Chinese NiCD batteries Craftsman 19.2 volt

I found a whole set of very old Craftsman powertools that someone was throwing out at their curb. I think they are from like the year 2006 or 2007 so they have 19.2 Diehard NiCD batteries that are no longer made. The two batteries they came with are totally shot. I see on Ebay lots of Chinese companies/sellers offering aftermarket for a fairly decent price.

How do I know how trustworthy those sellers/batteries are? Also some of them offer them Lithium Ion, which I don't see how they would they would compatible even though the sellers pretend they are compatible.

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  1. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Convert them to corded by using a 12 V and 6 V battery charger in series.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      holy moronic

      https://i.imgur.com/KTwthFY.jpeg

      I found a whole set of very old Craftsman powertools that someone was throwing out at their curb. I think they are from like the year 2006 or 2007 so they have 19.2 Diehard NiCD batteries that are no longer made. The two batteries they came with are totally shot. I see on Ebay lots of Chinese companies/sellers offering aftermarket for a fairly decent price.

      How do I know how trustworthy those sellers/batteries are? Also some of them offer them Lithium Ion, which I don't see how they would they would compatible even though the sellers pretend they are compatible.

      Don't listen to that moronic anon. He's either trolling or moronic.

      Get slide adapters and generic dewalts ($50 for 2x), and an OEM dewalt charger ($20 or less on ebay); do not get the generic shit chargers. You've spent $70 now and still need that slide adapter.

      Start looking at the adapters: figure out what profile the craftsman used (maybe from an old dead battery), and get that mated to a dewalt form factor. It may not be that much different. You also 3D print it.

      Yes. The generic dewalts are NOT real XR's, but they will absolutely beat the pants off the original Craftsman packs, even when those packs were new. And they are like $25 a piece. My favorites are made by Waitley and about $30-35 ea.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        > buy buy buy more batteries, anything but not buying more batteries. Buy them now! The sooner you buy them, the sooner you can buy MORE batteries. Now where’s my 25 cents as chief battery shill?

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          > Dig up lithium and make your own batteries. Don't ever buy anything from anyone. Just steal it.

          Wow. Isn't there enough moron on /misc/ for you? Go there.

          [...]
          These are both equally moronic solutions. The Dewalt batteries you are pimping are likely Lithium Ion rechargeables, this old Craftsman takes NiCD. I don't want to spend hours and hours prototyping a 3d printed plastic adapter either.

          A bunch of Chinese sellers/companies offers batteries for Diehard 19.2 volt NiCD batteries, model 130279005. See:
          >https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_nkw=craftsman+130279005+19.2+volt+nicd&_sacat=0

          Does anyone have experience with these third party Chinese batteries? How do I know which one to trust?

          > hurr durr i am moronic. 20v lithium bad, but 20v nicad is gud.
          No one uses Nicad or even nmih.

          > I'm too lazy to google for a slide adapter or diy one.
          Well that's your problem, then. You'll always be poor, moronic and lazy. /diy cannot fix that for you. Only you can.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      holy moronic

      [...]
      Don't listen to that moronic anon. He's either trolling or moronic.

      Get slide adapters and generic dewalts ($50 for 2x), and an OEM dewalt charger ($20 or less on ebay); do not get the generic shit chargers. You've spent $70 now and still need that slide adapter.

      Start looking at the adapters: figure out what profile the craftsman used (maybe from an old dead battery), and get that mated to a dewalt form factor. It may not be that much different. You also 3D print it.

      Yes. The generic dewalts are NOT real XR's, but they will absolutely beat the pants off the original Craftsman packs, even when those packs were new. And they are like $25 a piece. My favorites are made by Waitley and about $30-35 ea.

      These are both equally moronic solutions. The Dewalt batteries you are pimping are likely Lithium Ion rechargeables, this old Craftsman takes NiCD. I don't want to spend hours and hours prototyping a 3d printed plastic adapter either.

