fury

does it really do anything more gooder than all the other meme calibers?

  1. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Gets in your pocketbook real nice.

  2. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Unironically a great round for long distance competition but there’s only like two guns chambered in it. Might take off in a few years.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >but there’s only like two guns chambered in it.
      No shit, the two guns that won the competition that introduced the round.

      You can't really expect other companies to develop for a specific SIG .277 fury cartridge when there was another competing 6.8x51 cartridge and rifle/LMG combo.

      Now that SIG won, you'll see more .277 fury guns in the future, it's pretty much guaranteed, just a matter of time.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Sig spear, sig cross, and the xm250
        3 guns really

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Too bad you have to buy a sig gun to use this caliber.

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            You know another company can use the caliber if they wanted to...right?

            It's a published SAAMI spec caliber, feel free to grab the exact dimension and design your gun for the caliber.

            • 2 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              I would absolutely buy the shit from Anonymous Armaments.
              >Random anons develop firearms together
              >Submit designs, ideas, build prototypes
              >Release the designs into the wild for semi-automatic 10 gauge bullpup shotguns and other horrible ideas

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >horrible ideas
                Like what? Can it have a shovel attachment on the front and a handle for a stock? Call it the trench digger.

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                I'd personally love a "10 Gauge From Hell", but shooting 1.5"+ long steel flechettes. Kinda think like a CAWS on roids or something.

            • 2 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              Yes, I know.

              ..... But none do.

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                I wonder if 277 FURY will be like 5.7 and hesitantly take off suddenly after 20 years of malingering.

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                5.7 has not taken off just because like 4 people on PrepHole posted threads about them.

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                That's about 400% better than it was doing 20 years ago.
                Seriously, there's a whopping 4 new guns using it now compared to just 5 years ago.

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                5.7mm hasn't not taken off just because you refuse to look outside of PrepHole.

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                You don't know what "malingering" means.

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            i've enjoyed all the sig guns i own.

            • 2 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              u see, we hate sig because they fucked up a polymer frame striker fire in 2017, and a GOD DAMN BOLT ACTION in 2022 holy fucking shit how do you fuck up a bolt action in the 21st century oh my god jay just look at that thing!

              also there's just too many Cohencidences with them getting all these US military contracts.

            • 2 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              You don't own any SIG's then.
              I've had about 5 now and every single one was a piece of shit, the P226 is just junk that is outclassed by every other wonder nine, the P250 is a somehow heavier DAO 226 with a polymer frame, the P320 is a striker fired 250, all the rifles are overpriced but they do work, the P210 seems nice but I don't feel like spending any more money on SIG.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >Unironically a great round for long distance competition but there’s only like two guns chambered in it. Might take off in a few years.

      How is this better than 6.5x55? American 6.5x55 is downloaded because it might get fired in old guns, but a high pressure 6.5x55 will push a 100 grain bullet at 3300 fps. And if you use a steel core you can get enough volume for a long low drag spitzer.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >How is this better than 6.5x55?

        That round (12.20mm) has a bigger rim diameter than the 308 Win (12.01mm), 30-06 (12mm), 6.5 Creedmoor (12.01mm) and 277 Fury (11.99mm). Takes too much space.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >how is a heavier, higher BC bullet, going 600 FPS faster better than my shitty meme round?????
        6.5x55 is absolute dogshit eurocuck.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >6.5x55
        Anon, of all the rounds to pick...
        Hey look, pocrel has more muzzle energy than .277 furry, let's use that!

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          > .277 furry
          I want to believe that this was intentional.

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          furry

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >but a high pressure 6.5x55 will push a 100 grain bullet at 3300 fps.
        Yeah, from what barrel length?

  3. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    80 kpsi peak pressure vs ~65 kpsi of typical brass. Rem is going to hold the monopoly as long as they can and customer is gonna suffer from that.
    bullet itself is probably like any other 6.5.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >80 kpsi peak pressure
      and that is why it is going nowhere...

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        That's unironically the only good thing about it.

  4. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    High BC with very good initial velocity, it's pretty impressive. Don't know if it's worth the trade off of case construction and pressures though

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      forgot about sectional density. Couldn't find anything on it, but if .277 fury is lower SD than .300 then it's already obsolete. Lots of 7mm PRC loadings safely above. 300 SD

      Honestly the fact Sig's website doesn't advertise the SD, makes me think it probably sucks but idk

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Dude you could just divide the mass by the area to get SD.

