How would you defend against these frickers as an infantryman?
Is it so difficult to shoot them down?
Jamming the signals?
Having a portable radar in the squad?
Why I see nobody even trying to fight them back?
drone defence
How would you defend against these frickers as an infantryman?
Is it so difficult to shoot them down?
Jamming the signals?
Having a portable radar in the squad?
Why I see nobody even trying to fight them back?
They are easy to kill, the only problem is nobody has dedicated anti drone systems yet. They are only a problem because nobody was prepared for them.
>MBTs are unkillable
>develop Javelin
>MBTs are a joke
>t. reddit tourist
>still coping that ukraine showed tanks became useless
>tanks used by slavs
When did Western MBTs prove themselves? Killing ragheads with only AKs doesn't count.
Desert Storm x 2, Israel wars and many others
moron, Russia is a 1980s military. Ukraine is a 1980s military with a couple of boxes of AMERICATEK, which is all it takes to shift the balance. Getting American support in this age is like a caveman being given a musket to fight other cavemen.
That's what the rest of the world is. Cavemen.
That's all this war has proved. It hasn't proved anything about "modern" war or "modern" equipment except that only one country on the planet is capable of either.
>AMERICATEK, which is all it takes to shift the balance
it's ww2 mines and ww1 trenches that are slowing them down
shotguns have low range, you want something like gyrojet if you want to reach the drone with a shotgun
>don't have AI
yet, it's actually very easy to get an AI drone going
>shotguns have low range
So does a Gyrojet dude. Real life is not 40k.
>They are easy to kill, the only problem is nobody has dedicated anti drone systems yet. They are only a problem because nobody was prepared for them.
The Aselsan Şahin ("Shahin", Hawk) can detect an approaching drone with radar, view it via an electro-optic system and destroy it with a 40mm high-velocity airburst grenade launched by the Aselsan SARP (Stabilized Advanced Remote Weapon Platform).
Dimensions: 2,450×3,720×2,675mm
700 meters effective range
yes the systems exists but nobody has them in enough quantities, they are too expensive, and too big
you want something that can be carried in a backpack by anyone
>("Shahin", Hawk)
i'm pronouncing it "saiyan" out of spite for presuming i would ever respect a turk enough to need a phonetic guide. one that isn't even IPA, either.
aselsan does put out some interestingly weird little systems like this tho.
Is everyone moronic here?
I asked AS AN INFANTRYMAN I was guessing how would be being on the receiving end and trying to defend from a drone trying to unload a mortar round on you.
Are they difficult to detect?
Are they difficult to shoot down with rifles or shotguns?
Can't they be jammed with portable devices?
I am talking specifically about the Black person rigged off the shelves AliExpress quadcopters not the most advanced military drones.
>Is everyone moronic here?
are you? you are the one asking moronic questions that have obvious answers
>Why I see nobody even trying to fight them back?
because they have nothing to detect them and nothing to hit them with
because nobody was prepared for it because west is run by morons obsessed with air superiority and russia is run by morons obsessed with tanks
>I am talking specifically about the Black person rigged off the shelves AliExpress quadcopters
everyone can tell from the picture homosexual
>off the shelf quadcopters
Very easy to jam. Even Russia can pull that off a majority of the time. Fast moving suicide drones are the ones much harder to do anything about unless you don’t mind $5,000,000 blowing apart a $20,000 drone
>Are they difficult to detect?
Very difficult unless you have equipment that detects the drone's signal
>Are they difficult to shoot down with rifles or shotguns?
Extremely difficult to nearly impossible.
>Can't they be jammed with portable devices?
Yes.
>I am talking specifically about the Black person rigged off the shelves AliExpress quadcopters not the most advanced military drones.
COTS drones are bleeding edge technology and the drones that drop mortars have spare payload to fit military communication equipment. It is just adding parts and changing software that turns COTS into better than military drones.
>Very difficult unless you have equipment that detects the drone's signal
Not very difficult. It's a little cumbersome but not end of the world.
>Yes.
Kek. COTS drones are the ones that are easier to jam. Those doesn't have the strengthen systems. And it's not much since a jammer can be less powerful to get the same effect.
>COTS drones are bleeding edge technology and the drones that drop mortars have spare payload to fit military communication equipment. It is just adding parts and changing software that turns COTS into better than military drones.
What? Lmfao. I'm not trying to shill for the MIC specifically in this question but those have certain limits(range and payload) and those are the easier to jam. Their electronics aren't hardened when face with jammers, DEW, and HPMs.
A javelin is way cheaper than a tank, even though it’s an expensive weapon.
Problem is drones are cheap and easy to spam, you need a way to destroy them en masse that’s even cheaper than the drone itself
>have complete and total air superiority
A fee might be able to sneak by and cause some problems, but air superiority mostly solves the drone problem
>but air superiority mostly solves the drone problem
it doesn't idiot
If the enemy has no air defense and all fortified positions have been bombed out along with know munitions warehouses, it’s going to be hard to launch more than a few drones moron. Try not being from a poor country next time
>if enemy is destroyed they can't launch drones
no shit moron
drones are a perfect tool for guerilla warfare
morons always assume they will only fight farmers even though those farmers raped them the last time
Slingshots and rocks?
