I was a hammock camper. Quilts are standard practice for that. I sat on my underquilt two nights ago (lol) and experienced a critical shelter failure that has me rethinking some things.
>what does this have to do with top quilts?
just talking about my last PrepHoleing
I got a pad from REI after the shelter failure incident and was cold even with my 30 degree quilt next to a fire. Was a hair under 40 degrees outside.
1 month ago
Anonymous
What's the r value on the pad?
1 month ago
Anonymous
2. My back wasn't cold, but feet/top of my body was.
1 month ago
Anonymous
2 is a little light on insulation and it will make you cold overall, not just the feeling of heat being sucked out of your back. Was it humid that day? To me 40 and humid feels way colder than being in the teens. Any drafts from around the edges?
I'm not here to defend quilts against sleeping bags btw, genuinely just trying to help. I use both for different situations.
1 month ago
Anonymous
>I'm not here to defend quilts against sleeping bags btw, genuinely just trying to help.
Thanks man! I appreciate it. >2 is a little light on insulation and it will make you cold overall, not just the feeling of heat being sucked out of your back.
Interesting. Do people often use second layers of insulation with closed-cell foam pads? I like the idea of not relying on an inflatable pad which can get punctured. >Was it humid that day?
Nope, not at all actually. We were in the Santa Cruz mountains in California. >Any drafts from around the edges?
Some. I was also using a sleeping bag liner, so it was hard to fully pull in the edges around my as I was also tossing and turning throughout the night.
>AHG Jarbidge
Oh. that's a really bad design. literally just a rectangle. If you look at real underquilts you'll notice that they are not rectangular like that. Should be alright for most purposes but no surprise that you had a bad time.
Yeah, it gets rave reviews on online forums, but I hated it. Not sure why it gets such good reviews. I'm gonna fix it up then try to sell it on hammockforums or something. I have a 0-degree Wooki that's totally overkill for anything in California but I don't want to have to deal with fiddle-factor anymore.
1 month ago
Anonymous
>Do people often use second layers of insulation with closed-cell foam pads?
my hennessy 4-season is a 2-layer design that incorporates a small foam pad, and recommended usage is to also toss extra clothes between the layers as necessary. I use this with an underquilt and other things tuned to conditions.
1 month ago
Anonymous
Yes, foam pad underneath an inflatable is the setup for places that get actual winter. But they are doing that with an inflatable pad that's already at r4 or higher. I've been taking an 1/8 inch neoprene foam pad that I use as a sit pad but also gives me the option to add .5r. I don't worry much about getting a hole in my pad, they are pretty tough and I take a patch kit. Worst case scenario you have a slow leak you can't find. I think you might have just been at your comfort limit for your quilt. You could add one of those cheap aegismax down bags, I use one with a 40 degree quilt over top and stay warm down to 20 weighing in around two pounds.
1 month ago
Anonymous
The classic foam pad is alright. You can stretch it by choosing your ground carefully, nice dry and soft locations, and sometimes it just helps to be really fucking tired. If you have serious draft problems you might consider a hoodless sleeping bag for the ability to seal up more. An inflatable and an attachment system is better for drafts but then you're adding some weight and bulk for your hammock gear. I think stick with the foam and get a new underquilt if you're going to keep with the hammock. I guess that depends if you consider it a place to sit and emergency pad or more of primary option.
1 month ago
Anonymous
that makes sense, ratings will keep you alive at that temperature but not comfortable
1 month ago
Anonymous
Thanks anon. I'm sure the synthetic insulation has also degraded over time (even though the quilt has gotten most use on my bed, lmao).
Yes, foam pad underneath an inflatable is the setup for places that get actual winter. But they are doing that with an inflatable pad that's already at r4 or higher. I've been taking an 1/8 inch neoprene foam pad that I use as a sit pad but also gives me the option to add .5r. I don't worry much about getting a hole in my pad, they are pretty tough and I take a patch kit. Worst case scenario you have a slow leak you can't find. I think you might have just been at your comfort limit for your quilt. You could add one of those cheap aegismax down bags, I use one with a 40 degree quilt over top and stay warm down to 20 weighing in around two pounds.
