British commonwealth
>20-30 round box lmg the entire war
>bolt actions the entire war; can't even make a straight shooting jungle carbine
>consistently the worst tanks of the entire war with underpowered guns
>muh universal carrier!
>heavy artillery is ww1 vintage with new munitions; literally had to use wooden blocks to keep the gun from jumping away
>Sten
>PIAT. This thing couldn't even be reloaded under fire
>Chindits suicide missions. Just look it up, no other army would ever have reinforced such titanic failures
>Completely BTFO by one panzer div in North Africa so badly they had to create the legend of the Desert Fox
>Muh Monty, this guy is soooo good because his tempo of operations is terrible
>Italy, entirely Chuchill's idea
>Utterly stymied in western europe after D-Day
>Market-Garden
>basically lost the battle of the atlantic till murica came around
>Sells off most of Europe to the soviets in the postwar, turns around and goes muh Iron Curtain
>Even their helmets are terrible
Yeah it's astounding how even winning WWI so thoroughly fricked the UK and France socially, economically, and militarily.
WWII would've been really dull without us funding/supplying the allies
if Churchill had conceded to reality and made peace with Hidler ww2 would have ended then and there. Nothing terrible would have happened, the world wouldn't have ended and millions of lives would have been saved
oh I'm sorry must've missed the part where the Japanese weren't eying up my country at the same time.
Sorry flip/Thai ladyboy/whatever variety of Black personchink you are, but your jungle shithole is rightful Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere clay.
>not wanting to fight for some nice ladyboy wiener
He's talking about Australia you fricking mong
'We never had enough troops to [invade Australia]. We had already far out-stretched our lines of communication. We did not have the armed strength or the supply facilities to mount such a terrific extension of our already over-strained and too thinly spread forces. We expected to occupy all New Guinea, to maintain Rabaul as a holding base, and to raid Northern Australia by air. But actual physical invasion—no, at no time'.
- Hideki Tojo, before his execution
Imagine what the Pacific would have been like if that's the only theater of war America had to focus on. Hundreds of Essex-class carriers I tremble at even the thought of such an amazing timeline
D-Day, except Japan and a frickton more casualties.
Imagine Asia now under Japanese rule... wait, that would be better.
Millions of Australian men not having to be deployed to Europe and Africa would have probably helped with that potentiality tbh
>If Hidler had conceited to reality
FTFY
Apparently we're in the BoBo phase of /misc/ tourists
Does /misc/ even like nazis anymore? Pretty sure it's the only thing putin managed to denazify
>noooo it’s the guy that won the war that had to face reality
>if Churchill had conceded to reality and made peace with Hidler ww2 would have ended then and there. Nothing terrible would have happened, the world wouldn't have ended and millions of lives would have been saved
True, they entered the war over Poland and handed it over to Russia
ROOSEVELT
ROOSEVELT
ROOSEVELT
ROOSEVELT
Do you people even know where Yalta is?
>Do you people even know where Yalta is?
Yalta, Idaho, is southwest of Moscow, duh
if you adjust the angles and how far you're willing to travel; yea, you are correct.
When will this Russian agit prop end.
The entire treaty was to defend against Germany, that was literally it.
And even though that was the case, the bongs still spent decades trying to free Poland.
>if Churchill had conceded to reality and made peace with Hidler ww2 would have ended then and there. Nothing terrible would have happened, the world wouldn't have ended and millions of lives would have been saved
it truly would have been peace in our time
Surely that would be the peace agreement that Hitler would never break
He was the Putin of his time, untrustworthy and always about to attack.
sometimes I wonder if you people even know when churchill became PM
like of course someone who has read a single paragraph about WW2 would know what they're saying is impossible even if their worldview of hitler being right is correct, but at the same time it's said with such conviction
>Nothing terrible would have happened
Being forced to speak g*rman and adopt g*rman customs would be the most evil thing to happen to all the people on this Earth. Also, Churchill became PM in 1940 you massive mongoloid /misc/Black person tourist.
>forced to speak german
Are you polish? This would not have happened to any western European or American country.
If he got the remaining ethnic Germans what other reason would he have to invade?
This is all pointless when you come to the realization that united world israelitery is behind the world wars (started and funded both of them and all sides of each war) so that the end result would be their further financial takeover of all European powers as well as the deletion of millions of the most able bodied men of the each of the nations involved. We truly live in a matrix since this takeover
If the Nazis had won, they'd have gassed subhumans such as yourself. You're right, we have been denied a better world.
Hitler is the one who made Churchill PM lmao
Churchill was saying in 1938 "this Austrian homie is gonna keep invading countries, kick his ass right now" but Chamberlain chose to negotiate and sacrificed Czechoslovakia to appease the Germans.
Then Churchill was immediately vindicated when Hitler annexed Czechia and invaded Poland.
Hitler broke his agreement with Chamberlain and thereby ensured no serious British leader would make himself look like a fool again.
The UK shouldn't have stuck its nose in places it didn't belong and made unenforceable guarantees which made war inevitable.
Really trying to figure out where you’re from, I’ve never seen a country live so rent free in your head. Keep crying and Rule Brittania.
>loses empire in gay war they started for no reason
>The UK shouldn't have stuck its nose in places it didn't belong
Germany shouldn't have invaded countries which didn't belong to them?
Czechs speak Czech, Poles speak Polish. They are not Germans and do not want to be Germans.
Bro the reason he invaded is because they had huge populations of ethnic Germans who did speak German, the allies should not have partitioned Germany as they did.
The sudentenland did speak German, as did most of Danzig
Having people speak your language in another country has never been a proper casus belli against that country.
Then why did you claim the fact they didn't speak the language meant he was unjustified? If a bunch of ethnic Americans in Hawaii were suddenly under Japanese occupation, wouldn't that give us SOME reason to want Hawaii?
That moron said "Czechs don't speak German" as if that has ant relevance when there literally were German speaking people there. Plenty of slavs liked the Germans and the Poles actually had amicable relations until their leadership changed. Many Germans were actively discriminated against on Poland.
>Plenty of slavs liked the Germans and the Poles actually had amicable relations until their leadership changed. Many Germans were actively discriminated against on Poland.
Yeah, they admired Germany, until Germany elected a lunatic who wrote and published a book where he talks about exterminating them and expanding Germany to the east at their expense. This isn't a secret document, Hitler was very public about all this and wrote a best seller on it kek.
Czechs not being Germans is relevant, they have their country and it's not Germany and therefore Germany shouldn't invade them. It's quite simple.
>Many Germans were actively discriminated against on Poland.
Meh. My great grandad owned a sugar mill in Poland (south of Danzig) and he kept running his business. Danzig itself was a city state with a NSDAP majority council government actually, Polish government couldn't rule over them, which is exactly why they built the Polish port of Gdnyia instead.
Bro the balts and Ukrainians were very pro German well into the war. Hitler never discusses genociding slavs but rather expansion into them as they were weak states. This is how nations worked universally until the idealists of the twentieth century gained dominance.
>Czechs not being Germans is relevant
Your logic was as follows
>Czechs aren't Germans so he shouldn't invade
okay but what about all the Germans that did live there
>W-well thats irrelevant
The Czechs were not even fully annexed, they were made a puppet state with defined borders. The western powers should not have trapped two million Germans in czechoslovakia and not expected that to cause issues.
> The western powers should not have trapped two million Germans in czechoslovakia and not expected that to cause issues.
Western powers shouldn't have even left a german state after ww1.
This guy actually thinks Hitler wasn't going to genocide the slavs after he got full power over them.
They basically did nothing wrong and were really nice to them after the war, given how their populations were treated by "anti-partisan groups" and Hitler's explicit desire to colonize the east. It doesn't take a genius to put two and two together.
Also there was 0 intention of creating an independent Ukraine they wouldn't even get protectorate or general government status they were just going to get rolled over native american style. Modern LARPers are moronic.
Buddy states naturally expand their borders, Germany could not have occupied all of thdt territory with a hostile regime and there's no evidence of wanting any Slavic mass genocide anywhere. General plan ost has one shitty document backing any sort of situation like that, not to mention all of the temporary governments outside of Poland had natives in charge.
Oh, no shit? My grandmother is from Danzig. I've asked her about the war a few times, I'm fairly sure she'd prefer having to cross the border a few times and live in Poland, rather than getting throw into an Autistic freak's "Vernichtungskrieg" and having her entire Prussian homeland wiped out in the process because they successfully pissed off every Slav in Europe to a biblical level.
I'm well aware of the Sudetenland, what you're forgetting is that the Brits actually agreed and they let the Germans have it, do you not learn about the Munich Agreement in school? The Brits sold out the Czechs just to appease Germany, hence why Chamberlain is called a coward. Germany shat on this agreement in less than a year and proceeded to also invade and annex Czech speaking areas.
So true.
Based. I also hate all british except for the top gear chads and Oswald Mosley.
It's sad Britain sided with France instead of Germany at all since they were both Germanic Protestants. Now look at the state of Europe
religion hadn't mattered in geopolitics for hundreds of years at that point
Anglicans barely count as Protestants
Sure the British army had many flaws, but they were far from the worst in WW2, they had their successes.
