Don't know but due to its extended range, any leakers can be re-engaged by the cheaper and shorter ranged SM-2s and ESSMs, without needing to spend multiple SM-6s per incoming missile.
IOC was in 2013 >2014
SM-6 intercepted a supersonic sea skimmer surrogate and a mid range subsonic surrogate >2015
SM-6 kills a ballistic missile surrogate in terminal phase >2016
five targets knocked down in tests earlier in the year, then later hit a maneuvering MRBM surrogate, which the yanks claim means it can hit DF-21/26s >2017
Another MRBM killed >2021
engaged two MRBM's failed to hit one but struck the second.
So 10/11 intercepts = 90% success rate
CIWS is just a class of weapon systems. The Phalanx CIWS is rather shit and its intended use is as an "OH SHIT OH FUCK THAT MISSILE IS GONNA KILL US FIRE EVERYTHING" gun. It's not intended to be used except as a last resort.
The RAM CIWS is far more reliable using short range guided rockets to intercept instead of just chucking a bucket of bullets towards an incoming missile.
SeaRAM CIWS is quickly becoming the US standard for CIWS going forward and at this point going forward I doubt we see too many Phalanx CIWS installations.
Long term the navy is working on a 300-600kW laser CIWS for the DDG(X) in the mid to late 2030s or 2040s.
tl:dr CIWS can't offer reliable protection. Not even against subsonic missles. Especially not against modern hypersonic threats. Realistically it's over for you, mutt carrier.
Can you prove that or is that just your mental fantasy you decided sounded true?
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
if they have real low altitude hypersonics or reentry vehicles lasers won't work against them, but they don't have real low altitude hypersonics
I can demonstrate it if you give me a tile off of the space shuttle and let me borrow a laser CIWS system
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
>tile off of the space shuttle
do we need to remind you how fragile those were?
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
That was due to NASA mass autism, the thermal performance can be replicated or improved upon easily at the cost of mass
Lmao concentrated 600kw laser is not the same as atmospheric reentry.
should be the same order of magnitude, what's the spot size on the 600kW laser
remember that during reentry it had nowhere to radiate heat to, the laser only occupies a small part of the sky
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
>can be replicated or improved upon easily at the cost of mass
Ahh, good thing mass isn't a significant factor in missiles or anything
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
Your own chart shows a peak at 120W/cm2
We are talking about a 600,000W laser.
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
over what spot size?
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
Who the fuck knows because it's all classified as fuck. But you're insane if you think you can brush it off by bringing up shuttle reentry numbers.
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
Typically less than 1,000cm2 (about a square foot or so). Also, combat lasers tend to pulse, which increases peak thermal loading compared to overall average heating.
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
>. Also, combat lasers tend to pulse
Nah. Things that are currently designed for military applications they are all continuous power
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
> nowhere for the heat to radiate outwards
Firstly Heat resistant materials are insulating by nature, meaning that if you heat one part of the insulating layer, then the heat doesn’t easily dissipate to other areas.
secondlt , the rate at which heat is lost due to radiation is dependent on the temp differential between the surface and ambient temperature , surface area and a correlation of other factors. For a small area being heated by a laser , to radiate the amount of heat away that the laser is suppling would require a temperature differential that would melt the material anyway.
You clearly don’t understand how heat works.
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
radiate as in black body radiation, it gets hot and glows and this dumps heat back into the environment
can't do this during reentry as the surroundings are already glowing
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
Lmao concentrated 600kw laser is not the same as atmospheric reentry.
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
If it is already that hot then adding lasers into the mix will certainly not help
Either way COADE taught me that lasers are basically useless little flashlights even in space so I reckon a railgun based CIWS that can fire rounds very quickly might work better
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
The navy dropped all research and development work on the rail gun project last year and the navy and other branches are investing heavily into a high powered 600kW class laser, currently pouring hundreds of millions a year into it.
>the endless Chinese hypersonic shit posting
I genuinely believe this is an intel gathering attempt by the PRC. Is PrepHole really a space to try and up your standing on the world stage? Obviously no. >Post shitty US bad/China Navy stronk bait >enraged vet/AD USN posts counters >more shitty bait >spills classified spaghetti to prove why USN would stomp a haze-grey mudhole in the PLAN
Genuinely plausible. There's a reason most "hacking" is just asking an idiot for their credentials and why the principal intelligence gathering technique is still a whore with a tight cunt and a good memory.
lol no, carriers have decent manoeuvrability and their top speed is classified for a reason.
I've even heard that a CSG's operating speed is limited by the escort ships, not the carrier.
