How the frick did France get BTFOd so hard by the Prussians (and the German Federation) in 1870?
France was worried by the prospect of a union of the various German states under Prussian leadership so declared war and invaded German territory in 1870. The Germans then proceeded to inflict the most humiliating defeat in European history on the French, who had more troops, were fighting on their home turf and were equipped with the most modern service rifle in the world, the Chassepot Rifle. This was far superior to the ageing Dreyse needle-gun the Germans were equipped with and had three times the range. Despite this the French lost all but am handful of minor battles, lost three times as many men and had their Emperor Napoleon III captured as well as their top generals. The war lasted six months but really it was over as a contest long before that, much of the six months was the Germans leisurely siege of Paris while the French tried to form a legitimate government to deal with them.
How did France go down so hard?
Artillery. Prussians had far superior steel artillery.
Literally what this anon said
it was all about artillery. The Prussian artillery was far more advanced, had more of them and actually utilized it the fullest degree. The French in comparison had outdated artillery and had too few to counter the Prussians, also the Prussian army went through a total reform prior to the start of the war. It's funny that the descendent of the guy who was the god father of artillery didn't even invest or use artillery.
Maybe that's what led France to focus on firepower as a military doctrine.
Artillery used to be France's thing in the Napoleonic Era. French artillery was the best and it allowed Napoleon to win so many battles
>It's funny that the descendent of the guy who was the god father of artillery didn't even invest or use artillery.
It isn't really his fault. He tried to reform the army but he couldn't. He faced too much internal opposition from the republicans, his power wasn't strong and he was sick (probably not long to live). He didn't even want the war, he knew France was not ready. His hand was forced by the republicans, that wanted the war (and even a french defeat) that would end the empire and so they would come back to power and reinstaur ethe Republic.
Even the german knew that, they were playing well, both before and after the war, backing the republicans. There are letters between Bismark and the german ambassador in France talking about backing the republicans and the Republic, that are seen as weak and instable, as opposed to the Empire.
also trains
this is a PrepHole thread, not /k/
>How the frick did France get BTFOd so hard by the Prussians (and the German Federation) in 1870?
Prussians/Germans had superior logistics and organization (better use of railways + general staff system)
>The Germans then proceeded to inflict the most humiliating defeat in European history on the French
it wasn't particularly humiliating, and I'm saying this as a German. It was a pretty fair and square victory, nothing extraordinary.
are you kidding? Fighting on your home soil you lose every battle, suffering 3x the casualties of the enemy and having your national leader captured and your capital surrounded within weeks of the outbreak of war (one you initiated)?
France did all of that to Prussia while they were literally ganging with Russia and Austria.
Auerstedt resulted in the complete reform of the Prussian institution (ironically largely based on revolutionary and napoleonic ones).
Yes, which was extremely humiliating, gave great credit to Napoleon, and shame on the Prussian state for laurel resting
>it wasn't particularly humiliating, and I'm saying this as a German. It was a pretty fair and square victory, nothing extraordinary.
It was literally the reason why they bend you over and fricked raw with treaty of versailles years later.
He said he's German so he's just being modest and eliminating all the excesses from German military history, so all German victories that have happened were pure and clean victories, nothing extraordinary. Fair and square.
Look at those beady eyes.
>bend you over and fricked raw with treaty of versailles years later.
Versailles had nothing on the peace treaty the Prussians/Germans imposed on France after 1870, why is it still considered as something extraordinarily harsh?
German post-WWI revisionism got mainstream in the English-speaking world.
Consider that the Versailles reparations were scaled according to the German economy's capacity.
In 1871, they demanded ALL of France's gold reserves to end the occupation, at once. In fact, it was so much it caused a drop in gold value in Germany.
>German post-WWI revisionism got mainstream in the English-speaking world.
Not only there, it's practically the same in French public discourse ffs. I remember that the 1871 reparations had the explicit aim of wrecking the French economy for decades, they were flabbergasted that they managed to pay them fully in record time. Meanwhile, Germany paid only a fraction of the reparation it owned (and those were much lower than they could have been). Probably even less than it gained from pillaging Northern France (its industrial heartland) during WW1 lmao. And that's without mentioning the self-destruction of the German currency in the 1920s out of sheer spite, that also got blamed on Versailles for some reason. Clown world.
The territorial losses were minor, in particualr the industrial power of Germany was basically untouched, allowing them to rebound from the war much more easily than nominal victors such as France.
Versailles was a shitshow, they should have gone more harsh on Germany instead of breaking up Austria-Hungary and creating a huge clusterfrick. A-H for all it's failures kept the region together and in peace and was not a direct threat to France or Britain. Instead of trying to destoy the KUK they should have let them off with minor concessions and enforced neutrality.
