How long do you think it will take Ukraine to seize the pre-2014 borders in Donetsk and Luhansk?

How long do you think it will take Ukraine to seize the pre-2014 borders in Donetsk and Luhansk? These areas have been built up with years of defenses and are a lot more urbanized than other portions of the oblasts.

  1. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    at earliest, jan-february '23, at latest june 24

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >two winters
      Don't forget to add
      >Putin's death

  2. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Kiev regime would be forced to negotiate before moving past the pre-war borders

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >forced
      by?

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        All parties.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          All parties that matter recognize it as Ukrainian clay and said they will support them as such.

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            Of course they do, if they did not they could not be used as bargaining chips to end the conflict.

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              Conflict doesnt end when Russia wants, sowwy

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              You don't bargain with someone who's losing.

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous
            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              >Yo-you have the bargain with the loosing side anon! You Baka!

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              >negotiating from weakness
              The cooper at it again

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          lol, lmao. US won't stop until Russia doesn't exist and all their ex territories are denuclearized.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          The US gets a morally acceptable way to keep laundering money through defense contractors by keeping the war open. Poland's hatred of Russia is ingrained in it's ethnic DNA.
          Neither one is going to back down in the foreseeable future.
          No matter how much every other country whines about it, those two are all Ukraine really needs.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        uhhh the christian god

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          God's on the Ukrainians' side, he isn't going to help Sodomites
          >piece of the True Cross on the Moskva
          >God sinks the ship and takes it back

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        Putin's best bet is the Americans once the Conservatives seize the legislator. It's obvious Putin and the Suadis are interfering in the American elections on the conservative's behalf by fucking with the price of oil.
        If the Americans cut the Ukrainians off, they might be forced to negotiate.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      dumb moron, here's your you and 15 rubles for bread

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        That only pays the down payment on the bread microloan. Bread's something like 150 rubles a loaf now.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >regime
      Projecting vatnik

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >pre-war borders
      you mean pre-2014 invasion?
      Because I'm sick as fuck of retards starting wars and calling them something other than wars.
      It's bad when the Burgers do that, and that does NOT mean that it's OK when the Vodkas are the ones doing so.
      Fucktards, both of you.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        >It's bad when the Burgers do that
        Yeah, but at least we weren't trying to make Afghanistan or Iraq the 51st state

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          We probably should've, though, would've made shit a lot easier.
          Unironically, a war of conquest and manifest destiny-style seizing of territory would have been WAY fucking easier than trying to pull off the clusterfuck we did in Afghanistan of "state-building."

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            You're not wrong anon
            t.7+ years in AFG

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous
  3. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Given what has happened in other supposedly entrenched areas (Izyum, Kherson) Im doubtful of the effectiveness of Russian fortifications. Also, their logistics apparatus would not be able to cope with the entire army trying to sit there

  4. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Two more weeks

  5. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Never, because Russia by law cannot let any of its territory leave Russia.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      It's a good thing laws can be changed, and aren't binding to other nations unless they allow it to be the isn't it.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        No? It matters because it pushes Russia to a situation where they cannot legally accept a situation. If you go 'fuck that law' then everything falls apart, so you gotta fight to maintain that particular law. Which means it opens up huge possibilities for what Russia can do to prevent it losing that
        >haha le nook
        No, not le nook, but a perpetual never ending war where they don't officially cede the areas is just as good. Ukraine never enters NATO, Ukraine cannot go further without risking nukes, Russia can milk the 'evil anglo saxons' forever.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          The territory they """annexed""" doesnt even become Russian until 2026, plenty of room for them to repeal it

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            No, it officially is their territory, it's just they have up till 2026 to integrate Russian economic and social and law and blahblahblah.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          Or they just make a law that repeals their chance at future statehood, considering it's been extended to 2026. It's just that easy.
          What good is Ukraine not joining NATO if NATO is giving them weapons and training anyway.
          Ukraine won't let this "forever war" not be costly to Russia, this is not 2015-2020, Russia will lose an obscene amount of people maintaining it as Ukraine now has a functioning army and is being funded far more heavily from the west.

          If anyone is being milked, anon, it's Russia. And not in the good way.

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            I mean it's a big theoretical situation anyway. Ukraine actually has to push them out first. Could take years, decades, without proper support from the West.

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              When 60x Russians start coming back in body bags than Chechnya, and the Russian worse way of life becomes more routine as sanctions press it, we will see.

              • 2 months ago
                Anonymous

                I give them six months at best before even parallel imports (smuggling) fail to keep up with demand. They might even suffer a complete military defeat before then.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          Defeated countries can not claim their own law to avoid the victor's IMPOSITIONS.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          And then the Ukies jsut forcibly demilitarise the border areas on the russian side and get into NATO anyway. And no nooks because Putin's too chicken. The forever war BS doesn't work if the otehr side doesn't agree with it.

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            >get into NATO
            see

            Will end in
            >Crimea recovered by Ukranie - not that I care, they are both Slavs
            >Russia's military prestige taken so low that Japan claims the Kuriles again - by threat of force (inb4 "muh SDF can't operate outside homeland", they will say they are retaking homeland) - not that I care, they are yellows vs slavs
            >Ukraine does whatever the fuck wants to do with its provinces - not that I care, they are slavs
            >Russian provinces next to Ukraine turned into DMZs
            >EU buttfucks Russia once they are no longer dependant of Russian gas (FYI, several southern countries use nowadays more solar or wind energy than gas, Russian or otherwise, and are pressuring Germany and others to stop being retards and foillow their lead now that Putin's bribes are no longer flooding the Bundestag) - not that I care for Russia, they are slavs
            >Ukraine joins EU - which causes russian war reparations to Ukraine to make the EU richer (color me surprised here)
            >Nato keeps rejecting Ukraine entry as they have been doing for years by now (because they are retards, if they had acepted them this trololo wouldn't have happened), a little bit of trivia that most Russian shills pontificating about "NATO proxy wars" seem to forget

            Screencap THAT, too.