>they are pretty tough and I take a patch kit
Cool cool. I had one fuck up on me, but it was some cheap chinkshit from Amazon that my brother bought. >heap aegismax down bags
That's a good idea. The liner that I brought with my didn't do shit.
The classic foam pad is alright. You can stretch it by choosing your ground carefully, nice dry and soft locations, and sometimes it just helps to be really fucking tired. If you have serious draft problems you might consider a hoodless sleeping bag for the ability to seal up more. An inflatable and an attachment system is better for drafts but then you're adding some weight and bulk for your hammock gear. I think stick with the foam and get a new underquilt if you're going to keep with the hammock. I guess that depends if you consider it a place to sit and emergency pad or more of primary option.
Thanks man I really appreciate the advice! I think I'll be fine with the foam pad. I'm in coastal California, so it really doesn't get that cold and I see lots of people /out and about/ with z-lites.
I gave my Jarbidge to my mom to fix, so it's usable now. I'll try it and see if I can get a good hang with it. If not, I'll just sell it.
I've used both and quilts are fine so long you get a really big and warm one
I have a 30 degree EE Enigma. One problem with it is that I got a "wide" because I have wide shoulders and thought it might be an issue with the quilt.
1 month ago
Anonymous
>30°
I don't understand the point of a bag less insulating than a zero bag
this is repairable with six inches of any random cord, or by tying one end of the fucking underquilt into a fucking knot. I've literally made this repair in ten seconds, sleep walking, when it was too dark to see my hands.
This doesn’t make any sense. Under quilts are held up with shock cord. How did you break shock cord? And even if you did, why couldn’t you just tie it back together?
>How did you break shock cord?
I didn't; the stitching ripped out. >And even if you did, why couldn’t you just tie it back together?
Probably could've. I didn't want to make the hole worse as the underquilt seemed to need to be stretched rather taut in order to not sag below the hammock. AHG Jarbidge for those curious.
1 month ago
Anonymous
>AHG Jarbidge
Oh. that's a really bad design. literally just a rectangle. If you look at real underquilts you'll notice that they are not rectangular like that. Should be alright for most purposes but no surprise that you had a bad time.
Broke my underquilt's suspension and had to shack up in my friend's tent (no homo) with only my footpad as bottom insulation. Wasn't the greatest.
2. My back wasn't cold, but feet/top of my body was.
in addition to what anon said there's some more very likely reason it was cold and drafty on the ground:
what width is your top quilt?
almost every hammock camper i know buys their top quilts in narrow or standard width. top quilts only work for ground sleeping in extra wide size.
AND
if you're using a revelation did you stuff a pair of socks in the footbox? non-sewn footboxes sort of suck dick for ground sleeping in general.
i would always order a ground sleeping bag with overstuff, draft guards, sewn footbox, not the same way as i would for a hammock. they need a little extra.
imo if you're a bigger guy and/or a light sleeper then ground sleeping on quilts isn't gonna work out for you. i also don't think they're good for restless sleepers when its cold despite how they get marketed. if you're small or a lanklet drafts happen less often. some people wake up from 40 degree drafts some people can sleep through it no problem. i think they're only good down to whatever this temp is for you. every quilt is going to draft to some degree when used on the ground, other than maybe the ugq ones, i heard their draft system works pretty good but never tried it. my 2c on using them for ground sleeping.
They're great if you live some place where it doesn't get below 60° at night. Just like all the tarp and hammock larpers in here. You can tell they've never been above treeline anywhere in their lives.
No one here is thinking about it as part of a sleep *system*.
Truly cold: Here you want a good thick down mummy bag, but not *just* the bag. Sandwich it between synthetics to protect it and handle moisture: a cheap fleece liner bag to keep it cozy next to skin and the bag clean, and a lightweight synthetic quilt to evaporate moisture away from the down.
About freezing: Ditch the big bag. Replace it with a lightweight down quilt that packs to almost nothing – like two liters. If you set it up right, drafts are basically a non-issue, and anything that does get through is blunted by the liner.
Cool weather: Pick one, the down quilt or synthetic quilt, based on how wet it is and how much you feel like hauling.
