Are we witnessing the return of mercenaries taking over major roles from national armies, like in the 1500s?

Are we witnessing the return of mercenaries taking over major roles from national armies, like in the 1500s? Or is this just an anomaly?

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  1. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    No

  2. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    Absolutely not. Mercenaries in the modern world suffer from gigantic disadvantages on several fronts
    a) no guaranteed state funding - impossible to organize for the future in peacetime since no income
    b) no guaranteed state intervention in case of defeat - meaning their soldiers are far more vulnerable
    c) no way to obtain equipment on a nation-state level
    d) extreme weakness to prosecution since there is no legal framework that provides for them
    e) very little recourse in case of war crimes against them - no state level diplomatic capability since the UN, the only such forum, is exclusively for states
    f) no legal ability to punish its members effectively - again opening itself up for prosecution and weakening its control
    g) no ability to coordinate war production with war plans, due to divergent and conflicting leadership in these different sectors, with no enforcement mechanism for the PMC
    And many more such issues. It’s useless. Wagner is just a contractor for cheap cannon fodder infantry that persiated for mainly historical reasons (the Syrian civil war in which they faced no state-level actor)

  3. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    That's just the return of Russia as a failed state

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      And this is the best post. Mercs only exist because of the absolute garbage fire that is the russian state. Though if we continue to push a bunch of oligarchical bullshit in the US as well i dont doubt we will also see the rise of the amazon private military.

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      And this is the best post. Mercs only exist because of the absolute garbage fire that is the russian state. Though if we continue to push a bunch of oligarchical bullshit in the US as well i dont doubt we will also see the rise of the amazon private military.

      If I was an Oligarch right now I'd be starting my own PMC too. This is the only backstop against the state nationalizing your assets, or purging you, and it gives you options if/when the government collapses.
      Its a growth industry and people clearly seem to be able to grow thier fortunes, and if worst came to worst (and you'd kept the warcrimes to a minimum) you could take a bribe from the enemy to just quit the field and go into exile.

  4. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    The entire point of Wagner was that they were supposed to be a cover for Russian forces intervening overseas where Russia itself didn't want to be directly involved.

    But with Russia being Russia, they gave it to some guy who had personal connections to leadership, he turned it into his own private fiefdom, and now it's slowly getting out of control. Something like that couldn't happen anywhere else because only Russia is stupid and corrupt enough to give some random guy a private army outfitted and equipped by the state

  5. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    Every single historical writer and military thinker has agreed on how shitty mercs are

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      "Whoever said the pen is mightier than the sword has never encountered nuclear weapons" - some amerimutt officer

  6. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    > "the return of"
    Explain?

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      OP probably thinks gayner is some epic return of the 17th century Landsknechts or some shit like that.

  7. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    I find it hard to consider Wagner a mercenary company at this point. It's just a privatised Russian army. The leader is in the government, isn't he? Or at least part of the ruling elite. It's even state funded to a degree.

    In fact, I'd consider this closer to how armies worked in Rome. They are Roman armies, but organised, commanded and paid by an individual.

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      It's just a PMC funded by the government just like Blackwater was. And the reason is simple; nobody gives a shit about dead mercs, while society tends to mind when regular troops die due to decision making politicians.

  8. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    More like we're witnessing Russia becoming a proper shithole.

    Mercenaries will never replace national armies in the modern age. Mercs couldnt compete with military industrial complexes and tax-funded standing armies. Equipping and training a professional force and fielding it is ruinously expensive for groups operating only on capital.

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      >Equipping and training a professional force and fielding it is ruinously expensive for groups operating only on capital
      Too true... I recently read "Dogs of War" by Frederick Forsythe, and it felt like three quarters of that fricking book were about people setting up accounts with various banks, depositing money, withdrawing money and closing accounts again, all over Europe, in tedious details. That book was more about accounting than about fighting or mercenary action.

  9. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    Russia collapsing into warring states in real time is not something that anyone else wants to copy.

  10. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    >like in the 1500s?
    For Russia certainly cause they never developed beyond that year

  11. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    >Create a handpicked army lead by one of the men in your inner clique
    >give them money, weapons from the state armories, training facilities, logistics support, aircraft, artillery and armored vehicles
    But they totally are some random mercenaries guys.

  12. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    they are PMC only formally - its a layer of deniability Russia has if they go berserk on local population or embarrass themselves

  13. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    Yes. Jagged Alliance was a documentary, and the events happened in real time.

    • 1 year ago
      Anonymous

      >Not using the internet to send Deidranna flowers, so Elliot gets hit even more
      >"Elliot you IDIOT"

  14. 1 year ago
    Anonymous

    It's a Russian thing. The country is on the precipice of collapse and everyone with something to lose wants their own army when that happens, either so they can take the reins when it does or protect their position at the very least. Plus with the Russian armed forces underperforming so badly they have the perfect excuse.

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