AH broke itself, it's the poster child of unsustainable empires (even more so than the ottomans). The peoples just wanted to leave
austria hungary collapsed on its own. the balkan was unsustainable for them and brought mroe probelms than benefits
Carving off great chunks of Germany along with their German inhabitants and giving them to foreign countries where the Germans were often treated badly was the real cause of resentment, not the money. Hitler launched WWII to regain Germany's lost territories, not some insane bid to conquer the world as portrayed by ~~*Western*~~ historians.
>Hitler launched WWII to regain Germany's lost territories, not some insane bid to conquer the world as portrayed by ~~*Western*~~ historians.
Do you live in some alternate reality where Generalplan Ost wasn't a thing?
Why did he start ww2 after England and France let him have that land back? Plus Czechosolvakia and Austria?
Germany never got Czechoslovakia. They got the Sudetenland and never wanted any Czechs. They were forced to intervene on Slovak behalf to ensure their independence.
The war was started by Poland.
>this level of blatant bullshittery
You don't happen to have russian ancestry by any chance?
Poland (military government) did not hand back Danzig - 95% German.
Listen, Danzig may be an butthole, a shitty homeowner, and a copyright troll, but he makes good music, so I wouldn't give him back either.
I didn't know he was 95% German either. Must be 1/20th demon
>revisionism
Is it though? From a glance the 1871 peace treaty seems far more limited in comparison. Doesn't help that currency comparisons are kind of shit and GDP, being from the mid 30s, is a pretty tough guess too.
Well sure they paid less than the treaty stipulated but that doesn't affect the terms of the treaty itself. A harsh treaty doesn't turn soft, nor does a soft one turn harsh, simply because you don't follow it or later treaties change things.
That isn't really an argument for it either.
>From a glance the 1871 peace treaty seems far more limited in comparison. Doesn't help that currency comparisons are kind of shit and GDP, being from the mid 30s, is a pretty tough guess too.
Because you're a dumb Black person comparing a 1 year relatively non destructive conflict with the gigantic shitshow that was WW1, where a single battle could see the use of a comparable amount of explosives to the entire 1870 conflict.
It might shock you to learn this, but reprations are meant to be commensurate to the damage caused.
Versailles is considered harsh because of the territorial losses.With some land given to countries that weren't even part of WW1 like Denmark.
France also openly supporting Poland in the Silesian Uprising in 20 and threatening with the occupation of the Rhine if they quell it didnt help either
What? The occupation of the left bank of the Rhine (by the Allies, not only France) was to serve as a guarantee for the reparations. It was yet another mirror to the 1871 treaty of Frankfurt. The difference is that Germany got coddled by the USA who wanted business to go back to usual, and so they managed to weasel their way out of it.
France threaten to occupy the Rhine IF Germany quells the uprising which Germany had all right to do because it was within their own borders. Weimar Germany didnt want to lack the payment so they didnt send the army.
The Rhineland was already occupied by 1920 and it had jack shit to do with any Polish insurrection, what are you talking about?
sorry the uprising was in mid 21 not 20
I'm just cinfused about why would France threaten to do something they were already doing for years at this point.
Wait, why wouldn't the treaty of Versailles be considered as more harsh? Just from looking at the wiki pages, I know I know.
In the treaty of Frankfurt the germans demanded:
>territories of Alsace and Lorraine
>5 billion francs
>occupation of parts until payment is fulfilled
The treaty of Versailles in contrast includes:
>ceding output of saar coal mines to france for 15 years
>plebiscite for saar area afterwards
>loss of Alsace and Lorraine
> loss of Eupen-Malmedy
>plebiscite of Schleswig-Holstein
>cessation of Easter territories to Poland, Lithuania and Czechoslovakia
>loss of the colonies
>demilitarization of the rhineland and destruction of all the forts in the area
>restriction of the army size to 100.000 men
>limit on the amount and type of manufactured arms
>15 year occupation in the west with staged reduction in 5 year intervals
>payment of ultimately 132 billion gold mark
While you can very well argue that Frankfurt was a harsh treaty, Versailles does sound a lot harsher in comparison
Currency conversion seems to be pretty awful for old currencies but I see nothing to indicate that 5 billion francs are similar amounts or more than 132 billion gold mark.
Germans are le evil, that's why everything they do is the worst crimes against poor france while everything france does is out of pure intentions and to secure a better future for everyone.