Warm weather: Ditch the quilts, just use the liner bag. Unzip it to a blanket as the mercury rises.
You don't really *need* the down quilt, you can make it work with the down bag unzipped, but it's super nice to go out with just a daypack and suitable quilts are pretty cheap because they don't have a lot of down. The liner does take up space, but it effectively replaces a change of clothes – no need to have dedicated sleep clothes, or have to fuss about moisture in your clothes. And I hate having to wash a sleeping bag, but the liner is easy.
I slept with a sleeping bag liner innaquilt. Wasn't a fan. I feel like it didn't add much warmth, and I couldn't pull the underquilt around me to keep out drafts. I would mess it up when I slipped in the liner.
He probably means 30°F.
Eggsactly.
[...]
[...]
in addition to what anon said there's some more very likely reason it was cold and drafty on the ground:
what width is your top quilt?
almost every hammock camper i know buys their top quilts in narrow or standard width. top quilts only work for ground sleeping in extra wide size.
AND
if you're using a revelation did you stuff a pair of socks in the footbox? non-sewn footboxes sort of suck dick for ground sleeping in general.
i would always order a ground sleeping bag with overstuff, draft guards, sewn footbox, not the same way as i would for a hammock. they need a little extra.
imo if you're a bigger guy and/or a light sleeper then ground sleeping on quilts isn't gonna work out for you. i also don't think they're good for restless sleepers when its cold despite how they get marketed. if you're small or a lanklet drafts happen less often. some people wake up from 40 degree drafts some people can sleep through it no problem. i think they're only good down to whatever this temp is for you. every quilt is going to draft to some degree when used on the ground, other than maybe the ugq ones, i heard their draft system works pretty good but never tried it. my 2c on using them for ground sleeping.
Thanks for the effortpost man! Appreciate it 🙂 >what width is your top quilt?
58 inches. It was not, however, wrapped around my sleeping pad. It had the claps to do so, but I was busy tending to a fire next to me which needed branches added throughout the night (burned a hole in my quilt, lel). >if you're using a revelation did you stuff a pair of socks in the footbox? non-sewn footboxes sort of suck dick for ground sleeping in general.
I'm using an Apex Enigma which has a sewn footbox. My feet get cold easily. >i would always order a ground sleeping bag with overstuff, draft guards, sewn footbox
I could really use some draft guards on my next quilt. Side elastics would also be nice too. I'm eyeing a 0 degree Warbonnet Diamondback as I love all their other gear.
< Questions for you and other anons:
Would a 0 degree quilt be too hot for other situations? Should I get any overfill? I have a 10 degree jacket and I can wear it comfortably in 60 degree weather.
Is down preferable to APEX? Getting down wet scares me t.b.h.
Why did you not get a sleeping bag. I have slept in about 2 inches of water in the bottom of one and was still cozy
Because hammock camping is comfy and everyone uses a quilt.
This. I live where it's always under 45 in winter and it's conveniently wet. Don't act like real camping is like going into your backyard
Have you ever gotten wet while hammock camping?
They're great if you live some place where it doesn't get below 60° at night. Just like all the tarp and hammock larpers in here. You can tell they've never been above treeline anywhere in their lives.
>Would a 0 degree quilt be too hot for other situations?
depends person to person but yeah probably. if you're a cold sleeper and fine sticking a leg out of the bag you might be fine to like 50-60 or so. when is that warm you don't even really need a bag though, a liner or a blanket is often good enough. i use a diy 2.5 apex quilt that cost me like 50bux to sew up and its a super easy first sewing project. >Is down preferable to APEX? Getting down wet scares me t.b.h.
down is better and apex is the best synthetic.
treated down exists and works decently good but it might reduce the longevity of the bag, no one really knows yet.
i find apex is just too bulky if you go below a 30-40* range 2.5 bag. i would consider apex over down if i lived in like i dunno forks washington or hawaii or somewhere with insane rainfall. i live one of those sorts of places and i've done fine with treated down and regular down. i do however only wear apex jackets and never down jackets. >I could really use some draft guards on my next quilt. Side elastics would also be nice too. I'm eyeing a 0 degree Warbonnet Diamondback as I love all their other gear.
i THINK ugq is the only brand that does the shock cord side draft guards. might be outdated info though.