        6.8 (.277) is basically the same thing as 7mm (.284). SDs will be pretty much the same. If 7mm has adequate SD, so will 6.8. You can only go so many calibers long in bullet length, so 300 will always win, but still. 6.8 can theoretically have better SDs than 6.5, and that’s a very popular long range caliber.

        To answer OPs question, an increase in pressure is effectively a proportional increase in energy density. It isn’t the 6.8x51 that’s better than other meme calibers, it’s the case tech. More energy density is always better. Higher velocities from smaller and lighter cases with higher magazine capacity. 6.8x51 is cool as a 308/6.5CM replacement, but I’d want to see other cartridges loaded to gigapressures in hybrid cases. 5.56, 5.7, 6.8SPC, the blackouts, etc. (their analogs really, I know we’ll never get actual 5.56 loaded to 80kpsi.)

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >6.8SPC, the blackouts, etc. (their analogs really, I know we’ll never get actual 5.56 loaded to 80kpsi.)
          Even 60-70kpsi would be a +P over 308.
          Think that could be contained in a new upper/bcg and keep existing lowers?

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Lowers arent load bearing, so yes. There are single shot 50BMG uppers that take standard AR lowers

            My point about not getting true 5.56 at 80kpsi is the massive risk in being able to be chambered and fired in existing 5.56 guns not rated for 80kpsi. So if you were to make something like that, you’d have to mess with the case dimensions just a hair to prevent them being chambered in existing guns

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Same anon, want to add something. You could probably even keep existing size uppers (receiver, BCG, barrel extension) for higher pressure 5.56-ish ammo. AR15/5.56 sized bolts, if made of the right materials, have proven to be sufficient in withstanding the bolt thrust of a 308. the POF revolution/rogue uses 5.56 sized bolts with 308 sized bolt faces. It’s made of unobtainium, but still.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Why the fuck do you care about SD so much?

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      It's not really going to matter to me, as I don't have a battle rifle. And for long range there are other and better round and nobody cares about action lenght. I can load 6.5x55 hot enough to just about match the .277 Fury balistics in OPs image, and that's just humble 6.5 Swede.

  5. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    It’s just another vanity project like all MIC products of the pst 20 years like the F35, Puma, Iris, you name it.

    They are developed as show pieces but usually end up not being able to be fielded in anything but mild weather conditions with a maintenance crew and spare parts around. Actual combat would prove all this tech to be absolute dogshit.

  6. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Blows out barrels sooner. They should've went with the True Velocity polymer cased, it operated at a lower PSI to save the barrel more and recoil less. It needed more barrel to burn enough powder to meet the specs, but the gun was a bullpup so it could handle it. The gun also needed a much shorter suppressor since it had a longer barrel and lower velocity PSI.

    Sig fucked up attempting to meet such high demands with such a short barrel. They cut the barrel to 13", upped the PSI to fucking hellish levels, and ended up having to use a longer suppressor as a result. They tried to reach a balance but didn't reach it at all, almost like they released an incomplete design. The result is the gun shooting at way too high a velocity for a reasonable barrel life, unbelievable recoil, and impossible for a human to safely shoot it without a suppressor or ear/eye pro (yes the muzzle flash is going to be insane, there's a reason they won't allow any reviewer to shoot it without the suppressor).

    They honestly should've bullpupped it to allow for a longer barrel and less velocity demand. But that gun already existed. The milcorp picked Sig because they play ball with kickback schemes to embezzle money alloted for weapons purchases.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      I'm talking about the General Dynamics bullpup (Genesis) in the first paragraph. Sorry to be confusing. It was the superior and you'd think obvious choice. Extracted completely cold casings, the machine gun version could have a completely cold chamber after strings of fire, and no more hot brass going down your buddy's shirts or behind their sunglasses.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        It was fucking garbage.
        Caseless/telescoping rounds are shitty garbage

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Oh look, another instance where you pretend the 8" barrel version is identical to the 15.3" barrel (+ suppressor) length of the M5.

      All you have to do is say the recoil is bad, look at this gif of a short barreled version to see it exaggerated a bit. Instead you pretend that gif IS the M5.

      Is it REALLY that hard for you to not lie?

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Anon I don't think you know what 8" is. That's a Krinkov length barrel, if that dude were shooting an 8" barrel gun the handguard would barely be longer than his hand like on a Krink. That looks to be about 13-15"

        It's just not a good gun on top of not meeting the concept it was supposed to meet. There's still time to join the GD Genesis gang.

