I see why the Bradley is so much of a bigger deal than the marder

I see why the Bradley is so much of a bigger deal than the marder

  1. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >Bradley
    Better cannon
    Better missile
    Better optics
    >Marder
    Better armor
    Better mobility
    Faster

    It's not it's just different

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Bradley videos gets Seek and Destroy, Marder videos get Kickstart My Heart, got it.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        good summary

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Best I can do is Sabaton covers and Hardbass remixes of the Initial D soundtrack.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >Full Country - Vincenzo Ceroli
          >Mahler's 8th.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        One day, they'll design an IFV whose videos will be set to Van Halen's Panama and consist of nothing but the vehicle destroying T-72s with missiles and cannon fire in multiple direction simultaneously, all while doing burnouts in a parking lot with the commander head-out mag-dumping a MAC-10 full of nothing but tracer rounds one-handedly because he's carry a 1980s boombox on his other shoulder.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >Better optics
      Will the Bradleys they send have thermals too? Otherwise I'd give that one to the Marders.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >Will the Bradleys they send have thermals too?
        Absolutely, and far superior armament

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >far superior armament
          Why?

          OK, but the Bradley has a better cannon it's not a debate its a fact.

          Better for what?

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Everything. Better calibre, better ballistics, better HE capacity, better range. Why are you being an autist coping over something irrelevant.

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              >Everything. Better calibre,
              7.62 is bigger than 5.56, western armies prefer 5.56. Do you understand why?
              >better ballistics,
              Are you sure?
              >better HE capacity,
              Does it make up for the greater number of shells a smaller caliber can spit out?
              >better range.
              Probably.
              >Why are you being an autist coping over something irrelevant.
              Nobody is coping, I didn't even say the Marder has a better gun, I asked you to give reasons and you sperged out. Now you just seem uninformed to the point where I can't tell if you just assume what you wrote or if you actually know.
              How badly did your parents fuck up with you that a neutral question has you lose your composure to such a degree?

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous
              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Calm down kraut your crying again

                >ask questions
                >cause seething
                Lmao fragile

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >gets told the 25mm is superior to 20mm
                >Can't handle it
                >Does standard autistic mental gymnastics
                >Gets told again
                >Cries
                Like clockwork

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                this is so sad

                >"x is better than y"
                >why?
                >"REEEEEEEEEEEEEEE"
                Lmao

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >All facts suggesting I am wrong are just reeeeing
                Meds.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >instant reply
                anon please

                >facts
                >brings none
                I didn't even expect any sources just some rough numbers but you couldn't provide any. I'm not German either you obsessed retards lmao
                All I said is that sometimes smaller calibers are better and asked why that's not the case here in your opinion and you sperged out.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                You're just a pedant retard who wants an argument not a honest discussion.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                I didn't want a discussion or an argument, I wasn't trying to argue for either side.
                I just asked a question and you brainlet sperged out because you were too uninformed to answer it and too proud to admit it.
                Sad, really.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >instant reply
                anon please

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Calm down kraut your crying again

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                this is so sad

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >western armies prefer 5.56. Do you understand why?
                Do you understand why that's not relevant when discussing a vehicle mounted weapon? I honestly don't understand your point. Nor do I care.

                >Are you sure?
                M242 can reach out to 3-6km, the mk20 can reach 2km on a good day. The m242 has a muzzle velocity of 1300m/s and can penetrate 30-60mm RHA, the Mk20 is about 1000m/s and can penetrate about 14mm. The Bradley can fire on the move, the Marder can't. The Bradley has better optics and ATGM. Finally the Bradley is combat proven in one of the largest wars of the last 40 years, and I struggle to recall any recent action the Marder's been involved in. That last point is quite important because as we learned from the Puma fiasco, German reliability can be very questionable.

                The only real advantage that the Mk20 has is its high rate of fire. Which is really of minimal importance in an IFV and can actually be detrimental, and the Bradley has a coaxial anyway.

                Also you are coping, let's drop the facade that you were ever interested in an objective discussion of the topic instead of trying to pretend that you remotely know what you're talking about.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Preach brother

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Do you understand why that's not relevant when discussing a vehicle mounted weapon? I honestly don't understand your point. Nor do I care.
                >Logistics and ammo capacity don't matter
                Lel
                Should I keep reading? I'll take your word for it if you tell me you weren't just pretending to be retarded there.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Puma fiasco
                Fake news. 2 vehicles had serious issues, the rest were fine. Combat ready is a pretty high standard in Germany. A flickering light means a vehicle doesn't meet the requirements.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >flickering light means a vehicle doesn't meet the requirements.
                Unsubstantiated cope

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Your military cannot train with more than 5 Pumas at a single time, neither marders or Leopards. I've seen it for myself at Sennelager, a small 40 warrior training operation had the local german garrison in awe of how much equipment we had. I felt bad for them, especially given we had another 200 sat in the depot amongst about a thousand other working armoured vehicles.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                you know that they still use 7.62, right? in fact they use it on vehicles.

                including on the MARDER THAT YOU ARE SHILLING FOR.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                The point was that the nature of the application affects the optimal choice of caliber you brainlet.
                And I didn't shill for the marder I asked a retard a question and he sperged out do I bullied him.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                I think you might be the retard, anon.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            The m242 and Integrated TOW of course. Stabilized gun vs non-stabilized.

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              I am pretty sure the Milan ADT is sufficient to destroy every vehicle in the russian army’s inventory, anon.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                The TOW is better by every metric. Especially 2B

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                More overkill =/= better.

                Also, Milan can be dismounted and used effectively as an infantry launcher, while Bradley's TOW tubes cannot, and dismounted TOW launchers aren't really useable in a mobile role either.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Bradleys have dedicated storage for Javelins so you can ATGM while your dismounts ATGM. Moot point. All this is totally dependent on which Milans and which TOWs they're getting.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                The TOW on Bradley is stuck on the side of the vehicle and is extremely risky to reload in combat. There's two of them but there's been failure to launch issues in the past.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                You have to reload the Milan beeing exposed too. And, by the way, TOWs can be stored in the launcher while driving around, Milans can not. They have to be placed in the launch position while stationary when you intend to fire, because otherwise the vibrations may damage the missile.

                Sauce for that:

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                You're not nearly as exposed as you are on Bradley though. You just pop out the hatch, (which opens forward to provide cover) and reload it. Somebody actually has to get out and climb on the Bradley to reload the TOW, it's really only something you'd do out of combat.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                No u

                https://www.quora.com/How-does-the-crew-of-a-Bradley-reload-the-TOW-missiles

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >And, by the way, TOWs can be stored in the launcher while driving around, Milans can not.

                Outright false. Also a claim that makes less than zero sense because any vibrations the missile will be subject to on the turret it will also be subject to while sitting in the hull. Literally everyone has been driving around with a missile at the ready in every exercise the Marder was ever in over the last 50+ years, and I've never heard of any problems with doing so.

                >Milan is better than the TOW by every metric.
                Does Milan have a top-attack mode?
                If it doesn't it is not better.

                Top-attack is not necessary to kill anything either missile will be facing in Ukraine. Both can kill essentially any target they'll come across. One being more overkill than the other is not a real advantage.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                The TOWs longer range is a distinct advantage. Did you forget Ukraine has vast open spaces.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Having 2 TOWs integrated into the FCS at the ready with a longer range is better than 1 at the ready with shorter range. You can’t refute this advantage.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                I was just refering to a video stating so, but I have never actually been part of a unit using Marders so I wouldnt know. That said I rarely see them mounted at all, but that may just be case of "If you do not intend to use it today, why bother mounting it".

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                You can't fire the MILAN from inside the vehicle though.

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              Marder has integrated Milan. It has to be manually loaded each time it's fired, but it can be loaded from the top hatches whereas Bradley needs someone to get out the back hatch and totally expose himself if he ever wants to reload the TOW. I still agree the Bradley has the edge but Marder isn't that bad in the missile department. Also ukes are probably more familiar with Milan as they've been using it quite a bit in tripod format.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                The Milan on Marder is actually a straight-up infantry launcher, tripod and all. The turret just has a specific mount for it. It can be freely dismounted and used by the infantry squad riding with the vehicle, which opens up some nice tactical opportunities you wouldn't have with a fixed ATGM launcher on your IFV.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >It has to be manually loaded each time it's fired, but it can be loaded from the top hatches whereas Bradley needs someone to get out the back hatch and totally expose himself if he ever wants to reload the TOW.
                Okay moron.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous
      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >Will the Bradleys they send have thermals too?
        All Bradleys have thermals. Just depends whether they're the ISU Gen 1 thermals like the original M2A2, or the IBAS Gen 2 thermals like the M2A2 ODS-SA and M2A3
        AFAIK, almost all US Bradleys in inventory are A2SA or A3 standard now, so those given to Ukraine will most likely have Gen 2 thermals

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >Better cannon
      The marder can kill everything Russian except the front armor of their MBTs. The stabilizer is probably a bigger issue than the cannon itself, the cannon seems very well minmaxed.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        OK, but the Bradley has a better cannon it's not a debate its a fact.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Any cannon is a series of compromises, anon. So of course it's a debate.
          If a cannon can kill all targets another cannon can stuff like ammo economy, weight, range, precision, rate of fire and so are important to look at.
          Even if the former is not the case it's still important. That's why tanks don't have 155mm guns.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            There is armor that 25mm DU will pen but 20mm won’t

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              Obviously, but which Russian targets in Ukraine does that apply to?

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Side profile of the t72 jumps out. T-62 or t-55. Terminators if they ever show face.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Shouldn't they be able to oen t62s?
                Not sure about T72s.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                All of them. 25mm will perform better aganst all targets at any given range.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >25mm will kill russian AFVs twice over where 20mm will only kill them once.

                What a great "advantage".

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                No you're retarded. Anything that Marder can kill, Bradley can kill with the same level of precision and lethality from further away.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                And ~95% of what Bradley can kill in Ukraine, Marder can kill just as effectively. While being cheaper to run and carrying more ammo. Seems rather like a wash to me.

                Bradleys have dedicated storage for Javelins so you can ATGM while your dismounts ATGM. Moot point. All this is totally dependent on which Milans and which TOWs they're getting.

                >storage for a whole other launcher

                Can do the same on Marder. on top of the dismountable Milan. So still a distinct and meaningful advantage for the Marder.

                >dependent on which Milans and TOWs

                Not really. All Milan types can be dismounted and used in a mobile infantry role. No TOW model can.

                So what about this French AMX-10RC or whatever the fuck it's called, what can that do? All I know is it has a 105mm gun but no stabilisation.

                Go fast, shrug off artillery fragment and mulch things with a gig ole 105mm that will fuck up anything other than a T-90's front armor.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >So still a distinct and meaningful advantage for the Marder.
                Nope. No reason to pop off an IFVs ATGM. The dismounts have superior javelins.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                That's a lot of cope. Effective penetration at longer ranges is objectively just better. More HE filler is just better. Having dedicated space for extra dismounted ATGMs on top of those packed by the dismounts and more mounted ATGMs to boot is probably much better than being able to dismount the mounted ATGM.

                It's just an irrelevent quirk of having an inferior ATGM launcher on the vehicle.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >muh cope

                Sorry, lad, but undisputable facts are not cope, no matter how much they offend your sensibilities.

                More penetration is meaningless when less penetration gets the job done as well at any realistic combat distances.

                More ammo = more HE filler to put on target. Not to mention that 25mm carries barely any more to begin with even individually.

                Being able to dismount the ATGM on top of having dedicated space for extra dismounted anti-tank weapons objectively beats not having the first part of that equation.

