I think everyone with an IQ higher than room temperature can tell the early parts of Dragon Ball are filled with references to old Chinese shit even if they aren't familiar with the references themselves
They're for signalling to your commanders. If I point red fan up attack if I point blue gpfan up retreat etc.
The weapon variant was just to smuggle heavy sticks into no fun zones. Sort of like a self defense pen. Not really useful but at least you have something.
Yari samurai suck, Yari ashigaru might be busted, but Yari samurai just can't compete with anyone. Katana samurai melt them because the huge discrepancy in attack means they chew through the Yari samurai, basically negating their defense, while the spearmen don't have enough attack to regularly kill them, and Naginata samurai frick them up too because they're just slightly better in both attack and defense with massive armor. Yari samurai have like no redeeming qualities.
you gotta use the charge ability. I usually put them on the flanks to intercept cavalry and flank the enemy line if they're able to. Most units will get wrecked by being stuck in a yari wall and having a yari samuri charge them in the back.
also, yari ashigaru aren't busted. Maybe from the AI's point of view, since they really don't play the moral factor so in defensive battles you can just let your yari walls chew up the AI. But really the moral is how you defeat yari ashigaru (and the whole army in general) not slaughtering them all (except of course your cavalry after the battle).
Think of yari ashigaru more as area denial, like a barbed wired mine field, rather a fighting unit.
They're okay for that mobility, but if you're going for flanks like that, Cavalry function better (as they get +5 melee defense) or using some other unit like Katana samurai to keep stuck in. The problem is Yari samurai really, really struggle to keep up with most anything except maybe a bow unit in a protracted battle. Their mobility helps, but unless you can back them up with unit with better sustain or killing power they're gonna fall apart. Not saying that strategy doesn't work, it's just there's better guys for the job.
also, yari ashigaru aren't busted. Maybe from the AI's point of view, since they really don't play the moral factor so in defensive battles you can just let your yari walls chew up the AI. But really the moral is how you defeat yari ashigaru (and the whole army in general) not slaughtering them all (except of course your cavalry after the battle).
Think of yari ashigaru more as area denial, like a barbed wired mine field, rather a fighting unit.
Yari ashigaru are totally busted. They're stupid cheap with high model count (meaning they retain strength for longer periods of time as casualties mount), they do have morale and fragility issues, but you can play around these with veterancy, province boosts or generals. The big thing is Yari wall does two huge things.
Number 1: Yari wall negates (or completely reverses) charge bonus. Normally in Shogun 2, a charge gives a unit an attack bonus equal to it's charge bonus (increasing hit chance significantly) and also completely ignores a unit's melee defense (which reduce hit chance) for a few seconds fading away until it hits 0. Yari wall stops that.
Second: Spears are physical, blocking objects. Yari wall puts those spears up front and allows the ashigaru free attacks on units while preventing them from approaching the spear wall. This is best noticed on the Oda long yari ashigaru.
On top of all this, the Yari ashigaru get a decent cavalry bonus so they can swarm and keep up with cav units that get stuck in with, as the units anti-cav bonus seems to apply both to melee defense and to-hit.
Sorry, I need to rectify something I said with Cavalry, it's not +5 melee defense; it's a hidden +5 melee attack modifier against infantry. This does apply to all infantry units (including anti-cav) but the anti-cav bonuses spear units get against them generally completely negates (and then some) their anti-infantry boost.
I forgot to mention, the benefit of having yari samuri flank, is that you put them at the flanks of your own line, not only good for anti cavalry, but if the enemy has a longer line, they can still just fight like normal yari, but are better at flanking, charging and attack than ashigaru if they get the chance.
yeah that's kind of how spears work lol. Just through your spears against there's and work out a way to flank.
This is true, but they crumble real fricking fast if you attack from any angle other than directly into the spears and they get shot to bits by archers and guns
Where the yari ashigaru really shine is on the campaign map, because their cost effectiveness is off the charts when used properly and they are recruitable for cheap everyone from turn 1
3 months ago
Anonymous
Oh yeah, I won't lie and say they have no downside; just that their downsides are pretty easy to play around. Making them indispensable, on top of all the strategic benefits they offer.
Morale is countered by higher veterancy and having a general nearby, among province boosts where applicable and whatever else you have going for your clan. Vulnerability to flanking is handled with clever placement and good positioning. Though this is the weakness you're most likely to see because nobody's perfect.
Yeah, realistically they would. I really want to like Yari samurai as a spear simp. But the problem is you pay twice the amount as a yari ashigaru for a really weird niche role of like, mobile anti-cav at the expense of getting bodied by everyone else. It's a really bad trade off they get handed. The best thing you can do with them is ambush other units, tie up units ahead of your mainline (rapid advance does make them the fastest foot unit in the game) or circle around your mainline after butting heads with the enemy.
