because Putin wanted banan
Ook ook NOOK NOOK?
I mean, they almost managed it, before Czar Monke I The Great decided banan was more important
I'd steal all I possibly could then frick off to US or UK to live off of stolen money.
I'd make a good russian general.
Don't leave your tea cup unattended.
Having your whipping boy (I assume they still have those in bongland) check for poison is a small price to no longer live in Russia
The pilot who defected from Russia to Ukraine was just shot in Spain. No need for poison.
Wasn’t that guy told to not leave Ukraine, or else that would happen to him?
not only did he leave but he also went into a area with zigger diaspora in spain and called his gf in russia inviting her to join him
Unleash the giant radioactive bears (who also have AIDS)
>How would YOU contest a nato dominated baltic sea as russia?
I'd start by handing over Putin the Ukrainian pows and kidnapped Ukranian children along with a letter of apology and a plea for mercy in the name of Christ. There may not even be time left for that.
>Ukrainians have Ukranian PoWs
Black person what
Based Scott has already figured out a way for Russia to outwit NATO.
Oh no he spilled sauce over the map
kino
Why won't America hang him? Where are these fricking 'glowies' the Russians are always shitting on about
Presumably because of free speech and because they're not actually at war with Russia
>Presumably because of free speech and because they're not actually at war with Russia
Treason the man is working for Russia which targets Americans with nuclear weapons
because he's living in russia
Lives in Russia and unlike Europe, USA actually has Freedom of Speech*.
*outside of wartime where it gets suspended if you start sucking the dick of your opponent
>unsupported paratrooper drops in Sweden
VEH DEH VEH BROS, WE ARE SO BACK!
paratrooper drops in Sweden
>VEH DEH VEH BROS, WE ARE SO BACK!
u go girls! maybe this time!
I just want to point out that the VDV leave this plane upside down before going right side up
am I just ignorant? do paratroopers hang upside down inside the plane like bats?
this doesn't seem practical, but I'm open to being wrong
They do manly backflips before landing directly in a lake and drowning. But it's very manly.
>those graphics
Reminder that video is from a parody/comedy show in Russia. It isn't meant to be serious. Like, I know humour is subjective and all but the outdated maps bit kinda gives it away.
>is from a parody/comedy show in Russia.
How are we supposed to tell when this is reality???
It's difficult and it is also played semi-seriously (to avoid defenestration for insulting glorious military) but it was meant to be a joke.
plus official kreml mouthpieces shout same bullshit dead seriously
This is a parody account right?
No, he's a twice convicted pedo and russia likely has compromising material to blackmail him with.
>6"
>203lbs
Fat frick
*230
6'4" chad
king
He's a convicted pedo. You can't get lower than that. russia doesn't need any extra compromising material.
He has to prostitute himself to monke because nobody else will hire him.
>You can't get lower than that.
A video of him raping a child has the potential to send him behind bars for a long time. Threaten to inform all of his new friends in prison just what he's doing time for and the prospects get even darker for him.
So yes, there are many ways they can blackmail him with that. Also since CP is legal to possess in russia it was likely that bait which caught him in the first place.
>Make your nation the global one-stop-shop for CP
>Pack all the websites out the ass with tracking program
>Screen everyone who accesses your shit from Europe or America for potential usefulness
>You now have instant double agents
Hory sheeit maybe the FSB isn't as useless as I thought.
Pedophiles don't suddenly stop just because they get caught. It is very possible that the Russians are blackmailing Ritter with something that could send him back to the joint for a long time. It's also the case that Ritter is angry and Bitter about Uncle Sam busting him in the first place, so he wants to get back at the US however he can.
What I don't get is that multipolar russia doesn't lack useless idiots from the west, why do they pick a convicted pedophile when all he does is do more damage than good? Like literally there are thousands they could groom
>why do they pick a convicted pedophile
Well they need someone from west who hates their country and this scott ritter, he talked dirty to some glowBlack person who pretended to be 12 - i would be pissed off aswell to be punished for that, as this is imaginary crime.
