What if there was a mechanical spear that extended rapidly for hundreds of meters towards enemy. It would be a revolution in war because you could kill at range but not lose your weapon from your hands like with a javelin or throwing spear
What if there was a mechanical spear that extended rapidly for hundreds of meters towards enemy.
I know overhand is the most likely way that hoplites fought, but it looks so gay
In single combat outside of formation they'd fight underhand. Although I concede that such single combat would've been pretty rare.
you look so gay
No, it was underarm.
Overarm doesn't make any real sense anyways. Hold a spear up like that and try to thrust with it. You can, but it's not nearly as accurate nor is it as powerful. It's not nearly as comfortable either. Underarm is what most people naturally do when they hold a spear because it's what makes biomechanical sense.
>but muh vases
The ones mostly showing Homeric duelling? With javelins? Ok. Nevermind the fact that that's like trying to reconstruct modern warfare with screenshots from Call of Duty. It's also worth noting that some vases do show underarm
>but you would hit the people behind you
Was never an issue for the Macedonians, and their sarissas had spikes on the end just like a dory does.
>but you couldn't use the spear close up underhand
That's what they carried swords for. The spears, at least of the front rankers, would have probably been broken by the time the 2 phalanxes met.
It's also worth considering that the butt spike, or sauroter, was used to stab fallen soldiers as the phalanx went over them. You can't do that overhand.
This isn't to say that they never did overarm, but it certainly wasn't the main way.
>Underarm.
No, not in the beginning. Before that, it was 1 handed spears held over the shoulder and the shield.
Why? BECAUSE YOU CAN’T UNDERHAND IN A SHIELD WALL. Every sources spoke of overlapping shields. You can only use overhand, unless in duels.
>You can, but it's not nearly as accurate nor is it as powerful. It's not nearly as comfortable either.
That’s because you’re from the present looking back at the past, so you think pike, but you’re going at it backward.
You have to start from the stone age than bronze age. You have throwing weapons to hunt and fight : Javelins, and spear thrower atlatl.
It becomes longer and heavier, with a thicker stick. So you add a counterweight. And you use it like a 1 handed spear and you can throw it too... think african Assagai. You can thrust and you can throw, but not as far as a javelin.
You can’t poke overhand, it’s mechanically impossible for the arm, you break your wrist. The move is necessarily a rotation downward and short ranged. At best you hit a shield or a feet. The main target is the head and the shoulders, which you can’t reach unless you open your palm.
So how was it used? Like a harpoon, a short range throw, through the lenght of the spear, and the thrust was stoped by the impact with the target. And you close your fist to grab the spear back. That’s why the stick is longer and there’s a rounded bulb before the back point, to help stop the spear’s forward movement.
And you can still fully throw away the spear to reach a target further away and rearm by grabing the spear of the guy behind you.
I suspect you get underhanded longer spears when the shield turn from the round Apis to the 8 shaped Beotian shield, with holes on both sides to allow for spears to get through at elbow level.
Then you progress to a 2 handed long pike with a smaller shield held on the shoulder (macedonian phalanx).
Not sure I was clear, it’s a short range throw, you open your palm and let the wooden stick slide forward. The spear stop because of the impact with the target of his shield. You close your fist on the wooden stick to slow it down and grab it. Then you pull, then a weak throw-slide backward and regrab to rearm at the point of balance.
>Of his shield
”or” his shield.
Another thing that can help your point is the phasing out of heavy armor for the hoplites in the late antiquity period. Spartans when they went up against Rome wore almost nothing, save for a shield, helmet and grieves with their robe too. Under arm thrusting would have left them absolutely vulnerable to their exposed unprotected chests, so a over hand where they maintained most of their body behind their shield would had been the most logical. And we know from archaeological evidence, that the hoplite became less and less armored with time as they specialized
>when the shield turn from the round Apis to the 8 shaped Beotian shield
The Aspis never "turned into" the Boeotian shield. In fact, the Beoetian was largely dropped after the Persian Wars while the Aspis kept going until much later. The Boeotian was little more than a shield for poorfags.
>Every sources spoke of overlapping shields.
So? You can rest the spear in the gap between your shield and the dude to your right. Reenactors have shown this off before.
>gigging
Gigging is what you're describing with how you're saying the spear was used. I've read about it before, and to be fair to you it was used among the various Pacific Islanders until pretty recently. However, most of the gigging stuff in regards to hoplites seems to stem from some youtube video from one of those Skalagrim type weirdos.
You can rest the shaft on the shield with the shield raised while overhand. You can't do this while underhand, which would make a big difference in battle fatigue
How high are you talking about raising it? Because if you just mean having it up like you would naturally then you absolutely can do that underhand.
Unless Pacific fish suddenly started fighting in formation, you know damn well I was talking about warfare.
That is pretty cool though. What kind of fish do you normally go after?
>it was used among the various Pacific Islanders until pretty recently.
... I’m a Pacific Islander harpoon fisherman :/
>until pretty recently
I didn’t know I stoped doing the move I do since I’m 5 yo.
For throwing javelins for military purpose, we used very light javelins, and the finger and the arm like an atlatl
logically, it was both:
overarm for trying to stab the cunt in the face -> he has to raise his shields
then your buddy stabs him from below with an underarm
only attacking from one direction is stupid
How high are you?
It's called Ballista
that's what they invented boomerangs for
Cool idea. It could also spit live snakes so that they'd bite while you smite.
>mechanical spear that extended rapidly for hundreds of meters
Like the Dragon Ball staff?
>Dilution focuses on making a board less interesting to its users
This is PrepHole's equiv of 4chan's "what are the political implications of coffee"
I agree. This thread is taking up valuable board space that we should be using for another Ukraine thread.
Fuck off back to 4chan moron.
Behold!
How is it that savages that rely on the bow never figured out basic tillering?
how have they not discovered fletching?
Because dats rayciss!
It may be hard to notice because picrel in
is wearing whiteface, but if you examine the true skintone of said savage, the answer will reveal itself to you
They figured out by themselves iron smelting and forging waaay before europeans, while Whitey had to get explained pretty much everything from Middle East and China for the past 8000 years.
And then...?
And then the Whitey briefly spread out like a plague before dying out, just like the Mongols.
>we wuz
>proceeds to pick cotton for free
lol
Anon, the animals in Africa are bullet resistant. Their bow and arrows are meant to inject poison, it doesn't need to be strong or accurate for that.
That's South America ya fuckin retard, most African tribes just run down and spear their prey or trap it.
No
I can't imagine that bow is worthwhile even for fishing, sheesh
What if your mother sucked my cock and gargled my cum?