                Trying to dismiss a major, undneiable advantage as an "irrelevant quirk" only goes to prove that you are either arguing in blatant bad faith, are utterly ignorant in regards to the topic or both of these, In either case, it is clear that you are incapable of engaging in a hones,t fact-based discussion and your opinion is to be discarded as meaningless. Good day, sir.

                >gets told the 25mm is superior to 20mm
                >Can't handle it
                >Does standard autistic mental gymnastics
                >Gets told again
                >Cries
                Like clockwork

                >gets told that overkill is not actually an advantage
                >can't handle it
                >engages standard bad faith debating
                >gets called out
                >starts projecting his behaviour upon those calling him out

                Completely predictable, and no less pathetic for it.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Trying to dismiss a major, undneiable advantage as an "irrelevant quirk"
                The longer range and more ATGMs carried is something you keep dismissing. It’s much more important than being able to pop off the vehicles ATGM.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                The difference between 20 and 25 isn’t just overkill. The max effective range of 20mm is 2,000m compared to the 25mms 3,000 meters. That’s a huge advantage for the 25mm in a flat country like Ukraine

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                and crickets in response lol

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                I assume his response would have been
                >what's the max engagement distance 99% of the time in ukraine?
                Since he posted that before in regards to missiles.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Penetration of armor is binary. You either get in or you don't and if you do you want whatever puts the most lead and shrapnel in the shortest amount if time in whoever's inside.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >And so on
            Fif((you))

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Better for what? I'm not shitting on the Bradley, I just don't see what targets it can nail that the 20mm on the Marder can't.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            a t72?

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              Side armor in both cases.

              >The 20mm. was the perfect choice.
              youre such a braindead jingoist because not even the bundeswehr believes this since the puma and lynx are 30mm.

              Nit him but
              >was
              It's been like 50 years, newer IFVs consider future threats.
              Luckily Russia uses 50 year old equipment.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Better range, better penetration, better HE capacity.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Pretty sure that the protection of a BMP against penetrator rounds from a 20mm cannon is factual, while that against a 25mm is very much theoretical, and if they give the Bradley its APFSDS rounds it just isn't there.

            TL;DR The Marder uses a cannon for which the BMP was almost explicitly designed to defend (They used 23mm as a metric but same difference), while the Bradley uses a cannon specifically picked to shit on the BMP.

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              >BMP
              Depends on the version but the marder should pen the side armor of all of them and likely the front armor of most if not all.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Nah, even the BMP1 sports frontal arc protection against 23mm. Though follow up shots on the same region will go through, the 25mm should just pummel straight through the glacis on the first try, especially the dart munition, and should do so reliably on most variants.

                Again, 20mm autocannon fire is the very thing the BMP was specifically armored to counter, which is why the US scrapped the idea of putting a 20mm on the Bradley to begin with.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >"25mm is a better round."
                >"Oh yeah?1?1?!?! Name one vehicle that 25mm can penetrate that 20mm can't!"
                >"here, it's the most primative and least capable IFV that the Russians use."
                B
                T
                F
                O

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                I'm not sure that accounts for the penetrators since they punch way above their weight.

                >"25mm is a better round."
                >"Oh yeah?1?1?!?! Name one vehicle that 25mm can penetrate that 20mm can't!"
                >"here, it's the most primative and least capable IFV that the Russians use."
                B
                T
                F
                O

                Do you often make up interactions that haven't happened?
                Also
                >primative
                Kek

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            the bradley rounds are razor sharp depleted uranium sabots. they can literally be used to stab a man

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Marders always accompany Leopard 2s, no need for extra firepower.
      The 20mm. was the perfect choice. Fuck up infantry in light cover from far away for a longer time than the Bradley.
      If the Ukranians have half a brain they integrate the IFVs they got into their tank battalions.

      Milan is better than the TOW by every metric.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        The extended range Milan only has a 3000m range. Modern TOW are atleast 4km. Plus they have top attack warheads.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >top attack
          Both will pen any russian armored vehicle at any angle.
          >range
          I am pretty sure that the range of both missles is sufficient, anon.

          It does not matter, both missles kill everything the Russians have at sufficient range. Marder can fire missles without exposing the vehicle while Bradley has two missles at the ready.
          Marder has slightly better armor and mobility while Bradley has a slightly better gun.
          Both are designed to fit slightly different doctrine. As long as you use the vehicle as intended, it will do its job. That’s why the nations that deliver the vehicles train the soldiers fielding them.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >I am pretty sure that the range of both missles is sufficient
            The TOW has a longer range so that’s a tangible advantage.

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              My man. What is the 95% CI for ATGM engagements in Ukraine? Do you have any other source for missle ranges than Wikipedia?
              I am pretty sure both missles have sufficient range.

              Having 2 TOWs integrated into the FCS at the ready with a longer range is better than 1 at the ready with shorter range. You can’t refute this advantage.

              One of the nice things about the Marder is that all you need to do is modify the mounting device and you can put any ATGM on the vehicle. Which you then can fire without exposing anything but the launcher. If the garden gnomes were less scummy, there would be MELLS mounted to the Marder.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Wikipedias numbers are accurate. The TOW has a longer range than the Milan.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Wikipedia isn't the source, scroll down and you'll see the citations. How about you provide a source on their ranges being the same.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >Milan is better than the TOW by every metric.
        Does Milan have a top-attack mode?
        If it doesn't it is not better.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Is top attack required to stack vatnigs?
          Last time I checked a Panzerfaust III removed half of the structure of their best tanks through the front armor.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        The bradley has 2 longer ranges atgms on tap. The marder has 1 shorter ranges ATGM

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >Marders always accompany Leopard 2s, no need for extra firepower.
        All I'm reading here is that we also should get our fingers out of our asses and finally send some Leo2s as well.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          I'm still torn between letting the Russians make some gains first and sending some ASAP.
          The easterlings have proven that they'll void of gratitude either way, most of them still believe Germany has only sent a couple helmets to this day and Russkis have been flip flopping a losing faith a bit lately. An early cease-fire would lead to both a lack of war kino involving western tanks and cause less dead vatnigs and ,more importantly, more surviving equipment.
          I'd rather solve the russian question for the next 30 years now but that requires some more grinding.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >The 20mm. was the perfect choice.
        youre such a braindead jingoist because not even the bundeswehr believes this since the puma and lynx are 30mm.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >While it used to include a few unique features, such as a fully remote machine gun on the rear deck and gun ports on the sides for infantry to fire through, these features have been deleted or streamlined in later upgrade packages to bring it more in line with modern IFV design.

      It's exactly like every other German POS in that on paper it's fucking invincible and contains actual Germanwunderwaffe features that strongly benefit the Mittlestrand which also make you completely dependent on air superiority in Essen, Germany, at all times as your security from the wolves.

      Yikes.

      Japanese are no better at electronics and neither are Asians in general. They turned every exponential curve in electronics into a logarithmic line of stasis, which was exactly the strategy when we spun off the electronics industry to those clowns in the late 70s and 80s, which they did by violating the Oligopoloy Agreement type contract against price dumping in their own market to lower prices for decent goods in USA. That's how every Toyota and Honda started who all have worse deaths/mile than any Pinto of concurrent vintage.

      Cheap, shoddy products produced by Chinese but now that production is moving to Vietnam, which is small and can't relay on endless pools of literally awesome chink industrial workers who ching-chong their way into perfect iPhones every single time.

      Instead awesome jungle asians are going to give up big daddy Communism in better fashion by using long-term, higher-paid, more dignified workers and Vietnam will be the long-term Asian powerhouse and she will lean on her neighbors with every Western device of innovation and they will be destroyed.

      I dont' even want an Asian wife of any type just saying, the Vietnamese are going to break the East Asia old man zaibatsu/Xi gay game for good. USA helped them by withdrawing from Vietnam and they kept their spears and shit. Best deal any human ever makes USA makes always. until then it's bombs.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >Yikes
        >redditspacing
        Tourists are such weird people.

  2. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    They are both just cold war battle busses that will absolutly shit on anything Russia has.

    Marders cant fire on the move accuratly, but I dont know if early Brads could do that either.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      they could indeed. bradleys utterly shat on the t72's at 73 eastings, they actually killed more t72's than the abrams did.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        To be fair they were being used in recon so they contacted first.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      yeah,Im honestly excited for the webms.Im not familiar with the mud season thing so but I can wait.I dont think we will see lot of vehicle on vehicle action but more of a mobik meat grinder.

  3. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >Non stabilized cannon

  4. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    In order to compare them in any resonably way, do we know what variant of Brads will be sent? The Marders will no doubth be 1A3 verisions.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      https://insidedefense.com/insider/dod-sending-50-bradley-vehicles-ukraine-part-3b-aid-package
      Looks like M2A2s

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Thank you! Indeed a capable variant. Armor wise they would be similar to Marder 1A3s (Both orotected against Russian 30mm AP in the frontal arc). Both carry the same ammount of dismounts. Ground pressure is lower for the Marder, so mobility in bad weather might be better for it in that regard, but power to weight ratio is slightly better for the Brad. Armament wise the Brad 2A2 absolutly shits all over the Marder tho, and that mainly comes down to the better FCS allowing it to fire on the move, better visibility for the commander and ability to launch ATGMs without exposing yourself.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >M2A2 has dedicated Javelin stowage.
          Oh they're gonna enjoy that.

  5. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Why are you people even arguing about this? I for one am just happy that the west is coming together to kill russians.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Some people are unable to have social interactions online that aren't antagonistic and feel attacked immediately.
      It's really pathetic.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >the west is coming together to kill russians
      >no effective long range precise weapons
      >50 different types of artillery and IFVs 20 pieces from each
      Why is senile Joe such a week pussy?

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Because you know what the training and delivery schedule is and there are definitely no more IFVs coming in the foreseeable future?

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        The west is giving garden gnometin so many offramps but sunk cost fallacy makes him ignore them.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Because it's fun talking about what weapon will fuck up the vatniks more.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Wish we could do a sweepstake

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      This
      If by "better" people mean more advanced, then of course the Bradley is better, its more modern because the Puma was messed up, but who cares, both are extremely capable and proven vehicles, superior to the russian ones, that Ukraine has asked for.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >the you'll never ride on top of the NATOmorph
      i can't take it, brehs

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >Norman Osborn
      >Joe Biden
      >Churchill

  6. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    There's way more bradleys in reserve than marders.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      There was 2000+ Marders produced. Too bad the Germans recycled most of them thinking war in Europe could never happen again.

  7. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Probably because it's yank gear instead of german gear, on top being newer, so it's sexier overall and causes more vatnik butthurt. Bradleys are a bit better than Marders overall (to be expected giventhe plattform is like 15 years newer), but IMO both should be able to do good work.

  8. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    So what about this French AMX-10RC or whatever the fuck it's called, what can that do? All I know is it has a 105mm gun but no stabilisation.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      french 105mm is not NATO compatible, it's a medium pressure canon. no logistics, no repair hubs, untrained personnel, no mechanics to repair it. rare ammo.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Yeah, sure. The French have totally not trained the first battalion batch of Ukrainians to operate those vehicles and no support staff to go along with them.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Ukraine is getting nearly the latest AMX-10 RCR model, minus the Mali IED kit. Compared to the baseline AMX-10R which was quite basic late 80s NATO stuff, it's been digitised with a battlefield network, maps, adjustable hydraulics, and countermeasures including infrared jammers and grenades.

      >no stabilisation
      it's stabilised.

      And ~95% of what Bradley can kill in Ukraine, Marder can kill just as effectively. While being cheaper to run and carrying more ammo. Seems rather like a wash to me.

      [...]
      >storage for a whole other launcher

      Can do the same on Marder. on top of the dismountable Milan. So still a distinct and meaningful advantage for the Marder.

