>Britain’s armed forces are too weak to fight Russia and cannot rely on the US in the event of a European conflict, MPs have been told.
>The UK must step up production of munitions now to prepare for a “window of vulnerability” in about 2026-2028, when the US could be distracted by a Chinese invasion of Taiwan, military experts have warned.
>They said a recent £11 billion increase in defence spending was not enough and ministers should commit 3 per cent of GDP if they wanted the British armed forces to be ready to fight in Europe later this decade.
>Simon Anglim, a military historian at King’s College London, told the defence committee that the British Army could field only one “understrength” division made up
How will the UK reform it's military to become a competent self sufficient force? Should the UK follow in the footsteps of the Poles in order to regain its ability to independently project power or is it even necessary seeing how poorly the Russian military has performed?
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/british-army-too-weak-to-fight-in-european-war-mrm2sk839
Good. I do hope that war serves as kick in the butt to western politicians, reminding them that in the end nations dont just need a token expeditionary force, but a proper mass of meat and iron to fight in actual war, and industry base to pump out more in case of need.
It almost makes me wish for ukrainian defeat, just to drive the point home - frickers need to realise that their own ass is indeed on the line.
At least eastern europeans seems to have gotten the memo for whatever good it makes.
>MPs have been told
>Experts have warned
>Simon Anglim
Just more military begging used as clickbait headlines
But yes, it would be nice if they spent that much on European defence
Britain isn’t america. If our military says we’re fricked it’s because we actually are. Yanks in Iraq called our squaddies “borrowers” because they’d pinch your grenades because they didn’t have any. The British economy is also pretty fricking dire and doesn’t show much hope of reform any time soon, so 2% of that really doesn’t get you much.
Anon, its economy is not so dire it can't afford basics, it just means it has a far too low an infantry force number
Your anecdote about grenades is nice and all but it doesn't prove anything.
MoD, a bunch of lying beggers asking for more gibs for them programs. Just give them the funding and tell them to frick off.
Thank you Tony Blair
>"One defence expert has questioned the government's plan"
They do that all the time, though.
>Take over countries and build a massive empire
>Empire falls and the people who you once ruled over now view you as cruel
>Import these people who despise you
>Make these people the centre of pop culture
>Be a fat and old c**t (you rule over the country but why would you put in any work? It's not like you will experience any of your work)
>Make sure cost of living is through the roof, make the situation for young people utterly hopeless
>Instead of treating our army like soldiers, treat them as individuals and give those with desirable traits promotions based on their traits
>Give no incentives to join the armed forces
>Treat everyone working for you like shit, act like a dragon on top of your wealth and over work your people because you refuse to do your job properly
>Have one night stands and drugs be the forefront of popular culture
>Get to the point where waving the national flag in public is seen as some white nationalism
Oh gee I wonder why we have a shit army, I guess young people are just so unmotivated
Aptly put, add to that the government seems to care more about immigrants and their rights than the native/citizens as well as constant race baiting and shitty politics endemic in our media now, it's no surprise no one cares about the military.
The current government objectively doesn't give a shit about immigrants rights. But only because they don't give a shit about anyone's rights.
>Have one night stands and drugs be the forefront of popular culture
This and 'cheeky banter' has been a disaster
What does this have to do with MOD procurement?
the nation has a lot of things that need fixing. MoD procurement (very aptly summarised by
) is a symptom of a greater malaise.
Military spending is important, but at the moment it's "let's give billion-pound contracts to whichever arms company has managed to poach the ex-official with the most pals in the MoD. And let's spend some more money on whichever auditing/management consultancy firm isn't currently sitting in the naughty corner to tell us what a good idea it was. Until the project overruns by a decade and comes in 3x original cost estimate."
Not a fan of chucking good money after bad. But equally not that optimistic that anything will change.
>Empire falls and the people who you once ruled over now view you as cruel
They mostly don’t. Most like us enough they that they’re happy to remain subjects of the crown and/or join the commonwealth. You sound like you must be a projecting Frenchman or Spaniard.
yeah, join the commonwealth, join the english people on their very own soil even
So this has nothing to do with being able to defend the homeland but rather to wage a war in another country? I mean, its cool if they want to spend for that ability (as a burger I'm comfortable relying on the British to share that) that's cool and they should do it. But its not an existential threat or anything if they aren't capable of doing that. All America asks is that each nation be able to strongly defend themselves and provide token expeditionary forces for coalition signaling purposes. That's it. Yet still half of you fricks can't manage it. But of all the countries to go after over this, UK has got to be oe of the last; they have argiably the second greatest expeditionary force projection in the modern world despite not even being in the top 20 by pop size. Absolute pants on head moronic.
