Are they setting a trap?

You fucking moron gay. Are you this dense? The whole Russian defense does not rely on one railroad or even a few for that matter. It’s not that fucking hard to put thousands of single-digit-IQ mobiks into thousands of trucks and send them on their merry way. Trains are a lability with fixed route, and especially since any depot inside of Ukraine is already in range of storm shadow and any rail line within 60-80km of the frontline is in range of HIMARs. If you want to see Dunning-Kruger in action just look in a mirror. I can believe I have to explain to nu-k that supply trucks aren’t some form of dark magic.

>It’s not that fucking hard to put thousands of single-digit-IQ mobiks into thousands of truck
NTA, but for a guy whining about "muh nu-k", you sure talk like an underage retard. One single train load requires multiple hundred trips by trucks. Not just due to volume, but also due to weight since a truck will fucking croak if you try to load it beyond it's weight limit.
And that's not even considering you're expecting Russia, always short on appropriate vehicles, to reach deep and pull a few thousand supply trucks out of their ass which they weren't already using.
Last but not least, you expect them to send entire traffic jams worth of trucks through already crowded highways and provincial roads, to be offloaded at an ad-hoc logistics depot where many will have to wait their turn to be offloaded.
Jesus fucking christ, the first world understanding of the services they benefit from daily rears it's ugly head once more. Pretty sure if I tell you about river barges and their load capacity you're gonna screech at me that it isn't the 16th century anymore or some shit.

What exactly is the current russian army heavy flatbed for moving tanks? It cant still be the MAZ-537 (which I think look and sound fucking awesome)

>Moving wheeled BMPs are the only things you need for logistics
Kek, woefully ill informed poster

> No Russia cannot support logistics for rocket artillery and artillery using trucks travelling 80LM round trips.
Wow, crazy that they can keep fighting then since every railhead in occupied Ukraine can be hit by Ukrainian capabilities and have been vulnerable for months on end! What fucking idiots the Ukrainians must be! Don’t they know that Russians are physically incapable of driving trucks to supply their troops because it seems to be a law of the universe! Or maybe you’re the retard because you think a 2 million man army with tens of thousands of supply vehicles, dozen of support ships, and access to multiple ports next to the front they are currently fighting on can find the men or equipment to supply a relatively small front right off of their own fucking border. I think the latter is the much more intelligent assumption.

Lol. Lmao. You think someone driving a truck 20km is not feasible (mortal danger, lol it’s almost like they are at war)? I can’t believe I’ve wasted so much time on a retard like you. So your solution to having someone drive a supply truck 80km is what? Drive every thing that needs to be resupplied to a very noticeable depot that is either 1) so far away it’s defeats your 80km round trip argument or 2) close enough to be in range of both HIMARs and storm shadows but still further than the 80km round trip? or better yet maybe they can bring the train straight to the front lines so regular arty can join in on the fun too. Ahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahaahahahhahahahah. The fact you think a 80km round trip for someone driving a truck is somehow not feasible tells me all I need to know about you. Plus a train isn’t carrying more than what a few hundred heavy duty trucks could (a ural-4320 can carry 13,000lbs, which means it can carry roughly 60-90 missiles, depending on the type, for a BM-21, WOW! And it’s almost MLRSs always have supply trucks with them) and the bonus with the trucks is that they are smaller targets, can take alternate routes, go to hidden depots, and don’t have to travel in one big group. It’s also should be mentioned that Ukies have been heavily relying on trucks for getting supplies to the front so maybe you should tell them they are going to lose if they don’t put their shit on very noticeable trains. I know I have been tossing the word retard around a lot but you are honest to god a fucking retard. You are RETARDED. Full stop.

>no argument
>just cope
I humbly accept your resignation in this argument and your admission that you are a retard.

>you think I’m a vatnik.
I'm actually veering towards thinking you come from somewhere with either very poor childhood and maternal nutrition or are something low IQ brown

I dont believe in Ural and Kamaz quality.