No one here is thinking about it as part of a sleep *system*.
Truly cold: Here you want a good thick down mummy bag, but not *just* the bag. Sandwich it between synthetics to protect it and handle moisture: a cheap fleece liner bag to keep it cozy next to skin and the bag clean, and a lightweight synthetic quilt to evaporate moisture away from the down.
About freezing: Ditch the big bag. Replace it with a lightweight down quilt that packs to almost nothing – like two liters. If you set it up right, drafts are basically a non-issue, and anything that does get through is blunted by the liner.
Cool weather: Pick one, the down quilt or synthetic quilt, based on how wet it is and how much you feel like hauling.
Warm weather: Ditch the quilts, just use the liner bag. Unzip it to a blanket as the mercury rises.
You don't really *need* the down quilt, you can make it work with the down bag unzipped, but it's super nice to go out with just a daypack and suitable quilts are pretty cheap because they don't have a lot of down. The liner does take up space, but it effectively replaces a change of clothes – no need to have dedicated sleep clothes, or have to fuss about moisture in your clothes. And I hate having to wash a sleeping bag, but the liner is easy.
seconded all this advice i basically do the same thing.
0 degree mummy, 20 degree down quilt, 40 degree apex quilt, and a blanket.
you might not need to if you're in a more tropical zone though.
Down and Apex are both good at different things.
Down: >compresses better >more warmth to weight >more warmth to volume >retains more warmth after repeated compress/decompress cycles
Apex: >better structural integrity so doesn’t need baffles of quilting or whatever >also doesn’t need much in the way of a shell to hold it together >more warmth when damp
Ultimately which is best depends on what you want. I use a down quilt for sleeping when lows are below 40. I use a woobie made out of Apex above 40, and also use it as a blanket when sitting to glass for animals.
apex bags also degrade and lose loft way more rapidly than down if you're the kind of person to use the stuff sack, consider that when deciding. if you're an ultralighter who just shoves your bag in the bottom of your backpack loose then its no biggie.
Based. Quilts are shilled to death on reddit, usually accompanied with tips to eat a lot of food and exercise before sleep to save every last bit of warmth, hahahahahahaha
I used to go camping with actual blankets; usually the worst ones I owned that were falling apart. I don't know what the hell is wrong with PrepHole one minor thing goes wrong and they freeze half to death.
Its not bad if you sleep by a fire. I once went on a group hike in michigan at with about 20 degrees (no snow though), and I was the larping nerd who slept by the fire with a wool blanket, while everyone enjoyed their tents. To my genuine surprise, half of the people in the tents came out, dragging their mats, and joined me. Just get another blanket if it gets a little colder. If Boone could do it, so can we.
I wont lie and say ive never woken up shivering on some of the colder/wetter outings, but hey, its part of the fun.
Has anyone actually shown what's the lowest temp a Kidaru Doobie was used at comfortably? Everyone says they are warm but no one has really tested them.
Went camping in the Central Belt using a Sierra Designs top quilt recently, went down to 2c (35f-ish) in the night, felt the warmest I have in years. Granted, the closed cell foam pad x insulated air pad combo probably helped a lot, but I can't relate to the talk of drafts at all.
Swagman Roll poncho zipped up in the bag configuration with a 20° down quilt stuffed inside as a liner is top tier warm and comfy in the winter, just make sure you have a good ground tarp and foam sleeping pad.
kek, if you'd have stopped to think for a second before being a mindless consoomer you wouldn't have fallen for the drafty garden gnome.
I was a hammock camper. Quilts are standard practice for that. I sat on my underquilt two nights ago (lol) and experienced a critical shelter failure that has me rethinking some things.
did u shidded n farded but couldn't get up in time?
Broke my underquilt's suspension and had to shack up in my friend's tent (no homo) with only my footpad as bottom insulation. Wasn't the greatest.
So you broke your underquilt like a dumbass, what does this have to do with top quilts? You would have been in the same situation with a sleeping bag.