Only half true. In vanilla they are the best anti-cav unit in the game. The problem is Yari ashigaru do that nearly as well with half the cost, higher unit counts and with yari wall on top of everything. Their melee defense just doesn't justify their melee attack, because it's beaten out by anything that isn't an ashigaru; and while it is the most important survivability stat in a protracted melee fight, their poor melee attack means the fight will go on longer. The only saving grace they have in that respect is fatigue being bugged for infantry, and not impacting their stats like it does cavalry.
So, how the stats interact with each other is I believe there's a base hit chance for every model in a melee; every so often the game rolls "initiative" between the two and the winner of that roll attacks. Their melee attack adds to the hit chance and the opponents melee defense reduces the hit chance at roughly the same rate. Charges ignore melee defense and provide a boost to melee attack and gradually fades away over the course of a few seconds. Anti-Cav provides a boost to both Attack and Defense equal to it's value, where Cavalry get a hidden +5 vs all infantry (including anti cav units)
So, looking at (base) Yari samurai stats:
attack 6
Defense 8
Oh, and since I didn't mention armor. Armor provides a secondary save against any incoming attacks, as every unit in Shogun 2 has a single hitpoint per model any successful attack will generally kill it. It's most effective against ranged attacks, but still provides some benefit in a melee fight. As I've said earlier in the thread however, not all arrows are the same. Bow cavalry arrows have less penetration than ashigaru arrows, which are weaker than Daikyu or Bow monk arrows.
It's less important in this case since both samurai have the same armor values, making them equally resistant to arrow fire; though the Yari samurai have a slight edge because they have rapid advance which lets them close the gap sooner.
I always make the blacksmith in their home province an armorer and that tends to work out pretty well. Bulletproof or naginata samurai are also great with the armorer because you can use them to shield your nodachis and then charge in once you're close enough.
I see too many people go sword smith with the nodachis, but they're already deadly enough without any buffs so there's really no point in it.
since this is now just a shogun 2 thread. Is there any mods to nerf cannons in FOTS? It kind of ruins the late game when even parrot guns will just frick everyone up, but I have to have a few in case the AI does. I also want to play on higher difficulties, but am afraid the AI will start using the busted cannons.
Also for the people saying yari ashigaru are busted. Cannons in FOTS are fricking BUSTED
Just don't recruit them then. You can win battles just fine without them. As for AI cannons, you can usually trick them into deploying somewhere where they can't impact the battle if you charge your general into their range and then retreat back to your lines.
For sure, armor is the best thing to give Nodachi samurai second only to veterancy levels and melee defense, since their super low armor and super low melee defense means they tend to get fricked up by arrows and start struggling in a protracted fight. I will note, armor is second to melee defense in that regard; you get less of a "save" chance in melee from armor than you do against arrows; and not all arrows are made equal.
Man I can NEVER predict when a /k/ thread will randomly turn into a Shogun 2 thread but I always welcome it when it does. Are there any definitive fixes for the fricking gun ai? I think matchlock guns are cool as shit but im so sick of them just sitting still doing nothing in a battle because a dandelion or something is in their way and counted as an obstruction to their shot
since this is now just a shogun 2 thread. Is there any mods to nerf cannons in FOTS? It kind of ruins the late game when even parrot guns will just frick everyone up, but I have to have a few in case the AI does. I also want to play on higher difficulties, but am afraid the AI will start using the busted cannons.
Also for the people saying yari ashigaru are busted. Cannons in FOTS are fricking BUSTED
Idk any mods but they're not really busted, thats just kind of how artillery was irl. If you look at casualties for 90% of black powder battles a majority of them always come from artillery
Question because we're talking about beatin' sticks: Where to look for a good, 6-flange mace? Ain't gotta be fancy, just durable. Wasn't impressed with MuseumReplicas'. Also, one piece construction would be a bonus.
Europeans were so cringe. 3x times Shoguns warned Christians not to evangelize. And they kept going like Johnny Somali. Then Shogun snapped and threw them into volcanoes. Then Modern Hollywood movies demonize Shoguns. Meanwhile secular Dutchmen followed rules and could continue having town in Nagasaki for trading.
Generally fans are used to give orders or signals, but depending on the type of fan they could have secondary functions. The folding style ones also functioned as small shields or bucklers that could deflect arrows or catch swords while the solid ones functioned more like a mace but could also be used to parry swords and protect from arrows.