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          ?t=99

          > The SIG MCX Raptor is a short-barreled rifle variant intended to serve as a carbine, featuring an 8-inch (200 mm) barrel

          Literally anytime that GIF gets posted, someone points out it's 8" and every time you chuckle fucks ignore it and pretend it's the M5.

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            barrel length has jack squat to do with recoil unless that 6" weighs 10lbs...

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            I didn't even say anything about the fucking daytime fireball being shit out the front, you're immediately jumping to being defensive about it? Look at the fucking insane recoil, the recoil was what I brought up. You're getting shill tier defensive about something I didn't even address (but is still a major issue lmao)

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Wouldn’t the m5 actually have MORE recoil by virtue of higher velocity?

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          No, the extra barrel length adds weight, not to mention using that gas to push a bullet out of a longer barrel allows for more gas to go towards the bullet, and not the recoil.

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Gas going towards the bullet is literally where recoil comes from. It pushes back on the gun with equal force.

            • 2 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              Oh my goodness I love retards posting.
              Recoil is the energy the rifle develops, due to accelerating to a given velocity to match the momentum of the projectile.
              When the projectile leaves the barrel, it will have a momentum value, mass x velocity, the rifle now must also have momentum equal to, but opposite in direction.
              The bullet having a high velocity, but low mass, will mean the rifle with high mass, will have lower velocity.

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                a lot of "felt recoil" is also the loading system...

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                You moron, I know all that. That was my point exactly. The faster the projectile, the more momentum going forwards, the more momentum going backwards. The guy I was responding to seemed to think gas/pressure/whatever wasted not accelerating the bullet allocates itself to recoil.

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                While he didn't phrase it perfectly, your reading comprehension or knowledge of basic physics is questionable, bud. He stated newton's third law (equal and opposite force) and you said "nuh uh, it's conservation of momentum." Conservation of momentum can be derived from newton's third law.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >15.3" barrel (+ suppressor) length of the M5
        It's 13 inches, you know. Not sure why wikipedia keeps repeating the lie that its 15.3 inches. I mean just look at it. The barrel isn't longer than an M4A1 barrel.

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          The barrel is 13", the suppressor length added however makes it 15.3"

          All of the XM5 specs sources claim this. You can't say it's not true because you don't want it to be.

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Which is not at all equivalent or comparable to a 15.3" barrel.
            Here you go, bro:
            https://arxiv.org/ftp/arxiv/papers/1802/1802.05748.pdf

            • 2 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              > test results support that yaw-related increases in drag are present in
              certain bullets that are prone to yaw. The methods used are able to support or refute
              anecdotal reports of the effects of muzzle devices by quantifying bullet yaw and drag
              over transitional and near ranges where the effects are greatest. Additional studies
              may inform whether certain classes of bullets are more prone to this effect and where
              the ballistic performance may benefit from use of a muzzle device. Future work might
              also consider additional muzzle device designs to better identify specific design
              features contributing to amelioration of transition-induced yaw.

              I think the elongated shape of the .277 bullet will negate this, as your paper shows only bullets that are prone to yaw in the first place seem to exhibit any substantial velocity loss from a silencer. Hell some of the bullets saw increased velocity that almost perfectly matched what you'd see from a barrel of the and length.

              That paper even says more research needs to be done on different bullet shapes, and suppressor designs to really understand their impact on a bullet.

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >The barrel is 13"
            I'm glad we agree, you know.

            >All of the XM5 specs sources claim this
            Actually they say the literal barrel is 15.3 inches. They don't understand.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      you voluntarily included a graphic showing benefits, greater energy and more precision at mid and long ranges

      >[loud whiny baby tears]
      Sig was the only one to not only get finished models but also show a barrel like >7k rounds, everything you claim is true of Sig's offering despite public information to the contrary was factually true of the failed ones and that's why they failed
      eat shit retard

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >bullpup
      dead meme

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        N-no it's the f-future!

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >grandpa gun with a stook
        Dead space.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      I'm talking about the General Dynamics bullpup (Genesis) in the first paragraph. Sorry to be confusing. It was the superior and you'd think obvious choice. Extracted completely cold casings, the machine gun version could have a completely cold chamber after strings of fire, and no more hot brass going down your buddy's shirts or behind their sunglasses.

