Czech republic officially selects F-35 over Gripen

To calm down swedesisters, they also want to buy CV-90 to replace their ancient BMP-2 IFV's

  1. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    can they even afford it?

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      I doubt it.
      t. Czech

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        F35 will solve our air force until 2050s at least. That is something that Gripen would not have done and we'd need to be buying replacement in 15 years.
        Sure if we had to pay lump sum for them at once, we would not be able to afford it - but that is not going to happen. The payments will be laid out over time. Not to mention that in the long term (I.e. decades) F35 absolutely is the most cost effective choice.
        Unless your ideal scenario is just slapping some A2A on L39s and calling it a day of course.
        So yes, we absolutely can afford F35s.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Who does use Gripens anyway? Sweden and couple 3rd world shitholes that are too poor to afford American, British, or French planes but don't want to use Soviet surplus?

          to add to this who else has them in the EU

          ther Germs and Poles wants them too
          Greece aswell and i bet i forgot some other too

          just the better choice for everything

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            those singapore numbers scream chinese reverse engineering op

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      you are literally black
      have a nice day

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        calm down swede

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      of course, they have an open czech ready

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Carlos I'm calling ICE

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Absolutely not.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      If a third world shithole like Singapore with a population of less than 6 million can afford it, surely a developed EU member state with twice the population can

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        m8 Singapore has a GDP 1.5 times bigger than Czechia and spends 4-5% on its military budget compared to CZ's 1%

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Because Czechs got cucked by the previous government into doing fuckall about their military, and before that it was one bribery scandal after another.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            wow. lets compare
            >not quite
            good try sweatie

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              >lets compare
              Prague actually can't into skyscrapers, because muh panorama, what you see is as tall they were allowed to do

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >Because Czechs got cucked by the previous government
            They rented Grippens they couldn't afford and now they want F35 they definitely can't afford. Nothing changed, and nothing will change in this regard.
            Czechs brutally downsized their army precisely because they thought 'Nah NATO will take care of it' and just embezzled money for paper shit like Pandur, which they totalled, entire column, during routine travel on the highway.

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              Czechs wanted to BUY 36 Gripens, back when their current president was still a prime minister, but after the bribery scandal unfolded, they ended up leasing 12+2 instead.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >a third world shithole like Singapore
        mola. llo, neev.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >If a third world shithole like Singapore
        are all PrepHole posters this fucking stupid nowdays?
        is there even point coming to this place anymore?
        I can literally smell the fucking high school coming off this board

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >singapoor
          >not a shithole
          SEAmonkey detected

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            I've travelled around the world and I can say that if Singapore is a shithole, United States is a shit in the gutter. What nation isn't a shithole by your standards?

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              For starters, those who aren't chink puppet states

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Not him, just needed to call you a retard

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      obviously not but that never stopped the government.

      What are the benefits of choosing a foreign-made equipment instead of domestically (for the region) produced equipment that will complicate logistics and parts availability?

      while czechia actually has relatively decent amount of plane makers, only company that makes military planes is aero l-159 which is only a trainer/light attack.

      https://i.imgur.com/VsFOm1o.png

      Obviously the lynx isnt as good as certain people here like to claim it is.

      source? i'd kinda like to read the report, can be in slovak.

      https://i.imgur.com/hVD68Xh.jpg

      Why no F-15s?

      isn't that even more expensive, and US probably wouldn't sell it to pleb nations like us anyway?

      So what's up? For decades we were RENTING two shitty Grippens, and suddenly we can buy subscription based platform like F-35? With 12% inflation?

      surprisingly czech military makes quite good purchashing choices recently. the problem wthi gripen is that we have the old versions so even if we got them for free, you end up with shitty old plane that will need replacing soon anyway and the modernized gripens are like half entirely different plane which we'd have to pay for. so long term it should save money and give us actually modern airforce shared with slovaks and other nato cunts.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        F-15EX probably isn't going to be much, if at all more expensive than the F-35. People mention the first batch of F-15EX's being way more expensive but that's normal. Operating costs of both planes looks to be about the same, F-35 isn't cheap to maintain.

        Real reasons you guys won't get the F-15 is that you shouldn't wait for the F-15EX, shouldn't buy older versions of the F-15, and really you shouldn't buy a plane that likely will never see another major upgrade program again.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          the f-15 was never in question anyway. it was always f-35s or gripen. which makes it more surprising somehow we ended up picking the right choice.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            actually i'm wrong, apparently at first it was f16V or gripen but i guess new government decided to go full out. still good decision

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      I wouldn't be surprised if the US is financing this in some way or another.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      depends on how many you buy.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      We could barely afford to fly JAS-39s, there's no way our tight military budget can sustain this.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        t. Pepik from Olomouc Oblast

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          This might come shocking to burgers, but places with limited army budgets have this tiny problem, if you buy a piece or two of ridiculously expensive equipment, which F-35 objectively is, you won't have money for other stuff. Like bullets.
          In my mandatory 1 year military service I have shot two magazines out of vz58 and that was it and that was BEFORE a massive downsizing of our forces and equipment.
          I know how to push up and clean floors though.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            When the Gripen got selected for the first time, Czechs were still giving 2% of GDP on defence, and initially there were plans for three wings of Gripens (36 jets). That they ended up with 14 Gripens on lease was a result of bribery scandal years before the financial crisis, not Czechs being poor. That they keep leasing the Gripen for another decade is responsibility of by then minister of defence, who didn't bother with any procurement, and simply signed for another ten years with Gripen. Still, at the time there was a lot of money, and no crisis in sight.

