I just came across this harpoon gun which shoots 12 gram steel darts with a force of 60 joules at 340 feet per second, would this be enough to potentially kill someone in a self defense situation? (to the head/heart)
It's not classed as a weapon under german laws so you can carry it everywhere
Potentially kill? Absoultely. But what you should be worring about is "can it reliably and quickly stop an attacker". And the answer to that is no.
>Can two arrow-diameter holes straight through a man's torso kill him
Gee anon, I don't know, if only there was something we could compare it to.
Obviously it's not as good as a gun, but punching two holes through someone is going to reliably (meaning, in the majority of cases) quickly stop an attack.
The odds of being killed or seriously injured by an attacker after putting even two 22lr slugs in them are extremely low. Two holes of any kind through the torso is going to be enough to stop 99% of cases.
>reliably (meaning, in the majority of cases) quickly stop an attack.
Says who?
No it's not. 2x 60J projectiles are not going to reliably put a stop to an attacker who is motivated to attack, or is at all pumped up on any drugs or just adrenaline. It wouldn't even reliably stop a medium animal.
>an attacker who is motivated to attack, or is at all pumped up on any drugs or just adrenaline
We don't generally have this kind of meat target in Europe
The monkeys here attack in packs but shit themselves and run if there's any resistance
in that case, something with a loud bang would be preferable, no? does that harpoon gun use air or gunpowder?
Infinitely harder to get anything that goes bang these days
>oh no it could be converted into a firearm!
Blank fire pistol is enough. The small weapon card is even the allowance to CC it.
They were popular in the 1980s and 1990s. Around 2000 the people simple forget they exist and instead you carry today pepperspray or a pocket knife....
If you draw a blank fire pistol and the Romanian or Arab draws a real one like a glock 19....you are fricked
You fricking moron.
First off, I can tell you're a noguns homosexual because you're using israeliteLs
Second off, energy is not the exclusive measurement of the lethality of a fricking projectile. An arrow with the energy of a 22lr will stab through three grown men. An arrow with the energy of a 22lr can pierce through a kevlar vest that stops a 44 magnum.
Any pointed metal object more than two inches long moving at 340 feet per second is likely to punch through the human torso and emerge from the other side. The sectional density, and momentum, of a long bodied projectile are going to vary wildly from those of a bullet shaped projectile.
%3D
Feel free to provide any statistics that run contrary to the established statistics, that two holes through the body are extremely likely to stop an attack regardless of caliber.
That would be statistics, not anecdotes or individual cases.
Brb, gonna hunt bears with 22lr.
Hey anecdote clinging, womanly arguing, goalpost shifting douchegay, how many people in the last fifty years have been killed or maimed by a bear they've hit twice with any caliber of gun in the torso or head?
You can buy industrial laser cutters on ebay and they will absolutely stop an attacker if you aim for the face.
>Blinds self and neighbors
That would be fricking rad though.
>Hear a crash
>Put on your safety glasses
>Come waddling through the living room dragging a big, wheeled battery with you and a mad grin on your face
>Now you see me, now you don't
Battery tech has come a long way. A 500 watt lithium battery is only slightly larger than a rifle magazine.
>Battery tech has come a long way. A 500 watt lithium battery is only slightly larger than a rifle magazine.
I think I'll stick to 40 watt lithium batteries for my plasma rifle. I don't like it when the magazines print.
Just buy a laser to "play with your pet" from eBay
They advertise in the same sentence that the same laser can burn paper; put a lens on the end that splits the beam in a horizontal line or a ton of points and shine that in their direction
instant eye sear
in Germany the maximum laser you can get without any ado is 50 watts. still a lot of energy to out through a laser, but not quite industrial cutter levels of power.
they're still purchasable over the counter, only proof of age required. what does happen occasionally is that a model is pulled from the market because it was considered a little too sturdy.
conversely, here's a little funny fact about the scuba ringer that joerg spoke about in some videos the first variant (actually depicted by OP) was at about 40 or 45 Joule, far above what's allowed for an airgun. it was legal to own for everyone since it counted as a harpoon gun. but after a while the lawmaker had it tested and came to the conclusion that it likely wasn't powerful enough for underwater hunting. so to keep it from potentially being classified as an illegal airgun, the makers when bringing out the second iteration increased its power to 60 joules. imagine that. "hey, this thing is too weak to be legal!"