The equipment is absolutely fine, some of the best in the world. The problem is in the numbers. There's not enough kit and even if there was there's not enough men to use it. Not sure how you solve that problem though, seems every military is experiencing a recruitment crisis.
>Should the UK follow in the footsteps of the Poles
Meaning?
>some of the best in the world
Out of curiosity what are you referring to
Definitely not the Army's, lmao. Challenger 2 was very good 20 years ago but is outdated these days (same with AS90), and Warrior and the rest of the mechanised fleet were past their best in the 90s.
Before you two start slap fighting, there is something like 200 countries in the world currently.. If whatever piece of equipment is in like the top 10 let's say, that means by most reasonable definitions of "one of the best" (95th percentile) it will qualify. If that isn't acceptable to either of you, I suggestyou both agree to shared terms before you start screaming past each other.
I'm not even bothering. Have a sneaking suspicion who made this thread and why. I've said my piece. The problem lies in the numbers, the equipment is more than adequate.
>I'm not even bothering
>I've said my piece.
Fair enough
>the equipment is more than adequate.
Largely true. Y'all need to unfrick your navy but you already started on that so now its just a matter of follow-thru.
There's a bizzare assumptiont hat the UK should reform the BAOR whilst maintaining its global air and naval capacities along with the CASND
No other European military has anything approaching our naval commitment, let them do the heavy lifting on land.
I do agree we should collapse the Army ORBAT down to the point where we have 1 heavy division and 3 light battalions for overseas deployments.
The whole medium weight strike concept is a waste of time as it doesn't let you take the glory, or give you a seat at the table with a coalition.
Recruitment is culture based
People join combat arms because they want action, if the prospect of being a mercenary isn't there, why the frick would anyone sign up
Surges are easy to create, the government simply doesn't want to beat the drum of nationalism
>via 9gag
>Downsizing to 70k troops and 128 tanks
State of bongerland
LOL
russia can't even beat a neighborhood poor nation, they are a joke
not like anyone's going to come after this
>stoke on trent
come on mate thats like making fun of detroit
To be fair you could say the same about any post-industrial city, and the UK (formerly one of the biggest industrial powers in the world, remember) has far too many of those.
once a critical fraction of pakis is achieved, this place will become paradise
>Potato on the roof
Kek
But also that's probably the worst street I have seen in bongland outside of maybe some very small streets in Birmingham, it's a rear garden path in a poor area that was probably an industrial town.
>Stoke on Trent
Ah
You can probably find worse images during the bin strikes or googling fly tippers if you went looking for shill images like that one.
>MPs have been told
>experts have warned
That aside, the whole shitshow in Ukraine has effectively crippled Russia's military for decades to come, so unless Germany or France suddenly decides to go chimpout mode I see no reason to be concerned regardless
The only realistic fight in Europe in the future is some kind of Balkan yugoslav shitshow or North African water shitshow
>Spend billions on a failed Ajax project that shakes it's occupants to death and whose greatest battlefield effect is to deafen the enemy as it approaches
>Make an absolute hash of the QE class with ramps and constant cost and time overruns. Forget that carriers need aircraft or how to into radar
>Make a destroyer that can't run in warm water
>Dreadnought nuclear submarines are constantly 10 years in the future, shitty Vanguards from the era of Mr Blobby should've been retired in 2007!
>Accidentally make Warrior IFV with a gun that lack stabilisation, spend millions to correct this problem then pull the plug before anything sees a factory. We STILL fricking use these because 'le prioritise changed'
Frick off. We've bunged MOD enough money over the past few years and every time they piss it up the wall.
Initially I was going to agree with you about no threats being on the horizon but then you laughed at the French chimping out. I bet they would be incredibly gay if they see their chance.
>if they see their chance
What does that even mean? Do burgers really think France would randomly attack its neighbors?
im not sure what he meant by this but i think he meant that the french would be incredibly gay if they saw their chance which is something i think makes sense
Sorry anon but that money is needed to pay for boomer pensions and dingy people
No chink or russian has ever called me a gammon , and what is it worth fighting for anymore here
Literally can't and won't until it is too late, just like WW2.
Everybody just wants more of muh welfare state and the govt will keep taxing for it and still have to print funny money.
the UK needs to import more africans and pakistanis or else they just wont have the manpower to keep their armed forces going and Great Britain will simply cease to exist.
People need to temper their expectations of England. They're not an empire anymore and they're barely even a first world country anymore, and they're only on track to get worse.
I don't know why anyone would expect them to have a decent military now just because they did when they were wealthy and ruled half the earth
There hasn't been a military disaster big enough for people to reconsider that yet, and they haven't noticed the absolute state of the country.
>cannot rely on the US in the event of a European conflict
Shame the UK would veto and rail against any talk about forming an EU military.
I mean most other EU countries also did but I can't be smug about Brexit failing if I acknowledge that