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              True and since bribery and corruption is still national sport (althought much less than further east, funny how that works) I cannot imagine how much we will lose with F35.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Well, indeed. If the F-35 order won't get through, we will end up somehow with 24 Gripens for the price of 24 F-35s.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        I dont think thats really going to be a problem in the long run, the problem is going to be the current ruling party losing the next election and ANO winning again, probably even cancelling the contract.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          ANO won't cancel shit. They are only sperging now, because they are THE opposition, but even Babish must be aware that keeping the Gripens would be worse option in the long run.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >but even Babish must be aware that keeping the Gripens would be worse option in the long run

            Depends. I was really curious what would be his reaction to russian war if the comrade agent Bureš was still in the office.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            If you saw one of his underlings on TV yesterday, you would be doubtful just like I am, and you know how people are with the prices of shit, half of his coters are people who vote for him only because he gave them gibs, and he wont be able to do that of he has to pay for the F-35s

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Are we talking about the same ANO that flipped the bird at Leonardo, and bought Vipers and Venoms directly from Murica?

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            We werent in an economic crisis back then, people are gonna want to see less spending, and Im afraid they will simply cancel it.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      they aren't as expensive as they used to be
      different models as well

  2. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    https://www.nasdaq.com/articles/czechs-want-f-35-fighter-jets-cv-90-fighting-vehicles-media-says

    >unfortunately decent sources are only in Czech for now

  3. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Who does use Gripens anyway? Sweden and couple 3rd world shitholes that are too poor to afford American, British, or French planes but don't want to use Soviet surplus?

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Give them to Ukraine, Sweden.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Are Gripens really that bad with no redeeming qualities. I'm not saying they are match for F-35 but how they fare when compared to let's say F-16?

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        They are pretty comperable. The f-16 makes more sense for parts availability alone

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        They can fly and work which for jet fighters is a quality already but they're very light. The E's max takeoff weight is like 5,000 pounds less than an F-16.

        Light fighters are nice because higher weight tends just mean a more expensive aircraft to operate but it also limits them heavily on things like range.

        In terms of capabilities a new F-16 is better in a lot of ways. That doesn't go into even more modernized 4.5 gen fighters.

        There's also a bit of a disdain towards it because of its insane marketing. One of the beetter examples is Gripen people talking about ECM non-stop when ECM and EW systems are common on jet fighters for aerial combat and the way they push it implies it's competing with a full sized EW plane like the Growler. It's not. It doesn't have the room for an EW system like that. It's a bit unfair but on the internet the insane shilling has left people disliking it.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          All that extra weight means fuck huge takeoff run. The Gripen is designed with using roads and unpaved runways, both of which is handy for exactly the kind of conflict like in ukraine.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Which is exactly why Sweden hasn't loaned a single one to Ukraine. UGH.

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              Sweden needs to demonstrate the plane's abilities in combat. Ukraine is an opportunity. Lend a few.

              Sweden isn't lending planes to Ukraine because Sweden's defenses have been sucky since we de-armed after the Soviet Union fell. The air force is what we have and we're not really interested in weakening it while we try to join NATO.
              If we still had our old arsenal, sending a Gripen would probably be fine though since we could've use Viggen to fill in temporarily.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        They are comparable to the f16, but then why not just buy the proven f16? Basically the gripen is in an awkward middle ground spot when it comes to value.

        can they even afford it?

        Brings up a valid point, between some of the highest inflation in Europe, being on their own currency, many industries just getting back to normal after covid, and the likely upcoming energy issues (cz gets the vast majority of its natural gas from russia, though there is also domestic coal and nuclear power)
        the economy isn’t looking too great, and new planes would be a big purchase even in normal times for a country of 11 million people

        >t. knower

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Yes
        >less fuel, essentially requires external fuel tanks
        >half the max payload, not to mention that the aformentioned fuel tanks take up almost half the pylons
        >Better avionics than F-16C, much worse avionics than F-16V
        >more expensive to buy and maintain than F-16
        Only countries that bought them are those that SAAB managed to bribe into buying them

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >less fuel, essentially requires external fuel tanks
          Less fuel capacity is a non-issue in Europe. The extra operational range isn't needed, so a smaller airframe is preferable to a larger airframe with a greater fuel capacity.

          >half the max payload, not to mention that the aformentioned fuel tanks take up almost half the pylons
          Again, Gripen is intended for a shorter operational range and thus doesn't need to carry as much ordnance for a single mission. A smaller airframe and a shorter turnaround time is preferable under these conditions.

          >Better avionics than F-16C, much worse avionics than F-16V
          I don't know enough about the differences in avionics to have a clear opinion on this. How exactly are the avionics "much worse" than in the F-16V?

          >more expensive to buy and maintain than F-16
          The F-16, being one of the cheaper jets to maintain, still has a cost per flight hour that is about 50% higher than Gripen.
          https://stratpost.com/gripen-operational-cost-lowest-of-all-western-fighters-janes/

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >tl;dr it doesnt matter the plane is shit because we designed it to be shit
            Seethe and cope saabite.
            Chances are that sweden itself will switch to F35s by 2040s and after that your company will be relegated to the dustbin tier of turkey or brazil tier companies that survive on nothing but selling cheap sugarcoated shit to thirdworlders, where it has always belonged

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              Why are you so mad? Did a Gripen pilot sleep with your girlfriend or something?

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                I just hate people defending a plane that is objectively awful in every single way.

                >a gripen pilot
                A rare thing already. Good thing thing won't exist in two decades.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Butthurt

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Operational and fuel range do matter because these planes wont just be doing air policing over the baltics forever.
            One day, when we finally decide to solve the vatnik issue once and for all, the planes will need to be flying a long way. Russia's pretty big.

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              The Danes and Norwegians are quite pleased with the range, given the airspace that they cover as part of their QRA and EEZ's

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            The AN/APG-83 has around 1400 T/R modules, the Selex ES-05 has 992. There are no real ways to know specifics but the size different and stronger power plant for the F-16V means it probably has a noticeably more powerful radar.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >I don't know enough about the differences in avionics to have a clear opinion on this. How exactly are the avionics "much worse" than in the F-16V?
            it doesn't, this is typical burgerfat education levels.
            F16V and GripenE are almost exactly on par in every way, the Gripen is more agile, the F16V has longer range.