>TF2 weapon >only Shogun 2 references in thread
While this may be a crossover from TW: Shogun 2, the FoW is a surprisingly good scout melee in the right hands, although it is worse than the Wrap Assassin or Fish.
That's probably because they were actual weapons as much as any solid piece of metal at the end of a stick, or even the ones that were a screen of folding pieces of metal.
turn fire mountain back into mountain
don't worry anon, I appreciate that reference
I can't believe Ox let his little girl run around in such a skimpy outfit.
Gokubro or Bejitabro?
Gohanbro.
Holy shit Gohan's such a homosexual.
Just like me!
And I love him for it.
I can't believe a hermit with a pet turtle would spill soup on it
Most people can't actually appreciate the reference because they've never read 西游记 and think everything was just some goofy original idea by Toriyama.
I think everyone with an IQ higher than room temperature can tell the early parts of Dragon Ball are filled with references to old Chinese shit even if they aren't familiar with the references themselves
Sound really good smacked against someone's backside.
getting hit in the face with an iron or even wooden mace sucks so much israelite dick you'll avoid it like the plague
how the frick could you get a could hit when the air is doing literally everything possible to stop your swing?
Turn it sideways?
so just use a stick in war?
insofar as every mace is a stick.
As most nations have done, even superior Western ones.
More like a very blunt axe
Hold that thought while I get my cricket bat
turn sideways to bonk. block with face.
probably more useful as a signal
They're for signalling to your commanders. If I point red fan up attack if I point blue gpfan up retreat etc.
The weapon variant was just to smuggle heavy sticks into no fun zones. Sort of like a self defense pen. Not really useful but at least you have something.
>frick is this supposed to do?
Bonk
grandpa always called those "Black person knockers"
You slap yari samurai with it for being worse then the yari ashigaru.
Yari samurai aren't bad. Yari ashigaru are just OP.
>"YARI HE!!!!!!!"
This. Digit confirms. Yari sam are used as a mobile reserve to plug holes in your forntline and to protect genral from cav.
>having holes in your frontline
If you naginata samurai aren't instantly winning on contact, your bow monks probably were blocked from firing.
Yari samurai suck, Yari ashigaru might be busted, but Yari samurai just can't compete with anyone. Katana samurai melt them because the huge discrepancy in attack means they chew through the Yari samurai, basically negating their defense, while the spearmen don't have enough attack to regularly kill them, and Naginata samurai frick them up too because they're just slightly better in both attack and defense with massive armor. Yari samurai have like no redeeming qualities.
you gotta use the charge ability. I usually put them on the flanks to intercept cavalry and flank the enemy line if they're able to. Most units will get wrecked by being stuck in a yari wall and having a yari samuri charge them in the back.
I usually try to have 2-4 of them in an army.
also, yari ashigaru aren't busted. Maybe from the AI's point of view, since they really don't play the moral factor so in defensive battles you can just let your yari walls chew up the AI. But really the moral is how you defeat yari ashigaru (and the whole army in general) not slaughtering them all (except of course your cavalry after the battle).
Think of yari ashigaru more as area denial, like a barbed wired mine field, rather a fighting unit.
They're okay for that mobility, but if you're going for flanks like that, Cavalry function better (as they get +5 melee defense) or using some other unit like Katana samurai to keep stuck in. The problem is Yari samurai really, really struggle to keep up with most anything except maybe a bow unit in a protracted battle. Their mobility helps, but unless you can back them up with unit with better sustain or killing power they're gonna fall apart. Not saying that strategy doesn't work, it's just there's better guys for the job.
Yari ashigaru are totally busted. They're stupid cheap with high model count (meaning they retain strength for longer periods of time as casualties mount), they do have morale and fragility issues, but you can play around these with veterancy, province boosts or generals. The big thing is Yari wall does two huge things.
Number 1: Yari wall negates (or completely reverses) charge bonus. Normally in Shogun 2, a charge gives a unit an attack bonus equal to it's charge bonus (increasing hit chance significantly) and also completely ignores a unit's melee defense (which reduce hit chance) for a few seconds fading away until it hits 0. Yari wall stops that.
Second: Spears are physical, blocking objects. Yari wall puts those spears up front and allows the ashigaru free attacks on units while preventing them from approaching the spear wall. This is best noticed on the Oda long yari ashigaru.
On top of all this, the Yari ashigaru get a decent cavalry bonus so they can swarm and keep up with cav units that get stuck in with, as the units anti-cav bonus seems to apply both to melee defense and to-hit.
Sorry, I need to rectify something I said with Cavalry, it's not +5 melee defense; it's a hidden +5 melee attack modifier against infantry. This does apply to all infantry units (including anti-cav) but the anti-cav bonuses spear units get against them generally completely negates (and then some) their anti-infantry boost.