Talking to francophones is useless. Not to mention that france was the cause for pretty much every big european war eccept the 30 years war. Even ww1 only got as bad as it did because of muh revanchism. Without france sperging out after ww1 and basicaly demanding the abolishment of the german state (cooler heads prevailed in the post war "negotiations") ww2 could have been avoided. Versailles was a big help to hitler
>wawawa germany sperging out in ww2 was because France got mean after Germany blasted the country to shit for 4 years
See
This is vatBlack person tier revisionism.
Learn2read
France after the Franco-Prussian war still owned a huge part of the planet in colonies and didn't suffer global misstrust due to years of propaganda. Pointing out that the french behaved towards germany as they would towards an african kingdom or east asian one isn't revisionist.
France started shit. No one forced them to declare war on germany over russia wanting the balkans, yet they did and got their shit pushed in.
No at the time of the war France did not own a lot of colonies, rather the remains of the first empire (tiny islands and commercial outpost) + Algeria. Colonialism started after the war under Republican leadership to divert French nationalism from Germany/Prussia
>cooler heads prevailed
>basically admits that those cooler heads allowed g*rmany to ape out again
By that line of reasoning france wasn't limited/punished hard enough after napoleon as they started yet another stupid war out of literaly being butthurt over a letter
It wasn't
Neither was Germany after WWI
Both post-Napoopan France and post-Hohenzollern Germany should've been punished way harsher
They never paid 132 billion, rather barely 20 billions. Also Versailles wasn't harsh enough to spare us a second round
Yes, let's just rape them harder, that's sure to avoid another round!
It's not like the treaty was such shit that the rest of the world just watched as it was violated, because it was clearly too harsh anyway. MOAR PUNISHMENT
Look what it took to actually stop the German Sonderweg : WW2, drawn, quartered, occupied.
Yeah, that seems like a very sound plan after WW1, well done, anon!
Worked after world war 2
Vichy France is proof that the French should have been raped harder in WW1. Thank god it’s becoming part of North Africa now
No that's because Bismarck got pushed by his people into not giving Elsass Lothringen (which was kinda useless) away to France for eternal peace like they did with Austria.
It's cool to see a moderate German and who has a good view of the Treaty of Versailles. Personally as a French, the war of 1870 is very humiliating even if it can be explained by the errors of the general staff. This defeat is a typical product of the end of reign of an aging sovereign (see Louis XIV, Napoleon etc ...). The war was very hard because the French people didn't want to admit defeat and continued to fight until the end, which is to their credit.
not the same poster, I'm only the first one. Versailles was far harsher than 1871, that's a fact.
>that's a fact.
That's explicitely not true. Versailles ended up as a slap on the wrist compared to what it should have been, had it been anywhere close to Frankfurt.
>What it should have been
>t. Foch the frog homosexual
1871 was a mirror of Tilsit (but softer). The reparations were per Capita the same as Napoleon I demanded of Prussia. The territorial demands were minor. The occupation was there until payments were made and then they retreated in good order returning full sovereignty to France.
Versailles 1919 was an attempt at reducing Germany to an economic colony. Not only were the reparations far higher, the demilitarization of the Rhineland and the limiting of the army to a glorified border force implied that Germany should just produce things for France with severely limited sovereignty.
Heavy industry in Germany was severely dismantled and weapons development was made illegal.
If you think Versailles 1919 was softer than Frankfurt 1871 then you're a delusional moron.
Versailles was a way softer Frankfurt, with reparations not even aimed at crippling the post-war recovery because the Allies couldn't agree on most things. The occupation ended after years of Weimar Germany paying a fraction of what it owed (after the reparation total being slashed because Germany kept crying about its plight) and setting its economy on fire and starting an economic crisis with moronic passive resistance. 1871 crippled French steel and coal production, and Versailles didn't improve that much because Germany flooded every mine it could and stole every factory (blowing up whatever was bolted too solidly).
The reparations were slashed because it became clear that they were insanely high and it was impossible for Germany to pay them back.
The monetary demands were so insane that it literally disrupted the international economy and it was one of the major reasons the great depression even happened.
And it was not the Germans who destroyed all those mines, but the allied disarmament commission which dismantled most of the heavy German industry.
You're just one of those seething homosexuals filled with slave ressentiment for Germany
I can't tell if I'm being baited by a master of the craft.
Post war Germany paid back Versailles debts plus their WW2 reparations and rebuilt the country. Not to mention Versailles reparations was a small fraction of what Germany ended up spending on rearmament. Keynes was very wrong on his bad assessment of German economics capacity and that colored English language perception for a long time.