But as time moves on and west falls further a LOT more people look for something better somewhere else - and some morons believe what putin is selling that russia is trad and based etc and some are just so pissed off at their country and leaders betraying the people that they will do whatever to bring it all down.
Russians like Scott because he was one of the few people who was outspoken in his belief that Iraq and Afghanistan had no WMD's during the GWOT. It seems to be a broken clock situation though, because around the same time Scott also was adamant that the US Military would be shattered by the regular forces of Iraq.
No it's the real one
His is "@therealscottritter"
Armchair copelord is "@ArmchairW"
The best parody is https://twitter.com/ArmchairCopelrd
Scott Ritter constantly posts in the replies of the Copelord parody, it really badly gets to him that his friend is getting mocked and he seethe in the replies pic related kek.
He even speaks like the average /chug/ user, I'm convinced they're briefed on some sort of propaganda script, either that or they're just copying each others speech patterns due to doing nothing but speaking to each other every day all day.
What's even funnier is Scott Ritter Child Diddler sat in front of thousands of soldiers on Chechnya and made a moronic speech, how anyone can say he's an American Patriot after that is beyond belief.
https://vxtwitter.com/igorsushko/status/1743849724745302412 for the link to the translated speech
Did he ask his girlfriend to come up with that plan after luring her to his van?
Look at how thick the arrows are
It's over for khohxkhxils
>Finnish coast occupied
>opens google maps and zooms in
Please do it I'm begging you it'll be the funniest shitshow in the history
>opens google maps
>looks at the coast around helsinki
holy shit I thought it was only the interior that was a shitshow for invading militaries
it's like looking at a sharks mouth
this coastline has fricking teeth dude what the frick
Now take a look at Stockholm's archipelago
It's so bad it fricked the Soviets by itself, pic rel
that's not a coastline
that's just a sunken mountainrange
does Sweden by chance hold the record for most islands within its exclusive economic zone?
holy fricking shit I was joking
it actually does
During the iceage there was a massive fricking glacier that crushed the shit out of the baltic sea, Sweden is basically on a mountain slope of an ancient mountain range, hence the hilly environment + depression = island hell
>Feed me ziggers
God that look fun to travel through.
Especially when you have to deal with hungry Polar Bears too.
I wasn't being sarcastic, put me in a small(ish) boat and give me a map and I'll be exploring for weeks.
Welcome to Finland.
Even mother nature hates russians.
>Sweden neutralized
how
on the ground and in the air
With MS Paint.
They just drop a bunch of unsupported paratroopers
see the + sign?
it balances out Sweden's net negative charge
>bro, just move your troops forward bro, that's all you got to do bro
>fortifications? logistics? difficult terrain? what are you talking about bro, none of that matters, just look at the lines
This is the type of shit i would come-up with when i was ten and day-dreaming about conquering the world. He probably got it from his latest victim after getting them in his van.
>fortifications? logistics? difficult terrain? what are you talking about bro, none of that matters, just look at the lines
Based and Fork pilled.
Does he just airbrush random arrows in MSpaint while jerking off? Is his big strategy the blindingly obvious plan of crossing the Suwalki Gap?
>Wow, that is some elite General Staff level planning. Patton would be jealous.
Do you not?
I stopped last night after the new life imprisonment laws were introduced. Badly photoshopped fanfiction is now considered hate speech.
>Do you think NATO is aware of the Russian Suwalki Gap strategy? Maybe I should send them a letter or something with a giant map inside of it covered in giant red arrows..
You ever think that Russia just facepalms and goes 'Why did we spend money on this guy?' when they make posts like this. Just boggles and baffles. Does this guy not realise that NATO's navy then goes and sails into the sea and starts raining missiles on their ground forces while setting up a screen of AA missiles all the while aircraft carriers launch F-35's? Like I know Russia could set up AA and shit around the coast but pretty sure they'd be targeted by various things at that point. Be it long range aircraft launched missiles or naval missiles.
>Finnish coast occupied
Laughs in PERKELE.