I forgot to mention, the benefit of having yari samuri flank, is that you put them at the flanks of your own line, not only good for anti cavalry, but if the enemy has a longer line, they can still just fight like normal yari, but are better at flanking, charging and attack than ashigaru if they get the chance.
yeah that's kind of how spears work lol. Just through your spears against there's and work out a way to flank.
This is true, but they crumble real fricking fast if you attack from any angle other than directly into the spears and they get shot to bits by archers and guns
Where the yari ashigaru really shine is on the campaign map, because their cost effectiveness is off the charts when used properly and they are recruitable for cheap everyone from turn 1
Oh yeah, I won't lie and say they have no downside; just that their downsides are pretty easy to play around. Making them indispensable, on top of all the strategic benefits they offer.
Morale is countered by higher veterancy and having a general nearby, among province boosts where applicable and whatever else you have going for your clan. Vulnerability to flanking is handled with clever placement and good positioning. Though this is the weakness you're most likely to see because nobody's perfect.
I know it makes sense for the game balance, but a bunch of samurai with giant spears would not have jobbed to samurai with swords
Yeah, realistically they would. I really want to like Yari samurai as a spear simp. But the problem is you pay twice the amount as a yari ashigaru for a really weird niche role of like, mobile anti-cav at the expense of getting bodied by everyone else. It's a really bad trade off they get handed. The best thing you can do with them is ambush other units, tie up units ahead of your mainline (rapid advance does make them the fastest foot unit in the game) or circle around your mainline after butting heads with the enemy.
OK but he's clearly talking about IRL compared to the game you obtuse Black
Did you not read the first part of my sentence where I acknowledge that, moron?
Yari Kachi are straight up good in FotS, equally effective on both the offence and the defence against a wide variety of targets
Yari samurai aren't bad, in that they serve a purpose. They just suck because anything they can do can be done better by other units, and cheaper.
Only half true. In vanilla they are the best anti-cav unit in the game. The problem is Yari ashigaru do that nearly as well with half the cost, higher unit counts and with yari wall on top of everything. Their melee defense just doesn't justify their melee attack, because it's beaten out by anything that isn't an ashigaru; and while it is the most important survivability stat in a protracted melee fight, their poor melee attack means the fight will go on longer. The only saving grace they have in that respect is fatigue being bugged for infantry, and not impacting their stats like it does cavalry.
So, how the stats interact with each other is I believe there's a base hit chance for every model in a melee; every so often the game rolls "initiative" between the two and the winner of that roll attacks. Their melee attack adds to the hit chance and the opponents melee defense reduces the hit chance at roughly the same rate. Charges ignore melee defense and provide a boost to melee attack and gradually fades away over the course of a few seconds. Anti-Cav provides a boost to both Attack and Defense equal to it's value, where Cavalry get a hidden +5 vs all infantry (including anti cav units)
So, looking at (base) Yari samurai stats:
attack 6
Defense 8
Vs
Katana Samurai
Attack 12
Defense 4
Oh, and since I didn't mention armor. Armor provides a secondary save against any incoming attacks, as every unit in Shogun 2 has a single hitpoint per model any successful attack will generally kill it. It's most effective against ranged attacks, but still provides some benefit in a melee fight. As I've said earlier in the thread however, not all arrows are the same. Bow cavalry arrows have less penetration than ashigaru arrows, which are weaker than Daikyu or Bow monk arrows.
It's less important in this case since both samurai have the same armor values, making them equally resistant to arrow fire; though the Yari samurai have a slight edge because they have rapid advance which lets them close the gap sooner.
it marks the target for eath
man I miss paddling the shit out of freshmen when I was in college
Killing spies
Usefull against
>BIG ROBOT!
Useful when the Australian is too busy filling up his jar of piss
Signal officers across the battlefield and also bonk the occasional flanker.
Give your team minicrits you moron, read the weapon description
Fan that you can use to bonk your moronic subordinate with when you're in your war camp
Lots of flags and fans were useful for signaling. In a time before radio and modern communications, it's real hard getting messages across.
fan the flames of war
spank naughty, naughty female soldiers
a violin plate? what does this have to do with weapons?
South Eastern winds? Zhuge Liang... He is... A DEVIL!
It's supposed to tell you which fat guy won
Imagine the smell, haha
That's not a fan, thats unironically a ceremonial rice paddle
It's a cutting board for cured meats.
>Frick this is supposed to do?
Give a good spank to a bratty lady
It's a signal flag. What do you think it's supposed to do?
