Yes and no. At first this ship (CSS Virginia) was fucking up the union ships at Hampton roads, sinking 2 iirc and badly damaging a third. Then the Monitor showed up and they both took pot shots at eachother for a few hours but couldn’t actually do much damage. At one point the Virginia tried to ram but the ram got stuck and broke off. The monitor’s captain got blinded when a shell struck his vision slit. Both eventually withdrew. The Virginia never got another opportunity to break the blockade and was eventually scuttled.
Tl:dr it was a draw and a strategic defeat for the rebels, but they still managed to sink a few ships.
>Tl:dr it was a draw and a strategic defeat for the rebels, but they still managed to sink a few ships.
Yep. It proved that ironclads were the future, and that the only thing that could fight one was another ironclad
NTA, but the original word is "jury." Comes from the age of sail as a bastardization of the French word "jour" for day. Means temporary in the sense of "daily."
FWIW I've read letters and journal entries from both union and confederate soldiers and at least from what I'd read, the people who did write seemed remarkably more literate than the average person today.
there was a second ship build that is still sunk in the savanna harbor (in a near by shore line).
basically what they did was take an old steam ship, cut the top off, build a slant roof, and lay metal slats on the top. the bottom of the ship was wooden, but that didn't matter because it was below the waterline. the slant design was coincidental to improving the effectiveness by sloping and was likely chosen to save on material. it was noted by the officers how much more effective the armor was than expected. I think they compared it to the sloped walls of European forts.
>Neither could kill the other so it’s not a question a which one was better.
It may or may not have been cope but the inventor, John Ericsson, claimed after the battle that the Monitor's guns could have breached Virginia's armor had they been used at full power. Supposedly the crew either weren't told the gun was capable of hotter loads or didn't trust the gun to do so due to the USS Princeton accident. The USS Princeton was a ship that Ericcson designed several years prior to the war, during some VIP cruise the crew were demoing one of the guns and it exploded killing a half dozen people including both the Secretary of State and the Secretary of the Navy. The President at the time, (John Tyler) would have been killed but had just gone below deck. The gun that blew up wasn't Ericsson's design but he was the one who took the fall.
>"We would'a blew the Merrimack's hull wide open if only those dumb fucking gunners would'a used mah pissin' hot loads!"
I don't think that would have ended well.
>The gun that blew up wasn't Ericsson's design but he was the one who took the fall.
I don’t think Ericsson designed any guns to begin with. He was responsible for the turret and ship design but not the guns.
>The gun that blew up wasn't Ericsson's design but he was the one who took the fall.
I don’t think Ericsson designed any guns to begin with. He was responsible for the turret and ship design but not the guns.
IIRC the US Navy had the most brainlet members out of the existing branches of the military and this wouldn't turn around until like 20 years later with the second Naval build up in US history and then take off from there. Because the Navy literally took everyone back in those days and it was hard fucking word, more so than the Army.
I have to admire the sheer balls of the guys who got into that cramped death trap, especially considering it killed its crew twice before it actually went into combat.
Considering its weapon was just a bomb on a long pole it’s effectively the first manned torpedo.
Confederate trapezoid (heh, trap) ironclads were a dead end. Union Monitors were the future, establishing the Golden Path for warships to follow. Trapedzoid (heh, trap) ironclads represent inefficient slave mentality; each gun fixed in position and forced to fire in one direction, thus necessitating large batteries. Union Monitors represent a Free Man's mind, the guns freely turning to fire in any direction, with smaller, more efficient batteries. The Monitor bore many children, even to this day, as all turreted warships are her children. The trapezoidal (heh, trap) ironclad was a dead end doomed to die with her homeland, going out with the rest of the broadside warships.
True but the casemate layout was more reliable at the time. Even during the battle at Hampton roads the Monitor’s turret was more of a liability then an advantage.
But casemates remained a staple feature of warships until the deprecation of naval guns in the 1940s. Even now, VLS tubes are more like casemates than turrets.
>The first battle between Ironclad warships in history ended in a draw. >One warship would later be scuttled to avoid capture and the other went into a storm and capsized.
why is real life so fucking boring.
I mean it is kinda a funny anecdote >both sides develop an epic invincible wunderwaffe to crush the inferior enemy ships >they both encounter eachother in battle >none of them have guns strong enough to pierce eachother's armor so they just both give up
I mean you say wunderwaffe but the crazier thing is no one else before that thought "hey what if we nailed a couple layers of steel plates on this boat, do you think it might stop a cannonball?