>what does this have to do with top quilts?
just talking about my last PrepHoleing
I got a pad from REI after the shelter failure incident and was cold even with my 30 degree quilt next to a fire. Was a hair under 40 degrees outside.
What's the r value on the pad?
2. My back wasn't cold, but feet/top of my body was.
2 is a little light on insulation and it will make you cold overall, not just the feeling of heat being sucked out of your back. Was it humid that day? To me 40 and humid feels way colder than being in the teens. Any drafts from around the edges?
I'm not here to defend quilts against sleeping bags btw, genuinely just trying to help. I use both for different situations.
>I'm not here to defend quilts against sleeping bags btw, genuinely just trying to help.
Thanks man! I appreciate it.
>2 is a little light on insulation and it will make you cold overall, not just the feeling of heat being sucked out of your back.
Interesting. Do people often use second layers of insulation with closed-cell foam pads? I like the idea of not relying on an inflatable pad which can get punctured.
>Was it humid that day?
Nope, not at all actually. We were in the Santa Cruz mountains in California.
>Any drafts from around the edges?
Some. I was also using a sleeping bag liner, so it was hard to fully pull in the edges around my as I was also tossing and turning throughout the night.
Yeah, it gets rave reviews on online forums, but I hated it. Not sure why it gets such good reviews. I'm gonna fix it up then try to sell it on hammockforums or something. I have a 0-degree Wooki that's totally overkill for anything in California but I don't want to have to deal with fiddle-factor anymore.
>Do people often use second layers of insulation with closed-cell foam pads?
my hennessy 4-season is a 2-layer design that incorporates a small foam pad, and recommended usage is to also toss extra clothes between the layers as necessary. I use this with an underquilt and other things tuned to conditions.
Yes, foam pad underneath an inflatable is the setup for places that get actual winter. But they are doing that with an inflatable pad that's already at r4 or higher. I've been taking an 1/8 inch neoprene foam pad that I use as a sit pad but also gives me the option to add .5r. I don't worry much about getting a hole in my pad, they are pretty tough and I take a patch kit. Worst case scenario you have a slow leak you can't find. I think you might have just been at your comfort limit for your quilt. You could add one of those cheap aegismax down bags, I use one with a 40 degree quilt over top and stay warm down to 20 weighing in around two pounds.
The classic foam pad is alright. You can stretch it by choosing your ground carefully, nice dry and soft locations, and sometimes it just helps to be really fucking tired. If you have serious draft problems you might consider a hoodless sleeping bag for the ability to seal up more. An inflatable and an attachment system is better for drafts but then you're adding some weight and bulk for your hammock gear. I think stick with the foam and get a new underquilt if you're going to keep with the hammock. I guess that depends if you consider it a place to sit and emergency pad or more of primary option.
that makes sense, ratings will keep you alive at that temperature but not comfortable
Thanks anon. I'm sure the synthetic insulation has also degraded over time (even though the quilt has gotten most use on my bed, lmao).
>they are pretty tough and I take a patch kit
Cool cool. I had one fuck up on me, but it was some cheap chinkshit from Amazon that my brother bought.
>heap aegismax down bags
That's a good idea. The liner that I brought with my didn't do shit.
Thanks man I really appreciate the advice! I think I'll be fine with the foam pad. I'm in coastal California, so it really doesn't get that cold and I see lots of people /out and about/ with z-lites.
I gave my Jarbidge to my mom to fix, so it's usable now. I'll try it and see if I can get a good hang with it. If not, I'll just sell it.
I have a 30 degree EE Enigma. One problem with it is that I got a "wide" because I have wide shoulders and thought it might be an issue with the quilt.
>30°
I don't understand the point of a bag less insulating than a zero bag
He probably means 30°F.
>broke my underquilts suspension
this is repairable with six inches of any random cord, or by tying one end of the fucking underquilt into a fucking knot. I've literally made this repair in ten seconds, sleep walking, when it was too dark to see my hands.
This doesn’t make any sense. Under quilts are held up with shock cord. How did you break shock cord? And even if you did, why couldn’t you just tie it back together?
>How did you break shock cord?
I didn't; the stitching ripped out.
>And even if you did, why couldn’t you just tie it back together?
