Why doesn’t Germany make a MANPADS? All the relevant defense industries offer MANPADS but Germany hasn’t figured out the tech yet. Do you think they will be able to develop their first one without receiving a tech transfer from someone else?
Why doesn’t Germany make a MANPADS? All the relevant defense industries offer MANPADS but Germany hasn’t figured out the tech yet. Do you think they will be able to develop their first one without receiving a tech transfer from someone else?
Does Germany actually make anything in the aerospace sector at all?
Not really. German engineering sure doesn’t mean what it used to mean. South Korea is the new Germany
I can't wait to see Germcuckistan fall apart after the EU outlaws diesel engines.
>germany mentioned
Pavel cope shills. Like clockwork
fritz you can stop now, nobody thinks germany is impressive anymore
How is Poland so far ahead of Germany when it comes to aerospace design!
Crazy to think the US was able to produce the most successful MANPADS in history back in the 80s and Germany still isn’t able to design a missile small, accurate, and lethal enough to intercept aircraft
>Most successfull
No, on kills alone that would be the Igla. Its not even close.
Crazy to think the germans were able to launch the first object into space and create the first ballistic missle.
Even crazier to think how far behind they are now. The US was able to capitalize on that early German work and for some reason Germany lags behind Poland
Kinda happens when you let ~~*them*~~ cuck a country for 50 years. Imposing a baseless guilt that keeps them handicapped for generations.
the germans have no desire to make manpads though. main consumers of them are shitholes and theyre covered with cheap strelas and iglas, and certainly wouldnt buy any overcomplicated system germany would make.
>Crazy to think the US was able to produce the most successful MANPADS in history
and now they are buying shit from polacks lol
Not for their own use, moron. The US has bought shittons of Soviet origin weapons and ammo to send to Ukraine, because that's what the UAF is familiar with.
>Not for their own use
source?
>US is going to issue Piorun to their own troops
source?
M number?
They aren't allowed to.
During the CW there was no need for them to do it, the US provided plenty of Stingers, and the Stinger was really good. The reson Sweden developed the RBS70 and 90 was because of neutrality. France did it because they hate anything that isnt french and wanted to export it to 3rd world nations. UK just did it because they could. Post CW there absolutly wasnt any need for Germany to develop it.
>France did it because they hate anything that isnt french and wanted to export it to 3rd world nations.
Mistral is pretty cool tho
EADS is making Stingers.
There is also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LFK_NG
although the manufacturer press release is from 2010 in other words its the semi-permanent plan B as to succession or indigenous (US pulls rights) for
that knot...
>guns of noguns tourists who got stranded here during the war are so butthurt abiut a ciunrey that baewly
I blame my dog for putting his head on my lap for scratches for that one, kek
>stinger manpads on license
doesn't count, dipshit; you know very well people mean domestic design when they ask these questions
or if you don't, you're actually moronic
>UK just did it because they could
Falklands probably played a part in that decision, and tbh it's not a bad one; Starstreak fills a palpable hole in the NATO armoury
Poland just modded the Igla, no big deal
hardly anything
they make IRIS, but even that they copied off the ASRAAM consortium
>doesn't count, dipshit; you know very well people mean domestic design when they ask these questions
>or if you don't, you're actually moronic
Sounds like you're moronic because that's not just what the OP said we also have people ITT fantasizing about a lack of technology and required tech transfers for a country that has both and among ither things created the IRIS-T.
Stay coping, vatnik.
>that's not just what the OP said
"Do you think they will be able to develop their first one without receiving a tech transfer from someone else?"
>created the IRIS-T
"without receiving a tech transfer from someone else"
>Stay coping, vatnik
One doesn't have to be a vatnik to be honest about where Germany has chosen to specialise its defence industry.
>One doesn't have to be a vatnik to be honest
No but you'll get called one if you are. It's almost like these morons are self-aware.
>Do you think they will be able to develop their first one without receiving a tech transfer from someone else?"
The tech is already there and in use.
Check mate, morons.
>Poland just modded the Igla, no big deal
Aight, what's your take on Ukie Igla-1M then? They are the developer **and** they've modernized it
Probably get a lotta shit done with access to Western electronics and NATO advisors
Nah, they couldn't even buy the sensors for the seekers, all western countries just refused to sell them. They had to resort to chinese ones, they showed a high rate of faliures, so at the end of 2021 they brought an entire factory (well, several divisions of it) back, almost from dead.
And now there are lots of videos with really fresh-looking Iglas shooting down russian cruise missiles.
>umm they're allowed to produce an american system??
Are you being moronic on purpose or what?