For example They utterly humiliated the Italians in North Africa before the Germans intervened.
mostly thanks to Australia. once they left they started losing everything in Africa
Like the other anon said, without australia the brits got immediately fricked in the ass by the guidos.
No it was the black female amputees who bailed them out
I wonder where the Aussies got the vast majority of there arms and resources from?
Without the rest of the Commonwealth, they'd just be a backwater shithole surrounded by the Empire of Japan and you know it.
I still wouldn't say the Italians were the worst either, given picrel. Just take this in context that the winners here got fricking rolled by the western Allies and realize that not only was Operation Unthinkable entirely possible (and would have been a damn cakewalk even without the nuking Moscow) and the only opposition to it was communist sympathizers.
The Italians got wrecked on the Eastern Front and the Soviets single handedly fricked the combined armies of mainland Europe
>single handedly
You mean with ridiculous amounts of American aid in the forms of guns, tanks, and other material required to wage a European land war? Aid that without which, even Stalin himself admitted there would have been a German flag flying over the Kremlin?
If FDR wasn't a communist sympathizer, there would have been no Soviet Union after 1945. Be that because we didn't give them any aid to begin with, or because Patton rolled our tanks up to Moscow and took that aid back in exchange for the Stars and Stripes flying over the Kremlin instead.
>Loses almost the entire military in '41, has to rebuild from scratch
>Industry only kept afloat by convoy after convoy of American lend lease
>takes 3:1 casualties in practically every engagement, even as the Wehrmacht was out of fuel, men, material and food and was actively collapsing
>loses so many people that the population never recovered, even 80 years later
truly military geniuses
Who hasn't humiliated Italy?
One free french colonel captured basically single-handely (with a fireteam on motorbikes) the entire italian command of east africa. (The commander of italian forces of east africa, 8 generals, 440 officers 9500 soldiers and sailors, 100 tanks and 127 guns).
>Italy, entirely Chuchill's idea
Allies liberated all of France, Belgium, the Netherlands and West Germany but could not advance past the middle of Italy lol
Because of Clark.
Wtf liberating flatlands is easier than fighting in a narrow mountainous península
a joke of a military, though please don't call them Commonwealth. Australians fought well
also
>surrendering Singapore with barely a fight
>those stupid helmets with no wides and extremely thin metal
Success breeds jealousy, and Hollwood breeds contempt.
I'm curious about what Monty did with his own personal B-52. Does anyone know?
still won tho
Germans and Italians must really be baboon apes
I forgot the failed bomber harris shit was a British idea
>failed
post your dresden old town. the combined bomber offensive destroyed so much much german logistics and tied up so many guns and fighters it completely dwarfs the war in the Atlantic.
it just killed a bunch of civilians you subhuman c**t
But you love what Russia is doing in Ukraine, right?
Are you honestly comparing dresden, where bomber Harris killed in a single night 100k germans, about the same number of dead from all causes in the ukrainian conflict?
Are you seriously comparing the callous and industrial grade bomber offensives to some vatniks throwing a few hundred missiles and flying mopeds with tnt and questionable accuracy?
25-35k at most
Well if it isnt the consequences of their own actions.
>it didn't kill enough germans and they should have killed the rest
fixed that for you you wehrboo homosexual cuck
funny how the germans tried the blitz and fricked that up too. germans actually can't do anything right. do it again, bomber harris.
you can't unironically be saying this as a german, that's for sure
Dresden was the railway transport hub for the entire eastern front, as well as a major industrial centre, it was logistically vital for the German war effort. A lot of civilians died, its true, but that was not the intention, although it was an accepted possible consequence. The British didnt start mass bombing, but they played the game the Germans had started, and played it better, Germans have no right to complain. Dresden wouldnt have happened if The Blitz had not.
>bomb warsaw
>bomb rotterdam
>do the blitz
>WAAAAH WE DIN'DU NUFFIN POOR 40 GORILLION DREDSEN GERMANS
>dresden
>it just killed a bunch of civilians you subhuman c**t
It also denied the Soviets an intact fully functional rail transport hub and city for what would become Soviet territory agreed at Yalta for the feared soviet push or cold war
Yalta confrence 4–11 February 1945
Dresden bombing 13 Feb 1945 – 15 Feb 1945
Does it make sense now?
The soviets literally asked the allies to bomb dresden, I dunno wtf your point is here
Women and children staff factories and logistics centers.
What is the Blitz you Wehraboo frick?
wow killing the civvies (old men, women, kids....) really ended the war quickly Harris! WOAH, BASED? Kill every civillian in the town you were going to occupy anyways before they can surrender just because??? Warcrimes, BASED???
>DO YOU WANT TOTAL WAR?
You got it chums
>Bombs everyone elses historic cities
>REEEEE MUH DRESDEN
Kek, do it again bomber Harris
Sleep tight bomber.
sleep tight bomber
Sleep tight bomber 🙂
Sleep tight bomber
sleep tight bomber
>if god wanted the germans to win, why did he make them so flamable?
sleep tight bomber
sleep tight bomber
>Sleep tight bomber
DO IT AGAIN BOMBER HARRIS
sleep tight bomber
"sleep tight bomber"
>onsistently the worst tanks of the entire war with underpowered guns
tbh Comet wasn't so bad and Centurion was pretty good.
>muh universal carrier
Not as good as Hanomag or M3, but not a bad machine either.
>Sten
First and last models were alright. Others inbetween are horrific.
>PIAT. This thing couldn't even be reloaded under fire
I've heard some good things about PIAT.
>Chindits
Outside of malaria, seems to be about as hard as soviet-finnish recon wars in 1942-43, when most of the job was done by partisans and scout groups on skis.
>Italy, entirely Chuchill's idea
What's so bad about Italian invasion? I may not know this.
>Sells off most of Europe to the soviets in the postwar, turns around and goes muh Iron Curtain
First, they did all they could to support right wing resistance in Greece and they won the Greece.
Second, they did support antisoviet guerillas/bandits/freedom fighters/call them as you like in Eastern Europe - Forest Brothers, Armia Krajowa, Cetnici, UPA, Kings of Sumava.
Considering that western allies weren't ready to start another war with soviets, they couldn't do more than they already did in that situation. It turned out that it wasn't enough or that SMERSH and MGB managed to undermine their actions.
>Chindits
These guys did glider borne suicide missions behind enemy lines with no appreciable strategic purpose not only once, but twice. Imagine cobbling together a special force just to have them get surrounded by Japs in the woods while having supply and disease issues, and there isn't a hope in hell of artillery support.
The Chindits weren't special forces units as we know them today.
Basically, for every company being sent to Burma, they'd pick one of the training regiments and go "Right, you lads are going to be Chindits" and specifically trained them for Jungle Warfare and Long-Range Recon. Because of that, there were thousands of them all over the place that fought where the Japanese were weakest. People forget that the Japanese detested fighting in jungles and only did so because it was the best way to get to where they actually wanted to fight, so just put up with it despite the fact it made supply lines a nightmare and the mostly urban population of Japan died as horribly to tropical diseases as their European counterparts.
People forget that the bongs did frickall for years, until the US destroyed japanese air and naval power.
Italy was an absolute attritional grind that the axis had the advantage of. We were still fighting there into 1945 with no real progress.
>Italy was an absolute attritional grind that the axis had the advantage of
Stalin wanted a second front, D-day wasn't ready yet, boots on the ground in the peninsular drew German divisions away from the East right as the Russians were prepping to assfrick Army Group South (again).It also took Italy and thus freed up most of the USN and RN in the med to go do shit elsewhere. A sound strategic move.
If memory serves Stalin didn't think much of the Italian sideshow for obvious reasons
>If memory serves Stalin didn't think much of the Italian sideshow for obvious reasons
Memory does not serve.
>Sells off most of Europe to the soviets in the postwar
That was fricking Roosevelt, do you know a single fricking thing about any of the people involved in this war or does your personality end where your lips meet Hitler's balls?
People make fun of Italy for having poor heavy industries but people don't realize Britain's wonky shit was produced mostly by repurposed bike shops and other smaller industries as well. Its why their tanks are the shit show they are too.
Anons ITT
>I know nothing and I must post
Worst army easily goes to Italy but in fairness they werent expecting war to begin until 1940/1941. Its been widely acknowledged Hitler knew Mussolini didnt want war until then but their alliance was structured to cover both offensive and defensive wars. Still their equipment was meme tier and they got btfo by the Greeks and had to beg for help. After that Japan is an easy second because the entire war was the army and navy having s perpetual slapfight for resources while their gains collapsed around them.
Their personal equipment was actually pretty good, but they didnt have enough of it as mussolini had just not planned for such an early war and had sold most of their stocks which they suddenly needed. The exception being their squad machine guns, which belonged in the 1890s, and the lack of any decent tank designs in any quantity, or attempts to design decent tanks which were either sensible or were actually produced. Admittedly most tanks in 1939/1940 were pretty bad but still, britain and germany have cruaders and panzer IIIs, and then Italy just has...rubbish little tankettes, including their "medium" tanks, which dont exceed 13 tonnes. They only just make a prototype for a competitor to the fricking crusader III in 1943. And they only make 103 P26/40s, which are supposed to be "heavy tanks" and yet have only a 50mm glacis, this would have been good in 1940 but, again, they only start production in 1943.
