I would not be surprised if Unmanned turret+Autoloader will become the standard in the future. The survivability and weight benefits just seem too substantial to ignore.
Requirements for an Australian amphibious tank
It must be armoured effectively against 150mm APFSDS at 500m from the front and 1500m from the sides and rear
It must have sufficient roof armour to be immune to man portable top attack munitions
It must be immune to HEAT warheads of any caliber likely fielded by potential enemy ground forces
It must have spall lining sufficient to negate HESH warheads.
It must have sufficient crew to move and fight effectively even if half the crew is unable to contribute.
It must carry 40 infantry plus their equipment.
It must be amphibious without modification (ie, does not require anything to be attached to the outside of the tank before going into water)
It must be able to operate from the well deck of a Canberra Class amphibious ship without the aid of an LST.
It must have a water speed of at least 20kts and a waterborne range of at least 20nmi in sea state 5 using no more than half its carried fuel.
It must have a sustained land speed of at least 80kph and an unrefueled range of 1000kms
It must be able to move 400m from a standing start in under 10 seconds.
It must be able to navigate the intersection of two by two lane roads.
It must be able to operate at moderate intensity for 30 days, including dismounted infantry, without resupply.
It must be able to operate at high intensity for 12 hours without refueling.
(cont...)
(...cont)
It must have anti-air/anti-drone capability including radar.
It must be capable of both direct and indirect fire
It must be able to engage infantry on the 5th floor of a building 20m away
It must be able to engage vehicles from a highway overpass at 100m
It must be able to fight in multiple directions and at multiple ranges simultaneously, with effective weapons against infantry at close range (less than 2m).
It must be able to operate at least two drones/ROVs simultaneously
It must be able to see in all directions simultaneously
It must be able to hear men talking quietly at a distance of 50m, and men shouting at a distance of 500m, knowing the direction of everything it hears (sonar).
It must be able to recharge any rechargeable devices in use by the ADF
It must be able to maintain network connectivity in combat and provide that connectivity to nearby friendly units.
The main gun must be able to reliably penetrate 4,000mm RHAe or 10,000mm concrete at 8kms.
It must carry 56 rounds of main gun ammunition.
Note: There is no requirement for the tank to be transportable by rail, allowing for much larger dimensions.
>155 mm smoothbore that can double as arty in a pinch, a coaxial 20mm autocannon, and a variety of CIWS and light AA to deal with munitions, drones, and infantry >relatively light all-around armor to stop frag, full APS coverage, heavier armor on the top and around vital compartments to hopefully survive one AT round slipping through the defenses >more autonomy, even at the cost of speed >unmanned turret, cutting edge sensor tech, built in recon drone(s), vidya-tier data link and fusion
The armor requirements alone result in enough weight to put the Ratte to shame.
Honestly, extremely hard to tell. NLOS ATGMs and precision guided artillery on the one hand, APS on the other hand. How well either of those will work in a modern peer conflict, and which approaches will be best, is just out there. Maybe some armies with a lot of brainpower are running simulations and tests and trying to find out right now. Maybe some of them will even be proven right (though almost certainly some will be proven wrong).
What's certain is that in the future, no vehicle will do without APS and no combat unit will do without defense against drones and loitering muns of all types and sizes. That said, the tank, with heavy frontal/side i.e. line of sight armor, and heavy cannon (line of sight weapon) will have to concentrate on those qualities. Putting drones, or drone operators, or missiles etc. on them is a poor use of armored space.
Doppler radars and IR/UV sensors on every tank, APS, programmable airburst mode for HEAT rounds, data links. Ability to automatically turn the turret towards origin point of anything fired towards it, with adjustable filter for projectile size.
External loudspeakers is something I wonder why it isn't commonplace already. Would be very useful for communicating with infantry around you if your comms are disrupted or broken. Or for telling civvies to move it.
>External loudspeakers is something I wonder why it isn't commonplace already. Would be very useful for communicating with infantry around you if your comms are disrupted or broken. Or for telling civvies to move it.
Yeah that's totally the reason
Just say you want a boombox on tracks for maximum intimidation during the thunder run.
Well obviously I want that too ya dingus. Whole soundboard of meme noises, Hellmarch etc. And you could do clever shit like play jet and helicopter noises.
Actually I want external speakers on the outside of a future tank, but not for communication. Imagine cancelling out the engine sound and other noise out and having an almost silent tank.
Probably the same but either replace one of the crew with a systems operator for integrated spotter drones
Likely a bigger gun
Some kind of ATGM, either gun launched or attached to the turret to allow for indirect fire on enemy tanks spotted by said drones?
