Just read the Zombie Survival Guide and thought it was pretty interesting! What are you guys prepping? What are your survival plans? What gear/weapons are you using? I think I may pick up some 7.62 ZMax ammo this weekend!
Preparedness & self-sufficiency community
Just read the Zombie Survival Guide and thought it was pretty interesting! What are you guys prepping? What are your survival plans? What gear/weapons are you using? I think I may pick up some 7.62 ZMax ammo this weekend!
We've come full circle back to like 2010 anon, it's all just a circle that we can't escape
What's the best advice in this book?
>Fill your bathrub with water
? That's all I can think of.
>22lr good, horde it
>Don't tell people that you're preparing for anything violent
I guess that was reasonable, if very basic.
22lr good because it bounces around zombie skulls dood, hail humanity.
Though zombies are a literal impossibility due to the laws of thermal dynamics (unless you consider morons, commies, etc as zombies), in that fictional zombie survival world, 22lr would be better than anything else. You can hit headshots out to 150 yards with a 22lr and limited training, and in your backpack you can carry two bricks of 22lr for a total of 1000 rounds. And if hordes of slow undead walking cannibalistic corpses are walking around 24/7 trying to kill people, the 22lr is hard to beat. There's simply nothing better that allows a person the ability to kill that many undead due to how small and light the ammo is.
I didn't say there was anything wrong with 22lr, I just laugh at Brook's explanation of it rattling around a skull causing uber damage when a single piece of hot metal going into a brain should be good enough anyway.
Ah, please excuse my autistic ignorance then.
that piece of fuddlore is exaggerated, but it does have basis in reality
when .22 hits the skull, it can deflect and fragment, creating multiple wound channels and causing much more damage than if it went through
not quite bouncing around, it spent too much energy punching through the skull to have any left to ricochet, but it will cuase an outsized amount of damage compared to its weight
It says in the book: best zombie killer is .30 carbine.
The book is clinically noguns. To the point where the author thinks the US military would lose against slow walking zombies.
Nobody wanted a hyper realistic WWZ. It's good storytelling for the US to get slapped around and come back swinging.
The best part is that zombies are apparently immune to pressure of all types. A bomb can go off right next to them, but so long as they weren't the target they suffer no damage, and they can walk on the ocean floor to reach islands and shit so nowhere is safe.
Which is retarded. They get swept away with currents or if they manage to walk at the bottom they get chewed piece eby piece by the myxine
Naw, that's covered in the book, The Z virus animates humans but kills all non human creatures who try to nom on their rotting bodies. It's one of the reasons why the Zs on land dont get scoffed by birds and maggots.
Ok so why don't zombies starve to death? Surely after a while zombies begin to decompose and die of starvation if they can't find enough humans to eat. Zombie stuff is so pants on head retarded, it's one level above the bottom of the barrel (capeshit).
I used to think about this a lot and use it to shut down all zombie discussions because “any zombie would be falling apart and immobilized within 2 years”. But then realized it’s a zombie virus that’s never been defined so fuck it the virus can keep the bodies healthy and moving constantly without the need for oxygen, water, or food. Its more fun to just assume the virus magically fixes all the holes.
Resident Evil has a good take on it, in that zombies are an unintended byproduct of Umbrella's research to create superhumans. They're the result of people that aren't compatible with the virus contracting it, and they're only kind of tough because the virus is literally eating their brains, and pain response is one of the first things to go.
>they're only kind of tough because the virus is literally eating their brains
I thought they still got some superhuman mutations from it. That's why they turn into redheads and lickers after a while.
>I thought they still got some superhuman mutations from it. That's why they turn into redheads and lickers after a while.
The Crimson Heads are something of an anomaly in universe and they only show up if you fuck up a zombie enough but don't kill it. Lickers are a secondary mutation but when a city of almost 100k gets infected only couple dozen lickers showed up. The rest of the times lickers appear in games outside of raccoon city, they are clones.
So basically the T-Virus jacks up the healing factor to 11, but if a zombie gets fucked up hard enough a process called V-ACT happens and the zombie mutates into a monster dependent on the T strain it's infected with, via this healing modification
Should I play resident evil? The movies are decent and I love zombies but there’s a bunch of games, which are good?
If you've never played them before I'd suggest the remakes, they're more accessible with more modern controls etc
Eating people I guess
I know some of the zombies have drastically increased healing abilities even compared to the others, the Pale Heads, and you can see them visibly steaming as they heal because biological processes are hot mang
>I know some of the zombies have drastically increased healing abilities even compared to the others, the Pale Heads, and you can see them visibly steaming as they heal because biological processes are hot mang
Seems like magic to me considering how much they'd have to eat and we never see them drink, I guess that's not a problem I prefer zombies supernatural.
it's weird science
Maybe that's why the zombies end up looking so gaunt and shrunken, their metabolism is jacked up and all excess fat is burned away to preserve vital organs. Non-fatal wounds clot up, but there's no need to fully heal & close up the wound since the T-Virus acts as a supercharged immune system killing off other bacteria/viruses.
>The movies are decent
The first one was in that it didn’t take itself seriously and knew it was schlock, all the others were absolutely garvage
The cgi ones are the ones you want. Newest one is bringing Jill back.
Oh fair those ones are fairly good
As someone who never played the game, yes. They’re cheesy obviously but it’s a fun movie with satisfying action and nice bundas.
Satisfying action is internally consistent, tense, and doesn't make you cringe. All Alice does is scowl and girlboss everything to death.
This isn’t /tv you’re allowed to admit cheesy trash is fun. Because it is.
This is PrepHole where badly made stuff gets called badly made.
Um no we trash poorly manufactured weapons while praising cheesy action media. Have you not seen the weekly The Thing and Heat threads?
The Thing is the greatest horror movie ever made, no "asterisk" or qualification required.
>the greatest horror movie ever made
return of the living dead
Good but not even close
Return of the Living dead is a very good movie, the best Zombie movie ever made (suck dead cock Romerofags) but not the best horror movie.
Where do they get all the extra mass from?
For the tyrants, the t103s are mass produced clones that are vat grown in Umbrella's facilities, so presumably the liquid in those tubes you find them in is some sort of nutrient solution that is calibrated to get them to the desired size. As for the rest, only Nemesis got an explanation for it's size increase, which was from consuming all the corpses in the disposal facility.
Zombies that do not heal would be blind within hours and unable to move within days.
Zombies that heal via eating would struggle to feed themselves and most would breakdown within days.
Groups of Zombies that try to eat people would do so much damage to the victim before they turned that no significant hordes could develop.
I'm fine with magical zombies but it's silly to ever try to justify them in a scientific context.
The best zombies are the Return of the Living Dead zombies, they only eat the brain, they can think and plan, and they can bring any corpse back to life even if it's just a skeleton. The "chemical" that brings them to life functions basically as magic, and they cant be killed without completely destroying the entire body.
They still aren’t killed even if you destroy the body, when they started cremating the bodies it got into the air and started to spread throughout the atmosphere. It got into the groundwater and started reanimating fucking everything, that’s why the town got nuked as soon as they called it in.
The author is a gnomish libtard and the 2nd book is literal Israeli propaganda. There's also a passage in the 1st book where the only time people actually defeated the zombies was when some moron slaves cleared them out on some Caribbean island but then evil whitey came back and re-enslaved them. It's pure unadultered anti-white liberal gnomish garbage. I remember this trash getting shilled on here and on 7chan back in the day and never understood the appeal.
>never understood the appeal.
primitivism, thats really it
it speaks to the "low tech best tech" mentality prevalent at the time it was written
that modern society made man weak and decadent and that there will come a time when high technology fails us and we all have to revert back to being farmers
hence the repeated themes of "and modern society failed us, we need to use older stuff"
Suck my cock Ukraine tourist
There was just a huge explosion of zombie related media after 28 Days Later and this book hopped on the bandwagon
Surely you also remember the historical section praising the Roman Empire's effective response to zombies and implication that the Hadrian Wall was a defence against the undead? Unfortunately, Brooks' scholarship also falls short here because the Romans were pretty superstitious in their own right, not hyper-rational as he depicts them.