>plus their WW2 reparations
they didn't
>1871 was a mirror of Tilsit (but softer). The reparations were per Capita the same as Napoleon I demanded of Prussia. The territorial demands were minor. The occupation was there until payments were made and then they retreated in good order returning full sovereignty to France.
TOPLEL
This is what turkrauts actually believe.
Alsace and Lorraine, rightful french clay stolen, with an attempted genocide of its population to boot through forced deportation and replacement, which happened to my ancestors by the way, and then consecutive attempts at forced germanization for 47 years, to no avail and without success, thanks to the strong ongoing french spirit of the alsaciens and lorrains.
All that to in the end use even the most germoid'd of them as cannon fodder because despite the krauts telling them they were german, they were still considered not german enough.
Pic related, the people of Strasbourg rejoicing after the victory during their first 14th of July after 47 years of occupation, in 1919.
This.
>Alsace and Lorraine, rightful french clay stolen, with an attempted genocide of its population to boot through forced deportation and replacement
Before Napoleon it was part of the HRE, it's people spoke german and even in your pic the plaza is named after a german.
They spoke french because german was outlawed by paris (like all other minority languages in france).
Large numbers of settlers where encouraged to settle there like in a colony.
France and the french in general behave in the worst way possible and then pretend to be victims of getting punished.
If germans where realy that bad you would've gotten the poland treatment during ww2. Also you shouldn't pretend that you aren't dependant on them in everything
Germany and France should be unified again.
No more brother conflicts.
At the current state that would cause an insane chimpout from the french. And as the french are 75% nafris or colonials at this point europe would burn down. And without germany (and german companies like ziess) everything would just grind down,
Never gonna happen.
You've seen the "discussions" in this thread, there is too much inane shitflinging for that.
>Alsace and Lorraine, rightful french clay stolen,
Holy seethe, that doesn't even make any sense.
The duchies of upper and lower Lorraine were part of East Francia after the end of Lothringia with it's rulers being appointed by the holy roman emperors.
Alsace and Lorraine only fell to the french crown in 1766, following the war of the polish succession in 1735.
>yadda yadda
Strasbourg is the literal birthplace of the Marseillaise.
No one cares how many "o"s you shove into it, everyone knows why it's called Strassburg.
moron
>literally not an argument
By that logic paris would be rightful kraut clay if they composed a song there during the 40s.
Maybe
was right and all the
>versailles was a soft treaty
>perfidious germony
posters are just salty morons with a personal grudge. What next did some jerry drive over your pet or frick your crush?
>Alsace and Lorraine, rightful french clay stolen
before or after 1766, Mamadou?
>attempted genocide of its population to boot through forced deportation and replacement
France did all of that in Elsass and their attempt in the complete destruction of the Palatinate in the 9yr war. A war you started while all the main forces were busy with the Turks in Vienna. "Turn the Palatinate into a desert!" was literally your battle cry for it. I have no clue why Hitler had such a hard on for russians; you deserved their treatment the most if everything would be equal.
Ach zo Adolf Mehmet is very angry tonight. Now you're getting buttraped by the same turks but I guess it's the fault of France too, not of your stupid alliances.
Better luck next time kraut. Remember: third time's the charm.
btw Adolf hated the french more than anybody else, even israelites. In mein kampf he describes the israelites as a simple nuisance but the french as mortal enemies. Himmler wanted to genocide the whole region of Bourgogne in order to repopulate it with pure aryans of which he was a great representative as everybody knows KEK.
Anyway the only reason you are able to be that important as of today is because of french self-hating traitors that let you destroy everything great France has ever done during the 6 last decades.
Get ACK'd.
not him but its france thats getting ack'd atm
>Anyway the only reason you are able to be that important as of today is because of french self-hating traitors that let you destroy everything great France has ever done during the 6 last decades.
But the only thing france did since the 60s was to try and keep its crumblig, disfunctional "empire" together while attempting to turn the EU into an extension of it's will.
And even before that germany absolutly mogged france in the "good things invented/researched for the betterment of all humanity" department
>This is what germs actually believe
Ariane and Airbus are enough to prove you wrong.
Come back when you're one of the top 5 economies.
Germany won't be top 5 in a few years.
yeah due to germs being germs and wanting to repatriate everything at home.
The french wanted to do reusable for Ariane 6, but it is the germans who did not want something "too complicated" and to keep Ariane 6 "simple" aka old and outdated. Then they said it wasn't german enough and demanded the repatriation of most of the industrial base in Germany. Thanks to them Ariane 6 lost 3 years and now Europe has no heavy launcher since Ariane 5 is no more. Meanwhile Merkel and Scholz push for the german newspace, of course, paid for with ESA money of course.