      The concept would've worked if they picked the GD bullpup. It fit the concept they were asking for. There's also a role that wasn't even considered and that's SF operations. Guys aren't going to be able to clear rooms with this excessively long platform, since the platform includes a suppressor and cant safely be shot without it. Unsuppressed it would be a 13" barrel on an AR10 length receiver but it would be fucking eardrum popping and blinding to shoot it that way indoors.

      https://i.imgur.com/LwBjYb0.jpg

      Anon I don't think you know what 8" is. That's a Krinkov length barrel, if that dude were shooting an 8" barrel gun the handguard would barely be longer than his hand like on a Krink. That looks to be about 13-15"

      It's just not a good gun on top of not meeting the concept it was supposed to meet. There's still time to join the GD Genesis gang.

      Fuck off, bullpup fag. The GD rifle was pointless, especially when it was shown that a normal M240 could be easily rechambered with the True Velocity ammo. At that point, why not call up KAC or FN and order a rifle chambered in that?

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Because the true velocity ammo was shot too
        Lmao

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Shit*

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >At that point, why not call up KAC or FN and order a rifle chambered in that?
        Because a normal rifle chambered in 6.8 TVC will perform worse than a similar length bullpup.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Because the lower pressure non barrel raping round needs a longer barrel to reach the velocities required by the program.

        I know you’re a retard but come on dude.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      The polymer shit is dumb and retarded and would/will be just another thing for gays to complain about against gun ownership.
      Brass at least either gets collected by goblins or returns to the earth without me giving a fuck about picking up casings after I shoot. I personally don't want to pick up little pieces of plastic every time I shoot on my own property or someone else's. I would say perhaps i could get a bolt gun chambered in the plastic bullshit, but reloading isn't gonna work with it either so it's doubly a waste of my time.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Brass is fine. Normal pressures are fine.
        The plastic shit was never going to catch on. Too many potential issues, from "environmental" concerns, to reloading, to proprietary specs and composition.
        The NGSW was always retarded.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Brass is fine. Normal pressures are fine.
        The plastic shit was never going to catch on. Too many potential issues, from "environmental" concerns, to reloading, to proprietary specs and composition.
        The NGSW was always retarded.

        I really wonder if biological degradable plastics could solve those problems. The biggest problem is finding a polymer that will last a long time in storage but won't last a long time in the ground. Maybe a casing that's stable for shelf life but exposure to water will degrade it within 2 or 3 years? And long term storage could be in dry sealed containers. Maybe that's magical miracle material I'm dreaming up, but who knows?

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >biological degradable plastics could solve those problems
          Sadly, doesn't exist. Have you gone to a fast food restaurant lately? These days, they give me paper straws that literally disintegrate in my drink.
          If there were such a thing, it would have broader applications than just cartridge casings...

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Yeah, it doesn't exist YET. But while we're trying to figure out biodiesel maybe someone will come up with bioplastics? This futurism stuff is way out in the weeds though, it's definitely not feasible in the foreseeable future at the very least.

            I actually think the ideas behind the Textron telescopic case ammo and feeding method are probably the future of firearms. But that's also probably 20 years out at the absolute minimum to work out the engineering of it.

            • 2 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              I'm with you there. The textron submission was way too mechanically complex. But maybe in a decade or two, they'll work out the kinks.

            • 2 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              literally who gives a shit about telescopes ammo
              >b..but it’s half an inch shorter!
              nobody gives a fuck, retard
              this is an idea for complete halfwits and redditors it literally does not matter

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                There were other benefits. Lower weight, for instance. Point was to enable soldiers to carry more ammo, even though the bullets themselves were a lot larger than 5.56.

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                More important than the space savings is the action. If the push through feeding method could be refined into a practical form it would basically eliminate an entire category of malfunctions. It could be reliable as hell with no failures to extract and a short action that still has a lot of power.

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                if my aunt had a cock she’d be my uncle

                There were other benefits. Lower weight, for instance. Point was to enable soldiers to carry more ammo, even though the bullets themselves were a lot larger than 5.56.

                this would matter if they already couldn’t carry enough ammo, but they can, so it doesn’t

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >this would matter if they already couldn’t carry enough ammo, but they can, so it doesn’t
                More never hurt.
                Machine gunners (particularly LMG operators) arguably don't carry enough ammo as things stand.
                Things get a lot worse with Sig Furry.