      A bunch of Chinese sellers/companies offers batteries for Diehard 19.2 volt NiCD batteries, model 130279005. See:
      >https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_nkw=craftsman+130279005+19.2+volt+nicd&_sacat=0

      Does anyone have experience with these third party Chinese batteries? How do I know which one to trust?

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        >Also some of them offer them Lithium Ion, which I don't see how they would they would compatible even though the sellers pretend they are compatible.
        There are LiIon batteries that are compatible with the C3 tools.
        The C3 NiCad charger is NOT compatible, so you need a LiIon charger for the newer batteries.
        I did this for a Craftsman C3 set my son got as a gift.

        If you want to go with DeWalt batteries, you still need a new charger.

        >I don't want to spend hours and hours prototyping a 3d printed plastic adapter either.

        https://www.amazon.com/Adapter-Craftsman-Cordless-DeWalt-Battery/dp/B08D796SX5

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >did this for a Craftsman C3 set my son got as a gift.
          do you hate youre son?

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >do you hate youre son?
            I got him Li-Ion batteries and a charger to replace the NiMh batteries and charger that came with the set he got as a gift FROM HIS WIFE AND SONS for Christmas.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        >"likely" Lithium ion
        >"takes NiCD"
        You have no idea whatsoever about what you're talking about. It's not "likely" lithium ion, there are no NON-lithium ion batteries on the tool market, because they vastly outperform everything else. There's no such thing as "takes NiCD", the tools take a voltage of 20V, you can deliver that voltage from potato batteries and they will still work. Conversely, delivering the voltage from a lithium battery will far outperform the original NiCD packs.

        holy moronic

        [...]
        Don't listen to that moronic anon. He's either trolling or moronic.

        Get slide adapters and generic dewalts ($50 for 2x), and an OEM dewalt charger ($20 or less on ebay); do not get the generic shit chargers. You've spent $70 now and still need that slide adapter.

        Start looking at the adapters: figure out what profile the craftsman used (maybe from an old dead battery), and get that mated to a dewalt form factor. It may not be that much different. You also 3D print it.

        Yes. The generic dewalts are NOT real XR's, but they will absolutely beat the pants off the original Craftsman packs, even when those packs were new. And they are like $25 a piece. My favorites are made by Waitley and about $30-35 ea.

        is the "best" solution in the sense that at least you'll end up with batteries that are useful for modern tools also. You're gonna waste money on these old low quality tools, even the absolute best NiCD batteries you could possibly buy will shit the bed in 3 years or less. Compared to that, a lithium battery would outlive the tools.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          As this anon says, matching the voltage is all that matters. There is no reason to buy NiCd or NiMH batteries for cordless tools in 2024, some form of lithium conversion is almost certainly your best bet. The maximum voltage of an 18/20V tool battery is 21V, which is about the maximum of the NiCd cells, so too high a voltage certainly won't be a problem.

          There are some caveats though. Any voltage cutoff thresholds will be somewhat different between the chemistries, you can calculate whether it matters or not but I'd assume it does. This is especially important for lithium batteries, which will really have impacted lifetimes if you discharge below 2.5V per cell (12.5V for a 20V pack), NiCd tools may just not even have that circuitry because those batteries are pretty tolerant to abuse. Some tool batteries are able to detect undervoltage and cut off the discharge, sometimes this is done entirely inside the tool circuitry instead, sometimes the voltage detection is done on one circuit and the actual shutoff is done on the other circuit (as is the case with Milwaukee). A common problem with generic battery adapters is they usually have no circuitry to take this into account, and so if your battery is expecting a signal to tell it to shut off but the tool doesn't give that signal, you're going to drain it flat and kill it. I don't know whether DeWalt batteries do the detection and shutoff in the battery itself, if they do then there's nothing wrong with using DeWalt batteries, if not I'd look for a battery brand that does (maybe Ryobi?). The tool itself may also want communication from the battery to run (more likely just pulling a third pin high or low), but any chinky battery adapter probably already does this otherwise they wouldn't work.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            A final note, while knockoff hardware and accessories for Milwaukee DeWalt and Makita cordless tools are the most common, your power tools that ran on NiCd batteries may well not need the high output current capability of them. Lower power home-gamer tool batteries will be somewhat cheaper and may well work fine. Though maybe the big pro brands do lower and higher current batteries anyhow, idk.