            >Nato keeps rejecting Ukraine entry as they have been doing for years by now
            Seriously. You guys read as little international news as the Vatnik shills.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          lol thinking this is a desirable outcome for russia and an undesirable one for nato

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            Yeah the US MIC probably jack themselves off thinking of just that particular scenario.
            Most european arms producers probably do too.
            It would be the gift that keeps on giving.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          Fine. Then Ukraine can use Russians for eternal target practice.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          >No? It matters because it pushes Russia to a situation where they cannot legally accept a situation

          It doesn't matter worth shit. Russia is not and has NEVER been a land governed by laws. It's a totalitarian dictatorship and has always been one. The only law is the whim of the currently reigning dictator.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Aren't they still deciding what the borders are going to be?

    • 2 months ago
      https://boards.4channel.org/k/thread/55488189

      enforcing laws requires force and sovereignty, things Russia should be very worried about keeping if the war maintains the momentum it's had since falling back from Kiev

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Why doesn't the Duma pass a law requiring Ukraine to immediately surrender unconditionally? For that matter, why haven't they made their ammo dumps immune to ATACMS by outlawing secondary explosions?

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      R*ssia by law cannot mobilize in peace time. In R*ssia the law is something you wipe your ass with after practicing open defecation behind your 18th century wooden shed.

  6. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    If Ukraine attrite them to unsustainable combat levels outside the city, they could walk in in a day or two.
    Considering the accurate artillery fire, and Russia doesn't spend another 400k men, I would suggest it would fall to unsustainable levels in less than a year.

  7. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    I was surprised to find out DPR was in open rebellion of Ukraine for 8+ years.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      it was never a rebellion. This was a hybrid war. Russians invaded in 2014

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      there was never a rebellion in the east. It was all organized by Russia from the beginning

  8. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    this war will most likely end with:
    >crimea is internationally recognized as russian, no more ukranian claims
    >everything else is ukranian, no more russian claims
    >DPR/LPR are ukrainian, but mostly demilitarized and have some semblance of civilian autonomy
    >western gov sanctions lifted from russia
    >ukraine joins EU
    >ukraine doesn't join NATO for the next N years (but in practice weapons keep flowing, with maybe some limitations on things like advanced AA and such)
    this will happen in 1-2 years at most, screencap this

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      gov sanctions lifted from russia
      lol, lmao

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        most private companies will most likely continue to sanction russia and avoid any sort of investments for many, many years to come

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          >private

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      also,
      >ukraine gets lots of $$ for rebuilding

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        that's what he mentioned by getting into the EU

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        Probably going to end up with all of Russia's seized US-based assets. Imagine losing $300 billion because you were stupid enough to put it in your enemy's banks.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          >Imagine losing $300 billion because you were stupid enough to put it in your enemy's banks.
          And that's just the Russian state assets. The oligarchs frozen assets will become Ukrainian too.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >crimea is internationally recognized as russian, no more ukranian claims
      x to doubt

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Maybe this would have been the case a few months ago
      At the rate its going in a years time putin is going to have to beg nato to stop ukraine taking moscow

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Not after the invasion and the annexation, no.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Puccia isn't getting sanctions lifted off it for at least 30-50 years mate

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      This makes sense because each side can present it as a victory.

      Russia
      >We got international recognition of Crimea!
      >We "liberated" DPR and LPR!
      >No NATO for Ukraine!
      >Sanctions lifted!
      >VICTORY IS OURS RUSSIA STRONK!

      Ukraine
      >Russia completely BTFO!
      >Back to pre-war borders!
      >Lots of cash from the EU!
      >Lots of weapons from NATO, eventual NATO membership guaranteed!

      Of course Ukraine is the real winner here, the Russian "victory" is only to save face.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        Russia needs to get NO victory, they need to be humiliated or they will keep doing this shit over and over. Terrorism should never be rewarded

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          This isn’t a victory, they didn’t actually get ANYTHING, they’re back to where they were before the war with a humiliated and destroyed military, tens of thousands of casualties, literally no say in the world stage, and a collapsing economy. This is a 100% defeat, but it’s a defeat Putin can agree to because they can at least try to present it as good to the vatniks.

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            If the russian populace experiences this as a victory, no matter how factual, they will be more encouraged to support another military incursion. They need to suffer a proper defeat, and their noses need to be rubbed in it.

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            And before the war they were occupying territory in Ukraine, Georgia, Moldova, Kazakhstan and EU (Poland and Lithuania may argue about this one) and still do. This has to be dealt with, and not by ceding this territory to puccia.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        Ukraine is going to take back crimea

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          I think they could but it’s honestly not worth it.

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            to cuck russia out of their best port is reason enough to do it

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        >This makes sense because each side can present it as a victory.
        No it doesn't make any sense. There is absolutely no interest in any sort of russian victory.
        Vatniks are getting rekt and can't stop it.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        >the Russian "victory" is only to save face.
        too bad russia has no face to save. it'll be lucky to keep belgorod, kursk, and the kurils, which are all rightful ukrainian clay.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          >the kurils
          >rightful ukranian clay
          Not sure if retarded or based

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            I'm sure he was talking about Kuban but something in his brain short circuited. But you know what, lets talk how much territory russia owes other countries anyway:
            >Ukraine: Crimea, Donetsk, Lugansk, Kherson (within 1991 borders, more if you count ethnic lands)
            >Poland and Lithuania: Kaliningrag
            >Moldova: Transnistria
            >Georgia: Abkhasia and Osetia
            >Japan: Kuril islands
            >China: Valdivostok
            What else?

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              >Kaliningrag
              Speaking of, have they decided to secede yet considering everyone keeps cockblocking Russia from sending them anything.