I love the tactical Moomin limu / juice bottle
haha
>HATO don't know about the Gdansk sleeper cell FSB assault division
I am Pekka from Helsinki Oblast and I am demoralized
What did he mean with the ominous cross of Svealand.
It scares me
super secret trained beluga whales with nuclear tsunami-causing bombs obviously
those are earmarked for UK
Anon, at best, the Russian ICBM's might be able to hit Hungary before years of neglect cause them to malfunction and break apart in flight.
>Anon, at best, the Russian ICBM's might be able to hit Hungary before years of neglect cause them to malfunction and break apart in flight.
"John Cody Fidler-Simpson CBE is an English foreign correspondent who is currently the world affairs editor of BBC News. He has spent all his working life with the BBC, and has reported from more than 120 countries, including thirty war zones, and interviewed many world leaders."
where is the russian cope where they say something like : only western pig push button with finger , in russia you hit it with hammer !
What would stop Estonia and Finland from dropping toxic waste to poison the citizens of st. Petersburg
Same thing that stops the citizens of st. Peterburg from doing it. Aka nothing, they themselves dump more toxic shit in there than indians do in their holy river.
>Nuke the US border and watch the USA collapse without the illegals that its leaders love so much.
The majority of mass immigration into the EU and a reasonable proportion of that via the USAs southern border is orchestrate by Russia and in the case of the USA, China.
https://www.euractiv.com/section/politics/news/sweden-backs-finland-closing-borders-to-fend-off-russia-orchestrated-migrant-crisis/
Sweden backs Finland closing borders to fend off ‘Russia-orchestrated’ migrant crisis
https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/italy-blames-surge-migration-russias-wagner-group-2023-03-13/
ROME, March 13 (Reuters) - The Italian government on Monday said Russian mercenary group Wagner was behind a surge in migrant boats trying to cross the central Mediterranean as part of Moscow's strategy to retaliate against countries supporting Ukraine.
You'd have to start with the Baltic states and southern Finland and hope that Belarus doesn't cuck out again. Without that coastline they don't have a hope in hell of leaving St. Petersburg, and its guaranteed that there will be damn near silent diesel-electric subs creeping about just itching to sink anything that does leave dock. You'd need air control to deal with the sub threat first and that's no easy task when fighting against NATO.
Their best hope is to split up NATO first, but they fricked that option up by invading Ukraine.
In fact they would just be far better off going and re-conquering the USSR's more easterly provinces first, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Tajikistan, Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan and just forgetting about anything NATO controlled. Plenty of land they can grab relatively easily there and make their population think that they're a great nation again able to conquer others. Trying to expand into Europe is just suicide.
Make Russia prosperous enough to be worth working with.
Also acquire dragons to frick up nafo's airforce
How do dragons fare against SAMs?
Both equally impossible prospects.
>you will never ride a dragon through the clouds
this universe frickin sucks man
They tried it, but then the eternal slavehood instinct won and they decided they need a banan dictator to squander their wealth in a war of conquest of a land that was likely to just join up willingly if monke did not steal all the wealth.
Russia upset because they can't terrorize their neighbors with impunity anymore
Foment civil war among my enemies by bringing in lifetime imprisonment laws for shitposting.
Storm Shadow, Taurus and Tomahawk (plus others) things until they stop being the thing they used to be.
>I can no longer support my family from X
wait there are people who post on Twitter as a career
he gets paid by the vatBlack folk to post shit on x.
when his shitposts get pushed to the back of the bus, his handlers cant pay him anymore.
Strategically Russia shouldn't sweat it. If they weren't moronic they'd be investing in massive upgrades to Murmansk's ports and infrastructure to take advantage of the metric frick ton of new shipping bypassing the Suez and Panama canals. Russia could be setting itself up to be the shipping mecca of Europe.
But instead they decided to roll in the mud over a highway to crimea, a semi decent natural gas basin, and juuust enough new land to bury their dead on.
Yup. And if their belligerence continues, they will be preparing to get Murmarsk bombed.
