So we heard the rumors about the milco lake city plant not being able to sell m855 anymore, but my question is, who was the m193 and m855 being made f...

So we heard the rumors about the milco lake city plant not being able to sell m855 anymore, but my question is, who was the m193 and m855 being made for? Like I always hear that xm193 and m855 on the civilian market are rejected rounds, but who are the good rounds going to? Doesn't the US military use the gen 3 M855A1 which is a different projectile and different powder than the gen 1 M193 and Gen 2 M855?

  1. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    who cares i just shoot what's cheapest. bullet is fine.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      >what a cringe picture

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        who are you quoting

  2. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    yeah

  3. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    M193 is objectively a superior round to M855.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      You wanna go more in-depth on that claim bud

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        The steel penetrator is not as concentric as a lead core bullet (m193). It's much better than it used to be, but it's still not as good as 193.
        55gr fmjbt at 1:12 will tumble as intended and perform as designed. Anything faster stabilizes it too well, it keeps spinning thru flesh instead of going off balance and flipping.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Got it, you’re talking vs soft targets.
          And what about plates?

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Both are worthless against ceramic plates. M193 can penetrate some steel plates at close range due to velocity though. M855 was never meant to defeat armor, just improve performance against light cover. M855 at high velocities is still very devastating in flesh, but the window is smaller since it is lower velocity to begin with.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            M855 has a steel penetrator, but that does not mean armor piercing. It was made to defeat thing steel helmets at range, which are much easier to pen than a rifle plate.
            Some L3 plates that will stop M855 will be defeated by M193's sheer velocity at close range. (This is why an NIJ L3+ rating exists)

            The penetrator also makes M855 an inherently less accurate round because it's harder to add the penetrator with consistency. The projectile was designed to be an MG round, where volume would make up for this inconsistency, but then some paper pusher decided to make it universal. It is barely adequate as a rifle cartridge.

            • 1 month ago
              Anonymous

              weird, the marine testing from the 80s in that army doc trashing the A2 (and it was a marine test so they might have cheated) said the A2 with M855 preformed better than the A1 with M193 at 300-500 yards and that the A1 and A2 were about the same within 300 yards, in terms of hitting the target. Of course he then points out the army has no 500 yard ranges and they already knew since like WWII no one engages at 300+ yards with irons anyway

              the post office. postalmorons are hoarding 90% of all ammo made for some reason. i know they have some operators but why do they need more ammo than all militaries of the world combined?

              wait really? as in a joke or as in feds are using the post office to buy up all the ammo so the price will be higher than it would be?

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                >no one engages at 300+ yards with irons
                golfers.

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous
              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                thats driver distance

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                for you maybe

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous
        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          >Anything faster stabilizes it too well, it keeps spinning thru flesh instead of going off balance and flipping.
          False. 55 gr (m193) is absolutely brutal against flesh even from a 1:7 twist.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Nah, m855 performs better against the majority of armor and hard targets, m855 is far more barrier blind than m193 as well. Both are useless against quality armor, and m193 is more accurate. Getting hit by either will take you out of the fight. But m855 will maintain velocity better out of shorter barrels as its made for 16inch guns, vs m193 for 20inch.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        >But m855 will maintain velocity better out of shorter barrels as its made for 16inch guns, vs m193 for 20inch.
        M855 was made for 20 inch guns. It was made for the M16A2. That was one of the big issues it had in Somalia and the GWoT, was that it was just icepicking out of M4s and that was one of the reasons they switched to the M855A1, because they changed the powder to burn more completely in the shorter barrel

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          LOL no it wasn't, it was made for the 16inch barrel of the saw retard, it's a Belgian ss109 projectile. M855a1 is designed for carbines along with mk318. But there isnt a huge difference between 16 and 14.5.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            you no guns, cock sucking, smooth brained yuro
            the military lists the 249 as having an 18 inch barrel https://www.military.com/equipment/m249-squad-automatic-weapon
            FN says 20.5 inches (I am assuming counting the muzzle device)
            https://fnamerica.com/products/machine-guns/fn-m249-saw/
            This terrible .mil website also says 18.3 inches
            https://odin.tradoc.army.mil/mediawiki/index.php/FN_Minimi_Belgian_5.56mm_Light_Machine_Gun
            none of those are 16 inches 18.3 and 14.5 is a significant difference in barrel length