Man's noswords as well. Motherfucker thinks that plate armour weighs a tonne and that you are immobile while wearing it, which is clearly the sort of thing you want to wear when riding a large animal which you have to jump onto and is only attached to you by leather straps. This was just so he could handwave the "wear medieval armour and bash their heads in with polearms" argument in favour of Hispanicy .22 rounds instead.
That's probably the saddest thing about The Zombie Survival Guide and World War Z. When you're young and you read them for the first time, it's really cool and it all sounds really plausible. Then you grow up, learn how the science behind these things really work and discover how fucking stupid the whole thing is. However, the actual character stories are still really good and more than make up for the psudeo-science. The one about the feral kid still makes me choke up a bit.
You never insert medieval times into zombie fiction because it breaks everything. Plate armor be damned but just a thick gambeson should be too much to bite through and swords or polearms just don't run out of ammo. And don't ever mention easily available bikes unless your zombies can sprint more than 20km/h.
I'm re-reading the Guide right now and it rates swords very highly, especially katanas. Of course, given that distance is the most important factor, a spear or some other pointed polearm would obviously be superior assuming you HAD to fight one in melee (which Brooks advises against, to his credit because CQC against zombies is retarded in general). Even if your aim isn't good enough to nail one in the head, shoving it away from several feet is already a huge advantage.
I'd like to remind everyone in the thread that we are all, as PrepHole posters, by definition autistic and primitivism escapism like surviving in a zombie apocalypse was the daydream of every one of us here back in middle school and you know it.
Drop the world-weary cynicism. It has no home here.
I think the point is being missed, post as if it was 2012.
Boy I really like 7n6! I can't believe AKs are so cheap to shoot.
I guess they were right about Obama all along.
As much as he is to blame I can understand being pissy about midget invading Ukraine and banning it as a result. Then again when I think on it:
>Profits are fuck all to Russia compared to gas and oil
>Not that you have the clairvoyance to realize this, but we could have literally robbed russia circa 2023 of 25% or even more of it's ammunition given how happy Americans would be to buy that shit and happy Russian officers be to offload it off the books.
So it really was just chicago politics 101 - punish your enemies and reward your friends.
Invading crimea, whatever. It was just such a fun round to shoot for how light the recoil was.
>fight the bear at home, buy russian ammo today!
>by buying ruski ammo, I get to shoot cheap and stick it to the bastards, this is the american way!
>have you been to the range this week? you should have! with russian ammo you can practice more and weaken our enemies!
what could've been
you might be interested in playing project zomboid
This book was so much fun in high school. There was one copy in the library that was checked out pretty much every day because people wanted. There was also walking dead, resident evil, and wwz book all going on the same time. Zombie prep was such a fun mental exercise. Heated debates over guns, gear, bug out locations, and strategies. Good times.
I remember one fat sperg lord kept telling us m1 garands would be the best gun due to durability or some bullshit while we were running wild in the woods. We bullied him until he took us to his house and showed us his guns. He handed us a loaded pistol and we just walked back to the woods and threw it in a river.
This book made me want an M1 carbine so bad. Now that I have one can confirm it would be my go to zombie rifle.
I'm still kicking myself for never buying any, meme as it was. At one point when the zombie craze had substantially died down, you could walk past shelves of Z-Max, marked down big-league because nobody wanted it. My dumb-ass refused to buy it because it looked "gimmicky and commercialized".
One of these days, I'm going to find me a box or two of the .223 or 7.62, and I'm buying that shit for nostalgia's sake. I'm probably going to end up paying scalper prices from some fat boomer at a gun show, but whatever.
>This book made me want an M1 carbine so bad.
Damn, I thought I was the only one! Where is the best place to find a surp M1 that isn't either a shot-to-shit Ethiopian nog-rod or a $3000 safe queen?
I'd rather get milsurp than a repro, but it seems you can't find anything for under $1400, even the RTI imports.
Z-Max ammo is actually based, could grab it for dirt cheap when the zombie craze died.
>could grab it for dirt cheap when the zombie craze died.
Yep, one of my biggest regrets
Don’t know about the current M1 market. Got one from my uncle who has more surplus than drywall.
>Where is the best place to find a surp M1 that isn't either a shot-to-shit Ethiopian nog-rod or a $3000 safe queen?
Thanks for the link, but I'm actually looking for an M1 Carbine. I am already blessed with a Garand. His name is Gary. Pic related.
Checked, based, and zompocpilled.
Based Gary owner. I hope you scratched the name in the stock.
I also have the comic book
The battle of Yonkers was fucking retarded on every level.
I think the book agrees with you anon
Less glib response: in a world which hasn't considered the concept of zombies before they start appearing, how effective is the Bush-era US military at adapting to them quickly?
They'd still mop the floor with them. The only way the military couldn't handle it is if it started within the military. I've always thought it would be neat to do a story like that kinda based on Desert Storm syndrome.
>The only way the military couldn't handle it is if it started within the military
I think that is the context, it erupts across the entire country
It's retarded to the point that it breaks suspension of disbelief that it occurred, not retarded in a way that normal reality is sometimes retarded. They funnel the zombies onto a highway. They know how many zombies there are, how long the highway they're spread out on is, and they bomb the first like 15% of it, and are completely flabbergasted when the ten miles of zombies they *did not bomb* do not die. That is square peg round hole levels of retarded. That is "cannot tell which is a bigger number, two or ten" levels of retarded.
That’s not even getting into all the things that Do Not Work That Way. Like explosives. Or Land Warrior.
But the thing that really tweaks my autism is that the fuckup is blamed on old generals that were too busy trying to fight like it was WWIII, when last time I checked, the strategy for a hypothetical WWIII was not “one line of defense. One salvos worth of artillery. No air support whatsoever.” It was, in fact, the exact opposite of that.
the late cold war doctrine of airland battle would have been largely unnecessary against the zombies because the unintelligent zombies would have no concept of probing attacks and no concept of operational concentration, so attempting to confuse them with constant counter-attacks would have been pointless
however, the other cold war strategy of defending in depth would have worked perfectly because of the zombies natural tendency to clump up
so as you slowly allow the zombies to advance down a channel they just attract all other zombies in that general direction drawing out their advance
this makes an envelopment of the attacking zombie force trivial
I got the impression they where treating the zombie horde like just a big riot, Army going all HooHaa! against what they though was just an unarmed mob. Also consider that if the Zs where popping up EVERYWHERE, the response would have been pretty confusing and disjointed. The stuff they used at Yonkers wasnt a carefully oiled military responding to a single crisis in a peaceful country, it was everything they could get hold of at short notice and put in the horde's way while the rest of the US was fighting to control all the other countless outbreaks. That's why it was telivised so much, to give the rest of the struggling population a spark of hope that the fractured and unco-odinated army still had it. It didnt.
> they where treating the zombie horde like just a big riot
Ah yes. The best way to stop a riot is DPICM. Of course.
No, you fucking idiot. The author had to do what every single writer of zombie apocalypse fiction has to: come up with a way to make the military ineffective. And because Brooks is a retard, he went with the retarded excuse of “well they just ran out of ammo?”
Also, even if it WAS a logistical clusterfuck (which there is zero reason to believe that’s the case since it was in CONUS and the US military is obviously capable of supplying logistics on the other side of the world) the fact that they did zero prep work (I.e. recon) and that they had one (1) singular defensive line is a fuckup of such proportion that it cannot be reasonably explained away.
Also, more to the point, they had Abrams. An Abrams is fully capable of looking at a horde of humanoids and driving straight through it all the way until it run out of gas.
Sounds more like you don't like the idea of the US military being ineffective against something. Are you really patriotic and tie you entire self worth to imaginary concepts? If they can't win against some afgans, what chance will they have against their own zombiefied population?
tiananmen square massacre 1989
But the PLA was very effective there, so what's your point?