            Yes
            >less fuel, essentially requires external fuel tanks
            >half the max payload, not to mention that the aformentioned fuel tanks take up almost half the pylons
            >Better avionics than F-16C, much worse avionics than F-16V
            >more expensive to buy and maintain than F-16
            Only countries that bought them are those that SAAB managed to bribe into buying them

            with the exception of Czech, all Gripen operators are developed non-NATO countries, and all Fat Amy operators/future operators are NATO or US aligned [Israel, Japan etc]. That is the primary reason for the buys, it is international diplomacy.
            the F is a better missile truck than the Gripen but outside of that [range, payload], it is in every way significantly inferior to the Gripen, and Czech will quietly continue to upgrade and modernize its Gripen fleet because Saab specifically designed the plane to accept regular, modular updates across the board so you can turn a Gripen C/D into an E very inexpensively

            Yes
            >less fuel, essentially requires external fuel tanks
            >half the max payload, not to mention that the aformentioned fuel tanks take up almost half the pylons
            >Better avionics than F-16C, much worse avionics than F-16V
            >more expensive to buy and maintain than F-16
            Only countries that bought them are those that SAAB managed to bribe into buying them

            >bribe
            undereducated people from low-trust, failing societies often see successful above-board negotiations as corrupt because they cannot imagine what honesty and hard work look like.

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              >all Gripen operators
              all what, 4 of them?

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Less fuel capacity means less loitering time, which means more aircraft to fly out which means higher maintenance. Lower weapon capacity means more aircraft are needed to do the same task which also means higher maintenance. It quickly snowballs into a logistical clusterfuck.
            As for its maintenance, it's extremely expensive. For comparison, during the Croatian tender, F-16V clocked in around 20,000$ per hour and Gripen was around 25,000$. Rafale, even though it's a twin engine aircraft, managed far lower maintenance costs than Gripen, at only 16,000$ per flight hour.

            >I don't know enough about the differences in avionics to have a clear opinion on this. How exactly are the avionics "much worse" than in the F-16V?
            it doesn't, this is typical burgerfat education levels.
            F16V and GripenE are almost exactly on par in every way, the Gripen is more agile, the F16V has longer range.
            [...]
            with the exception of Czech, all Gripen operators are developed non-NATO countries, and all Fat Amy operators/future operators are NATO or US aligned [Israel, Japan etc]. That is the primary reason for the buys, it is international diplomacy.
            the F is a better missile truck than the Gripen but outside of that [range, payload], it is in every way significantly inferior to the Gripen, and Czech will quietly continue to upgrade and modernize its Gripen fleet because Saab specifically designed the plane to accept regular, modular updates across the board so you can turn a Gripen C/D into an E very inexpensively
            [...]
            >bribe
            undereducated people from low-trust, failing societies often see successful above-board negotiations as corrupt because they cannot imagine what honesty and hard work look like.

            How many Gripen E's got manufactured? Last news I heard was that one was about to be delivered, and that was winter of 2021. Even Su-57 has more airframes than Gripen E. Not to mention how Gripen E's avionics are worse compared to F-16V or Rafale

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              >As for its maintenance, it's extremely expensive.
              https://stratpost.com/gripen-operational-cost-lowest-of-all-western-fighters-janes/

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                And I'm talking about a real tender with real money and real aircraft with real experts who ran the costs, instead of a single paragraph written by a poo.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Real tenders with real money take real politics into account. If the politicians want to buy 'murrican, then the experts will find that the 'murrican option is superior.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Rafale won the tender, though.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                In Indonesia? No, they won against F-16 F15 and Su-35. In UAE? No they were a default choice because the country was pissed off to be denied the F-35. In Greece they were chosen for political reasons.
                It's still a very underated jet but it didn't win only thanks to its merits.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >for comparison, during the CROATIAN tender...
                Choice was garden gnomed F-16C, F-16V, Rafale and Gripen. Rafale won.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Didn't Croatia also picked the Rafale BECAUSE they were not allowed to buy the second hand F-16s, with Murica wanting to push the latest Vipers on them?

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Yes correct, but F-16 lost especially because the USA would not let Croatia get second hand israeli F-16 block 30, but tried to sell overpriced F-16 block 70 built from old retired airframes, while France sold used Rafale with 2 thirds of their operational life remaining for a bargain at 47 million per aircraft. If I sold you a used Ferrari for half the cost of a brand new one, would you prefer a crashed then rebuilt Porsche for a higher price instead?

                Is Rafale more comparable to f35 or f18?

                It's inbetween both honestly. Has some EW capabilities making it close to the F-18G but will never jam as hard. It is 35% lighter and won't be able to carry as much fuel with the same weapons loadouts either. The navy version has no twin seater. It has a very good tactical picture and advanced sensor fusion, but lacks real stealth features like the F-35 despite some measures clearly visible.
                It's a small aircraft with lots of good and bad points. It's different, strange, too french, and that's why it had so little success for such a long time before landing sales in a row because for a short time it looked like a hot thing.
                Now with the F-35 democratized and the KF-21, even the Su-75 in a few years maybe, I don't see the Rafale being sold again in big numbers. Especially as the french themselves look for a stealth jet now, even if they won't buy the F-35 out of pride and arrogance. The same pride they display in not wanting to integrate american weapons like the Sidewinder and Amraam because they don't use it. They would sell more jets if they did, but then MBDA would lose money. See how it goes?

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Especially as the french themselves look for a stealth jet now, even if they won't buy the F-35 out of pride and arrogance. The same pride they display in not wanting to integrate american weapons like the Sidewinder and Amraam because they don't use it. They would sell more jets if they did, but then MBDA would lose money.

                It has nothing to do with pride and everything to do with keeping the ability to develop aircraft independently and also avoid ITAR components that make exports risky. They have already been burned by ITAR rules several times in the past.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                the Saab Embraer factory has been running since 2020 and there are 2 Gripen Es out of production as well as the prototypes. I expect more will be announced on tomorrows earnings call.

