Is 45-70 an awesome round? How does it stack up to other large calibers?

Is 45-70 an awesome round? How does it stack up to other large calibers?

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  1. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Pretty good, my dad does 54-58 gr (i think), quite a kick but not unbearable, don't expect accuracy or consistency but it's a cheap strong caliber to fire in yuropeland if you self reload

  2. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    matches my ass

  3. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Several million American Bison were killed with 45-70 back in the day. If you've ever been close to a Bison you'll realize how impressive that is

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      The majority of them were killed with other cartridges and .45-70 was on the lower end of popularity with buffalo hunters. The famous Buffalo Bill did his hunting with a .50-70. Billy Dixon had a .45-90 and borrowed a .50-90 for his famous shot.

  4. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >awesome
    no, not really.
    It doesn't do anything any better than a magnum rifle caliber does. if you want the full performance available for the case you have to move to a Ruger No.1, at which point you may as well get a bolt action in .458WM or .458 Lott.
    it is easy to reload, though.

  5. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >is 45-70 an awesome round?
    Frick yeah it is. Imagine the myth of .45, but in a rifle.
    >How does it stack up to other large calibers?
    I'm going to assume you're talking about larger than .308, so I'm going to say not well. There's plenty of better rounds to choose from, and I'd argue 30-06 is more practical. If you insist on big game, though, accept no substitute. There's a reason these a bear guns, and .45-70 is known to ruin the poor sacks of shit that piss off the guy with one.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      IMHO it's more hype and historical interest than anything else. It played a role in the American west, it was the US Army issue cartridge for a while. It's a classic levergun round and is especially famous as a short-range "brush gun" for hunting. On the other hand it has a lot of disadvantages too. Most loads are relatively weak compared to modern rifle ammo or even big pistol ammo like .454 or .500 S&W since it was originally a black powder cartridge and they don't want people blowing up old guns. It's rimmed so it doesn't play nice with modern actions. You can get revolvers chambered in it, which I originally though was very cool since I'm into big-bore handguns. However, this is more of a "bark than bite" thing because the average factory load is meant for a rifle so it has crappy performance out of a revolver whose barrel is much too short to burn all the powder. A .454 or even a hot .44 magnum is more powerful while the gun is nowhere near as big. I had a BFR in .45-70 and sold it after less than a year. It also has pretty crappy ballistics with a rainbow trajectory--while you can certainly shoot at long rang with it, it's the opposite of "flat shooting".

      >If you insist on big game, though, accept no substitute
      What's the logic here? It's weaker than most dangerous game or big game calibers unless you're talking Ruger #1 tier loads, and even then it's comparable not superior. Now clearly it's a proven hunting cartridge, but I wouldn't say "accept no substitute".

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        If you wanted to do something cool with 45-70 BFR, all you had to do was load it appropriately. That cylinder is exactly the same one they load the other 60-65,000psi rounds in like the 454, 460, and 500, the 500 is even larger diameter.
        Use IMR4198 and load it heavy, you'll outdo a 500 Mag simply through more case capacity.
        You just get to travel in no man's land as far as load data.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Can’t you get the newer style 45-70 lever guns rated for full power ammo instead of historical loadings? I’d think as far as levergun loadings go it’s probably the top of the heap.

        How did the 45-70 bfr recoil compare to a 500 (bfr or xframe)? I’ve got a 500 magnum bfr getting converted to 500 bushwacker and the 45-70 bfr looks neat, but I’d be curious how it actually compares.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          depends on the gun and manufacturer. there are no less than 3 load levels for .45-70, Trapdoor, Levergun and Ruger no 1 (and Siamese Mauser). it's the reality of it being a big case because it started as a BP cartridge. lever guns also have a limited COAL due to ejection port size and elevator clearance, and they don't have the strongest lockup because they have long, slender bolts supported from the rear.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Honestly… after I get my bfr back in 500 bushwacker I wanna see about getting a no1 converted… talked with the tII guys and they’re working on it. They’ve done 2 encore conversions already

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >Is 45-70 an awesome round?
      It's a fun still easy to get ammo and guns for historical round. It'll be quirky in balllistics and such for people used to more modern stuff which is part of the fun, it's a different experience. So in that respect I guess one could call it awesome. But
      >How does it stack up to other large calibers?
      Other anons have been polite but let's be clear: it gets fricking slaughtered by modern large bore rounds. There's no contest in terms of pure performance. Hell it gets outdone by big pistol rounds.