So now some ESA projects like Callisto which is supposed to pave the way to Ariane Next, reusable, are contending against private german rocket projects.
The ESA has been successfully hijacked by germans.
France had been holding the whole ESA by itself for 30 years before that. And germans hate that. This is the sad truth.
Yeah.
The board of Ariane Group (all french) thought they could pull a Boeing and fire a whole bunch of their engineers back in 2018 which fricked them beyond repair for decades probably.
https://www.spiegel.de/wissenschaft/technik/alain-charmeau-die-amerikaner-wollen-europa-aus-dem-weltraum-kicken-a-1207322.html
^ some delicious french seethe at the americans for simply being better lmao
>Ariane
Completely unable to compete with SpaceX due to incompetent leadership (french)
Half of the company is german or located in germany anyways, if wikipedia is correct
Because Ariane was really just a front for maintaining ICBM motor institutional knowledge, that's why they're hard on for solids. Reusable rockets could be used for ICBM first stages but they're really not fit for purpose. A reusable rocket means liquid, usually cryogenic propellants, which aren't storeable like solids.
frenchoids really lack any self awarness calling others Mehmet while their country is (again) burning because of a bunch of dindus lel.
No, Germany ruined Europe and behaved like an butthole, it had to pay. The Treaty of Versailles was sabotaged by the Anglo-Saxons, that's a fact.
And do you have the same opinion on the franc-tireurs of the Peninsular War or the American Revolution?
The culture of corporal punishment of the Prussian army and the attitude of the Germans during the genocide of the hereros, the Boxer war, the war of 1870, WW1 and WW2 rather leaves me thinking that Germany was a more "cruel" country than the average European country. If not the first.
>fighting to the end is le bad
>surrender is le bad
OK
>fighting to the end is le bad
Yes, pissing your life away for literally no change in outcome is moronic. But I guess it meant less Fr*nchmen in the end so maybe they just a brief moment of altruism.
>t. Cur
I guess you never made a french surrender joke in your life then
>No, Germany ruined Europe and behaved like an butthole, it had to pay
Ah yes, the crime of getting war declared on for something happening to an ally.
WW1 didn't have to happen, the french could have just not decided to make a local conflict in eastern europe into the war it became. Remember, without france chimping out there is no need to go through belgium and england doesn't get involved either.
WW! is everyones fault, not just germanys.
>without france chimping out there is no need to go through belgium and england doesn't get involved either.
If Germany mobilised it HAD to swing west and smash the French through Belgium in a lighning campaign then swing east and meet the Russians otherwise they would be crushed. And Germany had to mobilise because Russia mobilised.
Mmmmmh
>July 28: Supported by Germany, Austria-Hungary declares a “preventive” war on Serbia.
>July 29: apart from the consultation provided for by the Franco-Russian military agreements, Russia declares partial mobilization against Austria-Hungary.
>July 31: German ultimatum to France.
>August 2: General mobilization in France. The German army invades the Grand Duchy of Luxembourg.
>August 3: Germany declares war on France.
>August 4: the German army invades Belgium to bypass the French army.
Germany begged AH not to declare war on Serbia. They were loyal to their ally. If anything blame the Russians and Serbs for being subhuman
>July 31: German ultimatum to France.
I love this one. The French had to let Germany occupate the fortresses of Toul and fricking Verdun to prove they didn't want war, basically opening the way to Paris through the east. Meanwhile the marching orders were already sent and the timetables couldn't be changed. Extremely subtle.
>WW1 didn't have to happen, the french could have just not decided to make a local conflict in eastern europe into the war it became.
How could France have done, the country was just being invaded. How to react accordingly? By making a guard of honor to the Eiffel Tower to the German army and saying "Take all the resources you need for the war against Serbia and Russia, the Germans deserve to dominate the world"?
>herero
It was literally a genocide and when France and the UK did just a tenth of that, opinion in mainland was pissed and the culprits punished. Not Belgium, it was the king's private property and that's where it went wrong.
>Boxer War
Hun_speech.jpeg
>1870
Napoleon reaped what he sowed, he was captured, the regime fell and instead of having a friendly democracy as a neighbor Bismark decided to make a mortal enemy of France forever.
>WW1
The central empires went into full autism war against everyone and massacred the peoples with whom they had a bad feeling (Serbia, Armenia, Anatolian Greece). Not to mention the looting.
>WW2
Are you trolling?
>Blaming Germany for killing Serbs, Armenians and Anatolian Greeks
Lmao
I wrote "Central Empires" and they actually caused the deaths of millions of civilians across Europe, Asia and the seas. But if you have sight problems or you can't read English I can't do anything for you.
