What's the current US plan to stop china from using its pl-15 on a semi-stealthy j-20 to snipe at AWACS?
What's the current US plan to stop china from using its pl-15 on a semi-stealthy j-20 to snipe at AWACS?
What's the current US plan to stop china from using its pl-15 on a semi-stealthy j-20 to snipe at AWACS?
Shoot them down.
the plane or the missile?
either
how the fuck is the j20 supposed to get within awacs range again?
with stealth. are you retarded?
>Chinese
>Stealth
Thats their plan. Their planes are so glaring on radar, the US will think those are decoys, because of how they trained. "Something so glowing on radar? Pah decoy" and then it was no plane but just 1 missile and bang.
Like that shitpost on how to kill a geologist
>hurr things dont work cause china
muttoid cope
>hurr thigns work in china
chinkmutt cope
such is life in china, an endless blooper reel
Final Destination: The Country.
Reminds me of https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cj0WCLQx2y0
Yes.
But the J20 isn't a stealth fighter.
it is though
it's not though
it is though
It does in fact pretend to be one.
it is one.
Only in your mind. In the real world? Sorry, no cigar.
muttoid cope
what was it, chinkmutt?
interesting how his shirt almost matches his skin
About as stealthy as an F117. And close to 1000 times less stealthy as an F-35.
https://basicsaboutaerodynamicsandavionics.wordpress.com/2022/11/27/j-20-radar-scattering-simulation/
now post non-frontal aspects.
Why would a non-frontal aspect even be relevant to this cope scenario where a J20 bum rushes an AWACS. Isn't the whole cope for J20 and PAK that they have """stealth""" frontal aspect but no stealth in other aspects.
>AWACS is a few hundred nmi to the rear of the front CAP fighters
>AWACS sees nothing
>CAP fighters between the Chinese interceptors and the AWACS see nothing
>CAP fighters 100+ nmi to the side get returns
>those fighters send the contact to the others
>interceptions proceed as normal
This is the Pacific, not Ukraine.
What if there are 2 AWACS? Now your """"stealth""""" aircraft is visible even as it takes off an airfield.
>PAK
Su-57 doesn't have even that. Its patent claims it's as stealthy as a Super Hornet and with their manufacturing quality they are unlikely to achieve even that.
>stealthy as a Super Hornet
How the fuck the failed when they just copy YF-23 which is more stealthy than F-22?
its because the yf23 airframe is less stealthy than hornet or even f16, this was a bait for russia to copy it
every su 57 simulation shows it even less stealthy than a cargo plane
>I live in a country that had a stealth fighter competition solely to bait its enemies into copying the wrong one.
God loves America and Americans
>based government for wasting my money
It's not wasting money if it going to be wasting chinks.
>f-22
>program cost: 75 billion
>target destroyed: 1 balloon
>chinks humiliated: uncountable
Vatnigs and chinsects too afraid to find out: priceless
3 ufos destroyed, missile test data at an altitude that we’ve never tested it at, and real world experience for our pilots (flying hours will count against FHP and missile being used would have been live fired at some point anyway, so it’s literally just net gains and Chinese recon losses + hurting the feelings of the Chinese people)
Stay mad Chang
Making Ace Combat tier super weapon is never waste of money.
is that what lockheed martin told you to say? lmao
does lockheed pay chinks to stay out of Taiwan too?
You just made me spit out my coffee and almost choke. Still made my day
Boeing made just as many shekels from building the F-22 as LM. But, I wouldn't expect a retarded war tourist shill to even know Boeing helped produce the F-22.
>dropping random factoid for no reason thinking it makes him sound smart
kek
Why wouldn't Boeing be paying for the shill? Not my fault you're retarded.
What is China's RAM? RAM usually only reduces the RCS by -10dB, unless we're talking about the old, heavy ass RAM from the F117. So, let's assume with RAM the RCS would be 0.02m^2. That's still 200 times less stealthy than an F-35, or F-22.
>What is China's RAM?
