>In 2003, the US military acquired four T-84 main battle tanks from Ukraine for testing and evaluation.

>In 2003, the US military acquired four T-84 main battle tanks from Ukraine for testing and evaluation.
>They were shocked to discover that the M829A2 120mm DU APFSDS of the M1 Abrams couldn't penetrate the hull armor of the T-84 when its covered with the Kontakt-5 ERA.
Why haven't we seen them being used by Ukraine against Russia?
https://twitter.com/GarupanH/status/1787832029188706767?t=Bp9nmaTRzLpjVvAd9iaGUg&s=19

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  1. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    They have like 5 of them in service. By the time Ukraine even had a chance to start getting it's shit together after 2014 they came to the conclusion it was more cost effective to just modernize T-64's (and even then it was sluggish).

  2. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    No money to build em during peace years
    No capabilities to build em after 2022
    Even the good BTR4 that their military procured in larger numbers and that had working production lines went extinct

  3. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    that's a russian propaganda account
    ERA only protects against chemical rounds not kinetic ones

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Heavier flying plates can degrade long rods. That's why the A3 (in service since 2003) and A4 (2011) are optimized against ERA+Compound armor rather than "pure RHA value" against steel or compound armor.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        only at extremely specific angles and velocities
        very ineffective at right angles and higher speeds

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >only at extremely specific angles and velocities
          Yeah, like most composite armor, all ERA and NERA...

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            wrong, NERA is far more polyvalent
            meanwhile everything must be just right for flyer plate ERA to be effective against apfsds

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              There's a continuum between ERA and composites (made by plates) with NERA (inert and energetic binder) in between, all of them are angled at angles +70º to be really effective against HEAT or AP.

              >ERA to be effective against apfsds
              Against APFSDS NERA behaves like composite armor that relies on variable density to degrade the penetrator, not ideal against long rods when wide-gap spaced armor is far more effective. Physical restrictions and being good enough means that except for turrets those NERA arrays are considered ok, for the hull heavier composites and ERA on top of steel (better than plain RHA) is more common.

              The binder/refractive lining in between steel plates of NERA don't work at <2 km/s like they do at +4 km/s against HEAT, their RHAeq value is ~0 against AP, all the degradation against APFSDS comes from the variable density of "narrow" gap plates.

              tl;dr you're wrong, gtfo

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >refractive
                refractory

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >They were shocked to discover that the M829A2 120mm DU APFSDS of the M1 Abrams couldn't penetrate the hull armor of the T-84 when its covered with the Kontakt-5 ERA.
      Literally the exact reason why M829A3 was created.
      Also, they don't have very many of them and the majority of the ones built were for export. Given that Ukraine also had extensive T-80 and T-64 stockpiles and production capability and the fact that they were poor, they couldn't afford to make this thing any more than a side project.

      Depends on the type, some are specialized against APFSDS and others against HEAT though I would suspect that anti-kinetic ERA is fundamentally less effective. Kontakt-5 can be defeated by modern 120mm APFSDS however.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >Literally the exact reason why M829A3 was created.
        It was the reason A2 was created, A3 was in anticipation of further ERA technology development. The alleged tests had nothing to do with A3 as the development started around 1999 and it already entered service in 2003

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Rumors are both M829A2 and DM53 had anti ERA capability, they have nose profiled in such way it doesn't trigger Kontact-5 ERA.
        Kontact-5 developers themselves disclosed that M829A2 penetrates T-90 from 5000 m range (in the AD materials for new ERA, buy it, it stop M829A2, Kontact-5 doesn't!)

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >(in the AD materials for new ERA, buy it, it stop M829A2, Kontact-5 doesn't!)
          Damn that's even more embarrassing than a War Blunder leak

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >ERA only protects against chemical rounds not kinetic ones
      Wrong

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >Garupan History
      Thank you saar

      SAAR
      SAAR
      THE TANKS 84 IS OF BESTING ABRAHAMS
      PLEASE REDEEM SAAR

      https://i.imgur.com/GnVoRGM.jpeg

      >Couldn't penetrate, russhill account
      Kek

      What's with all of the mouth breathers here and in the Twitter thread calling him a Russian shill? It's literally a UKRAINIAN tank, and none of what he said is wrong either. It's been known for quite a while that the US bought and extensively tested T-84s. Also, Garupan is Japanese shorthand for "Girls und Panzer". Maybe a weeb isn't much better than a 'jeet, but Christ, /k/ is fricking brain dead sometimes.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >none of what he said is wrong either.