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
>I've even heard that a CSG's operating speed is limited by the escort ships, not the carrier.
Basically yes. Nuclear reactors don't particularly care about fuel efficiency so a CVN can run at flank speed until the propeller falls off. Conventional ships have an efficient cruising speed of ~20 knots or so and would only last a couple hours at full speed.
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
why do American radar suits and wirings look so primitive compared to the Chinese?
is there any electrical engineer left in mutt land? Or all the smart ones have become bankers?
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
The current generation of sensors are based on designs that were designed before integrated masts were a thing and many of the ships these sensors were designed for were built decades ago. So the non-integrated mast trend continues in the USN because we have a LOT of hardware designed for regular masts. We have SOME integrated mast hardware, but it's not applicable for everything, so even now we have new ship designs using integrated masts. This might eventually end, but the USN hasn't deemed it necessary enough to FORCE integrated mast adoption across the board.
A decade and a half before the Type 55 went into service, the US had ships with integrated masts(pic related), it's just not been done on the US destroyer yet (unless you count Zumwalt).
3 weeks ago
Anonymous
>using integrated masts
using non-integrated masts
Actually, a nuclear powered carrier could still move a mile or two between when a hypersonic missile launched and when it lands. A hypersonic might take 3-5 minutes to reach the carrier and the carrier moves at about 35 knots.
>Does not work reliably
Has there been an instance of CWIS not working and it NOT being due to some retard turning it off or it not being operational when entering the theatre of war in the first place?
Depends. RAM is quite good. Gun CIWS on ships is ass.
CIWS on land, when in the CRAM configuration is quite good for mortars and rockets.
Basically gun CIWS as envisioned for naval usage was a failure, but it developed useful technologies and turned out to be really, really useful for the army so it kinda worked out.
>Basically gun CIWS as envisioned for naval usage was a failure
Not a failure, just not as good as they'd like and is actively being replaced in favor of RAM systems that are far more effective.
These cruisers and destroyers are basically designed around air defense.
A better question is how exactly they will engage in surface warfare if they have to.
8 harpoons is pretty pathetic against pseudo aegis destroyers like the Chinese ships, presumably SM-2 and SM-6 will be the main anti-surface weapon.
No the better question is how is the Navy going to fight with the limited ammunition they have. The Navy doesn't even have enough missiles to fill the all the cells in the existing fleet. The PLAN doesn't even need to sink the USN to win. They can just missile spam with relatively inexpensive missiles until the USN runs out of AD and is forced to exit the theater of combat.
>what is soft kill for $1000?
This "missile swarm to overwhelm the fleet" shit posting is old. It's not a new threat. In fact, it's the primary threat AEGIS was designed and built to counter.
https://i.imgur.com/GUH9Uep.jpg
CIWS is a complete scam. Does not work reliably.
https://i.imgur.com/bz2UDXL.jpg
How does Aegis defeat ASM's beyond CIWS?
https://i.imgur.com/hW6A9Qp.jpg
CIWS is just a class of weapon systems. The Phalanx CIWS is rather shit and its intended use is as an "OH SHIT OH FUCK THAT MISSILE IS GONNA KILL US FIRE EVERYTHING" gun. It's not intended to be used except as a last resort.
The RAM CIWS is far more reliable using short range guided rockets to intercept instead of just chucking a bucket of bullets towards an incoming missile.
SeaRAM CIWS is quickly becoming the US standard for CIWS going forward and at this point going forward I doubt we see too many Phalanx CIWS installations.
Long term the navy is working on a 300-600kW laser CIWS for the DDG(X) in the mid to late 2030s or 2040s.
This is accurate. CIWS is an "oh shit" Hail Mary of a weapon system against ASMs. This is not exclusive to the US; this is every CIWS system.
ESSM, SM-2, SM-3, SM-6.
That's not including the array of countermeasures carried and queued by the Aegis system.
What's the intercept success rate?
(for SM-6)
Don't know but due to its extended range, any leakers can be re-engaged by the cheaper and shorter ranged SM-2s and ESSMs, without needing to spend multiple SM-6s per incoming missile.
It hasn't been fired in anger yet. The most recent action was USS Mason off Yemen, and she used SM-2s and ESSMs.
IOC was in 2013
>2014
SM-6 intercepted a supersonic sea skimmer surrogate and a mid range subsonic surrogate
>2015
SM-6 kills a ballistic missile surrogate in terminal phase
>2016
five targets knocked down in tests earlier in the year, then later hit a maneuvering MRBM surrogate, which the yanks claim means it can hit DF-21/26s
>2017
Another MRBM killed
>2021
engaged two MRBM's failed to hit one but struck the second.