Planes were generally decent, although fraught with issues and generally underpowered, excepting the G.55 and C.205, of which very few were built. Navy had a lot of powerful ships which were pretty good too, at least in design, shame they never accomplished anything of note. Italians just didnt have the industrial base to go to war in the first place, much less continuously adapt and produce on parity with Britain (or Germany) during the war.
Strong fricking post OP.
A rare treat
>20-30 round box lmg the entire war
The Bren is frequently acknowledged as being one of, if not THE best LMGs of the entire war outside of BARgays. It's a LIGHT MACHINE GUN, not a big heavy GPMG like the MG-42 or M1919.
shoulda been belt fed. A 30 round box isn't any better than the BAR and the amerifats found it wanting/replaced with the m1919a6
>A 30 round box isn't any better than the BAR and the amerifats found it wanting/replaced with the m1919a6
M1919, as the name suggests, came out the same time the BAR did and was the standard LMG throughout the war.
You're an idiot.
m1919a6 was pushed into service as an lmg around the time of normandy you frickwit
>During the war it became clear to the US military that the M1918 Browning Automatic Rifle, while portable, was not sufficient as a sustained fire weapon due to its fixed barrel and 20-round magazine... the military decided that a stop-gap solution would be best and adapted an existing design. The M1919A6 was an attempt at such a solution... first saw combat service in the fall of 1943
what you're trying to say is
>it was moved into rifle squads after Normandy
M1919 has always been an LMG, since 1919.
It's a GPMG, not a LMG. Fricks sake.
It became as GPMG, it was an LMG.
ding ding ding
HMG. M1919s before the A6 were tripod-mounted 60+-pound affairs that required multiple men just to carry them around.
>M1919 has always been an LMG, since 1919,
Wrong. It was a company-level, tripod-mounted HMG before the A6 variant.
>M1919A6
>15kg
>LMG
The US machine guns were woeful vs their contemporaries, both the M1918 BAR and M1919 were overweight for their roles.
The only good MG is the M2, but that doesn't really have any contemporaries outside the Dshka
>LMG
>fed from loose box
No real LMG does this, because it would be extremely impractical.
Either gunner will take very long to to fire after moving or he will have just a short muddy belt getting stuck everywhere.
I could've sworn the a6 could attach the box
Belt feeding is heavy as frick you mong. They didn't have fricking 5.56 back then.
>BREN
BAR had a 20 round mag. Your point?
>Enfield
One of the most iconic rifles ever made.
>consistently the worst tanks of the entire war
Infantry tanks werent bad if you consider their role. Comet was a fantastic tank and so was the Firefly.
>artillery
No. Just no.
QF 25, BL 4.5-inch, BL 5.5-inch, BL 7.2-inch which were their standard guns all entered service in the late 30's early 40's.
>Utterly stymied in western Europe after D-Day
Because they baited every German armored division in France and then fixed them so Patton could do his thing? A battle that not only set the stage for the breakout but resulted in the British suffering WW1 tier casualties, casualties they struggled to make up since they had been at war for 5 years at that point.
>Market Garden
Operation Varsity
>sells of most of Europe
Most egregious of your errors. That was 10001% Roosevelt.
>7.2 inch
In 1940 the British Army concluded that the only heavy howitzer available to it, the First World War-era BL 8-inch howitzer, had insufficient range for the conditions of the Second World War. As a stopgap the decision was made to re-line the existing barrels to a smaller calibre and develop a new range of ammunition to achieve the desired ranges
check out those wedges!
You do realize that gun is a Corps level piece? So, the criticism is
>this very specific piece of specialist equipment, a 182mm gun, is from WW1
imagine having a gun that literally jumps in the air every time it fires because the munition is too potent for the carriage and your response is "okay, let's start hauling around wedges"
...
The problem is?
So in other words, they used old WWI guns as an ingredient to build new WWII guns.
>One of the most iconic rifles ever made.
That doesn't mean it's good. All of the early century bolt actions are iconic, and all of them were outdated shit by the 40s.
Lee Enfield with its big magazine and quick to cycle configuration was probably the best bolt action of the war but that's nothing compared to the M1. It's a triumph alone that they are even comparable in equipment to other major powers despite being closer to Italy in size though GB was nonetheless slower to develop some weapons (tanks, even despite being the most advanced in them during interwar) than others.
Mostly American supply autism delaying not fully developed but needed weapons though HVAP was probably just failing to forsee a need which is hard to do when you're consistently winning.
They didnt foresee it because the US had never fought with tanks before, and were actively ignoring the British experience in north africa, advice to upgun tanks, and intelligence that there were several thousand Panthers. A few listened and pushed to get the Pershing into production, but were prevented.
Its a paper box the size of a Tiger II, the armour isnt thick or sloped enough to be effective, the sides are massive, flat, relatively thin, and prominent due to its gigantic profile. The 75mm turret is cast and thin, the m4 and m4a1s hulls are cast, the 76mm turret is better but still cast. The 75mm is a gun 3/4 years out of date, which cannot effectively frontally deal with any german armour except for the relatively small number of similarly obsolete panzer IVs, or a very good shot on a StUG. The 76mm can deal with most TDs which bumps up the % of german tanks it can fight frontally, but is relatively ineffective vs panthers, and almost completely frontally ineffective against anything heavier or heavy TDs. These were in total about 1/3 of German armour present. It cannot neutral steer, its centre of gravity is high and its tracks are very thin, which leaves it with very high ground pressure for its size, leaving it with poor rough terrain capabilities. Sure a few had 'wet' ammo stowage, but 80% did not and instead fairly often catastrophically cooked off when hit. It was an absolutely terrible tank which was only used because it was already being made+supplied for, and was genuinely as expendable and cheap as the T-34 is memed to be. Britain would take whatever it could get and had figured out how to Black person rig a 17pdr into one, and the US had convinced themselves that only 100 panthers existed and the King Tiger was a myth before D-Day. US shouldve put Pershings into production before D-Day, Britain shouldve put more effort into rushing the Centurion into production instead of spending a year playing with the suspension and transmission.
>except for the relatively small number of similarly obsolete panzer IVs
and this is how I know you are just moronic
MUH HORDES of panzers and tigers has always been a total myth
This how i know youre moronic. The number of Panzer ivs was similar to the number of Panthers.
1943-45
Tiger II-569
Tiger I-1,290
Elefant/Ferdinand-90
Panther (chasis)-6,557
-Panther-6,144
-Jagdpanther-413
Panzer IV (chasis)-11,537
-Panzer IV(tank)-6,543
-StuG IV (TD)-1,141
-Jpz IV (TD)-2,000-2,200
-Hummel (SPG)-714
-Sturmpanzer IV (SPG)-somewhere around 300
-Nashorn (SPG)-some of 494 total
Pz 38(t)
-(Hetzer TD)-2,827
-(Marder III SPG)-1,392
Panzer III
-(STUG IIIG TD)-8,432
-(STUH 42 SPG/TD)-1,299
-Nashorn (SPG)-some of 494 total
-*A handful of panzer III Ns, flame tanks, and command tanks were produced between late 1942 and early 1943, these are the last panzer iiis to be produced, most existing stocks are converted to StUG, to an ARV, or used for training purposes. Numbering about 50 command tanks, 700 Ns, and 100 flame tanks. e.g. Around 173 were converted to stug in mid 1944, very few see frontline service after 1943.
As you can see. Most German tanks were SPGs. From a frontal angle the 75mm is inadequate for many.
Tiger II- immune to 76+75mm
Tiger I-mostly immune, unangled ufp vuln to 76mm <500m
Elefant-immune
Panther-immune to 75mm, turret at <100m to 76mm or to ~900m with tungsten AP.
Jagdpanther-immune
JpzIV-"
Hetzer-immune to 75mm, vulnerable to 76mm
Sturmpanzer-"
Stug III G-Resistant to 75mm (mostly proof but transmission and gunner/driver ports vulnerable), mostly vulnerable to 76mm
STUG IV-"
STUH42-"
Panzer IV-vulberable to 76mm, partially resistant to 75mm (glacis sometimes resistant at >500m at an angle, turret vulnerable at all ranges)
Nashorn-vulnerable to 75+76mm
Hummel-"
Marder III-"
10,500-700 =completely or mostly resistant to both
13,999=mostly resistant to 75mm, vuln to 76mm
6,543=partially resistant to 75mm, vuln to 76mm
2,600=not armoured vs most tank calibres
24,699/33,842= ~72.9% of german armour from 1943-45 is mostly or completely frontally resistant to 75mm. Shit gun. 76mm better but still struggles with ~1/3 of armour.
>the size of a Tiger II
>in the pic it is very clearly not the size of a Tiger II
what did he mean by this?