>Hanzo Hattori: Die with it.
It’s Master Roshi’s pot holder, but threw it away after he spilled wonton soup all over it.
Keep your fireplace going through the night.
Gives you another action, you get your first one on turn 14, than you declare war just n the tokugawa house.
Hey, at least it's not a crutch.
>black box
>conch
>weeb sword
yep... it's solo pubbing time
>gets random critted
nothing personnel kid
Damn you guys talking Fall of the samurai? This gives me that total war itch.
>forming a spear line
>not just carving through your enemies with nodachi
TENNO HEIKA BANZAI
I love the Date and their nodachi samurai; but frick man that lack of staying power is brutal.
I always make the blacksmith in their home province an armorer and that tends to work out pretty well. Bulletproof or naginata samurai are also great with the armorer because you can use them to shield your nodachis and then charge in once you're close enough.
I see too many people go sword smith with the nodachis, but they're already deadly enough without any buffs so there's really no point in it.
Just don't recruit them then. You can win battles just fine without them. As for AI cannons, you can usually trick them into deploying somewhere where they can't impact the battle if you charge your general into their range and then retreat back to your lines.
For sure, armor is the best thing to give Nodachi samurai second only to veterancy levels and melee defense, since their super low armor and super low melee defense means they tend to get fricked up by arrows and start struggling in a protracted fight. I will note, armor is second to melee defense in that regard; you get less of a "save" chance in melee from armor than you do against arrows; and not all arrows are made equal.
Man I can NEVER predict when a /k/ thread will randomly turn into a Shogun 2 thread but I always welcome it when it does. Are there any definitive fixes for the fricking gun ai? I think matchlock guns are cool as shit but im so sick of them just sitting still doing nothing in a battle because a dandelion or something is in their way and counted as an obstruction to their shot
Not to the best of my knowledge but I'm not up to date on mods
since this is now just a shogun 2 thread. Is there any mods to nerf cannons in FOTS? It kind of ruins the late game when even parrot guns will just frick everyone up, but I have to have a few in case the AI does. I also want to play on higher difficulties, but am afraid the AI will start using the busted cannons.
Also for the people saying yari ashigaru are busted. Cannons in FOTS are fricking BUSTED
basically I just want a mod that will delet explosive shot and make all (at least land) cannons solid shot by default.
Idk any mods but they're not really busted, thats just kind of how artillery was irl. If you look at casualties for 90% of black powder battles a majority of them always come from artillery
There was a mod a while ago that just replaced rank fire with kneel fire from FotS, it worked great.
Question because we're talking about beatin' sticks: Where to look for a good, 6-flange mace? Ain't gotta be fancy, just durable. Wasn't impressed with MuseumReplicas'. Also, one piece construction would be a bonus.
>go christian
>never lose another naval battle despite overwhelming odds
Thank you southern savages
That thing looks goofy and heavy, whatever the hell it is.
However it reminded me of Polynesian war clubs, which are dope.
it's a fricking FAN, are you blind
slap dat ass
I always wondered what this thing was
Seems like he has no use for it considering all the jutsu in his arsenal
Bang
GLORIOUS WESTERN SHEET METAL, FOLDED 0 TIMES. CAN CUT THROUGH BOOLET AND BUTTER
Europeans were so cringe. 3x times Shoguns warned Christians not to evangelize. And they kept going like Johnny Somali. Then Shogun snapped and threw them into volcanoes. Then Modern Hollywood movies demonize Shoguns. Meanwhile secular Dutchmen followed rules and could continue having town in Nagasaki for trading.
Sorry ching chong but the Godlessness will stop.
>the Godlessness will stop.
Well, actually...
Japan will be empty of Japanese and they'll have no one to blame but themselves.
>Christianity coming to Japan vs Shoguns
>Main belief is worshiping israelites as chosen people
cringe
You will know them by their fruits.
>randomly seething about Christianity in a thread about a japanese fan
sounds like a mentally stable person to me.
It is their way.
Generally fans are used to give orders or signals, but depending on the type of fan they could have secondary functions. The folding style ones also functioned as small shields or bucklers that could deflect arrows or catch swords while the solid ones functioned more like a mace but could also be used to parry swords and protect from arrows.
>TF2 weapon
>only Shogun 2 references in thread
While this may be a crossover from TW: Shogun 2, the FoW is a surprisingly good scout melee in the right hands, although it is worse than the Wrap Assassin or Fish.
That's probably because they were actual weapons as much as any solid piece of metal at the end of a stick, or even the ones that were a screen of folding pieces of metal.
frick that shit
Kanabo is the GOAT
le BONK-desu