        At least you tried. That's what's important.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >Weeb tank expert
          >Stalin
          >WoT

          Garbage or excellent parody

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >russian
        >ukrainian
        whats the difference?

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          in ERA they're different.
          Ukrainians ERA bricks have linear shaped charge inside (Nizh ERA), Russians shaped charges are ERA with heavier flying plates (Kontakt-5 and Relikt that can "pre-detonate" to work better iirc)

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Garupan translates to girl undies, actually.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Pan | パン | Bread
          Pantsu | ぱんつ | Panties

          Garupan is a shortening of Garu ando Pantsaa, or ガルアンドパンッァー. I had thought that Pantsaa was some sort of play on word of pantsu (panties) given the first thought would be that the correct rendering of the word "panzer" would be パンザ or "panza," but no that is apparently the used transliteration of the word in Japanese.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >shaped charges are now "chemical rounds"

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        It's a valid term.
        Explosives are chemicals and the action of shaped charges relies on explosives, therefore chemical round.

  4. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >Garupan History
    Thank you saar

  5. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >no source
    >half of the pics are from youtube videos of an amateur computer model
    Total twitter genocide can't come soon enough.

  6. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >source: extensive tests in Wart Hunder

  7. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    SAAR
    SAAR
    THE TANKS 84 IS OF BESTING ABRAHAMS
    PLEASE REDEEM SAAR

  8. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >Couldn't penetrate, russhill account
    Kek

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      The Ukrainian T-84 is based of T-80UD which has better armour than the older T-80BV which is what the Russian are refurbishing into T-80BVM.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Russian Nomenclature or rather their need to make ten billion variants of a tank is absolute nonsense
        >b, bv, m, u, um , bvm, bbc, lgtb+, brap
        the only one I understand is obr. because thats just the year it was refurbed

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          russia and chevy should collaborate to make the most cancerous names for things

  9. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >[military/government/manufacturer] was SHOCKED to discover [thing that was probably known/suspected for years]

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >design against your expecatations of thing
      >finally get thing in your hands
      >test thing
      >thing is slightly better than your expectation of it
      >adjust your future designs against a more realistic version of thing
      THE WEST HAS FALLEN, BILLIONS MUST TRANSITION

  10. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    doesn't work against drones
    tanks are obsolete

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      hey, look!
      its one of the idiots who fell for the meme!
      point at him and laugh!

  11. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Because unlike russians Ukrainians know how to build a good tank but usualy they lack the budget. So ready those ass cheeks due rasheed and ivan once ukies restart their proper MIC with the help of of Europe your shit geting phased out

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >once ukies restart their proper MIC with the help of of Europe
      I hope this actually happens and maybe Ukes can have their own factories for artillery, aircraft, and tanks

  12. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous
  13. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Someone post webm of Abrams turret lifting up and out of its hull from exploding.

  14. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    The early T-84 used Nizh I believe but if it was that tough. Then Duplet and Nizh-2 is gonna be hard as frick. Uke tanks are pretty unique for tying to maximize the shitty soviet design into something good. I kind of wish the army would have bough era from Ukraine and use it on out tanks.

  15. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Garupan History is administrated by a furry, obsessed pajeet tier shill.
    Here's his pixiv if you'd like to see it.
    https://www.pixiv.net/en/users/16306130/artworks

  16. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >Why haven't we seen them being used by Ukraine against Russia?
    Because Russia doesn't use M829A2 120mm DU APFSDS. They use mostly old Soviet "Mango" rounds that are shit.

  17. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    well that's just wrong. m829a3 was in development well before 2003

  18. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >With the Soviet creation of the Kontakt-5 Explosive Reactive Armor (ERA), the M829A2 was the US immediate response, developed in part to take on this new ERA type. The M829A3 is a further improvement, designed to defeat any future armor protection methods, like 'Kaktus' ERA, which was seen on the now canceled prototype tank, the Object 640 "Chiorny Oriol". It completed type classification standard in March 2003.

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