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >this would matter if they already couldn’t carry enough ammo, but they can, so it doesn’t
                lmaooo
                ask me how I know you've never been a machinegunner or a platoon sausage (the answer is an average MG team needs about 1500 more rounds than they have).

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                What is that number 1500 based off? I’m not doubting it at all, just wondering if there is actual math behind it, and if we’re really that close to optimum ammo weight/capacity at this stage of firearms tech, or if it’s a reasonably attainable number derived to set a roadmap or establish a list of requirements for future MG/ammo development.

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                If a half inch doesn’t matter, surely you’d be fine with a longer 5.56 that retains the exact same performance? What about longer?

                That half inch saved is big in terms of ammo carrying capacity, magazine size, the weight of guns that use them, the max length (thus SD and ff) of bullets used in a given action length, etc. that’s what the 6.8x51 did anyways. Higher pressure = higher energy density = not as large a case needed. The result is a cartridge a half inch shorter than 270 win that outperforms it significantly

  7. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    What are the chances that it alongside the xm5 are adopted and is used in the war against combatants in mil-grade body armor, and it turns out that all of the "on paper ideas" XM5 and the .277 Fury brought were worthless in practice, and we return to Stoner.
    Or .308 gets revived

    • 2 weeks ago
      [email protected]

      The insane recoil is going to kill this thing once it takes off. The people in gif related aren't even shooting the AP rounds.

      https://i.imgur.com/8kjkvR4.gif

      Blows out barrels sooner. They should've went with the True Velocity polymer cased, it operated at a lower PSI to save the barrel more and recoil less. It needed more barrel to burn enough powder to meet the specs, but the gun was a bullpup so it could handle it. The gun also needed a much shorter suppressor since it had a longer barrel and lower velocity PSI.

      Sig fucked up attempting to meet such high demands with such a short barrel. They cut the barrel to 13", upped the PSI to fucking hellish levels, and ended up having to use a longer suppressor as a result. They tried to reach a balance but didn't reach it at all, almost like they released an incomplete design. The result is the gun shooting at way too high a velocity for a reasonable barrel life, unbelievable recoil, and impossible for a human to safely shoot it without a suppressor or ear/eye pro (yes the muzzle flash is going to be insane, there's a reason they won't allow any reviewer to shoot it without the suppressor).

      They honestly should've bullpupped it to allow for a longer barrel and less velocity demand. But that gun already existed. The milcorp picked Sig because they play ball with kickback schemes to embezzle money alloted for weapons purchases.

      It would've been better if they asked for companies to design a DMR that the Hispanicy rounds could work in, then just issue 1-2 per squad and use them in a DMR role or AP role if needed. Trying to make it into the main assault/battle rifle didn't work, or won't work I'm telling you. This is such an obviously failed design.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        The concept would've worked if they picked the GD bullpup. It fit the concept they were asking for. There's also a role that wasn't even considered and that's SF operations. Guys aren't going to be able to clear rooms with this excessively long platform, since the platform includes a suppressor and cant safely be shot without it. Unsuppressed it would be a 13" barrel on an AR10 length receiver but it would be fucking eardrum popping and blinding to shoot it that way indoors.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      If it turns out that the aimbot optic doesn’t actually make the carrying of more ammo unnecessary, I expect a return to smaller and lighter cartridges, but still with steel case heads and loaded to 80kpsi. But never a return to .308. Literally anything 308 does, 6.8x51 does better. It’s an excellent replacement for 308 in all of its roles, not so much for 5.56 IMO, but we’ll see, maybe the new optic makes assault rifles obsolete by increasing hit probability, so no need for full auto or 210rds

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Except it's not, 308 is basically the same as 277 but without absurd pressures. If anything the .338 would make a better replacement but good luck getting .338 service rifles to take off (as much as I want them to)

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Why don't they just put a .300 win mag or .338 lapua mag on every squad? Sniping can't seriously be a special forces only thing while actual combat operations are limited to designated marksman rifles.

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          That “absurd pressure” missing from the 308 isn’t trivial. It literally translates to a proportional increase in energy. The 308 also is less overbore, thus can not propel bullets of the same sectional density to the same velocities.

          What 338 are you talking about? Surely not Lapua mag?

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            I don't see how the pressure helps that much, you are getting far more wear on the gun and the result is a 135gr projectile moving at 2750fps. While M80 Ball manages to pull off a 147gr projectile at 2800fps.
            I fail to see how .277 is better than .308 in anyway. Also the .338 would be Norma Magnum because it's already in use with a handful of groups.