>a guy hidden in an underground hole can keep launching FPV drones and rape your unstoppable MBTs
>air superiority will fix this
Both drone and operator's antenna have easily detectable electronic signature that reveals the location of both. I hope the operator has spare antennas and long cables that keep him hidden and safe.
unless you have AI drones that automatically seek out targets
>muh air superiority
>muh MBTs
The example was for a FPV drone, which needs an operator controlling and drone providing video the operator is receiving.
A fully automated drone can only have its GPS or sensors jammed. You can't jam a mortar round while it's falling through the air.
I thought vice was bankrupt
heat lasers and tracking
>Why I see nobody even trying to fight them back?
ok ukies said russians are actually jamming a lot of them
>Why I see nobody even trying to fight them back?
Because when a drone got shot down it won't bring back a footage for you to see. There's a few footages from some dudes who managed to down them if you dig a bit, but it won't be super common because the reality is your average slav infantryman can't afford gopro
>Because when a drone got shot down it won't bring back a footage for you to see.
you know they record a live stream from the drone
easy to jam but you first need the equipment at your disposal that's why vatnik trenches get raped
this will be fixed with AI drones
Only the trenches recently made and on the frontline. Even Russia can figure out how to take down $200 drones a majority of the time
>on the frontline
so the most important ones
but what does air superiority have to do with it?
Their most important is the second line. Instead of doing an elastic defense strategy to entrap Ukrainians they do assault’s because a proper defense requires giving up land, which is politically problematic. Russias largest enemy in Ukraine is themselves with their refined version of Soviet strategy
>because a proper defense requires giving up land
>make defenses and trenches
>move back
>attacker now has your trenches
>you have no trenches and no defenses
Their frontline trenches are dog shit. It’s their second line that is easyily defendable and will be a nightmare for Ukraine to break
>unless Russia keeps sending out assault teams on suicide missions
>It’s their second line that is easyily defendable and will be a nightmare for Ukraine to break
not really, they are just trenches but deeper
ukies will hunt for the jammers and drones will rape trenches like they always do
the thing with jammers is they are very easy to detect due to their strong signal
>but what does air superiority have to do with it?
Air superiority lets you have bigger and better drones and sensors that let you out-detect and respond to enemy drone launches as they launch.
But jammers and detectors can all be man-portable and you can fight enemy drones without aircraft support. The only man-portable antidrone (kinetic) weapon is a tiny stinger. Vehicle mounted and computer aimed machineguns and autocannons have a chance, but are still crapshoots. Jammer is best option.
>you know they record a live stream from the drone
Yeah, a potato quality streamed 'footage' that's like 480p. It's pretty much useless as intel so a lot of operators don't even bother recording it
Signal detectors, jammers and light AA.
Shooting a drone with small arms is extremely difficult if you're highly trained about the specific ballistics of firing upwards at flying things. Nearly impossible if you're only trained to fire at ground targets.
Know those Arisaka AA sights? Do you know how to use them?
We need to bring back punt guns, soimple as
lots of EMPs or something
EMP is a meme but you could use microwave beams
my heart was in the right place
attrition rate fort those is pretty high - so someone is doing something about it.
They're cheap weapons that can be expended at high loss rates. They're also very effective weapons for their low cost.
>But they cost $2.5k-$9k
That's very cheap.
The main issue is just the lack of cost-efficient systems. There are a lot of anti-drone systems that are both kinetic and non-kinetic in nature but none are produced in large enough numbers or are mature enough to be usable at any larger scale. Your drone jamming guns that you occasionally see are somewhat sufficient against commercial grade drones but anything with inertial guidance or other EW countermeasures is highly resistant and you can do all sorts of signal boosting shenanigans etc. For purely kinetic solutions the best ones that I've seen are probably the 40mm airbursting automatic grenade launchers because it's still somewhat affordable and already uses pre-existing components and is pretty simple to install on top of vehicles or to place into a fortified position. There are some anti-drone optics that can be used on different types of machine guns and optics and surprisingly enough they do seem decent but the issue is that for anyone that isn't the US it's not a good solutions to give out incredibly expensive optics to everyone in frontline units that will face the most attrition anyway and are the most likely to face up against grenade dropping drones and suicide drones. Right now ironically enough the best solutions against drone based targets are systems like PANTSIR. The issue is that the PANTSIR fricking sucks ass because the Russian electronics and software is shit beyond description. A SPAAG type system that for example uses 35mm airbursting explosive rounds is about as cost-effective and scalable as you can make an anti-air system and if you slap some shit like stingers, pioruns etc. on top of it you get a decent enough SHORAD system that can effectively protect infantry and artillery batteries. For those artillery batteries specifically you absolutely need automation and MANPADS and anti-drone optics or grenade launchers are not fast enough nor reliable enough against FPV drones or lancets because you have seconds to engage a small target.