            There's a guy on YouTube who is reverse engineering the protocols of Milwaukee batteries and their tools, which is fascinating to watch and gives a good idea of what it takes to get one of the batteries outputting power. I don't know if any similar material exists for other brands, but there's probably reddit posts about certain brands shutting off even when on chinky battery adapters.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            2789892 here. Why the frick doesn't this board have tripcodes? Refering to 2790094, also:

            There is a slight difference in that the peak amperage discharge in an LFPo* vs nisad. It is 100% from the first pull of the trigger on the tool. Nicads have a different chemistry and lower capacity in the same size, and so don't have the same current dump. That means your tools will work better, as if they were on a brand new nicad pack +, all the time. This may wear the tool out a tiny bit faster, as you have 100% current from the word 'go', but you didn't have to pay money for them, so there's that.

            Voltage drop:
            It's completely different. The LFPo* will stay at voltage until it's mostly discharged, then drop off rapidly. The nicads will gradually fade, similar to lead-acid. You will notice it in the performance of the tool on LFPo, suddenly becoming weak. In Dewalts and others, it's the tool that has the cut-off circuitry. If for some reason your Craftsman tools do not cut off (they should), you will notice it, because you are actively using it. Do not leave the batteries in that State for very long; stick them on a charger, if only for a few minutes, before putting them away (say you are at the end of the day, and done, and have a low batt - don't leave it till tomorrow. Throw it in the charger for at least a few minutes.)

            * Dewalt does not explicitly state chemistry, but I'm using LFPo here as a designation.

            Per

            >Also some of them offer them Lithium Ion, which I don't see how they would they would compatible even though the sellers pretend they are compatible.
            There are LiIon batteries that are compatible with the C3 tools.
            The C3 NiCad charger is NOT compatible, so you need a LiIon charger for the newer batteries.
            I did this for a Craftsman C3 set my son got as a gift.

            If you want to go with DeWalt batteries, you still need a new charger.

            >I don't want to spend hours and hours prototyping a 3d printed plastic adapter either.

            https://www.amazon.com/Adapter-Craftsman-Cordless-DeWalt-Battery/dp/B08D796SX5

            Oh yeah. Based. This is what I meant. OP, when you get the adapter, there will likely be at least a screw holding it together. Open it up, and verify that the soldering was done correctly. Post photos if you're not sure. Don't be gay about this: get the adapter and get a pair of Waitley batteries, and a Dewalt DCB115 or 116 charger (for example. $15-20)

            Lastly, Waitley's will give you a better assurance of the SOC of your tool battery, via a percentage. Generic dewalts mimic the minimal dewalt 3-bar battery charge indicator.

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              >Why the frick doesn't this board have tripcodes
              It does, see bepis or seigheil or any of the other wankers on this board. You could also just enter a name in the name field since it doesn't matter that you actually verify that you were a certain poster.

              >In Dewalts and others, it's the tool that has the cut-off circuitry
              If that's the case, a NiCd tool isn't going to cut off your lithium DeWalt battery at the right voltage.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >You could also just enter a name in the name field

                that's more than that moronic boomer can handle. this is the funniest moronation I've read lately: "2789892 here. Why the frick doesn't this board have tripcodes? Refering to 2790094, also"

                "2789892 here". BWAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAA unbelievable

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                2905488 here, are you saying identifying myself in some other way is even possible? And why would you think that's so funny? 2905488 signing off.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                > cutoff voltage

                It's probably the same enough. I wouldn't worry, because the tool performance will sag.

