GCAP update

Latest GCAP news, Japan finally agrees to allow export, though they require cabinet approval on a case-by-case basis, and the country getting the exports must have a defense transfer agreement with Japan and are not currently involved in a war.

They further are only lifting export restrictions on the 6th generation fighter, not other potential arms exports.

https://aviationweek.com/defense-space/budget-policy-operations/japan-ruling-coalition-clears-gcap-export

https://www.reuters.com/business/aerospace-defense/japan-relax-export-curbs-allow-overseas-sales-joint-jet-fighter-2024-03-13/

https://www.agenzianova.com/en/news/gcap-program-japan-plans-to-review-export-guidelines-within-a-month/

Rumors also continue to persist about Saudi Arabia joining the program maybe as a junior partner and not a full-fledged project member. Seeing as their role would almost certainly be economic only, and they will not provide any sort of technological or manufacturing capabilities to the program, being a junior partner seems to be about the most they should expect.

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  1. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    We should glass the Saudis

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous
    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Eh, as long as they want to throw $10-15B into the program I have no problem giving them access to early training/order priority, and maybe some help with integration with whatever command systems the Saudis use and maybe help with the integration of some Saudi-produced missiles/bombs/UAVs.

      I just don't want to see Saudi Arabia have any say on development/design direction or requirements.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        I one attended a meeting about the installation of new pump jet propulsion units into Saudi Navy FAC's. The meeting consisted off 3 Brits, 2 Americana, 1 German, 2 Indians and 1 Saudi. The Saudi spent 1 hour looking at his phone, then left and never returned.

        This was quite normal.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Saudis are set to joining KF-21 block III as well. They've recently sent an envoy including Talal bin Abdullah Al-Otaibi, a right-hand man of the prince, to see the progress.
        https://angelmetropolitano.com.mx/alto-representante-de-defensa-saudi-visita-corea-del-sur-para-examinar-armamento/

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Yeah but that's not really the same thing.

          A 4.5th gen fighter that might be 5th gen in another 15 years is a far cry from a genuine 5.5th or 6th gen in 15 years.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            In a recent newsletter, KAI officials have already confirmed that they're already working on a stealthy conversion of KF-21 by utilizing the components including the IWB from the stealth UCAV that has been being developed for some years now, so the actual process won't take too long once they find a right client like UAE, who had already been working on Checkmate with the Russians previously, has recently signed an MOU with KAI regarding the block 3 and they're persuading the Saudis to join the project.

            • 1 month ago
              Anonymous

              So basically the KF-21 will most likely be 5th gen, at least in the block 3 version.

              15 years IS the generous estimate.

              They're talking about the Block 3 IWB version test flights in the early/mid 2030s (2032-35), and that's without a RAM coating. If they can somehow demonstrate a RAM coating in Block 4 sometime in the mid to late 2030s that would be the first time it MIGHT be considered 5th gen, and it wouldn't enter full-rate production until the late 2030s, which is when GCAP expects to enter production. And just because the Block 3/4 versions may attain 5th gen qualifications, that doesn't mean the ~200+ Block 1/2 aircraft are magically upgraded.

              Saudi Arabia would be moronic to put more stock in KF-21 than GCAP and if they had to choose one over the other, GCAP would be the obvious choice.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                2030s was a mild estimation, it was never meant to be the final schedeule since the South Korean air force was not interested in the stealth mode initially, so the conversion could only be done with an outside investment, and from what I heard, if they can manage to find a proper investor(i.e. UAE) at the moment. they can shorten the development period to be completed within 2030, which I honestly don't think that it completely doesn't make sense, since the technology needed for the upgrade will be developed in tandem with KUS-FC, and the actual integration process won't take too long either. Because after all, it's easier to modify an existing platform than building one from scratch.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Bullshit

                Sorry but the Block 1 and 2 roadmaps are already solidified and don't include RAM or an IWB.

                Block 3 is at minimum ~2030, but more likely 2032+ as I doubt Block 1 and 2 will go without a single setback or delay. But even if they DO go by as planned, that means Block 3 with an IWB (and without RAM) wouldn't hit production until ~2034-35 at a minimum. A Block 4 with RAM and improved software for UAV cooperation WOULD be a convincing argument for 5th gen status, but we're looking at ~2035-36 for initial test flights if you're lucky and 2039-2040+ if there are any delays in the current Block 1-3 testing and production timelines.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Sorry but the Block 1 and 2 roadmaps are already solidified and don't include RAM or an IWB.
                Nobody has defied that and I wonder why you're bringing it up at this point.
                Even if the development does fall behind schedule for block 2, it won't affect the stealth modification of the plane, since the block 2 upgrade is all about sensor fusion and the worst scenario you can expect from it is a limited ground attack capability. As a side note, the Koreans are already planning to replace the F414 engines with local engines which are expected to be ready by the mid 2030s.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Nobody has defied that and I wonder why you're bringing it up at this point.
                Because Block 2 isn't scheduled to be in early production until 2029/30. The dates in your picture are test flight time periods, not when they'll be produced, which is usually a year or so after the tests.

