>2024
>The United States declares that it must restore the rightful government of China to power, the Republic of China, and launches an attack to "pacify" the CCP
>NATO won't get involved directly, though it will provide weapons, but Japan and Taiwan agree to help as much as possible
>North Korea and South Korea are tense, but want to avoid getting involved directly
Can the US overthrow Beijing?
Yeah
lol, no. It would obviously end with nukes flying.
Yes.
Chinese nukes do not work, their components are made of Chinesium or are sold off. Same for Russia.
>Chinese nukes do not work
Explain this
>Trinity and Beyond
That stuff is hilariously lunatic. It was like bigger North Korea back then. The PLA still is.
?t=174
I really resent the assumption that nuclear war ends in armageddon. It's never been tested, and thus is reliant on fallible mathematical models. A limited nuclear exchange between the US and China, while devastating, wouldn't necessarily mean the end of all existence.
Now, the real question is if it came to nuclear exchange, would either combatant's will to fight crack in the aftermath?
A relatively small-scale countervalue strike is still enough to effectively end any existing nationstate as a functional, coherent political entity. Modern civilization is a fragile thing once you enter the realm of canned sunshine being released in city centers.
Or so we assume. Governments, much like the human body, manage to be both remarkably fragile and impressively durable.
I doubt Japan would agree to help. US aggression would be castigated worldwide including in allied countries such as most (all) of Europe. The invasion would fail due to China's strong homefield defensive advantage. They have a large fleet and loads of land-based missiles.
USA loses the war with massive losses of material and equipment and it's global status as hegemon is probably coming to an end then and there. The US government would almost certainly collapse from internal opposition combined with military failure.
Things would be substantially different if it's China invading Taiwan.
You obviously know nothing about Japan. They’d be busting nuts in their pants at the opportunity to get boots on the ground in China for the hundredth time.
"Surrender ye Confucian Dogs!"
based, they really hold a romanticized view of their past thanks to the Samurai spirit. Even in WW2, officers kept their family blades in gunto koshirae, they'd probably bust a nut thinking about doing that again and setting foot to rape the chinks once more
>You obviously know nothing about Japan
Said the ignorant mutts. Japan are scared shirtless of China taking revenge on them.
The Northern fleet alone will wipe out the Jap navy and bomb every Jap ports
1. No gun no opinion
2. It's scared SHITLESS not shirtless you dumb chink.
Yes. A direct assault would work but the US is unlikely to do that. Long-range embargo of the sea lanes to China will destroy their economy and cause a nightmare-tier scenario for the CCP. The CCP is a very large organization propped up by careerism and corruption so it’ll be a more complex operation than just tanking their economy, The US may also decide to enhance the economic pressure by destroying Chinese oil reserves. If the US can follow this up with a good transition plan that takes care of all the corrupt CCP management and their family ties in the oligarchy while giving the careerists a place in the new government we might see a surprisingly tidy regime change to democracy. Maybe just telling the CCP they have to have a democratic election and constitutional change would be enough to let them take care of the major corruption leaving just the top players. Good enough?
Without nukes, yes. With nukes, everybody loses, but China loses harder. In reality, the US doesn't actually want to open up with military aggression. Even if things went hot, the US would try to keep it contained by just blocking shipping lanes and crushing any hopes of a Chinese navy.
It’s unlikely the CCP responds to a threat with absolutely assured death to themselves. They are largely corrupt and so are more interested in securing their wealth, lifestyles and access, all of which would be assuredly destroyed with no possible gain to themselves. The purpose of any nuclear arsenal is to deter; if it fails to deter it has lost its purpose. The CCP, of which the PLA is a branch (not a national institution), has proven itself to be rational actors. Aggression against China and/or the CCP will only be met with conventional force. Which is still very much inferior to America’s conventional forces.
>the US would try to keep it contained by just blocking shipping lanes
For what purpose? China have infinite suppler of oil, minerals, food and gas just across its northern border.
>infinite
>through a tiny pipeline
>from a nation that barely supplies itself internally
Kek, Strait of Malacca blocked and Chink industry dies in a month. Don't even get me started on blocking food imports.