So 10/11 intercepts = 90% success rate
SM-6
CIWS is a complete scam. Does not work reliably.
CIWS is just a class of weapon systems. The Phalanx CIWS is rather shit and its intended use is as an "OH SHIT OH FUCK THAT MISSILE IS GONNA KILL US FIRE EVERYTHING" gun. It's not intended to be used except as a last resort.
The RAM CIWS is far more reliable using short range guided rockets to intercept instead of just chucking a bucket of bullets towards an incoming missile.
SeaRAM CIWS is quickly becoming the US standard for CIWS going forward and at this point going forward I doubt we see too many Phalanx CIWS installations.
Long term the navy is working on a 300-600kW laser CIWS for the DDG(X) in the mid to late 2030s or 2040s.
tl:dr CIWS can't offer reliable protection. Not even against subsonic missles. Especially not against modern hypersonic threats. Realistically it's over for you, mutt carrier.
Then it's a good thing the CIWS is like the 3rd or 4th line of defense and not the one and only.
>Especially not against modern hypersonic threats.
Laser CIWS is faster than hypersonic.
The speed of light is hard to beat.
lasers don't work against things already hardened against hypersonic heat
Can you prove that or is that just your mental fantasy you decided sounded true?
if they have real low altitude hypersonics or reentry vehicles lasers won't work against them, but they don't have real low altitude hypersonics
I can demonstrate it if you give me a tile off of the space shuttle and let me borrow a laser CIWS system
>tile off of the space shuttle
do we need to remind you how fragile those were?
That was due to NASA mass autism, the thermal performance can be replicated or improved upon easily at the cost of mass
should be the same order of magnitude, what's the spot size on the 600kW laser
remember that during reentry it had nowhere to radiate heat to, the laser only occupies a small part of the sky
>can be replicated or improved upon easily at the cost of mass
Ahh, good thing mass isn't a significant factor in missiles or anything
Your own chart shows a peak at 120W/cm2
We are talking about a 600,000W laser.
over what spot size?
Who the fuck knows because it's all classified as fuck. But you're insane if you think you can brush it off by bringing up shuttle reentry numbers.
Typically less than 1,000cm2 (about a square foot or so). Also, combat lasers tend to pulse, which increases peak thermal loading compared to overall average heating.
>. Also, combat lasers tend to pulse
Nah. Things that are currently designed for military applications they are all continuous power
> nowhere for the heat to radiate outwards
Firstly Heat resistant materials are insulating by nature, meaning that if you heat one part of the insulating layer, then the heat doesn’t easily dissipate to other areas.
secondlt , the rate at which heat is lost due to radiation is dependent on the temp differential between the surface and ambient temperature , surface area and a correlation of other factors. For a small area being heated by a laser , to radiate the amount of heat away that the laser is suppling would require a temperature differential that would melt the material anyway.
You clearly don’t understand how heat works.
radiate as in black body radiation, it gets hot and glows and this dumps heat back into the environment
can't do this during reentry as the surroundings are already glowing
Lmao concentrated 600kw laser is not the same as atmospheric reentry.
If it is already that hot then adding lasers into the mix will certainly not help
Either way COADE taught me that lasers are basically useless little flashlights even in space so I reckon a railgun based CIWS that can fire rounds very quickly might work better
The navy dropped all research and development work on the rail gun project last year and the navy and other branches are investing heavily into a high powered 600kW class laser, currently pouring hundreds of millions a year into it.
Heat is additive, retard.
The missile is not going to be in effective range of the laser for more than a few seconds, so it better be in the megawatts.
The laser doesn't need to destroy the missile entirely, just damaging the sensors or control surfaces would be enough.
>someone puts time and effort into answering your question
>you ignore 90% of it just to shitpost
you are not allowed to ask why the quality of posting is going downhill on this site because YOU are part of why its happening.
>the endless Chinese hypersonic shit posting
I genuinely believe this is an intel gathering attempt by the PRC. Is PrepHole really a space to try and up your standing on the world stage? Obviously no.
>Post shitty US bad/China Navy stronk bait
>enraged vet/AD USN posts counters
>more shitty bait
>spills classified spaghetti to prove why USN would stomp a haze-grey mudhole in the PLAN
Works in Warthunder
Genuinely plausible. There's a reason most "hacking" is just asking an idiot for their credentials and why the principal intelligence gathering technique is still a whore with a tight cunt and a good memory.