>produces stinger manpads on license
>local product
WAT
>So no technology transfer necessary, it's already there, should a local product ever be desired
Read that sentence again. It literally can't refer to the stinger.
>we have the tech to copy a 50 year old American missile anytime we like!
Okay, sure
>Germany doesn't have modern missile/jet/helicopter defence technology
>what is the IRIS
>what is TAPS
What did he mean by this?
>what is the IRIS
a relic of German participation in ASRAAM
face it, Germany develops a lot of stuff, but its aerospace and missile industry is barely there
>Germany has the technology
>but it doesn't COUNT!
Why? Technology is technology. They clearly know how to use it, design weapons with it and upgrade it.
Where exactly is the issue?
Except the iris-t is a much more capable missile than the bong trash that only third worlders buy.
>more capable
moronic take, IrisT is shorter range. Asraam has better range and faster.
Also Germany only has like 1200 of them, pathetic really just like all there other missile stocks.
>b-bong
Obsessed
ASRAAM is so shit the australians stopped using so now the only users are bongistan and india (lmao)
Meanwhile everyone wants iris-t and the slm version is stackimg up kills in Ukraine.
ASSRAM
>HA!
I'm genuinely surprised nobody picked up on that terrible acronym
literally lying
they're practically identical save the ASRAAM is longer-ranged while the IRIS has a tad higher G-loading
>Technology is technology
Be honest, that's cope for developing literally everything from allied tech transfers; which isn't wrong per se, but don't pretend that's the same thing as fully domestic tech R&D
similarly, Australia license-producing Boxer doesn't place it on the same pedestal as Rheinmetall
>Be honest, that's cope for developing literally everything from allied tech transfers; which isn't wrong per se, but don't pretend that's the same thing as fully domestic tech R&D
The issue at hand was whether they could design their own. Germans have proved very capable with the technology, local upgrades, repurposed systems and even related products.
That's why I asked what the issue is, there doesn't seem to be one in eegards to Rheinmetall's actual capabilities.
>local upgrades, repurposed systems and even related products
anyone in NATO can do that. anyone in CHINA can do that.
>The issue at hand was whether they could design their own
clearly, not without tech transfers at the start to springboard off of.
>anyone in NATO can do that. anyone in CHINA can do that.
China has consistently failed to even copy western systems, let alone upgrade and adapt them. Other countries haven't been nearky as succesful as Germany either.
Plus, Germany does fine in related product ranges.
>clearly, not without tech transfers at the start to springboard off of.
Based on what?
It sounds like you formed your opinion befire thinking about evidence and using post hoc rationale to defend a position you reached based on emotions.
No offense.
>China has consistently failed to even copy western systems
They copy what they can get well enough, or attempt their versions of it.
>Plus, Germany does fine in related product ranges
Name them.
>Based on what?
Based on the fact there are a grand total of two (2) German missile defence systems in current use and both of them are either license-produced or corporately developed? Well, until recently there was the Roland... oh wait. Joint project with the French.
Germany doesn't build combat aircraft and missiles of its own, they purchase their allies'. This is just fact.
>They copy what they can get well enough
Das not troo.
>Name them
TAPS immediately comes to mind for high speed defensive ballistics and collisions at high velocities.
>license-produced or corporately developed?
That's just a clever use of resources abd knowledge base acquisition.
>Well, until recently there was the Roland... oh wait. Joint project with the French.
What's the issue here?
IRIS-T was a German led programm that included Italy, Germany, Sweden, Greece, Norway and Spain.
What is the problem?
You skipped my post, anon.
They're clearly capable and knowledgeable in regards to the technology, what are you saying they're missing?
Also anon is right, the IRIS has been getting upgradss over the years.
IRIS does almost everything the Stinger does, except being a MANPAD. - it's a solution for Stinger A2A and vehicle mounted stingers.
It's probably better that Germany just decided to produce Stinger, it saves money and R&D costs, and they very likely could have ended up like the UK if they went all in on Manpads a la Blowpipe/Javelin/Starburst/Starstreak because that shit is garbage only really suited to counter helicopters and light vehicles
They kneel before Sungur Porsav BVLLS.
this and hisar
There's a MANPAD version of Hisar?
>Why doesn’t Germany make a MANPADS?
They make Stinger under licence with a domestically designed seeker AFAIK. Same as they did with AIM-9s
>anti-German thread #45533453 turns into semi-civilized discussion
Did the shills go to bed?
Probably
>ASRAAM is so shit the australians stopped using
Don't be disingenuous
The RAAF stopped using ASRAAM because the 9X was finally available, which it wasn't before, and the Australians want to rely on Uncle Sam's weapons warehouses in times of war
Plus the 9X is cheaper and Australia isn't flush with cash
TAPS?