On an unrelated tangent did you know that NATO already has B61-capable WS3 lockers in northern Finland? Pretty close to Murmarsk. And Finland is getting F35s soon. What a funny string of coincidences.
what are the odds, eh?
Every navy in the world except the US navy is a prestige project.
The US navy keeps trade lanes open and safe (mostly), and the other navies pose for photos.
The follies of trying to actually use a navy as a country other than the USA can be seen in the Russian Black Sea campaign.
Lure EU into building Nordstream 3 by agreeing to sell cheap gas. Hold them hostage after dependency. Provoke the US into blowing it up for lulz. It's like poetry.
If Hitler had just focused on attacking the USSR instead of dumb revanchist ethnostate BS, the rest of Europe would have called him a hero.
Hitler poisoned the well for commie haters and gave the communists a scapegoat and a rhetorical tool, unfortunately. Should've just killed every single Russian. Would've been easier, and more ethical.
Russia already stood no chance of competing in the Baltic anyway and it wouldn't have made sense to try even before they joined. RU would have to commit forces to St Petersburg to deal with Finland rather than concentrate fully on the Baltics. Sweden is basically a non-factor except as a staging point for harassment, but would likely be untouchable and should just be ignored except as a target for missiles and bombs.
Strategy would be to blitz the highway between Vyborg and Turku before Finland can get up to wartime strength. Would be a good trade if this meant the loss of Kaliningrad but splitting offensive capability between Estonia / Finland would lessen the chances of success in either and NATO is both more ready to defend Estonia than Finland and will also have an easier time reinforcing and supplying large troop movements there.
Then dig in or go for the Baltics depending on how the cookie crumbles.
It took 4 years for brave American warriors to take the Sadr city from goat farmers with unlimited 100% air support. Now imagine them taking Kaliningrad fortress with trained garrison and underground networks + constant sams ambushes on nato planes
Absolutely possible they don't take it, but deciding to focus on Finland first instead of Baltics is at the expense of time to relieve Kaliningrad. There is uncertainty there regardless and the decision should be made with the worst outcome in mind
>Strategy would be to blitz the highway between Vyborg and Turku before Finland can get up to wartime strength.
Some issues with this:
1. Russia couldn't even fricking blitz Kyiv after months of build up.
2. Russia would in no way shape or form have air superiority here. NATO would 100% be fricking the Russians from the air the whole time.
3. Pretty much all of Finland is a densely forrested swamp intersperesed with thousands of lakes. And the Finnish road network in the eastern parts of the country is intentionally constructed to frick up any advance from the Russian side. This isn't a good place to blitz anything.
Ukraine had 300k troops in position at the start of the invasion, roughly outnumbering Russia 3:2, versus Finland's standing army of ~25k. Airpower or not Finland doesn't have the bodies to stand up to what Russia has IF they get caught off guard.
It's a whole other story if they get up strength but the idea here is not to engage NATO in Finland because its a great place to fight but to engage Finland before NATO has its ducks in a row to keep it from being the monumental pain in the ass it has the potential to be for all the reasons you've described.
Occupying Finland is also a huge political bargaining chip in the sense that Russia has no reasons or interest in annexation or long-term occupation and could probably get away with extracting some nice concessions in exchange for leaving if its a fait accompli and both sides get nervous and don't want things to spiral any further than they already will have by that point
I think you underestimate how much shit terrain + air dominance would level the playing field
Nevermind that pre-war Russia doesn't exist anymore, only their rundown, depleted self does. If they spent months arming up next to Finland and Finland got informed by US intelligence like Ukraine did the matchup is a complete stomp
You simply can't mass enough forces that matter and supply them near the very few possible routes of invasion without tipping things of weeks if not months in advance. And the orders to actually attact would be known by western spooks before the commanders themselves, like it happened already. The only reason it worked in Ukraine was that the ukes were afraid of angering russia if they reacted and were desperately hoping that russia was a rational actor. No way that happens with Finland where they've been preparing for this for almost a century now. And that was before the great banan retrieval attempt.
you forgot that the ukrainians actually did respond, it was just the government (mostly zelensky apparently) that refused to give the formal "disperse and prepare for war" orders from kyiv. the army and air force both moved to wartime conditions without being formally ordered to do so.