Hypersonics are completely useless against anything but an extremely large, totally immobile target.
So a carrier? Even at maximum speed, it may as well be sitting still compared to a hypersonic.
The era of imperialist American naval dominance is over.
lol no, carriers have decent manoeuvrability and their top speed is classified for a reason.
I've even heard that a CSG's operating speed is limited by the escort ships, not the carrier.
>I've even heard that a CSG's operating speed is limited by the escort ships, not the carrier.
Basically yes. Nuclear reactors don't particularly care about fuel efficiency so a CVN can run at flank speed until the propeller falls off. Conventional ships have an efficient cruising speed of ~20 knots or so and would only last a couple hours at full speed.
why do American radar suits and wirings look so primitive compared to the Chinese?
is there any electrical engineer left in mutt land? Or all the smart ones have become bankers?
The current generation of sensors are based on designs that were designed before integrated masts were a thing and many of the ships these sensors were designed for were built decades ago. So the non-integrated mast trend continues in the USN because we have a LOT of hardware designed for regular masts. We have SOME integrated mast hardware, but it's not applicable for everything, so even now we have new ship designs using integrated masts. This might eventually end, but the USN hasn't deemed it necessary enough to FORCE integrated mast adoption across the board.
A decade and a half before the Type 55 went into service, the US had ships with integrated masts(pic related), it's just not been done on the US destroyer yet (unless you count Zumwalt).
>using integrated masts
using non-integrated masts
Actually, a nuclear powered carrier could still move a mile or two between when a hypersonic missile launched and when it lands. A hypersonic might take 3-5 minutes to reach the carrier and the carrier moves at about 35 knots.
Like a city. We should totally put a nuclear weapon on a hypersonic missile or something!
....wait
>tl:dr CIWS can't offer reliable protection.
Hello. This is why AEGIS doesn't rely on Phalanx and Phalanx itself is ditched in the favor of the RAM.
What does the reddit frog have to do with that?
>reddit frog
>over half a decade after ADL declared it a hate symbol
Boy, pepe sure made the normies seethe for you guys to hold a grudge this long
>Implying reddit isn't a hate site too.
Come on fag
>Normalfag detected
You're right, it's not just the Reddit frog, it's the Twitch frog too
>Does not work reliably
Has there been an instance of CWIS not working and it NOT being due to some retard turning it off or it not being operational when entering the theatre of war in the first place?
Gulf war, silkworm (?) Attack and cows somehow targeted chaff
Depends. RAM is quite good. Gun CIWS on ships is ass.
CIWS on land, when in the CRAM configuration is quite good for mortars and rockets.
Basically gun CIWS as envisioned for naval usage was a failure, but it developed useful technologies and turned out to be really, really useful for the army so it kinda worked out.
>Basically gun CIWS as envisioned for naval usage was a failure
Not a failure, just not as good as they'd like and is actively being replaced in favor of RAM systems that are far more effective.
I'm not going to make the argument that it's useless, because it has frankly barely been used, but its track record is not good.
Ticos are gonna get retired soon. bye bye ticos
These cruisers and destroyers are basically designed around air defense.
A better question is how exactly they will engage in surface warfare if they have to.
8 harpoons is pretty pathetic against pseudo aegis destroyers like the Chinese ships, presumably SM-2 and SM-6 will be the main anti-surface weapon.
No the better question is how is the Navy going to fight with the limited ammunition they have. The Navy doesn't even have enough missiles to fill the all the cells in the existing fleet. The PLAN doesn't even need to sink the USN to win. They can just missile spam with relatively inexpensive missiles until the USN runs out of AD and is forced to exit the theater of combat.
>what is soft kill for $1000?
This "missile swarm to overwhelm the fleet" shit posting is old. It's not a new threat. In fact, it's the primary threat AEGIS was designed and built to counter.
This is accurate. CIWS is an "oh shit" Hail Mary of a weapon system against ASMs. This is not exclusive to the US; this is every CIWS system.
PLAY COLD WATERS DOT MOD OR WATCH VIDEOS OF PEOPLE PLAYING.
how can we be asking these questions in 2023?
Watch dis and shut up
?t=268
What kind of heat shielding do hypersonic missiles use? I'd assume ablative rather than something like the space shuttle.
> Chinese TV reported that it is able to intercept incoming anti-ship missiles up to a speed of Mach 4 with a 96% success rate
lmao
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_730_CIWS#Type_1130
What's this?
The bug is afraid, it knows it's not the top dog in technology game anymore