The Afghans they suppressed for 2 decades and who couldn't launch an effective offensive until the other side realized that the locals weren't worth the trouble and left?
Yeah, I'm sure if (you) had been in charge you'd have worked some sort of miracle that caused the locals to want a democratic republic.
>I got the impression they where treating the zombie horde like just a big riot,
But their plan was to herd them onto a highway and air strike them.
I vaguely remember that the level of retard that the author depicted included the army fielding electronic warfare gear and anti-aircraft missiles against the zombie hordes. I think that the operators just sat there and got eaten.
Literally a perfect scenario for A10s.
Not even slightly necessary. Why bother with gun runs when you could just drop thermobarics and napalm all day?
MB has a "reformer" take on the US military procurement that amounts to a hatred of new technology. It comes up again and again in the book
>M16 too delicate
>Land Warrior too complicated (I don't think he knew what it was).
>Marines hit things with medieval shovels
>F22 pilots forced into cargo planes (Makes sense in context I guess)
Completely retarded book.
I got this when I was flying with my mom to florida, it was a fun read to pass the time. I just downloaded the Do/k/ument though and I think it has a lot more cool info in it. IT EVEN has a guide for RDX LOL. I'm definitely on a watchlist
I came here for do/k/s, what is PrepHoles recommended literature?
yeah anon, hand over the do/k/s.
The coolest part of this book was the historical accounts of minor uprisings in the back of it. He easily could have done several books based around that concept.
WWZ was shit though. Yonkers and that schizo pilot bitch were easily the worst parts of it.
They could have based a massive series on those stories. Instead we got Brad fucking Pitt giving everyone the Flu. Fucking Hollywood and their IP theft.
Boy, I'm glad that election is over.
> Chocolate Jesus won
> I fucking hate that guy
> but at least it's the least we'll ever see of Biden
> that guy is an idiot
> notice how they buried him and never had him in front of a live mic?
Stop injecting politics into everything you sad mindbroken shitbag
Scratches the mil + zombie itch fairly well. It's a bit motarded at times, but it's rage zombies vs grunts in bradleys.
The good parts of WWZ were the ones with interesting PoVs far removed from the action like the space station, radio operators, or the nuclear submarine. But whenever the book zooms in and shows a guy confronting a zombie, it gets retarded.
I like this and WWZ a lot when I was in high school. I agree with that the parts that have held up the best were the ones were the ones not about fighting Zs.
zombie survival guide was more fun than WWZ. WWZ was full of really, really ham fisted politics that ruined large chunks of it.
while they were flawed and got a ton of things wrong, WWZ and zombie survival guide was the gateway for alot of people to get into guns, prepping, survival, etc..
id say they were a positive influence, and all the people here criticizing them for inaccuracy is proof of that.
>Comfy 2012 throwback
For me, it was Backyard Ballistics
This book started me down the path of getting my house raided by the police lmao
Why was zombie media so prevalent in 2009-2014?
Trends. Profitable trends stick around for a while.
zombies move around in cycles of constant death and re-animation as people get tired of them, dig them back up when people forget,then drive them back into the ground
in a perfect world we would have about a handful of zombie movies every year consistently forever instead of going through cycles of boom and bust
they also tend to reflect public fears, with zombies being used as a stand-in for whatever is a hot topic
WWZ and others came out at a time when anarcho-primitivism was at its height, so the idea of going full vatnik "we dont need high tech junk" spoke to the public
bro there was so many retarded "scares" going on in that period. christcucks thought the world was gonna end on 06/06/06 and then they thought it was gonna end when the mayan calendar ran out and then again another time. and then there was the rapture shit. basically what im trying to say is most people are retarded. shawn of the dead was cool though.
The last scene was the best bit. I wanna z bro to game with for eternity
There was an interesting article published about how during periods of Republican rule zombie media is popular when there is a larger public fear of unwashed hordes of idiots destroying the world and vampires take their spot when Democrats are in charge due to fears of a shadowy cabal of elites. Of course, it also could just be they're on a similar cyclical timescale as American politics oscillates between the two parties, but that's less fun to speculate about.
Nah, when Obama got elected in 08, the fear mongering was through the roof. Its why shows like the Colony and Doomsday Preppers were huge.
to add to this
zombie and survival stuff got more popular during the Obama Era and prepping became more mainstream unironically because everyone thought Obama was literally Satan incarnate.
Yes, but this was looking at historical trends from like 60s to the modern era. You can see a pretty clear relationship between who's in charge in DC and which forms of generic horror antagonists are popular.
That is something I was going to mention but I am not sure about defining it in political lenses so much as more what the economic mood is. 2008+ is recession, angry poor/proles. Democrats are a part of it but more the part being their constituents than the people in power. Not only does that not match the obama timeline and heyday of zombie culture but we never really see vampires as the huge boogeyman. PEople wanna be vampires, they rarely ever are afraid of them and some of the most popular shit involves some good vampire (Buffy's boyfriend and spike or Blade being half vampire).
But where do the vampires or similar shadowy cabals show up during Trump or the Bush Years? Don't say Underworld as that was always limping, matrix and world of darkness ripoffs rather than any cultural zeitgeist. For the bush years it felt more often like it was either terrorists or the government itself and for Trump years it was just Trump or nazis. Vampires don't show up.
i believe when the first season of walking dead came out in 2010 that kicked off zombies into maximum overdrive in an effect we are still seeing today
No, it was 28 Days Later in 2002.
I’m sure it was a combination of CoD nazi zombies, walking dead, L4D2, and 28 days. Books were just the sprinkles on top.
There were basically no notable zombie movies in the 90s except for the NOTLD remake.
28 Days Later introduced/popularized fast zombies in 2002 which was followed by the remake of Dawn of the Dead in 2004, also with fast zombies. That's when the zombie shit really exploded and soon there were countless other movies and vidya like Dead Rising (2006) and Left 4 Dead (2008)
By the time Walking Dead came out people were already getting tired of it
agree with everything minus walking dead, people didnt start to get sick of that until atleast season 2 or 3. when the show first came out is was all people talked about. i even remember "groups" that would watch the show each week together like total nerds
You were one of those nerds. And so was I.
And so was i. Fuck that gay talkshow shit though
Yeah that show was trash. And the new show that I can’t even remember the name of is god awful.
The Walking Dead killed the zombie trend at least 5 years earlier than it could have been by making zombies no longer the focus of zombie media.
>by walking dead people were tired of it
Maybe the older generation, but when I was in high school walking dead exploded zombie culture all over again. Made us all go back and play zombie games again. Also the show fit side by side with Doomsday prepper and deadliest warrior. Anyone watching tv claimed to be a tactics expert and quote the show as fact.
>By the time Walking Dead came out people were already getting tired of it
only because most zombie movies/shows aren't well made, image related was kinda ok
90's was too optimistic for the general public for zombie stuff, fear of the deep state existed though and that's what drove stuff like Xfiles. The zombie stuff only really started with Obama when people became much more worried about the future.
>The zombie stuff only really started with Obama
come on man
bro this thread is talking about the zombie craze of the 2000's-early 2010's, everyone knows the original stuff is earlier. Dawn of the Dead's remake is sort of the beginning of some of the early zombie craze.
you make it sound like it went away at some point
I think a better explanation/theory behind the zombie craze in the 00s and 10s is economic rather than political. The Great Recession hit during that time, which effectively ended the hopes and dreams of a lot of disenfranchised and frustrated people. Thus, the zombie apocalypse could be seen not as a reflection of contemporary enemies, but a deeper existential fear of becoming as a hopeless, stagnant rotting mass, aimlessly shambling in a mockery of life within the meaningless ruins of society. In that context, the survivor-heroes are thus the embodiment of the hopes of rising past that living death to regain identity, purpose and agency in the world.
Damn I know that feel. That recession was a motherfucker. It destroyed my dad's small business and he never really recovered.
If you go a few years back from 28 Days, it was Resident Evil and House of the Dead that kindled the zombie revival. Even Romero said as much in interviews. The guy who wrote 28 Days said he was inspired to write a zombie movie because those games reminded him of how fun they were as a concept too.