              • 2 months ago
                Anonymous

                Just talked to mum there, they're in full blown vatnik mode, donating to "crowdfunding gear for mobilized" scams...

              • 2 months ago
                Anonymous

                Rip, this is the perfect time to make something happen instead of kowtowing to them.

              • 2 months ago
                Anonymous

                I'm a few thousands kilometers away and never going back, anon. I haven't been to Mordor in over a decade and I'd rather kill ten people than go back.

              • 2 months ago
                Anonymous

                Damn, would have never thought to meet someone on here who was born there too lmao

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              That's a pretty reasonable map and list. Though hard to see it coming about without a general breakup of the Russian Empire and its feudal vassals into overall free republics.

              If Moscow was nuked and then Russian warheads all failed/were intercepted it'd honestly probably be better for the Russian people long term.

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              Karelia and Salla for Finland, although I doubt they want those shitholes back.

              • 2 months ago
                Anonymous

                Ouch, how could I forget those. And yes, at least based on self-proclaimed finns on the interwebs, Finland doesn't want Karelia back, russia turned it into a dirty depressed region over the years and all Finnish were evacuated after the war anyway.
                So it will take a lot of time and money to fix that place and thats without dealing with russians which currently inhabit it.

              • 2 months ago
                Anonymous

                Secure the border, pay the Russian inhabitants to leave. Focus heavily on families and single women, let demographic collapse aid you. Karelia already lost ~100k population since the fall of the USSR. No one can complain about ethnic cleasing because it's a voluntary process.

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              Estonia - Petserimaa
              altho reclaiming it would have to entail genocide of resident vatmorons and in this day and age it wouldnt fly

              • 2 months ago
                Anonymous

                No need to Genocide, just don't issue citizenship unless they learn Estonian (and leave returning to Russia as something they can always do). Any True Vatnik will balk at learning an 'inferior' language, so won't be able to get citizenship and might just head back to whatever borders Russia has left.

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              >What else?
              Maybe the Buryats could join Mongolia?

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              Königsberg is rightful German clay, Poolander.

              • 2 months ago
                Anonymous

                I say we give it to the swedes for the meme of it

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              Finland - Karelia and parts of Kola

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              >Poland and Lithuania: Kaliningrag
              You can tell a plumber typed this post.

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            after ww2, the soviet union relocated a bunch of ukrainians to its newly-conquered kuril islands. they're majority ukrainian ethnicity, which means that by russia's own rules they are rightful ukrainian clay (or rock, since i don't think the kurils have much clay)

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous
          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            Why not both?

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              >the kurils
              >rightful ukranian clay
              Not sure if retarded or based

              tell you what guys, if russia gives up their claims to sovereignty over crimea, luhansk, donetsk, zaporizhia, and kherson based on their ethnic russian population, then ukraine will give up its claims on the kuril islands based on their ethnic ukrainian population. deal?

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        >>Back to pre-war borders!
        I don't think you understand when the war started.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        He who controls Crimea controls the future of humanity.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        Ukraine's not gonna be content with pre-war borders now. They could've accepted that early on, maybe, but now? Sunk cost fallacy. Same for R*ssia. Pre-2014 borders or bust.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      This war has been difficult to predict. So I'm not going to try beyond vagueries. Now to make a liar of myself:

      Somewhat.
      >Crimea is not recognized as Russian, but Ukraine is less supported in trying to take it. It's can kicked down the road, lots of habloblo about negotiations over its status.
      >Donbebwe and the like are returned to Ukraine with agreeements on autonomous status.
      >Putin presents it as he won't sacrifice Russian lives to help faithless traitors who were willing to fight Ukraine to the last Russian, not willing to fight themselves.
      >Ukraine joins EU
      >Ukraine does not join NATO, but gets some kind of tact agreement with Poland/UK/ect. that if they are invaded again they will aid them.
      Sanctions are not all disappearing until Putin is dead, but some may be relaxed.

      This is not what I want, this is just what I expect. Even Biden is talking about letting Putin have some face-saving gesture.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        I think this is not unrealistic, I would expand/differ on the following points though.
        >Crimea, if it is ever returned, will be granted autonomous status; that was already the plan anyway. Ukraine's best chance of retaking it may be to capitalize on vatnik flight and overwhelming momentum following a Southern blitzkrieg, if they stall out too hard then this will not work. At this point I suspect Ukraine may opt for a more diplomatic approach that includes further UKR concessions.
        >Donbabwe and Luganda don't get real autonomy, not after all the shit they've pulled. Maybe a nominal facade. Many of their pro-RU supporters have been wiped out at this point and a large number of the pro-Ukraine supporters who were kicked out a few years ago will want to return. By the end of it I suspect LDPR will be in no position to be demanding compromises.
        >LDPR will probably not be demilitarized. I doubt Russia finds a demilitarized LDPR much more acceptable than a militarized one and they lack any bargaining power short of MUH NOOOOKERIES.
        >Unless Russia credibly threatens NOOOOOKS I don't think Ukraine will easily back down on NATO. They've suffered a lot for it and EU owes them quite a bit.
        >Sanctions will be relaxed on the basis of what is most beneficial for the west, not Russia. There will be little global compassion for poor poor Rossiya until they own up to their mistakes and make a genuine effort to unfuck themselves. Imports of sophisticated military technology will remain banned.
        >Georgia may consider taking back its territory in the wake of Russia's expeditionary collapse, Ukraine may be willing to help.
        >Japan retaking Kuril islands is plausible but not extremely likely. May be negotiated diplomatically.
        >chudtria ("I identify as Russian") becomes a cold shitshow that no one knows what to do with, Armenia becomes a hot shitshow that no one knows what to do with.
        >Kazakhstan: I GO TO AMERICA (or at least try)