Some kind of knockoff of the F-117's coating sample they received, likely with reduced performance for the sake of easier maintenance.
>Some kind of knockoff of the F-117's coating sample they received
So, around -10dB effectiveness in X-Band.
So, about 3 times worse just like everything else china copies.
Nah it's the Ж-Band now, just to circumvent any potential western copyrights
>arsenal bird but instead of a fuck ton of drones for air superiority, it's riddled with point-defense lasers and and massive payload capacity for cruise missiles and ATA missiles
A missileboat but in the air
>How the fuck the failed when they just copy YF-23
You can't just copy a stealth aircraft from looks, it requires incredibly precise and specific geometry to work properly and having the same general shape without all the exact angles and curves will ruin the stealth. You need either the exact plane to measure to the milimeter to copy or have advanced computers and programs to model radar reflections from multiple angles in great detail to reverse engineer it. If you can't, your best bet is a low-poly model like the F-117 but it won't be a fighter like that, assuming you can even get it to fly.
And Su-57 isn't a copy of YF-23, or F-22 or any other aircraft because it's ultimately a Su-27 with a bodykit that made more surfaces flat, along with some other basic rcs reducing features like angled vertical stabilizers.
thats right they actually just put su 27 under a hydraulic press to make the new flat su57 airframes
that would explain why it's warping at the seams like this
>Why would a non-frontal aspect even be relevant to this cope scenario
Clearly they'll use their superior aircraft technology to Tokyo Drifto their aircraft sideways and remain invisibru to capitalist pig-dog radar.
It would be like 10m^2 from the rear, and probably 25m^2 from the side.
Those escorts have excellent LPI radars with great detection ranges, and the J-20 would always be in a perfect front on scenario with neither them nor the AWACS.
>would always
Wouldn't always*
according to [random sourcse on the internet]
It's about as good as you're going to get, and it's done by a literal chink and vatnig. So, if anything, it would favor the J-20.
>So, if anything, it would favor the J-20.
It does, since it doesn't take RAM coating into account and has some artistic freedom to modify his models since nobody has accurate dimensions.
If this is who I think it is he literally posts his models along with his analysis. You can do your own RCS calculations.
My point is that he models things himself, with no original to compare to which can be better or, more likely, worse than the rendered model.
That's all open source analysis though. I can't tell, are you trying to point out that fact (which is fair) or are you trying to cast doubt on his analysis?
I'm pointing out that someone who's been biased towards russia and china before is likely going to be so in such analysis.
I mean sure yeah. Unfortunately it's one of those niche things where it might be easily disproven, but disproving it takes significant time. At least from some, reliable, aspects his images give a decent upper bound on how stealthy the J-20 might be.
>it's one of those niche things where it might be easily disproven
no it isn't, not in cases other than the most glaring falsification. if we had more accurate dimensions of the plane this would be true but here a lot rests on guesswork that one can skew in his favor.
Well, contact the PLAAF and have them give you accurate dimensions, so they can make an accurate model, until then continue to cope.
so you lost your argument and went back to repeating your asiatic shill findings? good.
You responded to another anon, not me. You're basically demanding that people disprove a negative.
Like bro, make a more reliable model and give it to him. It's not like he's modelling RCS (where shit can get weird) or using unique tools.
>You're basically demanding that people disprove a negative
Not really. I'm just saying that the findings are likely exaggerated in china's favor.
nagger, what? I hate chinsects and asiatics. Stop the false flagging, Wang.
Pretty much, and probably 10 times more toxic.
nagger, I told you a chinsect and a vatnig made it, so if anything it would be a favorable outcome for the J-20.
>a chinsect and a vatnig made it, so if anything it would be a favorable outcome for the J-20.
that's what i was saying
Okay, yeah. I got you now.
"stealth" doesn't completely remove an aircraft from radar, it makes it harder to see exactly what it is, but that's not a problem when the AWACS knows where everything that should be there is, and if it spots something that shouldn't be there it will vector other AIR units to intercept. AWACS don't operate out of secure airspace.