I'm more than sure it's video games that wad the cataclyst for the zombie boon
>7th gen consoles just came out
>systems powerful enough to be able to render large hordes of zombies unlike anything we've seen before
>zombie games before like Resident Evil could only render a handful of zombies at a time
>now we can play with a Romeo style zombies, dense crowds with multiple unique zombie models
Dead Rising, L4D, COD Zombies
>now with the 7th gen a introduction of a much better multiplayer system
It was like a perfect storm
Yeah dude, that scene from Day of the Dead where the big platform lowers basically shows the perfect zombie horde, and how what a zombie is wearing can show a small slice of the zombie's pervious life
>the clown zombie
>the bride wedding dress zombie
I love how they all politely waited for the lift to descend all the way to the floor before stepping off. Old habits die hard, I suppose.
100% practical effects, too expensive to drop extras down the elevator shaft
dawn of the dead did explain that they still keep some memories of their former lives, which is why they flocked to the mall
they probably remembered somewhere deep down to wait for the elevator to stop before stepping off
What was your zombie apocalypse loadout back in the day? Assuming the same zombie parameters as World War Z, would it have changed in the intervening years or did your younger self have the right idea?
Anyone who doesn’t choose some variant of an AR-15 is wrong. Do not pass go, do not collect $200, because you’re wrong.
I'm not gonna say you're wrong, but AR-15s weren't nearly as cheap and prevalent back then. There was a lot of semi auto surplus guns floating around in the form of SKS and Garands that were much more affordable since the bottom end of the AR market wasn't nearly as reliable as it is now.
Any kind of intermediate caliber semi auto rifle with box Magazines. Handgun/sidearm. And ofc your prep essentials.
I'd agree, but PrepHole was a very different place when those books came out, so it's very likely that people would've had very different ideas back when AR-15s weren't as cheap as they are now.
Assuming this is a scavenging loadout where I'm working from a fixed location as I had a nice spot in Idaho picked out:
>Mini 30 rifle
>Katana because fucking weeb
>Condor tactical vest
>Surplus ALICE pack
>Surplus combat boots
If I had to pick now
>Suppressed AR-15 carbine
>Glock 17 preferably suppressed
>Longsword to be able to thrust as well as cut
>This surplus chest rig from an unknown country that does everything better than the Condor vest
>Osprey hiking pack
>Merrell Moab boots
>A drone, probably an Autel to avoid any lingering geofencing issues
The drone alone is probably the biggest game-changer. The ability to safely scout a general area from a distance makes looting less risky and they can be flown at low levels as a distraction. A modern solar charger offsets battery issues, even without a reliable electricity supply.
Anyone who doesn’t choose something akin to a 10/22 is wrong.
Per shot performance is trivial.
Ammo stockpile size is king.
Having a handy rifle that doesn’t get in the way while you go about your day is important.
rimfire is unreliable so that's a no go. AR-15 it is. I do like me some Federal 38 gr hollow points tho.
A ~1% failure rate is worth it, any situation in which a single shot is the difference between life and death is just carelessness
Very few people had ARs back then, it was all DPMS, Bushmaster or Colt. Price to entry was at least 800-1000 dollars and that was for something equivalent to a total poorfags build now.
I know you're a noguns child, but ~12 years ago a basic bitch ar15 was 1000+ dollars and an AK was ~400, sks was 200, mosin was 125. And a spam can of was half the price of 1000 rounds of 556.
Believe it or not, young me filled out a zombie loadout meme back in 2011. It's about what you'd expect from some young derp just getting into guns, but it's interesting to see what I thought was cool back then.
And here's the template for anyone who wants to make their own for shits and giggles.
Fuck it, I'll do it.
Alright, here's a hypothetical loadout if I were my current age in the 2009-2012 era, assuming my tastes didn't change from what they actually were back then.
im numbah one, the protagonist
Basado. Who's the bodacious babe?
Oh damn, nvm.
What? But otherwise who gives a shit, she's a whore who poses nude for money, why would you pay attention to or give a shit about her personal life?
Goddammit, anon, you're bringing me back to the golden age of PrepHole.
Ha, yeah I was going through my "Ahhh Motherland!" phase at the time. Mosins, SKSs, and cringy Soviet aesthetics. Good times.
I was 11 and my parents got me the zombie survival guide, a 10/22 with a few bx-25s, and one of those zombie green United cutlery m48 tomahawks for Christmas 2012. I still have all of them. That was such a fun time. I will always love the zombies era.
same thing as it is today
whatever I've got in the house
I'm holing up
Since I was like 15 at the peak,
>few big hunting knives
>backpack of basic camping supplies
>big thick sticks I got from yard work.
Now that I’m has gun,
>M1 carbine with bayonet and ammo carrier
>20inch mossy 590
>gp100 and Hellcat
My plan was
>have a group of people
>sail through Caribbean down to Guyana (ideally having reconnoitered the area first)
>sail up the river until we hit triple canopy jungle
>use the sticks and vines to create a network of treehouses in between the first and third canopies so it's safe from zombies and can't easily be seen from the air
>survive off of bananas and endangered species
>don't really need guns as human raiders are likely to die in the jungle before they find us and zombies can't climb good
>if they do show up, try to use suppressed weapons and the element of concealment to kill them one by one before they realize what's happening
That or build a cabin in Kamchatka but that plan was way less cool.
>eat endangered animals
You dropped this king.
Oddly the military officers at NTC Irwin and 29 Palms in the late 80s-early 90s actually gamed some fantasy stuff out. How would you deal with a dragon? and so on. Dealing with a Zombie uprising like a George Romero film... easy!
The ultimate weapon... block the doors and ground floor windows and cruise the streets with tanks and APCs.
So when I read the Zombie survival guide it was like a gun action movie written by someone who did not know how guns worked.
Zombie attack? Any lightly armored vehicle with gun ports would do. Your typical Brinks armored cars would work perfectly. Head shots from the safety and comfort of your own truck. I know the gaming culture is all over the US military and the Generals who do not game are going to be advised by Captains and Majors who have played fantasy games since junior high. People would catch on pretty fast that head shots worked. And they would get ready because even in the screwed up reality of the book it was Televised.
A couple of APCs cruising along supporting each other would limited by how much ammo they could carry and on single shot they could do a lot.
I remember when everyone was talking about how we'd trash any non space force from star wars effortlessly, good times.
Post-apocalyptic fiction in general had a renaissance during the late 2000's-early 2010's. Mad max got a major "reboot", and so did Fallout. Hell, there were more than one Terminator films made in that era I also noticed a pretty distinct aesthetic in the sci-fi at that time, and I think that one "Oblivion" movie captures it pretty well, even if the movie wasn't great.
Even id software jumped onto the post-apocalyptic train. The game was mediocre, but the aesthetics of the game were exceptionally characteristic of late 2010's sci-fi.
I forget when the brown and bloom aesthetic ended, but we've clearly been taken over by the pastel-punk look in the past half decade or more. I'd say it's yielding to the anime genshin look.
Yeah, I know what you mean. Everything has to be hyper-detailed now, and nothing can be trusted to be left up to our imaginations to expand on. I'd prefer a good story in a creative setting with shitty production value/graphics over the mirror-finish turds we've been getting lately.
The best part of that movie was Andrea Riseborough skinny-dipping in the pool.
I'd rather not think back to those times
I do miss the toxic green stuff, always liked the color, now you can't find shit in it.
It's the Year of Our Lord 2011+12 and I still think pic related is absolutely bitchin.
>Moist Nuggets were $90-100
>SKS's were sub-$300
>Makarovs were $250
>WASR-10's were $350-400
>FAL Sporters were $600-$700
The only thing was AR's started around $850 for a basic bitch model. Other than that, it was a glorious time. I'd gladly trade $450-500 AR's for the olden days.