      >dependent on which Milans and TOWs

      Not really. All Milan types can be dismounted and used in a mobile infantry role. No TOW model can.

      [...]
      Go fast, shrug off artillery fragment and mulch things with a gig ole 105mm that will fuck up anything other than a T-90's front armor.

      >a wash
      >a distinct and meaningful advantage
      smells like contradictory cope

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        AMX 10RCR is not stabilised. it never recieved stabilisation

  9. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    In an ATGM dual between Bradley and marder the Bradley could kill the marder from further away. In a cannon dual the Bradley could pen the marder from further away.

  10. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    It's going to be one of those moments, with the Ukraine explicitly stated how superior German material is isn't it?

  11. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    On models since version 1A1A, a MILAN anti-tank guided missile launcher can be attached to the turret to provide enhanced anti-armour capabilities. Typically, four missiles are carried inside the vehicle.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >Almost half the total stored ammo
      >Half the ready amm
      >2/3rds the range
      >Just as good.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >almost half the total ammo

        And then more than the Bradleys ammo once you start using the extra space inside.

        >half the ready amm

        10+ is half of 2 now? Every single missile in the Marder is effectively ready amm given how rapidly the launcher can be reloaded under combat conditions.

        >2/3rds the range

        Meaningless, given that that's still more range than some ~99.9% of all combat engagements either vehicle will see in Ukraine. Yet again an on-paper "advantage" that turns out to be worthless overkill.

  12. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    The 25mm is just superior to 20mm. Atleast 25 has DU rounds that can compete with 30mm while still carrying more ammo than 30mm. There aren’t any 20mm rounds that can compete with 25mm.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Who asked?

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        We are directly comparing the Bradley and marder

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Who?

  13. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Your German shitcan is gay, useful but gay. Get over it.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >postercount didn't rise
      Triggered

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Your autism is way beyond regular sperg range. Well done.

  14. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Why are Germans the most autistic mental gymnasts when upset about something? It's like this in every thread.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      They are lashing out since this war has proven their government is a joke, their military is pathetic, and their equipment is beyond mediocre. It is pretty blatant and hilarious.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        I think that speaks for the entirety of the EU

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Britain has probably come off the worst. Germany has definitely stepped it up

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Britain has done a lot better than Germany for most of the war. Though after Patriot batteries and the AFVs they gotta try harder to stay relevant.

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              German SPGs, patriots, gephards, and marders trump anything the UK has sent.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Patriots and marders would fall under my previous statement. Brits got work to do to stay relevant to the last few weeks.

                But Gepards have been basically nowhere for most of the war and lots of people have sent lots of atillery. Starstreak bad memes aside the UK gets a pass over the Germans for being there on day one while Germany still had it's nose up Putin's ass.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >14 (lol) pzh2k vs 40 m109
                >3 ancient Mars3 vs 9 M270b1
                >30 Gepards almost a year after the invasion began
                >Marders that haven't turned up vs 200 armoured vehicles including 80 cvrt fv103 stormer aa scimitar

                That's just the start let's not get it twisted here, Britain sent the most important shit straight away while Germany was shitting itself in the corner next to a rusty leopard missing its gun.

                Also how many RC135s have you got in the air over Ukraine right now?

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >>3 ancient Mars3 vs 9 M270b1
                Wrong numbers plus it's the sane machine for all intends and purposes.
                Also pic related.
                You seem very low on accurate information and left out a lot. Are you uninformed or lying out of butthurt because of a lack of guns in your life?

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Bbbbbut it's the same
                No the B1 has better armour and better protected against mines.
                >wrong numbers
                Yeh they have upped it to a huge 5 vs 9. Plus a huge stock pile of ammunition which Germany simply doesn't have.
                >also pic related
                Ah the EU inflated meme to make Germany look good with things that haven't happened yet, why doesn't it include Britain's commitment to donate the same amount next year already provided? Strange...
                anyway look how much more military aid the UK has provided lol

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >No the B1 has better armour and better protected against mines.
                Which hasn't mattered at all after months of warfare meaning effectively they're just heavier.
                >Yeh they have upped it to a huge 5 vs 9. Plus a huge stock pile of ammunition which Germany simply doesn't have.
                5 to 9 is okay considering all the other stuff sent.
                Germany did actually send a lot of ammo though, not just tens of millions of other rounds but also missiles.
                >Ah the EU inflated meme to make Germany look good with things that haven't happened yet, why doesn't it include Britain's commitment to donate the same amount next year already provided? Strange...
                Probably because you're seething, coping and misunderstanding?
                >anyway look how much more military aid the UK has provided lol
                Okay? Financial aid is as necessary as military aid. You also seem to believe this is a competition.
                Both Germany and the UK sent respectable amounts of weaponry and aid and will continue to do so. Not really sure why you're trying to pretend otherwise.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >It's better but it doesn't matter!!!
                Oh my god your the same fucking idiot that thinks the better Bradley 25mm cannon isn't better than the Marders 20mm pea shooter because it just isn't OK!
                >Germany sent alot of ammo
                No way near the amount the UK sent, M31A1s on tap pretty much in three shipments. The UK has a much larger stock of weapon munitions than Germany.
                >EU inflated chart
                Look it's simple, it includes things like loans they to pay back and money that is allocated to them later this year. The UK has said it would match what it's already given this coming year but you don't see that on the graph?
                Also go to Kiels website, click the map select each country specifically for an up to date total. The UK is way infront without factoring in the imaginary figures from the EU "Loans"
                >Financial aid is military aid
                Nah, those loans have specific requirements on what they can be spent on.

                And let's not forget most importantly TIMING. Germany did basically nothing when Ukraine needed help Britain was there immediately even before the invasion don't for one second think because Germany has stuck it's hand reluctantly in its pocket so late on its anything like equal.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Oh my god your the same fucking idiot that thinks the better Bradley 25mm cannon isn't better than the Marders 20mm pea shooter because it just isn't OK!
                I'm not the other guy, but we know for a fact the armor has not made a difference.
                >No way near the amount the UK sent, M31A1s on tap pretty much in three shipments. The UK has a much larger stock of weapon munitions than Germany.
                No idea how it is in comparison. Currently both countries are low on ammo but before the war Germany had rather large cold war stock piles.
                I wasn't kidding about the tens of millions of rounds Germany sent.
                >Look it's simple
                I don't think you're talking about these things in good faith. Loans are a part of financial aid, so is deferred payment for military aid, but it's still aid. And despite what you pretend it's just a part of it, not all, by far.
                >Nah, those loans have specific requirements on what they can be spent on
                Some do, most of them have requirements meant for the war, but not all aid by far consists of loans.
                >And let's not forget most importantly TIMING
                The first shipment announcements of Britain, France and Germany all happened within 48 hours.
                You sound like you base your information mostly on memes and twitter. Look up the actual lists.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >I'm not the other guy, but we know for a fact the armor has not made a difference.
                Actually you could argue that the british vehicles are worse since obviously their way to avoid damage has been speed and maneuverability. And armor is heavy.
                But the argument would be equally retarded since it's unlikely the increased fuel consumption and less speed made much of a noticable difference.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >25mm
                It's better that's end of the argument really, just like the B1 is better than the Mars2. Nothing else to say on the matter.
                >Ammunition sent
                Actually Germany only sent 18,000 155mm and an unstated amount of MLRS rounds and smart 155mm.
                UK sent 60,000 155mm, 50,000 152mm and continues to supply M31a1 at scale meaning there isn't just one shipment like the German one. You can look this up on the aid wiki. The UK has a huge stockpile of ammunition that is in date, this is down to the constant use of it and ever refreshing stocks used in Iraq/Afgan.
                >Loans
                OK for example the loan to buy 100 Pzh2k and 18 Boxer with arty turret, what's the point of that? None of them will be delivered before the war is over. The loans have to be paid back so shouldn't be down as donated aid.
                It's simple in its true form, the UK donates or sources things to give immediately, Germany includes things that haven't been given or things that will be available in 5 years time. The two aren't comparable it's just EU/Germany upset the UK made it look foolish so early on.
                >The first aid shipments within 48 hours
                Stop right there.
                >The UK was the first country in Europe to send military aid to Ukraine, sending thousands of NLAW anti-tank missiles early in 2022.
                We had thousands of NLAWs in Ukraine for January 17th so cut the shit Germany and France were still in Putins pocket at that time. Post your lists right now Germany lacked for months only sending mouldy iglas and 20k helmets.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                > just like the B1 is better than the Mars2.
                They do the same thing. Armor hasn't come into play.
                >Actually Germany only sent 18,000 155mm and an unstated amount of MLRS rounds and smart 155mm.
                Look a bit harder, you forgot quite a lot and I don't understand why. The 100k hand grenades aside, you literally missed millions of rounds in different calibers.
                Tens of millions. Frankly, you seem more focused more of masturbating in front of strangers than the truth.
                >OK for example the loan to buy 100 Pzh2k and 18 Boxer with arty turret, what's the point of that? None of them will be delivered before the war is over. The loans have to be paid back so shouldn't be down as donated aid.
                Yes, that is an example, ni it's neither exhaustive nor representative.
                >It's simple in its true form, the UK donates or sources things to give immediately, Germany includes things that haven't been given or things that will be available in 5 years time.
                Nah, UK's long term commitments are in there too.
                >>The UK was the first
                Read what I wrote again.
                >We had thousands of NLAWs in Ukraine for January 17th so cut the shit Germany and France were still in Putins pocket at that time.
                Stop getting your news from visegrad24
                >Post your lists right now Germany lacked for months only sending mouldy iglas and 20k helmets.
                Kek, it's on wikipedia and would require 4 different posts to get them all. It's also too long to be legible.
                You can look it up yourself.
                Or you can keep seething for no reason.
                I genuinely don't understand why you're so butthurt and delusional. You're desperately clinging to a narrative you don't even gain anything from.
                It's weird.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >They do the same
                One is better than the other you idiot
                >Armour doesn't come into play
                >drives over land mine
                >gets counter artyd
                Are you being retarded on purpose?
                >millions of small arms rounds and grenades
                We are talking about artillery here anon if you would stop coping you would see I left out the UKs donated small arms munitions.
                >UKs long term commitments are in there too
                Nope, like I said go on the Kiel map to see total donations to date.
                >UK 7.082bn € (Rank: 2) Military 4.129bn € (Rank: 2)
                >5.445bn € (Rank: 3) Military 2.345bn € (Rank: 3)
                If your chart included the UKs 2023 comitment it would be it's current donations x2. Meaning it would be around €14bn on the graph. So no it isn't included there, its just cope for the other gay nations like France Spain and Italy.
                >UK sends NLAWs before invasion
                Are you denying this? Dozens of flights from C17s dropped them there.
                >On Saturday, Berlin finally bowed to that pressure, and to the reality that Russia is encircling Ukrainian cities and threatening to topple the government in Kyiv.
                Germany shit itself and reluctsntly send 1000 Pz3s and 500 Stingers. Its not until recently its pulled its weight. I'm not saying it isn't doing OK now, but you have to admit it was a joke before.
                >Muh list
                Yeh check it its full of cope and 'too be delivered' and **bought by ukraine. Pathetic really.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >One is better than the other you idiot
                The only upgrade you mentioned was armor, which makes it heavier, slower and more expensive.
                But due to their vast range they all remain untouched anyway.
                >drives over landmine apparently that never happened in the entire war to any MARS based system.
                >Are you being retarded on purpose?
                Rest of the post is tldnr, you're clearly not in the right mindset to have a productive conversation.

