When turtle ships were unleashed it was new technology, highly maneuverable and armed from all sides, it could drive into a fleet of picrel ships and wreak total havoc nips could hardly resist, if tried to board, sailors would slip from oblong shaped roof or impale themselves on the pikes.
Sail around them?
I can't believe that a sailing ship in 1510 couldn't outrun a hand-rowed barge.
Hand rowed barges are the only ships in Korean-Japanese wars, they didn't have sailing ships (it's white people invention)
Even the Flips were roaming the high seas with properly-built clinkers armed with the one or two shitty cannons their feudal lord could afford. That Japan and Korea didn't do the same was out of a lack of trying, rather then ignorance.
Oars make a lot of sense no matter what back in those days. Cannons weren't that good and it's not like anybody was actually able to line up racking fire with huge broadsides. Ships with oars could easily maneuver to reinforce each other, which matters in a fleet action. Fleets that were 100% sail were at a disadvantage at the time compared to mixed fleets.
Sails are ancient and widespread tech they just make less sense when you need a maneuverable coastal only military vessel with lots of open deck space for fighting that can be crewed by anyone. It was a society that could barely produce matchlocks and looked down on sailors with the naval fighting men just lost infantry.
I think he was making a joke. Asians tended not to use sails in combat since rowing was faster and the sails would just get set on fire anyway. Same as classical period Greeks.
It should be noted that the Turtle Ship comes about right as Europeans started developing Age of Sail tactics and ships.
What the fuck are you talking about? Hand-rowed ships were still the best combat ships in that time. When Spain attacked England at the end of the century, their most dangerous ships were still their hand rowed ones and England had to steer clear of them.
The problem was that the Koreans had better cannons than the Japanese so if you didn't kill it the turtle ship would follow you around putting holes in your hull.
It was heavy with no sails. Then again, Jap ships were even heavier, with poorer protection and no sail.
Oars make a lot of sense no matter what back in those days. Cannons weren't that good and it's not like anybody was actually able to line up racking fire with huge broadsides. Ships with oars could easily maneuver to reinforce each other, which matters in a fleet action. Fleets that were 100% sail were at a disadvantage at the time compared to mixed fleets.
Lepanto, biggest naval battle of the era, was agile rowing ships with sails being used as ramming and boarding ships. Catholic side even had couple of large Galleasses, fast in normal situation, but in this clusterfuck, they simply anchored them, and they were used as mobile fortresses.
It also didn't help that Japan's big advantage was that their infantry was better than Korea's. If they tried to go gunline to gunline with Korea they'd lose so the Japanese fleets always pushed in for boarding.
Build their own. Possibly even better, It's not like as if muskets are going to do anything. Ships with cannons were the "meta" centuries before the war even happened. The turtle ships were rightfully credited with rendering the Japanese navy impotent, but they're hardly amazing by the standards of the time, the Japanese just didn't care about their navy. or if you're talking about meeting them for the first time and need to deal with them right now, you're fucked. Fight and you'll lose. Run away and you'll probably get executed for incompetence and cowardice. Your best hope is to hope that they hit a reef or storm or something.
>or if you're talking about meeting them for the first time
that is what I asked about, I just felt really sorry for nips after reading how they got btfo'd spectacularly in many sea battles, I guess there's no countre-attacking that after all.
Probably try to set it on fire. Because the top was covered with spikes you can get torches to get snagged on it and the crew would have a hell of a time climbing on top to deal with it.
This, but Japan didn't know how to make greek fire.
Almost all the Jap-Korea naval battles were on the coast. They could have coaxed the turtle ship into range then hit them with an insane amount of large coastal artillery
Not built flat bottomed keels for a start
When turtle ships were unleashed it was new technology, highly maneuverable and armed from all sides, it could drive into a fleet of picrel ships and wreak total havoc nips could hardly resist, if tried to board, sailors would slip from oblong shaped roof or impale themselves on the pikes.