first thing to do would a gepard system small enough to put on top of a humvee
the solution to drones are anti-drone drones equipped with either beehive fletchette launchers (smart and cheap) or miniature airburst rockets/missiles (moronic and expensive)
you either have the anti-drones flying around looking for the drones or a separate drone detection system and have the anti-drones engage the drones in addition to reporting them to infantry who can, if necessary, plink them down
another potential solution would be miniature suicide drones that are built for speed but have limited (yet sufficient for a kamikaze mission) range as a result of said speed and their size
regardless of the solutions we'll end up where we did with aircraft eventually
nobody uses drones offensively without total airspace contorl because they are so expensive and they immediately get blown to shit
You are thinking in terms of munitions that are too complex. The vast majority of targets that your infantry and other assets close to the frontline need shot down aren't expensive and complex systems but rather commercial grade drones or slightly improved upon military grade ones but still somewhat comparable. Not to be a rheinmetall shill but the idea of just placing a rangefinder to a 40mm and just using that to program airbursting grenades is all you need to shoot down low flying small drones dropping grenades or just gathering intelliigence. Using already existing hardware and munitions decreases the costs associated and means that it is usable in more roles as well.
The concept itself has a lot of room for improvement but it's a good start.
?t=56
>nobody uses drones offensively without total airspace contorl
russia and ukraine have no air space control and use drones offensively
> because they are so expensive
they are very cheap
>and they immediately get blown to shit
only big dumb ones
> miniature airburst rockets/missiles (moronic and expensive)
pretty sure they would cost as much or less as the drone they destroy
I said that's where there situation will end up at (once both drone and anti-drone technology mature), not where we are at right now you illiterate
>pretty sure they would cost as much or less as the drone they destroy
hence the bracketed part
Not quite humvee sized but the skynex is planned on being userd on systems like the Boxer and probably Patria AMV and other similar platforms. It's probably the best SPAAG on the market right now unless if you want to believe the the Turkish Korkut is any good but I remain skeptical. The Finns took their Marksman turrets that are more or less the equivalent of the ones that the Gepard uses and put it on a Leopard 2 completely unmodified. Regardless of whether or not that's a good idea the Finnish SPAAG's are probably the most well protected systems out there.
>Regardless of whether or not that's a good idea
It's a great idea solely because half of the country is forest and swamp that are untraversable except via foot or tracked vehicle
t. finn who lives in the area of the country that is the swampiest and forestiest
destroying drones is easy just hit it with another drone
but nobody has portable systems to detect drones
Designated shotgun
it would have to be a mini rocket (gyrojet) that triggers a shotgun shell after a delay
No it wouldn't. Being rocket propelled wouldn't make your design any better.
Just use jammers lmao
don't work on AI
FPVs don't have AI and commercial DJIs don't have AI, and they account for 99.9% of drones on the battlefield, so while jammers might suck against a future peer force they're fine for dunking on Russians, ISIS, larpers, etc.
what about small cheap drones with like 20 grams payload of TNT?
Maybe with signal chasing software or something
I was thinking something like this. Similar in size to the AT4, but it wouldn't be disposable to save on weight and cost. Some other riflemen can carry the rockets idk. The laser rangefinder finds the distance and tells the rocket when to pop its flechette warhead. The rockets may be too pricey tho.
Trace the control wire back to the operator and shoot him.
>Why I see nobody even trying to fight them back?
You have any idea how incredibly hard it is to spot or even hit one? By the time you hear the buzzing, it's already in range to rape you with its payload.
Has there been development in drones with the specific purpose of hunting and killing other drones?
Are we at some point in warfare where "Oh no, our enemy has a flying device that drops bombs on us and all we can hope to do is shoot at them from the ground." as though the concept of the fighter aircraft hasn't been around for a century?
These rotary drones are fragile, slow, and should be easy pickings for a dedicated "fighter" drone.
Google MORFIUS. HPM equipped anti-drone-drones are half a decade old. For whites that is lol.
Big issue with drones is they’re hard for a human to detect, if they fly high enough they’re fairly quiet. They’re also small and hard to spot unless you’re really looking out for one.
You need a way to detect them reliably, maybe a combination of radar and sensitive acoustics that can pick up on buzzing noises they make. Then you want some kind of CIWS system that automatically engages it, obviously one issue would be not shooting down friendly drones and animals like birds, etc. The CIWS could also be hacked so that’s another danger.
Drones aren’t that durable so you might not even need a fully lethal weapon like a shotgun to engage them, maybe some kind of automatic BB gun that shoots large volumes of metal pellets would be sufficient. Otherwise birdshot or some other kind of shotgun shell should do the trick
The only thing is hope someone has enough money for a drone jammer. Other wise its spreading out and hitting the deck, and refer to the pic related.
just hook up a good military camera with a trained AI model on a tall platform/pole and it could pick out any drone from far away
...why don't they just have a detection system and some guys that shoor up?