Yes.
Yeah
The plan is to have undisputed dominance in the air despite new chinkshit hyped up by subhumans
This. You can easily google the DoD’s published military doctrine and see that all our plans are predicated on air superiority… which we have, due to even our 4th Gen fighters being more like 4+ Gen, having ridiculous fuck huge numbers, the best SEAD doctrine in the world, more flying hours per pilot than China, Russia, Iran, Eritrea, and North Korea… COMBINED, and having stealth bombers that are 3 fucking gens ahead of the competition. No amount of chinkshit military parades will change this fact. No amount of reposting one or two TikToks of trannies will change this. No amount of CCP shilling will change the fact that we have a larger GDP than China, Russia, Iran, Eritrea, and North Korea… COMBINED, and spend more on our military than all of those cunts combined. It won’t change the fact that America’s Naval Aviation component can solo China. It won’t change the fact that Chink demographics are collapsing even faster than their housing market. And it won’t cause dedollarisation to magically coalesce into existence
F-35 has limited AWACS capabilities that can be used in contested airspace. Dedicated AWACS planes can move closer to the battlefield as the Chinese air threat is reduced.
>current
basically what said
>near future
lasers
Decentralization through network centric warfare.
I love these crazy DoD powerpoint slides
Do you think people in the meeting get excited when they see the little clip art that represents their job?
unironically yes
it's one of life's greatest thrills just behind being the person that ultimately put this gem together
No one read anything on there
I'd argue the ballistic missile spam is a greater threat than Chinese air to air missiles having good range. China would want to destroy assets on the ground than have to divert airframes to hunting US shit in air, especially given they will be dealing with Taiwan at the same time. The US is seeking to reduce the range advantage, so JATM and LREW, and they will continue to improve ISR and networking. 6th gen fighter will probably prioritize range and endurance, using very expensive sensors plus expendable drones to be an absolute motherfucker to deal with so really the main effort should be to wipe every usable base within 2000 miles, course US missile defense is very good - and when the B-21 is in production that will be a huge factor. Anons underestimate how having a large number of 21s means round the clock standoff strikes on the chinese bases and critical infrastructure. It's not much smaller than the B-2, it'll have the range to be very safe from anything china can do about it unless they manage to execute a hugely successful strike on bases in the middle of CONUS.
The US should work with Korea and Japan to build ballistic missile spam of their own. If the Chinese launch then they should expect every chink base and ball bearing plant to be hit within 5 minutes.
I cannot wait for the level of cope and seethe on this board when US gets BTFO by China
Lol, you're going to be waiting a long time you sad little homosexual.
The 4 f-22s protecting it, probably
pl-15 outranges f-22s
If they can see them.
The point is the US AWACS have a wider range of coverage and thus can see the Chinese before they can see us so we can pre-launch missiles before they're even aware F-22s are even in the air nearby.
There isn't a snowballs chance in hell China could sneak up on a US AWACS.
Stealth planes can easily sneak into the 300km Awacs range if even regular fighters can be detected from around 400km
Good thing Chinese stealth and Chinese EW is complete dogshit
Nothing. Chinese AWACS are better than the US ones, and China has better radar tech and EW in general. That's actually one of the reason why Chinese missiles can afford to have longer range.
Most this threat are retarded Boomer circle jerking while day dreaming it's still the 90s.
Delusional retard
> Chinese AWACS are better than the US ones, and China has better radar tech and EW in general
>Chinsects actually believe this
Let them believe. Overconfidence is a slow and insidious killer.
>Overconfidence is a slow and insidious killer.
Good description of the USA and the average amerimutt
try saying this without hitting yourself chinkmutt
good thing the usa is constantly involving itself in 15 wars at all fucking times and its higher ranks always have a steady flow of experience
>steady flow of experience
Bombing goat fucker with AK doesn't count as experience
And yet we dominate wars with it
USA! USA! USA!
it actually does
I'd say having erratic moving target is good for target practice
you are clearly from a country without an effective military
ESL
It does when they're on another continent and your higher end gear(from 40yrs ago) is proving it's ability to BTFO the "2nd strongest" army in the world. Logistics win wars.