>versus Finland's standing army of ~25k
now what are the reserves. I know this is a alien concept for western mind used to only microscopic mercenary armies but it is possible to bulk the shit out of your standing armies with mobilized reservists that are trained systematically in the years leading up to it. Both finland and estonia practice that in the region as conscription can actually work and not just end up in a forced gay orgy like the vatnik variant
Finlands population is only 5.5 million. If we assume a standard demographic pyramid, (which we shouldn't because Finland is european) then that means Finland can only draw on a maximum of 2.1 million troops IF they conscript every man and woman between the ages of 18 and 50. Ukraine has that many men under arms after two years of war and they're starting to buckle; Finland would have no chance in a prolonged fight (without reinforcement)
Remind me why the Finns sued for peace in the Winter War and the Continuation War
they did, and lived to fight another day
remind me how many tanks did Finland have vs soviets
Yeah but why did they do it
to live and fight another day
btw, notice how putin is not doing this and is slowly breaking russia apart until it will cease to exist
Yeah but why were they at risk of dying?
>why were they at risk of dying?
they were not, and especially not when you compare it to the 20M russians who got killed
Then why did they sue for peace in the Winter War under the same terms Stalin asked for, and in the Continuation War under terms so harsh it forced them to attack their German allies?
Because the allies were supplying the Soviets with infinite supplies?
what a historical fricking mistake, the nukes should have been tested on moscow instead
>why the Finns sued for peace in the Winter War
The western allies did not supply Finland exept for minor handouts and a handful of volunteers. Instead the US started to dump fricking assloads of free shit to the sovshit union
>and the Continuation War
Germany faltered and it was better to live as independents vs. be swallowed by sovshit
Winter War was over before the Lend Lease to the Soviets even started.
They didnt even have recoiless rifles back then for blowing up tanks in the woods
lots of ethnic Finns in America, and many of them did a leap year conscripted in Finland because baba told them from mother's milk that Finland needs defending
Just like how there was no way were able to push into soviet Karelia during WW2? Graphs about (on paper) manpower mean nothing, when we know Russian logistics can barely arm and supply the 200k troops they have in Ukraine. Neither side is never going to field a military force larger than 300k at any point, and the fact of the matter is Russia's logistics is entirely reliant on trucks and trains. There is literally three highways in the entirety of eastern Finland big enough for Russia to transport their troops and all the assorted supplies they're gThey would have to use the roads, which means hundreds of kilometers long columns like in the beginning of the Ukraine war, except we actually have the artillery, rocket and air power to turn that column into pink mist. Russia can't advance on Ukraine's flat plains, so i highly fricking doubt they can do in Finland.
Finland is not a giant frontline fight like Ukraine due to the shitty environment, there's no reason to assume Russia can leverage its advantages as easily as on a flat field.
>IF they get caught off guard
Yeah, IF russkies just happen to pull teleportation and invisibility technology out of their asses. Goddamn this board is full of morons nowadays.
What do you mean Russia can't just poof 300k troops and all their equipment into existence on the border without anyone noticing? The invasion of Ukraine wasn't preceded by literal months of troop build up on both sides, they just appeared out of nowhere the exact moment whatever news channel i first heard about it first spoke about it, bro.
Strategic ambiguity and a boy-cried-wolf approach with enough time could create an opening. Start massing tanks outside st Pete to encourage 175k western reservists to interrupt their cushy lives and sit in a trench in -40c weather and then sit there menacingly for a bit. Stand down, try again next year , probe for political weakness, give up if more sustained deterrence is put into place but if not talk big game about moving into Estonia and pull a bait and switch. Russia enjoys the advantage of a malleable populace content to stay on war footing and Finland would feel the price of having to commit to repeated, unnecessary build-up chicken games way more than Russia would.