>Hampton roads was a turning point
Yes but if you take Hampton roads into Norfolk that's where the hookers generally hang out, but if you keep going you'll eventually find Joe's Crab shack.
Ironclads existed before the ACW. The royal navy had Warrior, the first iron hulled ironclad warship already in service. Hampton roads was the first battle between two ironclads.
What was significant about Hampton roads was that it was the first engagement between ti fully steam powered ironclad. The British and French had been messing around with ironcladding ships of the line, but they still had full rigs of sail.
It's wierd how this fight that was basically a turning point in naval history, was just kind of a wierd oddity at the time because the armor was too strong for their own guns
The first tank battle at Villers Bretonneux turned out the same way. The German and British tank took shots at eachother, couldn’t really do anything, and both retreated. Which is weird because at that time tank armor was basically cardboard.
yeah, didn't the Mark I-IV use 6-pounder guns? That's not that impressive but it should still rip through tank armor, that shit was only designed to stop a machinegun
Engines are not the ship and most of the structure was gone (either remove or burnt). Not to mention the significant damage from the scuttling and submerging. 'm not saying there was nothing of the ship, I'm saying that just describing it as "a modification" is taking the piss...and you already know this.
Bro, are you having a break with reality? I never even said the word minor at any point, much less put it in the direct quote I copy pasted from your post
Seriously dog, take your meds
2 weeks ago
Anonymous
How exactly would you describe it if not as a modification? A rebuild?
The Confederation clearly lacked shipbuilding abilities since they never built another such ship in the three years after the loss of the Virginia.
2 weeks ago
Anonymous
>since they never built another such ship in the three years after the loss of the Virginia.
The Confederacy continued building ironclads for the duration of the war.
2 weeks ago
Anonymous
May we see some?
2 weeks ago
Anonymous
>we
speak for yourself fag
2 weeks ago
Anonymous
Here's an exhaustive list of confederate warships.
https://en.www.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ships_of_the_Confederate_States_Navy
Look through the ironclads section and you'll see that many of them were finished after 1862.
2 weeks ago
Anonymous
Anything comparable to the Merrimack in terms of displacement or armament?
2 weeks ago
Anonymous
My understanding is that the Virginia was by far the largest casemate ironclad, which is probably both due to the south not having the resources in iron and the fact that there wasn't much reason for them to be that big in the first place. They really could only operate in harbors and rivers, and the design wasn't really focused around massed firepower.
2 weeks ago
Anonymous
>They really could only operate in harbors and rivers
I hate that stupid rule in Civ games for ironclads
2 weeks ago
Anonymous
the Atlanta was an especially pretty one, didn't have much of a career though.
That's a bold strategy Grant, Let's see if it pays off for him.
I know nothing about this. was it ever beaten?
Yes and no. At first this ship (CSS Virginia) was fucking up the union ships at Hampton roads, sinking 2 iirc and badly damaging a third. Then the Monitor showed up and they both took pot shots at eachother for a few hours but couldn’t actually do much damage. At one point the Virginia tried to ram but the ram got stuck and broke off. The monitor’s captain got blinded when a shell struck his vision slit. Both eventually withdrew. The Virginia never got another opportunity to break the blockade and was eventually scuttled.
Tl:dr it was a draw and a strategic defeat for the rebels, but they still managed to sink a few ships.
>Tl:dr it was a draw and a strategic defeat for the rebels, but they still managed to sink a few ships.
Yep. It proved that ironclads were the future, and that the only thing that could fight one was another ironclad
In a direct fight, no.
Strategically, yeah.
Which ship would you rather fight in PrepHole? Neither could kill the other so it’s not a question a which one was better.
CSS Virginia. far more comfortable and way more soul.
not a fan of how low the monitor is on the water line, and the Virginia is sort of a jury rigged deathtrap. it's kind of a toss up
Much easier to escape the Virginia though. If a big wave overtook the Monitor you’d be fucked before you even knew it.
That's exactly what happened they all died. Here's the Monitor today:
?si=EW-gjleTaOuLfHiS
jerry rigged. pretty interesting phrase, look it up
NTA, but the original word is "jury." Comes from the age of sail as a bastardization of the French word "jour" for day. Means temporary in the sense of "daily."
