What the fuck is wrong with the US Military and their promotion system?
>noooooo you can't just be good at your job you HAVE to promote to a new rank every week
>invents 10 superfluous extra enlisted ranks to justify dumb "up or out" mentality instead of just using the British system
>forces fit fighting-age males in their mid 20s into senior leadership positions pushing paper or wasting away on multi-year postings to training schools
>forces guys in their late 30s out of the military losing all of their experience and wisdom
The forced retirement age in my military is like 60 years old and 65 for Reserves. Why the fuck do Americans jettison their best and most experienced soldiers into homelessness when they have literal decades left of potential left in them?
Someone content in their position is likely to get stuck in a rut which makes them predictable which is generally a bad thing.
>nooo don't keep institutional knowledge noo
Being predictable is a GREAT thing if you're in a position like armorer, quartermaster, etc.
real life is not a fighting game and teh entirety of the miltiary is based on rigid doctrine and everything is about referencing and creating planning documents
It takes like 8 years to become a Corporal (E-3) in the British army (according to their official website), do you really want that?
Also, its not forced retirement, its optional, 20 years is just the requirement to get a pension.
>It takes like 8 years to become a Corporal (E-3) in the British army
A Corporal in the British Army is an E6 you fucking retard.
>Private (E3)
>Lance Corporal (E5)
>Corporal (E6)
>Sergeant (E7)
>Warrant Officer Class 2 (CSM)
>Warrant Officer Class 1 (RSM)
8 years is a reasonable time to become an E6 if you join at 16-18 you're 24-26
Uhhh i dont think thats correct, from what im seeing private is equal to E-1 and E-2, lance corporal is E-3 and Corporal is E-4.
What? You get kicked out in the Army for not making Staff Sergeant in like 18 years. How the fuck could you NOT promote at that point?
You are unironically completely and utterly retarded
The US Army has the career intermission program, which is literally the same thing except you get paid a little on top of it.
You can’t retire as an E-5 anymore. Max enlistment for E-5 is 15 years. They changed it around 2018-2019. Max enlistment for E-6 is 20
If you get E6 at 20 years, that person is a fucking idiot for not becoming an officer. I truly think that there should be a rule where all enlisted WILL become an officer after E5. Only those that sign an actual contract guaranteeing E9 will be allowed to remain enlisted.
yeah that’s the point. just pointing out that there are forced retirements under some circumstances in the military
lmao your contracts are retarded too
Here we do 4 years and then you can just stay in the Army forever on an open contract and leave whenever you like, take a year or 2 years without pay and come back. The only time you accrue additional locked-in contract years is if you change your job and have to go through another training school like going from Infantry to becoming a vehicle mechanic or a medic.
It's all retarded, friend. I don't know anything functions in our military.
>open contract and leave whenever you like, take a year or 2 years without pay and come back.
I like that method.
Man, it's almost like you're a different country with a different culture or something. So weird.
maybe for you. In the air force we can retire at 20 as an e5
US? Depends on the person. They raised the high year of tenure for E5 and E4 a few years ago so there is a sizable amount of people who managed to stay E4 for longer than they normally would be so they are (relatively) recently at E5 despite being in for almost 16 or 17 years. These people were grandfathered in. Normally you cannot retire as E5. The AF is all kinds of fucked up right now. Certain career fields only promote like 7 people a year while others are forcibly retiring people at 15 years because there's too many of them.
Bong soldiers serve for the sooner of 22 years or age 40, it isn't any different to the US.
Although SNCO's can serve a little longer.
Slower promotion is due to bong soldiers staying in service longer on average & that the amount of NCOs in a unit is much smaller. Cpl commands a section in bong land, rather than a Sgt in burger land. There is only 1 Sgt in a bong infantry platoon, where as a burger one has 10.
Meant to be 20 or age 40.
>It takes like 8 years to become a Corporal (E-3) in the British army
From my understanding a British corporal has the same responsibility as a US sergeant (E-4)
as an E-6 I meant
They do. A bong cpl is paid more than a US Sgt as well.
British people are so disgusting it's unreal.
Burger here. I met some Euro Sergeants in NATO that had been in a very, very long time. Great guys but they were old, broken, fat, and did not have it in them to do more than what they were already doing. While I'm happy they're still around, and have a wealth of experience, them still being in their military is actively blocking another young up-and-comer from promoting towards their potential.
Once you hit E7 in an Infantry Platoon the likelihood of you firing a shot in anger or even seeing the enemy drops to almost 0. In any dismounted land warfare context you're literally hundreds of metres away from the fighting in PHQ with the LT and the Medic, sitting on a radio liaising with the other Platoons and CHQ or other assets. You could be a PLSGT at age 100 in a fucking wheelchair and it wouldn't make a difference.