                Right on, I figured I would go the factory route with the C3 charger and battery, which I figured there would be little risk in, and roll the dice on the chinese batteries, which to this point have worked great, and they have the lo-voltage cutoff built in already. So far so good, and it's nice to have as a backup if something in my main Ryobi platform takes a crap at a bad moment.
                I use Milwaukee at work (land surveyor, we have to drill holes and make crosscuts in concrete all the time), and they're nice and all, but I don't think changing platforms at my advanced age is worth the time and effort.
                >Bauer behind a DeWalt battery
                I'll take "Torture Test" for $400, Alex

                Don't go with 'factory nicad charger and factory nicad battery'. Performance will suck. You'll need about 4 to 6 batteries to be the equivalent of one 5-6ah Lithium (even a generic dewalt or similar capacity).

                Nicad has been dead for a long time, for a reason. Every anon on here has spent time to explain that to your dense ass stupid self.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Not Nicad, I got Lithium
                https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00L8OCTI8/
                ^this is the charger and 2AH battery
                https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08TWR2FQF/
                ^These are the chinese 4AH batteries
                They've been great

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                see
                Here's the links for what I bought, OP.
                I've heard that stuff is cheaper on Aliexpress or wherever, but I spent the little extra so if they didn't pan out I could b***h to Amazon and get my money back.
                Best of luck in whatever you decide upon.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >dense ass stupid self
                see

                I have a similar set that my grandmom bought me before she passed away. They're Ryobi, but a slightly higher grade...the casings are a little beefier.
                My charger went ages ago, and having them hanging around was killing me, so I went on Amazon and bought:
                1. a genuine Craftsman C3 Li charger with the smaller Li battery (2AH? Don't remember) was like 80 bucks
                2. A pair of the larger C3 4AH Li batteries, was under 50 bucks.
                Now everything works better than they ever did, and they were good back in the day for what they were. I'm not pretentious about my tools, I've used Ryobi for years in both my life as a carpenter and after I left that field, for my own personal use. I don't abuse my stuff beyond what I think it can handle, and I haven't had a problem. I still have one of the original blue Ryobis from pre-2000 hanging in there and use it pretty often, if it's any indication.

                my first post
                When did I say I bought NiCd? I am trying to tell the OP that he can get the modern batteries for his older tools, I did the same and am happy with what I did.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >It's probably the same enough
                A NiCd tool may not even have a low voltage cutoff feature, because you can drain those cells all you like without impacting battery health by much. Most LiCd/NiMH powered devices were just the battery, motor, and a switch, no protection circuitry whatsoever. And the tool itself may not even be able to detect and cut off the power by itself. Like with Milwaukee tools, where the battery needs to tell the tool that the voltage is getting low.
                Just relying on the user not to destroy the batteries seems like a bad plan.

                Tripcode, as in on /misc/ autogenerated, per thread. Not one I have to namegay with, or change (or switch) for every thread. Maybe I'm using the wrong terminology.

                >Tripcode, as in on /misc/ autogenerated, per thread
                That's not a tripcode, pretty sure it's just called a poster ID or something along those lines. A tripcode requires a password.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Tripcode, as in on /misc/ autogenerated, per thread. Not one I have to namegay with, or change (or switch) for every thread. Maybe I'm using the wrong terminology.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Pretty much no one here wants an id. That's why we're here. You might want to consider a nice forum instead.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                It's what the prior anon was saying. it's an autogenerated ID so within the same thread, it's possible to see which anon is speaking (again) on the same item. The id's are only temporary for that thread, just like on /misc/.

                > a nice forum
                Forums do not have that feature.

                > battery drain is the cause
                Kind of. Drain and larger dimensions are the reason for “tabless” batteries. In reality, they actually have lots of tabs.

                It’s the same with lead acid battery tech and supercapacitors. You can get a very long-lasting and deep-cycle car battery if you use solid lead plates, but almost all car batteries use a lead paste because of the high surface area. Car batteries are very fragile compared to your solid plate counterparts.
                It’s the same with li-ion: the highest drain and capacities will have the *thinnest* anode, cathode, and dielectric membrane to get more wraps inside the cell because more surface area = more capacity and more drain available with multiple cell taps (or ‘tabs’).