      Which doesn't at all mean it's not a fun round if you're into it or want a different rifle or just to shoot something with a connection to an interesting period in American history. But "big game accept no substitutes" like said is just silly. It's nothing special there at all, not even by history odd gun standards like nitro express rounds.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >It's nothing special there at all, not even by history odd gun standards like nitro express rounds.
        Heck, even in the black powder days it wasn't anything that special. Comparing it to other BP military rounds, the .577 Snider had the same powder charge but a much bigger bullet. The .450 Martini-Henry had the same size bullet as the .45-70 but had more powder.
        Comparing it to other hunting rounds of the day it was nothing special either. There was also .45-90, .45-110, .50-110, and others. On the British side you had cartridges like the .500/.450 Express which had a whopping 140 grains of powder. And even then we haven't even gotten started on the real dangerous game calibers of that day measured in bore gauge.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Most of those express "hunting cartridges" you cite came too late to take many buffalo. They also tended to be loaded with lighter bullets to facilitate a flatter trajectory.
          You can send a 405gr boolit into the far side dirt of a buffalo so hard so pushing them faster didn't make a difference. The 45-70 had staying power because of how common the rifles it was chambered in were.
          What good was a 50-140 cartridge on the eve of smokeless powder?

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >45-70 rekt by modern cartridges

        Wasn't the purpose of 45-70 to use blackpowder (and not modern smokeless powder) for large game?

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          It was invented by the US army. It was on par with, maybe a bit on the lighter side, compared to large game hunting cartridges of its era. It was much weaker than dangerous game cartridges of its time.
          But yes, it was a black powder cartridge. That's what the "70" meant: 70 grains of black powder as the charge.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >it gets outdone by big pistol rounds
        The only one I can think that has actually done it is the 500 Bushwhacker, but that's out of a very long barrel. No the S&W magnums don't outdo a Ruger No1 or modern 1886 loaded to 50,000psi.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Nobody is talking about them outdoing Ruger tier loads, we're talking about comparing to the standard off the shelf stuff.

          If you wanted to do something cool with 45-70 BFR, all you had to do was load it appropriately. That cylinder is exactly the same one they load the other 60-65,000psi rounds in like the 454, 460, and 500, the 500 is even larger diameter.
          Use IMR4198 and load it heavy, you'll outdo a 500 Mag simply through more case capacity.
          You just get to travel in no man's land as far as load data.

          The round is much better if you're handloading. But if you're doing that, why not go with something that has even higher case capacity than .45-70?

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Off the shelf anything is dogshit.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Here's one reason why you might not use a longer straightwall cartridge: imagine you have a really long, heavy bullet.
            For example if we're comparing 45-70 and 45-90. Lets say we have an OAL restriction like a cylinder, what the action will cycle, or how long our gun's throat is. If we load them to the exact same length then both cartridges have the same case capacity, but the shorter brass might be better suited for crimping. This is true of 45 Colt and 454 comparisons too etc.

  6. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Like many cartridges first designed for black powder, the case volume is too much for modern powders. This can make velocities erratic if you don't use a filler. The same problem occurs to a lesser degree with 45 Colt and 38 Special

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Use a slower powder lmao

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        It wouldn't matter. You are not getting anywhere near to a compressed load unless you're loading for a Ruger No 1 and at max velocities.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          What a tard mongler you are.

          >Like many cartridges first designed for black powder, the case volume is too much for modern powders. This can make velocities erratic if you don't use a filler
          I use 11-15 grains of unique and get single-digit standard deviations

          Yep, my 12gr of Universal is very consistent. Some should try the things they're proclaiming first.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >Yep, my 12gr of Universal is very consistent
            funny thing is my unique load is the most accurate 45-70 load I have

            Ironically the publisher-recommended IMR 4198 / Alliant 2400 loads give me bad hangfires once the temperature dips below 40F

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              For sure, they are extremely consistent, pic rel. One of my buddies commented how cool it was that you could see the bullet flying through the air.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >Like many cartridges first designed for black powder, the case volume is too much for modern powders. This can make velocities erratic if you don't use a filler
      I use 11-15 grains of unique and get single-digit standard deviations

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >11-15 grains of unique
        In the 45-70? That's a mouse fart and you for sure aren't using such fast powder in full power loads.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >405 grains going 1050-1075 fps depending on the outside temperature
          Works great for subsonic loads and much more effective than subsonic 300 BLACKED

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            And much harder to suppress a 45 than a 30

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              you just screw a suppressor on the end. it isn't any more effort than any other gun. anything that shoots 45-70 will suppress better than an AR in whatever (except 22lr) because it doesn't have a gas system shitting out a bunch of high pressure gas from the bolt. stop using bolt gun testing to pretend that's how ARs suppress.

  7. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    How does it stack up to other large calibers? Well.... it's .458 caliber which is larger than .429 caliber but smaller than .50 caliber.

  8. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    it's awesome at bankrupting you

  9. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    My brother uses .45-70 when he's hunting in thick brush because the heavy bullet is less likely to deflect off twigs and branches than his .30-30.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      This isn't a thing and youtube videos of rednecks shooting through the forest to test it are not proof of anything

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Yeah, because an object with more mass has exactly the same chance of being knocked off its trajectory as an object with much less mass. That's why every time a freight train hits a car it acts exactly the same as one car hitting another car, right? That's how physics works in your world, right?

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        How do you know it's not a thing?

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