                Thanks for your concession, Germany doesn't train in large battle groups because it has no ready armour and your availability is less than Egypt.
                I tried to find an image and couldn't, just some Marders ready for scrap with no cannon lmao

                >Thanks for your concession
                None was made. You seem to have trouble with basic logic.
                Man, I hope this is the same guy and not 2 separate constantly butthurt bongs.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Can you post an image of a large scale German training exercise or not you autistic sperg

                Seems to mostly be garden gnomes, bongs and poles seething.
                Used to just be bongs and garden gnomes. Who knew the main reason for brexit would become their staunchest ally in autistic internet spergouts. Armatard really buckbroke them with the ajax threads and they've never forgiven Germany for random people spamming
                >should've bought German
                In those threads.
                I wonder if armatard is proud of himself.

                [...]
                Here's an update
                https://augengeradeaus.net/2023/01/trotz-puma-debakels-hi-tech-schuetzenpanzer-soll-eine-zukunft-in-der-bundeswehr-haben/
                Tldnr
                >pumas will continue to serve
                >17 of 18 are completely fixed already (not that hard since it wa shit like a single loose screw (literally) in all but two)
                >reliability upgrades are planned anyway, but meeting with industry heads soon
                I'd still prefer the lynx but since we have 350 pumas we might as well use them.

                Same goes for you could you please post a large scale deployment
                >18 Pumas broke
                >b-but they are fixed now
                oook, but 18 on an exercise is fucking tiny lmao what's wrong with the rest of them needing to be upgraded to s1?
                All this wunderwaggle and this is your big finale, proof 18 vehicles work?

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                You don't seem like a pleasant or honest person.
                Case in point
                >>18 Pumas broke
                A single loose screw causing a bit of rattling on a container doesn't break a vehicle.
                Though I guess I understand the british trauma about rattling IFVs after the ajax.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                It's not a case of being unpleasant it's just a reality check for upity Germans getting abit excited.
                The point was 18 is tiny to exercise with and their isn't a single image of a large German training exercise which leads me to belive the reports are true and you don't have many working vehicles otherwise you would train with them like we do.
                Ajax is shit.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                If you look at the NATO deployments each nation has a country its responsible for.
                For example Germany has Lithuania, deployed to Lithuania they only managed;
                >30 Marder IFV (Pumas didn't make it)
                >6 Leopard 2
                >6 Leopard 2 recovery
                That's it. Later 3500 soldiers were supposed to bolster this force but they back tracked and kept them in Germany instead.

                The UK in comparison seen as that's what is being discussed here has Estonia to look after. The UK deployed;
                >4 Apaches
                >4 Wildcat
                >4 Chinook
                >12 AS90
                >6 M270
                >26 Challenger 2
                >50 Warrior
                >50 Scimitar
                >10 Stormer hvm
                >A hundred or so Utility and support vehicles
                In total other British Nato commitments total
                >72 Challenger 2
                >120 Warriors
                >8000 troops
                How is it possible an island nation can deploy so much kit from its German bases but Germany itself cannot even manage to do 5% of that? France too...

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Nobody asked.

                It's not a case of being unpleasant it's just a reality check for upity Germans getting abit excited.
                The point was 18 is tiny to exercise with and their isn't a single image of a large German training exercise which leads me to belive the reports are true and you don't have many working vehicles otherwise you would train with them like we do.
                Ajax is shit.

                Nah, you're actively butthurt and lying and you've posted this nonsense plenty of times and were proven wrong. You ignore it and ignore the pictures you ask for and just repeat it in another thread.
                You've been doing this for quite a while so I don't think the truth is any part of your motivation.
                You're just a bad person.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Don't like the truth, not my problem.
                Post an image for everyone to see.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >lie
                >make demands in bad faith
                >think you'll go to heaven
                Anon, your soul will burn, not mine.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Germany does have big training operations!
                >Show them
                >n-no?
                Pathetic, picrel occupying force me looking at you

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Anon, if you'd put more effort into the defence of your own country maybe over 1 million young children wouldn't have been groomed, tortured and forcefully prostituted by paki rape gangs. Don't talk about getting uppity while you chose go be led by a foreigner after your entire country found out that your leftists spent 3 decades nation wide actively protecting pakistanis who preyed on your children and years later still nothing has been done about it, none of the politicians were thrown in jail and executed and nobody as far as anybody can tell it's likely still ongoing.
                Scholz is a bald manlet with commie sympathies and yet he somehow manages to be better than the average mid-level british politician.
                Get the fuck back in your lane and fix your own country before you try to dictate the behavior of anybody else.

                Are you pretending to be retarded? Germany and the political sentiment there is completely different to the UK for multiple reasons involving a stronger anti-german socialist front which formed due to ongoing manipulation an "de-Nazification" after losing world war 1. As well as heavy demilitarization. The US specifically has been doing everything in their power to keep Germany as defenceless and in discord as possible while retaining a strong military presence. Years of sabotage, literal brainwashing psyops and political meddling are responsible for an underfunded, incompetent and nepotism dominated military culture.

                The BW is not structured and the population not willing to support the same niche as the UK or France does. Pretending Germany should just suddenly live up to that out of nothing is dangerously low IQ. The reformation of the German army will take decades, billions and billions of euros and help from the outside.

                Don't bother trying to be reasonable, he isn't.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                One picture, Dennis.
                Just a single fucking picture.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >you've posted this nonsense plenty of times and were proven wrong.
                Every time I've seen it happen, it ends with someone asking that you post 1 picture in support of your assertions but you never do. Not once.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Are you pretending to be retarded? Germany and the political sentiment there is completely different to the UK for multiple reasons involving a stronger anti-german socialist front which formed due to ongoing manipulation an "de-Nazification" after losing world war 1. As well as heavy demilitarization. The US specifically has been doing everything in their power to keep Germany as defenceless and in discord as possible while retaining a strong military presence. Years of sabotage, literal brainwashing psyops and political meddling are responsible for an underfunded, incompetent and nepotism dominated military culture.

                The BW is not structured and the population not willing to support the same niche as the UK or France does. Pretending Germany should just suddenly live up to that out of nothing is dangerously low IQ. The reformation of the German army will take decades, billions and billions of euros and help from the outside.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >world war 1
                meant world war 2, in case you're gonna be a retard and focus on that typo

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Anon, if you'd put more effort into the defence of your own country maybe over 1 million young children wouldn't have been groomed, tortured and forcefully prostituted by paki rape gangs. Don't talk about getting uppity while you chose go be led by a foreigner after your entire country found out that your leftists spent 3 decades nation wide actively protecting pakistanis who preyed on your children and years later still nothing has been done about it, none of the politicians were thrown in jail and executed and nobody as far as anybody can tell it's likely still ongoing.
                Scholz is a bald manlet with commie sympathies and yet he somehow manages to be better than the average mid-level british politician.
                Get the fuck back in your lane and fix your own country before you try to dictate the behavior of anybody else.
                [...]
                Don't bother trying to be reasonable, he isn't.

                >The final stage
                Acceptance.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                I don't see a reason to ignore the reality. It's sad but delusions will not fix your problems - instead you will end up like Russia. Humiliated, over your head and close to a total collapse.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Worse, you'll end up like Britain with roving rape gangs.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Gets bullied about the topic at hand
                >Spergs like a 4chantard
                K?

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >anon makes up shit
                >gets BTFO with reality
                Heh
                What are you gonna do about it, bongoloid? Buy a 22 bolt action rifle to maybe use after sucking off your local representative of the crown?

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >German crying again
                Yeah

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >unimaginative spam response after getting destroyed
                I accept your surrender, curryboi.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                He's a Serbian named Dennis who likes to larp as a German.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                dennis SMIROV.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Ha! You think Germany doesn't have large formations of armored vehicles hey!
                Well, check this, easily comparable to your battlegroup images.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Are you pretending to be retarded? Germany and the political sentiment there is completely different to the UK for multiple reasons involving a stronger anti-german socialist front which formed due to ongoing manipulation an "de-Nazification" after losing world war 1. As well as heavy demilitarization. The US specifically has been doing everything in their power to keep Germany as defenceless and in discord as possible while retaining a strong military presence. Years of sabotage, literal brainwashing psyops and political meddling are responsible for an underfunded, incompetent and nepotism dominated military culture.
                This has only been the case since the 90s. In the Cold War West Germany had 3000 tanks of all types

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                It did but the Ossi invasion after the Wall fell finished off West Germany which had no ideology to match the leftists from the East.

                Sad as West Germany was a pleasure to defend but the West Germans of that era are elderly or dead. Perhaps their roach bulls will inject some strength into their society but the spiritual leadership of Europe moved to the nations who actually objected to Soviet rule (Poland, Baltics etc). West Germany was remarkably chill, well-kept as befits people who cared for their nation and even the commie protesters were polite.

                Wessis were creative too. There was a scheduled anti-GLCM protest at my base (Sembach, which had no GLCM) but the farmer who tilled the area by the flightline gate fucking drenched the fields in liquid and solid manure. We had to roll up our windows on the flightline side but no protestors showed up because the stench was amazing.

                It was so nice defending appreciative people vs. deconflicting homicidal ragheads who prefer decapitating each other to food, sex and oxygen.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >the spiritual leadership of Europe moved to the nations who actually objected to Soviet rule (Poland, Baltics etc)
                Nobody there is leading anything, anon.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Here's a prime example of such a degenerate PrepHole larper who compares stuff that is being in service since decades to a new weapon system that has only been put out for testing. The only vehicle you remotely could compare the Puma to is the Ajax and we all know how that would turn out.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Sorry to upset you but if you could read correctly and weren't esl, you would have noticed I asked for large armoured deployments.
                It didn't have to be Puma Marder would have sufficed. But you don't have any of those working either, sad. Feel free to prove me wrong.

                Or let's see 30 Leopard 2 on exercise you've had them for decades, should be easy right.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                I don't even get the point. Everyone knows germany is governed by anti-german degenerates since the 60's who used to money from the defense budget for everything but the military and shit their diapers as soon as upgrading the Bundeswehr is even talked about. Imagine you army being under command of a british hating degenerate for decades. Literally what's the point you're trying to make?

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Too much cringe in this thread.

                MARS, MLRS, M270 are all the same vehicle/launcher. HIMARS fires the same rockets as well but only 1 pod instead of 2.

                25mm > 20mm. I dont even know why it's questioned. The 20mm can carry more ammo is bs as well. Bradley 25mm carries 300 rds ready to fire. 225 he and 75 ap. Marder has less ready to fire i think.

                UK has not donated as much as Germany. UK was just more enthusiastic and earlier with their donations but haven't donated as much as the germans.

                No, you don't understand. The british version of the weapon non-Brits (mostly Germans) designed for brits is better because it has armor other countries did not deem necessary.
                That is clearly proven by all the less armored versions of it being destroyed. Trusted Eussian sources have posted many exploded HIMARS.

                t. John from Londonistan oblast

                Autistic German crying
                HH4RRD

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >By this chart France and Spain basically non entity's in this war along with Italy is now a major player.
                Are you fucking dumb anon
                >EU certified body makes EU nations look good
                Pathetic

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Money is money, anon. Its value does not change based on who sends it.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Lol nibba what. Britain is defacto the King of Europe militarily speaking in terms of donations and individual capabilities.
            This is some serious cope.

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              Name one major British system sent. NLAWs are ok. Starstreak didn’t end up doing much

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >M270s x9
                Sorry you cannot compete

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Didn’t Germany send MARS

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                3 MARS 1 much inferior to the UKs M270B1

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                More than 3 MARS2 and they have twice the capacity of HIMARS while being more cumbersome as a result.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                and the UK's M270B1s are the superior model to the MARS, so fuck off

                I thought those came from US stocks. The m270 is an American design but you counted it as British aid because it came from British stocks.

                and is the MARS German?