Ok, we can even assume that they're in perfect health, or that their health doesn't matter. Why are they still an E-5 after having had 20 years to promote? Is that indicative of someone with greater potential?
Well, one thing Ukraine has reinforced, and we saw it in Desert Storm, that it’s often more dangerous to be BEHIND the line than innit.
Especially if you’re yakking into a radio.
Against a competent enemy, using a radio is basically spray-painting your helmets and vest orange, jumping up and down, and waving a big yellow flag.
dumbass, privates have radios
You're an absolute fucking mouth breathing retard.
E-1 to E-3: you are learning not just your job but how to function like a soldier
E-4: you've been in long enough to know what you need to do, and to be flexible and fill roles outside of your MOS. Depending on how good you are, you will likely be put in charge of 3-5 Privates to show them the ropes.
E-5 & E-6: you are essentially the actual backbone of the armed forces. You are responsible for up to 20 junior soldiers, basically like an older sibling, making sure they learn what they need to, while also handling administrative duties and most likely 1 or 2 other generic responsibilities at the CO & BN level. You will also spend time recruiting, or instructing, or being a drill sergeant.
E7: You have been enlisted for around 15 years at this point, have seen the Army grow and change, and if you are an E7 today in the US military, you have served in an active war zone at least twice, if not more. You can serve as a First Sergeant (even if you don't have that rank), be the NCOIC for BN or even BDE S-shops, and fill in senior leadership roles when it comes to mentoring lower rank NCOs. You may even be the senior enlisted soldier for the management of an entire military base.
E8: basically like an E7, except better pay. Odds are you have served close to 20 year at this point, and are eligible for retirement (NOT required).
E9: You are a confirmed lifer. You no longer do anything relating to your MOS and serve as a senior enlisted leader for a BN, or BDE, or DIV, or higher. You are responsible for hundreds or thousands of joes, and are more bureaucrat and politician than anything else.
That's just for enlisted. You can go from a PFC to SGT in less than three years, or spend three years chilling as a SPC. I know it's almost certain that this is a troll post, but God damn, at least put some effort in.
No, you're an absolute fucking mouth breathing retard. Your system is fucking retarded.
Private: you are responsible for yourself.
At this rank you can serve in all kinds of roles within the Infantry from 81mm Mortars to .50cals to recon and develop your skills laterally instead of being forced into some bullshit leadership position
Lance Corporal: you've been in the military for 4+ years and you've cross-trained on a number of different specialties as a Private and you're now responsible for 3 other soldiers and you are the 2IC of the Infantry Section of 8 people
Corporal: you've been in the Army for ~10 years and you're in charge of an Infantry Section so you directly command 7 other men and work with your Section 2IC, a Lance Corporal.
Sergeant: you're the Platoon Sergeant
Notice how I condensed 6 entire bullshit ranks into 3? You're fucking retarded mutt
I will give you some grace on this issue since you are clearly a neverserved. But you turned the first three levels of rank into four, which is actually a larger amount.
No, you stupid fuck, you turned ONE rank (Private) into FOUR FUCKING RANKS and invented a whole new rank (specialist) for absolutely no reason.
An Infantry Section in the British Army has 8 men, and there are 4 Sections in a Platoon, which is commanded by a Lieutenant and a Sergeant.
How are you so retarded that you need 20 NCOs in a Platoon?
>How are you so retarded that you need 20 NCOs in a Platoon?
There aren't....? At most there are 5.
you have 2 sergeants and a staff sergeant per squad, 4 squads in a platoon and then you also have a PLSGT. That's literally 13 sergeants per platoon at a minimum
No there's 1 sergeant per squad and one staff sergeant per platoon in my experience.
cope harder
About what someone's fanfiction?
lmao are you really going to pretend that a rifle platoon is made of
>one 2LT
>one E6
>three E5s
>33 privates
>I know this stuff, I read an infographic on the Internet!!
the very definition of an armchair general
And here im sitting with one SSG, 3 SGTs, and a CPL because admin can't get there shit together.
Did they just throw all the excess ncos in one squad?
No its just a odd bit of timing. For quite a while we just had our SSG as our only NCO. Then we got one guy promoted to CPL and a SGT transferred in. Then the CPL did something stupid so they took away his slot and instead promoted another solider to SGT. The first SGT said he was ETSing in the next couple months and then they let one of our old squadmates who transferred out to pick up a E5 slot come back to take his place but for about three months we had 5 NCOs
>pictures are functionally the same
>TLs are just called sergeants instead of “WHIPPER SNIPPER BANGERS AND MASH CORPREAL 2nd DEGREE CRUMPET”
>this triggers the bong to no end
The only real difference is the addition of an another TL, which is really due to how a teams are expected to be able to move independent of each other during an assault with the SSG coordinating between the two while relaying to higher.
Not enough buzzwords, I’m not sure what you’re trying to say. Try again?
