Reminder that it took the US 31 months to send just 35 Abrams. And while europe gears up to deliver 200 Leopard 1, the US is still sitting on hundreds of M60 it could give to Ukraine, but doesn't.
Oh also F16's.
Pretty sure the US is trying to deliberately drag this on so the Russians are depleted.
Judging by how incompetent the Russians are, the US could have sent enough advanced shit to end Russia. They don't.
they are still afraid russia will collapse if losing too quickly
goal is still to slowly deplete russia of combat capability until they pull back piecemeal on their own - with enough time to find some excuses for why they are giving up area x now
It's a region of Russia that's unironically US fanboys. I wonder if things have changed since the war, since being publicly pro US in Russia right now is practically begging to be sent to the gulag.
Look at this fucking HOI4 map bullshit. Lemme guess: there's an independent Chechnya in the midst of a civil war, Prigozhin's son rules from Rostov-on-Don, St. Petersburg is a liberal republic, Moscow is neo-Bolshevik, there's a tiny military junta called "The Remnant" headed by Gerasimov, an unstable, Ukrainian puppet called "Free Russia" centered on Belgorod, the Tuvan Horde is ruled by Shoigu Khan, and Girkin is the regent of an Imperial Russian larp-state.
> Your brain on HOI4
Why the fuck does America control the middle of Siberia and Japan hold that strip of land on the border Belarus? Why the fuck would Japan take back the rest of that northern island?
> Your brain on HOI4
Why the fuck does America control the middle of Siberia and Japan hold that strip of land on the border Belarus? Why the fuck would Japan take back the rest of that northern island?
https://i.imgur.com/4n2E5EY.png
>Why is America in the center of Siberia
for memes
Collapsing russia with no survivors would be kino.
Imagine russian children selling their body for a meal, russian babushkas that shilled putin dying painfully of starvation.
Oh wait you dont have to imagine that, this already happened in the 90s when russians ruled russians. The only mistake of the west was to save these animals, should have let them all die.
idk, at this point it feels like "it's not a bug, it's a feature"
there wouldn't be so much kvetching about not sending any more aid if it boiling the frog was the actual intent
>they are still afraid russia will collapse if losing too quickly
This is my guess. Western Europeans and Americans still see Russia as a member of the "Great powers" club. Western Europeans from back when they were superpowers and played in the theater of old European politics and the US from the cold war.
Whatever the reason, this is shortsighted, expensive, harmful to the West and cruel. "Realpolitik" explanations are all copes to justify being a shortsighted asshole.
>they are still afraid russia will collapse if losing too quickly
This is something no westerner (except for trained specialists) can understand. Russia would be 100% a-okay for decades to come if Ukraine won the war in 2022. Fast and decisive loss with major western support would be extremely easy to explain to people at home. >we lost cuz we were fighting whole NATO, duh
Now, you will say that they are still saying that. Sure. But it doesn't really matter if they keep saying that Ukraine is almost finished, just wait 2 more weeks. Russia has literally no control over what is happening inside anymore. Anyone who is willing to arm 3k men can take Moscow and crown himself king. The longer this goes on the more likely collapse gets. Especially considering how their economy keeps getting worse and worse. Something like 60% of russians are struggling to pay off debts that take as much as 90% of their paycheck. Almost nobody cares about the war but at the same time they will lynch the one that loses it.
>Pretty sure the US is trying to deliberately drag this on so the Russians are depleted.
This will only work if Ukraine has more manpower than Russia, then you get recent reports that even if Russia is bleeding, then Ukraine is equally bleeding as well.
>the US is still sitting on hundreds of M60 it could give to Ukraine
We don't have any M60s and haven't for years. The only M60s left in the United States are range targets or in private hands.
Mainly because Biden a geriatric degenerate and a subhuman coward, as are the rest of his clique.