You guys have no compelling argument. I want Ukraine win but the railroads in Ukraine currently under Russian control arent preventing them from winning and taking them won’t matter too much. Since HIMARs have arrived Russia has spread out its logistics network and is relying on small depots and lots of trucks. Only delusional retards like you think Russia is running trains laden with millions of pounds of equipment into the southern front, or eastern front for that matter. It’s wild to me that you think you’re so knowledgeable about the military but think military truck drivers aren’t putting in thousands of miles every week because someone in high command would be stupid enough to bring a massive train within striking distance of Ukrainian capabilities. I think you guys should probably just kys to be honest. It’s gotta be tough going through life with such low IQs. Feel bad for you guys actually.

I mean, there is literally plenty of articles on explaining how important rail logistic is to Russia. Because internally, roads don't really work due to the cold, so you need trains to take shit. When you get to Ukraine, you need to be near the front. Do you not understand if you increase the distance a truck needs to go, this adds time? Like, it's not teleportation. The truck will take X mins longer to get the same amount of materiel. So, that's really bad. Russia isn't going to collapse if the train station is lost, but it really does fuck with them quite heavily and forces Crimea to be supplied via the road, Kerch Bridge, air or boat.

>g-guys I definitely support Ukraine but there is a thousand reasons why they will lose because russia is a logistics genius
Yeah you must be really smart trying this hard to defend a nonsensical argument. Why do we continuously hear of russian supply shortages then? What an aspie.

>he doesn’t believe in trucks

My friend. The ammo isn't all in Ukraine. It's in depots in Russia. Those depots are either already connected with a rail network or require a truck to transport it to a rail network. The train then takes those to Ukraine. They are then unloaded into trucks and the trucks drive them to the depots near the front. If the rail station where the unloading of quantities of materiel needed to maintain a war front is now disabled/out of action/under artillery threat, you now have to make the train stop at an earlier station. That station is X kilometres from the now lost/at risk station and you still then have to get the ammo to the depots/front from the train station that is now lost anyway. So lets say it's 20km from the front, you've now lost it and the nearest train station that can handle such loads is 100km away, you're now at 120km from the frontline. The trucks now need to drive 120km to that station and then back with extremely limited quantities of materiel.

I don't think you understand how adding another four hours onto a trip is quite important when you're fighting a war.

Of course Russia doesn't PURELY move stuff by train, but trains are literally perfect for transporting huge supplies and reinforcements. Go ask the French what happened when the Prussians used trains in 1870.

Take a read of this paper
https://www.foi.se/rest-api/report/FOI%20Memo%207954

Then just some random articles will cover more https://www.aljazeera.com/features/2023/8/31/ukraines-months-long-counteroffensive-at-the-crossroads
>Russian military logistics depends heavily on the rail system, but this network is under increasing attacks not just from Ukrainian artillery but also from precision strike by HIMARS rocket batteries and Storm Shadow cruise missiles.

Thank you again for demonstrating your knowledge of how the Russo-Ukraine war has developed is absolutely 0. Russia isn’t unloading trains near the front, the trains aren’t even come close to it thanks to HIMARs and storm shadows. Trucks coming out of Crimea, Russia, and Azov coast are already supplying the majority of the troops in occupied Ukraine and taking rail lines in Zaporizhzhia won’t stop that.

Yes, they are. That's how military logistics work. The train station isn't within range of artillery and the Ukrainians are not using their extremely limited precision targeting systems on it because a rail system can be repaired easily. But when a station is under TUBE ARTILLERY range it becomes a major issue because TUBE ARTILLERY is much more common place and not vital precision capable that you need for other things.

If you honestly think Russia is running multiple hour long truck convoys to supply the front, you're retarded. It works the same way it has always worked. Train comes in, train unloads, trucks take the stuff to where they need to go. Do you honestly, truly, really, think that Russia is going to a depot in Siberia, taking it by train to the border of Ukraine and then relying on Kamaz and Urals to take the tens of thousands of kg needed per day to the front which is many hours away? Do you not understand how fucking retarded that is?

Do you also not understand that cutting off Tomak fucks Crimea being resupplied, as already said?

Stop being a Dunning-Kruger text book case and read the paper I posted. Don't bother going
>b-b-but it's old a-a-and *sniff* they've *sniff* cc-c-changed
Because they literally haven't. .