                Less fuel capacity means less loitering time, which means more aircraft to fly out which means higher maintenance. Lower weapon capacity means more aircraft are needed to do the same task which also means higher maintenance. It quickly snowballs into a logistical clusterfuck.
                As for its maintenance, it's extremely expensive. For comparison, during the Croatian tender, F-16V clocked in around 20,000$ per hour and Gripen was around 25,000$. Rafale, even though it's a twin engine aircraft, managed far lower maintenance costs than Gripen, at only 16,000$ per flight hour.
                [...]
                How many Gripen E's got manufactured? Last news I heard was that one was about to be delivered, and that was winter of 2021. Even Su-57 has more airframes than Gripen E. Not to mention how Gripen E's avionics are worse compared to F-16V or Rafale

                >As for its maintenance, it's extremely expensive.
                it is the cheapest airframe to operate and maintain by a very large margin. It also has the most diverse supply chain using off the shelf and modular components where ever possible.

                Less fuel capacity means less loitering time, which means more aircraft to fly out which means higher maintenance. Lower weapon capacity means more aircraft are needed to do the same task which also means higher maintenance. It quickly snowballs into a logistical clusterfuck.
                As for its maintenance, it's extremely expensive. For comparison, during the Croatian tender, F-16V clocked in around 20,000$ per hour and Gripen was around 25,000$. Rafale, even though it's a twin engine aircraft, managed far lower maintenance costs than Gripen, at only 16,000$ per flight hour.
                [...]
                How many Gripen E's got manufactured? Last news I heard was that one was about to be delivered, and that was winter of 2021. Even Su-57 has more airframes than Gripen E. Not to mention how Gripen E's avionics are worse compared to F-16V or Rafale

                >Su-57 has more airframes than Gripen E
                if you count the ones that cant fly or got crashed, I guess. The major difference there is that Saab is not lying and can and will actually produce more of its planes, and there wont be another SU-57 seen unless its CGI

                another one buying the dogshit bloated planes
                you've got to be kidding me
                the bribery suHispanicion is probably real

                Its diplomacy, which is official legal bribery. A concrete way to say, I back and am backed by NATO, of which the US is the default leader.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >it is the cheapest airframe to operate and maintain by a very large margin
                ...is a claim that is entirely unfounded

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        No, just very much the
        >mom can i have f-16
        >no we have f-16 at home
        meme. decent, affordable, does everything a 4th gen fighter needs to do for basic air sovereignty roles.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      That's about it. E's are only Brazil and Sweden. C/D is Thailand, Czechs, which is why them going with the F-35 is funny, Hungary and South Africa. As an aside, the Thai C/D completely blew out J-11s in BVR combat practice but lost in BFM.

      If you can afford better but don't have access to the F-35 you'll go with the Rafale or Super Hornet. Latest block F-16s are really only popular in countries that already use them to cut down on training costs.

      If you can't afford the Gripen you'll go with something like a militarized trainer. If you can't afford that you go with Sukhoi.

      The KF-51 might be a good price point to compete and if it does the Gripen will probably do even worse in the future.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        nice headcanon

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >If you can afford better but don't have access to the F-35 you'll go with the Rafale
        Oh yeah?
        Explain Greece then. They already bought the Rafale, both used taken from the french air force, and brand new to be delivered in 2 years, and they will have the F-35 in 2028. They also modernized 84 F-16 to block 70 standard and they keep their most modern Mirage 2000. All this in a super small NATO country of only 10 million people.
        Explain UAE, they were denied the F-35, but still want it, so discussions have been restarted a few weeks ago. However they also bought 80 Rafale on the go without asking questions when they were first denied the F-35. Yet they also look at the KF-21 now due to american interference into their procurement strategy.
        It's almost the same story in Indonesia, they knew they wouldn't get the F-35, so they embarked in the KF-21 and will definitely get it, but they also bought 42 Rafale!
        This "either Rafale either F-35 depending on conditions", or "it's just a stopgap before getting something better" arguments have become ridiculous. You don't just keep an expensive fighter for 10 or 15 years. Even the leased Gripen C/D lasted longer in the airforces operating them.
        This market is much more complicated than most people think.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Is Rafale more comparable to f35 or f18?

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Rafale is like a fat F-16 or a tiny F-15.

            Didn't Croatia also picked the Rafale BECAUSE they were not allowed to buy the second hand F-16s, with Murica wanting to push the latest Vipers on them?

            First tender, where the Barak won, was cancelled because the garden gnomes never asked for permission to sell from US. That tender also didn't include Rafale. Second tender that was started after the first one failed was the one where Rafale won. It also inlcuded Baraks, but they'd be de-garden gnomefied to a regular block 50/52 and were more expensive than Rafale

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Sweden needs to corner the Ukrainian market already. Ukraine is desperate for weapons and does not give a flying fuck who sends the weapons.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          They have no ability to pay for them and despite what you think, all of Ukraine's sugar daddies are well aware that Ukraine is capable of winning the war without modern jets. Also warplane orders usually take something like five years to actually deliver just one functional squadron.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      You do realize that it was tailor made to swedish requirements, just like the CV90 and with that in mind it could hardly be considered a failure

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        The fact that even Sweden's neighbors, with almost identical climate and pretty similar political conditions, would rather use American planes (even when Sweden promises a whole bunch of extra shit to go alongside with Gripen) kinda indicates that it isn't all that great of a plane.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          It's almost like politics are involved when a country decides on a certain jet

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Muh NATO may explain Denmark and Norway, but what about Finland, which, like Sweden, was a non-NATO EU member when it chose the F-35 over the Gripen? Finland in general is basically just Sweden, but 5–10 years behind when it comes to mass third-world immigration and the joys that that brings. Hell, they were even memeing about muh deeper non-NATO Nordic defence cooperation together with Sweden back when that decision was made, so if anything, politics should have favored Gripen, but yet they ultimately chose F-35.