                And yes if block 2 falls behind schedule it 100% WOULD delay subsequent production block development/testing.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Because Block 2 isn't scheduled to be in early production until 2029/30.
                Uhhhhh, nope.

                https://i.imgur.com/1oulr9d.jpg

                >Sorry but the Block 1 and 2 roadmaps are already solidified and don't include RAM or an IWB.
                Nobody has defied that and I wonder why you're bringing it up at this point.
                Even if the development does fall behind schedule for block 2, it won't affect the stealth modification of the plane, since the block 2 upgrade is all about sensor fusion and the worst scenario you can expect from it is a limited ground attack capability. As a side note, the Koreans are already planning to replace the F414 engines with local engines which are expected to be ready by the mid 2030s.

                the road map here clearly states that the development of block 2 will take place somewhere between 2026 and 2028.
                >The dates in your picture are test flight time periods, not when they'll be produced, which is usually a year or so after the tests.
                What do you mean? KF-21 is already in the mass production stage, which is why a total of 40 KF-21 block 1+2 will be ordered starting this year. What you're not getting here is that the block 1 and 2 are not separate planes. Block 2 is merely an upgraded version of block 1 with more sensors and etc, but the fuselage won't change. Also, those sensors from block 2 will not be shared in block 3 in order to be stealth, so the development of those sensor units will be done separately.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            So basically the KF-21 will most likely be 5th gen, at least in the block 3 version.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            > uk, italy, japan...dumb, dumber, dumberer

            Lol gcap is going to be a 4.5 gen version of the eurofighter rolling out some time in the 2040s with less than 100 units ever becoming operational

            Nope, the intel leak/crackdown proves that there is a tangible roadmap to 6th gen and beyond already, apparently the US is even trying to get the latest tech from worst Korea

            tldr, gcap is a low tier jobs program with no real path to operationalization...kf21 has a near unlimited budget with the highest iq techies with a stated objective that would make ngad blush

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              go home asiaticshill/warriortard

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                > Nipshill on suicide watch that the land of the pygmies is behind chinkland on miltech

                Lmfao

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                I just don't see why anyone should entertain your post when you say shit like
                > kf21 has a near unlimited budget with the highest iq techies with a stated objective that would make ngad blush

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                > every jap alive carries Korean y dna
                > every jap alive carries native Jomon x dna

                Let that sink in, lmfao

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                > Delusinal pseudohistory asiatic-shill posts for the 900th time
                no one bought it the first time, why do you think they'd buy it years later?

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                > official historical doctrine of not only the entire world but the japanese to include everybody from the emperor, business elites, and working class people

                Lmfao, seethe and dilate you fricking weeb troony lol

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >official historical doctrine
                Riiiiight

                > South Korean pseudohistory of early Northeast Asia imagines ancient Korea as an expansive continental empire centered on Manchuria, its territory further incorporating much of China, with still deeper origins located in a prehistoric “lost civilization.” Framed against recent history wars with China, authors of pseudohistory interweave an emotive polemic denouncing the academic establishment as national traitors who promote colonial-era Japanese historiography to the detriment of Korea and benefit of China.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Doesn't deny it
                Why does every single one of your gay threads devolve to this shit.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >A 4.5th gen fighter that might be 5th gen in another 15 years is a far cry from a genuine 5.5th or 6th gen in 15 years.
            There is no MIGHT here. It is absolutely going to be developed further into a 5th Generation fighter.

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              And it's still a farcry from a clean sheet 5th or 6th gen design.

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              And it's still a farcry from a clean sheet 5th or 6th gen design.

              Yes, will be 4.5 gen...some time between 2040 and 2060 lmfao

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Nope. It's gonna have a fully stealthy airframe by 2040. The bulbous IRST module will be replaced by an indigenous developed EOTS. It's gonna play second fiddle to their F-35s who are gonna operate as their Tier-1 fighter aircraft while the Stealth variant of the KF-21 is gonna act more in a support role prioritizing targets who don't operate 5th Gen aircraft, e.g. North Korea.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      unless they use foreign pilots and staff they wont even be able to operate them
      you could probably sell the saudis the jets with none of the necessary accompanying ground equipment and they wouldn't notice

  2. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Why are you posting old renderings that they ditched long ago?

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Because there ARE no relevant renderings/images to post? Any GCAP/Tempest/F-X image would suffice for the thread until we actually see something new and confirmed from the program.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        The original mockup is quit outdated by this point though, a quick google search...

  3. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Japan should be able to extort their Kuril territory back from Russia with these aircraft. I would tell the Russians all production goes to Ukraine until the islands are returned.

  4. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    For those interested in reading... Some interesting bits about GCAP in the following transcript from a recent bong defense committee

    https://committees.parliament.uk/oralevidence/14441/html/

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      A diamond of a post hidden amongst the shitheap of armatard desperately trying to derail.

      My key takeaways:
      >Japan have 2035 as a hard requirement, which is currently on track to be met. If there are delays they will desync and go their own way even if it means greater cost
      >Excellent discussion on cost projections and the repurcussions of being too optimistic with toolp ups needed later out of operational budgets. Open discussion about the UK defence budget needed to be increased if this, carrier strike & dreadnought are to all be delivered while maintaining (or indeed growing) current operational capability
      >Good discussion around capability and the potential for Japan & UK/IT to be differentially incentivised to try and aim for 'top shelf" capability to fight an ascendent China vs. get something cheaper that only needs to fight Russians and can be sold more easily to gulf states. Sees major competition as F-35 for this rather than NGAD
      >A 'less exquisite' programme than euro-FCAS, GCAP is manned airframe only, drone wingmen pursued under a different effort. Good discussion around euro-FCAS programme, they see German dropout as likely
      >Good discussion over 'open flight architecture' to keep flight critical and mission critical systems separate to allow for rapid mission upgrades without recertifying which the gripen has done.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Neat

  5. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Does it bother you that if you so much as look in the direction of a jap chick they will call the cops on you whereas they are uncontrollably spending trillions to try get a chance for a typical kbull to even look their way?

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Lmfao

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      https://i.imgur.com/0BUeRTZ.jpg

      Lmfao

      How's your jawbone healing anyway?

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        In Japan this makes the titanic movie look like a ren and stumpy episode in comparison

  6. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    /misc/ immigrants really have done a number on this board, huh.

  7. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >must have a defense transfer agreement with Japan and are not currently involved in a war
    >Saudi Arabia joining the program maybe as a junior partner
    means

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