>in Germany the maximum laser you can get without any ado is 50 watts. still a lot of energy to out through a laser, but not quite industrial cutter levels of power.
A .5 watt laser is a massive blinding hazard, let alone one 100 times as powerful.
So many morons are going to blind themselves, their neighbors, and random animals in the next decade or so. It's going to be so awful.
You could just buy black powder guns, you don't need a weapon license you can just do it online (e.g. frankonia.de), the only thing they will ask for is your ID to make sure you are above age 18.
Make sure you learn how black powder weapons work, you can buy everything (the gun, caps, and lead balls) except black powder. But there is a trick: You can buy black powder "quickmatch" fuse online on Amazon, I would choose the red ignition wire from WANO, because I found out they just use their 3FFFG black powder for those. Peel off the plastic and you can collect a sizeable supply easily.
This is all technically legal but something you only want as a last resort (e.g. home defense), those .44/.45 lead balls can have muzzle energies of 250-450 J. This is basically a workaround to get a "Gun" anywhere in Europe w/o a license - even in Germany - but remember that you are in a legal grey area so act responsibly. Best if you have your own basement or something if you want to test-fire.
>t. knower
>This is basically a workaround to get a "Gun" anywhere in Europe w/o a license
Not really, like in Finland the caps or anything that could pass for explosives are restricted. You can only own a BP gun without license if it's an antique. But Finland after the EU directive is a fricking worthless Commie shithole anyway
>a deactivated machine gun is a machine gun
>didn't register something you could buy freely until 2019? Too bad, go to jail
So you are not even allowed to use fireworks?
Thank you officer.
I hope no one is listening seriously to this moron.
>This is all technically legal
Owning black powder without a loicense isn't
buy a can of wd40 and an outdoors lighter
What you need is an air compressor and drill bits. But the fact that you ask means you’re on a watchlist.
dump a few dry powder fire extinguishers and some oven cleaner on them. gets into the lungs and eyes and you've got a big metal tube to stove their head in should it escalate to that.
and most importantly when the rozzers show up and find a weezing blind guy with a broken nose you can just shrug and say he was commin right for you.
This. A fire extinguisher is not classified as a weapon. The same with a hatchet or ice hockey bat
By law the hatchet is a tool and the ice hockey bat is sport equipment. Baseball bat however is classified as a weapon.
Look at the german gun law. You can read it online as a pdf document
Goddamn virgins, IF YOU CARRY AROUND HOCKEY STICK AND YOU ARE NOT ACTIVE HOCKEY PLAYER, EURO JUDGE WILL CLASSIFY IT AS INSIDIOUS WEAPON.
You will get fricked with intent. If you defend yourself with an object, court will consider all circumstances of it and you won't lie yourself out of it.
Carry around small hammer? It's a tool right, normal thing? You carry it everyday? No, it's brand new. Ok let's check packaging and place where you bought it etcetc. all aiming for the killing with intent.
depends really, you just need to have a decent enough reason to be lugging it around.
And those reasons can be really dumb. I got a client off in a stabbing case because he used the knife to open up his offices packages so he just kept it on him while going out after work.
In general pick an item that has a legitimate everyday use. The smaller the better because you'r not going to forget to leave your sledgehammer at work. Oh and this very important get a decent lawyer. If you are going to go trough the bother to pick some selfdefense tool, pick the guy that you will have to bail your ass out.
>sticking around
Leave in these situations unless there is someone nearby who can positively identify you.
>home defense
just get a gun
>not classed as a weapon under german laws
yes, but do you think that the public persecutor or the judge will care? At that point you are better of carrying a legally owned pistol and coming up with some half arsed excuses as to why you where carrying it
using a gun in self defense is not illegal you could use antrax or an atom bomb under german law as long as its a measured response.