>Germany only really wanted to declare war on Serbia, France and Belgium
Oh my bad
>The central empires went into full autism war against everyone and massacred the peoples with whom they had a bad feeling (Serbia, Armenia, Anatolian Greece). Not to mention the looting.
I can tell you're British because only they have such a moronic view of history
what is this meme even supposed to apply to?
Germany only really wanted to declare war on Serbia, France and Belgium
>What do you mean you won’t just let me declare war on your allies? Why are you attacking me after saying you’ll attack me?
Kaiser Wilhelm II was easily one of the dumbest geopolitical leaders of the 20th century. It’s hard to find someone who had such a terrible understanding of geopolitics as that German with one noodle arm.
Even though he screwed things up in about the worst way possible, I kind of appreciate his frankness with the other leaders and sticking to his alliance. De Gaul on the other hand was a massive pussy who didn’t even know about Overlord until the very last minute and then got to “liberate” Paris. Fricking gay frogs
>attitude of the Germans during the genocide of the hereros, the Boxer war, the war of 1870, WW1 and WW2
You're so full of shit that this has to be bait, but i'll bite:
>herero
Colonial wars always where deadly, the herero aren't the only ones getting massacred. Check what the brits, french, belgians, etc. got up to.
>Boxer War
Literally every western nation (and japan) participated and behaved the fricking same
>1870
Napoleon was no saint and that's what people measured against. France reaped what it sowed
>WW1
Escalation happened on both sides, but as the entende never got into germany they got less opportunities to ape out
>WW2
Here you might have a point if stalin didn't exist. You have to differentiate between the eastern front and western occupation.
Now kys
Les franc-tireur did do some really stupid shit that got (merited) german (over) reaction.
And would shape german thinking on military-civilian relations during an occupation for the worst.
>being too moronic to know when to give up is good
w e w Fr*g
Wish it was a bit more humiliating honestly. After your centuries of eastward expansion you finally faced a nation on equal footing and not some german micro states. Paying the Swedes to prolong the 30yr war and turning the Palatinate into a desert after you retreated shouldve been repayed equally by turning Paris into a parking space
Even the French navy, with hundreds of ships, failed to blockade German ports.
Was the Chassepot the first really modern rifle?
railroads. double railroads actually
>How the frick did France get BTFOd so hard by the Prussians
Blitzkrieg works better in France due to the existing infrastructure and proximity.
Didn’t the Germans use meth too? I can see how that would help fore muzzle loaders faster
>Franco-Prussian War
>muzzle loaders
Go back, moron.
The Prussians had the power of the hyperborean race soul on their side
>great great great grandfather was a landser in this war, his son a deaths head hussar, and even a literal storm trooper after
>2023, only male descendant with the last name is a frumpy transsexual
LOL
It happens. Only one family bloodline in the world is going to be the last one. Everyone else's must end eventually.
Krupp canons
Railways
Better trained army
Better generals
The war was over on the 2nd of sept btw, it really only lasted one month, not 6
There was a mix of causes
The Prussians and other germans manageged to mobilize faster so at the start of the war they had more men at the front.
They managed to concentrate their troops more
They had better plans and better trained officers
Better arty and logistics has already been mentioned
But one of the key issues is that the Germans for their glut of princes under arms and bismarck coming as an honorary major, left the campaign to the professional (also noble) officer core. While napoleon III was more hands on
>How the frick did France get BTFOd so hard by the Prussians (and the German Federation) in 1870?
Napoleon the III was not willing to have his men die. This is the real answer. Both sides had good small arms and training, the Gremans had longer range artillery but what ended it fast was the fact that Napoleon III was not willing to throw his own men into death like his famous namesake who bled France dry, He's one of my favourite people in history for that reason. On a side note, did you know his son died in the British Zulu wars ?
He was genuinely a good guy. Really believed in improving the lot of the workers and you can't understate his role in the creation of an Italian state.
The French were antivaxxers and lost upwards of 23.000 soldiers to smallpox.
Germany lost 297.
france under Nappy III was a shitshow
More than under the Restauration, IIe, IIIe and IVth republics?
France was baited into declaring a war it was not ready for, contrary to Prussia. Prussia mobilized way faster and had better logistics. Also they probably didn't expect Prussia to unite the whole Germany and reverse the balance of power.
The biggest failure is that they were completely without allies.
Britain/Hanover and Austria had lost against Prussia in 1866 but neither were willing to ally with France.