                The durability is inversely proportional the drain and capacity of the battery. If you think about it, it kind of makes intuitive sense. There’s no “magic” or “free lunch” involved.

                The reason manufactures keep upping the voltage and upping the when-new specs is because absolutely nobody has the patience to test longevity, the only thing the test is new packs in one session. Most people can’t even remember when they bought the things let alone perform a controlled full-discharge over a day in bursts, then full charge at night for 3 years. Plus it’s destructive.

                Li-ion, like (modern) lead acid cannot handle deep discharges. NiCd can.
                Li-ion can’t handle low temperatures. Both lead acid and NiCd can.
                Lead acid excels at maintaining it’s float charge, NiCds are not bad at this either.
                Li-ion is generally considered less poisonous than either cadmium or lead.
                Everything has different trade-offs.

                We still use NiCds for outdoor lighting, for example. Take apart one of those little solar lights and you’ll likey find a NICd, like a aaa or 2/3 aaa.

                Neat. Who offers a group 24 with solid lead plates though?
                > lead-acid maintains float
                With a float charger. They self-drain without, way worse that LFPo, and no one is going to use it for a tool battery. I have an ancient battery-operated cordless drill, and I shit you not, it has a 6v lead acid gel cell in the pack. Fancy LFPo 6v batts are on clearance at TSC, for $20, might swap that out.

                > LFPo doesn't operate below freezing.
                It will discharge below freezing. Unless it has some fancy electrolyte or internal heaters, it will not charge below freezing wo damage or the BMS (if it has one) turning it off.

                >It's probably the same enough
                A NiCd tool may not even have a low voltage cutoff feature, because you can drain those cells all you like without impacting battery health by much. Most LiCd/NiMH powered devices were just the battery, motor, and a switch, no protection circuitry whatsoever. And the tool itself may not even be able to detect and cut off the power by itself. Like with Milwaukee tools, where the battery needs to tell the tool that the voltage is getting low.
                Just relying on the user not to destroy the batteries seems like a bad plan.

                [...]
                >Tripcode, as in on /misc/ autogenerated, per thread
                That's not a tripcode, pretty sure it's just called a poster ID or something along those lines. A tripcode requires a password.

                > That's not a tripcode
                Ok. Thanks.
                > LFPo without a cut-out will destroy itself.
                Practically speaking, from experience, if you are using an LFPo/lithium tool pack, and it's about to run-out, you'll know. The danger would be in using it in a cradle, to power a remote piece of equipment, without a low-voltage cut-off board, when you aren't there to notice that it's dying. That's the only time I ever killed one.

                >dense ass stupid self
                see[...] my first post
                When did I say I bought NiCd? I am trying to tell the OP that he can get the modern batteries for his older tools, I did the same and am happy with what I did.

                A) I can't tell if you are OP or the guy who bought the lithium C3 and charger for $80. It seemed OP was still going to frick around with Nicad despite your advice. I was responding to OP.
                B) See my earlier comment on this board not being able to associate posts with a poster ID within a single thread.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                I am C3 lithium guy. I probably could have been a little clearer, but it was like 4am and I was 10 beers deep at the time.
                By 'factory' I didn't mean NiCd, I figured the best thing to do was get a C3 charger for Li that came from Craftsman so I knew it would be absolutely compatible with my stuff.
                They should use a unique poster identifier here too, it doesn't compromise anonymousness, it just lets you differentiate between posters. /misc/ was right again...