                Patriots and marders would fall under my previous statement. Brits got work to do to stay relevant to the last few weeks.

                But Gepards have been basically nowhere for most of the war and lots of people have sent lots of atillery. Starstreak bad memes aside the UK gets a pass over the Germans for being there on day one while Germany still had it's nose up Putin's ass.

                >Gepards have been basically nowhere for most of the war
                they seem to be doing well defending againt Shasneeds
                >Starstreak bad memes
                probably just cope plus confidentiality requirements by the bongs

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >probably just cope plus confidentiality requirements by the bongs
                There is no confidentiality requirement from the bongs. Post the source or continue to be disregarded

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                the cope is there though, isn't it, Dennis?

                and I do remember when Martlet was being roundly praised as the anti-drone weapon of choice... but you never liked facts

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                meds

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                you first, Dennis

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >and the UK's M270B1s are the superior model to the MARS, so fuck off
                MARS2, anon, which is a variant of the M270B1s without much of a difference. What's your point?
                >is the MARS German?
                Nit him but the MARS2 is the continental version of the M270B1. M270s were designed by Lockheed Martin, KWM, Rheinmetall and some French company while MARS2 is basically the same with an EFCS.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Which is a variant of the M270b1
                You stupid moron
                >Mars2 is akkktually continental version of B1
                When In reality
                >MARS II / LRU / MLRS-I is a European variant of the M270A1 involving Germany, France, and Italy.
                The British version has better armor Better protection from mines and is a better vehicle suited to nations that fight wars, unlike Germany.
                Sit down idiot.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >barely a difference
                >no meaningful difference
                How many MARS, HIMARS or BongMARS have been lost?
                None?
                So I guess it makes no difference, eh?

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                German MARS was scrapped on delivery due to it missing every part but the steering wheel, the rocket pack was also found to contain broom sticks painted grey with red tips.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Kek come on bro

                >flickering light means a vehicle doesn't meet the requirements.
                Unsubstantiated cope

                One of the "failures" was the heater not working because some retard forgot to turn on that ot does so automatically and didn't do it by hand.
                Another was due to some retard kicking a computer screen.

                Your military cannot train with more than 5 Pumas at a single time, neither marders or Leopards. I've seen it for myself at Sennelager, a small 40 warrior training operation had the local german garrison in awe of how much equipment we had. I felt bad for them, especially given we had another 200 sat in the depot amongst about a thousand other working armoured vehicles.

                That's not true but I'm happy you've had fun. Did you get to try out any cool gear?

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >That's not true
                OK let's not argue I will post one image and you post one with equal value and the picture with more vehicles on exercise wins.
                I did have fun but not as much as at BATUS

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Your proposed game seems to have no orobative value in regards to your claim.
                What a weird thing to come up with.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Germany has no more than 5 Pumas to train with at one time I've seen it for myself they get mogged by us bongs on there own turf
                You denied this and I asked you to post a large exercise deployment of Pumas or even Marders for that matter, but you didn't and can't because it doesn't happen.

                I missed out of CERBUS 22, Look it up its also another huge British lead exercise in Germany with 800 armoured vehicles all in use.
                You don't compare, post a big party or fuck off.
                >Ex Cerberus 22 is the British Army’s largest field exercise of 2022 with nearly 3500 troops and up to 800 vehicles involved.
                You don't even have moving targets on German ranges you rent ours lmao

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >You denied this and I asked you to post a large exercise deployment of Pumas or even Marders for that matter, but you didn't and can't because it doesn't happen.
                Anon, my willingness to google pictures for you has no impact on reality.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Thanks for your concession, Germany doesn't train in large battle groups because it has no ready armour and your availability is less than Egypt.
                I tried to find an image and couldn't, just some Marders ready for scrap with no cannon lmao

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >One of the "failures" was the heater not working because some retard forgot to turn on that ot does so automatically and didn't do it by hand.
                Another was due to some retard kicking a computer screen.
                I don’t believe you. Prove it

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >don’t believe you. Prove it
                https://augengeradeaus.net/2022/12/puma-sachstand-ganz-kaputt-oder-nur-ein-bisschen/

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >One of the "failures" was the heater not working because some retard forgot to turn on that ot does so automatically and didn't do it by hand.
                Another was due to some retard kicking a computer screen.
                I don’t believe you. Prove it

                Here's an update
                https://augengeradeaus.net/2023/01/trotz-puma-debakels-hi-tech-schuetzenpanzer-soll-eine-zukunft-in-der-bundeswehr-haben/
                Tldnr
                >pumas will continue to serve
                >17 of 18 are completely fixed already (not that hard since it wa shit like a single loose screw (literally) in all but two)
                >reliability upgrades are planned anyway, but meeting with industry heads soon
                I'd still prefer the lynx but since we have 350 pumas we might as well use them.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                NOOOOO THE BUNDESWEHR SUUUUCKS REEEEE ALL PUMAS ARE BROKEN FOREEEEVVEEEER BILLIONENGRAB AAAAAAH SAVE ME SCHOLZ

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                What is the most funniest - all these PrepHole degenerates have literally no idea how putting a new weapon system into service works. They want those failures to materialize during testing - the problem here is the number of vehicles is too small. Germany should've ordered 1000+ and we wouldn't even talk about it anymore. With only 20 for testing this will take considerably longer than is usual.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >without much of a difference. What's your point?
                the 1st post I replied to compared the MARS vs the HIMARS instead of the M270b1, while the second pretended that the M270 is an American design and thus "not counted", implying the MARS isn't

                I don't got a horse in this race but it's clear that someone's twisting around to paint a narrative

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >the 1st post I replied to compared the MARS vs the HIMARS instead of the M270b1, while the second pretended that the M270 is an American design and thus "not counted", implying the MARS isn't
                Wat
                I feel like either you misunderstood somebody here or I missed something because that sounds all kinds of retarded and at least one of your replies was to a post of mine that had nothing to do with that.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                You got the numbers wrong and it's basically the same machine, both designed by Germans, Frogs and Americans with no british involvement.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                M777

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                I thought those came from US stocks. The m270 is an American design but you counted it as British aid because it came from British stocks.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >1st to send aid to Ukraine
            >2nd biggest donator to Ukraine
            >Trains tens of thousands of Ukrainians every few months
            >Conducts constant ISR with aircraft no one else but the US can compete with
            How can you be so uninformed.

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              Should have sent rapiers. You blew it

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                I'm not British. I guess they didn't send Rapiers because they just retired them and don't have many Sky Sabre systems yet.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Sort of yes, but Germany is a special case. Germany spends almost as much on its military as France, and have no where near anything like France in capabilities. And thats not because the Frogs are especially awsome, its just that Germany are actually horrible when it comes to anything related to its armed forces. Hell, Im pretty sure a place like Poland could beat Germany, and they spend like 10% of what germany does on its military.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      it's not a true Germoid, it's the same seether who plagues PrepHole with the same ol threads. he got banned for a while but now he's back.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      They are lashing out since this war has proven their government is a joke, their military is pathetic, and their equipment is beyond mediocre. It is pretty blatant and hilarious.

      Sort of yes, but Germany is a special case. Germany spends almost as much on its military as France, and have no where near anything like France in capabilities. And thats not because the Frogs are especially awsome, its just that Germany are actually horrible when it comes to anything related to its armed forces. Hell, Im pretty sure a place like Poland could beat Germany, and they spend like 10% of what germany does on its military.

      Imagine being this obsessed you cry about Germany in every thread with the same weird disconnected squealing.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Imagine being so upset you can’t handle the fact that the Bradley is superior to the marder.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          I'm not the guy arguing about it here.

          >German crying
          >No by my mental gymnastics it's actually u who I'd crying ja!
          >Continues to cry
          Yeah

          You seem upset.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >German crying
        >No by my mental gymnastics it's actually u who I'd crying ja!
        >Continues to cry
        Yeah

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Their superiority slant never got beaten out of them even after they lost WW2.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Seems to mostly be garden gnomes, bongs and poles seething.
        Used to just be bongs and garden gnomes. Who knew the main reason for brexit would become their staunchest ally in autistic internet spergouts. Armatard really buckbroke them with the ajax threads and they've never forgiven Germany for random people spamming
        >should've bought German
        In those threads.
        I wonder if armatard is proud of himself.

  15. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Marder also has the advantage of the option to fight out of the infantry compartment. Big hatches on the top. In afghanistan germans used to put wire and sandbags around for added protection. I think this would work well when attacking trenches.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Doesn’t make up for the shorter ranges and less armor penetrating capabilities of marder’s armaments compared to the Bradley.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Weird cope.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          It’s better to be able to kill at longer ranges than to have troops popped up shooting.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      It's not an insignificant advantage, and fits nicely with the different ways the two vehicles are going to be used, but it doesn't work great. The vehicle is a big target and human arms and eyeball don't make for good stabilization. But when you consider it seriously and set aside the shitposting it becomes obvious that Marders are going to be used in a more aggressive fashion while Bradleys will favor longer engagements, and that just cements the role for Marder.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        It’s a very insignificant advantage.

  16. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >pavels have a new weapon system to cope over

  17. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    I don’t know what is more ridiculous, the low quality bait threads or the amount of BS being posted in them.
    While a small but very dedicated subgroup of anons keep sliding the entire thing with pointless shitflinging over some OS available stat of any one piece of equipment is better in some dreamed up outlier case scenario, the bigger picture gets blurred.
    Both IFVs are very good at what they are supposed to do within the doctrine they were designed for. Both are optimized for slightly different expected combat conditions which in both cases differ from what we are seeing in Ukraine. Both are just small pieces in a much larger machine which is the mechanized formation they are part of. Comparing them based on paper stats is pointless. They both have advantages and disadvantages and in the end, the performance of each individual vehicle on the battlefield is determined by many outside factors.

    The far more interesting thing to observe will be how each formation will fare against the challenges they are facing. Don’t kid yourselves. When countries are starting to send equipment in batallion batches, they are training and equipping at least brigades worth of Ukrainians. So we will see German style Panzergrenadierbrigade type formations and US HBCTs. It will be very interesting to see how each formation will work along the lines of their respective doctrine and what missions will be assigned to the individual formations.

  18. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Who would've thougt the good old iron pig can make anti-german pavel copers seethe like this at the end of its days lel

    Guess they couldn't handle that a literal weapon system from the scrapyard is the most effective weapon against vodka corpse forces

  19. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >we get to see all NATO equipment do what it was supposed to: shredding ivans side by side
    >it works even better than ever anticipated
    >fat virgin basement dwellers are dumb enough to fall for vatnik divide-and-conquer shit and start playing "my dad can beat up your dad" milsurp edition like underage gays
    How you people haven't suffocated on your own spit yet is beyond me.

  20. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Stupid wording kys botmoron slide threader.

  21. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    I don't get why they don't give Ukraine the Strykers with the 120mm mortar and some of that spotter drone to targeting system integration stuff.

    Seems like firepower is what they need, and that's a lighter way to get it and the Stryker is going to be phased out anyhow. They could even convert other versions over to the mortar or the ATGM version.

    The other problem is, 155mm shells just aren't enough to break entrenched defenses. They need more firepower for punching holes than a 95lb shell. I know they are getting JDAMs for 500 and 1,000lb bombs that will let them drop them miles out, but IDK how much they can really afford to carry out strikes at this point. It seems like some Strike Eagles could really help here.

    End of the day, a bunch of dug in concrete and trenches in your way, 15 1,000lb bombs, maybe some thermobarics, are going to blast a hole for you way better than an artillery barrage.

  22. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Too much cringe in this thread.