>me now entering the gun market
>I’d really like a wood stock bolt action, maybe something surplus, a classic smith n Wesson .38 special, as nice metal frame handgun, maybe a beretta or 1911.
>every gun shop: entire wall of ARs with various length and handguards and a smattering of composite compact pistols.
Hogue still makes a couple of "zombie green" products, mostly shotgun furniture & 1911 grips.
>arsenal SGL 21s were $800 new
Take me back bros, I was too busy partying, and now they are banned.
I'm so fucking glad I got my sgl31 for $900 back then. I remember looking at 104frs for $1,100 thinking it was a bit much, how times change.
Anyone remember pic?
Science zombies always sparks autism debates about biological degradation and the military would kick their ass before it could spread, etc. etc.
I propose not only magic zombies. But magic zombies brought to life by a necromancer who has limited control over the zombie horde. This would fix multiple pet peeves people have such as degrading because MAGIC, they are possessed by evil spirits which keep them from completely rotting. And since there is an actual mastermind behind them the hordes could be somewhat intelligently guided to large population centers, military bases, etc. But other than being guided in a general direction they still just kind of otherwise muck about and kill whatever they get near. This also provides a much more convenient explanation for why they would bother traveling in groups instead of dispersing all scatter shot. How do the zombies increase their numbers? Once they kill something more evil spirits possess that dead body and bring it back to unlife.
It's the perfect setup that addresses all of the typical complains.
I've actually been thinking recently about how terrifying and difficult a zombie horde ruled by a necromancer would be to fight for the average generic fantasy army (mostly because I've been playing a lot of total warhammer)
>Fallen zombies can potentially be resurrected again
>Enemy dead can join the zombie horde
>Can just massacre random towns and use the dead to further fill up the horde
>Army is dead so no supply train necessary
>Would be absolutely terrifying to fight for anyone not dead
>The bulk of the ancient dead is made up of the ancient legions. They are what conquered most of the known world once, and they may well do so again. Legions that never tire, legionaries that know no fear, a cold machine that ever marches forward. What could stop them?
Sounds like Heinrich Kemmler just raised a full stack immediately after you defeated him. Many such cases.
The way he described it sounded kind of silly, but a few people have made at least somewhat reasonable versions of them. They're essentially shovels, but the sides of the shovels are sharpened. I suspect they'd dull really quickly if actually used for digging, but I remember them starting out as sort of a field modification of an entrenching tool.
The World War Z game had its own version that's sort of passable, even if it's based on the shitty movie instead of the book.
I would love to see a scenario done today where it was like dwarf fortress zombification where all dead tissue at all is a threat. Fingers able to worm their way around and legs QWOPing their way to fuck your bitch would be fun to imagine. You'd have to incinerate the dead and entomb the bones and ash somehow I imagine, but then what if animals were also zombies you'd have a constant stream of half eaten animals from the wilds.
Zombies? No sweat. It's the robots I am concerned about. For reals.
isn't "zombie apocalypse" just mockery of the regular Apocalypse?
Bought my first gun, Mosin at Cabelas for $120, feel like I overpaid with them having been $69 not to long ago but whatever.
I've been pouring all my spare cash into this cool project called Bitcoin.
Zombie apocalypse fiction is honestly stupid as hell. People really went "you know what's scarier than a leper? A retarded leper!"
What’s scarier than a retarded leper? A HOARD of retarded lepers! But for real fuck off killjoy
have a nice day gay
I’ll return as a zombie and get the last laugh
As a general rule, lepers don't form into large mobs and attempt to eat you alive. Actual zombie apocalypse with an effectively contagious disease in a populated area is nightmare fuel.
>As a general rule, lepers don't form into large mobs and attempt to eat you alive
isn't that the plot of the Simpsons Homega Man halloween episode?
Just bought a crate full of mosins and a dozen spam cans of ammo! I also hit up the milsurp store for some great deals on alice gear. I will outfit my whole family and my neighbors to bug out!
You just reminded me that I had pic related collecting dust in one of my old folders. Man, I miss those days.
Did you guys watch Nutnfancy's latest video on EDC size and weight constraints and the philosophy of use regarding your CCW? I think if WROL kicks off when im at gunnies, my BOB will be plenty to get me home. YMMV
That depends on your POU for when TEOTWAWKI happens. Too bad there's no one else like him on YouTube right now.
Nutn has always been great. I appreciate that he takes it seriously. Even if he is a little eccentric. I can't watch most gun channels these days. The childlike entertainment and tactical consumerism is off putting
I bought and made my first BOB because of this book, and some family issues when I was kid. Lots of nostalgia from this.
For as fuddy and noguns as the books were, I think the amount of people that got into guns and survivalism because of them outweighs any cringe they might have caused.
This. It at least created awareness that you could find yourself in a shit situation and unprepared. You never know when you could lose power, water, or grocery stores. Even for a few days could be bad.
Was a great book, was planning on running away from home if shit got too bad so that did help me a lot
If you can’t afford to buy or protect gold I think things like cigarettes and hot sauce will always hold their value.
Lighters too. Learn to make kerosene. Learn how to grow easy crops. As long as you have a skill your neighbors wont skullfuck you and take your women
Vacuum sealed pemmican will last indefinitely. People could trade bricks of it.
I threw my AR15 in the trash and bought a neon green chinesium hatchet wrapped in paracord. Nobody needs that plastic mattel trash! Get me a BOLT ACTION any day.
>all of these people recommending blades for cutting through human skulls
Never done actual labor in your life confirmed
I think the idea is to either sever the head with a cut, thrust through the relatively thin bone of the skull, or just bonk it to death. If I had to choose, I'd probably go with a thrust since it seems less likely to send infectious zombie goo everywhere than the other options.
>bonk it to death
Don't gotta bonk it to death, just to the point it's not a threat. Smash it's jaw, smash it's arms, done, move onto the next one.
I mean yeah alot of these folk were 12-17 in 2012, the cringe is period appropriate
Why wouldn't this work?
it would WORK but after potentially slashing through dozens of solid objects a day your blade would require constant heavy maintenance to not go dull or outright break, and it takes up a fair amount of space to carry as well. It also takes FAR more effort and precision than just bonking them on the head with a light mace or something.
If you have a forest near you and a blade to spare, go cut through small trees/shrubs for a bit and see how fast it chips. Something specifically for chopping through tough objects like a machete might work but its going to get stuck in heads very very often.
Light mace would necessarily be as hard to swing as a sword to deliver the same impact. It's pure physics. Having it shorter than a sword just makes it overall much worse from safety view point. Sword just has the extra help of being able to cut through the skull so it requires less energy, while at the same time it doesn't forbid you from delivering as much energy as a "light" mace.
>or outright break,
Well made swords don't break, especially with softer steel core. There is a ton of youtube videos where people repeatedly swing some chink katanas into wood, then metal, and at the end the edge is ruined and the sword is bent, but it never manages to actually break.
>go cut through small trees/shrubs for a bit and see how fast it chips
At worst you end up with a mace after all. A cutting edge doesn't make it worse at being a blunt weapon.
Ok just use a polearm instead
That's why you should have both. Our ancestors a thousand years ago figured it out.
Consider if you're willing to carry a polearm around with you everywhere. A sword can be carried in a scabbard without impeding your movement too much and while leaving your hands free to use a firearm. A melee weapon should be a backup and be as unobtrusive as possible.
I could maybe see using a polearm if you're entirely nogunz, but you really should be avoiding melee combat at all costs since all it takes is a bit of goo in your eye or in your open mouth for it to all be over.
Depending on the sword, you may be better off
stabbing instead of cutting. Something like a rapier, though not what I'd personally choose to use in this particular scenario, is depicted in fighting manuals as being able to penetrate a skull completely and emerge from the opposite side.
Also depending on the sword, you may be able to spin it around and strike with the pommel if needed. Realistically, this should be a weapon used in an emergency to help you get away from danger, not as a primary weapon to secure an area or clear out a group of zombies with.
Side note: This thread is just like old PrepHole and we should all fucking treasure it.