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Ok. Yeah this is a good thread. What are you doing destroying brain cells with alcohol? Putin, Trump and Painter man did not drink or smoke. Be more like Rejected Art Student Man.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                I'm out on temp disability for bad rotator cuffs and, being naturally a night owl, I've fallen back into my old habits...sleeping from 5am to noon. Gonna try to enjoy this little break from the grind as best as I can, tho it's hard not being able to lift anything heavier than a beer bottle, my wife has to drive me everywhere etc etc.
                God, I'd love to go back to work right now tho...this is the nicest time of the year to work outside in a mid-Atlantic state

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                >I'm out on temp disability for bad rotator cuffs

                Change what you do because the next step is finishing off your shoulder joints and a joint replacement which is severely load-limiting. Being suitably creative I can lift, drag and otherwise move anything I wish by machine but it takes much longer and necessitated changing how I work.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                How do you damage your rotator cuffs?
                Ow do you prevent it from happening? I have enough other problems as it is, I don’t need another one.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                I'm an archer and you need to strengthen them to not have one terrible arm in old age. Lying on our side with a dumbell and raising it up to our side for 20 reps a side has been enough.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Boost your recovery. Buyiodine, whyiodine, and no it's not a meme. I have no financial ties with jim (buyiodine), and have poured over the research, done it to myself and helped many other people.

                Will speed your recovery by giving your endocrine system lots of help. I could fill this thread with stories of rapid turn-arounds that happen at the 1-2 month mark once they've gotten up to 50mg/day.

                > Who offers a group 24 with solid lead plates though
                Nobody, because it would be too big to get the necessary cranking amps. That was the point of my post. The high-drain Li-ion trade-off longevity for current and capacity. You can get Li-ion with low drains and higher cycles, and low drain, and low self-drain Li-ions.

                > PbSO4 float
                I was primarily talking about their abundance in UPS systems. Where I worked, they had custom lead plate batteries with clear cases so we could inspect them.

                My old toro weed wacker uses a bp7-12 home ups battery. It’s 7 Ah, and is reasonably deep cycle enough that it’s still going. When the battery goes kaput, I’ll use a car battery or a corded adapter. Or both.

                Old 12 volt tools are great, you can even power them with those new Li-ion “jump starter” packs, it what I call “semi cordless” although I can see so e autist with a 3D printer making a ryobi compatible plug pack for one.

                What about golf-cart battery x 2 in the midsection of the vehicle, for weight distribution, wired up to capacitors where the battery normally goes?

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Thanks, I'll look into it.

                How do you damage your rotator cuffs?
                Ow do you prevent it from happening? I have enough other problems as it is, I don’t need another one.

                I'm rotator cuff guy. God only knows how it happened...I was typically active in my youth and in my work life...they started acting up a few years ago but I thought it was just aches and pains of getting older, then a year ago it got to the point that throwing the ball for my dog was painful, and has progressed to the point that the weight of my arms on my shoulders is excruciating and I can't carry anything heavier than a pound or two, and not for very long. Currently undergoing tests and medical stuff.

                >I'm out on temp disability for bad rotator cuffs

                Change what you do because the next step is finishing off your shoulder joints and a joint replacement which is severely load-limiting. Being suitably creative I can lift, drag and otherwise move anything I wish by machine but it takes much longer and necessitated changing how I work.

                It's beginning to look like I am going to have to make a change. My days of hauling a hundred pounds of equipment miles over all types of terrain imaginable may be coming to an end...I am the land surveyor from earlier in the thread. I liked it because it helped keep me in shape, among other things...I'm probably going to have to begin doing office type stuff, drafting and tech stuff. Kinda sad.

                Lead acid.

                Beastly!

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Sounds like general inflammation, that it happens to present the most in that area where irritation was highest.

                I recommended the iodine for general recovery. When you order from Jim, get the 46%, at least the 10ml bottle. https://www.youtube.com/live/Oix26uuBfZg

                Listening to more of your case and history, you should also consult with a qualified rolfer, or someone who does structural integration (can be found under either name). I like the old school ones, myself. Little more painful, but imo more effective.