    MARS, MLRS, M270 are all the same vehicle/launcher. HIMARS fires the same rockets as well but only 1 pod instead of 2.

    25mm > 20mm. I dont even know why it's questioned. The 20mm can carry more ammo is bs as well. Bradley 25mm carries 300 rds ready to fire. 225 he and 75 ap. Marder has less ready to fire i think.

    UK has not donated as much as Germany. UK was just more enthusiastic and earlier with their donations but haven't donated as much as the germans.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      No, you don't understand. The british version of the weapon non-Brits (mostly Germans) designed for brits is better because it has armor other countries did not deem necessary.
      That is clearly proven by all the less armored versions of it being destroyed. Trusted Eussian sources have posted many exploded HIMARS.

      t. John from Londonistan oblast

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >UK has not donated as many loans to buy German equipment that won't be ready until the war is over.
      Ftfy, bilaterally the UK blows Germany out of the water also the equipment they donated is superior and more in number.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >muh loans
        Can you tell the rest of the class how much of Germany's and the EU's financial support consist of loans that were used to buy systems that will only be delivered in a few years instead of, say, loans and direct donations used to buy ammo, drones, fuel or weaponry Ukraine has already received after buying it with the money?

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >100 pzh2000 cost €2bn delivery date post war
          >18 rch155 cost €200m delivery date post war
          >8000 Rgw90 €40m delivered
          Here bro just use my money to buy my things that won't get there in time, also remember you have to pay me back too.
          Do you mind if I note this down as a donation?
          Imagine what the other loans are like lmao

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >a bit more than 2 Billion
            Wow, now only about 30 billion are left.
            Of course the EU (meaning Germany among others) also sent over 3 billion in direct military aid, but let's just ignore that.
            So what did Ukraine spend the other 30 billion in financial aid it got from Germany as a nation and the EU as an institution on?

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              Pensions, debt service, their government employees. You know, the stuff they would have spent taxes on if there wasn’t war in the country.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                I don't see a breakdown. Are you just guessing, anon?

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              €30bn? Lol the inflated EU number is only €12bn so that makes it €9.8 combined to the UKs €7.2bn. Sorry your so ill-informed.

              https://i.imgur.com/OFe6ZAO.jpg

              >>3 ancient Mars3 vs 9 M270b1
              Wrong numbers plus it's the sane machine for all intends and purposes.
              Also pic related.
              You seem very low on accurate information and left out a lot. Are you uninformed or lying out of butthurt because of a lack of guns in your life?

              Reminder that the UK pledged 1.9 billion in military equipment and 2.2 billion in financial aid expressly for military purposes.
              No idea why you've been seething the entire thread but that stuff is pretty normal to do.
              Meanwhile Germany pledged 2,3 billion in military equipment of specific items committed.
              You can't even do the whole
              >German aid never arrives
              Shtick anymore because all the big stuff has arrived.
              The numbers are from November and Germany has pledged a lot more than the UK since.

              UK gave €4.2bn solely for Military aid, Germany only gave €2.3 try to keep up.
              >You can't do Germany won't deliver
              >100pzh2k, 18 rch155 as part of aid
              >Won't arrive until after the war
              Can't I?
              Sorry dude, your German autist, goal post moving and sly EU number inflating tactics don't work here.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                30 billion, feel free to look it up right now. Check the website, scroll a bit until you see the breakdown.
                >UK gave €4.2bn solely for Military aid, Germany only gave €2.3 try to keep up.
                2.3 in materiel. The UK gave 1.9, the rest is financial aid explicitly for military purposes so it counts towards military aid.
                German financial aid not being explicitly only for military purposes doesn't mean it's not used for it, in fact, you yourself mentioned about 2 billion that went towards weapon procurement. Though the question is purely academic since money they don't have to spend on other stuff frees up capacities in their budget for military applications anyway.
                >Can't I?
                You can't, you're also still missing quite a few billion that aren't accounted for.

                Getting frustrated?

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                United Kingdom
                Total commitments
                7.082bn € (Rank: 2)
                0.258% of GDP (Rank: 6)
                Humanitarian commitments
                0.398bn € (Rank: 4)
                0.014% of GDP (Rank: 18)
                Financial commitments
                2.555bn € (Rank: 2)
                0.093% of GDP (Rank: 4)
                Military commitments
                4.129bn € (Rank: 2)
                0.150% of GDP (Rank: 8)

                Germany
                Total commitments
                5.445bn € (Rank: 3)
                0.142% of GDP (Rank: 14)
                Humanitarian commitments
                1.950bn € (Rank: 2)
                0.051% of GDP (Rank: 4)
                Financial commitments
                1.150bn € (Rank: 4)
                0.030% of GDP (Rank: 11)
                Military commitments
                2.345bn € (Rank: 3)
                0.061% of GDP (Rank: 17)

                https://app.23degrees.io/view/x67vE7NsM3NeQu7z-atlas-slideshow_v4-atlantic/MN8juinnuWJ7fecU-choro-ukraine-aid-tracker-final-data

                >It's €30bn I swear!
                >Germany's new commitments and its contribution to the large new EU package now make it the largest donor in Europe in absolute terms, overtaking the UK for the first time, with a total of 12.6 billion euros

                So you were wrong with everything you said. Sorry If the truth hurts but it gets worse.

                >UK will match record Ukraine support in 2023 Prime Minister announces the UK will meet or exceed the amount of military aid spent on Ukraine in 2022 next year.
                The Kiel chart doesn't include the future comitment for the UK like it does for Germany.

                Thanks for playing

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >bong simultaneously can't differentiate between the EU and Germany and consider Germany's individual commitments and its commitments as part of the EU funds as German money
                That is impressive retardation lmao
                >The Kiel chart doesn't include the future comitment for the UK like it does for Germany.
                There is no commitment by the UK.
                You keep mentioning the UKsaid it would keep up it's level of commitments in the next year, but that's a broad announcement, nothing more, nothing binding and nothing concrete. Scholz has already said German commitments wouldn't be reduced in the future as long as it takes so if we do brainlet math like yours Germany has committed infinite money.
                But that doesn't work because neither country has committed to anything with it. Stay desperate, bong shill.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Scholz has already said German commitments wouldn't be reduced in the future as long as it takes so if we do brainlet math like yours Germany has committed infinite money.
                When do we get daily mail articles announcing German superiority as an ally? Bong logic is wild

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Are you retarded? We are talking about Germany and EU inflated number €12bn and it's (actual) bilateral number is €5.4bn in comparison to the UKs.
                >UK hasn't committed anything just broad announcment
                Its pretty clear, to match or exceed current donations current donation x2 or above.
                Let's not get bogged down with Scholz bullshittery, we all know Germany is a joke and cannot do anything without a spiders Web of lies and feet dragging. BTW how's the €100bn fund for the military going I heard its been back tracked already lol

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                He still doesn't get it lmao
                >BTW how's the €100bn fund for the military going I heard its been back tracked already lol
                Last time I checked 81 billion had already been assigned, it went through parliament successfully as well so no backtracking yet.
                You really are not particularly smart or informed, are you?

                [...]
                Here's a nice article demonstrating the reliability of Germanys commitments.
                https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.politico.eu/article/germany-backtracks-on-defense-spending-promise-warns-about-delays-ukraine-war/amp/?espv=1
                >Last month, it had already emerged that Germany will likely miss its 2 percent target in 2023 as the regular defense budget of about €50 billion will slightly shrink by about €300 million. Only a comparably small first tranche of a massive €100 billion special military upgrading fund is expected to be paid out.
                Meanwhile Bonglands just spent $82bn this year alone set to rise next year. Stay in your lane.

                >british media
                Kek, I'm starting to understand where your distorting view on reality is coming from, bongoloid.
                The arrogance combined with the retardation is what really does it for me.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Politico.eu
                >British media
                >Politico Europe (stylized as POLITICO Europe) is the European edition of the German-owned news organization Politico reporting on political affairs of the European Union.
                Just stop, you have completely lost it.
                >N-no backtrack yet!
                >Last month, it had already emerged that Germany will likely miss its 2 percent target in 2023 as the regular defense budget of about €50 billion will slightly shrink by about €300 million. Only a comparably small first tranche of a massive €100 billion special military upgrading fund is expected to be paid out.
                You can't read can you.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                media
                Europe
                Correct, you think they employ Germans for filthy angloid news?
                >You can't read can you.
                Can you?
                There is no backtracking there, the 100 billion are intact and allocated, they just won't be spent all at once right now.
                E.g the f35 deal is still being finalized last time I checked and there's more.
                Where is the backtracking?

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Politico Europe (stylized as POLITICO Europe) is the European edition of the German-owned news organization Politico reporting on political affairs of the European Union.
                >article written BY HANS VON DER BURCHARD AND GABRIEL RINALDI

                >>N-no backtrack yet!
                >>Last month, it had already emerged that Germany will likely miss its 2 percent target in 2023 as the regular defense budget of about €50 billion will slightly shrink by about €300 million.
                This is irrelevant because the 100 billion are explicitly not part of the regular budget.
                >Only a comparably small first tranche of a massive €100 billion special military upgrading fund is expected to be paid out.
                Expected by whom and when? Most of it is already allocated, including, after the latest revision, a lot more for ammo.
                But the money isn't spent yet because no ammo has been bought yet and deals are still being made with the industry. Rheinmetall has been building 2 new ammo facilities,one in Germany and one in hungary, due to it (maybe more but those are the ones I heard of).
                But the feds haven't spent any money on ammo itself yet, even if they told the industry that they will.
                You really are an idiot, bro.

                [...]
                >bongoloid in charge of understanding the news
                >bongoloid in charge of understanding the world
                >bongoloid in charge of understanding simple English
                EL EM AY OH

                >Only a comparably small first tranche of a massive €100 billion special military upgrading fund is expected to be paid out.
                >first tranche
                Materiel acquisition is known to take a while and your own quote proves you wrong. Welcome to PrepHole, newfriend. Enjoy the inevitable sound of heels being dragged. Member the ajax? It's usually not that bad, but it's always bad.

                Copers coping kek

                https://i.imgur.com/TIyUfHM.jpg

                [...]
                I think I've seen this moron post exactly that shit about backtracking like a smug cunt before.
                He's in every thread tangentially related to Germany to seethe about it.
                What an embarrassment for his toothless nation.

                Enter the autist

                1. You're not counting all the eastern european stuff that is given to Ukraine that is paid for or replaced by Germany

                2. EU aid also has a lot coming from Germans also while none from BREXIT BRITS.

                3. UK is enthusiastic and early with their military aid. Germany was more passive and reluctant with their aid. BUT in the end Germany ended up contributing more.

                Brits is the girl who likes you, called you, wants to hang out and gives you a blowjob on the 1st date.

                Germs is the girl that doesn't like you, didn't wanna hang out, didn't want to fool around but ended up letting you fuck, let you poop on her, put it in her butt and cum in her mouth.

                1. Yes I am
                2. EU aid like I've said before is riddle ld with clauses and stupid rules like buying 100 Pzh2k for €2bn+ that won't be delivered for another decade.
                3. UK military aid is nearly double what Germany has given to date, just because your adding all the fantasy loans and shit that hasn't happened yet to make yourselves feel better doesn't change the fact €4.5bn of acutal material from the UK is in Ukraine right now and only €2.3bn from Germany is there right now.

                Nah Britain put its big dick on the table right away without fear
                Germany is the little dick who was too shriveled to get it out straight away and instead went home took a picture of it, added some filters and abit of photoshop reappeared nearly a year later and said GUYS LOOK IM WINNING!
                Your a gay nation, you wouldn't have done anything unless pressured timing is everything if you help a man when he's starving it's infintatly better than giving him a meal ticket and a promise for next year.