Again, if you're still on the 'Russia is depleted' train you haven't been paying attention, and that line of thinking is the exact kind of miscalculation that would see a country get caught off guard
And you think the Finnihs populace would think twice about turning out en masse after being given a sorely needed reminder pf the sort of looting, murdering, raping, and torturing vatniks like to inflict on civilians?
Personally think they would very hapy to go sit in a tent time and time again while private conscriptovich starves to death on a cold floor to ensure that doens't happen to Finland.
Be honest; are you just projecting your own lazyness and cowardice on an entire nation, now?
I'm not going to dignify this bait with a proper response, all your misinformation is easily debunked with readily available public information
As other people have stated you're a fricking moron
But on top of you being a moron, everything you've said doesn't matter anymore because they're in NATO, so they now have millions of troops available and just a few hours away.
The absolute fricking delusion to think that Finns won't live in ice huts and drink human blood just to stop the pozziyan mongrel horde claiming another square foot of their land.
The absolute delusion to think the vatBlack person barbarians have more grit when this very board hosts 100+ video compilations of them killing themselves in the trenches.
Also, here's a funny thought; NATO armies actually pay and properly equip their troops. Send them off to a Finnish winter and it's a neat training exercise - frick, I got a buddy in the officer corps and he's bored out of his fricking mind most of the year, he would LOVE that shit.
>The absolute fricking delusion to think that Finns won't live in ice huts and drink human blood just to stop the pozziyan mongrel horde claiming another square foot of their land.
Finland is full of delusional fatties who think any notion of war is bad because they can't keep gorging on pizza and beer, fifth columnists who think pozziya good because of cheap vodka and hookers, and women who refuse all notion of self-defence
That said our military still isn't as bad as most Euro nations
Add to this the fact that the distace between Vyborg and Turku is like 500 kilometers with several large cities in the way, including fricking Helsinki
Lmfao defeating Finland was off the table before, now it's literally impossible.
The strategic depth that the alliance with Sweden gives means that for all intents and purposes they can move their troops to the moon for reconstitution. On top of that Sweden literally have their own MIC with their own fighter program, which by all accounts is very formidable and it will be supplemented by NATO intelligence and air control assets.
So the air war is instantly lost, logsitics are now too vast and deep to ever be cut, and never forget that it's fricking Finland and we know how pozziyans invading there works out.
Does anyone have the infographic of NATO vs russia equipment as of February 2024? Thanks in advance.
Step 1: unfrick Russia's Banana Republic-tier legal/political system
Step 2: use new-found anti-corruption measures to unfrick Russia's Gulf State-tier economy
Step 3: use new-found political and economic liberty to generate a wave of hope which will unfrick Russia's demography
Step 4: use new-found wealth, industry, and manpower to create a new anti-NATO powerbloc that can generate sufficient economies of scale to maintain more than 8 Su-57s
Step 5: use my Gen 6 or 7 fighter-bomber fleet to clear the air and water of non-Russian forces
Simple as
>Gen 6 or 7
I think you are drastically underestimating the time it would take to unfrick Russia.
I could do it in three afternoons, but Vlad keeps declining my calls.
>DEPLOY NOW JVPITER, I FRICKING DARE YOU !
Someone needs to take this picture, frame it, put it on a table in an empty room with those candles with saints on them, with an AK on each side or some shells. One of those slav tribute displays.
Give it long enough timeline there will be a Trinity of Nemtsov, Prigozhin and Navalny with some snow Black folk doing their church worship around in a few generations
They might be praying in Chinese, but they will still be quite drunk
Like Stalin ?
For this to work, you would have to systematically annihilate the entire country and begin again
Yes.