Britain probably didn't expect such a steamroll. The French army was supposed to be the best in the world at that time. If both France and Prussia could weaken each other, that would be a good thing.
Britain was cool with Prussia kerb-stomping their traditional enemy and imperial rival. It took a while before they realised this meant a major shift in the continental balance of power.
The Germans had a better mobilization plan. Their total forces were twice as large as the French and were able to move faster. Because of this they were able to slowly maneuver all of the French armies into Sneedan and were then able to capture them, including Napoleon III, who was leading them. This collapsed the government and therefore French resistance.
France was stagnant and corrupt in comparison to Germany. The military leadership was stagnant and learned the wrong lessons from their wars against Austria. Napoleon III was exhausted and unable to reform the French artillery. The Germans weren't perfect however, a few too many suicidal frontal bayonet charges against defending French infantry.
>G*rmanigs are posting
Disgusting!
>As a result, Napoleon demanded from Prussia a return to the French borders of 1814, with the annexation of Luxembourg, most of Saarland, and the Bavarian Palatinate.
lol, what were the french thinking
I know he was pressured by his parliament to demand that, so the ultimate blame lies on most french people
>thread succefully derailed!
The P*ussian menace is the reason for all of the wests current problems.
>French invent and use the first proper rapid fire weapon
>it sucks
the North German Federation was the legal successor state to the German Confederation, which itself was the legal successor to the HRE (leaving out the status of the Confederation of the Rhine).
Listen to me carefully. There was no such place as Germany or any participant in the Franco Prussian war called Germany. The state called Germany did not exist Do you understand?
thanks for your efforts anon
it's time for WE WUZ GERMANS to end
It is far better to think of the place that was called Germany after 1871 as the Prussian empire. Many German speaking states had little in common with Prussian culture, society or religion. By the time ww2 was over the Prussian empire had completely destroyed these German states and their peoples. The Prussian empire was a disaster for Europe and the world, particularly its creation of Marxism as a subversion tool growing from its practise of playing on social divisions to undermine German states that Prussian subsequently annexed and its virulent anti-Catholicism and militarism. A disaster for the other German speaking states, Europe and the world. It was Prussia that fatally wounded Austria, which was Prussians great rival and an infinitely better place and people than the Prussians.
Read up on Metternich and how Austria was never interested in a unified Germany. They wanted their status quo with the balkan apes, which cost them their empire. Germans woulve been infinitely more times more stable and loyal towards Austria but they had no interest; dont blame Prussians for taking the initiative
Are you claiming there is no link whatsoever between Prussia and the German Reich? That the Prussian aristocracy didn't dominate Germany after its creation? The same policies? And some of the post you link mention Prussia or are just talking other countries ffs.
So nobody is going to mention Dreyfus ...
Even Zemmour came out and admitted that he was passing all the military intelligence to germany.
Dreyfus was 12 years when the war started.
/pol/s absolute cluelessness while being smugly confident never ceases to amaze me.
Taht is factually wrong, Even if you go full nitpicking mode and cling to legalities: The War ended on January 28th 1871, the emperor of the second reich was proclaimed on January 18th 1871. The First constitution was dated January 1st 1871.
The German Empire was just an expanded version of the North German Confederation.
That has shot all to do with anything. The point is that it was Germany.
The point is that the North German Confederation already was Germany as was the German Confederation before that.
>nobody has mentioned Kriegsspiel
Prussians won by the power of /tg/ autism.
>how the frick did france get BTFO
shaky political and military leadership, ineffecient and undertrained artillery, and a volatile political landscape.
HOWEVER, some of those major german victories were dragged out not by overwhelming tactical superiority but by the germans being willing to ram their fricking head into things and die in droves to do it.
> Example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Mars-la-Tour#Von_Bredow's_Death_Ride
>To protect the German position, Alvensleben sent his chief of staff, Colonel von Voigts Rhetz, to Bredow with orders to silence Canrobert's batteries along the Roman road.
>Noting that "it will cost what it will", Bredow took care to organize the brigade, consisting of the 7th Cuirassiers, 13th Dragoons and 16th Uhlans.[55][56] The 13th Dragoons did not participate in the charge, having been detached earlier in the battle. In what would become known as "Von Bredow's Death Ride", the cavalrymen rode out from Prussian lines at 1400, Bredow using the depression north of Vionville and gun smoke to mask movements from French observers until the very last moment.[57] Erupting into view some 1,000 meters from the French lines, the Prussian cavalry charged in line into and through two French gun lines, killing French gunners and scattering Canrobert's soldiers in all directions.[57] Two brigades of Forton's French cavalry division, some 3,100 men, attempted to counter-charge into Bredow's flank and rear but were partially dispersed by Canrobert's infantry, who shot down any cavalry they could see without discrimination.[58] Bredow's brigade managed to extricate itself and withdrew to its own lines by 1500. The French cavalry did not pursue.[59] Of the 800 horsemen who had started out, only 420 returned.[56]
Other examples are german troops assaulting the french-occupied heights at Spicherin and being shredded by Chassepot rifles, despite eventually driving the french off of them.