Yeah, mutts are fucking retarded and incapable of understanding and executing command intent without constant micromanaging so they need a bloated under-class of junior NCOs to individually direct each soldier in each fireteam
just admit you're 60 IQ subhumans and Brits are better Infantrymen in every conceivable way
>add in one additional TL role per squad
>this again triggers the Bong to no end
Jesus Nigel, did all the inbreeding leave you incapable of seeing they’re functionally the same thing with different naming conventions?
haven't you got some morons to kneel to you circumcised gay cuck? another 100 billion dollars to give to israel and ukraine?
Are you still upset that your "regiments" are the size of a battalion?
Kek anon you must have a learning disability or something
Unironic garden gnome post
>retire at age 37
oh no, that sounds absolutely devastating.
good. up or out.
>ITT neverserveds argue with infographics and vidya logic
americans just love their bling. they made up more ranks so young people can feel more important compared to their allied equals who aren't covered in gold bars and braided ropes and shit
in the US you literally get a medal for being qualified on the basic service rifle. you do your yearly mandatory range day, here's a medal!
you also get one for getting good marks at basic and still wear it even if you make four star general. same for the ridiculous number of bars, you get one just for being in the military at the time of a particular operation. meanwhile in canada if you're in a given service you can get like three operation ribbons max because of how operations are defined and each one/type encompasses half the damn world
lmao the mutt military is so disgustingly Judaic it's unironically hilarious
>1 million different micro ranks which don't mean anything to keep the zog moron cattle placated and feeling important
>gnomish corporate rat race style promotion system where you have to be constantly groveling on your knees sucking dick in order to promote or you literally get fired
>stupid little decorative awards for doing nothing, literal glorified good goy points
>unceremoniously kicks out career soldiers at 20 years to make way for fresh moron cattle
>gnomish VA which denies medical care to 100% disabled wheelchair-bound blind amputees and directly causes 90% of veteran homelessness and opioid addiction
but at least they get a free meal on veterans day amirite
If you want to constantly get a stream of new recruits on the officer track you need to have real prospects of promotion.
has your country considered simply paying people for their service
You get the wrong kind of people by focusing on pay in the same position over promotions
You do get at the heart of the personnel management issue. 20 years as the standard career is both too short and too long. It's too short for the valuable personnel who could perform 40 years of service. It's also too long for the dullards who are best booted after 5 years. However it is also necessary for recruiting and retention so it's not really fixable.
It isn’t mandatory you get out after 20 years though? You can keep serving for well after 20 if you want, 20 is just the minimum to qualify for a standard retirement. 30 years or 62 years old are the typical “mandatory” retirement times for enlisted- and even those can be waived on a case by case basis.
It depends on the rank. For officers, with very few exceptions, the mandatory retirement age is 64. That is set by federal law. In the 1800s the army promoted by seniority and so you just waited for someone to die. The first purpose of the military retirement system was to clear out ancient officers.
These days you are set a maximum amount of time you are allowed to stay in by officer rank. Captains can stay in a maximum of 20 years, 4 star Generals a maximum of 40 years.
The enlisted personnel management system is similar, but not set by federal statute. So while there is a law forcing officers to retire at 64 there are just internal policies forcing the enlisted to retire.
Without getting too in the weeds at 20 years you are eligible for 50% of your old pay, at 30 years 75%, and at 40 years 75%. That last one isn't a typo.
This isn't the 19th century, retard. You can't sit as a General Officer for 20 years. Learn something and move up or get the fuck out.
30+ year old mid-tier NCOs are an embarrassment and the most mediocre humans you will ever meet.
Sweep them away so they can live the rest of their no-jawline lives working at a local Pep Boys.
>t. power tripping 22 year old E5 POG who makes his soldiers call him Sergeant
>30+ year old mid-tier NCOs
That's the typical age bracket for a mid-level NCO
SGM Mike Glover was an E8 at age 28
Special Forces is a completely different ballgame and you'd know that if you ever served. Consider how many people are medically retired early out of Special Forces, and how difficult it is to keep them in service considering the opportunities for them in the private sector. There's even a measurable difference between branches, a low retention rate service like the Army is going to have faster promotion rates than a high retention service like the Coast Guard.
You are unironically right. I'm going to OCS specifically to get away from these people as my peer group
t. E8 absolutely disgusted by his peers
>British system
qrd?
It almost feels like warriortard made this to try and get people to mock the rightly retarded British rank structure
The army has a system of constantly rotating officers into new unfamiliar positions when they’re not in command for broadening experiences but this does contribute to up or out since you eventually have to choose between soul crushing work to grind out a good OER for that LTC spot or more enjoyable work that ends your career. The alternative though is transitioning to guard/reserve where promotions are less of a vice crushing your balls and you can retire as a terminal major at 20 years, something completely unfeasible for active
>t. Weekend warrior O