Also virtually the entire M60 fleet is basically worthless because they're either rusting away in glorified scrapyards or they get used for target practice.
they are still afraid russia will collapse if losing too quickly
goal is still to slowly deplete russia of combat capability until they pull back piecemeal on their own - with enough time to find some excuses for why they are giving up area x now
>they are still afraid russia will collapse if losing too quickly
Well that's an abysmal strategy that's 100% doomed to backfire because dragging this thing out makes a Russian state collapse MORE likely, not less. The economic, material, and human toll becomes increasingly irrecoverable and the next Prigozhin aspirant suddenly.
If we merely wanted to deplete Russian combat capability but keep the Russian state itself intact, NATO Intervention on Day 1 and bombing the Russians out of Ukraine with a strict "no attacks on Russian territory under any circumstances" policy would have been the best option. Then America and ONLY America would get to decide where and when to stop. Now, there are Russian paramilitaries armed with NATO weaponry and wearing NATO uniforms periodically running around Belgorod Oblast, wasting Russian soldiers.
Abrams are being held back for the Russian 'counter-offensive' because the military has been given the order to capture Avdiivka by the end of the year so Putin has a 'victory' to show the population so they vote for him (it's rigged, but you gotta pretend). So they're there for that.
they are still afraid russia will collapse if losing too quickly
goal is still to slowly deplete russia of combat capability until they pull back piecemeal on their own - with enough time to find some excuses for why they are giving up area x now
https://i.imgur.com/EKXuYfh.jpg
This makes sense. Dismantling them too quickly could cause somebody to act rashly.
>Ukraine has twice as many casualties pr. capita
Russia has 140 Million people, 99% of whom are not involved in the war in any way, shape or form. So if they have half the per capita casualties they must REALLY be fucking up. You retard.
Lmao no it won't, Russia would just blow them up with artillery when they find 80 concentrated armored vehicles getting stuck in a minefield if they followed your stupid plan.
Attacking in small groups is normal in this kind of war, and Ukraine has accepted limited gains made slowly in exchange for limiting casualties. They'd have zero Leopards by now otherwise.
Western doctrine is way too reliant on "MUH AIR SUPERIORITY". We don't conceive of conflicts where we might not have it, forcing us to fight at closer-range.
No, because NATO has combat engineering battalions and regiments equipped with breaching and bridging equipment and structured to deal with much larger and more complex obstacles than we see in the Ukraine. Apparently east of Berlin this is unknown technology.
This is completely untrue. I've literally had conversations with three generals on the topic of CCW treaty and mine warfare and they all predicted massive complex obstacle belts (the big daddy version of a minefield that dwarfs what we see in the Ukraine) in any peer land war. The problem isn't that no one saw mines coming, it's that combat engineering is a complex area of warfare that's extremely dependent on combined arms and levels of individual and collective training that you can't really export or do for another country.
The flip side is that Russia is very authoritarian which means if they arm too much of their population their army might mutiny and march on Moscow. This has nearly happened already and we already have reports of Russians rebelling against Putin.
Is this the ukranian desert?
Oleshky sands, left bank
Hello oldfag
Reminder that it took the US 31 months to send just 35 Abrams. And while europe gears up to deliver 200 Leopard 1, the US is still sitting on hundreds of M60 it could give to Ukraine, but doesn't.
Oh also F16's.
Pretty sure the US is trying to deliberately drag this on so the Russians are depleted.
Judging by how incompetent the Russians are, the US could have sent enough advanced shit to end Russia. They don't.
they are still afraid russia will collapse if losing too quickly
goal is still to slowly deplete russia of combat capability until they pull back piecemeal on their own - with enough time to find some excuses for why they are giving up area x now
This makes sense. Dismantling them too quickly could cause somebody to act rashly.
>picrel
mmmmmm pp is hard
Question is: would Buryiata use nukes on moscow after putins meat grinder genocide?
>pp hard at image of an unironic homosexual
I got news for you; that means you're gay
Why is America in the center of Siberia?
It's where Mitchell WerBell VI currently lives.
Turn the least populated part of the country into one giant FOB so they can jump down the throats of anyone who starts shit.
Pic unrelated.