>Side note: This thread is just like old PrepHole and we should all fucking treasure it.
>penetrate a skull completely and emerge from the other side
>you now need to take the time to pull your rapier out before you can strike again, whereas with a mace you can just bonk one after another
A fair point, and that's why I wouldn't go for a rapier. I still think that a XVa longsword like pic related would be a good pick since you'd have excellent thrusting ability, decent cutting ability, good range, and versatility in handling. You can half-sword if you're in tight quarters and bonk with the pommel if you need to for whatever reason.
A mace would also be a decent option, though the shorter reach and limited versatility would be why I'd personally pass on it. This is all conjecture, though, so it's not like my opinion is any more or less valid in this case.
Swords are really cool and I wish they were practical in this scenario because swords vs zombies is also really cool, but eh. Think about it this way. A cantaloupe is about the density of a human head. Hit a cantaloupe with any blunt object around the house, if there's a noticeable dent, thats a dead person. Something like a mace or club is just too viable for any alternative to really be worth bothering with.
Actually though now that I'm thinking about it, sword might be worth it if you really go all out with it, take one of those insane 5 foot long doppelsoldner swords, approach the slow moving horde, and just go apeshit with big wide swings, cutting them to pieces to massively slow and weaken them and allow your comrades or yourself to finish them off more easily afterwards.
>Think about it this way. A cantaloupe is about the density of a human head.
You uh, know density isn't the only or even largest factor in an impact below Mach 5, right.
I'm just saying its an easy way for you at home to see how easy it is to crack a human skull when its not moving or fighting back efficiently
A mace is specifically weighted to be easy to swing and to concentrate all of its force on a small point, whereas a sword you want to cut deep or ideally all the way through or you risk getting it stuck. Cutting clean through the skull with a sword will require FAR more effort than just casually bopping them over the head.
>At worst you end up with a mace after all. A cutting edge doesn't make it worse at being a blunt weapon.
Yes it fucking does lmao, its weight distribution is way worse and its far more fragile, not to mention it gets stuck far easier
Machetes are shit for chopping humans and you are 100% that it will get stuck in bones. Take a look at all the muslim machete attacks. Not many dead compared to wounded.
I love zombies so much it's unreal. Any good obscure zombie games? I've already played L4D, Dead Rising, Dying Light, Dead Island, CoD Zombies, The Walking Dead, Resident Evil, Day Z, World War Z etc. I also tried Project Zomboid but I didn't like it.
Dead Space one and two if you count them as zombie games are great. If you haven't played Killing Floor, get to it, they're great games, the kind people put 1000s of hours into. One and two are different enough to justify trying both, especially since one is probably like 2 bucks now on g2a and its an absolute classic.
TLOU Part 2
At the risk of sounding like a sonic porn jacking off to autismo I'll recommend Unturned. It's basically what I wanted when I was in middle/high school.
>Base building like Minecraft but with prefabricated wall sections not block shit
>""""Realistic""""" resource management but it's configurable to change difficulty/rarity
>Meticulous bullshit like dutch loading mags and just manual magazine loading
>Vehicles with gas so you have to scavenge gas stations
If you have friends or retarded little siblings/cousins you could get them in it to play co-op as it has fortnite like shit in it while also having roblox like graphics.
It's very autistic but I mean everyone was wanting "realistic" games with open world maps back then and this delivered.
fun game man its been years since I played that the same with ace of space and rust
Piggybacking off this, does anyone remember a browser based top down/isometric zombie shooter where you had to clear out a city section by section with difficulty increasing if you took too long to reach a section? It also had little wave defense interludes that could increase or decrease difficulty depending on how well you did.
you might be interested in project zomboid, it has multiplayer
The Last Stand?
No, same era though.
7 Days to Die if you like zombies with block autism
If you want more end gane check out the mod darkness falls
State of Decay 1 and 2 are pretty good. Decent amounts of gun autism and so forth.
No More Room In Hell is basically Left 4 Dead if it was a Romero licensed game. You have your classic shamblers, swift runners, and even child zombies (as per Dawn of the Dead), only headshots are lethal, ammo is scarce, and one bite WILL kill and turn you. The cherry on top is a sequel in the works.
>only headshots are lethal
it was possible to kill zombies with body shots, but it usually took a whole magazine to do so, which was impractical when you only had 1 magazine to use
>The cherry on top is a sequel in the works.
good to know it isnt abandoned
used to play the crap out of that until it just fell off, like 30 players in the entire game on a good night
Yeah, it's a bit sad how far the player-base declined considering all the accolades and press it got. I hear the devs have shifted to using Unreal Engine 5 for the second game, which is a nice upgrade.
contagion is worth playing since its like 4 bucks on g2a
I remember reading this in the 2nd grade lmao. This book carried me all throughout school with book reports and projects. My copy is so worn the front page is ripped off and its just the paper itself. I gotta sit down and read World War Z
The biggest issue is going to be infrastructure collapse and people rioting than actual zombies. Since any zombie outbreak would be over in a month.
>Since any zombie outbreak would be over in a month.
in Romeros original 1968 night of the living dead (in public domain!) and the 1990 remake, it looks like the entire thing is going to be wrapped up in matter of days..
in the sequel the attrition is starting to set in for the living, things are coming apart at the seams, but government, local and national, still exists and is still attempting to assert control through the armed forces.. by the third movie, we are deep post-collapse
what makes it worse in-universe is not only the infected turn zombies, but all the recently deceased
The issue is that the bodies would all decompose within a month's time. Even faster for recently deceased people. Though it begs the question as to how they'd move with the embalming fluid in the bodies.
Brooks handwaves this by saying that the virus is extremely toxic to nonhuman organisms, including the bacteria and scavengers that would normally break the corpse down. They still decompose but it's now a matter of years instead of weeks depending on the climate.
Cracking the skull isn't a kill in of itself with WWZ zombies. You have to specifically destroy the hindbrain as the rest of it is basically useless spongy tissue that's being absorbed by the rest of it. If I remember right, Brooks has zombies getting parts of their heads blown off and still remaining active, which adds to the panic at Yonkers. It's why the US develops the little explosive 5.56 rounds that they use on the Road to New York.
THATS fair, I figured the zombies would have human levels of brain durability.
In that case I guess id say some weighted chopping sword would be better for lopping heads off
If your body wasn't constantly repairing itself your eyes would stop working in hours and your legs would be unable to carry you within days.
That was mentioned in the book as how zombies break down over time, though it was years rather than days before they're nonfunctional. I don't remember if he gave a reason why it took that long, but the zombies do get weaker as time passes. It even comes up in World War Z where one of the factions in the US wants to hunker down west of the Rockies and let the zombies fall apart, though that faction is eventually overridden in favor of a reclamation offensive.
It says that the virus acts as like formaldehyde and slows decomposition.
They also say that if you take a zombie and preserve it chemically, it will keep moving forever.
It doesn't explain the strength or endurance they have. Plus the fact that they don't consume any food would result in very lethargic zombies even if it takes years to decompose. Plus the first thing to go would be their legs as it is the most frequently used muscle group. They're not driving car or flying planes and the like.
They explain the strength by saying that zombie bodies simply don't have any of the self regulation that humans use to avoid damaging their bodies. So a zombie will start out super strong but they'll quickly destroy their muscle fibers and tendons and shit and eventually become much weaker.
As for the food part, the book straight up says that solanum allows them to violate the laws of physics and have infinite energy. There's one story where they have a zombie head in a jar of preservatives that had been moving and biting at people for hundreds of years.
I do appreciate that the explanation for how the zombies get their energy is "It's a mystery to everyone" instead of trying to justify it somehow. What does make me laugh a little bit is that he named it Solanum, which is also a plant genus that includes eggplants, tomatoes, and potatoes.
>They explain the strength by saying that zombie bodies simply don't have any of the self regulation that humans use to avoid damaging their bodies. So a zombie will start out super strong but they'll quickly destroy their muscle fibers and tendons and shit and eventually become much weaker
If not for the Magic of the Virus, the zombie would have no usable muscle left in a matter of days.