>your higher end gear(from 40yrs ago)
Delusional boomer. USA is so fucked.
yeah
Seething won't make women not spit on you, hapanda.
Is that why China is trying to model its military after the US, and it's experience, then?
>China is trying to model its military after the US
They are not
They are.
i dunno, man. they're replacing their bullpup service rifle with an ar-style gun and trying to make aircraft carriers and stealth aircraft. they even try to make their own versions of 75th ranger regiment and navy seals
>trying to make aircraft carriers and stealth aircraft
China don't use their carriers the same way as USA dumbass
What about the 2nd strongest army in the world?
>be jurchen manchu mongolian trimutt
>call anyone else mutt
unberivabre
Let's be fair, Mongolians are much cooler, he's the mutted amalgamation of the peoples they conquered.
If a stealth plane knows, sure.
Again, you have to KNOW where you're going to use your stealth against them, and they know where you are before you know where they are.
So it's a non-starter.
Sure, if China MAGICALLY knows where the AWAC is ahead of time they MIGHT be able to sneak up to it, but that's not gonna happen.
Wasn’t the Growler designed with this exact scenario in mind?
EW is a topic few anons on /k/ understand fully and it is really underappreciated. It doesn't get the glory it deserves because Russia really ended up sucking ass at it despite having the reputation of one of the better EW capabilities. It's a big factor and the new pods should reduce their ability to find key assets.
I would love to see dark eagles in Hokkaido and the Philippines if they end up actually working out but more realistically the army tested a ramjet engine for the PRSM which might be able to push the range to 1000km, so M270s/HIMARs in Okinawa could strike all of Taiwan and the Chinese coast from Shanghai to Quanzhou.
I mean they're also on LRIP (or maybe even full production runs I'm not sure) of JASSM-XR aka AGM-158-B-2 or whatever they renamed it. 1000 nautical mile (1852 km) range, enough to hit coastal targets in China if launched far south-east of Japan.
Same anon but this should, from my brief testing in CMO, also mean that B-52Js could hit China from airbases in California without refueling. Obviously this depends on the exact fuel efficiency numbers of the new engines on the B-52J and a billion other things but it's something to think about.
Russian ew is a meme yeah
AWACS planes are less and less crucial as datalink network improves. For example, F-15EX is going to have the biggest radar of any fighter in the world operating without stealth emission constraints. F-15 is also a datalink bridge between new stealthy datalink and old datalink. F-15 is also the airframe without internal bay size constraints. It can carry huge missiles.
The best part of EW is how better it makes the stealth platforms at hiding in the noise. That's never accounted for in casual comparisons.
>F-15EX is going to have the biggest radar of any fighter in the world operating without stealth emission constraints.
AWACS is still bigger though.
It doesnt help public perceptions that similar to humint secret spy shit,the less people know about it the better; if your enemies think it's trash and hold it in low regard it makes your life a lot easier when you want to wave your magic wand and turn their systems inside out because they haven't spent any resources to defend against it
NTA, EW is also very difficult to understand, it has tons of weird edge cases and learning enough about it to implement non-trivial solutions is difficult enough that you generally only do it last year of college or in post grad courses. It's like cryptography in that all of the bleeding edge knowledge is in government departments or a few select tech companies.
Where do I get started with learning though
Based EW enjoyer. I just hope the next Gen of Air Force and navy ew pods are more maintenance friendly.
That's classified Chang.
>ramjet engine for the PRSM which might be able to push the range to 1000km
I came.
China makes nothing only sadness.
>using its pl-15 on a semi-stealthy j-20 to snipe at AWACS?