The Afrika Korps was not one division. Unsurprisingly, it was an army corps. Plus they had the support of multiple elite Italian armored divisions and 10+ infantry divisions.
15th panzer/21st panzer. You have autism
I do not give a shit about German civilians and I never will. Stop crying your crocodile tears about the heckin innocent civilorinos.
Anglos are like Russians, if you question any of their military history or actions they spurg out.
not all of us. I don't know why there's so much Anglo homosexualry on the board as of late. We've always been about doing a lot with a little, there's no shame in it but there's a new wave of sperging behaviour that makes me cringe.
There's enough success to offset the long history of leadership blunders, I don't really know where all this insecure homosexualry is coming from
Mhmm. How about you frick off and die warriortard your threads are gay and aids
Don't mention vietnam,
>sells off most of europe to the soviets
homie WHAT?
Roosevelt is responsible for all of the soviet pandering after the war. Churchill had to order Britain to race to occupy Denmark and make a dash to Berlin because Roosvelt was fine letting the soviets occupy anything. Churchill proposed an immediate invasion of the USSR which the Americans refused to agree to. Churchill complained about the explusion of Germans from territories not agreed to at Yalta, Roosevelt just shrugged, Churchill complained about the continuing occupation of Poland, Roosevelt just shrugged. Bavraia wanted to elect a king and become their own nation, America said no. Both America and the USSR encouraged the decolonisation movement, which caused both Britain and France to decline, the latter into civil chaos, and opened up about 1/3 of the world to soviet influence as well as indirectly starting the Vietnam War. America would go on to back Egypt in the Suez Crisis, causing political chaos in NATO-aligned Europe. American foreign policy was and is constantly schitzophrenic and chaotic, with no seeming purpose other than to frick over its allies and create problems for itself in the future.
>America would go on to back Egypt in the Suez Crisis, causing political chaos
t. ahistorical moron
The feeble bongs and frogs, having embraced 60 years of humiliation and defeat, decided to posture again, and invade Egypt. This gave the USSR an excuse to invade Hungary and slaughter 40,000 people, and reenslave the rest.
So the bong morons extended the Cold War and got people killed, fighting a greedy war they couldn't win in any event because they're forever morons.
>This gave the USSR an excuse to invade Hungary and slaughter 40,000 people, and reenslave the rest.
Fricking what? The USSR would have let the Hungarian revolution slide?
What defeats had britain suffered in the 60 years before suez? Only France had actually been humiliated by being occupied.
The USSR was always going to react to the hungarian revolution by invading, any pretext or excuse the USSR used or ever used was nothing more than political convenience, and either another exuse would be found, or none would and they'd just do it anyways and blame NATO agitators and/or cite something banal like 'security concerns" or "responding to the pleas of the hungarian government to restore order". They were never EVER going to let the Hungarians break away, because when one does and the USSR doesnt use force, they all do, their leadership and academics may have wanted to be there but the vast majority of the populace did not *and* had very recently been totally ideologically at war with the USSR, and thats exactly what happened to the eastern bloc in the end. You must work for the American foreign office, because you are a blithering arrogant moron just trying to shit stir.
>What defeats had britain suffered in the 60 years before suez?
All of them? Why do you think they were starving and on rations then?
>The USSR was always going to react to the hungarian revolution by invading,
No, but the bong morons ensured they would, and gave them license to slaughter tens of thousands of Hungarians.
I know this is a troll thread but the bit about Chindits caught my eye. Look up Operation Thursday. 77 Brigade, Mad Mike Calvert and the Battle of Mogaung if you like stories of endurance and warriorshit.
No strategic value whatsoever. Just bongs being bongs, hunting headlines.
>worst tanks
that'd be italy
>consistently underpowered guns
that'd be america
>heavy artillery is ww1 vintage
some of it was, so was some of everywhere else's
>sten
mass-produced garden shed version of sterling, same principle as the grease gun except worked better
>PIAT
More commonly used as an anti-emplacement weapon
>Chindits
The first commandos
>North Africa
Won that
>Italy
Knocked out Italy as a power, held up along with the USA by massive german reinforcements and difficult terrain
>D-Day
Most troops landed, paras didnt drown and actually completed their objectives, unlike the US ones, most successful landings, had to clear the hardest and densest concentrations of inland fortifications. Then got attacked by, and defeated, most of the armour in Northern France, while the US only had to deal with 1+1/2 armoured divisions.
>Market-Garden
Not sure what your complaint is
>Lost battle of the atlantic
No.
>Sells off Europe
His name behins with R and he was an American politician. Britain wanted to invade the USSR and knock it out quickly while it was weak.
>Helmets are terrible
Theyre fine for the time and were more effective vs bullets than the thinner US ones.
contrary to popular belief, Italian tanks were perfectly fine at the beginning of the war
imo the worst tanks of WW2 were the japs’
Market Garden was a huge disaster and marked the death of the British Empire. After that the Americans never listened to the British again.
>consistently underpowered guns
what does this even mean
>basically lost the battle of the atlantic till murica came around
Black person what the frick are you smoking
i think he means the pacific, cause the british got their asses kicked there too in the early stages
Consistently BTFO by the Nips in Asia too.
>in the early stages
The two years Britain was literally the only Allied power, fighting the entire Axis on multiple fronts?
still lost your empire so you lost at the end too kek
america was part of the pacific war when the british lost singapore and burma, but they werent there en mass and the american industrial machine hadnt fully spun up
british codebreaking did give the americans a gigantic advantage and saved their asses multiple times though
bongs are so fricking insufferable. they truly believe to be superior to everybody even though they're a bunch of fat drunks living on the brink of economic collapse. and even when they used to be powerful they slaved their miserable lives under the nobility they love so much. truly despicable people.
Hard to disagree. Their delusions of importance have cost them bigly.
Nobody believes that you moronic sack of grease. We suck and you suck just as much. You're insecure about bongland because you will never ever have our history or our cultural output. At least we had a moment in the sun and left behind us beautiful things. Your legacy is set to be dancing minstrels in Disney films and obese creatures born of miscegenation.
Stop embarrassing your self and your country, please.
Can you vocaroo that so I can hear it your clear cut ebonics?
You're just getting more pathetic. Not even worth laughing at any more.
>Dodges question
You are quite literally non white, aren't you?
The average Tommy Atkins they sent to rape white women and destroy property wasn't much better than the average Black person, either.
t.pedro gonzalez american patriot
What language are you speaking now?
You do understand you're just proving their point, right? Are British people really this stupid?
So what language is that?
american
We speak your language and we don't think about you at all. So, well done. Try not to get confused when no one takes your shit country seriously.
you seem to be quite mad about us at the moment, for some reason
Yeah about as mad as I am about the existence of Sudan or Romania or any other irrelevant shithole.
Yeah that's why you make a dozen angry threads about the Sudan and Romania every week.
Keep seething my brown friend.
does your military get armour technology, in-flight refuelling systems, jet engines, and license its microprocessor technology from Sudan?
:^)
yet you still rely on us for a lot of military technology. Really rinks your dink
American.
This is the one thing people get wrong about bongland. We know we're the little underdog island, and we're more aware of it than anyone else. We have embraced this a long time ago. Nobody likes the nobility either, it's just that having a monarch diverts the jingoistic flag waving nationalistic horseshit towards the monarch, thereby ensuring we will never worship and sperg out over the actual political leaders. The monarchy buys us lifetime immunity from Trump rallies, so actual prime ministers just get the scorn they deserve.
Why do you think its so rare to see a UK flag over here? Outside of the poimp and ceremony in the capital, we don't like that flag waving shit, it's cringe. We only go in for nationalism with thick irony.
We know we're trash, yet the worlds nations celebrate their independence from us anyway. And we're not even proud of it.
The UK wasn't equipped to take on Nazi Germany but did anyway, did it alone for a long time, and yet again managed to scrape another victory for the pile, defeating them when they actually threatened the mainland even with all our industrial cities on fire
It's the US honestly, they could do frick all without fire support or CAS
Brainlet CoD tier take. Fire support and CAS IS what an army is built around. Almost all tasks the infantry will do is revolved around protecting armour and co-ordinating artillery. Deaths from small arms throughout the war was probably >10% with deaths from individual rifles being maybe at >2%. The vast majority of deaths come from mortars, artillery, armour and CAS, and the American army dominated later war because they slapped a radio on every platoon, and using pre plotted artillery can destroy a target 5 minutes after taking fire. What your saying is basically the same as going "Michael Phelps is only a famous swimmer because of his speed, he could do frick all without it."
>20-30 round box lmg the entire war
Also had exceptional accuracy and range
>bolt actions the entire war; can't even make a straight shooting jungle carbine
Le mad minute
>consistently the worst tanks of the entire war with underpowered guns
The worst british tank shits on the best japanese/italian tanks, also the Cromwell is consistently underrated because muh bocage. Agree everything else was mostly crap and the cruiser/infantry tank paradigm was a massive blunder
>muh universal carrier!