>political and economic liberty to generate a wave of hope which will unfrick Russia's demography
Not sure that would work
Most first world countries have those liberties and they are demographically fricked too
There a very few ways to fix the demographics of any country imo
>Mass immigration (Line goes up, but the country is screwed long term)
>Banning birth control (''worked'' in Communist Romania; but kids ended up in terrible state orphanages since the parents were too poor to take care of them)
>Spread religious fanaticism (Orthodox israelites are already becoming the majority in Israel because the other sects don't have enough kids)
All true, BUT there is reason to believe that Russia's fertility rate could be recovered by those liberties for three reasons:
1. Less gangsterism means more security means more people are comfortable having kids and raising families
2. More economic well-being means its easier for people to justify having and affording children
3. Better political and economic conditions means fewer young people migrating to richer countries and maybe having their children there
Then there's also the immigration pull 'line goes up arguments but you already covered that.
The tough thing about industrial fertility rates is that no one has an idea on how to fix them. The only correlation that exists with high fertility is female social agency, commonly referred to as 'median female education attainment', and short of turning the clock back on feminism by 200 years, with female consent, that isn't a solution. Even Hungarys solution of basically bribing women to have three children didn't do anything more than bring Hungary's fertility rate back up to about replacement level.
> Russia's fertility rate could be recovered
It might increase it somewhat but it would probably be still on par with EU nations (So still fricked)
Developed nations like South Korea and Italy have even lower birth rates than Russia; and on the other hand a poor shithole like India breeds more than ''happiest in the world'' Scandinavian countries
>Then there's also the immigration pull 'line goes up arguments but you already covered that.
This is also a temporary solution at best; if immigrants ''assimilate'' (Which you'd theoretically want them too) they will be affected by whatever is stopping the locals from breeding
>short of turning the clock back on feminism by 200 years,
Yeah i think that might be the only solution
In a scenario where you are in charge of Russia you could potentially pull it of; since you already have a structure in place to control people
Granted not even Iran's birthrate is that good
>Even Hungarys solution of basically bribing women to have three children
This might work but pherhaps more extreme; no retirement or gibs for people who don't reproduce
Anyway if i was in charge of Russia the main priority would be increasing the birth rate somehow; in the long run the first power to do that wins (At the end only rivals left are even shittier backwaters that breed more and dying boomer nations)
https://vxtwitter.com/paulmcleary/status/1762848086152421393
Czech defense policy chief, Jan Jires, brings the heat:
"Some crucial segments of the European defense industry are now performing better than US defense industry....Rheinmetall in Germany is producing way more 155 artillery shells than the entire US defense industry combined."
Yeah, this reminds me of that quote "I fear all we have done is to awaken a sleeping giant and fill him with a terrible resolve."
The Europeans DO KNOW how to wage war. Just because they have been sleeping like a beauty for the past half a century doesn't mean that they have forgotten. And if you wake them up and give them a reason to genuinely start arming themselves, shit might get real ugly surprisingly fast.
that still leaves Expal and the Aussie factory to pick up the slack, not to mention NAMMO
I won't be satisfied until the EU is outproducing South Korea
>shit might get real ugly surprisingly fast.
It better. Someone needs to pick up the slack.
This time the starting positions of the pieces are great compared to WWI and WWII. Only good things can come out of this. Feel free to quote me on that once the world is a frick.
It fills me with a warm fuzzy feeling knowing Europeans are finally starting to gain some sense back into themselves. EU has been the most successful peace project in history, no one in Europe aside from Russia wants war, but it also made everyone except few nations like Finland too soft. Glad that we're finally fixing that part.
and as america's influence fades when Trump is elected, Europe will get to flex its fully military muscle bordered by Easter European countries itching for payback.
Please do. I want to see more liveleak videos of Euros dying in agony
>extremely brown hands typed this post
Black, actually; its from gunsmoke
Absolutely no one on this world wants a militarized imperialistic europe besides some hawks from the old continent dreaming of the good old days.
That's a great way to get ganged up by the other Great Powers. China, India, Russia, and the USA will have a very big say in this process if it ever begins.
>That's a great way to get ganged up by the other Great Powers.