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              You're retard if you don't think politics have anything to do with the purchase of fighter jets.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                lol coper is coping

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >claim that finland chose f-35 because muh politics
                >get pointed about that if anything politics should had made them choose gripen instead
                >muh politics made them choose f-35
                Saab please, I understand that it might be upsetting that nobody wants your shit plane but c'mon.

                You two are brain damaged retards. Fuck off my board cancer.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                You're just mad you're wrong.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >claim that finland chose f-35 because muh politics
                >get pointed about that if anything politics should had made them choose gripen instead
                >muh politics made them choose f-35
                Saab please, I understand that it might be upsetting that nobody wants your shit plane but c'mon.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                With that logic hungary and the czech republic should have bought F16s

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              finland has been eyeing NATO membership for several years now. it hadn't applied because finns are apathetic until roused, but most of the countrys leadership thought it was a wise idea.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Lolno
                T. Finn

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                the first time you tried to join NATO was 2007 , you lumpy snowcone. and its been talked about in every election since then.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Lol wut? Finnish public has been against joining NATO forever until now. Public opinion has constantly been 60% against and 25% in favor. Rest didnt care or know their stance.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Being againt NATO was "free" until now. Its been the same in sweden but now public opinion is for NATO.
                idk about finland but the defence establishment has been very pro nato for a long time in sweden.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                FDF has been pro NATO over 30 years. It still doesn't change the fact that public was against NATO and changed their opinion when Vanja crossed the ukrainian-belarussian border. Joining NATO has not been a political topic in 2007 or after.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                If opinion of NATO changed that quickly the public obviously was not against NATO for deep seated ideological reasons though.
                They didn't see a reason for joining NATO and were thus against, perfectly reasonable.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                im not talking about the proles.
                go back and read what i wrote again

                finland has been eyeing NATO membership for several years now. it hadn't applied because finns are apathetic until roused, but most of the countrys leadership thought it was a wise idea.

                >most of the countrys leadership thought it was a wise idea

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Then why didn't Finnish leadership apply to Nato in 90s when they had the chance? Only swenno-finns were openly pro NATO before and everyone else were either agaisnt or deemed it unnescessary. Joining NATO was never political topic during or between any elections.

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              >they were even memeing about muh deeper non-NATO Nordic defence cooperation together with Sweden back when that decision was made
              No unlike retarded commie swedish politicans the finsish leadership understood that NATO was the only real alternative.
              It was actually quite amazing to read both swedish and international media on the subject. The delusion in sweden was total.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Come on anon. It's about strengthening relationships

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >tailor made to swedish requirements
        it has a reciprocating dildo in the seat?

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >shitholes that are too poor to afford American, British, or French planes
      lmao this bro is pretending that the countries that the US *ALLOWS* to have F-35s would ever consider the Euroshitter and the RaFail

  4. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    F35 only won because of dastardly underhanded dealings, I tell ya! Shenanigans! Skulduggery! Accursed dark money!

  5. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    What are the benefits of choosing a foreign-made equipment instead of domestically (for the region) produced equipment that will complicate logistics and parts availability?

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      1) Slovaks are buying them too (if I had to guess, they are the reason why we finally picked a winner after almost 10 years of trials)
      2) at least partial domestic production is absolutely mandatory

      Honestly, I thought we would have picked ASCOD or Lynx, and not because I think they are better IFVs.
      GDLS had a very strong marketing campaign, shills and lobbyists everywhere and we already had business with them when they sold us Pandurs (maybe the reason why we did not choose ASCOD, now when I think of it)
      Lynx was the most modern one so it seemed like a reasonable second option when Puma was deemed too expensive.
      They will probably winge and end the minister's career through media, hoping to overturn the decision.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Obviously the lynx isnt as good as certain people here like to claim it is.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >Borsuk 30
          Ohnonono Poolack bros, what happened?

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Nothing, they finished trials before even first one was completed

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            404: Borsuk not found

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Cv90 is unfairly good

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >blow our budget on F35s
        >save atleast some money on the IFVs
        Probably good call. Its more likely that our planes will be used in combat than the mechanized division sill.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >basically every single one of your closest allies and most of your neighbours fly F35s, a plane that has half a dozen decades of service ahead of it as a NATO standard
      >but somehow it makes more sense to get inferior swedish joke of a plane that will be obsolete in a month and that literally nobody is going to be flying just because its creators happen to inhabit the same continent
      Literally and unironically KYS

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        swedes got this weird superiority complex despite being the most cucked race on this planet by far
        thats why they also always push their language "äccidently" like this

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Looks like a few parts are made in Czech Republic but i wouldn't call it euro domestic.

  6. 3 weeks ago
    Indian Shill

    Funnily enough it was the FA-50 that has cut into Gripen sales.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Not for long. With T-7 (which is developed by Boeing-Saab) is slated to have its own light combat variant, you could expect Saab to pull the same shit on FA-50 with its F-7

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >Not for long. With T-7 (which is developed by Boeing-Saab) is slated to have its own light combat variant, you could expect Saab to pull the same shit on FA-50 with its F-7
        Yeah, by then the FA-50 will be fully upgraded with AMRAAM integration and stand-off missile capabilities. T-7A's subsonic airframe allows it to reach a speed of only up to mach 0.9 and the synthetic body is already deemed too brittle for use as combat roles so the air force is turning to find other options by launching another trainer program which is obviously aimed at the newest version of T-50.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Does it even matter? Gripen already had that BVR and standoff capability and yet FA-50 still eat into its sales potential so what makes you think weaponized T-7 wouldn't do the same

          >0.9 mach
          The airframe is capable of at least transonic/low supersonic flight and any design deficiency can be rectified as it's caught early and the plane hasn't entere serial production yet

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            T-50 is twice as heavier than T-7 and so is the max take off weight, and unless the Boeing has come up with a magical material to overcome the law of physics I'm sure you know what that weight difference implies.