A basic, reliable all-purpose vehicle, g*rms made heavy use of captured models
>heavy artillery is ww1 vintage with new munitions; literally had to use wooden blocks to keep the gun from jumping away
If it works it works
>Sten
Objectively dogshit
>PIAT. This thing couldn't even be reloaded under fire
Only MANPAT that could take out the late-war heavies, lift more pussy
>Chindits suicide missions. Just look it up, no other army would ever have reinforced such titanic failures
True, Wingate was a fricking psychopath. A terrible indictment of the upper class old boy network that blights Britain to this day.
>Completely BTFO by one panzer div in North Africa so badly they had to create the legend of the Desert Fox
True, mostly Churchill's fault for sperging over Greece.
>Muh Monty, this guy is soooo good because his tempo of operations is terrible
Monty tempo is what finally broke Rommel. He was a huge pissbaby about working with Eisenhower though, weird looking c**t.
>Italy, entirely Chuchill's idea
True
>Utterly stymied in western europe after D-Day
True
>Market-Garden
Good strategy shafted by the worst intelligence frickup of the war
>basically lost the battle of the atlantic till murica came around
It's spelled LIDAR
>Sells off most of Europe to the soviets in the postwar, turns around and goes muh Iron Curtain
True
>Even their helmets are terrible
True
You forgot the Boys homosexual
> the cruiser/infantry tank paradigm was a massive blunder
The Germans did the same thing with their initial planned paradigm or panzer IIIs and short barrel panzer IVs.
Also, it's not so much a massive blunder as a less optimal use of resources. It'll still work on the offense. it's less effective on the defense but then again, German tanks weren't really planned to be used defensively either. In Rommel's playbook, you use tanks for offense and anti-tank guns for defense.
The meta strat, the MBT that everyone now follows was invented by the Brits.
This is a dumb bait thread for morons and /misc/Black folk though. I like the Brits and if by nothing other than geography they were the crucial lynchpin in defeating Germany.
I would argue that late war Panthers with most of the mechanical problems ironed out were the only WW2 tanks that didn't objectively suck
That seems like you would need a rather narrow definition for "doesn't suck" to come to that outcome.
I would also argue the Comet was in many ways the equal of the panther, with better reliability from the off. A slightly worse gun (but arguably better ammunition) and worse armor. The comet was faster though with much better power to weight (which is more important off road) and were lighter, which meant they had better strategic mobility.
I also suppose it depends on whether you consider the Centurion a ww2 tank (I don't).
I would also say the M26 is better than the panther, better gun, equivalent armor, slower but again more reliable with better strategic mobility.
>True, Wingate was a fricking psychopath. A terrible indictment of the upper class old boy network that blights Britain to this day.
It's more complicated than that. The initial chindit missions were very successful, considering the resources put into them. The mistake that was made was believing they could be scaled up indefinitely. But that's often the thing about success, it's dangerous. It makes smart people think they can't lose.
>Market garden
Plus, the actual broken link in Market Garden was the Americans. The 82nd parachute division was late to their bridge and it had been reinforced, they then had to wait for British reinforcements and by the time they took the bridge the operation was way behind schedule and the Germans had time to bring up armour.
Not really, XXX corps was very behind schedule. If they had been there to support the 82nd, the bridge would have fallen faster.
The plan was too ambitious overrall, with too many failure points. And yet, with everything that went wrong, the American and British soldiers on the ground NEARLY made it work. Like it had no right to come even as close as it did to success. Market Garden is literally the counter argument to when people say American/British troops weren't good fighters in WW2. Because those poor bastards got handed a shit sandwich of circumstances and nearly made it work.
the reason the americans needed to wait for XXX corp was because they delayed for more than 24 hours after landing in trying to take the bridge, whole point of the plan was to seize the bridges quickly as possible and hold them while the armour linked up and passed through to arnhem 101st got theirs blown up, 82 didnt take theirs on time
ironically the only group to actually take their bridge on day one was frosts battalion which then had to try and hold the sodding thing fr 9 days while most of a panzer divisin tried to kill the british paras
>Agree everything else was mostly crap and the cruiser/infantry tank paradigm was a massive blunder
Comet was good, churchill was actually ok, slow but good cross country and ok gun
>Objectively dogshit
worked and cheap as frick to make, sure there were better SMGs but not for the cost
>Utterly stymied in western europe after D-Day
True
false, did better on D day than the americans, only failed in taking caen day one because of a large scale armoured counter attack from 21st panzer division, proceeded to draw 70% of the available german armour and 60%+ of the german infantry into the fighting for Caen freeing the americans to take Cherbourg and set up for Cobra, then fought to the rhine including some of the heaviest fighting in the wear to clear the reichswald,
>Good strategy shafted by the worst intelligence frickup of the war
but understandable not to believe dutch resistance warnings as dutch had been repeatedly infiltrated by german intelligence and while brave were not therefore entirely reliable, still could have worked if the americans had actually tried to take their bridge on day one at nijmegan instead of digging in around the dropzone. that delay cost days
>Even their helmets are terrible
false actually, protected a wider area from the primary threat which was overhead shrapnel, other designs covered more of neck but with thinner metal more easily penetrated and for greater cost.
and as for the Boys sure it was rapidly obsolete but ever major power entered ww1 with a antitank rifle in pretty much the same role the boys was in and all pretty much abandoned them around the same time for the same reason
Honestly the cruiser/infantry tank concept wasnt entirely wrong. Cruiser tanks (Crusader, Comet, Cromwell) were largely used for manoeuvre and killing other tanks, infantry tanks (Churchill) were slow but could cross most terrain and were primarily used with and against infantry very effectively. Ultimately the cruiser tank concept won out and evolved into the MBT, but the Churchill was good enough to be used into the 50s. The Centurion, while a little late, is the first MBT, and is still in use today as the Olifant, making it the longest actively serving tank design in the world, alongside maybe the IS-3 which NK may or may not still operate.
Imo nowadays, we are seeing a kind of move back to cruiser/infantry tank concept. With countries investing in much cheaper and lighter tank destroyers, to complement the increasingly heavy, expensive and difficult to deploy MBTs. Although frankly Britain never completely abandoned the concept, flawed or not, it simply changed to relatively slow and heavy infantry tanks dedicated to tank killing (chieftain, challenger)-but having more of the mobility of a cruiser, and cruiser tanks dedicated to going fast, providing infantry support, and scouting (scimitar, scorpion). Albeit frankly the chieftain absolutely did not have the mobility of a proper cruiser on account of the multifuel engine NATO meme'd Britain into adopting before completely abandoning it.
>Le mad minute
homosexual. Opinion discarded
Nobody has a right to complain about the Bren when the Italians had the Breda 30.
>decide disposable mags are a meme
>design gun to have non-removable 20rd mag
>have to reload magazine via stripper clips
>if mag is damaged, gun is unusable
>open topped mag and oiling system attracts dust and sand like nothing else
>sights are on the barrel, requiring resighting any time its changed
>have to change barrels every 200rds
Bergsaglieri drip goes hard
The Bren was fine, OP is just an ignorant American desperate to be the toughest guy in the imaginary room by making aggressively stupid statements and seeing if anyone challenges him.
Probably not the worst but definitely not the best, however its really not fair to treat the British army this way. The priority of the British government throughout the war was always Airforce > Navy > Army, with resources and skilled personnel being assigned in that order. If you measure airforces on a pound for pound basis, you'll find that the RAF absolutely BTFOs all other rival airforces by a huge margin. RAF pilots, maintenance crews, commanders, logisticians, scientists and especially engineers were of superlative quality. pic especially related.
off most of Europe to the soviets in the postwar, turns around and goes muh Iron Curtain
that's just wrong
the usa insisted on not using the british embasy in Teheran and instead using the soviet embasy. All the conversations between the american delegation where spied on because surprise surprise the soviets had their rooms bugged.
And from there on the soviets pushed harder and harder and the usa folded faster and faster.
Also don't forget that hating on the brits was more of a thing than hating on the soviets amongst american politicians and military personel.
So if anyone sold out eastern europe it was the usa.
It was totally the USA
British and russians have fricking HATED one another for centuries, even mid war propaganda dehumanised one another when they were allies, Churchill wanted to push on to Moscow
Patton did too, the israelite us israelited him out of existence and let the crumbling shambles of a state absorb poor war torn EEU
Frick Eisenhower
>Worst army of ww2 awards ceremony
1. France
2. Italy
3. Japan
4. Germany
5. UK/Commonwealth
6. US
7. Soviet Union
That's an extremely favorable view of an army that had little to offer other than endless manpower
Everything it achieved was done at eye wateringly high cost, but in terms of measurable effect, the Soviets did the most on the ground.
We weren't talking about what got done though, I thought
>USSR
>Entire officer corps purged before the start of the war
>little to no effort put into organisation or logistical issues
>tanks often abandoned because they forgot to feed the tankers or that resources need transport
>Britain supplied half of its logistics
>USA supplied the other half
>Spends the war pumping out scrap metal shrapnel boxes and accusing the dead of unpatriotic behaviour
>tactics consist of relying on infinite manpower and infinite space to retreat
>Makes crap planes, crap tanks and doesnt even have much in the way of ships
>Germany consistently sabotged or distracted and prevented from focusing on them at any point
>Air war effectively won elsewhere
>loses a significant proportion of its young male population while accomplishing no more than the other allies.