The fact that the PL-15 needs an AWACS and data-link to target long range. IF you jam the data-link, or delete the AWACS, game over. Also, the fact that the AWACS will be travelling with F-22, F-35, E/A-18 Growlers, and F-15EXs.
you know they can detect AWACS emission right?
> Also, the fact that the AWACS will be travelling with F-22, F-35, E/A-18 Growlers, and F-15EXs.
except they wont. awacs stay on station for 8 hours, those planes do not have the legs.
those planes have legs because US operate 90% of the world tanker fleet
tankers are equally vulnerable to pl-15
so they equally aren't? your argument was that escorts don't have the legs to protect awacs. they do.
>Sure bro, China's just going to shut down worldwide shipping by threatening the safety of goods and services in transit, on which the entire global economy relies
>This totally won't result in the entire world being against China as a unified force, smacking them down like a red-headed stepchild
Spin me another one. They would only be ensuring that all nations see China as the threat that has to be eliminated so that they can go back to the business of doing business.
It's just 3 days special naval operation no civilan ships will be left unharmed
did you even read the thread? do you even know what a pl-15 is?
Vaporware?
Trash?
>first batch of fighters runs low on fuel
>second batch of fighters flies over from the carrier
>first batch returns to the carrier
What now
>First batch of fighters gets air refueling from KC-135 instead of returning to carrier, while third batch is getting ready to launch from carrier.
Why? Because double and triple fuck China and every other paper tiger military that thirdies hype up. Total thirdie death
>you know they can detect AWACS emission right?
No, really? That chinsect AWACS will be radiating just as much. And given the shit quality radar and extreme side lobe leakage, likely more than the US AWACS.
>except they wont. awacs stay on station for 8 hours, those planes do not have the legs.
Have you ever heard of in flight refueling? Or just alternate escort wings from the carriers.
>the Chinese once again pretending they can do force projection well past Japan
F-22 pilots are going to be writing Russian mobik tier letters to the WSJ and NYT talking about how they're being forced to take amphetamines and do 18 hour long missions from Hawaii to the coast of Japan, US senators are going to cry about it, and you're going to seethe watching half of the PLAAF disappear in real time.
what's with all the noguns chinkoid spam the last couple of days?
Same logic as the Russians, some kind of massive embarrassment happened so they need to spin up their shill farms to save face. Not really tuned into happenings in China but I'm assuming something like their real estate market just went and popped or something, again.
Commies going to invade Taiwan like, right now.
NO PLEASE, NO MORE WARNINGS CHINKA!
ALL THE CIVILIZED PEOPLE OF THE WORLD WILL DIE OF LAUGHTER IF YOU WARN US AGAIN!
WE BEG YOU,
NOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!
Please do.
Zero chance, no mulberries
im about to ask the same thing about muttoid spam
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>china boasts about new tech
>US defense industry lays an egg and shits out a verifiable counter
>china didnt actually have new tech
>US has now jumped yet another tier in military tech because they didnt think the US would actually take their word
it never gets old
It mostly happened with the USSR, not China. See the F-15 for example.
>semi-stealthy
>semi
Why are your threads so dogshit?
Chaff Flare-Chaff Flare, Bedlewoop!
Is the E-7A going to be a good E-3B replacement?
on all levels except aesthetics it is far superior.
but just look at that ugly ass thing, like someone took a balcony rail and glued it onto a model plane.
It's already a massive improvement over the E-3 by virtue of being a twin-engine jet instead of a four-engine one. Much cheaper to maintain the engines and better fuel efficiency. We're probably saving money by switching to the wedgetail.
*smacks lips* Its simple, we uh nuke china
So what I'm getting from this is that if it wanted to, the US could just drown China in missiles from Japan if it wanted to, and there is literally nothing China can do about the USN or those new little white stealth bombers the US has?
They COULD but they'd risk the chink chimpout NOOOK tantrum that might occur
>semi-stealthy
Is this changspeak for gen 3.5 shitplane?
Scrap out the AWACS, which is happening now. Delay their replacement, because Boeing.
There. No targets left to shoot down.