Let me explain basic logistics to you.
Trains are some of the most efficient forms of transport for men and material, they can handle relatively massive loads (yes, get it out of your system) and move pretty vast quantities of material quickly from the depots further back in Russia to near the front where they are then distributed to trucks for the final leg.
Removing the rail puts more pressure on the trucks, flat out. That means that with the same amount of trucks, Russia can now transport much less equipment because each truck has to go further and wheeled trucks can't carry as much as a train so specialist vehicles need to be brought in for some pieces like the latest batch of T-55s, IFVs, self-propelled guns, etc.
It doesn't collapse it, but it puts the whole system under intense strain and suddenly troops near the front start receiving less supplies, less ammo, less artillery shells, and less reinforcements (since even if you've been transporting uncubed mobiks by truck until now, those trucks are now going to be pressed into carrying ammo, rockets, etc which competes with the meat for space and weight capacity.)
As for why the Ukranians haven't been hitting the rail line as much. Rail repairs are relatively quick and cheap so hitting it with an expensive HIMARS or Storm Shadow is poor return on investment. If they can bring it in range of the relatively cheap tube artillery shells however, it becomes cost effective to repeatedly blow it up and then hit it again to kill the repair crews.

You have to be careful when talking about the Scooby van. There are actual cargo and multi-purpose chassis variants of the Buhanka used by multiple countries for military purposes like how the US military uses Silverados, Tahoes, and Suburbans for light utility vehicles.

Easiest way to answer that question is to look at the paint job. If it's in the drab greens and browns used by the rest of the military it's probably a military vehicle, if not it's probably a requisitioned vehicle. Granted even if it's a civvie model it might have been requisitioned from another part of the government.

Air bases relied on box vans (P-30 etc) to haul technicians and some GM and Dodge trucks, either longbeds or crewcab longbeds to drag support equipment and for general use. Some bobtailed (short frames with rear wheels just behind the cab) were used as GSE and aircraft tugs.

Typical air base use in USAF was and remains van bodies (box or standard) with no rear seats so specs and crew chiefs can fit themselves,tools, aircraft wheel assemblies (aircraft devour tires) etc and roam or park on the flighline.
Production Supers (P1) get standard cab pickups. Crew cabs haul smaller crews and their kit.

CUCV etc trucks were simple rugged designs that worked great even after sitting in Saudi etc as prepostioned stocks for years before Desert Shield. They were certainly not "supply" trucks or suited to palletized logistics since 463L pallets with cargo don't fit pickup truck beds. Pallets are life for any non-retarded force.

So are AAR "Cadillac" bins so named for AARs facility in Cadillac Michigan. Designed for airlift those are delicate aluminum so if you see them surplused they're normally damaged as they're expensive to repair vs replace. If you don't see damage the base sheet on the bottom usually got forked by a forlift. They're neat for civilian use but don't come up surplus often or I'd have all I could score.

Have some key logistics equipment proven for many decades. Page ten onwards show my beloved bins which beat the shit out of pallet buildup:

https://www.aarcorp.com/globalassets/2.-products/aar_catalog_2022.pdf

No, that's exactly what I was trying to convey: losing Tokmak wouldn't instantaneously collapse the Russian front, but the effects would be felt over the subsequent weeks and months, and those effects would probably be pretty severe over time.
That said, if the Russians lose rail I fully expect Putin to double down rather than order a withdrawal. He'll probably order resupply through the ports and throw tons of whatever trucking they can scrounge at the coastal highways until those are in 155mm range, too, and the wear-and-tear on all those vehicles will ramp up severely. It'll prolong the inevitable.

>It's like giving a guy with a gangrenous leg painkillers, then putting makeup on the leg.
You nailed it, Anon. Last summer, when somebody looked at the digits on newly mobilized tanks and worked out that the Russians were cannibalizing their training regiments to get some functional equipment and trained soldiers on the front, that was where it really hit home for me. Putin had spent the whole war thinking that the Ukrainians were just a month or two from collapsing and giving him whatever he wanted.
I think Kharkiv happened right after that, so when they announced mobilization, who was going to train the mobiks? Crazy.