I understand the economic and logistical arguments, the Soviet Union was a basket case without US/UK support, but in terms of actual fighting the Soviets absorbed and eventually defeated 75-80% of German forces.
North Africa starved Germany of oil and took up a lot of manpower and tanks.
The Atlantic blockade prevented Germany from further supplies of oil, and nearly any supplies of rubber
Operations in Norway and bombings prevented the supply of Manganese for hardened steel
Battle of Britain and subsequent British fighter sweeps and British bombings took up much of german air power before barbarossa even began and then British+US gradually weakened the german industrial base, for one drastically reducing the number of Tiger IIs planned to be built from around 1000 to no more than 500 by the end of the war.
German forces were split in half by D-Day and Italy, the Soviets didnt face the vast majority of their one opponent's (ground forces) for much more than 2 years, but even then thats a Germany greatly distracted by north africa, without access to vital resources, and with much depleted and distracted airpower. Meanwhile the soviets are effectively fighting only on one front .
German forces in the west in France, Italy etc generally surrendered instead of fighting to the death and staging non-stop fighting withdrawals, because Britain wasnt known for arbitrarily executing prisoners and sending the rest to die in Siberia. Soviets may well have killed the majority of German soldiers during the war, and thats almost exclusively because the Germans would just not surrender to the Soviets because of the Soviet's own behaviour. Its an example of incompetence and counterproductive brutality rather than the assumption of more of the work. The Germans chose to evacuate from courland rather than surrender, despite the war being over, likewise with the fighting withdrawal from Berlin, many such cases, theyd fight to the death against the soviets up to the last days of the war, just so they could surrender to British or US forces.
Not to mention that the US and UK also defeated Japan, Soviet contribution to which was minimal. Brits had over a million men in Burma, while the number of Americans in the Pacific must be at least double that. Added to that, much of the Soviet dominance over Germany was on account of the fact that German troop numbers in the East dwindled massively once Italy started and once the Germans realized an invasion of France was on the cards.
The Japanese surrendered when the Soviets swept into Manchuria; the timing of the atomic bombings was coincidental to this.
That's all true, but it still remains the case that no other country gave so much of itself in order to defeat Germany, they suffered the most casualties both civilian and military, a lot of which may have been due to incompetence, but still they exhausted the efforts of Germany with their armed forces more than any other, and after 1942 they were the ones dealing the most damage to German forces anywhere. So in terms of efficacy the Soviets were the most deleterious to German war plans, regardless of loss and material support from elsewhere.
>SU was a dogshit failure
Clearly not. It was able to weather the majority of German efforts during Barbarossa, and then roll the Germans back, at great cost.
>propped up entirely
It received significant support, and wouldn't have stayed in the fight without it, but the same goes for the UK.
>It was able to weather
It lost almost all of its territory and got demographically destroyed, surviving on a knife edge, and rolled them back with Western boots, stomachs filled with Western food, transported on western trucks and western trains so they could fight the battles with Western intel, western radar, western electronical equipment, western tanks, western planes
It's pathetic, they only made any gains or progress when the west proxied them, and also fought the Germans on multiple other fronts
Oh, and the bongoloids at least fought alone while the Soviet scum made treaties with the Nazis
They were pathetic
>weather
Was ruined so utterly that 21st century Britain is a perfect analogue of 19th century Spain.
SU was a dogshit failure propped up entirely as a UK/US proxy, surviving only because of the bones the west were willing to throw them
>ranking germany worse than the commonwealth
They literally did EVERY single thing better in terms of equipment except stuff they didn't even bother using like four engine heavy bombers. Seriously, there isn't a single piece of WW2 british equipment that was better than the german counterpart.
tempest was better than Fw190, spitfire was better than Bf109, and they never managed to come close to matching the mossie, smle was better than K98
25 pounder was better than anything the germans had as a field gun
17pounder was a better AT weapon and the 3.7" was better as a AA piece
british capital ships were better, british maritime patrol aircraft were better, british cruisers and destroyers were better
they had some good subs, some nice aircraft and their tanks were good on the battlefield albeit worse to get to the battlefield
>tempest was better than Fw190
war was already over
>spitfire was better than Bf109
only major impact it had was in the battle of britain and the hurricane (a shit plane) did most of the work, the spit was forgettable otherwise
>mossie
ju87 was an absolute workhorse ground attacker that contributed far more despite dropping off towards the end
>smle
just another bolt action who cares, the brits never graduated to semi auto so this doesn't mean much
>AT
pak 75 did everything it needed to do and was iconically successful at destroying armor, the germans just built bigger tanks for the IS2s
>navy
irrelevant in the german context besides submarine warfare where they nearly drove your island to famine, plus they sank the best royal navy ship with a single shell, PLUS brits had comical naval disasters like force H anyway
>maritime patrol
irrelevant in german context
also german ships were excellently made despite them not even caring about the navy after the first 18 months of the war
>so what if it was better! War was over!
>nooo! the most iconic fighter of the war was forgettable!
Yet another cope essay from yet another wehraboo
>the most iconic fighter of the war
imagine believing this
You're talking about it now, right?
it can't compete with the messerchmitts, fockewulfs, zero, mustang, or thunderbolt
the spit is a second-tier literally who like the hellcat
LARGE if confirmed. Link?
widespread global public opinion for 80 years re-evaluated at regular intervals
So, no link then?
Nah tempest is introduced in 1942
Spitfire performed better than the hurricane and was present in huge numbers, hurricane had more planes present throughout the battle of britain, but not a huge majority.
Mosquito did better than the jU87
SMLE was better than bolt actions commonly used by Germany or USSR, it could essentially fire as fast as a semi auto too. Most doctrine of most nations involved, bolt actions, machine pistols, and squad machine guns.
Faster than 109
Better energy retention than 109
Better armed than 109
Better turn time than 109
Smaller turn radius than 109
Stronger wings than 109
109 bros...
>, it could essentially fire as fast as a semi auto too
ok now thats cope
it was probably the best bolt action fielded though
>Nah tempest is introduced in 1942
What the frick are you talking about? Tempests didn't enter service until mid-44, which makes comparing it to a fighter that did so in 1941 moronic. I can only assume you think "first prototype flight" means "introduced"
Brownoid hands typed this, post melanin texture pack.
>only major impact it had was in the battle of britain and the hurricane (a shit plane) did most of the work, the spit was forgettable otherwise
by the BoB the hurri was getting old but was by no means a shit plane. plus its just was to go after the bombers whereas the spitfires dealt with the fighters, leading to the kill disparity. the spit was used successfully throughout the war and was very well liked by its pilots.
>ju87 was an absolute workhorse
a completely different aircraft to the mossie with a different role. moronic comparison.
>brits never graduated to semi auto
neither did anyone else fully except the US.
> nearly drove your island to famine
wrong. germany never once sank enough tonnage to signifigantly impact the UK, only getting close to the minumum for a single month. true, the bismark won that battle, im sure it went on to have a very successful career.
> also german ships were excellently made despite them not even caring about the navy after the first 18 months of the war
every word of this is wrong. their ships were often overweight for their size with a poor armour scheme as well as having issues with the sea keeping. their early torpedoes were as bad as the early american ones, they just fixed the issues faster. germans gave up on large surface ships early war but went hard into subs because that was the only thing that could leave port without being immediately sunk, and even those were rendered useless by mid 1943.
The early spits had the inline engine cutting out in -G, but this is resolved from the mk.V onwards, and the late merlin spits are increasingly flawless, especially the mk IX. The griffon spits are not only more agile, but as fast as any other plane designed for high speed interception, and performance only increased at altitude, they had one of the most powerful engines of the war. The LF MKIX was literally able to climb to 50,000 feet, and turnfight zeroes and win. The only issue with any of the spitfires is the same as the 109s, lack of range due to low capacity internal fuel, sacrificed for better performance, the late merlins arent even notably slower than a FW. Typhoon is equal to the FW, Tempest is better, both are also capable ground attackers. Mosquito didnt have a German equivalent.
17pdr was as good as the long 88
Britain invents APDS
etc
Ask OP.
What i take it to mean is that Americans just dont bother upgrading their firepower, and are mostly milling around with 75mm shermans for the majority of the war, which are basically obsolete by 1944, and the 76mm isnt much better by the time its introduced, especially as the AP ammo was generally not avaliable. Sure it may have been ok in 1942, but not great as an AT weapon, and America doesnt see any proper land warfare until 1943. Meanwhile Germany has the various marks of long 76mm and the 88 and long 88, Britain has the 17pdr and the early war 6pdr was pretty decent, the USSR has its 100mm guns or 122mm. The American 3 inch gun, used by the majority of American tank destroyers, and never by Shermans, is outperformed by the 17pdr or 88. Sure America has the 90mm, but thats on only a very tiny proportion of vehicles, most of which are unarmoured tank destroyers. Generally their firepower was extremely lacking, hence them begging Britain to convert shermans into fireflies for them following the german armoured counter attack.