For example somebody breaks down your door and is carrying a soviet tank army to rob your place and possible hurt you or others you could theoretically nuke em even thou having a nuke or activating one is a serious crime in germany.
yes, I know
but it isn't legal to go around carrying without a permit (good luck getting one) or when you are going to/from the range ect.
So home defense, no problem.
Carrying for self defense, sure the defense is legal but the carrying isn't
the problem with meme "selfdefense" things to carry is that the public persecutor and the judge will see it as intent to hurt someone "why is mister spergannon going about his day with a harpoon pistol on him. What reason does he have other than he wants to shoot someone."
that is where illegally carrying a legal pistol becomes the better option. "judge I was going to the range later that day/I had gone to the range, forgot to put it in my safe when I got home and then went out"
You are turning intent => murder into I forgot => fire arms violation
But honestly unless you live in the most shit parts of urban north Germany. You are more likely to hurt yourself with your carry piece than to get mugged"
You're just fricking stupid as your post is. The harpoon is not a FIREarm, you fricking moron.
If the guy have a harpoon at that point he should have a Glock.
Get the new version, those hollow darts suck ass, are expensive and single use against anything harder than a block of foam.
As for an actual answer, yes, but you basically got the power of a .22lr, so it's not exactly reliable.
Or just be absolutely fricking based, get your Pulverschein, buy a Steinschlosspistole.and open carry that fricking thing.
>just get a gun
I mean sure, for home defense that's fine, but if you get caught carrying outside of your home you can say goodby to your loicence, pay a hefty fine and probably go to jail for a few months.
Depends on the judge and on your lawyer. Do not say a single fricking word without your lawyer and you'll probably be fine.
There are some umarex airguns that can be modded to 50- 100 joules.
Use steel balls and you got a """relatively""" decent weapon
Pcp hatsan blitz 30 with stendomags
Hunting loicence
Bow and arrow
Crossbow
>It's not classed as a weapon under german laws so you can carry it everywhere
Godfricking dammit with noguns. Why do you even bother. Read your fricking self-defense laws, if you are not defending yourself with legally owned gun, in most of EUSSR you will certainly get slammed with premeditation and end up with killing or murder charge.
Doesn't matter if it is knife, or knuckle duster, or harpoon, or kusch, or baseball bat, if it isn't something you can have on you in most common circustances, you are getting fricked.
Euros wanted a nanny state and tgen they refuse to understand that the nanny state wants exclusivity on the use of violence.
This also.
If you real come into self defense situation at home just throw a chair at them or get into kitchen and get a large knife.
Most of the house breaking Romanian gypsies only want fast money and no blood. They break your window with a stone at night, steal your mobile phone or something else they can quickly store into there backpack and then they run away. Move like that only takes like 2 or 3 minutes.
Most oft the house breaks don't happen at night, thet happen in the late morning till early afternoon, when people are still at work or if you are longer not at home cause vacation.
They also don't rob randomly. They observe first if you are wealthy or not. What kind if car is in the drive way, when are you away at work when are you at home.
They drive past neighborhood and observe.
They are not that smart or skilled either.
If you are dumb and let garage door open all the time you are basically asking for it
if you want to avoid getting burglarized
look poorer and have better (visible) security than the people in your neighborhood.
those thieve gangs will scope out an area, pick a few houses to hit and then do them on after an other, sometimes on the same day. If your place isn't on their top 10 pick of your area then you are probably safe.
just don't try to make it look like your home is a castle. They will just figure that you don't put up that much security if you don't have something to secure and hit you, probably last (don't want the cops showing up in an hour frick up their other houses of the day).
Why don't you people just stop talking out of your ass and frick off? And what the frick are the EURO Laws? Last time I checked Brussels has no saying in what I can own or what I can carry around. And what cucked land, aside perhaps UK, files a baseball bat under weapons?