                Your joints are recovering 24/7. Besides diet, it's improper body mechanics, over time, that help to accelerate wear and inflammation, faster than the repair process. Rolfing also helps with your perception of where your body is at: like your arms, hands and feet. That will help to avoid future accidents or strain injuries. Go for a 'tuneup', which is approx 1 hr, where they work on some of the most severely out-of-place areas. Likely will not work on your cuff, at all, but what they do will have a significant knock-on effect, in making it more relieved and accelerating healing.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                > Who offers a group 24 with solid lead plates though
                Nobody, because it would be too big to get the necessary cranking amps. That was the point of my post. The high-drain Li-ion trade-off longevity for current and capacity. You can get Li-ion with low drains and higher cycles, and low drain, and low self-drain Li-ions.

                > PbSO4 float
                I was primarily talking about their abundance in UPS systems. Where I worked, they had custom lead plate batteries with clear cases so we could inspect them.

                My old toro weed wacker uses a bp7-12 home ups battery. It’s 7 Ah, and is reasonably deep cycle enough that it’s still going. When the battery goes kaput, I’ll use a car battery or a corded adapter. Or both.

                Old 12 volt tools are great, you can even power them with those new Li-ion “jump starter” packs, it what I call “semi cordless” although I can see so e autist with a 3D printer making a ryobi compatible plug pack for one.

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                > semi-cordless
                There was always this for those of you changing wheels on nato military vehicles

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                That's wild. Do you know what the nature of the batteries in the case is?

              • 4 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Lead acid.

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          > no non-lithium on the market
          That’s because all power tool companies (like 3 of them which all source things from one or two chinese factories) are in the business of selling, and re-selling batteries on a continuous (and escalating) basis.
          Generally, Li-Ion lasts (very roughly) half as long as NiCd, although Li-Ion does have roughly twice the total energy density.
          The highest energy density and highest current draw (the ones they’re putting in power tools) also have the lowest lifetimes.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >The highest energy density and highest current draw (the ones they’re putting in power tools) also have the lowest lifetimes.
            I was under the impression that it wasn't so much the design of the battery that made it last fewer years, but the fact that the batteries are being drained heavily in the first place. Especially low-capacity batteries. Bigger (e.g. 5+Ah) batteries would be discharged at fewer amps per cell, so you'd expect them to last longer than smaller batteries for the same load. Lower-power tools (i.e. not angle grinders) should result in longer lasting batteries.

            There's probably a market for longer lasting battery tech, be it the batteries themselves (e.g. LiFePO4) or just by having a charger that doesn't charge above 4V per cell or whatever. But maybe just replacing your batteries every 3 years isn't a big deal in the scope of things. For a professional that's chump change unless you have a frickton of batteries.

            ***The 4AH batteries were the chinese knockoff ones; the charger and 2AH were genuine Craftsman

            You're using craftsman batteries in ryobi tools? Do they happen to have the same fittings?

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              Nope, I was just calling out that Ryobi made the Craftsman stuff of that vintage and that they are similar in a lot of ways. I think the outer casing of the Craftsman is built more heavily than the Ryobi outer casing, but once you start examining the innards of the two makes next to each other they're the same thing, more or less.
              The stuff I bought the new batteries and charger for was a Craftsman 19.2 100th anniversary set from the early 2000's. I wish I could have just used my current 18v Ryobi batteries for the Craftsman, but the top of the battery is different in shape and in the style of electrical connection, and I didn't feel like trying to adapt it or alter it.

            • 4 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              > battery drain is the cause
              Kind of. Drain and larger dimensions are the reason for “tabless” batteries. In reality, they actually have lots of tabs.

              It’s the same with lead acid battery tech and supercapacitors. You can get a very long-lasting and deep-cycle car battery if you use solid lead plates, but almost all car batteries use a lead paste because of the high surface area. Car batteries are very fragile compared to your solid plate counterparts.
              It’s the same with li-ion: the highest drain and capacities will have the *thinnest* anode, cathode, and dielectric membrane to get more wraps inside the cell because more surface area = more capacity and more drain available with multiple cell taps (or ‘tabs’).