I think the super strength only comes into play when they're doing something other than shambling and moaning (eg, tearing off a barricade, attacking a human)
Let me put it to you this way, if not for the magic of the virus, their legs would weaken constantly, and they wouldn't be able to walk inside a week.
This comes off as a kid just pulling shit out of his ass at this point. Necroscope made sense since it was dealing with supernatural elements including fucking vampirism.
This means that you could hook zombies to generators to break conservation of energy, they put out more than they take in, they are, as odd as this phrase sounds, "temporary perpetual motion machines"
Yes, zombies should and would die off from exposure and decomp real fast
The virus is powerful enough to only barely keep the body moving for years and makes them near immortal.
I’ll let you choose which is more fun
God I miss the zombie craze. Dead island 1 was cool as fuck.
2 is pretty damn good too, the cross platform/ generation thing is cool as well.
I watched a few gameplay videos but I didn't like it. They turned it into some kind of dead rising knockoff.
>mfw I remember that my first post on PrepHole ever, back in 2010, was a post about the Zombie Survival Guide
Good thread OP. Well done. This is the first fun post for the sake of fun we’ve had in a while. Let’s all please do this again some time.
I just recently read World War Z, and the thing that took me out of it the most, even more than the fuddlore, was the Lobotomizer. Why would Brookes think that a dual-bit axe with an attached shovel head would be effective as an entrenching tool? I remember one of the reasons he gives is that the axe heads can be used to kill left-over zombies, but a sturdy shovel head should be able to take down a zombie about as well. Mixing two perfectly good tools together, instead of just issuing out both shovels and axes in different amounts seems cumbrous.
When I imagine actually trying to use a Lobotomizer for digging or cutting, I just get the impression that Brookes had never swung a tool in his life. The additional weight and different weight distribution would make the tool worse in both of its intended roles.
I remember people laughed when it came out the USA military has a "zombie plan"
No one seemed to put together it was just a plan for an unarmed swarming mob.
can we all agree WWZ is silly, but has some cool set pieces and things?
>Russian mobiks conscripted and forced into hand-to-hand combat wearing grandpa's WWII uniforms
>frogs fighting in the flooded Parisian catacombs
>nobody knowing what happened to North Korea
>the retired war doggies
>Alpha teams doing spooky shit
>Line infantry tactics at the Battle of Hope and the subsequent campaign
>The Chinese submarine captain fighting its way out and personally nuking the CCP headquarters so the rest of the country could have a chance of survival
>Bongolians living in castles
>General Raj-Singh in the Himalayas
>Fighting zombies in the ocean using armored diving exosuits
The book would've made for a great HBO series.
The Canadian that's the first official military encounter of Zeke is pretty cool, and I do believe you could rejig Yonkers to actually make sense. I also love the story of the Zeppelin pilot that gets stranded and has to hoof it back to civilization while hallucinating
An updated Yonkers where the military gets overwhelmed by sheer numbers and panic wouldn't even be that hard to do. Have that be the place where the first major chain swarm is encountered. Maybe have the battle start with waves after waves of the dead getting mowed down, but eventually ammunition starts running low and zombies attracted by the noise start moving in from all sides. Suddenly there's millions more zombies than predicted and ammunition just can't keep up with them. Fire support becomes too risky as the zombies get too close to the lines and the military decides that its only chance of survival is to punch out of the rapidly-forming ring of zombies, which it barely manages to do at great cost. There doesn't need to be any of that land warrior stuff, just soldiers panicking as they realize that they're suddenly and unexpectedly being surrounded without anywhere near enough ammunition to kill all the zombies that show up. It could even keep the last-ditch thermobaric strikes as the military breaks out and the survivors escape.
You'd need like a billion undead. We're very good at digging holes and destroying defenseless packed together meat.
One of the reasonable issues brought up in the book is that nobody'd figured out the logistics of what it would actually take to fight that many undead. I'm fine with that as it's meant to show how unprepared the military was to fight this kind of enemy since only catastrophic damage to the brain stops them and they're very resistant to explosive overpressure.
Here's the specific chapter that depicts the Battle of Yonkers if any anon wants to try their hand at making it more believable. I'm curious how some of the more creative anons would present it.
the army is sitting on massive stockpiles of ammo
>I'm curious how some of the more creative anons would present it.
I'm a former 13J (rocket not cannon) so I know all about US MLRS munitions. The passage states the following
>I’d say there were maybe thirty, maybe forty or fifty, zombies spread out all across this half mile stretch of freeway. The opening bombardment took out at least three-quarters of them.
An MLRS battery should have 6-8 M270 MLRS. Your M270 MLRS can carry 2 M39 ATACMS Block I missiles. Each M39 shits out 950 M74 APAM bomblets. Each M74 has a 15 meter kill radius. Assume a singular full strength M270 battery has deployed, and is firing at once. Let's do the math. 8 M270 x 2 M39 x 950 M74 APAMs = 15,200 M74s dropped on the field. Area is pi x radius squared. Area of a single M74 would be 706.5 meters squared. So total that's an area of 10,738,800 meters squared, or about 2,654 acres. The area of Yonkers itself is 12,970 acres. A single salvo from a single battery could kill any zombie in a fifth of the entire city. A battalion has 2 batteries, so lets double those numbers and say it could wipe 5,308 acres at once, or almost half the city at once. And the author said that would at most kill under 40 zombies. I know it's autistic as hell but I think it's amusing.
One of the issues with the account is that he never actually says how big the military force was, so we have no idea how many tanks, MLRS, Paladins, etc there actually were. What we do see is the artillery and MLRS fire becoming less effective against the increasingly-dense hordes before running out with a miles-long stream of zombies still coming.
If I'm rewriting it, I'm emphasizing that the military response at Yonkers is a clusterfuck of whatever military units were available in the immediate area. Supply lines are fucked due to the country being three months into the Great Panic, with manpower severely limited and the highways clogged with people trying to flee the cities. Some journo just leaked that the zombie vax is a placebo and the government wants a win right now.
Have Yonkers be a half-cocked propaganda operation that suffers from a fatal dose of assumptions. The military assumes that rockets and artillery will be effective, which they aren't due to zombie biology. The command assumes that they'll be working with proper logistical support, which they won't because the supply lines are absolutely fucked. Everyone assumes the soldiers loaded down in MOPP gear will be perfect marksmen and kill every zombie with one shot, which they won't because MOPP gear reduces effectiveness and zombies are scary as fuck. I'd then finish it off by having all the shooting draw zombies in from other areas aside from Manhattan. Maybe make the battle last a day and night with the situation becoming more and more fucked as swarms are drawn in from Connecticut to the east. Have zombies cross the river from New Jersey to the west as well, since zombies have no issues crossing water. Really play up the numbers for the best effect.
But then again, it's 2:30AM and I could be full of shit. I'd like to hear other ideas about how to make Yonkers more interesting/believable.
The thing is that even if you gave a plausible justification to the failure of Yonkers, the fact remains that untold thousands of zombies (perhaps up to or even over a million) would still be destroyed by such a massive effort. The real fallout would be, as Brooks points out, political and mental, similar to how the Tet Offensive was a driving factor in retreat from the Vietnam War despite technically being a massive defeat for North Vietnam. Such a high-profile failure to decisively halt the zombie apocalypse would naturally lead to decreased federal authority, giving rise to factionalist or even secessionist movements as powerful figures begin to split over how to save the US.
The real way to write it is to emphasize the endless nature of the horde. The way I’d write it is along the lines of “In normal conditions, we’d have Anouilh supplies for a month of continuous combat. With all the shit going down, we had enough for a week. Unfortunately, it’s day seventeen.”