>China
Lmao
>India
GOOD MORNING SARS PLEASE DO OF NEEDFUL WE ARE GREAT POWER YES
>Russia
Lmfao wake me up when they're able to defeat one of their neighbors
>and the USA
Uh... why?
delusion moron thinks America wants Europe weak when the last 2 decades has been America literally begging Europe to fund their militaries
Ever heard of... balance of power? What do you think happens if another super state - especially one with a long history of genocide and colonialism - is added to the mix?
Based moron, laying it on too thick, no one here gives a flying frick about those things
this is a reminder that there is no better alternative to being part of the american hegemony, we might have trannies and homosexuals but it is still better than being russian or chinese
>democracy is non-negiotable.
being american means informing yourself in order to not blindfully hate
too bad a significant number of your population is being indoctrinated to think isolationism is in their favour
that's overblown domestic politics, the republican party is seething about the border because it's the only issue they can run a president on. there's no "peaceful protests" like there were in the past to drum up a boogeyman
What value does the USA derive from running global security? How does that value compare to the expense? Can that value be substituted by other means?
I'll answer for you:
>trade relations and resource access to global markets allows the US to swiftly and cheaply import virtually anything they want for almost no cost
>this is achieved at the cost of $800 billion per year in defense spending on top of tens of billions of dollars of international bribes and discretionary spending, as well as domestic economic dislocation from lack of import tariffs
>luxury goods such as French wine or Italian cars cannot be replaced fully, but domestic production can come close. Dirt cheap foreign manufacturing can be found in countries like Columbia and Venezuala, which are much closer and have less baggage than India or Indonesia
tl;dr the USA spends tons of money that it doesn't have to maintain access to top-tier luxury goods and international influence that supports global endeavors. From the POV of a Paradox player, it's bad to ket that go. From the POV of the guy footing the bill, its a joke
You're being a moron. The point of NATO is to prevent nuclear proliferation by bringing countries that have very clear and justified reasons to desire nukes (i.e. Eastern Europe) under the US nuclear umbrella, thereby keeping nukes under US control. Remember, you aren't dealing with thirdie countries that are only a couple of generations removed from mud-huts here, the Europeans can start building nukes tomorrow if they want to.
That sounds like a job for an international agency to enforce international non-proliferation treaties. But even this answer builds on the previous, because the US is shouldering the burden to prevent international incidents for free
Because literally no one else will, some one has to be the responsible one, thank your gods its America
I'm sure all the defense spending is done for the benefit of foreign countries and not the USA's, like. at all. no sir
Remind me of the proportion of Middle Eastern oil that goes to the US
We also make people use USD by buying their crap using bonds. They have to be invested in the US or else they don't get paid.
only Jeb! should get Kaliningrad. From Sea to Shining Sea.
!
you have no idea how unintentionally funny this picture is to any slav speaker
Let them settle in then subtly program all their men to be gay and their women to frick blacks, while encouraging unlimited migration into their public services and let women vote.
They pretty much program themselves you'd just need to keep pointing it out
So people either see you as an alternative to this or lean hard on it saying any opposition to it is treason to their values (The enemy hates it, so it must be good!)
Also work hard on removing those problems from your country while you are it (Russia is failing this)
>POOLS CLOSED
uh, we uh didn't want it uh anyway
Sell Kalingrad and St. Petersburg to the Poles and Finns respectfully. Then I watch as the HIV rates skyrocket.
Promote radical communist ideology, racial agitation, class envy, and sexual fetishization of gender roles as appropriate for children. Then I'd attack the people pointing this out as in league with me.
What's the "realist" cope for this?
If I were expecting imminent war, I would send the whole fleet out to sea before the enviable blockade is put in place. I would order them to cause as much havoc on NATO supply lines before getting sunk. Hopefully they can cause some trade disruption before being destroyed.
sevastopols closed due to RAIDS
Best post in /k/ since 2014-02-20
first idea that makes sense, they even have such plentiful aids-reserves as to make it more than a joke
Like Ukraine did - drones, a lot of naval drones. Very cheap, very effective, everyone would be shitting themselves and civilian vessels would leave ports only in heavily guarded convoys. Any Nordic naval commerce would basically cease to be.