  7. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    if only there was a war nearby where they could send gripens to prove that they are good machines to buy... if only...

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Sweden has no balls to provoke russia. Bitch nation.

  8. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    The biggest ironing is the f35 is a modern Gripen. Muricans used to hate single engine jets, wonder what made them change their minds.
    It should be called the JAS 35 Lightning.
    You rabid retards lol.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >Muricans used to hate single engine jets, wonder what made them change their minds.
      Engines are expensive and maintenance intensive. 2 engines nearly double the workload.
      That, and the concerns of engine flameouts are much lower nowadays, modern engines are more reliable and have more failsafes.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      I still hate single jet jets, they're ugly

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Shut up.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          If you think about it, a Gripen is pretty close to a Tigershark with the wings put on the wrong way around

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          One of the most aesthetic jet aircraft ever built

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >they're the same because they're both single engine
      kys retard

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >Muricans used to hate single engine jets,
      >what is f-16

  9. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >Swedish aircraft innovators

  10. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    [...]

    Do you have more hunter cock pics? How big is your "Hunter's Cock" folder?

  11. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    You love to see it

  12. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Only thing I'm gripen is MUH BALLS.

  13. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Was there even any doubt? No one want's some quirky Euro trash jet. The F-35 WILL be the ubiquitous multi-role platform for the next 30 years at least.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Absolutely. Literally the only argument for gripen is the price. Of course the thing is that knowers are aware that ultimately it might not even be low enough to justify the drawbacks.
      If there's anything surprising its that we went for 24 planes instead of doing something retarded like sperging out at the last moment and getting just 16 thinking that well get the rest in indeterminate future or sth.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Indeed. Also commonality of parts/training is something the tards on this board never think of. There's a reason why there are hundreds of millions of AR mags on the cheap and it's because of the STANAG program. If everyone used F-35s then no one would have to depend on a single country for spare parts or personnel.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >If everyone used F-35s then no one would have to depend on a single country for spare parts or personnel.
          No need for the "if".
          F35 is already becoming the NATO standard, and with projected service life until like 2070s even the countries that decide to get some other plane now will probably end up getting the 35s eventually. Especially since they'll probably end up being the cheapest 5th gen anyway.

  14. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Why no F-15s?

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      F-35 and F-15 serves a different role. It's best to have both. That's what Poles, Czechs and Slovaks should get to form a common extend defence power.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Duck off that's our main ho

  15. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    BEST PLANE KEEPS WINNING
    COPE AND SNEED GRIPTARDS
    COPE AND SNEED RAFAILERS
    COPE AND SNEED BOEING EMPLOYEES

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      belly erotic

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      God bless America.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous
    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      fugg, I never found f-35s particulraly sexy untill I saw the belly

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        It's a nice tummy

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        https://i.imgur.com/v3F0ZcK.jpg

        BEST PLANE KEEPS WINNING
        COPE AND SNEED GRIPTARDS
        COPE AND SNEED RAFAILERS
        COPE AND SNEED BOEING EMPLOYEES

        The futuristic organic-technical underbelly is so god dam hot its unreal. Like a muscular machine. Sexual morphism driven pure physics

        the gripen is ok but just so retro/classical

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        The F-35 is a trap, no wonder PrepHole likes it

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          So true

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          So true

          That's her pubic mound you dummies

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Why is F35-chan so lewd?

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              "Aerodynamic streamlining" Just imagine her naked in a windtunnel while the eggheads figure out the best way to dress her.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Even American planes are fat.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      So trve

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      You know Boeing makes money for every F-35 built

  16. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOBODY SAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAID IT WAS EAAAAAAAAASYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Forward swept wings are so fucking cool. Forever mad they’re so rare.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        let's go back to the start

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        They are cool but really not practical. They're very draggy and require a lot of structural reinforcement which brings up the weight.
        Plus they're poison for VLO design.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          The Su-47 tackled this problem by making extensive use of composite materials for the wings which offer greater durability at less weight.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            it tackled the problem so hard that no more than one has been produced and it never flew again after just a decade of use

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              That's because Russia is fucking poor
              But the Golden Eagle is gtg

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                if russia is so poor what makes you think they can fund designs that are not pieces of shit? All the other reasons for russians being subhuman notwithstanding.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >if russia is so poor what makes you think they can fund designs that are not pieces of shit?
                They didn't, Sukhoi was able to finance its own project and have it ready earlier, while also running an R&D programme and further evaluating/improving the design. By the time the Mikoyan MFI performed its first flight, the Su-47 was already taking part in air shows while serving as a testbed for various technologies (many of them finding their way to PAK FA).

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                that gibberish doesn't answer my question

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Being too poor to mass produce an expensive design does not preclude the ability to come up with said designs. Duh

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Warsaw Pact engineers are geniuses chained to increasingly stupid administrations, look at Ukraine reverse engineering random drone and artillery designs in real time in the middle of a war for example

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                We are better at engineering than westerners

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                is that why you never created an original design in your entire existence?

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                The vast wealth of history strongly disagrees

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >We are better at bragging about our non-existent accomplishments than westerners
                FTFY

                You only got a satellite to space first because you brute-forced rocket design instead of making smaller warheads to meet in the middle.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >There's a timeline where Russia joined NATO and put the Su47 and Black Eagle tank into service.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >Russia is fucking poor
                The only thing which makes that true is they're gullible enough to believe it. It's almost funny that the only effective weapon the West has deployed against the Russians is the St. Petersburg school of economics, but no one is smart enough to grasp that and thinks it's "sanctions".

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      https://i.imgur.com/m9Am6qc.gif

      let's go back to the start

      Too beautiful for this world.

  17. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    God bless US industrial-military complex.

  18. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Wish someone took Norwegian F-35s and photoshopped them with Czech rounders.