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        >Even Biden is talking about letting Putin have some face-saving gesture.
        I'm sure Macron has been trying to pull him in that direction for a while. Especially with more nuke rhetoric coming up.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Right after everyone who isn't russi said that they do not recognise any puccian claims on UA terrotory?
      ESPECIALLY after russia showcased how much of a weak failure it is?
      Nobody would give them a damn thing, russkies no longer have the power or even perceived power to make demands.
      So cratch Crimea part and add contribution from russia to the list

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Will end in
      >Crimea recovered by Ukranie - not that I care, they are both Slavs
      >Russia's military prestige taken so low that Japan claims the Kuriles again - by threat of force (inb4 "muh SDF can't operate outside homeland", they will say they are retaking homeland) - not that I care, they are yellows vs slavs
      >Ukraine does whatever the fuck wants to do with its provinces - not that I care, they are slavs
      >Russian provinces next to Ukraine turned into DMZs
      >EU buttfucks Russia once they are no longer dependant of Russian gas (FYI, several southern countries use nowadays more solar or wind energy than gas, Russian or otherwise, and are pressuring Germany and others to stop being retards and foillow their lead now that Putin's bribes are no longer flooding the Bundestag) - not that I care for Russia, they are slavs
      >Ukraine joins EU - which causes russian war reparations to Ukraine to make the EU richer (color me surprised here)
      >Nato keeps rejecting Ukraine entry as they have been doing for years by now (because they are retards, if they had acepted them this trololo wouldn't have happened), a little bit of trivia that most Russian shills pontificating about "NATO proxy wars" seem to forget

      Screencap THAT, too.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        >Nato keeps rejecting Ukraine entry
        They are literally about to accept them into NATO with some restrictions until the war is over.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          substantiate your claims

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            Okay, I was a bit wrong on them accepting them with some restrictions, but Ukraine's newest bid is being fast-tracked and several allies back it.
            https://www.euractiv.com/section/defence-and-security/news/nine-nato-allies-back-ukraines-path-to-membership/
            https://www.politico.com/news/2022/09/30/zelenzkyy-ukraine-nato-putin-annexations-00059782
            https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/09/30/ukraine-application-nato-russia-war/

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              Thanks for posting the links but it was pretty much expected for CEE to support Ukraine's application. Western states are still going to need a lot of convincing (or to wait for the war to end) to solidly back it though.

              • 2 months ago
                Anonymous

                My bet is that Ukraine will be accepted into NATO the moment the war ends officially. Also, Orban and especially Erdogan can be little pieces of shit and delay the accession.

              • 2 months ago
                Anonymous

                >Orban and especially Erdogan can be little pieces of shit and delay the accession.

                Fuck em, kick them both out, get Cyprus to join instead, so we have somewhere close to the Middle East, and kick the roaches out of there too. The whole island becomes a massive NATO aircraft carrier and Ergoroach seethes.

              • 2 months ago
                Anonymous

                lol retard

                turkey is more valuable to NATO than uk and germany put together

              • 2 months ago
                Anonymous

                Erdogan will let Ukraine in because his MIC has ties to their MIC. Orban will be gelded.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        https://i.imgur.com/q74Dh6q.gif

        this war will most likely end with:
        >crimea is internationally recognized as russian, no more ukranian claims
        >everything else is ukranian, no more russian claims
        >DPR/LPR are ukrainian, but mostly demilitarized and have some semblance of civilian autonomy
        >western gov sanctions lifted from russia
        >ukraine joins EU
        >ukraine doesn't join NATO for the next N years (but in practice weapons keep flowing, with maybe some limitations on things like advanced AA and such)
        this will happen in 1-2 years at most, screencap this

        >Ukraine say no sweetie :^)
        >Russia lose
        >Russia collapse
        Do you really think Ukraine cares about the length of the war? What can Russia even do? Nukes? Yeah that is how you fuck by NATO

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          >Nukes? Yeah that is how you fuck by NATO
          Rhetoric like that from both sides kills billions. Strategically, even if all of Ukraine was pacified, and then annexed into Russia, it wouldn't matter because Ukraine is a demographic shithole that'll have the population of Pennsylvania by the end of the century, and already has a GDP per capita lower than Namibia and half that of Iraq BEFORE the invasion. Now it has a GDP per capita lower than Sub-Saharan Africa.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      This to me would have been the outcome during the summer stalemate and pre-annexation.

      Now the Russian military is crumbling and Putin has torpedoed diplomacy with annexations no one recognizes. If things continue like this I can see nothing but a total Russian defeat.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >crimea is internationally recognized as russian, no more ukranian claims
      Not even fucking Iran recognizes it as such.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      What? Europe still has sanction up from 2014, Russia never fully recovered its economy from a Pre 2014 state because of them

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      No, i will not screencap it because its fucking retarded and you smell

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      No foreful change in borders will ever be recognized. Crimea will never be recognized Russian, unless it goes back to Ukraine and Ukraine itself wants to hold a referendum there and let them go out of their own will. Everything else is a cope.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >crimea is internationally recognized as russian, no more ukranian claims
      >western gov sanctions lifted from russia

      Haha, no.
      I could see the West not willing to help Ukraine take Crimea by force (by stopping the much needed economic support if they try), and try and get a diplomatic solution, such as independence, autonomy, a true referendum, or maybe facilitate an uprising against Russia, but there's no way they straight away grant it to Russia after starting the biggest war in Europe since WWII. Russia will not be allowed to get a sliver of gain after all this; it's going to turn into an example not to start shit anywhere close to the first world.
      Sanctions will be relaxed depending on Russia's behavior, but it will take a lot to lift them.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        By the time Ukraine is in position to assault Crimea it's unlikely Russia will be able to put up meaning resistance for long. Plus Ukraine doesn't need all of Crimea to fuck over Russia's ambitions.

        >crimea is internationally recognized as russian, no more ukranian claims
        Can Russia actually defend it?