>stationed/deployed to Siberia
That makes every shitty American base sound like heaven by comparison.
guess where all of Russia's oil fields are
It's a counter-alaska trade deal
It's a region of Russia that's unironically US fanboys. I wonder if things have changed since the war, since being publicly pro US in Russia right now is practically begging to be sent to the gulag.
I wouldn't worry about it
>Why is America in the center of Siberia
for memes
Look at this fucking HOI4 map bullshit. Lemme guess: there's an independent Chechnya in the midst of a civil war, Prigozhin's son rules from Rostov-on-Don, St. Petersburg is a liberal republic, Moscow is neo-Bolshevik, there's a tiny military junta called "The Remnant" headed by Gerasimov, an unstable, Ukrainian puppet called "Free Russia" centered on Belgorod, the Tuvan Horde is ruled by Shoigu Khan, and Girkin is the regent of an Imperial Russian larp-state.
This map would just result in an almost immediate war, and someone would take over everything again.
> Your brain on HOI4
Why the fuck does America control the middle of Siberia and Japan hold that strip of land on the border Belarus? Why the fuck would Japan take back the rest of that northern island?
gunther swallowed the entire bottle of NATO pills and overdosed
hehe...
BENIS XDDDD
Collapsing russia with no survivors would be kino.
Imagine russian children selling their body for a meal, russian babushkas that shilled putin dying painfully of starvation.
Oh wait you dont have to imagine that, this already happened in the 90s when russians ruled russians. The only mistake of the west was to save these animals, should have let them all die.
idk, at this point it feels like "it's not a bug, it's a feature"
there wouldn't be so much kvetching about not sending any more aid if it boiling the frog was the actual intent
>they are still afraid russia will collapse if losing too quickly
This is my guess. Western Europeans and Americans still see Russia as a member of the "Great powers" club. Western Europeans from back when they were superpowers and played in the theater of old European politics and the US from the cold war.
Whatever the reason, this is shortsighted, expensive, harmful to the West and cruel. "Realpolitik" explanations are all copes to justify being a shortsighted asshole.
>they are still afraid russia will collapse if losing too quickly
This is something no westerner (except for trained specialists) can understand. Russia would be 100% a-okay for decades to come if Ukraine won the war in 2022. Fast and decisive loss with major western support would be extremely easy to explain to people at home.
>we lost cuz we were fighting whole NATO, duh
Now, you will say that they are still saying that. Sure. But it doesn't really matter if they keep saying that Ukraine is almost finished, just wait 2 more weeks. Russia has literally no control over what is happening inside anymore. Anyone who is willing to arm 3k men can take Moscow and crown himself king. The longer this goes on the more likely collapse gets. Especially considering how their economy keeps getting worse and worse. Something like 60% of russians are struggling to pay off debts that take as much as 90% of their paycheck. Almost nobody cares about the war but at the same time they will lynch the one that loses it.
>Pretty sure the US is trying to deliberately drag this on so the Russians are depleted.
This will only work if Ukraine has more manpower than Russia, then you get recent reports that even if Russia is bleeding, then Ukraine is equally bleeding as well.
I just want ziggers to suffer anon and the best way to be cruel to someone is to let them have hope before crushing it before their eyes
>the US is still sitting on hundreds of M60 it could give to Ukraine
We don't have any M60s and haven't for years. The only M60s left in the United States are range targets or in private hands.
Mainly because Biden a geriatric degenerate and a subhuman coward, as are the rest of his clique.
Also virtually the entire M60 fleet is basically worthless because they're either rusting away in glorified scrapyards or they get used for target practice.
>they are still afraid russia will collapse if losing too quickly
Well that's an abysmal strategy that's 100% doomed to backfire because dragging this thing out makes a Russian state collapse MORE likely, not less. The economic, material, and human toll becomes increasingly irrecoverable and the next Prigozhin aspirant suddenly.
If we merely wanted to deplete Russian combat capability but keep the Russian state itself intact, NATO Intervention on Day 1 and bombing the Russians out of Ukraine with a strict "no attacks on Russian territory under any circumstances" policy would have been the best option. Then America and ONLY America would get to decide where and when to stop. Now, there are Russian paramilitaries armed with NATO weaponry and wearing NATO uniforms periodically running around Belgorod Oblast, wasting Russian soldiers.