Probably could've. I didn't want to make the hole worse as the underquilt seemed to need to be stretched rather taut in order to not sag below the hammock. AHG Jarbidge for those curious.
>AHG Jarbidge
Oh. that's a really bad design. literally just a rectangle. If you look at real underquilts you'll notice that they are not rectangular like that. Should be alright for most purposes but no surprise that you had a bad time.
>bottom insulation
I heard that's what his friend calls him now.
in addition to what anon said there's some more very likely reason it was cold and drafty on the ground:
what width is your top quilt?
almost every hammock camper i know buys their top quilts in narrow or standard width. top quilts only work for ground sleeping in extra wide size.
AND
if you're using a revelation did you stuff a pair of socks in the footbox? non-sewn footboxes sort of suck dick for ground sleeping in general.
i would always order a ground sleeping bag with overstuff, draft guards, sewn footbox, not the same way as i would for a hammock. they need a little extra.
imo if you're a bigger guy and/or a light sleeper then ground sleeping on quilts isn't gonna work out for you. i also don't think they're good for restless sleepers when its cold despite how they get marketed. if you're small or a lanklet drafts happen less often. some people wake up from 40 degree drafts some people can sleep through it no problem. i think they're only good down to whatever this temp is for you. every quilt is going to draft to some degree when used on the ground, other than maybe the ugq ones, i heard their draft system works pretty good but never tried it. my 2c on using them for ground sleeping.
B-but my favorite youtubers said "DONT MAKE THIS MISTAKE HIKING", with a thumbnail of of them pointing at a sleeping bag
cold hard sleepy sleepy is not fun
I prefer to sleep on the ground with two quilts wrapped around me. I only use a sleeping bag when I hike.
Sleeping bags are shit, finally I can fucking roll around in my sleep like God intended, thank you quilt chan
I've used both and quilts are fine so long you get a really big and warm one
They're great if you live some place where it doesn't get below 60° at night. Just like all the tarp and hammock larpers in here. You can tell they've never been above treeline anywhere in their lives.
This. I live where it's always under 45 in winter and it's conveniently wet. Don't act like real camping is like going into your backyard
Real Scotsman hours.
Why did you not get a sleeping bag. I have slept in about 2 inches of water in the bottom of one and was still cozy
No one here is thinking about it as part of a sleep *system*.
Truly cold: Here you want a good thick down mummy bag, but not *just* the bag. Sandwich it between synthetics to protect it and handle moisture: a cheap fleece liner bag to keep it cozy next to skin and the bag clean, and a lightweight synthetic quilt to evaporate moisture away from the down.
About freezing: Ditch the big bag. Replace it with a lightweight down quilt that packs to almost nothing – like two liters. If you set it up right, drafts are basically a non-issue, and anything that does get through is blunted by the liner.
Cool weather: Pick one, the down quilt or synthetic quilt, based on how wet it is and how much you feel like hauling.
Warm weather: Ditch the quilts, just use the liner bag. Unzip it to a blanket as the mercury rises.
You don't really *need* the down quilt, you can make it work with the down bag unzipped, but it's super nice to go out with just a daypack and suitable quilts are pretty cheap because they don't have a lot of down. The liner does take up space, but it effectively replaces a change of clothes – no need to have dedicated sleep clothes, or have to fuss about moisture in your clothes. And I hate having to wash a sleeping bag, but the liner is easy.
I slept with a sleeping bag liner innaquilt. Wasn't a fan. I feel like it didn't add much warmth, and I couldn't pull the underquilt around me to keep out drafts. I would mess it up when I slipped in the liner.
Eggsactly.
Thanks for the effortpost man! Appreciate it 🙂
>what width is your top quilt?
58 inches. It was not, however, wrapped around my sleeping pad. It had the claps to do so, but I was busy tending to a fire next to me which needed branches added throughout the night (burned a hole in my quilt, lel).
>if you're using a revelation did you stuff a pair of socks in the footbox? non-sewn footboxes sort of suck dick for ground sleeping in general.
I'm using an Apex Enigma which has a sewn footbox. My feet get cold easily.