>and are mostly milling around with 75mm shermans for the majority of the war
there were good reasons for that
moronation yeah
read the reports about the 76mm guns anon
Talking about 75mm
And the reports about 76mm arent great, they couldnt penetrate a panther's turret beyond 100 metres unless they had tungsten AP ammo that most tanks would never receive due to scarcity of tungsten, and even that would only have a chance of penetrate the turret up to 900 metres, no chance of penetrating the glacis at any angle or range. German TDs with similar levels of protection to the panther's glacis (jpz IV and the uparmoured IV/70, jagdpanther and tigers) were immortal to the 76mm, and the rest were generally resistant to the 75mm including even the StUGIIIG and hetzer. And they were even less effective against King Tigers or even Tiger Is. Thats why Eisenhower went cap in hand to Churchill to ask for Fireflies. The US was incredibly lucky that the vast majority of post-D Day armoured warfare was between Britain and Germany, with 5+1/2 armoured divisions facing the British forces to the east, but only 1+1/2 divisions facing the US divisions. Despite facing less than 1/4 of German armour, in the very favourable bocage terrain, the Americans were shaken enough to finally start trying to upgun their tanks. Once the allies moved out of the bocage of Normandy the engagement ranges moved from 300 metres to 500-1500 metres and the US started facing proportionally more armour, sherman casualty rates skyrocketed. 76mm is better than 75mm sure, but it isnt a 17pdr or 90mm.
For land forces, you mean? Because I don't see how Germany could possibly have "outclassed" their opponents at Sea or in the Air
Somehow Germans didn't know the importance of logistics, especially later on in the war. Guns may win battles but logistics wins wars.
Germans did know logistics were important, they were simply physically incapable of finding a solution to that conundrum. Just like a short man cannot simply become taller, Germany could not create oil and metal out of thin air.
Hitler was simply a hotheaded moron who picked fights that he could not possibly win with Germany's resources and manpower. It was Game Over before it even began.
Honestly I'd rank Germany higher than the Brits, but I guess giving them the rest of the Commonwealth (mainly Canada and Australia, New Zealand's main battle tank was a tractor with a Bren and sheet metal welded to it) brings them up to a higher spot. If we're counting them separately though, then the order of the Commonwealth militaries sees Britain itself relegated to third place at best, with the Canadians and Australians in the two spots above them.
>a tractor with a Bren
i believe it had like 7 brens or something ridiculous like that
Yeah, it was like 6 or 7 of them intended to be used by that many crewmen inside. I don't really fault the guy who made them, he mostly made it out of frustration that nobody else on that entire island seemed to be doing anything. That was his retort when the other New Zealanders pointed out it was a tractor covered in sheet metal IIRC, he told them that if they didn't like it, they should get off their asses and try making one themselves.
Honestly though, if he'd used some concrete too he could have made an army of killdozers. At the very least you'd have some kind of proto-IFV given how well Heemeyer's later design protected against bullets. I want to make one like that to defend my land (and double as a farming implement) with one day, assuming I ever get to own property. Instead of a Bren I'd put an AR-15 with a crank lower and a belt feed upper in there. And probably an AC unit or a fan because it has to get hot in there.
Yeah Germany was so shit it just needed a coalition of every superpower on earth to beat them lol
The Bren was consistently praised by the troops that used it. The mistake is thinking that it's a single-man support weapon, like the BAR, which isn't true. It was the primary weapon of the rifle section, which would built around supporting it.
Every man in the section carried two full Bren mags on them, except for the Bren Assistant, who carried six and the spare barrel.
Behold, my WW2 nation!
Geographic location of the UK, infantry weapons of Italy, uniforms of Denmark, tank corps of France, air force of the USSR, surface fleet of Germany, sub fleet of the early-war US, and the intelligence branch of Japan.
lost the battle of the atlantic till murica came around
you mean the atlantic convoys that were never once halted and continued from 1939 -1945?
They were losing 1939-41.
define losing when atlantic shipping was getting through uninterrupted
Starving and running out of ships
Brits never starved though?
Their nutrition actually improved during the war, because it ended inequality between classes in terms of who could access nutritional foodstuffs.
Never starved because the US intervened to save them and give them Lend Lease.
You're losing track of your own narrative lmao. The US was delivering equipment to the UK already before the US entered the war, there wasn't any definite point in the battle of the Atlantic where the UK suddenly went from "starving" to "being saved by the USA". The UK successfully kept its citizens nourished for the duration of the whole conflict and did not endure any hunger.
Lend Lease also refers to equipment like trucks and tanks, not wheat and beef. Funnily enough my grandpa actually made the family money selling beef to the British in WW2 (Argentina)
>US was delivering equipment to the UK already before the US entered the war
Correct, and was also fighting and dying vs the nazis. Had to, because the bongs were losing and bankrupt.
>Lend Lease also refers
Lend Lease refers to US aid to beggar nations, and the bongs were the biggest recipient and biggest beggar.
>>Lend Lease refers to US aid to beggar nations
>he doesn't know the US received LL from the UK
>US received LL from the UK
Again, Lend Lease was a US program, for beggars like the bongs. So you seem ignorant here.
>Again, Lend Lease was a US program, for beggars like the bongs. So you seem ignorant here.
You know less than you think you do, So you seem ignorant here.
"Reverse Lend-Lease to the United States totalled $7.8 billion. Of this, $6.8 billion came from the British and the Commonwealth. Canada also aided the United Kingdom and other Allies with the Billion Dollar Gift and Mutual Aid totalling $3.4 billion in supplies and services (equivalent to $61 billion in 2020)"
you've been done.
No, the US didn't have to beg and could finance itself as well as the bong beggars.
You see, when you beg for handouts, and you're bankrupt and losing, you're a beggar, as the bongs.
Thanks for the help, Towarisch.
Why does Uncle Sam give so much gibs to foreign countries while the fat American average citizens have to pay thousands of dollars for insulin and other medications to survive?
You forgot 30K IJA annihilating an entire army in Singapore and basically making what was left of Britain flee to Madagascar after a few months
That was partially due to incompetence on the part of the command, partially due to incredibly bad luck when HMS Ark Royal hit an uncharted reef off of the East Indies and therefore left the Eastern Fleet without air cover, partially due to japs innovating the mass naval fighter bomber and making HMS Prince of Wales and HMS Repulse the first capital ships to be sunk only by torpedo bombers, and partially due to singapore being almost indefensible without dominance at sea.
>No other nation gave so much of itself
Yes, and i'd put that mostly down to incompetence and lack of concern/value for human life over petty internal political appearances and/or objectives.
Dealing the most damage as in? Their air power was heavily hit and was being continuously drained over western europe, true they could replace planes but they had trouble replacing the huge quantity of experienced pilots they lost during the battle of britain, and they were constantly being confronted by british fighter sweeps over northern france as well as bombing attempts. Their surface navy was hemmed in and hounded by the RN, they had no access to resources from outside of Europe, the U-boat fleet had a 75% mortality rate and wasnt able to stop shipping. North Africa took up many of their most experienced men, many of their tanks, as well as most of the fighting manpower of Italy, effectively knocking the 3rd Axis member out of the war. USSR acts like a sponge for german ground units maybe a year or two, like Britain had for German air power, except the USSR had its logistics provided for it, Germany was fighting on another front, and Germany didnt have the benefit of an entirely fresh and intact air force to support its ground units. The USSR was useful for keeping a an additional front open until D-Day, but they didnt single handedly grind the German war machine to a halt, and Britain+USA would have won without them +1-2 years.
That was 100% due to bong military incompetence.
how could I forget their use of revolvers. Shame
>mad minute
Now this, this is the cope. I remember reading a account of Brits assaulting the gothic line and the commander had the brilliant idea of getting everybody to do a mad minute before jumping off. Thanks for the heads-up, Tommy!
you are literally being replaced by muslims in an intergenerational struggle and you think not seeing national flags is a good thing...
German AT rifles penetrated about 4mm more of armor. Sticky grenades were a total failure more dangerous to the user than the tank. Not a good show chap
sticky grenades were mostly a homeguard weapon and the primary mid to late war british antitank weapon was the PIAT which could frontally pen a king tiger and was very hard to locate if fired from cover.
a little cumbersome to use but not so bad as is sometimes made out
the springs on these things were so taunt it took two men to wind and could not be done outside of cover. Some definite cons
>pros: kill anything
>cons: you get one shot
No different from a panzerfaust if you think about it.
>the springs on these things were so taunt it took two men to wind and could not be done outside of cover. Some definite cons
I've watched an 80 year old D-Day veteran wiener one from a prone position. Frick off with your boomerfudd myths.
all I've got are written sources, they've been mostly correct so far
I've physically seen it with my own eyes.