        >Russia deploys everything to the Crimean land bridge
        >Ukraine pulls off an airborne and amphibious landing on Crimea's northwestern coast and flanks them

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        >Russia will not be allowed to get a sliver of gain after all this; it's going to turn into an example not to start shit anywhere close to the first world.
        Fucking this. You people are retarded if you think the EU is going to back down at this point, it literally cannot afford to be seen to reward warmongering.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        >Russia will not be allowed to get a sliver of gain after all this; it's going to turn into an example not to start shit anywhere close to the first world.
        This.

        Russia is going to receive a brutal punishment beating and the whole time, USA is going to be staring China in the eyes and telling them "take a good look, this is what happens if you start shit around Taiwan or the South Sea, make sure you remember what happens next..."

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >crimea is internationally recognized as russian, no more ukranian claims
      Can Russia actually defend it?

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Ukraine will join NATO or declare the Budapest Memorandum voided and immediately re-develop nuclear weapons. Those are the only choices.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Everything points to West being ready to support Ukraine to reclaim its pre-2014 borders. There will be no negotiations with this Russian government and after Putin gets the Gaddafi treatment, the war will become a factional war between Russian power cliques and shift from Ukraine to Russia proper. Russia has already lost in Ukraine, so the West should get ready for the post-Putin era chaos.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Nah, this is what they would have gotten before the annexation, now they're not getting shit. All land goes back to pre-2014 borders, Russia gets sanctions lifted and doesn't have to pay reparations but has to return all kidnapped civillians, Ukraine gets gibs from USA/EU to rebuild, probably joins NATO or at least gets security guarantees

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        Ukraine mic needs to be rebuilt. Real security begins at home.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          that was going to be the plan from the beginning. ZSU and Ukie MoD have already drawn up some white papers for it and I believe even have some working in neighboring countries on the downlow, until the time comes for them to come back to home soil.

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            Tank and aircraft production are likely high priority considering what a pain it was to get outside help there. They literally had to steal a tank force.

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              p much this, tanks and aircraft are first priority. Would be nice if they could get HATO designs for their kit as well to build

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        >Russia gets sanctions lifted and doesn't have to pay reparations
        not happening, not after bucha and mariupol

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >western gov sanctions lifted from russia
      Not unless russia
      >Demilitarizes extensively and transparently (western observers allowed everywhere), nukes probably allowed to counter china but under supervision and far fewer of them
      >Institutes true democratic reforms and has free elections with a non-nationalist, democratic government elected
      >Puts everyone responsible for the ukraine war and everyone involved in war crimes over to the hague
      This is only for the harshest sanctions to be lifted. Further lifting of sanctions only when russian democracy proves stable and nonagressive for several years.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        Puccia isn't getting sanctions lifted off it for at least 30-50 years mate

        >crimea is internationally recognized as russian, no more ukranian claims
        >western gov sanctions lifted from russia

        Haha, no.
        I could see the West not willing to help Ukraine take Crimea by force (by stopping the much needed economic support if they try), and try and get a diplomatic solution, such as independence, autonomy, a true referendum, or maybe facilitate an uprising against Russia, but there's no way they straight away grant it to Russia after starting the biggest war in Europe since WWII. Russia will not be allowed to get a sliver of gain after all this; it's going to turn into an example not to start shit anywhere close to the first world.
        Sanctions will be relaxed depending on Russia's behavior, but it will take a lot to lift them.

        A certain lifting of sanctions will be necessary to throw russia a carrot for changing its behaviour. You can't tell them "democratize now and your life starts getting better a couple years later", that won't work. The deal must be "better behaviour now (including a lot to make sure russia does not become a threat again) for less sanctions = better life now".

        Frankly, I don't think it matters because russia won't take that deal. They're retarded and stubborn and deeply distrustful of the west, they will rather become a second north korea than give the west credible assurances they won't be a threat again. And without that, the sanctions cannot be lifted.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          >You can't tell them "democratize now and your life starts getting better a couple years later", that won't work.
          It worked for Germany and France.

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            When?

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        This is absolutely retarded reddit fantasy. It would be demanding the removal of any Russian leverage in the HOPE that eventually the west will relent. The continued brutal sanctions will serve to make most economic activity unviable because as we know crippling poverty is conducive to democratic governance . The only way an agreement like this is signed is in the smoking wreckage of Moscow and the most likely outcome is another revanchist regime once sanctions are removed 20 years down the line when public sentiment has long moved on everywhere but Russia.

        [...]
        [...]
        A certain lifting of sanctions will be necessary to throw russia a carrot for changing its behaviour. You can't tell them "democratize now and your life starts getting better a couple years later", that won't work. The deal must be "better behaviour now (including a lot to make sure russia does not become a threat again) for less sanctions = better life now".

        Frankly, I don't think it matters because russia won't take that deal. They're retarded and stubborn and deeply distrustful of the west, they will rather become a second north korea than give the west credible assurances they won't be a threat again. And without that, the sanctions cannot be lifted.

        I have no idea why so many anons have fallen into the trap of “Putin says the west wants to destroy the Russian people, let’s prove him right! That’ll get the Russian to come around!”

        All it does is give Putin a stronger position.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          >removal of any Russian leverage in the HOPE that eventually the west will relent
          It may have escaped you, but Russia has zero leverage as it is. It is sanctioned to isolation because it is a threat, the kind we would be invading and occupying right now if not for russian nukes. We're doing this to protect ourselves from russia, not to hurt russia. Once russia proves that we have no need to do that, the sanctions can be, slowly, lifted. It does not need to endanger itself for that - as I said, the nukes would probably remain, if only to defend against china, and that makes a western invasion impossible too (even if wanted to, which we really rather wouldn't). And as I said, the regime would be such that russian life improves instantly the moment it moves credibly into that direction.