  19. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    another one buying the dogshit bloated planes
    you've got to be kidding me
    the bribery suHispanicion is probably real

  20. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Didn't saab offer gripen for free or some shit? Was the f35 just that much better

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Obviously they would only get them for "free" if they buy another 12 of Gripen E

  21. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >Poles buy F-35
    >Czechs buy F-35
    >Puccia will soon become 3rd biggest 5th gen fighters operator among slavic countries.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Czechs alone will have more 5th gens than Russia lol

  22. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    So what's up? For decades we were RENTING two shitty Grippens, and suddenly we can buy subscription based platform like F-35? With 12% inflation?

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      they decided to purchase the superior aircraft.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        You skipped all of my points and posted obese single engine F22.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Compered to FAT32 it's slim.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            keep talking shit about 32, see if he gives a fuck. You'll never break his smile

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              GOOMBA

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            :DDDD

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          I answered every point, they selected the superior aircraft, yes in spite of expense and time sunk in other platforms.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        i wanna lick her, bros

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >get a more expensive plane that will last into 2070s
      Vs
      >get a sugercoated rehashed piece of shit used only by fourth world shitholes that will be obsolete in 15 years after which you'd probably end up getting F35s anyway

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >you'd probably end up getting F35s anyway
        With money we have we should be getting japanese Zeros.

  23. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Can the Gripen do this?

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      No, but neither can the F-35 unless you subtract all the weaponry and most of the fuel. A circus trick.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        lol more cope

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Go look it up.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            That's only for vertical takeoff, which the US navy doesn't do. It can carry a normal combat load for short takeoff and vertical landing.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      No and neither will the 35’s that Croatia is buying

  24. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >Another thread comparing two planes that never will see combat against each other instead of comparing how they fare against actual hostile planes.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      the F-FuddyFive will never be in a dogfight. It is an instantly obsolete show pony/white elephant good for nothing that cant be done better and cheaper by other planes and drones.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        F-35 doesn't need to dogfight. It snipes at BVR then runs off when you go nose cold.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Gripen E has better BVR/OTH than the F35. Already fully kitted up with BVRAAM and swashplate/AESA and everything

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >Gripen E has better BVR/OTH than the F35
            lol

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              lmao

              refute it

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Gripen doesn't have stealth coating and it's IRST is forwards looking only. There's also no evidence of a towed decoy system, certainly not an integrated system like the F-35.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                the stealth coating is worthless, which is why Sweden didn't bother. it has radar guided decoy missiles, which are quite an improvement over towed decoys, which is dinosaur tech in aeronautics

                AN/APG-81 is better radar than Selex ES-05.

                >Under 1000 T/R modules (vs 1500+ on F35)
                >Weaker power plant
                >Weaker cooling

                Even if Selex modules were 20% more efficient than F35's modules, Raven would still have less power output with same power source. And guess what? F35 has lot more power available.

                >AN/APG-81 is better radar than Selex ES-05
                making equipment lighter and more efficient is a positive in aircraft design if you weren't told. the Selex is mobile on a swashplate and has better overall field and equivalent range.
                Gripen E wins BVR again

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >the stealth coating is worthless, which is why Sweden didn't bother
                >equipment lighter and more efficient
                lol sour grapen strikes again

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >the stealth coating is worthless
                It's actually the best defense these days.
                > it has radar guided decoy missiles
                Everybody has radar guided decoys. A towed decoy is cheaper and lasts longer.
                >the Selex is mobile on a swashplate and has better overall field and equivalent range.
                Gripen E wins BVR again
                Then why does the Gripen E have an AESA radar?

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >It's actually the best defense these days.
                it is worthless. the only things that matter are RCS and ECM

                >towed decoy is cheaper
                right. the F-354 went with the gyppo inferior version to save pennies
                >why does the Gripen E have an AESA radar
                so they can stick it on a swashplate and let the avionics move it around at will.
                dont mistake my meaing, the F-35 is superior to the Gripen in several ways. it weighs more, and is longer, and can do some cool Robotech-looking moves with its fuselage bits. it can also carry more bombs for longer distances, but you know what else can do that even better? bombers and drones.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >it is worthless
                >the only things that matter are RCS
                takey your meds anon

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                > the only things that matter are RCS
                Stealth reduces RCS. Gripen might have a low RCS from the front but it looses out everywhere else. If the Gripen has to crank or go nose cold for any reason it's no better than any 4th gen plane.
                >right. the F-354 went with the gyppo inferior version to save pennie
                AND it lasts longer. A launched decoy will eventually run out of fuel and drop to the ground but a towed decoy can stay active for as long as the plane does. Being cheaper and smaller also means you can carry more of them.
                >bombers and drones.
                The F-35 basically acts as a signal relay and spotter for drones and does a fine job as a stealthy bomber. The B-2 is great but it's shear size means it's got a reasonable RCS. For a fighter.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                AN/APG-81 is better radar than Selex ES-05.

                >Under 1000 T/R modules (vs 1500+ on F35)
                >Weaker power plant
                >Weaker cooling

                Even if Selex modules were 20% more efficient than F35's modules, Raven would still have less power output with same power source. And guess what? F35 has lot more power available.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Actually, I heard that the Gripen E has American made AESA radars. Unfortunately, this means the Gripen E will only match the F-35's radar performance at best and will more likely trail behind due to getting older, cheaper radar arrays.

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                it's just smaller and has less power to use F-35's radar, not to mention data processing. It's way too different of an aircraft to have a far cry at F-35's performance.

                getting American is going to give it the most advanced radar it could ever get anyway

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            lmao

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            [...]
            refute it

            I'm a Radar Engineer at Northrop Grumman that works on the APG-81 program.
            Basically to even suggest that any other country could ever in a million years *produce* an array that comes anywhere close to something made by NG (or Raytheon) is incredibly stupid.
            It shows that you have zero engineering background and think radars are a "design problem", and not an industrial, production, and testing problem.
            To your credit, you could give an elite team of Russians, Chinese, Eurocuck, or even Pajeet engineers 12 months and all the design tools and they could EASILY design an array that shits on an APG-81.
            But they could NEVER hope to produce more than a single one.