>germans being willing to ram their fricking head into things and die in droves to do it
Very big and important point, that was kind of the attitude of the germans for quite some time and was still relevant during WW1 with them drawing the conclusion that the british lacked that will during the boer war.
>The British infantry’s failure was not attributed to an impenetrable Boer defense but to the piecemeal commitment of troops. Lack of success at the outset had forced the British to adopt greater extension in the attack.
>The Germans thought this unwise. They looked at the small losses incurred by the British infantry--Magersfontein, 9 per cent; Colenso, 5½ per cent; and Stormberg 3½ per cent compared them with their own losses in the Franco-Prussian War, and concluded that the British could have succeeded, if only they had been more committed.
>In general this German attitude gained credence in the Russo-Japanese War of 1904-1905. In this first war between great powers since the Franco-Prussian War, all the modern weapons of war were employed: machine guns, hand grenades, smokeless powder, magazine rifles, and quick-firing artillery. And, since the Japanese followed the German tactical school’s preachings, there was great interest in the out come.
Background of a Stalemate: A Study of the Development of Tactics and Weapons prior to World War I by Joseph Coleman Arnold
Absolute chads.
>Germans then proceeded to inflict the most humiliating defeat in European history on the French
Not really. I would probably give that to when Napoleon defeated Prussia in two months after Prussian officers demanded the king declare war on France by literally throwing their swords at the king’s feet.
Either way France wasn’t prepared for war, its army took too long to mobilize and it lost the demographic conflict about 80 years earlier. Even had they mobilized they still would have lost just in a longer, bloodier war which would leave France even weaker.
Also Napoleon III was a product of adultery and genetic tests show that he’s unrelated to Napoleon the competent.
It's purely logistics
French mobiks at to report to their hometown local barrack to get mobilised while prussians got mobilised anywhere, and yes the prussian trains led to the front much faster than french trains having to cross the entirety of France
Was this the first war captured on cameras?
Yes but no, it depends on what you mean. The Mexican-American war was the first time pictures were made during one. The Crimean war and American civil war followed also had substantial amounts of pictures taken.
The Franco-Prussian war might be the first war with pictures taken during combat with at least some claims that pic related was the first instance of one.
Wut. The German Kingdom has been ratified since the Treaty of Verdun in 843, and then once more after the kingship passed from Frankish kings to the Saxon Ottonian dynasty in 919, which would eventually form the core of the HRE, whose ruler has always taken the title of "Ruler of the German Nation". Germany as a landmass and nation has been a thing for almost a thousand years before the Franco Prussian war.
Germany has a habit of exploding back into all the little Germanies, at least in pre-modern times. But they were united by the end of the Franco-Prussian War.
Anti-germans always try to somehow argue that germany is a fake state with no history or real legitimacy.
Or other stupid shit. Like for example when the french try to claim karl the great (or charlemagne as they call him, despite him calling himself karl) or ignoring that their country is named after the tribe that conquered them.
Also probably coping about germany having a gdp twice as high as them
charlemagne is a way better name than carol
It's what he called himself and it's what his subjects called him. His capitol also isn't in france.
well it would've been france if primogeniture was invented yet
Well this turned into krautaboo central remarkably quick. Oh well.
>this entire thread
So is this a cope thread because france is going through riots again?
Riots that are caused by people from frances ex-colonies?
Riots that don't happen in germany and as the french only think of 3 things (smokes, baguette and krauts) they must shitpost about their twice as successfull neighbor?
What on earth makes you think that this thread was created by french people?
No, the people in the thread are coping. The OP is just bait or a genuine question, who cares.
My point is, the op was already answerd in the first 3 posts, but then some anons turned into a whining-about-le-evil-allemondes-thread.
Actually, Anon, the whining started with krauts going into dindu nuffin mode about everything from the treaty of Frankfurt to WW fricking II and this has been going on for the past few days. But I am glad other people get to experience the classic German response of going into full spergery and denial anytime an iota of criticism is directed their way.
Anyway, you've been spewing your chauvinism for days itt and you're probably going to have a busy weekend if this thread stays up so I'll leave you to it.
Yeah anon everything is French