Hand rowed barges are the only ships in Korean-Japanese wars, they didn't have sailing ships (it's white people invention)
Even the Flips were roaming the high seas with properly-built clinkers armed with the one or two shitty cannons their feudal lord could afford. That Japan and Korea didn't do the same was out of a lack of trying, rather then ignorance.
If you rely heavily on boarding tactics oars actually make a lot of sense
Oars make a lot of sense no matter what back in those days. Cannons weren't that good and it's not like anybody was actually able to line up racking fire with huge broadsides. Ships with oars could easily maneuver to reinforce each other, which matters in a fleet action. Fleets that were 100% sail were at a disadvantage at the time compared to mixed fleets.
Sails are ancient and widespread tech they just make less sense when you need a maneuverable coastal only military vessel with lots of open deck space for fighting that can be crewed by anyone. It was a society that could barely produce matchlocks and looked down on sailors with the naval fighting men just lost infantry.
I thought the Chinese had Junks they could sail with.
I think he was making a joke. Asians tended not to use sails in combat since rowing was faster and the sails would just get set on fire anyway. Same as classical period Greeks.
It should be noted that the Turtle Ship comes about right as Europeans started developing Age of Sail tactics and ships.
Sail around them?
I can't believe that a sailing ship in 1510 couldn't outrun a hand-rowed barge.
What the fuck are you talking about? Hand-rowed ships were still the best combat ships in that time. When Spain attacked England at the end of the century, their most dangerous ships were still their hand rowed ones and England had to steer clear of them.
The problem was that the Koreans had better cannons than the Japanese so if you didn't kill it the turtle ship would follow you around putting holes in your hull.
It was heavy with no sails. Then again, Jap ships were even heavier, with poorer protection and no sail.
Lepanto, biggest naval battle of the era, was agile rowing ships with sails being used as ramming and boarding ships. Catholic side even had couple of large Galleasses, fast in normal situation, but in this clusterfuck, they simply anchored them, and they were used as mobile fortresses.
It also didn't help that Japan's big advantage was that their infantry was better than Korea's. If they tried to go gunline to gunline with Korea they'd lose so the Japanese fleets always pushed in for boarding.
Oh man.
You are going to be SHOCKED at how many times the Portuguese lost a sailing ship to an ottoman galley.
Build their own. Possibly even better, It's not like as if muskets are going to do anything. Ships with cannons were the "meta" centuries before the war even happened. The turtle ships were rightfully credited with rendering the Japanese navy impotent, but they're hardly amazing by the standards of the time, the Japanese just didn't care about their navy. or if you're talking about meeting them for the first time and need to deal with them right now, you're fucked. Fight and you'll lose. Run away and you'll probably get executed for incompetence and cowardice. Your best hope is to hope that they hit a reef or storm or something.
>or if you're talking about meeting them for the first time
that is what I asked about, I just felt really sorry for nips after reading how they got btfo'd spectacularly in many sea battles, I guess there's no countre-attacking that after all.
eat it
A decent ram would do the trick.
Use galleons.
greek fire would probably work well against it. It'll turn the metal armor into a giant oven
Probably try to set it on fire. Because the top was covered with spikes you can get torches to get snagged on it and the crew would have a hell of a time climbing on top to deal with it.
This, but Japan didn't know how to make greek fire.
>metal roof
I thought this was debunked.
It's of dubious historicity at best
they should have waited a few centuries then invaded
There are no reliable accounts of turtle ships being used in battle, the korean navy was simply better lead than the japanese.
The turtle ships you see in contemporary paintings are most likely just goofy concepts like the leonardo tank.
It was in Age of Empires 2 so it's canon (to history. Historically canonical)
Why are they women?
Nations being depicted as women is an old tradition. Because your nation is your mother.
>Called a trade ship
>Can't trade with it
It trades broadsides with you.
Almost all the Jap-Korea naval battles were on the coast. They could have coaxed the turtle ship into range then hit them with an insane amount of large coastal artillery