>the springs on these things were so taunt it took two men to wind and could not be done outside of cover.
one man can do it, standing or laying down
you could have just said that you didnt know how the PIAT works from the start. to wiener the weapon you had to pull the spring back, but all subsequent shots would automatically rewiener the firng pin. this sometimes wouldnt work of course but when it did, it allowed for a pretty fast rate of fire. plus as another anon said, it was very popular for its ability to be used in indirect fire. obviously there were better options, but it was better than anything the italians or soviets had.
You clearly don't know the piat. It can be wienered lying down or standing and the projectile has a charge that resets the spring after firing. I've wienered one before and it's not that hard as it's mostly leg strength
I like service revolvers tho
Honestly continuing to use the Webley was one of the only based things the British military did in the 1940s and onward.
WW1
WW2
Scoreboard wehraboos
>20-30 round box lmg the entire war
Still way better than the bar
>bolt actions the entire war; can't even make a straight shooting jungle carbine
All armies except americans used bolt actions the whole war
>consistently the worst tanks of the entire war with underpowered guns
British tanks were adequate
>muh universal carrier!
What exactly is the problem with that
>heavy artillery is ww1 vintage with new munitions; literally had to use wooden blocks to keep the gun from jumping away
It still worked so no reason not to use it. Some smaller countries still used 1800's artillery
>Sten
Is a piece of shit but had one goal, shoot and be cheap and it did both
>PIAT. This thing couldn't even be reloaded under fire
This one is true and in arguable
>Chindits suicide missions. Just look it up, no other army would ever have reinforced such titanic failures
Yea a failure but its not like other armies didnt have stupid campaigns
>Completely BTFO by one panzer div in North Africa so badly they had to create the legend of the Desert Fox
They won in north africa eventually
>Muh Monty, this guy is soooo good because his tempo of operations is terrible
Idk what you mean
>Italy, entirely Chuchill's idea
Italy was a success
>Utterly stymied in western europe after D-Day
American media supremacy overshadowing other people nothing else
>Market-Garden
Yea this one failed
>basically lost the battle of the atlantic till murica came around
Not true
>Sells off most of Europe to the soviets in the postwar, turns around and goes muh Iron Curtain
Americans are just as guilty
>Even their helmets are terrible
Yes
Soviets were worse. Italians were worse.
>worst tank of the war
>best K/D ratio
>PIAT. This thing couldn't even be reloaded under fire
It was wienered before firefights and the charge in the rear of the projectile resets the spring after firing
Daily reminder that the bongs were the biggest recipients of US Lend Lease, not the Sovs.
>tiny island isolated and surrounded by U-boats
well no duh
Daily reminder that the British homeland and the British empire were not the same thing, so no the Bongs were not the biggest recipients of lend lease
Daily reminder that the bongs were beggars and only survived at the US' pleasure.
>Daily reminder that the bongs were beggars
Daily reminder that the bongs paid for everything
Daily reminder that when you beg you are a beggar, as were the bongs when the US saved them.
Daily reminder when you pay for things in gold and intellectualy propery, don't have your debts written off you're no begger
Daily reminder that when you brg and will die without charity, you're a beggar.
As the bongs
paying for stuff with hard currency =/= charity
>paying for stuff with hard currency
The bongs were begging, for credit. They were beggars, and losing.
I suspect you are also javascript:quote('56798794'); what the frick did the british ever do to you mother fricker
and why the frick do you presume t lecture oter people when you dont even know the definitions of the terms you are using
for example 'bankrupt' is when a entity be it state corporation or private individual is unable to service a debt, ie out of money and credit, at no point did that state pertain to the UK during world war 1 or world war 2, out of ready cash reserves during ww2 because the american corporations were charging outrageous prices for weapons, but able to borrow and meet the debt, literally nothing was given to the british that wasnt paid for, and if some of the money was loaned it was paid back on time.
and the UK was never paid for the information provided by the tizard mission which had a value at the time somewhere in excess of £1billion sterling
Bankrupt UK put is when you're losing a war you started and can't pay to defend yourself... like the bong beggars when they begged the US to save them.
how can you be bankrupt when you can pay your debts?
You're bankrupt when you have to beg for credit to fight a war you were moronic enough to declare, but are now losing.
That makes the bongs moronic, losing, bankrupt beggars.
Why are you using words you don't know the meaning of?
Why are you responding to a bot, anon?
i'm a bot aswell, icecream? god I love icecream
Why are you a delusional bong?
ok c**t lets be honest here.
you dont know what the frick you are talking about, have at best a 9th grade understanding of both history war and economics and a frankly irrational hate boner for the british.
I am not sure what motivates your hate boner, one of your parents abandon you for a brit? lingering sense of cultural inferiority? dropped on your head as a child and never right since, who knows, frankly at this point who cares? You are ignorant, bigoted and not bright enough to pour piss out of a boot without instructions on the heel
frick off and stop shitting up the boards
Man this is one seething bong.
Try coping and dilating.
reasoned argument has failed because quite frankly
is either too stupid to follow simple facts or so filled with rage and hate that they have no interest in facts just in posting the same bullshit again and again in the belief that if they just say it loud enough and wish hard enough reality will warp around the sheer strength of their vitriol and suddenly what they say will be true.
alas they go and check any text book and discover it isnt, weep, screech, and post again
so yes for one moment they dragged me down to their level.
NB at least a little creativity in response is nice once in a while
Do recommend the coping and dilation, to go with your bong seethe.
so you dont actually have a intelligent response then?
I am surprised
Coping is your primary, apparently.
again, you cannt actually refute.
your responses boil down to repeating the same false statement then adding 'cope' seethe or dilate.
your obsession with dilating might be telling, but i suspect its simply a reflex response
go outside, touch grass, read a book, anything but continuing to shit up perfectly ok boards with your moronation
This seething bong never quits.
Tldr
not a argument
closer to a concession
but they didnt need to beg, the lenders saw it as a good risk and a chance to make a handsome profit, which they did
frankly the interest was higher than justified because they figured the british would waste to much time arguing
The lenders saw the bongs getting BTFO, and would rather they didn't. So the bankrupt beggars became the biggest recipient of Lend Lease.
but if they didnt think they would get their money back (with interest) they wouldnt have lent it. Q.E.D. the british credit was still good
This is such a moronic point to make. How does it contradict them being bankrupt beggars?
>Oh well the US thought it could suck interest out of them for the next 50 years
Sure how does that not make them poor and on the dole? It's almost worse because they're debt slaves to the US in addition to being dependent on them for defense.
That's not hyperbole they'd get ass-fricked in the Suez crisis like a decade later and be America's lapdog to this day after that.
well for starters it means that both 'bankrupt' and 'beggars' cannot be said to apply
bankrupt because it literally means unable to service their debts, this was never the case
and beggars because if the other guy wants to give you a loan and profits from doing so you dont have to beg, you just ask, its no more begging than taking a mortgage or financing a car.
No, the US paid serfs to fight for them.
Didn't work, the bongs were still losing and the US had to save them.
at no point after 1940 was the defense of the UK a primary concern, taking the fight to the germans was a issue.
and no thats not what bankrupt means you ignorant motherfricker.
if the UK had had to beg if the UK had been that desperate the US wouldnt have loaned them the money as it would have been a bad risk, as it was the US correctly assessed that the UK could win if the loans were made and could meet the loan terms. the both won and met the loan terms
>at no point after 1940 was the defense of the UK a primary concern
Yes, because the bong beggars submitted to the US, who saved them.
UK supplied Soviets with Lend Lease too, so that is also incorrect.
No, you see, the US executed Lend Lease, most of which went to the bongs, who were a beggar poverty nation.
France gets credit for having the most moronic pre-war government but the Netherlands gives it a run for its money
>Been slashing the military budget since pre-WWI
>Germany invading all of its neighbours, we need to build up our army
>We need guns, where can we get those though?
>Oh I know we'll buy them from Germany! They've been making a lot of weapons lately
>Why are our weapon deliveries constantly being delayed over and over and over again? It's probably nothing, let's just keep waiting for them
On the topic of WW2 armies, can we pour one out for the French?
Holy shit the British coping and seething this thread is amazing
Good job OP
Americans are literally British.
Therefore Britain literally won the entirety of WW2
Feels good to be anglo
>Americans are literally British
No they're not
If they were, they'd be a civilized country like Canada or New Zealand, with universal healthcare, life expectancy over 80+, and policemen who don't execute people on a daily basis.
Americans are something else, something... Blacker.
>a civilized country like Canada or New Zealand
Kek
Careful, citizen. Do you want us to get civilized with you? Pick up that can.
>i've paid for X on credit that means i'm bankrupt
fricking moron lmao
>I'm a moron who declared war on a guy and now he's BTFOing me. I beg of you to give me free stuff and I can't pay you. But dont call me a moron, bankrupt or a beggar.
Kek
Here's your (You)s.
Verification not required.
Why would the US care about the loans its way more important to keep the UK running otherwise just concede the war.
>Hi, I'm a moron and the guy I declared war on just hung a swastika over my Capitol. Because I begged and begged for help but they said I was a moron. Plus I was bankrupt and couldn't pay. But call me bankrupt beggar and I'll declare war on you too.
ITT: bait and cope from various subhumans