              The durability is inversely proportional the drain and capacity of the battery. If you think about it, it kind of makes intuitive sense. There’s no “magic” or “free lunch” involved.

              The reason manufactures keep upping the voltage and upping the when-new specs is because absolutely nobody has the patience to test longevity, the only thing the test is new packs in one session. Most people can’t even remember when they bought the things let alone perform a controlled full-discharge over a day in bursts, then full charge at night for 3 years. Plus it’s destructive.

              Li-ion, like (modern) lead acid cannot handle deep discharges. NiCd can.
              Li-ion can’t handle low temperatures. Both lead acid and NiCd can.
              Lead acid excels at maintaining it’s float charge, NiCds are not bad at this either.
              Li-ion is generally considered less poisonous than either cadmium or lead.
              Everything has different trade-offs.

              We still use NiCds for outdoor lighting, for example. Take apart one of those little solar lights and you’ll likey find a NICd, like a aaa or 2/3 aaa.

  2. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    These tools weren't great even when new.
    Your best option is: https://www.ebay.com/itm/196150738932

    $27 for two batteries that use the original charger.

    You'll be able to use the tools right away and decide if they're good enough to warrant going to Li-Ion later.

  3. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Just do your own battery solution. The tool just takes electricity and does what it should when fed the correct voltage. It doesn't give a shit if your batteries are nickel cadmium or lithium. Toss together a pack, attach a BMS, and let her rip. Charge on something of your own design.

  4. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    I have a similar set that my grandmom bought me before she passed away. They're Ryobi, but a slightly higher grade...the casings are a little beefier.
    My charger went ages ago, and having them hanging around was killing me, so I went on Amazon and bought:
    1. a genuine Craftsman C3 Li charger with the smaller Li battery (2AH? Don't remember) was like 80 bucks
    2. A pair of the larger C3 4AH Li batteries, was under 50 bucks.
    Now everything works better than they ever did, and they were good back in the day for what they were. I'm not pretentious about my tools, I've used Ryobi for years in both my life as a carpenter and after I left that field, for my own personal use. I don't abuse my stuff beyond what I think it can handle, and I haven't had a problem. I still have one of the original blue Ryobis from pre-2000 hanging in there and use it pretty often, if it's any indication.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      ***The 4AH batteries were the chinese knockoff ones; the charger and 2AH were genuine Craftsman

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Same poster as above. I was made aware from your post and a prior one, that C3 Li were available. Yeah, OP could certainly go that route.

      I personally, like to standardize on dewalt's battery mechanism for everything. Then I can hotswap in someone else's genuine XR on a jobsite or use my generics for my own projects. Meanwhile, I have a mixture of tools, including Bauer (Hazard Fright). In that case, with a red slide adapter. That's where I discovered it's necessary to open those up and verify the soldering is done correctly. The plastics quality has significantly levelled up; that adapter housing is good quality. It's the soldering job that was... not so great. Now easily fixed.

      I discovered the incorrect soldering when loaning the Bauer recip saw, to someone nearby, who was using the wrong blade to cut a pressure treated 4x4, which put the saw under a high current drain. The adapter heated up, because the soldering was done wrong.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Right on, I figured I would go the factory route with the C3 charger and battery, which I figured there would be little risk in, and roll the dice on the chinese batteries, which to this point have worked great, and they have the lo-voltage cutoff built in already. So far so good, and it's nice to have as a backup if something in my main Ryobi platform takes a crap at a bad moment.
        I use Milwaukee at work (land surveyor, we have to drill holes and make crosscuts in concrete all the time), and they're nice and all, but I don't think changing platforms at my advanced age is worth the time and effort.
        >Bauer behind a DeWalt battery
        I'll take "Torture Test" for $400, Alex

  5. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >Also some of them offer them Lithium Ion, which I don't see how they would they would compatible even though the sellers pretend they are compatible.
    you can totally use Lion batteries in them, you just need a Lion charger.

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