I think autoloaders will be standard in the future alongside some form of alternative power source as fossil fuels become more and more scarce. My guess is either hybrid or full electric to try and improve the range and reduce noise of turbine powered designs. Guns are getting bigger, as are secondary weapons. I also forsee some kind of drone integration for scouting and targeting as well as weapons to counter enemy drones. Crews will likely hover around 4 or 3, we will likely never see fully unmanned turrets for MBTs
I think the biggest thing that will happen is the separation of tanks into "Urban" and "Open" designs. Open tanks have already been described. Urban designs would primarily use autocannons and thermobaric/ some other flavor of antipersonnel missile, designed to be as small and maneuverable as possible. Likely completely unmanned or at least a completely unmanned turret
>Weapons
130+ mm autoloading gun, future-proofed for future penetrators and BLOS smart ammo. RCWS autocannon in the 30/35mm range, with airburst and a dedicated radar to defeat drones/loiterers and frick up enemy infantry (this could also be a laser). Possibly loitering ammo to scout out and hit targets of opportunity. >Armor
Unmanned turret, crew in a central armoured cocoon with VR goggles and sensors for 360º "see through the metal" battle awareness. Soft and hard-kill APS, integrated into the passive armour, 360º coverage (including against top attack missiles). >Mobility
Hybrid diesel/electric, electric motor in the front. Can use the batteries to keep everything online when the main engine is off, to cruise silently for a little bit, and retreat if the main engine is damaged. >Features
Tethered drones for increased awareness. Sensor fusion with other units to order pinpoint strikes. Fully modular architecture allowing for the use of the main platform as a super-armoured APC, command vehicle, IFV with troop capacity, or specialist vehicles like a drone mothership or missile carrier. Ability to control armed UGVS as expendable force multipliers. Maybe light enough to be more easily transportable.
What will they be like?
Instead of tanks you'll get unmanned ground vehicles with smaller guns and unmanned aerial vehicles with bigger guns
Why cover the barrel like that? Reduced radar signature?
Shrouds stop the barrel from warping under direct sun.
I would not be surprised if Unmanned turret+Autoloader will become the standard in the future. The survivability and weight benefits just seem too substantial to ignore.
Absolutely. Unmanned turrets are a no brainer. As is electric transmission.
>When dronehomosexuals and unmannedhomosexuals answer
Requirements for an Australian amphibious tank
It must be armoured effectively against 150mm APFSDS at 500m from the front and 1500m from the sides and rear
It must have sufficient roof armour to be immune to man portable top attack munitions
It must be immune to HEAT warheads of any caliber likely fielded by potential enemy ground forces
It must have spall lining sufficient to negate HESH warheads.
It must have sufficient crew to move and fight effectively even if half the crew is unable to contribute.
It must carry 40 infantry plus their equipment.
It must be amphibious without modification (ie, does not require anything to be attached to the outside of the tank before going into water)
It must be able to operate from the well deck of a Canberra Class amphibious ship without the aid of an LST.
It must have a water speed of at least 20kts and a waterborne range of at least 20nmi in sea state 5 using no more than half its carried fuel.
It must have a sustained land speed of at least 80kph and an unrefueled range of 1000kms
It must be able to move 400m from a standing start in under 10 seconds.
It must be able to navigate the intersection of two by two lane roads.
It must be able to operate at moderate intensity for 30 days, including dismounted infantry, without resupply.
It must be able to operate at high intensity for 12 hours without refueling.
(cont...)
(...cont)
It must have anti-air/anti-drone capability including radar.
It must be capable of both direct and indirect fire
It must be able to engage infantry on the 5th floor of a building 20m away
It must be able to engage vehicles from a highway overpass at 100m
It must be able to fight in multiple directions and at multiple ranges simultaneously, with effective weapons against infantry at close range (less than 2m).
It must be able to operate at least two drones/ROVs simultaneously
It must be able to see in all directions simultaneously
It must be able to hear men talking quietly at a distance of 50m, and men shouting at a distance of 500m, knowing the direction of everything it hears (sonar).
It must be able to recharge any rechargeable devices in use by the ADF
It must be able to maintain network connectivity in combat and provide that connectivity to nearby friendly units.
The main gun must be able to reliably penetrate 4,000mm RHAe or 10,000mm concrete at 8kms.
It must carry 56 rounds of main gun ammunition.
Note: There is no requirement for the tank to be transportable by rail, allowing for much larger dimensions.
>155 mm smoothbore that can double as arty in a pinch, a coaxial 20mm autocannon, and a variety of CIWS and light AA to deal with munitions, drones, and infantry
>relatively light all-around armor to stop frag, full APS coverage, heavier armor on the top and around vital compartments to hopefully survive one AT round slipping through the defenses
>more autonomy, even at the cost of speed
>unmanned turret, cutting edge sensor tech, built in recon drone(s), vidya-tier data link and fusion
The armor requirements alone result in enough weight to put the Ratte to shame.