                It's pretty simple look at it this way
                According to your EU fabricated chart The EU has done more for Ukraine than the USA. Are you that fucking dumb you believe that too?
                That France Spain and Italy have contributed more than Canada? Just check the wiki and give your head a shake.

                You still cannot accept 25mm bushmaster is superior to 20mm, that the dyal TOW fired from the Bradley is better than the Milan.

                Tldr Germans have the neck to argue forever on an autistic level uncomprendable to others and will do mental gymnastics at Olympic level for days on end.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >anon doesn't know what tranche means
                >fantasised about muh backtracking
                >proven wrong by his own source
                >desperately tries to pretend he wasn't being a retard now
                Holy shit man, I really didn't expect you to have so little shame you'd come back into the thread lmao
                You were objectively wrong according to your own source. The 100 billion stand and will be spent, just like every other acquisition program it won't happen immediately and due to the size and the nature of it being outside of the regular budget it won't happen all at once either.
                >first tranche
                Means others will follow.
                You were wrong. Learn English.
                Also
                >that longform cope
                Lmao, do you actually expect the guy to read your pathetic attempts to pretend the UK giving money that had to be spent on military purposes making up more than half of its military aid counts as aid but both Germany and the EU giving way more money that can be spent on other things (or military acquisition as we know they've done) doesn't and still take you seriously?
                I got 2 points in, I wonder if he'll get to 3 before he just starts laughing at you as well.
                Wait, actually you believed 100 billion being spent in waves means it's nit being spent at all because you didn't know the term tranche so you might actually be that delusional.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Germany spends as much as France on Defence, but is missing;
                1x Aircraft carrier
                10x Nuclear submarines
                2x Nuclear delivery systems
                280x Nuclear weapons
                Working vehicles
                Working ships
                Working submarines
                Working helicopters
                Working aircraft

                Why?

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Because unlike the frogs, Germany is sending so much to support Ukraine.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Kek, is that your new goalpost after getting BTFO'd by your own source?
                How many threads did you post that shit about backtracking in? How many people rightfully laughed at you?
                >1x Aircraft carrier
                >10x Nuclear submarines
                >2x Nuclear delivery systems
                Lack of colonies and overseas interests that would require power projection capabilities on the other end of the world and nuclear arsenals are expensive as shit to maintain, nukes can be created in about a month in Germany if necessary but the current and foreseeable situation simply do not make it necessary. Can you name a single realistic scenario where nukes would be required or even helpful?
                >Working
                They do the bare minimum in some cases, in others more and it's set to noticeably improve.
                >why
                Lack of necessity. It's still not really necessary but it's good capabilities are being beefed up again in case that changes.
                As you might remember, Germany hasn't been in a real war for 80 years (and neither have France and Britain).

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Kek
                Did anybody get court martial'd for that pic?

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Reminder:
                Financial and humanitarian aid is as necessary as materiel deliveries for a war, Stalin understood that, FDR understood it, even the fat golem Churchill understood it.
                You don't.
                And Germany has given about twice the amount in aid compared to Britain.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Germany has given twice the amount UK has
                Again no they haven't lol what the UK has given is there in Ukraine double the amount of military equipment Germany has sent. Germany, like the rest of the EU has tacked on the new statistics coming from loans meant for products that won't be delivered in time for the war and aren't very usefull.

                Because unlike the frogs, Germany is sending so much to support Ukraine.

                France is only marginally behind Germany on that chart, which doesn't make sense because in reality France has sent barely anything to Ukraine. But try telling the autismo krauts that.

                Kek, is that your new goalpost after getting BTFO'd by your own source?
                How many threads did you post that shit about backtracking in? How many people rightfully laughed at you?
                >1x Aircraft carrier
                >10x Nuclear submarines
                >2x Nuclear delivery systems
                Lack of colonies and overseas interests that would require power projection capabilities on the other end of the world and nuclear arsenals are expensive as shit to maintain, nukes can be created in about a month in Germany if necessary but the current and foreseeable situation simply do not make it necessary. Can you name a single realistic scenario where nukes would be required or even helpful?
                >Working
                They do the bare minimum in some cases, in others more and it's set to noticeably improve.
                >why
                Lack of necessity. It's still not really necessary but it's good capabilities are being beefed up again in case that changes.
                As you might remember, Germany hasn't been in a real war for 80 years (and neither have France and Britain).

                Nah just a point about how riddled with corporate corruption, red tape and mismanagement of funds the German military/government is, this also seen in the donations.
                >Lack of Carrier nukes etc
                >B-but we don't have colonies
                OK sweet so you would spend all the money saved from that on land forces and airforce etc?
                But no Germany while spending the same has less equipment to hand. How is that possible?
                >Germany hasn't been in a real war
                Germany hasn't even fired a tank shot in anger in an actual conflict since ww2 its pathetic really.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Holy cope lmao
                Reminder that Germany sent more military equipment, pure military aid is only higher for Britain due to financial aid explicitly given for military purchases counts as military aid only.
                Meanwhile Germany has given about twice the amount the UK has and plenty of financial aid which can also be used to buy weaponry.
                You lost, anon.
                As for your goalpost moving you desperately shifted to after getting BTFO'd because you can't read basic English.
                >red tape and mismanagement of funds
                Ajax
                >this also seen in the donations.
                Nothing you have ever provided proof for.
                Money is money, anon. And Germany sent about twice as much as the UK.
                >OK sweet so you would spend all the money saved from that on land forces and airforce etc?
                Germany is surrounded by allies with no threat in sight. Russia has been proven to be toothless.
                hasn't been in a real war
                Neither has britain.
                Shooting at sandmorons from inside a tank is no war, anon.
                Britain hasn't been in a war since WWII in which it embarrassed itself on the continent to the point where its greatest point of pride is Dunkirk which consists of not losing as hard as you could have before sitting on your island and waiting for Daddy America to save you.
                What a pathetic nation.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Germany sent more military aid referee
                False UK sent 4.4bn worth Germany only 2.3bn.
                >Ajax
                Shit
                >proofs
                MFA 18bn fund is for post war rebuilding not military aid.
                >We don't want to have a military just because ok!
                The view of a cuck gay and also a coward
                >B-britain hasn't had a real war waaaa
                Yeah, had lots. Big huge deployments thousands of miles away all carried by out fantastic logistical capabilities and masterfull maintainance of vehicles.
                Germany managed to get six (6!) Leopard 2s to Lithuania on a train lmao your a wet wipe no mark on Europe Poland at this point shits directly into your mother's mouth.

                Why do you let us dominate you so hard. Pretty sad that the UK has more working vehicles inside Germany than the German military and better facilities too. You could always join the FFL I guess.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                sent more military aid referee
                >False UK sent 4.4bn worth Germany only 2.3bn.
                moron oearn to read.
                I wrote military equipment. Britain sent 1.9 billion in equipment, the rest was financial aid explicitly meant for materiel which somehow counts as military aid while financial aid without conditions that can be spent on military materiel is just financial aid.
                >MFA
                Far from the only one.
                Rest is tldnr, Britain hasn't been in a real war since WWII. Your copes won't change that.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >UK Military commitments 4.129bn € (Rank: 2)
                >Germany Military commitments 2.345bn € (Rank: 3)
                Get rekt saurkraut
                >MFA
                Kek I'll send you a wipe to clean up your tears can I put it as military aid though?

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Nah just a point about how riddled with corporate corruption, red tape and mismanagement of funds the German military/government is,
                >coming from a bong
                Ahem
                >warrior
                >Battle of Saratoga
                >B.E. 9
                >ajax
                >Charge of the light brigade in 1854
                >Sizaire-Berwick Armoured Car
                >Blue Peacock
                >SA80 (barely acceptable after krauts fixed it for the brits)
                >Chieftain
                >Gallipoli
                >Mary Rose
                >Singapore 1942
                >literally every WWII tank

                Your island is and always has been a joke, everybody worth his salt emigrated to America.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                The boxer is not on the list because it is good and decidedly non-British.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >anon in 1854 you did some dumb shit!
                lol
                lmao
                >150 German soldiers were preparing to return home from serving in Afghanistan, they were told their aircraft had broken down. Under normal circumstances, the commander would have called for another military transport plane. But there were none available. They weren’t fit to fly. If necessary, the government’s plane, used by German Chancellor Angela Merkel, was on standby. All this would be laughable were it not so serious.

                >All this would be laughable were it not so serious
                Kek

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                I'm not German, there are plenty of newer examples in the list and the problem is the pattern of british incompetence shown throughout history.
                Napoleon was right about you and if the Prussians Prussians wouldn't have won the war for you frogs would have conquered Britain.
                Again.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Esl get a bath you stink of desperation

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Guns on engine block, anon. Now.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Your island is and always has been a joke
                This is true, but then Germany and all other Euro states are the mother of all jokes; they're continually invaded, occupied, launching revolutions, struggling under dictatorships etc. They collapse in on themselves every few generations, literally 3rd world tier.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >literally 3rd world tier
                Over 1 million British children systematically groomed, raped and prostituted by a protected class of foreign transplants with special rights, privileges and accommodations.
                Doesn't exactly scream first world, does it?

                >UK Military commitments 4.129bn € (Rank: 2)
                >Germany Military commitments 2.345bn € (Rank: 3)
                Get rekt saurkraut
                >MFA
                Kek I'll send you a wipe to clean up your tears can I put it as military aid though?

                Germany sent more equipment, most of the "military aid" is financial aid with military purposes by britain.
                Germany also sent more financial aid.
                There are also plenty of funds and many smaller projects to send aid by the EU, including military equipment.
                Keep seething.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >groomed, raped and prostituted
                This sucks, but 1million is a figure pulled from someones ass.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                They had 30 years, institutional protection and and often even support and were present in every single medium to large sized city.
                1 million is a low estimate if anything.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >muh 1 million
                Oh look its the 4chantard! Is it Dennis?
                Remember the 1 million Syrians you let in is that what your talking about?
                >A 15-year-old German teenager who was helping two young migrant men integrate, which included providing them with German lessons, was raped by the two Syrian men.
                Those in glass houses anon...I can see this conversion has you seething that you've forgotten the basics.
                >Military aid with financial benefits!
                Nope that's the Financial bar it's separate just like the Humanitarian bar too!
                UK has nearly double the amount of kit sent to Ukraine Germany did...because let's face it you don't have anything do you? Not in any sizeable numbers just very very basic things like 7.62x51mm I think you only sent like 10,000 155mm when the UK sent 60,000 155mm and 50,000 152mm
                But at least they got the AdBlue!

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Don't forget the 125 pairs of binoculars anon

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Anon, somehow I don't think one case is the same as 30 years of child rape actively supported by your institutions.
                >UK has nearly double the amount of kit sent to Ukraine Germany did
                Everything you wrote is wrong, but just to remind you, Germany sent 2,3 billion in equipment, Britain sent 1,9 billion according to November numbers. The rest is financial aid by the UK which counts as military aid because it's explicitly only for military purposes.
                Of course those numbers have risen since then (in Germany's favor).

                >Germany was still a assortment of dukedoms and principalities sucking each other off whilst Britain was dominating people in every corner of the globe
                Germany has only ever pulled its finger out in 1914 and again in 1939 so it could try and plunge Europe into war and destroy European global hegemony, as all Germans, deep in their shrivelled black hearts, hate to see white people on top.