>Strait of Malacca blocked
Litteraly under range of 1000s of anti ship missiles.
Ok boomer
>a strait at war is conducive to naval trade
You are a special kind of moron
>Thinking blocking world trade won't make the US enemy of the world; justifying China anti-ship strike.
You are a special kind of moron
>blocking world trade
>by not allowing the transfer of goods to China
Hate to break it to you but SEA nations would consider China the aggressor and the one creating war in the shipping lanes. Whether you choose to accept this now will soften the blow to your nationalist pride later
SEA don't manufacture shit, they mostly assemble stuff, which come from China.
Also 90% of your pharmaceutical come from China, you'll due first.
ASBM and air launched Anti ship missiles
>Chinese people are compliant and conformist
Keep believing that
people are compliant and conformist
>Keep believing that
I will. History has proven it true time and time again, and it's your obstinance preventing you from learning from it. Just because you think you are not like the other gongfei Black folk, you are not representative of the country as a whole. The Chinese population are unarmed and will put up no resistance if the PLA made an incursion against them at the direction of the Party. The Chinese people are too comfy with their way of life to put up a fight if a puppet maintains what they are used to
see: Every American president
Mutts truly never learm from history
good thinking emperor hirohito, we will make a first strike across the pacific
The Chinese not being conformist and compliant is even worse for China since it means that all the CIA needs to do is to show them the US standard of living. As crappy as it is, it's better than China's and nobody is doubting the CCP's mismanagement both with Covid and the Evergrande collapse. Smuggle in some guns and China will be facing an insurgency.
>The Chinese not being conformist and compliant is even worse for China since it means that all the CIA needs to do is to show them the US standard of living
This is why a puppet government would be able to maintain the parts of China that aren't split amongst other nations. The nature of politics in China is to not get involved so as long as their standard of living stays the same or improves, they will not have many objections to who is in charge
>a puppet government
And who's gonna put that together and control it? The bureaucrats in Washington that got all turned into radioactive dust for playing the stupid game of invading a nuclear power?
Also
>as long as their standard of living stays the same or improves
Yeah, something tells me that a massive war involving millions dead on both sides even before the nukes fly is going to make that rather wishful thinking.
>The nature of politics in China is to not get involved so as long as their standard of living stays the same or improves, they will not have many objections to who is in charge
Lol.
The nature of chinese politics is to seek more power, that's the nature of every Chinese. Chinese are irl Sith
I can gain more power by raising in rank in the CCP, why would I listen to a moronic glowie?
We are beyond your understanding, that's why your color revolution always fail lol
Lol wut. South Korea and Japan will probably decimate your entire military while you’re crying in an internment camp watching some french Canadian with an average for them, huge for Chinese blow out your moms back.
Here’s the deal tiny dick Chang, everyone hates the US. Everyone hates China more.
The difference here is US cultural has an impact on every nation, so the people of the US are humanized to them. China contributes nothing, even Vietnam would happily kill Chinese bugmen in a war over Americhads.
I am sorry everyone hates you and your shithole country it has always and will always be so. Accept it or leave.
>China anti-ship strike.
AShM are probably the biggest slowest fricking targets imaginable.
Depends, can those missiles hit submarines?
Railroads and car roads are there as well. Would be not as cheap and require a huge logistic effort, but doable. Plus Russia can run a nonstop line of sea shipments from their northern European ports to their Far East ports, entirely by their and "their" (aka Chinese with Russian flag) vessels and being all the time inside russian territorial waters. There you can unload them and cross China land border right nearby.
> food imports
Protip - Russia is one of the largest food exporters in the world.
Really? I don't see Russia on the list, and that's before any industrial farming they were doing was destroyed by sanctions on all the parts they need for maintenance.
>value
Based moron. You probably think that iFart is the best too, because omg look at the earnings
>Without nukes, yes. With nukes, everybody loses
This is the problem of modern conflict among great powers basically.
Other option is pysop, but China seems able to do that better given extreme control of information there.