          But yeah, I understand your point. Russia does not understand that the west wants to merely not be harmed by russia, and maybe do some business too. Russia thinks it's us or them and that is why they will become a new north korea, and my suggestions about a way out of that are indeed purely hypothetical - a reddit fantasy for one who would honestly hope for it.

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            >Russia has zero leverage as it is
            They have a large nuclear arsenal, a large conventional military, and control over a significant amount of the energy market. Any of those could be overcome with varying amounts of pain, but that pain still factors into the calculus of western decision making.

            > the regime would be such that russian life improves instantly the moment it moves credibly into that direction.
            After years of brutal sanctions it would take decades for a nation to recover. You’d be replicating the circumstances that gave Putin the power he has.

            > We're doing this to protect ourselves from russia, not to hurt russia
            This is the best point, cripple them so they can’t be a threat. But that doesn’t work on a nation with a large nuclear arsenal. Because as long as they have those missiles they are a threat.

            > Russia does not understand that the west wants to merely not be harmed by russia, and maybe do some business too. Russia thinks it's us or them
            Under the scheme you’re proposing it would be. Sanctions aren’t just a switch you flip. Factories that have been shut down for years can’t just be restarted. The population can’t just sit in stasis until the day the sanctions drop.

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              >a large nuclear arsenal
              As does the United States, who effectively zero's out the threat of Russian nukes. It's either no nukes, or the USA and Russia destroy the world. the USA has been very clear about that, or at the very least, destroying Russian military power for a generation or more within the week, conventionally, and trivially.
              >a large conventional military
              Certainly a large conscript base. But oops! All of the professionals fucking died in the war, or ARE dying in the war as we speak, and being replaced with conscriptniki. Oops!
              >and control over a significant amount of the energy market
              And unless you're India, China, or some other non-aligned nation, guess what! It doesn't matter anymore. The decoupling of Russian energy from the main markets of Europe is already occurring. They already played those cards! It's too late to pretend that it can hurt any more than it already has, since it's already over.
              The pain of nukes is zero'd out by Americans, the pain of Russia's army is zero'd out by its own failures in this war, and the pain of energy has already happened. There's no leverage left.

              • 2 months ago
                Anonymous

                None of that is correct. As I said
                > Any of those could be overcome with varying amounts of pain, but that pain still factors into the calculus of western decision making.
                The American nuclear arsenal does not “zero out” Russia’s nuclear arsenal. It does not prevent them from using it, it merely highly discourages them from doing so. And that very much plays into western decision making. For example the Biden administration has refused to send certain weapons systems out of fear of a nuclear escalation. That is leverage. While Russian conventional forces have proved themselves inept, destroying them is not a bloodless affair. That is leverage.

                > aligned nation, guess what! It doesn't matter anymore. The decoupling of Russian energy from the main markets of Europe is already occurring. They already played those cards! It's too late to pretend that it can hurt any more than it already has, since it's already over.
                This is pure ignorance. Russian gas imports to Europe have been reduced not stopped. With OPEC+ Having decided to cut production the pain is very much not over. If Russia decided to fully turn off the taps it would be ruinous for them, but the west would absolutely experience far worse pain than have already.

              • 2 months ago
                Anonymous

                The leverage those provide are minor at best. Nuclear escalation is a game that ends in Russia being annihilated. Its only a question of how much the West is willing to entertain the notion of diplomacy with Putin that we are limiting our support. The leverage is more with China in that we need to put up a display of support and not outright proxy warfare.

                In terms of natural gas, Europe is already securing enough alternative production that a crisis is highly unlikely. Obviously OPEC is going to put the boot to them for money, but that is in the grand scheme of things minor. The big problem for Putin is that if he does indeed cut all gas, he has lost his biggest revenue stream, which would rapidly turn his peers against him as they fight over the increasingly small pie.

                In a vacuum, sure there could be a deal made. But Ukraine is winning the war, Russia is losing the war. and that is only becoming more obvious as time goes on. Public opinion in both the US and Europe is still very pro Ukrainian. Unless people start freezing to death, the outcome is certain.

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              >They have a large nuclear arsenal
              they claim to have large nuclear arsenal. not the same thing.
              >a large conventional military
              the had a large conventional military. for some reason russia decided to convert it into scrap metal and sunflower fertilizer.
              >control over a significant amount of the energy market
              once again you seem to be forgetting that history didn't stop in feb 2022.

              • 2 months ago
                Anonymous

                >they claim to have large nuclear arsenal. not the same thing.
                Yeah that’s not a gamble that could have pretty huge repercussions.
                >the had a large conventional military. for some reason russia decided to convert it into scrap metal and sunflower fertilizer.
                Shitty and nonexistent are the same thing!
                >once again you seem to be forgetting that history didn't stop in feb 2022.
                And you seem to have not paid attention to anything that has happened since February 2022.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        gov sanctions lifted from russia
        They won't. Western world saves more money from reducing Russia to 4th world country then it does from taxes.
        I don't get this cope by retarded pro-Russians. You WON'T go back to 2021 days.You WON'T go back to your normal everyday life. Sanctions will pound you back to 20th century where you rightfully belong. There is NO way Russia exit this war will any resemblance of prosperity for next 40 years.
        This is rightful punishment for funding extreme far right and left in EU and USA.
        Dildo of consequences rarely comes lubed.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      What's actually going to happen:
      >Ukraine recovers all rightful clay
      >including Crimea but that will take longer
      >Ukraine is built up with the defenses of 40k's Terra
      >sanctions persist until Russia admits it owns nothing in Ukraine (hint: they never will)
      >Ukraine joins NATO
      >all Russian security assurances evaporate
      >Russia dissolves
      >Brots send in sniper teams to secure nuclear material before bad guys abscond with it
      >they blow off the arm of an arms dealer
      >but the nukes are already out
      >dissolution of Russian security assurances leads to widespread revolt across countries that previously enjoyed said assurances
      >America invades one of these countries to keep in power a western sympathizer
      >enemy forces turn out to have a nuke and they use it during the war
      >MI6 tracks down the arms dealer that supplied the nuke
      >it was the guy whose arm got blown off X years ago
      >they track down his son to draw him out
      >son kills himself
      >dad is PISSED
      >commands an old Russian nuke silo
      >launches the nuke at America
      >combined British and American task force storms the control room
      >disarm the nuke in the air and attempt to exfil
      >they get got by the arms dealer
      >all but two die before arms dealer is rekt by Ukrainian SF