There are no Euro laws but the continental European countries operate under pretty similar legal principles due to sharing a civil law system.
I read my countries self defense law, it says I can use whatever the frick I want when defending myself as long as it's an equal measure of force. What are you on about?
Against a criminal you aren't equal in force.
Europoors are such weaks lmao
>equal measure of force
What this means is that you can't shoot and the only good shoot is when the attacker shoots first
It means that if you rightfully feel threatened for your life you can do whatever you want. If the intruder is armed then he's game. You are not of course entitled to chase somebody running out of your house and shoot him in the back. Better if you shoot a warning round first, so you can show the authorities you were forced to engage after the intruder didn't give up. Your word against the one of a dead man. Honestly the only big downside is having your name on TV news and wasting time on a trial.
>It means that if you rightfully feel threatened for your life you can do whatever you want.
I think that's true for Germany but not true for e.g. Finland and some other European states. Here it's very much duty to retreat and if you shoot you'll probably go to jail if the other guy just had a bat
Yeah, but retreat where? Are you meant to flee your own home?
>Are you meant to flee your own home?
Basically yes
The law here has taken the stance that you're not allowed to defend your property with lethal force ever
Best europoor home defense weapon is a glock
What is that, a Joerg Sprave Nerf Maverick?
Most euros can own antique black powder guns.
It's trivially easy to get a modern shotgun if home defense is what you're looking for
Carrying is a bit harder but since you'll be breaking the law anyway, you could always buy a rifle legally and then obrez it, regular handgun if you aren't in a complete shithole
carry of such may be explicitly legal under german law (so long as it's a historic design and not a percussion cap lock), but you need a loicense for the propellant. which isn't all that hard to get, but even IF you had that loicense, they still technically could still frick you over on the basis that it was given to you for a different use case than carry (such as shooting on a range, or salute shooting with just powder).
as explained by another anon, it's not that easily comparable.
joerg sprave also showed off another one recently that has 220J, but it's a lot less compact
WaffG Anlage 2 Abschnitt 3 Unterabschnitt 1: harpoon devices (the scubaringer was classified as such) are exempt from all weapon laws except having to be 18 to own one and there not being a weapon ownership ban placed on you by a judge
>but you need a loicense for the propellant
€20 for a box, the powder you can extract is enough for about 40-ish shots in a handgun. You can get it mailed to your doorstep. It's FFFg grade black powder.
A street from where I live a guy killed two cops with a black powder revolver
It is classified as a weapon in Germany and you are only allowed to carry it if you are at the beach or under water diving.
But it is free to buy and own if you are 18 and older.
Allowed to own and allowed to carry is a difference in the german weapon laws.
Just get a crossbow or a black Powder pistol or a double barrel flintlock shotgun like the Pedersoli Howda
Greetings from Bavaria
>60J
>same energy as 3 .177 airgun pellets
I doubt they would even penetrate the skin beyond 10m
>europoor
>home defense
Lube and knowing to assume the position before an attacker gets to you. If you think you wouldn't get arrested for carrying that harpoon thing you're setting yourself up for your eventual arrest. I would expect anything explicitly meant for home/self defense to get you arrested in the majority of Europe even if on paper it's completely legal. Always assume the system is going to work hard to frick you over even if you were 100% in the right and your actions are the only reason you're still alive and well.
Weapons that are not weapons should be the goal. No not even cricket bats or kitchen knives if you're not in the kitchen or where you keep your sports stuff. Blunt objects that can be passed off as the closest thing in arm's reach and were only used because oh lawd he was comin fo dat booty. Heavy lamps, wine bottle candles, small statues, sturdy metal chairs or stools, and other stuff like that. Also work out. Most of what's reasonably available to you is worthless if you're a weak twig, Bright ass lights would also be a good idea. It's pretty damn hard to fight or rape when you can't see shit because the sun is in your victim's living room and all you see is white spots everywhere.
>this harpoon gun
Jorg calls it a harpoon for legal reasons so he can keep selling these to anyone over 18, but it's basically just a PCP pistol