*the next Prigozhin aspirant suddenly stands a reasonable chance of success instead of no chance.
If this war was about helping the Ukrainians, then US and EU wouldn't have gone and got Ukraine to their sphere of influence in the first place.
Abrams are being held back for the Russian 'counter-offensive' because the military has been given the order to capture Avdiivka by the end of the year so Putin has a 'victory' to show the population so they vote for him (it's rigged, but you gotta pretend). So they're there for that.
Correct. They're waiting for the stupid-ass Russian barbarian to exhaust himself.
I wouldn't hold my breath. I never got good Leopard 2 kino for my taxes. Or at least I've never seen any.
>where challenger?!
>where leopard 2?!
The crews need time to train on their own soil.
>
cope of all copes
>kino
tanks only seem to be doing well when they're sniping defensive positions from long range, which isn't likely to result in kino
Likely in strategic reserve
Or waiting for an opportunity to not drive through a minefield
>AAAAAHHH WHERE'S MY SHOW WHERE ARE MY HECKING DEAD RUSSIARINOS I NEED MY FIX!!!!
this and pol are the boards that churn out the most serial killers.
Given what happened to the leopards and bradleys, you probably won't.
>Ukraine has twice as many casualties pr. capita
Russia has 140 Million people, 99% of whom are not involved in the war in any way, shape or form. So if they have half the per capita casualties they must REALLY be fucking up. You retard.
Minefields, artillery and drones
It's obvious that they signed a deal where the Abrams will only be used textbook US military style.
You'll never see a lone Abrams like how Ukraine uses Leo2s.
When you see the Abrams it'll be half of them supported by hundreds of armored vehicles and anti-air just like how the US military operates.
Lmao no it won't, Russia would just blow them up with artillery when they find 80 concentrated armored vehicles getting stuck in a minefield if they followed your stupid plan.
Attacking in small groups is normal in this kind of war, and Ukraine has accepted limited gains made slowly in exchange for limiting casualties. They'd have zero Leopards by now otherwise.
>It's obvious that
(You) must be 18 years of age or older to access this website.
Slav reality will beat out of touch Western doctrine
I'm sure the Abrams are all fighting as indirect artillery
not sure if it's out of touch so much as it is inappropriate for this fairly unique conflict
Western doctrine is way too reliant on "MUH AIR SUPERIORITY". We don't conceive of conflicts where we might not have it, forcing us to fight at closer-range.
true, part of why US wants to maintain air dominance
AirLand Battle was explicitly based around the assumption that NATO wouldn't have air superiority over the battlefield.
Seems like huge-ass minefields were an oversight in that plan.
No, because NATO has combat engineering battalions and regiments equipped with breaching and bridging equipment and structured to deal with much larger and more complex obstacles than we see in the Ukraine. Apparently east of Berlin this is unknown technology.
No general knew that mass landmines is a viable meta
This is completely untrue. I've literally had conversations with three generals on the topic of CCW treaty and mine warfare and they all predicted massive complex obstacle belts (the big daddy version of a minefield that dwarfs what we see in the Ukraine) in any peer land war. The problem isn't that no one saw mines coming, it's that combat engineering is a complex area of warfare that's extremely dependent on combined arms and levels of individual and collective training that you can't really export or do for another country.
The flip side is that Russia is very authoritarian which means if they arm too much of their population their army might mutiny and march on Moscow. This has nearly happened already and we already have reports of Russians rebelling against Putin.
If they're not seen in video that means they're kept in reserve and Ukraine is probably waiting for F-16s before they get deployed.
the first video we're gonna get of a Abrams is gonna be one getting hit or burning because the west is so autistic about taking videos of their gear
Do you think supplying the ARAT kits for Abrams in Ukraine would be useful like they did eventually did with BRAT kits for the Bradley?
parked in a circle around kiev
They're cutting up the Abrams and dropping the parts from drones.
Man they have to get them across the Dnipro and re-paint them tan.