The thing that really pisses me off is that in this age where information is fucking everything, they didn’t even bother commandeering some middle-class fuck’s Cessna to provide some sort of aerial reconnaissance beforehand. If they did, then they wouldn’t bother wasting ammo on the frontlines.
max brooks was a retarded moron when it came to simple small arms trivia, why would you expect him to know literally anything about something as niche as that
The problem with Yonkers is that it's just a very dumb concept as presented (infection starts in one place, the zombies are all slow shamblers that can only infect through bites, and the army has plenty of time to set up a defensive line with heavy weapons). You'd have to change to something else like the Army getting swamped trying to deal with waves of infected refugees turning behind their lines while having to deal with major outbreaks popping up everywhere and the whole thing happening a lot faster than what's presented in the story.
The author mentions slow-burning infections being an issue, so it is a bit surprising that he didn't use that with the refugees that passed through the lines ahead of the horde. I'd also agree that having the zombies all coming from the same direction is a bit odd since the whole zombie pandemic had been going for months at that point. I'd expect more of them to be spread out throughout the area, potentially streaming in from all sides as they're drawn in by all the noise.
There's a single incident of previously trapped zombies behind the lines ambushing a single soldier who then livestreams his helmet cam of getting devoured to the entire unit (not how that would've worked, especially in the late 2000s), but it never seems be anything more than that single isolated incident. Really, there's no reason the military shouldn't have continually bombed the horde after the battle when it's so slow moving and exposed (before I guess you could've argued they didn't want to destroy Manhattan in the process) because it seems like they just throw a few bombs at the first few thousand zombies and then throw up their hands and do nothing while the horde slowly consumes the rest of the East Coast.
They bombed the front 10% of a line they knew the size of and reacted with surprise when the zombies they didn't bomb, didn't die.
There's "We didn't bring enough ammo" and there's "we didn't even bring enough bombs to cover the area we intended to bomb, by an order of magnitude"
It's beyond absurd, it's literally 2+2=1 logic.
They should have had problems with refugees being mixed in with the zombies and refusals to launch strikes, there should have been high as fuck desertion rates, and there should have been way too many zeds (which there were)
>refugees being mixed in with the zombies
Lol you didn’t even read the book
it's been over 10 years since I've read it, give me the Yonkers chapter page talking about refugees
checked and you forgot
>civil war uniforms brought back with wooden m16's
>downed pilot hallucinates(?) a radio operator who saves her life
>government confiscates everyone's cars for scrap metal
>snake oil vaccine salesman hiding in Antarctica
check. You/him might be confused with the chapter where they nerve gas the refugees to see who's infected, because the zombies still revive (somehow).
AFAIK there were no refugee hesitation moments during the Yonkers battle, they just rand out of ammo, panicked, and ran away. Makes sense if you consider the average infantryman carries only 200-300 rounds, and will headshot a zombie in like 5 rounds or so, so each dude can only pop 40-60 zombies max before running dry, freaking out, and running away.
I wonder if there's a calculable ratio of bullets to zombies for cleanup/defensive operations. Given the discrepancy between the theoretical optimum of one headshot per bullet and the reality of accuracy rates in combat, there should be one based on the average amount of ammo an infantryman requires to kill/disable one zombie.
Genuinely makes me wonder if our new military rifle would be up to the task for taking on a zombie apocalypse. The increased power and range would definitely be an advantage, but the prospect of less shots overall is disturbing.
>Makes sense if you consider the average infantryman carries only 200-300 rounds,
Infantry generally have to walk long distance to engage an enemy, this was a shooting gallery. They could have just had entire shipping containers full of fresh mags.
Never try to make sense of Yonkers.
Brooks is pretty good at the little slice of life vignettes, those are what make the book worth reading. When he tries to go big picture it's just a reminder of why most zombie fiction skips over the collapse of society.
>AFAIK there were no refugee hesitation moments during the Yonkers battle, they just rand out of ammo, panicked, and ran away.
There's one case of an infected family turning and ripping apart one unlucky soldier in the rear lines which then causes mass panic because his helmet cam livestreams his demise for everyone to see.
>Makes sense if you consider the average infantryman carries only 200-300 rounds, and will headshot a zombie in like 5 rounds or so, so each dude can only pop 40-60 zombies max before running dry, freaking out, and running away.
It'd make sense if Yonkers was an ad hoc task force of the first soldiers to respond to all of New York turning into zombies and they're desperately trying to hold the line with little more than small arms and light vehicles. Not when they've had literal months to prepare for a big setpiece battle and inexplicably don't bring enough ammo.
That's why the collapse of the US military in Romero's films and The Walking Dead makes more sense, because a scenario where every person is a potential zombie would naturally stretch even their logistics and supplies to the limit. The only hope of shifting the balance of attrition in their favour would be to introduce draconian measures to mitigate the undeath-rate, such as ankle-monitors measuring heart-rate, prohibition of weapons and dangerous substances (e.g. drugs), mandatory cremation of dead, and 'childbirth incentives'. As a matter of fact, I'm surprised there aren't more works dealing with the dystopia that would naturally result if humanity WON against the zombies.
one of the better parts of WWZ is everyone talking about the aftermath of the war
>logistical guy in charge of making sure the safe zones were well-fed and supplied who complained about how even a can of rootbeer requires inhumanly large global supply chain ends his story pulling out some rootbeer to share with the interviewer
>guy who sold phalanx as a fake-cure and hid in antarctica is mentioned as having his lease on the Antarctic base ending and in real danger of being extradited to the US
>south african consultant who has been friendly and warm is revealed to have been redecker, the infamously cold and calculating mind behind the redecker zone recovering from a mental breakdown
Definitely, it was an interesting book especially the way it was written. Silly but fun
God, I miss the old PrepHole reads threads.
Lo Pan truly did explain everything.
>Lo Pan truly did explain everything.
Explain what Lo Pan explained that applies to PrepHole
how new are you
The conclusion the threads came to was that Lo Pan's magic was responsible for all the ridiculousness, absurd absences of physics, and general army fuckups. I can't for the life of me remember how it actually came up in the first place (wasn't there a bit in World War Z about ancient chinese zombies?) but it was a good running gag.
Victoria was the really fun readalong though, what a hilarious trainwreck it was.
Some good basic survival tips which are unfortunately offset by badly researched/impractical bullshit. No, a monk's spade won't 'decapitate' a zombie with a thrust because neither blade is sharpened, nor intended to be. No, the M16 isn't the worst assault rifle designed, not even during the days of the Vietnam War.
The Zombie Survival Guide unironically 'Red Pilled' me. Reading this book was the first time I realized that at the end of the day all we can really rely on is self-sufficiency, and how much contempt most people have for self-sufficiency.
So, how much intelligence does a zombie have? They have some intelligence, enough to seek out and consume brain matter. Is that something inherent to them, like a fragment of a soul? Or is it an evil curse type of thing and the individual zombie has no intelligence whatsoever and is just a puppet?
>So, how much intelligence does a zombie have?
In the book it's stated that they're "somewhere below that of an insect" and that they can't solve mazes or do anything other than shamble forward, moan, and bite.
in Romeros movies they would occasionally do things like pick up a rock to use it to break a window, also
>I once saw one of those things sitting behind the wheel of a car in D.C. trying to drive down Independence Avenue.
They end up doing a whole lot more in Day of the Living Dead and Land of the Dead. It's heavily implied that given enough time, Romero zombies will regain some of their humanity and memories, though still possess their feral urges.
one thing about the romero movies that hasnt caught on in future movies is that theres a bit of an "i am legend" theme of zombies slowly replacing humans as the dominant species
so by the time of day of the dead, zombies are capable of dog-like intelligence if properly trained
and by land of the dead, zombies are capable of problem-solving and group cohesion
To my knowledge, the only other zombie work that takes this philosophical approach to humanity's demise is the manga series I Am A Hero, where the zombie apocalypse may have been engineered by aliens to terraform the world for their takeover.
>What are you guys prepping? What are your survival plans?
Watching Woodcraft and maybe even the Cooking show.
>The comfiest thread in ages hit the bump limit and now stands at the end of it's life.
It's not fair, bros. I don't want it to end yet.
We’ll meet again, don’t know where, don’t know when, but I know we’ll meet again so me sunny day~