            • 2 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              [email protected] isn’t the high pressure load. The high pressure load is [email protected] and that’s from a 16 inch barrel. The round is crazy overbore, and I’d expect north of 3200fps with a 20-24” barrel.

              But anyways, To compare 6.8x51 to 308 you’d need to control for barrel lengths.

              Your idea for a general issue cartridge is a 338NM? Are you high?

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                M80a1 already hits ~2950fps out of a 16inch barrel, I get that 6.8 has higher sectional density and better ballistic coefficient, but its not particularly compelling for 98% of engagements, especially outside of Afghanistan. We already had the answers to the test but Brass wants to reinvent M80a1 performance for umpteen million dollars and sweet kickbacks to Sig.

                A Ruger SFAR with M80a1 and the high speed new optic would be cheaper and better for troops from a weight standpoint, and with ZERO of the "warshot / pussy training round" dichotomy that developed around this program. Imagine, purposely training troops with weaker ammo when they arent actively deployed, like WTF how is that a sane idea. And thats the gigabrained SIGGER workaround to barrels getting burnt out quick.

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >But, you see, the military will have to buy and stock TWO kinds of ammunition! We sell them the pussy shit AND the wartime shit and laugh all the way to the bank while they try to figure out how the fuck much of each to order and stockpile! And EITHER WAY THEY GO WE WIN!

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                The power move is to adopt the SFAR in 6.8TVC

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Well to start SIG already makes guns in .338NM but it won't be any more difficult to make a gun in it than it would fury. The benefits are larger bullet moving at the same speed with a lower pressure.

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                338NM is like twice the weight of 6.8x51, which itself is already around twice the weight of 5.56. The guns would have to be enormous and very heavy, and the cartridges are physically a lot larger. The rifles would be running like 15 round mags and machineguns like 50rd belts. Nonstarter dude. are you new to guns?

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                No, this is literally already being done, .338NM is not twice as big as 308 or 277, it's larger yes but the benefits of said cartridge outweigh that .338 is already used in a machinegun role to replace the 240B and it does better in every way while being almost the same weight.
                As for infantry the round would no doubt take up more room but with all the gadgets and gizmos of the modern US Military they could have every retard shooting highly accurate and deadly fire out as far as they could see.
                You may lose some of the close range volume of fire that we love so much but nothing is stopping them from issuing an M4 as a SMG (like it was intended to be) for that role.
                In the end though it will all fail and we will once again go back to the AR15 with some magic 115gr bullet that makes it better somehow.

              • 2 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Remember the point of the NGSW program was to find a replacement for the M4 and 5.56 cartridge. The 5.56, an intermediate cartridge, that weighs 186 grains. They replace it with something in the weight and power class of a 7.62x51 (contrary to what retards say, the 6.8x51 is not an intermediate cartridge). And you want to go bigger? I mean, why exactly? What do you gain from a bigger caliber/bullet? Trajectory improvement is trivial, if present at all. Are the terminal ballistics of smaller cartridges insufficient? What would a soldiers load look like? A 10 pound rifle and 100 round loadout that weighs 25 pounds? 338NM is quite overbore, how long will their rifle barrels be?

                The 338NM machinegun that sig made was as far as I understand intended to fill in the space between a GPMG and HMG. It’s sort of halfway there to 50BMG, definitely not a standard issue rifle cartridge candidate.

                The ideal infantry round ought to be the lightest bullet that can achieve some standard of penetration, has enough energy needed for acceptable incapacitation, and meets the trajectory requirements for the most common engagement distances. This all calls for small caliber, low form factor, and high velocity. Aka the 5.56 FABRL I posted above.

  8. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    I think what will happen is that people will remember that small arms performance is only a very small portion of a squad's capabilities and go back to 5.56.

  9. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    It does move a projectile faster than anything else .308 length and standard width.
    You're basically getting 7mm rem mag performance from a short action, non-fat-mag sized case

  10. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Pointless round when 7.62x51 is already in use. It won't catch on in the next 20 years, that's for sure.