Longer term it's looking like demographic collapse in china (aging population, and extreme capital flight and brain drain), so if USA can HODL for 25 years and keep China from expanding I think it will actually work out fine.
Particularly when Xi leaves office, doesn't appear to be a clear successor, possible that major disruption can happen at that time in hinterlands.
But thats a spooks game and not what I know about, I am here for kino weapons tech.
>Can the US overthrow Beijing?
Likely not, China is so frickhuge and has such a big population it's likely beyond any army to successfully occupy. even the chinese themselves struggle to keep control around the edges.
The US has the ability to subdue China completely, but we’re talking about regime change, not invasion.
Realistically speaking, China's main fault is food import and most industry being centered around high flood areas.
That was true in the 30s/40s but not anymore. The CCP did one thing right. They realised how vulnerable their military-industrial complex was by being concentrated on the Eastern Coast cities- so they invested in building industries in inland provinces like mountainous Sichuan and Yunnan.
Still though
>Still though
Series of well timed rods from god hitting damns would be so kino.
Also probably a horrific war crime. But very kino.
First couple SpaceX Starships should be 'lost after launch' and go into blackops Area51 site for some Space Force spooky shit.
You’re dumb and so are the Chinese. The Japanese and Koreans have both occupied China throughout history. They’re a pathetic bunch of wankers.
>Koreans
when?
All the US needs to do is start imposing sanctions on China.
China imports almost everything, it would be like laying siege to a caste.
>All the US needs to do is start imposing sanctions on China.
How's that trade war working out for you?
The last time I check, prices in china are still at pre covid level.
>chinese gov statistics
Its a paradise if you believe them, why don’t you move over there?
>chinese gov statistics
More trustworthy than mutts stats
>Its a paradise if you believe them, why don’t you move over there?
Because cost of living is lower in Montréal than in Beijing. Not that a NEET like you would understand.
Post your gun
>Montréal
So you are a second gen chink in Canada.
Never ask
>A woman her weight
>A man his salary
>A chinaman why he isn't living in china
>More trustworthy than mutts stats
LOL give me a fricking break tankie.
https://wikileaks.org/plusd/cables/07BEIJING1760_a.html
Liaoning Party Secretary Li Keqiang, from 2007:
>GDP figures are "man-made" and therefore unreliable, Li said.
>All other figures, especially GDP statistics, are "for reference only," he said smiling.
Everything they release publicly is doctored and questioning it gets you "re-educated".
That little girl is speaking English.
When you have a centrally planned and controlled economy built on nothing, it's very for the state to simply make prices not move.
The US lost the last "trade war" you dummy.
if the US tried to decouple from the chinese economy it would collapse. During the years Trump was president economic ties with china increased, same with biden. The idea we could do without them is pure theater and neither major US political party has the will or the political capital (or the competence) to revitalize the domestic economy sufficiently and even if they could it would take years, a generation, to achieve.
This would fail. It's better to wait for China to invade Taiwan.
All of this China vs US bullshit completely ignores the fact that both are extremely economically dependant on each other. Now sure, a moron-monke scenario like with Russia deciding to become a hermit kingdom might repeat, but I doubt that a) any person in US can have enough power to do it without getting restrained or that b) the CCP isn't corrupt to the core by the business interests of cadres whose companies would get fricked in case of war.
At best we are getting Vietnam 2.0 in some developing African country.
I hope they do it, I already reserved my seat in one of those fancy Vault-Tec vaults just in case.
>Can the US overthrow Beijing?
No. The USA get a reverse pacific war and lose everything up to the west coast.
China can build 2 USN in one years, American plebs are delusional
>In OPs moronic scenario
Nukes fly immediately
>Realistically if for some reason all nukes were gone
Electronics get fried immediately worldwide.
Defeating china is easy. Just bomb dams and infrastructure, block shipping, cut off trade. Hundreds of millions will starve.
"Taking over" china would be the pointless endless quagmire to end all pointless, endless quagmires.
Just let it collapse into the same schizophrenic warlord incoherence it's always been.
