Wunderwaffe v2

HIMARS is no wunderwaffe but compared to vatnik technology, yes, it is.

Suppose Russia gets its hands on something comparable. What will NATO give to Ukraine that would be just a step above and again will be a wunderwaffe against the big monke?

  1. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >HIMARS
    Shit wectern technology, also COPE!

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      I am officially demoralized.

      -John Johnson, from Dakota Oblast

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Let me give you a QRD:
      >"shit" technology +
      >competent Ukie operators +
      >superior American intelligence =
      >Russians humiliated and outclassed
      But please try to stay on the topic.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      those arent himars you imbecil

  2. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Saab JAS 39 Gripen.
    Air supremacy.

  3. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >Suppose Russia gets its hands on something comparable.
    Russia has the weapons to reach out and touch Ukraine's logistical and command infrastructure. No they are not as accurate but they are accurate enough to do serious damage to vital Ukrainian targets... they can't find em.
    The combination of drones, partisans and 5 eyes is what makes HIMARS so deadly, if Russia got 50 of them and 10,000 rockets it would be like giving a monkey a trumpet, they'd have no idea what to do with it besides fuck it.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      But that can't be the end of story: why doesn't Russia use those weapons to counter Ukrainian units doing manning the HIMARS? From what we understand it is because their accurate weapons don't go deep enough and ukies are far gone for the inaccurate ones.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >why doesn't Russia use those weapons to counter Ukrainian units doing manning the HIMARS? From what we understand it is because their accurate weapons don't go deep enough and ukies are far gone for the inaccurate ones.

        It's not because shit like Kalibur can't go deep enough, it is because they are cruise missiles that are controlled by the VVS or missile forces, firing at targets that have to be spotted by some fucking grunt in the army and runnered, or spotted by a drone that had to fly back and land, then telephoned up to command, who then relays info to VVS-

        by which time the HIGH MOBILITY Artillery Rocket System has scooted and fired at another two targets in completely different places.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >But that can't be the end of story: why doesn't Russia use those weapons to counter Ukrainian units doing manning the HIMARS?
          It is the end of the story. Why? Because if they knew where the HIMARS's were they would be toast, you can't counter them if you can't find them.
          10,000 artillery shells landing on an empty field is less effective than 10 artillery shells each landing on an enemy target. Russia can't find shit, they don't know where the fuck anything is so they can't hit any of it even though they have the weapons to do so.

          So what would a rational vatnik (contradiction in terms) do? Short of just giving up or escalating beyond belief

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Nothing they can do. They don't have the intelligence infrastructure or airpower to counter them. The way for Russia to win this war would be 2. fix all the corruption and graft in their military and modernize it in the 10 years before the conflict, 2. don't under-estimate Ukraine in the initial planning as if you were just going to walk in and take it all.
            They are far, far to late to fix the situation they have found themselves in.

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              >2. fix all the corruption and graft in their military and modernize it in the 10 years before the conflict, 2. don't under-estimate Ukraine in the initial planning as if you were just going to walk in and take it all.
              That first 2 is supposed to be a 1...

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Send armies instead of prostitutes.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >So what would a rational vatnik (contradiction in terms) do?
            Surrender and hope I'm not lynched.

            If that isn't satisfactory for you
            -Plug intel gaps as much as possible. This probably won't do much but I'm willing to bet at this point there are plenty of DPR and LPR citizens tired of their "protectors" feeding info to the UA
            -Create fake Depots, while working at doing a better job at hiding the existing ones. Old and Low-tech but it genuinely could work, so long as they fakes aren't put in places where you'd obviously never have a depot, and traffic still passes through them.
            -More smaller, dispersed Depots, along with investing a lot more into the current logistics system to distribute things around better instead of stacking shit into big targets. It's something they need to do anyway, would have the benefit of not having stupidly large amounts of shit destroyed in one strike, and when the UA routs their demoralized "volunteers" they won't be liberating as much (theoretically)
            -Take away soldiers' phones and internet when they are on fucking duty.
            -Fire anyone who is fucking careless with their tongue or camo or fucking cigarettes and put them on the front in the human wave attacks.

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              >-Create fake Depots, while working at doing a better job at hiding the existing ones. Old and Low-tech but it genuinely could work, so long as they fakes aren't put in places where you'd obviously never have a depot, and traffic still passes through them.
              >-More smaller, dispersed Depots, along with investing a lot more into the current logistics system to distribute things around better instead of stacking shit into big targets. It's something they need to do anyway, would have the benefit of not having stupidly large amounts of shit destroyed in one strike, and when the UA routs their demoralized "volunteers" they won't be liberating as much (theoretically)
              To be clear, the goal with these two suggestions is to inundate the ukies with lots of targets that ultimately have a lower value, or no value at all. This won't stop the strikes but it will reduce how much each strike hurts in the long run.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                It would be a pretty hard sell though. You can bet they are watching traffic to and from depots via NATO satellites to determine their location. A fake dump with nothing going to and from might be ignored or backburnered while the use of assets to make it look real might further starve the logistics situation.
                The capability gap in intel between Russia and Ukraine/NATO is massive.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                How do you watch traffic coming and going from a depot? Spy satellites cannot stay on top of a target for long. Do they even record live? I guess you could guess by the amount of radio and other marks.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                They can!

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Spy satellites are low orbit meaning that they don't stay in a place for long. You need a lot of them to track a single target.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >>You need a lot of them
                Guess what every 3rd satellite launch for past 40 years has been? Yeah that's right! Spysats!!