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        I mean the CoD writers were right about Russians committing war crimes in 2019 game and the Russians bitching hard about it/crying they would never do warcrimes or celebrate them. Ironically, the writers were vindicated.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          They were vindicated anyway. All of Russian warfare history is littered with war crimes. Even populations they moved through but weren't actually warring against still suffered at their hands.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          In an ironic way, MW19 ended up being an extremely pro-russian game. The MW19 russias are everything the modern russians wish they were: competent and brutal. The MW19 russian army would BTFO the IRL one and still have time to commit war crimes.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          Wait, so how is CoD going to depict Ukrainians then? The American Military's BFF, regularly participating in joint operations?

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            Would not be surprised at all.

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            The protagonist will probably run into his Ukrainian-bro as soon as he gets in-theater. They'll have some cool guy interaction (picrel) which will transition into the Ukrainian giving the player the plot rundown (this mostly be an explanation for why Russia is not a joke in-universe: probably the cliche "new strongman" who consolidated his position through hyper-nationalism and revachism, who is exploiting Russia's natural resources to pay for his new war machine--- the only change will be that this time it's lithium, not oil)
            The Ukraine-bro will be the best character in the game by far and he will almost certainly die at the end of the second mission in circumstances that demand avenging.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      It's funny that this is getting mixed responses here but it's actually arguably more pro-Russian in effect than Musk's hypothetical that everyone sneeded over

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >implying US will let vatnik retards keep Crimea.

      Crimea is gonna have the biggest fucking American naval base in Easter Europe my dude. The Blak Sea will be an American lake and the Russians will have to get used to it.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        Not to mention it will be absolutely packed with Ukrainian shipyards assembling new Ukrainian naval craft at a frightening speed.

        Ukraine MUST protect its ocean and maritime fleets from interference, especially in the event America is preoccupied by a war with China.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        No way Crimea is ever going to become a US Naval Base, not in this century at least. Ukraine will take control and use it's ports to dominate the Black sea and to trade with Turkey, Georgia, Romania, Bulgaria, and more than likely Russia. Additionally, if turkey and Ukraine control the entrance of the black sea, you can expect NATO war ships conducting 24/7 patrols.

        I don't believe Russia will ever maintain dominance in the black sea once Sevastopol is in Ukraine hands.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        We don't need Crimea as a naval base. The only reason the US would want a substantial naval presence in the Black Sea is if there was some regional crisis, in which case, I imagine Ukraine would be very willing to free up dock space for the USN.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          What might the new Ukraine Navy look like? I know they have corvettes from Turkey coming in but I can't imagine them operating any heavy ships in their inventory. Frigates and corvettes with a heavy focus on anti-ship/anti-air supplemented with future drone/very-low-crew direct combat ships like Sea Hunter and like stuff?

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            Given that Ukraine is not a rich nation and its immediate concern doesn't extend past the Black Sea, the three corvettes they've got on order, one or two frigates purchased second hand, some missile boats and fast attack craft, a few minelayers/sweepers, auxillary vessels as needed, and a decently sized land based naval air arm and defence batteries. Probably no more than 25-30 vessels total. Within a decade and a half, depending on their economy, they'll start a replacement and expansion program with eyes to expand naval presence to the Med, north Atlantic, and Horn of Africa, and join in on NATO operations.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      gov sanctions lifted from russia
      hahahahahahahah

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      You do know Minsk agreements failed right? Cause that's literally Minsk kek.

  9. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    I doubt their status will be determined by fighting. Russia will either manage to freeze the conflict and hold on to them, or more likely will withdraw and Ukraine moves in.

  10. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    I think at this point what people arguing pro-Russia aren't considering is what it means if Ukraine actually gets that far. It won't be like a reset to 2014, because the very fact that Ukraine in this scenario has pushed that far means Russia has utterly collapsed. Ukraine will be high on victory, with momentum, by that point a stupendously hardened and experienced, well equipped modern army, and fully unified nation behind it. If Russia wanted to reset the clock and keep Crimea even let alone those two, the time to do it would be NOW. Or better yet this summer, before all the current victories. If they wait until Ukraine has already completely crushed them, crushed the "land bridge", has done 99% of the work, undoubtedly uncovered numerous more atrocities along the way, and is now breathing on the door it's too fucking late. Might be "years of defenses" but that's still heavily dependent on Ukraine being much weaker and Russia stronger. Ukraine with high precision modern weapons and drones and intel will pick it part. Ukraine also has no reason to hold back, they can cut the Crimea bridge and fresh water and everything.

    So yeah, if it actually gets that far it's already over and Russia is getting 100% evicted and fast too. Though undoubtedly snowgeria will once again threaten NOOOOOOOKS at that point.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >Ukraine will be high on victory, with momentum, by that point a stupendously hardened and experienced, well equipped modern army, and fully unified nation behind it.
      Also a nation that is sick of war. Not kiddin. They may push the borders to the next town by "we advooonced and took it, it's now ours", but I don't see the Ukrainian populace being in support of conquering Russia. I might be wrong, however, and it's somewhat likely that they deliberately claim a sizeable buffer zone.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        I have no idea what you're fucking talking about anon? I only said Ukraine would take back all its territory, not just stop at pre-invasion#1 borders. I didn't say they'd try to conquer Russia and I don't think they will. They don't need to, kicking Russia out completely is enough. They can secure and fortify after that, their trajectory is far better then Russia, they just need time to capitalize on that. In 5 years let alone 10 they'll be untouchable and it'll take a generation or three of peace before that starts to slacken. Meanwhile Russia governance, demographics and economics will continue the plunge down the cliff.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Ukrainians are fucking done with talk!