>That's just a clever use
yeah, copying allied tech is certainly clever
c**tland stopped using the asraam because it wasn't good enough, gotcha
Meanwhile iris-t is selling like hotcakes while only a few turdworlders want the asraam.
>Brazil
>Egypt
>Greece
>Saudi
>S.Africa
>Thailand
Looks like Iris T is the favorite of the Turdies...
Again two different missiles, Iris T us good for close range which is an outdated concept now for 1st World nations. The ASRAAM is faster and longer range, much superior in real world situations.
Side note how come Germany has only 1200 missiles that's ridiculous. Military budget woes I guess.
>>S.Africa
>Looks like Iris T is the favorite of the Turdies...
and Hungary
and Austria
and Ukraine
and Italy
and S.Korea
and Norway
and Sweden
and Spain
>The ASRAAM is faster and longer range, much superior in real world situations.
cope, they're both close range missiles. METEOR exists for long range engagements.
>they're both close range missiles
you really don't know jack
>does almost everything the Stinger does, except being a MANPAD
that's the strangest description of a missile I've ever heard; you sound like you know this stuff mainly from video games
too much cope ITT for an honest discussion, I'm out
hmmm
but yeah it's good that you decided to frick off
>and Hungary
Turdie
>and Austria
Irrelevant
>and Ukraine
Turdie
>and Italy
Ok
>and S.Korea
Ok
>and Norway
Irrelevant
>and Sweden
Irrelevant
>and Spain
Turdie
As I said before, favorite for the Turdies.
>B-bbut cope, both are close range
Are you mentally moronic? One flies further faster the other one doesn't the latter is worse.
>Meteor
Ah another superior British lead missile. Yeah that things great.
NTA but how is Sweden's defence industry not relevant? It's better than Britain's.
Nah its shit.
>BAE own hagglunds
>Gripen is shit no buyers
>NLAW was a British idea and a British funded project
Sweden isn't even top 10, get a clue.
>Gripen is shit no buyers
More buyers than for the asraam lmao
That seems to be bith both untrue and a cope.
CV90 > every single British armoted vehicle ever made
>NTA but how is Sweden's defence industry not relevant? It's better than Britain's.
It is no longer relevant because it has been americanized.
>TAPS?
APS against top attacks for tanks and the like. Rheinmetall was the first one to shiw off its solution to that particular problem though knowing the US I'd expect an American solution to the problem to be ready or at least presentable before the next gen tank gets revealed.
>yeah, copying allied tech is certainly clever
Depending on the project it's just the best way to do it, only frogs refuse to realize that, everybody else happily does it.
Though as I said, IRIS-T was a German led project.
It goes back to the 80s to replace the sidewinder (but contrary to that one bong's claims it is not based on it) and Germany was part of the process from the very beginning.
>APS against top attacks for tanks
cool, but not "aerospace" per se
>IRIS-T was a German led project.
>It goes back to the 80s to replace the sidewinder
say the name, anon: ASRAAM
which wasn't German-led
IRIS is the result of Germany pulling out of the project and taking the data with them
>cool, but not "aerospace" per se
I mean, I did write related products.
Getting 2 small objects to collide with fractions of a second of time to do so is harder than missile to missile love making. Hence why it was developed so much later.
>which wasn't German-led
IRIS-T absolutely was.
ASSRAM was divided into America for the long range and Germany/UK for the short to medium range.
>IRIS is the result of Germany pulling out of the project and taking the data with them
So... we can conclude that Germany has no issue with it?
>IRIS is the result of Germany pulling out of the project and taking the data with them
Errrrr, anon?
After German reunification in 1990, Germany found itself with large stockpiles of the Soviet Vympel R-73 missiles (NATO reporting name: AA-11 Archer) carried by the MiG-29 Fulcrum and concluded that the AA-11's capabilities had been noticeably underestimated.[7] In particular, it was found to be both far more maneuverable, and far more capable in terms of seeker acquisition and tracking than the latest AIM-9 Sidewinder.[8][better source needed] In 1990, Germany withdrew from the ASRAAM project, while the UK resolved to find another seeker and develop ASRAAM according to the original requirements.[9]
>wikipedia knowledge
Mmhmm, yeah.
it's literally in the name you fricking moron.
And we all know you only need to know a thing's name to know what it can do 😉
you're a moron thats arguing nothing for no reason.
you're the type of person thats going to catch a bullet soon
>just, yknow, trust the name
no shot
Is anything in my quote wrong?
Does it refute anything I said?