            Manufacturing an array unit isnt something you just "do", it's something that requires dedicated facilities whose air conditioning costs alone surpass the budgets of entire foreign defense industries.
            I shit you not on my first day on the job while getting a tour of the facilities I thought "oh...so that's why the rest of the world cant compete and needs us to make them" and I finally understood.
            It's something you genuinely have to see to believe.
            >TL;DR: you literally need an endless supply of American tax dollars to create things that compete with American avionics, and for now, no one else has American tax dollars

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              The sinews of war are infinite money, and the US is looking pretty ripped these days

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Lol. The number of arrays made the Gripen E is eh.

            ? The F-35 have the D and the Meteor in its arsenal. And in the future, it's JATM.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >the F-FuddyFive will never be in a dogfight.
        Because it'll only enter combat that close if it decides to.

  25. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Honestly as a Swede we should just pour our effort into the Tempest project with the Brits and Nips to get our own Tempest variant some years down the line, then name it something fancy like "Döden" or "Oden"
    What do you think?

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      I don't think you have much of a bargaining position to get into such a contract. Besides, Gripen still has a role to play, despite the fact that you've only managed to export the E variant to one country. I bet being in Nato will improve your sales chances until whatever that American low cost stealth fighter ends up being.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Sweden needs to demonstrate the plane's abilities in combat. Ukraine is an opportunity. Lend a few.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          No, they don't, and I don't think you understand what you are describing entails. tl;dr it's impossible without putting Swedes in harm's way.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >I don't think you have much of a bargaining position to get into such a contract.
        We're are already in the Tempest project, just not comitted yet.
        >By July 2020, trilateral industry discussions between UK, Sweden and Italy had begun;[25] also announced was an initial investment of £50m in the project by Saab and the opening of a Future Combat Air Systems centre in the UK.[25] Saab did not however explicitly commit to Tempest.[26]
        >The involvement of Italy and Sweden was confirmed by the signing of a trilateral MoU with the UK, called Future Combat Air System Cooperation (FCASC), on 21 December 2020, "defining general principles for co-operation on an equal basis between the three countries"
        The idea seems to be that it might be the Gripen successor and also introduce some tech to let us upgrade Gripen further.
        Chances are if Tempest gets made that we're probably gonna make some variety of modifications to it to fit the local climate and defense strategy so it can incorporate into a similar role of the Gripen.
        We'd also probably get more drones, since 6th gen is all about that.

  26. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    The US is probably just subsidizing it. A drop in the bucket, insignificant amount to maintain the empire

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      nah our government is incapable of negotationing such a good deal that it'd make mutts pay for it

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      literally the opposite megasatan, the US subsidizes US production by forcing Lockheed to upsell foreign bids

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        just for reference the last set of planes to the US was $71.1 million each, including the more expensive F-35B/F-35C, while the sale for Poland's "starter pack" of 32 in 2020 was $143.8 million each plane.
        Lockheed unironically gives the US a BOGO discount compared to that, and their quoted export price for countries who have already made their first purchase in 2022 was $77.9 million, mysteriously 10% higher than what the US paid 3 years earlier (when the plane was allegedly over $80 billion)...

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >just for reference the last set of planes to the US was $71.1 million
          how nice of them to give a discount to the country that paid to have them designed and built in the first place.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Sure your not comparing a planes-only package vs a planes+support infrastructure+weapons-deal?

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            no, I am comparing planes only packages to other planes only packages and at the same time pointing out that Poland's "planes+infrastructure+support+weapons" deal was double the same-year cost of just planes, which is insane, and that since a lot of the training money goes to the US military technically that's also just subsidizing the US to buy more F-35s

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >empire handing out next gen tech nobody has but them to their vassals for free
      dare i say, based?

  27. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    People only buy American because 1 they want the political connection or 2 some official was bribed.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >w-why won't anyone buy my stuff!
      >it's just as good!

  28. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    How the fuck are F-35s and Gripens in the same competition?

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >competition

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      only because for a while now czechia had leased gripens as its airforce so the consideration was buy modernized gripens (and probably get the old leased ones for free). the selection few years ago was that or f16s apparently, but new government just went all out and decided for f35s.

      obviously when it comes down to it it's the best decision, which is why its surprising because government usually chooses the bad decisions when buying stuff

  29. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    No way in hell we're actually getting them

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >noo we must keep flying the Gripens for another half of the century, please think of the (gypsy) children

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      They won't get deployed sooner than 2028

  30. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    The correct choice. It may have been debatable 5 years ago...but now? If you have the finances to buy a modern Western fighter jet there's hardly any reason at all to not buy the F-35. That's because due to the economics of scale you can now buy the best (and only) 5th gen on the market for the price of a top-of-the-line 4th gen. On top of that, your F-35s can plug into the same networks and battle management systems as everyone else. Large capability upgrades will be made available to everyone and which will also be cheaper thanks to economy of scale. Cost-cutting measures for ongoing maintenance upgrades developed by the US will be shared with everyone. Parts supply chain is so robust that you'll never have grounded F-35s due to lack of parts. It's just one benefit after the other.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >If you have the finances to buy a modern Western fighter jet there's hardly any reason at all to not buy the F-35.
      >>If you have the finances
      >czechnya
      but otherwise you're right.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >If you have the finances to buy a modern Western fighter jet
      Lol we can't.

  31. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Is Prague reasonably safe for a foreigner to visit, Czech bros? Can't decide between there or riga this year

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      No, it is extremely dangerous eastern European shithole. You will get killed. Also radiation. Pic related is Prague, its richest city.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Fuck Prague

        I just like kafka man

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          I like Kafka too but Prague should get an ERW treatment

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Nah, a neutron bomb would be better, its a very pretty city after all.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Fuck Prague

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