The US couldn’t democratize countries that are 10 times smaller in both area and population. I honestly don’t know where all these people saying victory is assured are coming from. I’m sure the initial operation will go great, they might even be able to take Beijing. And then what? Another 20 year occupation in the third largest country in the world?
Lessons learned. It'll probably be similar to the first Gulf War.
But the strategic goals of the first Gulf war were completely different. Desert Storm was meant to liberate a country from another country, not occupy another country on behalf of a puppet government.
And lessons learned? Are you sure about that?
>the Chinese population are not armed
No, they just have one of the cheapest to produce modern ARs and a ton of factories that can be converted to build them. I really don’t think a lack of personal armaments is going to be a massive problem in mobilizing resistance.
China certainly would lose some states, but the core Han territory would be like a giant Vietnam.
If your idea is to just take Beijing, install the KMT and leave, sure, that will definitely destabilize China for another decade. It will destroy the world economy, and revanchism will only legitimize the CCP further, but an occupation by American forces, especially without allies, would break America’s back.
>No, they just have one of the cheapest to produce modern ARs and a ton of factories that can be converted to build them
This does not make a difference. China already makes these guns in abundance and has the guns & ammunition to supply its military, which isn't the issue. Arming the citizens is not on the table for the Party. Xi is a moron but he has learned from history and he will absolutely not expect full loyalty from the PLA, combined loyalty from all of its branches, or any loyalty from outside of it. If the citizens were armed the Party would have far more problems than hostile foreign nations on their doorstep.
>Another 20 year occupation in the third largest country in the world?
The Chinese people are compliant and conformist, the proper puppet would be installed to maintain their way of life. some of Tibet would come under Indian governance, and the significant Mongolian population and area in China would be fine amalgamating into Mongolia. The Chinese population are not armed and there is no capability for an organized armed rebellion especially when taking into account the PLA, the PLAN, and the PLAAF practically have pissing contests with one another instead of cooperating. This combined with military/police presence being the ONLY thing preventing secular Islamist uprisings in Xinjiang is a huge recipe for disaster if China's current government loses any legitimacy whatsoever, which
would be the bare minimum goal instead of occupation.
Yes BUT not with ONLY direct military action. China's army is too big and the CCP is too willing to use human wave tactics and civilian shields. The US frankly doesn't have the will to get bogged down in what's going to be decades of massive bloody conflict. Not after Afghanistan went bust.
So what you want to do is to start some civil unrest. There's always going to be some disatisfaction and all the news of food counterfeiting, financial instability, and tofu-dreg building project China will have more than it's share. Send the CIA in to disrupt the censors and smuggle in as much surplus rifles and ammo as possible before someone catches on. Dissidents will form militant groups and the PLA will have to come down hard on them.
THAT is when you send in the big ol' US Armed Forces. With half the PLA tied up fighting insurgencies, supply convoys to the PLAAF and PLAN being ambushed, and the population in general not willing to work for a government that gives them nothing in return the PRC would face an impossible situation without the institutes needed to face them.
>You will never see an American bombing/firebombing campaign in Chinas most densely populated areas
>You will never see monthly civilian casualty counts in the seven figures
>You will never witness the US destroy China's dams leading to death tolls in the tens of millions
It's not fair
You will.
you might witness a catastrophic dam collapse
China is a third world shithole with nothing but mid tier early 2000’s stolen tech.
They refuse to address why they have tiny penises, until this addressed and accepted they will never be taken seriously on the world scale. Militarily or economically, right now they are basically just a giant slave colony for Europe and the USA.
The US never won and never will win against a communist country. So yeah, China would win.
how come people are always trying to come up with scenarios for china to be the bad guy when they literally just want to be left alone and mind their business like best korea
They're constantly meddling in other countries business what the frick are you talking about?
>Day 2: Global economy collapses worse than the 1920s
Mutt fantasy wars are dumb
two weeks but for real
Where you gonna get your 2 day delivery random Amazon goodies?
Just divide up China into different foreign occupied regions (Japanese zone, American zone, Vietnamese zone, etc), making separate regions for Mandarin, Cantonese, etc. Does anyone have a map like this?