IRIS isn't ASSRAM's baby. Germany eas a part of ASSRAM and realized after unification that the Soviet missike technology wasn't bad in that case (thanks eastern German engineers, very cool), thus pulled out of ASSRAM and used the eastern German engineers and the tech left behind by commies to clnbine it with their existing technology and to this day unmatched lens/seeker technology to make the IRIS with a lot of smaller European nations.
Saying the IRIS is just what's left of the placenta after the stillbirth of ASSRAM is disingenuous or uninformed.
>ASSRAM
sounds like you have a bone to pick with the missile with the superior range
>Saying the IRIS is just what's left of the placenta after the stillbirth of ASSRAM is disingenuous or uninformed
Germany certainly didn't come up with it all by themselves
they've NEVER come up with any aerospace project all by themselves
>NLAW was a British idea
Be fair, don't rise to bait
NLAW took the BILL 2 warhead and slapped a proper guidance system on it
Sounds like you're the assmad one
>sounds like you have a bone to pick with the missile with the superior range
I'm not the guy who argued about it with you. That quote was my first contribution to the discussion I think.
>Germany certainly didn't come up with it all by themselves
Okay? Not sure what you base it on or what your requirements are there, butt you admit now that Germany can build that kinda stuff just fine?
>they've NEVER come up with any aerospace project all by themselves
Come on, anon. That's objectively untrue. Working together with others also isn't a weakness in the first place, especially if you're the senior and leading partner as Germany was in the IRIS project.
>objectively untrue
Name one 100% German combat jet or missile.
Panzerfaust 3 doesn't count.
>senior and leading partner
yes, because THEY had pulled out of ASRAAM, and nobody else in their B-team had much missile expertise
>Hungary, Austria, Italy, SK, Norway, Sweden, Spain
well known for their missile expertise
Night time in Russia, India and most of China.
no wonder that korea and poland where brought up 2 min into the thread.its always the same gays(k9 asiatic,dennis mongoloid,warriortard and our beloved armatard who mistake this place for PrepHole.
warriortard isn't dennis?
no,Im merely pointing out that there are morons who make these threads to stirr up shit.these are all diffrent people.atleast rivet anon gave up a few months ago.
>dennis
Dennis is a Russiaboo and I've never seen him post on /k/.
One guy has been bringing him up here lately and now morons think he's some kind of German boogeyman despite him being a russki with the last name Smirnov lmao
Germany had convinced itself wars aren't real any more, so its arms industry was about keeping engineers employed and making shit for export
>bongs bring unable to produce competitive hardware
In what other domains can this phenomenon be observed?
Just face it niegel the only market that exists for the ASMAD are countries that aren't allowed to buy the big boy hardware.
Speak English you disgusting third world tripe
ESL thirdie has lost control of his ability to communicate with the first world. Are you that mad?
>3 Gripen buyers
>4 Asraam buyers
>Swedish defence industry isn't in the top 10
>CV90 is now British owned
Sweden has been consumed
>thread about Germany's (lack of) aerospace industry
>morons start seething about bongs instead
Why does this always happen?
>some guy keeps on bringing up bongs and shitting on everybody else
>people disagree withiut really mentioning bongoloids
>eventually some swede chimes in ti say his nation isn't irrelevant and has a better defence industry
>"WHY DO THEY PERSECUTE ME SO?"
Kek, whatcha doin rabbi?
I'm the second but not the first poster, you seem upset.
Though if we go by those rules most of the british defemce industry and all of their car industry is owned by Germans.
I was abiut to say at least you still have the financial sector but that one's run by another tribe.
>bongs
>joos
>cars
>finance
it's like playing seethe and cope bingo lmao
>GG2WM
>>joos
Opinion discarded. You're either a israelite or a moron if you both type it like that and deny israeli power in the financial system.
>>It's da jooooz
Stopped reading there, see above.
You are tourists and do not own guns. Have a nice night.
>speaks about joos
>Gets called out
>Tries reverse uno
Go to bed you dumb frick lol
>joo
He is right, you do not own guns. There is nothing to call out here, israelites aren't owed special protection or reverence and their influence is self-evident and undeniable.
>Name one 100% German combat jet or missile.
IRIS-T.
>yes, because THEY had pulled out of ASRAAM, and nobody else in their B-team had much missile expertise
Of course they pulled out, soviet tech turned out to be better than the latest british tech and they had access to that Soviet tech and its engineers after the wall fell.
>well known for their missile expertise
If they would be you'd complain that Germany didn't do the work itself. Decide what you wanna complain about it really can't be both. The fact that they weren't good at it just makes Germany's contribution more impressive.