The original is moron rigged, jerry and jury rigged are for emasculated fags that use pronouns
Monitor sank later because it capsized. Virginia was scuttled to prevent capture iirc. Seems to me Virginia is a safer design for a ship.
the virginia must have had bad spalling and splintering rattling around inside
I have never heard of any accounts of those things being a problem.
it's because none of the rebel sailors were literate, so none of them could write down their accounts. true story
Tbf being illiterate used to be pretty common among sailors, you took such a dangerous job because you didn't have many other prospects
FWIW I've read letters and journal entries from both union and confederate soldiers and at least from what I'd read, the people who did write seemed remarkably more literate than the average person today.
it was metal over wood, so the wood would have absorbed any spall.
there was a second ship build that is still sunk in the savanna harbor (in a near by shore line).
basically what they did was take an old steam ship, cut the top off, build a slant roof, and lay metal slats on the top. the bottom of the ship was wooden, but that didn't matter because it was below the waterline. the slant design was coincidental to improving the effectiveness by sloping and was likely chosen to save on material. it was noted by the officers how much more effective the armor was than expected. I think they compared it to the sloped walls of European forts.
>Neither could kill the other so it’s not a question a which one was better.
It may or may not have been cope but the inventor, John Ericsson, claimed after the battle that the Monitor's guns could have breached Virginia's armor had they been used at full power. Supposedly the crew either weren't told the gun was capable of hotter loads or didn't trust the gun to do so due to the USS Princeton accident. The USS Princeton was a ship that Ericcson designed several years prior to the war, during some VIP cruise the crew were demoing one of the guns and it exploded killing a half dozen people including both the Secretary of State and the Secretary of the Navy. The President at the time, (John Tyler) would have been killed but had just gone below deck. The gun that blew up wasn't Ericsson's design but he was the one who took the fall.
>"We would'a blew the Merrimack's hull wide open if only those dumb fucking gunners would'a used mah pissin' hot loads!"
I don't think that would have ended well.
>The gun that blew up wasn't Ericsson's design but he was the one who took the fall.
I don’t think Ericsson designed any guns to begin with. He was responsible for the turret and ship design but not the guns.
But who designed the toilet?
the Monitor hands down, just so I don't have to listen to
>WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEELLLLLLLL, IUNNO IFFE HEEEEEEEEV ENUFFF PAODURRRRRR
IIRC the US Navy had the most brainlet members out of the existing branches of the military and this wouldn't turn around until like 20 years later with the second Naval build up in US history and then take off from there. Because the Navy literally took everyone back in those days and it was hard fucking word, more so than the Army.
that was a soufuuuuurn aaaaccnt
I haven't seen that in a coon's age!
Well, I could see how for a man of your stature, you’d have trouble keeping up with at least half the posts you’ve known.
>fuck your union blockade
I have to admire the sheer balls of the guys who got into that cramped death trap, especially considering it killed its crew twice before it actually went into combat.
Considering its weapon was just a bomb on a long pole it’s effectively the first manned torpedo.
>shear balls
Buddy I hate to tell ya but I doubt people willingly volunteered for that shit sides it’s creator
Since this was a specialist mission I’m sure they did. You don’t draft guys to crew a new secret weapon.
Confederate trapezoid (heh, trap) ironclads were a dead end. Union Monitors were the future, establishing the Golden Path for warships to follow. Trapedzoid (heh, trap) ironclads represent inefficient slave mentality; each gun fixed in position and forced to fire in one direction, thus necessitating large batteries. Union Monitors represent a Free Man's mind, the guns freely turning to fire in any direction, with smaller, more efficient batteries. The Monitor bore many children, even to this day, as all turreted warships are her children. The trapezoidal (heh, trap) ironclad was a dead end doomed to die with her homeland, going out with the rest of the broadside warships.
True but the casemate layout was more reliable at the time. Even during the battle at Hampton roads the Monitor’s turret was more of a liability then an advantage.
But casemates remained a staple feature of warships until the deprecation of naval guns in the 1940s. Even now, VLS tubes are more like casemates than turrets.
What ship is that on?
Texas, there were later ships that had them as well, but they all got scrapped or sunk 60 years ago.