            • 1 month ago
              Anonymous

              LOL no it wasn't, it was made for the 16inch barrel of the saw retard, it's a Belgian ss109 projectile. M855a1 is designed for carbines along with mk318. But there isnt a huge difference between 16 and 14.5.

              oh look, also the aussies saying 18.3 inches
              https://www.navy.gov.au/weapon/f89a1-minimi

            • 1 month ago
              Anonymous

              18.3 really sounds like 20 bud

              • 1 month ago
                Anonymous

                That’s what my wife told you you gay

  4. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Take this with a grain of salt but what they were making is either stock they had left over, they are putting the pieces together and shutting down, or the new M855A1 is significantly more expensive to make considering the tin/bismuth copper steel concoction it's made of paired with the non lead primers and they're making the legacy rounds for training.

    When is A1 coming on the civilian market? I want more dammit.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      I thought the whole point of being leadless was because they could train more places with it without leading up the place. And there are that many m193 and m885 projectiles left? I thought they switched years ago and they stopped m193 in the 80s

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        >I thought the whole point of being leadless was because they could train more places with it without leading up the place
        That's a major reason, a lead ban is coming and they're getting ready, it's still expensive to produce. The increase in performance is a big plus as well. Look at that cross section

        And if I was to put money on it I'd be willing to bet millions, if not billions are still around. The amount of ammo the .mil produces is staggering. And it's not just the .mil they are contracted with, think about foreign exports and domestic police forces.

  5. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    green means go

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      best post on the forum right now

  6. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    >talking about fmj
    Cheap steel HP is far more effective at dropping bodi- oh wait I forgot "high tier" rifles can't run steel.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      What are you talking about anon? m855 and a1 have a steel penetraters and HP cannot be used in a military capacity.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        >and HP cannot be used in a military capacity.
        Both Mk318 and M855A1 act like fragmenting hollow points, only they use naming garden gnomeery to legalize them fro military use.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          But technically they aren't. So it's fine. And really it had little to do with the shitposter I was talking to who doesn't know how soft the steel in bimetal jackets are. M855A1 is so hard they had to make a new magazine to stop it from fucking up guns.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            M855A1 still fucks up guns, it's just not a good round for standard issue.

            • 1 month ago
              Anonymous

              tell us what you know that they US army doesn't, because training units have had it since 2016

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Mk318, has sintered copper fragmenting tip, or a fragmenting lead tip, both with a solid copper base for penetration. It is in no way a HP. It is the finest round ever designed for 556

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      It's not that they can't run steel, it's that they can short stroke with rounds that aren't loaded to an adequate hotness. I bought a case of indian 55 grain brass that no properly gassed rifle will run

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      >remove buffer weight from "high tier" rifle
      >or open up gas port
      >or reduce spring weight
      >steel suddenly cycles without issues
      wow

  7. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    damn i kept hearing the opposite from the info in this thread that m193 is worse than m855

    might start stocking m193

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Realistically the difference is too small to matter, especially for self defense.
      But yeah, I always buy M193 over M855 if I can.

  8. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Is Korean X-tac m193 good ammo?

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      I like X-tac, ive not had any issues with them. Idk if theyre generally accepted as good though.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      If I'm being completely honest my entire experience with it is fucking around in a field shooting at stationary card board target. With all that being put out there, it went bang and smelled like cat piss.

  9. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    the post office. postalmorons are hoarding 90% of all ammo made for some reason. i know they have some operators but why do they need more ammo than all militaries of the world combined?

  10. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    It’s made for the military. M855A1 is situationally issued. Think of how many live rounds the U.S. Military blows through in a year for training. Far more than on deployments, especially now that GWOT is dead.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      >M855A1 is situationally issued.
      The situation is every trip to the range a soldier makes.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      >M855A1 is situationally issued
      Did you just make that up? Because it's wrong. They give out what they have and quite often it's A1.

  11. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    M855 is an okay round, but M193 performs slightly better comparatively if you do not consider the steel core necessary. If you only shoot targets behind car doors or russians wearing steel helmets 500m out, sure it works fine.

  12. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    yeah

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