  11. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    If they regain all the pre-invasion territory they should march to moscow and burn it down.

  12. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    They're just going to go through Russia to get around the rear of the trench line and then collapse it from the east.

    Maginot strats are in play.

  13. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    The BEST (for Russia) scenario on the table for Crimea is a demilitarized and autonomously administered neutral region.

    Perhaps a demilitarized region under Ukrainian administration with Visa-less travel for puccians

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Ukraine won't accept any demilitarized areas because that would allow Russia to just invade again later.

  14. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    I expect Kherson to fall before the onset of Winter. Ukies will consolidate gains and shore up Bhakmut defences if it hasn't fallen. Winter will be an attritional but low level struggle. Russian morale will be completely bumfucked by the time spring arrives. Winter will see increased partisan and SOF activity with the long hours of darkness. Once Russians that Evropa hasn't frozen to death they'll lose hope. By Summer 2023 when the ground has dried out, UA will drive straight through from Western Luhansk, Kherson and Zhaporizia. They'll go around or take Melitopol, cut off Crimea and then siege Mariupol. Game over. 100k plus Vatniks/Mobiks will die.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      if we count donbabweans 100k+ have died already.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >I expect Kherson to fall before the onset of Winter.
      I wouldn't be so sure. I'd love to be wrong, but it's going to be a hard nut to crack. I don't believe it will happen soon.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        >it's going to be a hard nut to crack. I don't believe it will happen soon.
        The ukies have plenty of HIMARS to keep shafting the russian resupply efforts to the area and the only russian reinforcements will be untrained zero-morale conscripts.
        I don't see the russian army lasting long in such an indefensible position.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          I can see them retreating into Kherson's urban core to use the city's population as hostage against artillery, but I also see Ukraine's response being to sweep the outskirts and using artillery to hit Russian positions deep on the other side of the river.

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            Use partisans to knife the vatniks.

            • 2 months ago
              Anonymous

              We need to find the shills after the war and ensure they're killed as subversives. That's wise strategy and the records of their work will be traceable with AI. They imagine that cannot happen because (by the quality of their posts) it's obvious they're primitive even by Russian standards.

              • 2 months ago
                Anonymous

                Or at least that fucker dugin.

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            ukraine will use paratroopers to take the nova khakovka dam and bridge.

  15. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    They will never take them lol

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous
  16. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    What do you think those defenses are? They're sandbags and ditches not concrete bunkers and birds nests

  17. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Well, things have slowed down a bit. Perhaps because the Ukies are rotating fresh soldiers in to relieve the battle groups who took Kharkiv (and who are now, essentially, beseiging Kherson.)

    Maybe in a week or two (heh heh) the Russian Mapmakers will find their life getting suddenly more hectic again.

  18. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    On a happier note, Ukraine is about to have a culinary revival (cherries, grapes, watermelon)

  19. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    I wonder what the actual demographics situation of those occupied regions of Lugansk and Donetsk are.
    >initial uprising
    >not-Russian invasion
    >8 years of civil war
    >Pre-war evacuations
    >Mobilization

    Who is even left there?
    40+ women adn 80+ men(all two of them)?

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Donbabwe and Lughanda are Women's Republics right now.
      If Russia wins this war, I am 100% positive that Russia will start a "Wive-Selling Progrom" to give Chinese men "Russian" wives as a sign of goodwill.
      If Ukraine wins, expect the same, but to the Polish.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        Ukraine will start a breeding program post-war. Much impregnation will ensue.

  20. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    I would rather see the world ending in a nuclear apocalypse than letting big countries do whatever they want as if this is the 19th century or something. It was bad enough with Iraq and now this. Just nuke everything already.

  21. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    2-3 years. Sone will be taken by force, rest, primary Crimea , will be rejoining Ukraine trough diplomatic means.

    Crimea out of all of them have chance to be semi autonomous region, like Hong Kong used to be in China, two systems one country, that was already in initial plans by the government after results of legal referendums that Ukraine held before 2014 Russian annexation happened.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Nah, fuck it. Deport all r*ssians and r*ssian sympathizers. They like africa with snow so much, then they should fuck off back there. Do this in all western countries and I guarantee most of the political retardation of the last decade or so would stop.

  22. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    I think Ukraine should begin asserting its independence from Russia in other ways.

    Apparently watermelon is known in Ukraine, but not a commonly used ingredient (slices, squares, juice, etc.) in its cuisine.

    Same with cherries. They're known to Ukraine but also not a common culinary ingredient.

    Ukraine needs to start creating more dishes that have absolutely no ties to the Vatniks.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Cherry Watermelon Pasta ala Kyiv

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        Russia, unsurprisingly, doesn't seem to be a fruit-centric cuisine culture.

        The addition of fruit-heavy dishes and increased use of fruit in Ukrainian cuisine would make an easy way to tell apart Ukrainian food from Russian.

        It would also have the national security bonus of making Ukrainians HEALTHIER than Russians.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >Same with cherries. They're known to Ukraine but also not a common culinary ingredient.
      Are you kidding me? Its used a lot in desserts, from varenyky to cakes. Cherry trees have a big cultural significance too, one of the most famous pieces of Ukrainian poetry which is generally regarded as a depiction of idyllic life and family starts with the passage about cherry trees.

  23. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    >How long do you think it will take Ukraine to seize the pre-2014 borders in Donetsk and Luhansk?
    Honestly I don't think they can unless they get way better arms transfers, I'm talking a zerg rush of F-16s

  24. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    should be done by May-June 2023

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