You are wrong. Trapezoid ironclads embraced the land like the Tiktaalik and had many great grandchildren that is alive to this day.
>ab ironclad built by hillbillies from a burned out frigate outperformed every active duty ship in the Russian Navy
stupid frogposter
stupid weebposter
It really do look like a pepe
KICK IT BACK
why did he do it?
VGH
>The first battle between Ironclad warships in history ended in a draw.
>One warship would later be scuttled to avoid capture and the other went into a storm and capsized.
why is real life so fucking boring.
I mean it is kinda a funny anecdote
>both sides develop an epic invincible wunderwaffe to crush the inferior enemy ships
>they both encounter eachother in battle
>none of them have guns strong enough to pierce eachother's armor so they just both give up
I mean you say wunderwaffe but the crazier thing is no one else before that thought "hey what if we nailed a couple layers of steel plates on this boat, do you think it might stop a cannonball?
It's less a matter of someone having the idea, and more a matter of the metallurgy, industrial tech, etc. being advanced enough.
We could make good steel plates long before that, the issue was more a lack of good riveting to actually fasten it properly to the hull
This
The French had the same idea 8 years prior to Hampton Roads, and had already used three ironclads in comat back in 1855.
As floating batteries, they didn’t fight other ironclads, which is why Hampton roads was a turning point
>Hampton roads was a turning point
Yes but if you take Hampton roads into Norfolk that's where the hookers generally hang out, but if you keep going you'll eventually find Joe's Crab shack.
Ironclads existed before the ACW. The royal navy had Warrior, the first iron hulled ironclad warship already in service. Hampton roads was the first battle between two ironclads.
What was significant about Hampton roads was that it was the first engagement between ti fully steam powered ironclad. The British and French had been messing around with ironcladding ships of the line, but they still had full rigs of sail.
>not so fast, bitch
It's wierd how this fight that was basically a turning point in naval history, was just kind of a wierd oddity at the time because the armor was too strong for their own guns
The first tank battle at Villers Bretonneux turned out the same way. The German and British tank took shots at eachother, couldn’t really do anything, and both retreated. Which is weird because at that time tank armor was basically cardboard.
yeah, didn't the Mark I-IV use 6-pounder guns? That's not that impressive but it should still rip through tank armor, that shit was only designed to stop a machinegun
TSWNRA
Tunisia shouldn't worry neighboring region Algeria?
>turning radius measured in kilometres
It's showing that the best ship the Confederacy could come up with was a modification of a Yankee built ship and buying ships in Europe.
>a modification
Underselling it a bit, aren't you?
It kept the engine and the main structure. Changing the superstructure wasn't that much.
Engines are not the ship and most of the structure was gone (either remove or burnt). Not to mention the significant damage from the scuttling and submerging. 'm not saying there was nothing of the ship, I'm saying that just describing it as "a modification" is taking the piss...and you already know this.
I didn't call it a minor modification.
Bro, are you having a break with reality? I never even said the word minor at any point, much less put it in the direct quote I copy pasted from your post
Seriously dog, take your meds
How exactly would you describe it if not as a modification? A rebuild?
The Confederation clearly lacked shipbuilding abilities since they never built another such ship in the three years after the loss of the Virginia.
>since they never built another such ship in the three years after the loss of the Virginia.
The Confederacy continued building ironclads for the duration of the war.
May we see some?
>we
speak for yourself fag
Here's an exhaustive list of confederate warships.
https://en.www.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ships_of_the_Confederate_States_Navy
Look through the ironclads section and you'll see that many of them were finished after 1862.
Anything comparable to the Merrimack in terms of displacement or armament?
My understanding is that the Virginia was by far the largest casemate ironclad, which is probably both due to the south not having the resources in iron and the fact that there wasn't much reason for them to be that big in the first place. They really could only operate in harbors and rivers, and the design wasn't really focused around massed firepower.
>They really could only operate in harbors and rivers
I hate that stupid rule in Civ games for ironclads
the Atlanta was an especially pretty one, didn't have much of a career though.
That was built in Scotland though.
It was a conversion, same as the Virginia.
such a fucking steampunk machine that was
Narrator: The Union blockade, was in fact, not fucked.
>blonde_confederate_girl_fucking_the_union_blockade_BLACKED.png
That's real cool and all but which makes the cuter shipgirl, monitor or Virginia?