    People aren't going to spend money changing their guns and/or production, especially when there's some NATO countries who only just switched away from 7.62x39 (Czechia, Slovakia, Slovenia) and some still have yet to (Albania, North Macedonia, MonteBlack), and others have recently adopted new models of guns for the 5.56x45 and/or 7.62x51 calibers.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Generals are going through this exercise instead of admitting they should have issued AR-10s or more DMRs in Afghanistan. Enemy had 7.62x54R and US was sending 5.56 back.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        What is it with this "standard service rifle" autism anyway. Guns and ammo make a minuscule part of the logistical load these days, issuing different guns to different roles or units is perfectly viable.

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          They think it saves money and is easier on logistics lol.

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Doesn't turkey issue different guns depending on mountain vs urban?

  11. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >A 2nd problem is that NGSW weapons have a muzzle velocity of 3,000 f/sec (914 m/sec) and chamber pressure of 80,000 psi versus 45,000-55,000 psi for 7.62 mm. This is going to cause serious barrel and parts longevity issues. NGSW reports suggest < 3,000 round weapon life.
    t. Nicholas Drummond, absolute mouthbreathing twittard who was not privy to "NGSW reports" that fantasists still quote to this day
    >During testing, SIG Sauer learned that its NGSW barrels could run to 12,000 rounds before needing to change them out.
    t. official releases regarding performance in 6.8mm, Sig over doubling the barrel requirement was essentially a death-knell for the other contenders (who were struggling to even make a prototype) but people here still acted surprised when the Spear won
    please do not post on PrepHole

  12. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Are there any videos of it penetrating level VI armor?

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      No, those are all classified videos with a special military round, I doubt the civvi rounds could get through LVLIV armor

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      remember some ordinary 7mm did that. So i guess if the velocity and sectional density is above that it should also do that.

  13. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Blocks SIG Fury's path.
    > B-but I'll just aim for the groin, checkmate, ha ha (nervous laughter)
    You can do that more comfortably and accurately with 5.56.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >and accurately with 5.56
      at distances under 100-200m maybe.

      Beyond that 6.8 will have substantially less drop, allowing far higher accuracy. .

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        From a 13" barrel?
        pressxtodoubt.png

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          it's 15.3" with suppressor length, .277 fury SAAMI spec was done with a 16" test barrel. They should be PRETTY close.

          Also, the chart given in the OP shows performance from a 16" barrel too.

          If it's beating 6.5CM in 16" vs 16", then it's probably beating a 14.5" M4 with a 13" barrel + suppressor, and likely by a good margin, especially at any extended ranges.

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Fair enough. Remains to be seen how it compares against a 20", though.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      hi paid shill for purple plate, why I can't find your company's physical door front like any other good old american brand?

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >He keeps posting the thing that hard counters an aspect of the Sigger rifle, how do I respond?
        >hes a shill
        I DO shill that plate, but that guy probably posted it to stir the pot, it was a talking point at one point that 6.8 would be OMGWTFBBQ armor pen. Whether that is a program goal I dont know, but its funny to have it cucked right out of the gate by a 650 dollar plate (and yeah that includes the SPECIAL AP most likely)

        Adepts engineering is extremely good, it would be sweet if they explicitly listed a company of origin but they are made in Europe *somewhere*. Armor companies are entirely content to sell the same fucking Level IVs they have since the 90s, never mind developments on the projectile/cartridge side. It was always possible to build something like this, at a higher weight using pure silicon carbide. Tencate has the only other VPAM 12 palte that you can find any information on, the CX-950, and that damn thing is 8.9lbs ICW, so closing in on 10lbs unless you have great backers. Having a company with the balls to sell a disruptively capable plate like the Colossus is a godsend, the playing field has been stagnant for way too long. Hopefully some other XSAPI+ plates come out soon.

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >He keeps posting the thing that hard counters an aspect of the Sigger rifle, how do I respond?
          It's practically a meme at this point. It's 100% proven that steel-core "Fury" absolutely won't penetrate any decent Level IV plates, and sure as shit won't pen any XSAPI+ plates.

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Not him, but SUPPOSEDLY, the military already has more modern (than 993 for example, at least) rounds that can penetrate more "modern" plates at ranges:
            https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2017/05/28/army-chief-milley-says-army-developed-new-bullet-defeat-level-iv-body-armor/

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Does anyone have news on future small arms penetrators for use against stuff like this?
      I don't think we'll see flechettes or chemical (explosive) rounds, so what'll it be? Just newer materials and different designs?
      Anything that could be "retrofit" into .224 bullets? I still feel like there's a place for Hispanicy 5.56 AP since, to my understanding, the US will be keeping a bunch of M4's in service, even IF the SIG is approved for wider adoption.
      The dream, to me, in regards to how it relates to the above, would be the military reconfiguring AR's in .224 Valkyrie or 6mm ARC, but with hybrid cases at much higher pressures. Perhaps new barrel extensions and bolts, but maybe also, it'd be sick if, they added newer stuff aside from that like special buffers/recoil systems, ambi controls, whatever.