                2012 a drunk NRO dude posted proofs here about having capability to monitor entire world with 2m resolution imagining 24/7 and any one country 24/7 with 20cm imagining. Since 2012 spysat launches have doubled in frequency so yeah the all seeing eye of Mordor is always watching what Orcs do

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >2012 a drunk NRO dude posted proofs here about having capability to monitor entire world with 2m resolution imagining 24/7 and any one country 24/7 with 20cm imagining
                archive?

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Go ahead start digging, also might not have been in 2012.. 2011 feels right too. Just search for NROL/Spysat or something assuming everything about it has not been purget from the net

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Let me see

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                You could delegate this task of tracking an object on the surface of the Earth in real-time to several satellites that follow each other's orbit at regular intervals, enabling covering of a single point on the Earth at all times. But regardless if you're using a few huge GEO satellites, or a large number of smaller LEO ones, they still can't make clouds move away from being over your target you're tracking.

                For the most part, it's just easier, faster and cheaper to deploy reconnaissance airplanes over your target, or if you're on a tight budget, maybe paint a blimp with some advert nobody cares to give attention to, and have your cameras hover a lot closer to the target you'd like to track and avoid the cloud cover.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Ok, fair point.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >A fake dump with nothing going to and from might be ignored or backburnered
                I did say to make sure traffic goes through them.
                Use ammo crates to deliver fucking onions and beets. Shoigu can give up some of his wood collection for the "operation"

                How do you watch traffic coming and going from a depot? Spy satellites cannot stay on top of a target for long. Do they even record live? I guess you could guess by the amount of radio and other marks.

                Drones, intel indicating where traffic is going and surveillance, either by SpecOps or more likely OsInt sources like fucking pinging from people's cell phones while they're on duty.

                Like I said you cannot stop the strikes, so the goal is to try and limit their effect. Ukraine, while they long-term wise have fucking infinite ammo, still have to abide by the laws of physics, which means that there is a definite limit to how many strikes can be made at a time. By divvying up the stockpiles more quickly and distributing them into smaller and more widely dispersed dumps, you are automatically reducing the amount of damage a single strike does, and forcing them to use more strikes to get the same effect that they currently have.
                Doing this though requires you actually put more time and thought into logistics than just loading shit on a truck from ones warehouse and moving it to another warehouse, and it requires that you either put a lot more time planning about your logistic needs, or have a much better communications system and more extensive logi network to ensure that if you need to move stuff from a thousand disparate dumps to wherever you need it- and again we run into the problem of "russian intelligence" here.
                Cheapshots aside, they are keeping shit in the big dumps so that they can move stuff easily wherever they need it. While this is a good idea on paper, it general reflects that 1) they don't have enough stuff ready to stock everyone, meaning they need to be picky, and 2) they don't really know who the fuck they need to stock supplies to in each region of the front, or how they should distribute supplies, the latter problem lacking their terrible intel collecting efforts.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >the latter problem lacking their terrible intel collecting efforts.
                The latter problem reflecting* their terrible intel collecting efforts.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                And there I was thinking that Russian SWEs were good at applied combinatorial optimization

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              > -Fire anyone who is fucking careless with their tongue or camo or fucking cigarettes and put them on the front in the human wave attacks.
              I wonder if they would end with 50% of their army strenght?

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >But that can't be the end of story: why doesn't Russia use those weapons to counter Ukrainian units doing manning the HIMARS?
        It is the end of the story. Why? Because if they knew where the HIMARS's were they would be toast, you can't counter them if you can't find them.
        10,000 artillery shells landing on an empty field is less effective than 10 artillery shells each landing on an enemy target. Russia can't find shit, they don't know where the fuck anything is so they can't hit any of it even though they have the weapons to do so.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      theoretically their more advanced ballistic missiles could be used in a similar way to himars; unfortunately they lack the intel to know where to really hit besides random fucking rail-stations and warehouses they thought they saw on TV, or whatever conscriptivich managed to ring up the chain of command 48 hours ago, and they also seemed perfectly content lobbing the stupid things at political and "morale" targets that do fuck all but harden the Ukrainian's resolve.

      And now they've probably fired off most of what isn't emergency war reserve, at a time where they aren't capable of replacing them in a timely manner.
      Even if they got their hands on more like says they'd basically squander the shit, if not because they have no idea what to really shoot at 80% of the time then because they are so retarded as to fire the things at stuff that doesn't fucking matter in the long term.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        So how many months until this is over or escalated to WW3?

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >So how many months until this is over
          I'd wager at least a year, Crimea will be difficult to retake, but technically Russia could pretend like it's not over at that point and make an ass of itself, inviting UN intervention.
          >or escalated
          never fucking happening unless putler chimps out again and attacks the baltics already, which would not go well for him even if nooks are off the table. This is probably not happening because while he's an arrogant fuck he must at some level realized by this point how fucked things are, and how much of a fucking joke his army is.
          Direct confrontation with NATO, in spite of the coping about UA being a "NATO Army," is no longer and will never be an option on the table, at least as an option that leads to anything but anihilation.
          If nooks are used then there will both be a NATO retaliation and the UN actually getting off it's ass to do something.

  4. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Russia would first need to acquire the means to develop all the associated technologies internally, or acquire an ally who can, so lol. Lmao, even.

  5. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Tornado has comparable capacities. What they need is better intel.

  6. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    I have a dream

  7. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >Suppose Russia gets its hands on something comparable
    you have wild imagination
    what can they come up with, cheap gps duct taped to ww2 rockets and shells and pretend its smart munitions

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