                Seething. And the guy you're seething st isn't German.
                Man, brits are so thin-skinned lmao

                Don't forget the 125 pairs of binoculars anon

                Meanwhile in reality Geemany has sent more and better kit than Britain.
                https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_foreign_aid_to_Ukraine_during_the_Russo-Ukrainian_War

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >isn't German
                If the direct comparison made is between German and British incompetence, then the response is going to be about German and British incompetence, you fucking retard.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                I don't see it in that post aside from the quote that caused it due to the britshit's unearned arrogance.
                What I see is a long list of british failures in the very sector britshill complained about.
                Maybe try having a working defence industry before you talk shit?

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Maybe try have a defense industry
                Wew lad wrong again, picrel kek it's only up to 2017 too, 6 years doesnt make a difference though

                It must be sad to think you have such a good defense industry, but your country's military is basically defenceless. How ironic.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                It's no use, he doesn't understand simple infographics his brain is in autism overdrive the Bongs have broken his spirit, like the generations before him.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >saud the retard who tried to claim EU aid doesn't count and tranche means totality
                Lel

                https://i.imgur.com/q9X4zhy.jpg

                >like a whole day and 200 posts worth of seething over krauts
                Damn you gays are autistic

                Kek

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >look we send garbage to shitholes
                Can't produce good guns, can't produce good armored vehicles, can't produce good tanks.
                What are you good for, really?

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >B-but it's wrong 🙁
                Sorry that was a direct quote from Kiel. UK 4.4bn Ger 2.3bn.
                >B-but it's risen too p-promise
                "The total value of individual licenses issued by the Federal Government for the export of military goods in the period from January 1, 2022 to January 2, 2023 amounts to 2.245.303.401 Euro."
                Nah it hasn't lmao.
                >Wiki aid list
                Bruh, why would you post that. It shows how much of a joke Germanys kit is hahahaha it's such low low low numbers of such shit stuff the only high numbers are jackets, hats and small arms ammunition.
                British stuff is muuuuuuch better than way more too.
                Anti ship missiles 40+spgs 100+ towed arty nearly twice as many MLRS 120,000+ 155/3 ammo high tech radars not just a single radar lol Brimstone missiles 200+ Armoured vehicles not iust soviet shit and vw pickups.

                Why would you do that to yourself lol.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Sorry that was a direct quote from Kiel. UK 4.4bn Ger 2.3bn.
                Yes, that only 1.9 billion is in equipment and the rest financial aid meant to order equipment is also from Kiel, scroll down a bit or click the bars for more info.
                >Nah it hasn't
                Marders, among other things. What's your Curryking sending?
                >Bruh, why would you post that. It shows how much of a joke Germanys kit is hahahaha
                Stopped reading there, I clearly broke you.
                Reminder:
                Germany sent about 25% more actual equipment than Britain.
                Germany sent better equipment than Britain.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Germany was still a assortment of dukedoms and principalities sucking each other off whilst Britain was dominating people in every corner of the globe
                Germany has only ever pulled its finger out in 1914 and again in 1939 so it could try and plunge Europe into war and destroy European global hegemony, as all Germans, deep in their shrivelled black hearts, hate to see white people on top.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >tranche
                >/trɑːn(t)ʃ/
                >noun
                >a portion of something, especially money.
                >"they released the first tranche of the loan"
                >brits in charge of simple English

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Tranche. French, it means ”a slice”
                The english had to use the french word, because they didn’t had one for that, as they didn’t eat bread but mud.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Reasonable explanation.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >>N-no backtrack yet!
                >>Last month, it had already emerged that Germany will likely miss its 2 percent target in 2023 as the regular defense budget of about €50 billion will slightly shrink by about €300 million.
                This is irrelevant because the 100 billion are explicitly not part of the regular budget.
                >Only a comparably small first tranche of a massive €100 billion special military upgrading fund is expected to be paid out.
                Expected by whom and when? Most of it is already allocated, including, after the latest revision, a lot more for ammo.
                But the money isn't spent yet because no ammo has been bought yet and deals are still being made with the industry. Rheinmetall has been building 2 new ammo facilities,one in Germany and one in hungary, due to it (maybe more but those are the ones I heard of).
                But the feds haven't spent any money on ammo itself yet, even if they told the industry that they will.
                You really are an idiot, bro.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >>N-no backtrack yet!
                >>Last month, it had already emerged that Germany will likely miss its 2 percent target in 2023 as the regular defense budget of about €50 billion will slightly shrink by about €300 million.
                This is irrelevant because the 100 billion are explicitly not part of the regular budget.
                >Only a comparably small first tranche of a massive €100 billion special military upgrading fund is expected to be paid out.
                Expected by whom and when? Most of it is already allocated, including, after the latest revision, a lot more for ammo.
                But the money isn't spent yet because no ammo has been bought yet and deals are still being made with the industry. Rheinmetall has been building 2 new ammo facilities,one in Germany and one in hungary, due to it (maybe more but those are the ones I heard of).
                But the feds haven't spent any money on ammo itself yet, even if they told the industry that they will.
                You really are an idiot, bro.

                >bongoloid in charge of understanding the news
                >bongoloid in charge of understanding the world
                >bongoloid in charge of understanding simple English
                EL EM AY OH

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Only a comparably small first tranche of a massive €100 billion special military upgrading fund is expected to be paid out.
                >first tranche
                Materiel acquisition is known to take a while and your own quote proves you wrong. Welcome to PrepHole, newfriend. Enjoy the inevitable sound of heels being dragged. Member the ajax? It's usually not that bad, but it's always bad.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                [...]
                Here's a nice article demonstrating the reliability of Germanys commitments.
                https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.politico.eu/article/germany-backtracks-on-defense-spending-promise-warns-about-delays-ukraine-war/amp/?espv=1
                >Last month, it had already emerged that Germany will likely miss its 2 percent target in 2023 as the regular defense budget of about €50 billion will slightly shrink by about €300 million. Only a comparably small first tranche of a massive €100 billion special military upgrading fund is expected to be paid out.
                Meanwhile Bonglands just spent $82bn this year alone set to rise next year. Stay in your lane.

                I think I've seen this moron post exactly that shit about backtracking like a smug cunt before.
                He's in every thread tangentially related to Germany to seethe about it.
                What an embarrassment for his toothless nation.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >>N-no backtrack yet!
                >>Last month, it had already emerged that Germany will likely miss its 2 percent target in 2023 as the regular defense budget of about €50 billion will slightly shrink by about €300 million. Only a comparably small first tranche of a massive €100 billion special military upgrading fund is expected to be paid out.
                >You can't read can you.
                >first tranche
                >You can't read can you.
                Oh I am laffin

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >>UK will match record Ukraine support in 2023 Prime Minister announces the UK will meet or exceed the amount of military aid spent on Ukraine in 2022 next year.
                >The Kiel chart doesn't include the future comitment for the UK like it does for Germany.
                Because that's not a commitment. Kinda lacks the whole part where you set specifics and commit to them. That's a platitude.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Scholz has already said German commitments wouldn't be reduced in the future as long as it takes so if we do brainlet math like yours Germany has committed infinite money.
                When do we get daily mail articles announcing German superiority as an ally? Bong logic is wild

                Here's a nice article demonstrating the reliability of Germanys commitments.
                https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.politico.eu/article/germany-backtracks-on-defense-spending-promise-warns-about-delays-ukraine-war/amp/?espv=1
                >Last month, it had already emerged that Germany will likely miss its 2 percent target in 2023 as the regular defense budget of about €50 billion will slightly shrink by about €300 million. Only a comparably small first tranche of a massive €100 billion special military upgrading fund is expected to be paid out.
                Meanwhile Bonglands just spent $82bn this year alone set to rise next year. Stay in your lane.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Reminder that the UK pledged 1.9 billion in military equipment and 2.2 billion in financial aid expressly for military purposes.
            No idea why you've been seething the entire thread but that stuff is pretty normal to do.
            Meanwhile Germany pledged 2,3 billion in military equipment of specific items committed.
            You can't even do the whole
            >German aid never arrives
            Shtick anymore because all the big stuff has arrived.
            The numbers are from November and Germany has pledged a lot more than the UK since.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        1. You're not counting all the eastern european stuff that is given to Ukraine that is paid for or replaced by Germany

        2. EU aid also has a lot coming from Germans also while none from BREXIT BRITS.

        3. UK is enthusiastic and early with their military aid. Germany was more passive and reluctant with their aid. BUT in the end Germany ended up contributing more.

        Brits is the girl who likes you, called you, wants to hang out and gives you a blowjob on the 1st date.

        Germs is the girl that doesn't like you, didn't wanna hang out, didn't want to fool around but ended up letting you fuck, let you poop on her, put it in her butt and cum in her mouth.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Bro, you probably have aids now.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            I can't have aids

            I've only slept with women and no black women

  23. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    why not send some cv90 to ukraine? come on theres thousands of these guys around

  24. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Marders Germany is sending to Ukraine are the ones without stabilized cannon so they can't fire precisely while moving lmao

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Well,l did you seriously think they'd give up the 80 or so upgraded 1A3's they still use themselves? If yes you might be retarded,

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Well,l did you seriously think they'd give up the 80 or so upgraded 1A3's they still use themselves? If yes you might be retarded,

      Actually, since they're being replaced anyway, the German defence minister announced today that they'd be coming out of active stocks. There should still be a thread up about it right now.

  25. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Because the USA will support the deliveries after donation and will make sure they arrive in a quick and efficient manner. Germany will make sure they arrive by the next fiscal year and won't provide much (if any) after donation support. Much like the Gepards ran out of ammo. If the USA donates something, it works and will be supported onwards. If Germany donates something, it's done because of international and internal pressure.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >Much like the Gepards ran out of ammo.
      But that hasn't happened.
      Spend less time on twitter, your post is retarded.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >But that hasn't happened.
        Source?

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          moron you can't prove a negative, that's logically impossible.
          Ammo deliveries are less than people would want them to be due to swiss judaism, but Rheinmetall bought an entire company (swiss or spanish, something with S) and set up a separate factory in Germany to produce more ammo. They also wanna set up another one in hungary. Maybe they're already doing it.
          Either way, Gepards still have ammo, likely less than they'd be comfortable with for a great offensive right now, but not only are you wrong as hell in your post, you're also gay.
          And you missed the recent gepard footage somehow.

  26. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    The Bradley being able to fire an ATGM without the commander having to expose most of his body is a big advantage.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      It looks so much fucking cooler though

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        It's up there with the Chieftain rolling around downtown Bagdad with an M4 on the turret roof next to him because it was faster to bring on target than the pintle-mounted M2.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      You can use the Marder missle without exposing anything but the missle tube though. Which is a distinct advantage if you consider both missles being wire guided and flight times.
      You can also mount any ATGM you like with very little modification.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Anon, they just strapped a tripod onto the turret.

        Pretty sure you can do that to any vehicle if you want.

        The Bradley oth the missile launcher is integrated into the FCS.

  27. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Marder isn't even really an IFV tbh, at least not when compared to the Bradley

  28. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    I can't believe we have to waste our time trying to explain how 25mm>20mm

    And how having an integrated, armored 2 tube long range missile launcher is better than having a single tube medium range tripod missile launcher strapped on to the turret

    God i hate annoying germans

  29. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >like a whole day and 200 posts worth of seething over krauts
    Damn you gays are autistic

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      This is PrepHole, and it is a thread about IFVs, so it follows that much arguing about 2nd rate militaries will ensue.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Armatard and warriortard have permanently buckbroken bongs for any IFV related threads.
        Their trepidation and autistic screeching have become instinctual.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          I thought warriortard was the guy making all those IFV threads.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            I think warriortard might have killed himself after realizing he inspired the shitskin who spams the obnoxious German Wunderwaffe threads to get people to hate Germany.
            Jannies have finally started deleting them but they tend to get to over 50+ posts due to tourists from poles of bongs pouncing on them like a moron on a goat.

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              What a tangled web we weave.

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