>put the Ratte to shame.
Yeah you get it.
>Armor
harder
>Features
better
>Mobility
faster
>Weapons
stronger
More than
Hour
Hour
Never
Ever
After
Work is
Over
Work it
Make it
Do it
Makes us
Harder, Better, Faster, Stronger
>Daft Punk moment
same thing but with more APS and drone swarm escort IMHO
Honestly, extremely hard to tell. NLOS ATGMs and precision guided artillery on the one hand, APS on the other hand. How well either of those will work in a modern peer conflict, and which approaches will be best, is just out there. Maybe some armies with a lot of brainpower are running simulations and tests and trying to find out right now. Maybe some of them will even be proven right (though almost certainly some will be proven wrong).
What's certain is that in the future, no vehicle will do without APS and no combat unit will do without defense against drones and loitering muns of all types and sizes. That said, the tank, with heavy frontal/side i.e. line of sight armor, and heavy cannon (line of sight weapon) will have to concentrate on those qualities. Putting drones, or drone operators, or missiles etc. on them is a poor use of armored space.
Radar Warning Receivers might become standard as mmW ARH ATGMs like Brimstone become more common.
Doppler radars and IR/UV sensors on every tank, APS, programmable airburst mode for HEAT rounds, data links. Ability to automatically turn the turret towards origin point of anything fired towards it, with adjustable filter for projectile size.
External loudspeakers is something I wonder why it isn't commonplace already. Would be very useful for communicating with infantry around you if your comms are disrupted or broken. Or for telling civvies to move it.
>External loudspeakers is something I wonder why it isn't commonplace already. Would be very useful for communicating with infantry around you if your comms are disrupted or broken. Or for telling civvies to move it.
Yeah that's totally the reason
Just say you want a boombox on tracks for maximum intimidation during the thunder run.
Well obviously I want that too ya dingus. Whole soundboard of meme noises, Hellmarch etc. And you could do clever shit like play jet and helicopter noises.
Actually I want external speakers on the outside of a future tank, but not for communication. Imagine cancelling out the engine sound and other noise out and having an almost silent tank.
Turret mounted anti drone laser.
Probably the same but either replace one of the crew with a systems operator for integrated spotter drones
Likely a bigger gun
Some kind of ATGM, either gun launched or attached to the turret to allow for indirect fire on enemy tanks spotted by said drones?
The first 5th generation tank (T-14 Armata) has an unmanned turret. Perhaps 6th generation will be completely unmanned/only has a driver.
Armata is vaporware, hasn't made a single appearance in russia's life and death struggle in Ukraine, the Turret was probably animatronic not unmanned.
I think autoloaders will be standard in the future alongside some form of alternative power source as fossil fuels become more and more scarce. My guess is either hybrid or full electric to try and improve the range and reduce noise of turbine powered designs. Guns are getting bigger, as are secondary weapons. I also forsee some kind of drone integration for scouting and targeting as well as weapons to counter enemy drones. Crews will likely hover around 4 or 3, we will likely never see fully unmanned turrets for MBTs
I think the biggest thing that will happen is the separation of tanks into "Urban" and "Open" designs. Open tanks have already been described. Urban designs would primarily use autocannons and thermobaric/ some other flavor of antipersonnel missile, designed to be as small and maneuverable as possible. Likely completely unmanned or at least a completely unmanned turret
>Weapons
130+ mm autoloading gun, future-proofed for future penetrators and BLOS smart ammo. RCWS autocannon in the 30/35mm range, with airburst and a dedicated radar to defeat drones/loiterers and frick up enemy infantry (this could also be a laser). Possibly loitering ammo to scout out and hit targets of opportunity.
>Armor
Unmanned turret, crew in a central armoured cocoon with VR goggles and sensors for 360º "see through the metal" battle awareness. Soft and hard-kill APS, integrated into the passive armour, 360º coverage (including against top attack missiles).
>Mobility
Hybrid diesel/electric, electric motor in the front. Can use the batteries to keep everything online when the main engine is off, to cruise silently for a little bit, and retreat if the main engine is damaged.
>Features
Tethered drones for increased awareness. Sensor fusion with other units to order pinpoint strikes. Fully modular architecture allowing for the use of the main platform as a super-armoured APC, command vehicle, IFV with troop capacity, or specialist vehicles like a drone mothership or missile carrier. Ability to control armed UGVS as expendable force multipliers. Maybe light enough to be more easily transportable.
That's all I can think off for now.
Likely 6-8 unmanned tank with a command tank which is manned.
>Tanks of the future
$30 chinese drone with an RPG strapped to it