  14. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    The new casing construction, why not use that on a 5.56 and 7.62?
    Since SIG basically sold its idea like ths next base invention since slice bread.

  15. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    it's pretending to kill the AR-15 longer than usual, but everyone knows the Army will chicken out again and use the money to buy more smart bombs.

  16. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >"more THEN 50 years"
    Instantly stopped reading there.

  17. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    I just like very fast or very heavy bullets. The faster or fatter the better.

  18. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    No, it’s retarded
    We should be going smaller caliber and even higher velocity, with longer bullets for ~40-50 grain weight
    Something like 5x51mm

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Picrel at 80kpsi is the only logical solution

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Correct

  19. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    I suppose you can reload this if you back off a full lenght die or use a neck size only die in conjunction with a backed off body die? Would there be any issue with the primer pocket?

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      How the fuck is this dude triple one-handing his phone, a water bottle and a fucking cigarette? Truly a legend.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        I didn’t see that. That’s seriously impressive

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          https://i.imgur.com/yEVSW6q.jpg

          I suppose you can reload this if you back off a full lenght die or use a neck size only die in conjunction with a backed off body die? Would there be any issue with the primer pocket?

          That's it, we officially have to get Trump back in and Make America Great Again.

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Good tactics. Never carry anything in your draw hand.

            5.7mm hasn't not taken off just because you refuse to look outside of PrepHole.

            The only people that seek out and buy, then pay to feed a fucking 5.7 are anti cop schizos who didn't do their research to see that copper 9mm punches through vests.

  20. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    I feel like DoD signing the initial contract only 10,700 rifles a year (plus 1,300 LMGs) is INCREDIBLY conservative, makes it impossible for it to ever truly become "the service rifle" and gives plenty of room to back out and just call it a DMR

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      it's 10,700 the FIRST year, the 2nd year is like 15-20k and then like 25k the year after.

  21. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Just make HM the President, he was never even as goofy as Trump.

  22. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    It makes me seethe.

  23. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Well nothing else is pushing 3000 FPS from a 13" barrel. Especially not with a 135gr projectile either.

  24. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    [...]

    Damn, rant get. So where exactly are they sourcing these "rebranded", 6.5lb Swiss P plates and upcharging for them, and what source do you have for that claim? If they were rebranded, then that plate sure as hell isnt public knowledge,

    I assume you are referring to Adept giving plates to Buffman and Oxide, and thats an awfully petty dig since Buffman is the most legit tester of armor this side of an accredited lab on youtube (not a high bar, but accurate). Are we to hold every company that sends him plates to this standard, that they are shilling? They sort of are, but there have been some pretty damning results out of more than one of those tests. He will be testing a LIBA plate I sent him eventually, try not to seethe too hard :^)

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      which part of NIJ do you not understand?

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        The highest the NIJ will certify is IV, one hit of 30-06 AP with less than 44mm BFD. Adept has a modified NIJ IV test (not for accredidation) on their page, swapping in M993 for 30-06 AP. It has just over half the NIJ allowance for BFD, 24mm. What result would you expect from a 30-06 test besides embarrasing overkill? The damn plate could probably stop it with a 5mm airgap between strikeface and backer.
        NIJ certification is extremely useful, since it forces companies to adhere to good QA practices, but there are a shitload of plates I would trust that have absolutely no certification. Additionally, a lot of companies are either holding off from new models or not getting them certified since the NIJ has been "two more weeks" away from releasing 101.07 for 3 years now, with most recent news I heard saying they are pushing it off again.

  25. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Say, theoretically, I wanted to have someone make me a .277 barrel for an AR10, and THEORETICALLY wanted to shoot it... Would I
    A) Get laughed off the phone/out of the gun shop
    B) Die immediately after pulling the trigger

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Possibly both.

  26. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    It burns your barrels

  27. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    only if you really really really insist on knocking a half inch off your receiver length and two inches off your barrel. Otherwise you can just use 270 winchester with a faster than normal twist barrel and get the exact same results

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