>i would always order a ground sleeping bag with overstuff, draft guards, sewn footbox
I could really use some draft guards on my next quilt. Side elastics would also be nice too. I'm eyeing a 0 degree Warbonnet Diamondback as I love all their other gear.
< Questions for you and other anons:
Would a 0 degree quilt be too hot for other situations? Should I get any overfill? I have a 10 degree jacket and I can wear it comfortably in 60 degree weather.
Is down preferable to APEX? Getting down wet scares me t.b.h.
Because hammock camping is comfy and everyone uses a quilt.
Have you ever gotten wet while hammock camping?
Watch based Shug hanging BWC(A)
>Would a 0 degree quilt be too hot for other situations?
depends person to person but yeah probably. if you're a cold sleeper and fine sticking a leg out of the bag you might be fine to like 50-60 or so. when is that warm you don't even really need a bag though, a liner or a blanket is often good enough. i use a diy 2.5 apex quilt that cost me like 50bux to sew up and its a super easy first sewing project.
>Is down preferable to APEX? Getting down wet scares me t.b.h.
down is better and apex is the best synthetic.
treated down exists and works decently good but it might reduce the longevity of the bag, no one really knows yet.
i find apex is just too bulky if you go below a 30-40* range 2.5 bag. i would consider apex over down if i lived in like i dunno forks washington or hawaii or somewhere with insane rainfall. i live one of those sorts of places and i've done fine with treated down and regular down. i do however only wear apex jackets and never down jackets.
>I could really use some draft guards on my next quilt. Side elastics would also be nice too. I'm eyeing a 0 degree Warbonnet Diamondback as I love all their other gear.
i THINK ugq is the only brand that does the shock cord side draft guards. might be outdated info though.
seconded all this advice i basically do the same thing.
0 degree mummy, 20 degree down quilt, 40 degree apex quilt, and a blanket.
you might not need to if you're in a more tropical zone though.
Down and Apex are both good at different things.
Down:
>compresses better
>more warmth to weight
>more warmth to volume
>retains more warmth after repeated compress/decompress cycles
Apex:
>better structural integrity so doesn’t need baffles of quilting or whatever
>also doesn’t need much in the way of a shell to hold it together
>more warmth when damp
Ultimately which is best depends on what you want. I use a down quilt for sleeping when lows are below 40. I use a woobie made out of Apex above 40, and also use it as a blanket when sitting to glass for animals.
apex bags also degrade and lose loft way more rapidly than down if you're the kind of person to use the stuff sack, consider that when deciding. if you're an ultralighter who just shoves your bag in the bottom of your backpack loose then its no biggie.
Based. Quilts are shilled to death on reddit, usually accompanied with tips to eat a lot of food and exercise before sleep to save every last bit of warmth, hahahahahahaha
I used to go camping with actual blankets; usually the worst ones I owned that were falling apart. I don't know what the hell is wrong with PrepHole one minor thing goes wrong and they freeze half to death.
some of us go backpacking year round not just in the summer when its 50 out at night
In PA and it's not bad aside from winter. Winter more just sucks because everything is wet all the time.
Its not bad if you sleep by a fire. I once went on a group hike in michigan at with about 20 degrees (no snow though), and I was the larping nerd who slept by the fire with a wool blanket, while everyone enjoyed their tents. To my genuine surprise, half of the people in the tents came out, dragging their mats, and joined me. Just get another blanket if it gets a little colder. If Boone could do it, so can we.
I wont lie and say ive never woken up shivering on some of the colder/wetter outings, but hey, its part of the fun.
Has anyone actually shown what's the lowest temp a Kidaru Doobie was used at comfortably? Everyone says they are warm but no one has really tested them.
Went camping in the Central Belt using a Sierra Designs top quilt recently, went down to 2c (35f-ish) in the night, felt the warmest I have in years. Granted, the closed cell foam pad x insulated air pad combo probably helped a lot, but I can't relate to the talk of drafts at all.
Imagine not using 1-2 wool blankets, and maybe a pad.
Swagman Roll poncho zipped up in the bag configuration with a 20° down quilt stuffed inside as a liner is top tier warm and comfy in the winter, just make sure you have a good ground tarp and foam sleeping pad.