Exactly what makes it impossible for a cartridge with the size of a .22 magnum to fire a projectile with the energy of a 9mm?

Exactly what makes it impossible for a cartridge with the size of a .22 magnum to fire a projectile with the energy of a 9mm? What is the most powerful gunpowder out there?

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  1. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    >Exactly what makes it impossible for a cartridge with the size of a .22 magnum to fire a projectile with the energy of a 9mm?
    Chamber pressure

    >What is the most powerful gunpowder out there?
    Fastest burning powder is Norma R1. Pack your .22 full of it, post results.

  2. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    >with the energy of a 9mm?
    You can acheive high muzzle energy by high velocity, since the ME is the square of the velocity, and the force on the barrel and cartridge walls is based on the pressure and surface area, so you can develop a small diameter small mass bullet traveling at high velocity to equal the ME of a 9mm, but effectivenss of the bullet is also related to mass (momentum, for penetration). If you only want high velocity go with a smooth bore, and you can also try a squeeze bore. The higher pressure on the cartridge may cause problems ejecting the spent cartridge, you can always just get thicker barrel to contain the higher pressure. If you have enough machinery in your garage and know enough about firearms and practice safety you can work up something, but it may not be practicle for the average "operator" sitting on his couch.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      The relationship of energy, momentum, and material strength to terminal effect is always complicated.

      Still, there's functionally no way to make a solid metal projectile that moves above mach 2 and isn't substantially lethal.

  3. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    It'd just be expensive ammo, have you sewn those two piece high pressure steel cases for 9mm ammo? You'd need some shit like that

  4. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    >exactly what makes it impossible for a cartridge with the size of a .22 magnum to fire a projectile with the energy of a 9mm?
    Nobody wants a .22 pistol cartridge with the power of a 9mm because that is moronic

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      How so?

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      I don’t think it’s moronic, and I would like enjoy a pistol that shot powerful 22 or 25 caliber rounds. Imagine a 25 ACP magnum.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Check out 22 tcm then

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Nta but I love the idea of 22tcm. The only thing stopping me from buying a gun chambered in it is that I don't want to be limited to just shitty armscor ammo. I wish it was more popular.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            If you want more selection, buy one. More sales, more interest, more incentive for other manufacturers to get involved. 22TCM/9R were developed specifically to keep costs down, the brass is readily made from 223 or 5.56 stock which makes it very accessible to reloaders, and major manufacturers can easily get in on the action with their existing equipment. Buy 22TCM, tell your friends, help it catch on.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      >Nobody wants a .22 pistol cartridge with the power of a 9mm because that is moronic
      Not really. It'd increase capacity to rifle-levels in a pistol. 9gays are always talking about how important capacity is

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      >5.56 is a .22

  5. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    If you had some kind of magical gunpowder with infinite energy density you still couldnt get much more energy with a short barrel like that unless you also ramped up the chamber pressure. Fast burning powder is easy, but you need beefier pressure bearing parts and blowback is off the table.
    High energy densities would still be interesting, for example you could have rifle energies from rifle barrels but with rounds and mags that fit into the grip and are also compatible with your handun

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      and i dont know of any really high energy density gunpowder, the compounds with really high energy have a tendency to detonate and even those dont have crazy much more

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        >8 nitro groups
        >Model literally contains "NO NO NO NO"
        This is entirely correct and I would not touch that with someone else's rented sunlight from a mile away.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          it's fine, it's supposedly shock resistant

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      >the size of a .22 magnum
      Could mean different things, but if we measure by overall volume:
      pi/4 * (rim diameter)^2 * (overall length)
      then .22 WMR (0.30" rim x 1.35" long) is 0.0954 cubic inches.
      .30 Super Carry (0.344" rim x 1.17" long) is 0.109 cubic inches, only 14" bigger.
      7mm Penna (0.312" rim x 1.36" long) is little better at 0.105 c.i.
      But since 7mm Penna is vaporware anyway, you may just as well wildcat it to your own specifications -- cut the same 5.7x28 parent case even shorter, and load it to 1.17" to fit 9mm frames instead of 1911s, and you actually wind up smaller than .22 WMR at 0.0900 c.i..
      But even if you load it at 5.7's 50 ksi, I don't think you'll actually match 9mm.

      >If you had some kind of magical gunpowder with infinite energy density you still couldnt get much more energy with a short barrel like that unless you also ramped up the chamber pressure
      You inspired me to run the numbers.
      We'll stay with .224 caliber, and take a 90-grain bullet as the heaviest practical option. To match 9mm performance, we'll then need about 1500 FPS, and we'll allow 5" of bullet travel, corresponding to a barrel length between 5" and 6".
      Obviously, the perfect magical, infinitely progressive powder would instantly reach max pressure, and sustains it until the projectile leaves the muzzle; the peak pressure will be exactly the same as the average pressure.
      The average pressure required is 27.4 ksi --only 14% over .22 WMR's actual max pressure, and rather lower than 5mm rimfire's 33ksi.

      I'm surprised, I thought it'd be a lot higher. Too bad we don't live in a world of magic gunpowder with flat pressure curves.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        If you had some kind of magical gunpowder with infinite energy density you still couldnt get much more energy with a short barrel like that unless you also ramped up the chamber pressure. Fast burning powder is easy, but you need beefier pressure bearing parts and blowback is off the table.
        High energy densities would still be interesting, for example you could have rifle energies from rifle barrels but with rounds and mags that fit into the grip and are also compatible with your handun

        here, one thing i havent really thought about is that the pressure of course has to be excerted by something. So by ideal gas law, if it breaks up into the same number of molecules as regular powder, and you want to keep up a really high pressure with a small amount of powder, it would have to get very hot in the end, potentially causing flame cutting problems, melting brass, etc.
        I didn't run any calculations but basically you'd want powder that both has a lot of energy and a lot of atoms that can break up into small molecules, confined into a small volume

  6. 1 month ago
    Anonymous
    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      couldn't they incorporate whatever advancements allow this into a full sized 5.56 cartridge and get absurd velocity boosts?

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        because without advantages like lower barrel temperatures the added recoil and muzzle blast outweigh it.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      I've spent years trying to find that image. Thank you

  7. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    https://www.armedconflicts.com/4-5x26R-t31878
    >790 J

  8. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    5.7x28 already exists
    btw, how many of you don't know that 5.56 isn't even 5.56? it's 5.7

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Actually it's 5.6896mm. Or 5.56mm between the lands, which is how it's measured.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        it's really just .22 but argays love to cope endlessly

  9. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Nothing. 1995 wants its cartridges back.

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