>He'll probably order resupply through the ports
Hilariously enough, thats no longer possible because the russians sank a line of barges along the kerch bridge to try and protect it from naval drones
They can still resupply Crimea by sea (assuming no ukie interdiction) but the port of berdyansk is effectively cut off
I sure wouldn't want to be whichever por bastard has to report that particular "defensive initiative" to king Monke

>more steps
>larger footprint
Ukraine has also shown it can hit ships and other naval targets pretty well.

>not without satellites
Luckily they have the support of the largest network of reconnaissance satellites in the world.

You have to be careful when talking about the Scooby van. There are actual cargo and multi-purpose chassis variants of the Buhanka used by multiple countries for military purposes like how the US military uses Silverados, Tahoes, and Suburbans for light utility vehicles.

>You have to be careful when talking about the Scooby van
nah, while there are useful variants of the uaz 452 (like the "tabletka" ambulance) you can absolutely make fun of it originating in the 60's or even more so of the abysmal build quality.
There was a video on PrepHole with electrodes sticking out of the welds in a new one, just to put it into perspective

Actual logistics guy here.

Trucks can be more efficient than trains at moving cargo if the roads allow for 20+ton containers to be hauled.

Please remember that unless your point of delivery is next to a railway line you still need trucks to bring the cargo from the railway station to the point of delivery.
Also unless your supply warehouse is at a train line you also need trucks going from the warehouse to the near railway station load, drive to the railway, unload, load again on onto the train often having to wait other trucks that might be late or the train might be late, than you need to unload the train at destination and load once again onto trucks drive near the front lines unload again either by crane truck (or by hand like the Russians do lol).
In many cases you can be better off just going with the first truck all the way to destination.

Of course this assumes that the roads are drivable and that the cargo has been designed to fit onto a truck or into a shipping container.

Train beats truck over very long distances and if you carry extremely heavy cargo by volume like artillery ammo without crates or liquids.
However most weapons come in boxes and crates which are light enough by volume to fill a shipping container without maxing out the weight.

Considering the distance of the rail line from the front I am surprised that drones or missiles aren't regularly hitting trains yet.

All said Russia seems to have structured it's logistics systems to work primarily by rail thus losing rail lines will be damaging to the war effort but any western logistics company should be able to arrange truck delivery to replace the train cargo without too much difficulty as long as the roads aren't already jammed by civilians.

They don't have pallets.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidaxe/2022/03/18/as-predicted-the-russian-army-is-running-out-of-trucks-for-its-war-in-ukraine/

https://warontherocks.com/2021/11/feeding-the-bear-a-closer-look-at-russian-army-logistics/
"The Russian army does not have enough trucks to meet its logistic requirement more than 90 miles beyond supply dumps. To reach a 180-mile range, the Russian army would have to double truck allocation to 400 trucks for each of the material-technical support brigades."

https://foreignpolicy.com/2022/04/21/russias-military-has-a-railroad-problem/

https://www.cna.org/reports/2023/04/russias-railway-troops
"RUSSIA’S RAILWAY TROOPS
THE BACKBONE SUSTAINING RUSSIAN MILITARY FORCE POSTURE"

https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-19th-century-technology-driving-russias-latest-gains-in-ukraine-railroads-11655218602

Sirs already deleting a thread showing this. Too bad for you that I am not illiterate when it comes to IT :^)

Thanks for telling me you have zero reading comprehension moron

Any railroad in the south has been within Ukraine’s capability to target for months, so please tell me you mongoloid retard why the front hasn’t collapse ?

>no argument
>no answer
>just cope
Damn, I guess your retardation maxed out and couldn’t generate a bullshit explanation about why Russians are actually physically incapable of driving the trucks they have so clearly been using. Thanks for proving me right since you can’t even defend a basic tenet of your retarded theory.

Just remember, don't cry when it happens.

Keep crying retards. I don’t live in a fantasy land. Also I think it’s cute you think I’m a vatnik. Honestly I think people like you and vatniks are on the same mental level, that being the level of severe mental deficiency.

Just remember, don't cry when it happens.

Trucks also require fuel and sustainment which must be trucked in. Some other anon did the math a while back but I didn't save the post. It's interesting stuff.

>trough the Kerch bridge
Until the Ukrainians blow that up again and force the Russians to spend another 3 months fixing it.