>The fact that they weren't good at it just makes Germany's contribution more impressive
Being lead partner of a bunch of technically advanced nations is a compliment. Being lead partner of a bunch of morons simply means you're the one-eyed man in the land of the blind
>IRIS-T
I accept your concession.
>Being lead partner of a bunch of morons simply means you're the one-eyed man in the land of the blind
And yet the IRIS-T is very good and very popular.
>accept your concession
You asked for a missile.
You just said Germany was the main force before this one.
Are you drunk?
You could've named a number of others to support your claim of a strong German aerospace industry, but according to you, IRIS-T, the missile originating from the ASRAAM project, is the only defence aerospace project the Germans ever developed by themselves, and they had to cadge off everyone else for everything else?
Lol
Lmao even
>It's da jooooz
Meds
>I'm the second esl sperg!
OK?
>But the car industry!
Sorry we are talking about missiles here and then turdies brought up Swedens lack of defence industry.
>Finance sector
The only finances discussed here are military budgets the UK is $82bn, first in Europe by a big margin.
Diversion as per usual
>Why doesn’t Germany make a MANPADS?
They make stingers under license. The market evidently doesn't need yet another home grown manpad system.
>without receiving a tech transfer from someone else?
Why does this matter?
>All the relevant defense industries offer MANPADS but Germany hasn’t figured out the tech yet.
>the tech
... It's the same as any other anti air system, just man portable. Tech trees aren't real you dumb baiting moron. FFS.
They use perfectly fine israelitePADS. No need to reinvent the wheel when Israel offers you a good deal
Why is there such a strong correlation between being obsessed with the German arms industry and weapons grade autism? The German MIC has been slowly degrading for the last 40 years. There's at least 5 countries way more relevant than Germany at this point yet none of them inspire nearly as much autism. Why do you give a shit? Why are there at least 5 Germany threads full of spergs arguing on this board at any given time? No other country inspires as much autism for some reason. Why not sperg out about the latest Indian weapons system for a change
>the latest Indian weapons system
can't sperg much about vaporware
>can't sperg much about vaporware
I've seen like 20 Puma threads in the last few days so that's wrong
>vaporware
>Puma
The articles about the break downs are fake news, one one of the 18 had serious issues, another had an issue, the rest had non-issues including but not limited to:
A heater that didn't work (because it wasn't turned on), a screw that was slightly loose, a lightly rattling container and a computer screen that broke (because one guy kicked it).
https://augengeradeaus.net/2022/12/puma-sachstand-ganz-kaputt-oder-nur-ein-bisschen/
I hope you didn't fall for the fake news, that would reflect poorly on your character.
>something something JOOS something OBAMA something
Are you okay?
You've been BTFOd in the Puma thread already
Seethe and cope
>heater that didn't work (because it wasn't turned on
what kind of morons does Germany send to the VJTF? I thought that was supposed to be the elite spearhead of NATO. How are you supposed to lead a counter offensive when you can't even turn on a heater
Thise pumas were the first that received the newest upgrade so they were widely shared among a lot of troops to get them used to it, I doubt all them were part of the elite.
Or sober.
Link me, I've got no idea what you're talking about.
Shills + brits + polish tourists
Not necessarily in that order. Brits hating Germans and Germans wondering why has been a /k/ tradition for years.
>your claim of a strong German aerospace industry,
Huh?
>only
You asked for one, I gave you one. Everything else was made up by you just now.
Forgot your meds today?
>Huh?
I accept your surrender.
>accept your surrender
I literally didn't write anything you said there.
You asked for an example of a German missile, I gave you one and then you broke.
Do you smell toast?
Crazy how the Anglosphere kept it's arms industry in S tier after 1991 but Germany fell off.
I mean Germany can't even build fighter planes without help.
Do they even have nuclear submarines?
Do you know how to use a search engine
He clearly doesn't. Must have lost some brain cells after getting raped by Pakis as a kid.
Why must there be Polish German battles on this board daily
>polish
Tourism.
Though this one seems to be just a butthurt brit or two, those have always been here. No idea why since they can't own guns, but they're here. Maybe I should visit navy threads to find out what they do when they aren't pretending this is PrepHole.
>Maybe I should visit navy threads to find out what they do when they aren't pretending this is PrepHole.
Hello Satan.
Actually the PrepHole spam is worse in navy threads.
because its easier to earn (you)s via shitposting than actual discussion and tourists love that shit. also various butthurt autists
Just buy American and be happy
EADS makes stingers under license
A lot of German companies make subsystems for various MANPADS. Germany is very big in the subcontractor business ie. outsourcing design and production of certain components